Loss of white balance correction

I just returned from a dive trip. In addition to cropping, adjusting the exposure and cropping, I use the white balance feature to correct the color of photos taken without a flash at depth. I uploaded my cards to my MacBook Pro (both the laptop and my Mac Pro are running Aperture 2.1.3), and edited these images. When I got home, I exported the project (like I always do), and imported it into my main Aperture library on my Mac Pro.
When I review these images, the color-corrected previews are seen in the Browser. When I click on an image, the color-corrected preview is shown in full size on my second, 30" Cinema Display while the RAW image is loading. However, once the full image is loaded, the white balance reverts to the original - but the levels and cropping are maintained! I can re-do the white balance correction, but once I quit and restart Aperture again, the white balance correction is again lost - but not my other edits! Thus, not only were the white balance corrections done on my laptop lost when I exported/imported the project, the repeat corrections done on my MacPro are lost when I quit and restart Aperture.
Curiously, after I've re-done the white balance on several images and quit, when I restart Aperture there is no indication that there are any images or projects that haven't been backed up in a vault.
This has never happened before when I would import a project; the last time I successfully imported a project with all of its adjustments maintained was February (I don't recall when 2.1.3 came out). I've searched this forum to no avail; has anyone else experienced this?

I've the x-rite passport and I can say only a thing:
Color correction seems to be an opinion!
With Aperture (and Canon RAW) with only white balance you will get an image very very close to the result with x-rite calibrated DNG and Adobe Camera Raw, but...
In both case Colors are very outside of reality!
Adobe Camera RAW and Canon DPP give other different "crazy opinion" on blues reds and greens, and the only program that I found go very closer to reality seems to be CaptureOne.
In my tests I've used two 5600°K Bowens lights to take a photo of x-rite passport and I've tried to compare it with the official datasheets from xrite:
http://xritephoto.com/phproductoverview.aspx?ID=1257&Action=Support&SupportID=5159
Seems very difficult to get real colors from the same RAW file, and every software give a personal opinion from the same data (?!)

Similar Messages

Cannot get white-balance correction to work

I have some diving video that needs white balance correction. I am trying out the PE11 trial.
I've tried smart-fix as well as the 3-way correction tool. I've used the dropper to select something that should be white, but it makes little to no difference.
Any ideas why ?

As an experiment I went for another dive today, this time taking the same camera (Canon S110 with underwater white balance mode active) as well as a GoPro with a red filter. The video from the GoPro seems to have much more colour in it so I think it's a case of the Canon not capturing as much of that spectrum. I'll do another dive tomorrow and manually set the white balance to see if it makes any difference. I'm so use to shooting on the GoPro that I was surprised by the reduced colour in the Canon.
Is there any way to determine how much of red / green / blue is available in the video using PE11 ?
Thanks for the reply.

White Balance Correction

Hi all,
This might be a question which is too "simple" for Aperture but here goes...
I am used to using Adobe or Nikon products to edit my RAW images, in those apps you could change white balance as if you were in camera (ie: daylight, shade, flash etc...). In Aperture it seems the only way I can adjust white balance is to click somewhere in the image which is white, is this correct?
Appreciate it.
MBP 15'' 2.16 Mac OS X (10.4.6)

I think it what would put Aperture in a
better position would be to use the same system as
the competition
How can Aperture surpass the competition by copying them? The current system is workable for saving presets. I am looking for something much better out of Apple in the next revision of Aperture than just 'copying' the competition.
Aperture is innovative and ground-breaking software in many areas. We will have to wait a bit longer for them to fill in some weaker spots in a application.

Flickering White Balance Correction

Hi,
I did a shot with a Nikon D90 moving through a subway tunnel, and the White Balance keeps oscilating slightly from warm to cool. Can I use some sort of temporal WB correction to deal with this problem, without keyframing the whole thing?
Regards,
Bogdan

Not sure if WB Effect is an "auto" Effect, but you might want to look at Keyframing one of the other CC Effects. About all of the Auto Effects are nearly useless. Some, like Shadow & Highlight can have the Auto turned OFF. I use S & H often, but NEVER on Auto.
Just do not know about WB Effect.
Good luck,
Hunt
PS - welcome to the Forum

White Balance Correction using Color Cecker?

Hi,
I have been looking at a number white balance cards and also at cards used for color correction cards, such as "Color Checker White Balance 18% Gray Card 16:9 format" (see http://cgi.ebay.com/Color-Checker-White-Balance-18-Gray-Card-16-9-format-/150465 201169?pt=LHDefaultDomain0&hash=item23086cc411). Is there a way of using these cards (automatically) for color correction when importing images or using a not too time-consuming process after the import?
Thanks!

I've the x-rite passport and I can say only a thing:
Color correction seems to be an opinion!
With Aperture (and Canon RAW) with only white balance you will get an image very very close to the result with x-rite calibrated DNG and Adobe Camera Raw, but...
In both case Colors are very outside of reality!
Adobe Camera RAW and Canon DPP give other different "crazy opinion" on blues reds and greens, and the only program that I found go very closer to reality seems to be CaptureOne.
In my tests I've used two 5600°K Bowens lights to take a photo of x-rite passport and I've tried to compare it with the official datasheets from xrite:
http://xritephoto.com/phproductoverview.aspx?ID=1257&Action=Support&SupportID=5159
Seems very difficult to get real colors from the same RAW file, and every software give a personal opinion from the same data (?!)

How can I turn off Automatic White Balance/Correction?

Hi,
I shoot color Infra-Red images. White Balance is handled in Camera - and then in Photoshop. As a new user to Lightroom 2 - everytime I view/click on an image in the Library - the color/balance of the image changes to a deep red, and I lose all of the vivid colors that I had from the original image. The files are Nikon NEF RAW - and I am looking for a way to turn this automatic change in colors off. Can anyone help?
Thanks and have a great weekend !!!
Dave

Hal,
I have a Nikon D-70 that has the Lifepixel infra-red conversion. Take a look at their website and you can see the great color infra-red pictures that you can take with this converted camera. So there is my problem - I can set the camera at a PRE White-Balance and shoot Cyan/Blue/Green photos - and then import them into Lightroom. I see the photos in the Library - but as I click on them to view them, they change color to Red. Now if I set up the camera to take White Balance as Auto - or pretty much anything else other than the PRE (for which I can adjust), I will also get a Red photo. Red is OK if you want to convert to B+W - but if you want to retain all of the colors, I need to keep the color that the camera shot - without Lightroom changing them. I looked at the history - and only have an import/date. Other than clicking on it to view - no changes have been applied by me - yet. I will try to shoot them as jpg's - the ones I am working with right now were shot in the summer. We have -20 Deg. C. here right now - so Infra Red camera is in bag - have no green leaves to shoot. Looking through preferences and settings to see if I can find a "turn-off"....... Actually - let me load the photos with Bridge and see what they look like there..........
Dave

Lens Profile Tool Addition – White Balance Offset Correction

I have noticed that my Canon 17-40mm and 70-200mm F4 IS lenses have virtually identical color temperature and can use the same white balance setting. My Sigma 50mm F2.8 Macro lens is another story, requiring almost 200K and +15 change to White Balance sliders. I am sure there are cases where Canon’s lenses will differ more widely and exhibit a similar degree of white balance differences, not to mention use of UV or 1B protection filters. An 85mm F1.2 lens using “rare earth” low dispersion glass, will have a warmer color temperature than a lens using more common glass elements.
I use the X-Rite ColorChecker Passport to create custom profiles for each of my camera bodies. I typically make separate correction presets for Daylight, Cloudy, and Tungsten (2700K). This requires changing the LR White Balance sliders to obtain “neutral gray in the ColorChecker image files shot in each of above described lighting conditions. It does not appear necessary to create a separate ColorChecker camera profile for each lens, just correction to the LR white balance slider settings.
I did some measurements of change in camera profile for Sunny Daylight (~5,500K), Cloudy (8,000K+), and Tungsten (~2,900K) lighting. There was no measurable change in rendering of the ColorChecker Passport images for the extreme Sunny to Cloudy conditions, and only very slight changewhen comparing the Tungsten profile. This was done by loading a ColorChecker Passport image file and applying alternate profiles:
EXAMPLE:
Open a DaylightColorChecker Passport image file in LR, apply Cloudy Camera Profile, and adjust White Balance for the gray scale patches using the Eyedropper Tool. Then look at the 'Before' and 'After' images....you will see NO visual change to any of the color patches. I saw only a very slight change when doing this with the Daylight to Tungsten (artificial light source) comparison.
The relatively small change in color balance between lenses (~500K max.) should have no measurable or visible affect to the ColorChecker Passport created "Camera Profile." The ColorChecker Passport or any other "Camera Profile" creation tool is first and foremost correcting for differences in the camera's image sensor color rendering.
SUGGESTION:
Since this white balance difference is a factor of the lens, it would be very convenient to add another tool in Lightroom's and Camera Raw Lens Profile panel for “White Balance Offset.” This allows setup of LR defaults for one specific lens type, such as your most used lens. Then you use the new ‘Lens Profile’ located ‘White Balance Offset’ correction tool to adjust white balance for all of your other lenses. In addition, Adobe or camera manufacturers could also provide the 'White Balance Offset Correction' as a function of the lens spectral response deviation from linear. This would provide a "uniform method" of calculating and adding the White Balance correction to the 'Lens Profile.' Since this is a factor of the lens only, the “lens offset correction” can be used with ANY lens/camera body pairing, The current LR and Camera Raw White Balance settings are then only used for “Global” correction of lighting conditions, and NOT for lens differences.
This is a linear mathematical function,which should be extremely easy for Adobe to add the ‘White Balance Offset’ correction feature to LR’s and Camera Raw's Lens Profile GUI. Just like many other tools in LR that some don't use, you can choose to use it or not!

Interesting suggestion. Thanks. -Simon

Correct white balance

I just join new job. They taped big project with white wall. Three cameras. Two of them are same and one new camera. I am not sure which camcorders but I see those two cameras are apparently off white balance (slight yellow) while new camera show look great. I am not familiar with color corrections. It got me confused which ones that I should adjust for white balance correction like level controls highlighs mids blacks, color balance, color controls.. all those... not sure which is good to correct white balance. Hope that I am able to match with one look so white and great colors.

Try the Magic Wand.
Turn the CC to Visual mode, that's where you see the colour wheels.
At about seven o'clock on the Balance wheel is a little eye dropper.
Here's how to do it:
Have the clip edited into the Timeline then place your playhead over that clip.
Open this clip (the one in the Timeline that needs to be corrected) into the Viewer. Okay, what you have is the same clip being diplayed in the Viewer and Canvas. This is so when color corrections are made in the Viewer you can see the changes in the Canvas straight away. You know if things going the right way or not.
Drag the Color Corrector from the Browser>Effects>Video Filters>Color Correction>Color Corrector and drop it on the Viewer.
A Color Corrector Tab will be available on the Viewer.
Click the Color Corrector Tab and the CC Filter appears.
Click the eye dropper and move the cursor over the Canvas, the cursor should look like an eye dropper if all is well.
Find something that should be WHITE in the Canvas, place the eye dropper over this and click on it. Instant balance correction can be seen in the Canvas.
If this doesn't work then you can use the wheels manually to change the balance.
Al

After adjusting white balance in ACR, images are opening in Ps at a different size.

Can anyone explain like I'm 5 why this is happening, and how to prevent it? Thanks!
Negatives are scanned at 3200dpi, and 24bit depth. This is the metadata from Bridge.
Default settings in Camera Raw
After opening in Photoshop.

Scanned direclty into photoshop. And if I open the tif from explorer or bridge, bypassing Camera Raw, it opens as the 75mb file size. I thought it might have somethign to do with the color, as Bridge labels bits/channel as 'Bit depth', but the images all are 24bit, even after White Balance correction in Camera Raw.
Thanks for taking the time to help me figure this out. It's been causing a huge problem this week.

Working Without White Balance

Camera: Nikon D90
Adobe CS5 Design Suite
My goal is to work in Photoshop and Camera Raw without using White Balance.
As I understand, the camera stores within the raw NEF file what was seen by the camera chip without correction. For example, if the camera chip sees say 10,000 red photons, this is stored as say 200. If the camera chip sees 20,000 red photons, this is stored as 400. Hence, it is linear. Of course, the actual storage is as a Bayer array.
http://www.cambridgeincolour.com/tutorials/camera-sensors.htm
In theory, from the raw NEF file, one should be able to reconstruct the image that fell upon the camera chip.
On the camera itself, there are many camera White Balance settings. However, it lacks a "None" i.e. "As Is" setting meaning do not assume anything about the light source and make no correctons. Just record the photon levels and give me back the same image that was focused on the camera chip.
As an experiment, I shot a daylight scene using 2,500K (obviously, an extreme value) for the white balance. When I look at the raw file in Camera Raw, the "As Shot" shows a heavy blue tint. Hence, Camera Raw was using the 2,500K white balance selecting of the Nikon for the "As Shot" setting in Camera Raw. Looking at the Camera Raw basic panel White Balance drop down items, there is no "None". Hence, Camera Raw always assumes there is a White Balance and makes corrections.
Why would I want to do this? For example, I have multiple varied color light sources. I want to see exactly the image my eye sees. I do not want the camera making corrections since there is not a single light source for it to make assumptions about how to correct.
Is there a way in Photoshop or Camera Raw to show me the image without any white balance correction. Thanks in advance.

Petrula wrote:
Camera: Nikon D90
Adobe CS5 Design Suite
My goal is to work in Photoshop and Camera Raw without using White Balance.
As I understand, the camera stores within the raw NEF file what was seen by the camera chip without correction. For example, if the camera chip sees say 10,000 red photons, this is stored as say 200. If the camera chip sees 20,000 red photons, this is stored as 400. Hence, it is linear. Of course, the actual storage is as a Bayer array. In theory, from the raw NEF file, one should be able to reconstruct the image that fell upon the camera chip.
On the camera itself, there are many camera White Balance settings. However, it lacks a "None" i.e. "As Is" setting meaning do not assume anything about the light source and make no correctons. Just record the photon levels and give me back the same image that was focused on the camera chip.
The sensor is linear, but the sensitivities of the red, green and blue channels differ, so one must take these differing sensitivities into account when rendering the image from the raw data. As demonstrated by others, channel multipliers of unity (UniWB) do not yield the intended result. To obtain your intended result, empirically determined multipliers would be necessary. When used for white balance, these multipliers are chosen to that a white target will have equal RGB values in the rendered image. For your purpose, multipliers would need to be chosen so that the white target would assume the color of the incident light. In other words, if the white target were illuminated with reddish light, the image would be reddish and not white.
Why would I want to do this? For example, I have multiple varied color light sources. I want to see exactly the image my eye sees. I do not want the camera making corrections since there is not a single light source for it to make assumptions about how to correct.
Is there a way in Photoshop or Camera Raw to show me the image without any white balance correction. Thanks in advance.
On the camera itself, there are many camera White Balance settings. However, it lacks a "None" i.e. "As Is" setting meaning do not assume anything about the light source and make no correctons. Just record the photon levels and give me back the same image that was focused on the camera chip.
As an experiment, I shot a daylight scene using 2,500K (obviously, an extreme value) for the white balance. When I look at the raw file in Camera Raw, the "As Shot" shows a heavy blue tint. Hence, Camera Raw was using the 2,500K white balance selecting of the Nikon for the "As Shot" setting in Camera Raw. Looking at the Camera Raw basic panel White Balance drop down items, there is no "None". Hence, Camera Raw always assumes there is a White Balance and makes corrections.
Why would I want to do this? For example, I have multiple varied color light sources. I want to see exactly the image my eye sees. I do not want the camera making corrections since there is not a single light source for it to make assumptions about how to correct.
Is there a way in Photoshop or Camera Raw to show me the image without any white balance correction. Thanks in advance.
I infer that you want the captured image to reflect the spectra of the actual scene luminances (or more likely a metameric tristimulus match) rather than how you perceive them. The human visual apparatus exhibits chromatic adaption, whereas the sensor does not. The CIE xyz model assumes complete chromatic adaption and the color models based on CIE models need a white point to operate, so you are attempting to use ACR in a manner other than for which it was intended. There is an interesting exercise on the Stanford web site that shows how one can use a digital camera (the Nikon D70) in conjunction with a spectrophotometer to obtain spectrophotometric data from the camera. To recreate the actual spectra, two additional colored filters are required, but if one merely needs a metameric tristimulus match, perhaps only the three native CFA filters of the camera would be needed.
http://scien.stanford.edu/pages/labsite/2006/psych221/projects/06/clintonk/index.htm
Going back to ACR, experience indicates that if one wants to recreate the appearance of a colorful sunset or a candlelit scene (cases that exceed the limits of chromatic adaption), a daylight color balance works best. It would seem intuitively that an equal energy illuminant (CIE Illuminant E) would be appropriate. This corresponds to a correlated color temperature of approximately 5455K.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standard_illuminant

No white balance in camera raw

i am trying to use iphoto instead of Photoshop to correct my raw images, but in the Adjustments pane i don't see a white balance correction. am i doing something wrong?

I looked at the Help, and it pointed me to the Eyedropper tool. That's that little icon left of the Tint in the adjust palette. It does exactly what white balance used to.

White Balance in LR vs. Aperture

I'm comparing LR and Aperture for use with my Pentax K10D. What's amazing is how different the RAW conversion is in each program. I now have a full appreciation of RAW files as "digital negatives" and the software programs as "developers".
For example, a RAW file that appears properly exposed on my K10D will also be properly exposed in LR. However, that same file will be overexposed by 2/3 a stop in Aperture (of course this is recoverable, but interesting nonetheless). I imagine this has something to do with the different tone curves applied to the RAW file by the camera, Aperture and LR. LR seems to be more similar to what is done in-camera on the Pentax K10D.
One thing I can't figure out though is why white balance values would be different in each program. I thought WB was simply stored as a number (kelvin) in the camera, and the RAW converter just reads that number. Clearly I'm mistaken here, because in several test photos I opened in both Aperture and LR, the white balance is dramatically different. (Both WB settings are "as shot"). For example, for the same photo, in Aperture WB was 5950 and in LR it was 4550.
The programs must have a different way of calculating or displaying this info, because when I use Aperture's WB settings in LR, or vice versa, the images don't look the same at all. The tint sliders seem to be very different as well.
Any insight you could offer on this would be appreciated. At the end of the day I can produce very similar results in both programs with adjustments, but I'm trying to figure out which one's default settings are closest to what I prefer.
Finally... what effect do the following preferences have, and is it advisable to use them?:
- "Make defaults specific to camera serial number"
- "Make defaults specific to camera ISO"

If you consistently get White balances in LR that are far off, it could be that the WB decoding algorithm for this camera is wrong. You might want to submit a bug report in that case. You should be able to see the actual white balance in the manufacturer's software (don't know if pentax makes any). You can also open it up in the open source dcraw (or its outstanding GUI derivative
ufraw) program. The author of dcraw has basically cracked all the RAW formats that are in use and it almost always reads white balance correctly. Also, exiftool might read those values.

White Balance in PSE3

Is there a plug-in for white balance correction for PSE 3 for us JPEG shooters?
Thanks
Richard Cooper

Hi Colin, My first time on this forum and you've just changed my life ;-). Thanks! Beth On 4/5/06 6:25 AM, in article [email protected], "[email protected]" <[email protected]> wrote: > One of the things I've tried to get my head around is the difference between > an incorrect white balance and a colour cast. > > Technically an incorrect white balance shifts all the colours depending on the > light source. A colour cast adds an offset colour to all colours. Is this the > same thing? > > However, I don't think you need a plug in to get reasonable results in JPEG - > even if you think it's a white balance or colour cast issue. > > Try this on the images from the link. I think the results are comparable. Its > similar to Bob's suggestion. > > 1. Add a Levels Adjustment Layer > 2. Double click on the White Level Eye Dropper and when the colour picker > window pops up set R=G=B to 245. This is just off white and prevents burn out. > 3. Close the Colour Picker and then click on the White Snow or the white rice. > > Tell me what you think of the result? > > Colin

Can't get decent white balance

I shot some photos with my Canon EOS outside with the white balance set to 3200. The photos are, of course, blue. In iPhoto, using the slider, I can get almost perfectly corrected white balance with great skin tones. Bringing the photos into Aperture and using the white balance correction slider doesn't get me close to what iPhoto did. What's up with this?
RM

It’s a common problem. Usually because of PC monitors being back lit and often set very bright. So the representation on the PC will be different compared with on photo paper. Nice image by the way.
Most labs use the sRGB color space; so make sure you are saving your print copy with that profile. If you view your image on screen by getting down on your knees, and looking up at your monitor rather than from eye level, you will get an indication of how dark the image really is.
I always make separate copies for print with an overall levels adjustment and with sharpening as the final edit, based on each different print size. I would suggest for this image moving the middle pointer to 1.75 but you may need to experiment with different settings. Make a test batch and compare them when you get them back from Walmart to see which works best and use that in future.

Apply White Balance To Multiple Images

Now that I'm shooting RAW all the time, I'm really, REALLY getting tired of having to manually change the white balance for every single image. As many of you probably know, you can select any number of images in Abode RAW, and then use your WB source image to mass-apply the white balance to said images. Further, you can select images and then contextual-menu to apply changes.
For the life of me, I cannot see how to do this in Aperture. I've tried everything I know to do, but I still have to manually activate individual images and then set the WB. If I could mass-apply a preset to a group of pics, that'd be passable -- but I don't see how to do that, either.
Thoughts? Advice? Solutions?
Thanks,
Maury

Hello! One way to do it is to first make sure that Primary Only is off. Then make the white balance correction to an image. Then use the Lift tool to lift the white balance off it. A dialog box will open showing you what is being lifted. Now you can shift-select a beginning image and an ending image. The shift-select will apply the Stamp to everything in between.

Loss of white balance correction

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