Perennial colour management question (browser srgb)

Howdy folks,
I wish I knew why my photos get banding and crushed blacks in the colour managed browsers, but the exact same image looks fine in the color managed applications - bridge and photoshop.
Chrome and firefox do this:
Eeek!  Green in my skies!
Photoshop does this:
and IE displays the colours incorrectly but without banding!
I've wondered about this for year.  I thought at one point it might be a monitor profile setup issue, but it happens on both my monitors, I've changed  systems and graphics cards. 
Heres the whole image:
Here in chrome that sky has bands of purple and green (or at least turquoise).  Anyone else seeing that?

Hi again all,
I've finally found some time yesterday to investigate this further and re-calibrate my monitor.
I nuked the previously created ICC monitor profile (so that there was none applied) and set to work with my Lacie Blue Eye device and the Lacie Blue Eye Pro software package. I set my preferred settings to 6500K, Gamma 2.2, 120cd/m2 and put the monitor into 'Standard' colour preset. I ran a test on those settings and while the colour and gamma levels were close-ish, the Lum was in the mid-high 200s...way too bright. (No wonder I felt like I was getting a tan sitting in front of the monitor. LOL!) DeltaE scores were okay but not great... Time for the manual calibration.
Set the monitor into 'Custom' colour preset and fired up the Lacie calibration software for the full calibration. Can't remember exactly how far the brightness and contrast controls had to come down, but from memory it was about 30 and 50 respectively. The RGB levels ended up in the high 80s each from memory. Ran the calibration, applied the newly created profile (double checked it was applied in Control Panel | Colour Management). Ran another test report with the Lacie software and got colour, gamma and lum results 0-1% from target, and average dE scores of 0.4, max dE of 0.7.
RAW files in LR and PS CS4 appear the same, sRGB jpeg exports viewed in Windows Photo Viewer and Firefox appear the same, IE is still a bit out, but that's expected/known.
I took the (exported jpeg) images to another computer with a cheapy (uncalibrated) LCD monitor and the results were perfectly fine when viewed in Windows Photo Viewer.
Having greatly reduced the brightness of my monitor I should hopefully reduce the likelihood of having issues with prints coming back too dark. Of course I know I can get hold of the printer profiles from my lab and softproof the images in CS4 when it comes to that anyway.
Thank you all for your input and feedback on this matter. Everything seems to be resolved now.
Chris

Similar Messages

  • Basic colour management questions

    Hi,
    I am a biology PhD student and I am reasonably proficient in using computers for everything except when it comes to colour management. I frequently encounter people at Uni who struggle when working on posters etc. because the colours do not print the way they looked on their monitors. I try to explain that most computer monitors are not calibrated correctly.
    Anyway, I have my monitor calibrated, the area where I run into trouble is when assigning colour profiles. For example, I need to scan some photos using a flat bed scanner, and I don't know which colour profile to assign it. Should I assign it the calibrated profile that I created or will this only work on my computer. I need to be able to share these images and know that they will look the same on other computers.
    I also don't understand what is meant by converting to a working space. I have an Apple PDF about Tiger colour management but it is a bit too technical for me.
    Basically I was hoping someone could explain the basics to me or point me towards a good article.
    One last question, the scanner I use is a very old UMAX Astra 2100U scanner that does not work in OS X. I have to boot up in Windows and scan there then go back to OS X. Am I likely to run into problems taking the picture between the two OSes?
    Thank-you in advance,
    Ben

    Ben_ wrote:
    What is the point of using profiles other than these two. For example, I know most digital cameras embed their own profile. Is there an advantage to using this over say Adobe RGB or should I always convert these images to Adobe RGB or sRGB?
    Scanner & camera profiles have two main purposes AFAICT: in colour-managed environments where the original file is sent to a printer or displayed on a monitor, the profile will enable the output to be adjusted for the idiosyncracies of the imaging device; and when opening a file for editing, the device profile will (in theory at least) allow a more accurate conversion to the program’s working space.
    If I was editing an image that I planned to print, why would I use Adobe RGB rather than convert the image to CMYK mode? Or is the colour mode (CMYK vs RGB) separate from the colorsync profile?
    Yes, there are various CMYK profiles as well: some are for particular printers, while others (like SWOP, Standard Web Offset Printing) attempt to encapsulate typical commercial printing environments. I work in prepress, where CMYK is always the eventual destination—but a printer that uses six or more colours of ink can often represent a larger portion of the RGB gamut than a four-colour press can, for example producing more vivid blues than would be possible in CMYK.
    Another issue is that CMYK images that have been optimized for prepress often look somewhat dull or ‘washed out’ on a monitor, especially one that has a high colour temperature (as is typical outside a prepress environment). If the image been tagged with an appropriate CMYK profile, the display may be able to compensate to some extent, but conversion from RGB to CMYK very frequently results in some ‘shoehorning’ of a wide range of colours into a narrower one.

  • CS4 Colour Management question(s)

    Ok, here goes...
    My team of designers create adverts in InDesign that are to appear in either a newspaper OR a glossy magazine.
    We employ an Ad Tracking system that provides a blank InDesign template for them to work from.
    The Ad Tracking system knows if the advert is for newsprint or glossy and provides a template where the CMYK Working Space is either ISOnewspaper26v4 or ISO Coated v2 300% (ECI) respectively.
    We only ever place CMYK images into these adverts. These images have been converted in Photoshop using the same ICC Profiles (depending on destination) as above. Profiles are not included in the images.
    We then output a PDF with "No Colour Conversion" and "Don't Include Profiles" in the output settings.
    We have been working this way for years but I would like to introduce an RGB workflow where we can place RGB images in InDesign and output a PDF that is not yet specifically for Newsprint or Glossy.
    I don't want InDesign to convert to a profile but our Ad Tracking system can route this "generic" PDF through a system called Asura from One Vision that does the conversion to Newsprint or Glossy using the relevant output ICC Profile.
    My questions...
    1. Am I correct in thinking that the RGB and CMYK values of the placed images will not change in the PDF exported from InDesign?
    2. How are placed images affected by the Working Space?
    3. Does "Emulate Adobe InDesign 2.0 CMS Off" give a non-specific document?
    I have watched both David Blatner's and Chris Murphy's titles on Colour Management on Lynda.com and thought I had a reasonable grasp of basic colour management until I came to think about changing workflow.
    Any help would be greatly appeciated.
    Thanks
    Simon.

    Thanks Rob, well explained.
    Just a couple more questions if you don't mind...
    How would you create an InDesign document with no profile assigned?
    and
    Does it matter if a document has a Glossy profile assigned and the exported PDF is then converted to Newsprint downstream? Is this just a case of the downstream conversion needing to know what profile was assigned to the document and the placed images?
    Thanks again.
    Simon.

  • Yet another colour management question

    Hi folks,
    I've read several of the very detailed colour management posts/threads here already but haven't found the answer(s) I'm looking for. So I'm hoping that some of the experts might be able to spare me some time and input...
    I am running a Windows 7 (32bit) environment with a Dell u2711 Ultrasharp display attached. I let the monitor warm up for close on 30 minutes and ran an 'Easy' calibration with a Lacie eye-one device using the Gretag Macbeth 3.6 software. (I guess I could have used the 'Advanced' calibration option but thought I'd save myself some time and was always pleased with the results on my older Sony CRTs.)
    I'm running LR3.2 and CS4. Viewing RAW images in LR the skin tones are way too saturated, but when I export the images as sRGB JPEGs the results look very pleasing when viewed in Windows Photo Viewer (far less saturated). If I open the same image in IE, it looks identical to the way it looks in LR. (I don't have Firefox installed so haven't compared that). If I open the image in CS4 by default it looks the same as it does in Windows, but if I change the Proof Setup to Monitor RGB it matches what I am seeing in LR and IE.
    I'm guessing this is somehow related to the new wider gamut range that this monitor can display (compare to my previous CRTs). I read in one of Jao's posts that LR is always right and other non-managed apps will do weird things on high-end displays. IE is not colour managed so why would it display colours very similar to what I'm seeing in LR, when the standard Windows image viewer is displaying colour far less saturated (which seems to be the opposite to what others are experiencing)?
    I generally always export as sRBG jpeg as the images usually go online, but this set is going to a client who will most likely be taking them for printing as well as viewing on a PC.
    Looking forward to your input on this.
    Kind regards,
    Chris

    Hi again all,
    I've finally found some time yesterday to investigate this further and re-calibrate my monitor.
    I nuked the previously created ICC monitor profile (so that there was none applied) and set to work with my Lacie Blue Eye device and the Lacie Blue Eye Pro software package. I set my preferred settings to 6500K, Gamma 2.2, 120cd/m2 and put the monitor into 'Standard' colour preset. I ran a test on those settings and while the colour and gamma levels were close-ish, the Lum was in the mid-high 200s...way too bright. (No wonder I felt like I was getting a tan sitting in front of the monitor. LOL!) DeltaE scores were okay but not great... Time for the manual calibration.
    Set the monitor into 'Custom' colour preset and fired up the Lacie calibration software for the full calibration. Can't remember exactly how far the brightness and contrast controls had to come down, but from memory it was about 30 and 50 respectively. The RGB levels ended up in the high 80s each from memory. Ran the calibration, applied the newly created profile (double checked it was applied in Control Panel | Colour Management). Ran another test report with the Lacie software and got colour, gamma and lum results 0-1% from target, and average dE scores of 0.4, max dE of 0.7.
    RAW files in LR and PS CS4 appear the same, sRGB jpeg exports viewed in Windows Photo Viewer and Firefox appear the same, IE is still a bit out, but that's expected/known.
    I took the (exported jpeg) images to another computer with a cheapy (uncalibrated) LCD monitor and the results were perfectly fine when viewed in Windows Photo Viewer.
    Having greatly reduced the brightness of my monitor I should hopefully reduce the likelihood of having issues with prints coming back too dark. Of course I know I can get hold of the printer profiles from my lab and softproof the images in CS4 when it comes to that anyway.
    Thank you all for your input and feedback on this matter. Everything seems to be resolved now.
    Chris

  • Illustrator and Blending modes. Colour managing question.

    Let's say i make 2 circles with 2 different fill colours. Then i intersect and blend them with multiply. Is there any way to save the colour resulting on the intersection?
    Thank you!

    Duplicate the 2 circles.
    Object > Flatten Transparency.
    Select the intersection colour and add it to your swatches.
    Get rid of the duplicated objects.

  • SRGB vs no Color Management question

    I have two workflows for Photoshop that produce the exact same results and I want to know which one to use, but most importantly why?
    WORKFLOW 1: NO COLOR MANAGEMENT
    1. Photoshop Color Settings is set to "Monitor Color" which tells the PSD to not use color management.
    2. I check with Proof Colors (View > Proof Colors), having Monitor RGB selected (View > Proof Setup > Monitor RGB), and of course nothing changes.
    3. I Save for Web and nothing changes (If I select "convert to sRGB" in the Save for Web dialog the colors wash out so I NEVER check this).
    4. Export the image.
    WORKFLOW 2: sRGB
    1. Photoshop Color Settings is set to "North America General Purpose 2" which tells the PSD to use sRGB.
    2. I check with Proof Colors (View > Proof Colors), having Monitor RGB selected (View > Proof Setup > Monitor RGB), and the colors change a good bit.
    3. I Save for Web and it matches what Proof Colors shows me (If I select "convert to sRGB" in the Save for Web dialog nothing changes).
    4. Export the image.
    Both of these yeild the exact same image. The technical difference is that the second image has sRGB embedded? From a workflow difference I perfer the first one since I never have to check if Proof Colors is selected, the image looks the same no mater what. In the second workflow I have to always check if Proof Colors is selected otherwise what I see in photoshop doesn't look the same as the exported image.
    PLEASE help me to understand, that while both of these workflows yeild the exact same image, why the second one is better because I feel like the first one is not.
    P.S. Majority of the work I do is for the screen (web or application UI) so I'm not to worried about print work but wouldn't mind any pointers in relation to this situation.

    It's about 1:30 AM in my part of the world I need to get some rest, so I'll have to be brief.
    I've never seen so many misconceptions crammed into a single post as you've managed to get in your last one. 
    I'll try to get at least the most glaring ones.
    eddit wrote:
    1. I do understand that of the millions on monitors there are none that match, and the exact reds, greens, and blues that I see on my screen differ from other screens (i have a number of computers in my home and am very aware of this).
    Good, but that's not the point. 
    eddit wrote:
    I also know that there is a huge gamma shift from PC to Mac as I use to be a PC users and am now on a Mac.
    Only if the Mac user is still living in the stone age.  Macs should be calibrated to gamma 2.2, just like a PeeCee.  The old gamma 1.8 standard is a relic left over from the day of Apple monochrome monitors and LaserWriter b&w printers.  Even Apple recommends 2.2.
    eddit wrote:
    why would I work with a psd that is color managed, if it will all just get dumped by the browser anyways?
    Because presumably you want to have a clue as to what your image looks like and what it might look like to others.
    This is totally independent from whether you embed a profile or not.  Different issue.
    eddit wrote:
    2. I'm not talking about EMBEDDING profiles into any of the images that I Save For Web.
    Neither am I.
    eddit wrote:
    3. I am far more interested in color consistency rather than color accuracy as G Ballard points out in his tutorials.
    The only way to achieve consistency is through a color managed workflow.  That's what Color Management is all about, consistency.
    eddit wrote:
    From what G Ballard says, in a web browser, Macs apply the monitor profile and Windows applies sRGB.
    Good grief!  That is so wrong or badly phrased that I feel bad even quoting it!   That statement is garbage/rubbish.
    Only the bloody Slowfari (Apple's Safari) throws monitor profile at untagged files, i.e. files with no embedded color profile.  No other browser does that.  Period.  If the file is tagged, Safari will honor the embedded profile.
    Firefox 3.9 (both Mac and Windows) correctly assumes sRGB for untagged files (files without an embedded color profile) with color management enabled in the guts of Firefox and/or even with color management disabled.
    All other browsers on this planet, Mac and Windoze, are not color managed and assume sRGB for all files, with or without an embedded profile.
    The reason the files look very similar to you is that you are dealing with the lowest common denominator (sRGB, where the s stands for sh¡t, as we know now), and probably your color monitor is pretty close to that common denominator.
    If you happened to have an expensive truly wide-gamut monitor, your untagged files created in your monitor profile as working space would look like cr@p to you.
    Get this through your head:  you cannot turn off color mangement in Photoshop, no matter what you do, the application won't let you.  You're just messing up with color management the way you work, you are not "turning it off" as you seem to think.

  • How do I fix colour picker to work across different colour-managed monitors?

    Hey everyone!
    I'm assuming this problem I'm having stems from having colour-calibrated monitors, but let me know if I'm wrong!
    To preface, this is the setup I have:
    Windows 7
    3 monitors as follows, all have individual colour profiles calibrated using the Spyder 3
    Cintiq 12WX
    Dell U2410
    Dell 2409WFP
    Photoshop CS6 - Proofed with Monitor RGB, and tested with colour-managed and non-colour-managed documents
    I usually do most of my work on the Cintiq 12WX, but pull the photoshop window to my main monitor to do large previews and some corrections. I noticed that the colour picker wouldn't pick colours consistently depending on the monitor the Photoshop window is on.
    Here are some video examples:
    This is how the colour picker works on my Dell U2410: http://screencast.com/t/lVevxk5Ihk
    This is how it works on my Cintiq 12WX: http://screencast.com/t/tdREx4Xyhw9
    Main Question
    I know the Cintiq's video capture makes the picture look more saturated than the Dell's, but it actually looks fine physically, which is okay. But notice how the Cintiq's colour picker doesn't pick a matching colour. It was actually happening the opposite way for a while (Dell was off, Cintiq was fine), but it magically swapped while I was trying to figure out what was going on. Anyone know what's going on, and how I might fix it?
    Thanks for *any* help!
    Semi-related Question regarding Colour Management
    Colour management has always been the elephant-in-the-room for me when I first tried to calibrate my monitors with a Spyder colourimeter years ago. My monitors looked great, but Photoshop's colours became unpredictable and I decided to abandon the idea of calibrating my monitors for years until recently. I decided to give it another chance and follow some tutorials and articles in an attempt to keep my colours consistent across Photoshop and web browsers, at least. I've been proofing against monitor colour  and exporting for web without an attached profile to keep pictures looking good on web browsers. However, pictures exported as such will look horrible when uploaded to Facebook. Uploading pictures with an attached colour profile makes it look good on Facebook. This has forced me to export 2 versions of a picture, one with an attached colour profile and one without, each time I want to share it across different platform. Is there no way to fix this issue?
    Pictures viewed in Windows Photo Viewer are also off-colour, but I think that's because it's not colour managed... but that's a lesser concern.

    I think I've figured out the colour management stuff in the secondary question, but the weird eyedropper issue is still happening. Could just be a quirk from working on things across multiple monitors, but I'm hoping someone might know if this is a bug/artifact.
    Going to lay out what I inferred from my experiments regarding colour management in case other noobs like me run into the same frustrations as I did. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong - the following are all based on observation.
    General Explanation
    A major source of my problems stem from my erroneous assumption that all browsers will use sRGB when rendering images. Apparently, most popular browsers today are colour-managed, and will use an image's embedded colour profile if it exists, and the monitor's colour profile if it doesn't. This was all well and good before I calibrated my monitors, because the profile attached to them by default were either sRGB or a monitor default that's close to it. While you can never guarantee consistency on other people's monitors, you can catch most cases by embedding a colour profile - even if it is sRGB. This forces colour-managed browsers to use sRGB to render your image, while non-colour-managed browsers will simply default to sRGB. sRGB seems to be the profile used by Windows Photo Viewer too, so images saved in other wider gamut colour spaces will look relatively drab when viewed in WPV versus a colour-managed browser.
    Another key to figuring all this out was understanding how Profile Assignment and Conversion work, and the somewhat-related soft-proofing feature. Under Edit, you are given the option to either assign a colour profile to the image, or convert the image to another colour profile. Converting an image to a colour profile will replace the colour profile and perform colour compensations so that the image will look as physically close to the original as possible. Assigning a profile only replaces the colour profile but performs no compensations. The latter is simulated when soft-proofing (View > Proof Colors or ctrl/cmd-Y). I had followed bad advice and made the mistake of setting up my proofing to Monitor Color because this made images edited in Photoshop look identical when the same image is viewed in the browser, which was rendering my images with the Monitor's colour profile, which in turn stemmed from yet another bad advice I got against embedding profiles .  This should formally answer Lundberg's bewilderment over my mention of soft-proofing against Monitor Colour.
    Conclusion and Typical Workflow (aka TL;DR)
    To begin, these are the settings I use:
    Color Settings: I leave it default at North American General Purpose 2, but probably switch from sRGB to AdobeRGB or  ProPhoto RGB so I can play in a wider gamut.
    Proof Setup: I don't really care about this anymore because I do not soft-proof (ctrl/cmd-Y) in this new workflow.
    Let's assume that I have a bunch of photographs I want to post online. RAWs usually come down in the AdobeRGB colour space - a nice, wide gamut that I'll keep while editing. Once I've made my edits, I save the source PSD to prep for export for web.
    To export to web, I first Convert to the sRGB profile by going to Edit > Convert to Profile. I select sRGB as the destination space, and change the Intent to either Perceptual or Relative Colorimetric, depending on what looks best to me. This will convert the image to the sRGB colour space while trying to keep the colours as close to the original as possible, although some shift may occur to compensate for the narrower gamut. Next, go to Save for Web. The settings you'll use:
    Embed Color Profile CHECKED
    Convert to sRGB UNCHECKED (really doesn't matter since you're already in the sRGB colour space)
    and Preview set to Internet Standard RGB (this is of no consequence - but it will give a preview of what the image will look like in the sRGB space)
    That's it! While there might be a slight shift in colour when you converted from AdobeRGB to sRGB, everything from then on should stay consistent from Photoshop to the browser
    Edit: Of course, if you'd like people to view your photos in glorious wide gamut in their colour-managed browsers, you can skip the conversion to sRGB and keep them in AdobeRGB. When Saving for Web, simply remember to Embed the Color Profile, DO NOT convert to sRGB, and set Preview to "Use Document Profile" to see what the image would look like when drawn with the embedded color profile

  • Another color management question

    Hi folks,
    Apologies for yet another color management question, but Im getting very confused and could do with some help. I use a Canon 10D and Canon 30D. Ive come to LightRoom from Pixmantec Raw Shooter.
    As Ive gotten more serious about producing high quality images for both the web and as prints, I thought Id invest in the Colorvision Spyder2 calibration product. So my monitor is now calibrated (quite a difference from what I was seeing!) and I have a calibration profile applied.
    My needs are pretty obvious I want my images to look the same wherever theyre viewed including exported files (such as JPEGs) whether this be on my monitor (in LightRoom, a web browser, Paint Shop Pro, whatever) and on a printer.
    Perhaps Im getting confused because Im trying to compare what LightRoom does with what RawShooter does.
    In RawShooter, when exporting from RAW to JPEG, I can specify the RGB Working Space Im using and then select my monitor profile. I think that what happens is that the export mechanism takes this profile into account and, low and behold, the JPEG looks fine when viewed in any web browser - the colours are exactly the same as in RawShooter. In Paint Shop Pro they look fine too unless I enable Color Management in which case (Im guessing) the monitor profile is, essentially, applied twice! But the upshot is I seem to get the results I want.
    What I cant figure out is how I do this in LightRoom. I can make the same adjustments to the RAW image as I did in RawShooter, but there doesnt seem an option for me to select my profile on export to JPEG only the standard 3 color spaces. Anyway the result is a JPEG that looks somewhat different when viewed in a web browser, or Paint Shop Pro with Color Management turned off. However, if I turn Color Management on in Paint Shop Pro, then it looks fine. So Im assuming that my profile isnt accounted for when exporting JPEGs from LightRoom.
    So any pointers or explanations would be really appreciated. I also acknowledge that this is my first foray into color management, and feel free to tell me to go and read some introductory article (link please!) and then come back with a sensible question if thats whats needed!
    Thanks in advance.
    - Pete

    Lightroom color management.
    a.) Monitor profile used: The profile set as the default in your operating system (e.g. Windows xp). (your monitor profile software usually does this when you calibrate/profile your monitor).
    b.) Working space: ProPhotoRGB
    c.) Export color space: You can choose one of the following sRGB; Adobe RGB or Pro Photo RGB.
    There is no option (afaik) to change a.) or b.) the option you choose in c.) will affect how the exported image will be displayed in color managed applications or non-color managed applications.
    Non-color managed applications are not able to display Adobe RGB or Pro Photo RGB correctly. I guess if you wish a consistent display of your images in color managed and non-color managed applications then the only common factor is sRGB and you should export your images in sRGB color space.
    The benefits of the other expanded color spaces are in printing and you also would have to get this end of your color management correct. Printing profiles to match your printer and each paper being used etc.
    Until you can get this all sorted out you will get better results from sRGB, this is also applicable when using most commercial printing services.

  • Colour management warning for dual display users

    For those of you who require a colour managed workflow and have more than one display, be very careful in Mountain Lion. It appears to have a bizarre bug where images loaded and shown on the primary display (e.g. in Preview) are initially rendered with the colour profile from the secondary display, or something along those lines. Dragging the display window to the secondary display and back again sorts things out. I've filed a bug report.
    If your two (or more) monitors have the same colour profile, you won't have a problem. The only workaround I can see is to set your least important display(s) to all have the same profile as your (probably calibrated, if these things matter to you) primary display, at least until (if?) the bug gets fixed.
    If you want to see it for yourself, set your two displays to differing profiles - e.g. NTSC (1953) on the primary and Wide Gamut RGB on the secondary. Then load an image into Preview - something with lots of shades of red "works" well for the colour profiles mentioned. Take a screenshot of the Preview window as a reference. Move the window to the secondary display; note the colour shift as it gets re-rendered. Now drag it back to the primary display. It'll look quite different compared to the screenshot you took earlier, despite the fact it's the same image being shown by the same application on the same display in the same window... All you did was drag the window between two monitors and back again.
    It doesn't seem to matter if the image in question has a colour profile embedded in it or not. When comparing with your screenshot, feel free to drag the screenshot between the monitors too - after all, it'll be suffering the same rendering bug! You'll still see a different result; in fact it may even be magnified by the accumulated rendering errors.
    Preview isn't the only application affected; I've seen identical issues under harder to replicate circumstances in Safari, for example.
    Given this fault and others I've seen with colour rendering in Lion, plus several new bugs found in Mountain Lion, I'm afraid that if a colour managed workflow is important to you - well - Snow Leopard or Windows...?! Ugh, what a mess

    I've encountered many of the same woes with color management being a graphic designer, but here's my issue:
    Have a 15" (Early 2011) Macbook Pro.  It is turned on with me hooked up to my Dell U2410 and display open for a dual display configuration.  The Dell is my primary monitor. 
    I then unplug my MBP to use it around the house.  I go to plug it back into the Dell for my dual monitor.  I notice that the color on the Dell looks good, but now the MBP has a very blue color temperature.  Like moving from the preconfigured 'Color LCD' profile to 'sRGB' which definitely shifts to a blue color on the MBP. 
    I check the color profiles in System Settings and the Color profiles are correct.  'Dell U2410' for my Dell and 'Color LCD' for my MBP.  But as I said, it's much bluer than standard.  I try to change the color profiles around on the MBP and no matter which I select it's always the same color with no shifts I would expect to see. 
    Only solution I have found is to restart my computer.  Upon restarting all is well again in the world.
    It's pretty annoying having to restart my computer everytime I plug it back into my workstation with Dell and keyboard. 
    Related note: USB does not work when I plug things back and again have to restart to fix this.

  • Yet another colour management thread

    Here is a warm, saturated image worked on in lightroom, converted to adobe RGB on export, converted to SRGB on output from photoshop. (srg profile not embedded).
    Its far too saturated and red
    Here is the same image with the adobe rgb tagged.
    and as srg with the profile embedded.
    Now my understanding is that in IE all of these will display the same (and they do, i've tested it), and they all look like the oversaturated red one.  I also understand that the gamut of your monitor will affect just how red they actually appear.
    Windows also displays  them all the same - the uber red version.
    So the question is - how the frick are we supposed to supply these to our clients?  Bearing in mind they all have different monitors, browsers, OS's.  I've just had the client on the phone complaining about the saturation and it just sounds like so much ******** waffling about gamut and colour managed browsers. 
    Are you to just avoid warm saturated images?  Is there an application that we can distribute with the images that will display them correctly? Because if I leave them on a DVD I have no control over what viewer will mangle the colour management.
    I'd love some feedback on how other photographers deal with this issue.
    EDIT: and joy of joys, adobe obviously strips out the colour managment when these are posted - because the 2nd two look correct in the edit window, but the same as the first when I post it

    I clearly see the differences in you screen shot, although my version of IE seems to obey the color profiles I embed in our imagery.
    I deal with color management like others in this thread - I use calibrated monitors, I profile using sRGB (the lowest common denominator tag for general digital distribution IMO) and advise my clients to do the same (calibrate!). Some commercial clients require CMYK, in that case I edit completly in sRGB and only convert to CMYK when creating final delivery imagery. I use Adobe PS default CMYK settings and I specify this up front in contractual agreements. I have yet to get many complaints that cannot be explained by failure to understand the huge variations in hardware and software that a viewer of digital images might encounter. This allows me to do the best I can and you gotta just let the rest go .

  • How to mimic non colour managed environment in CS6

    Can anyone tell me please if it is possible to see in Photoshop what an image will look like when it is out in the un-colour managed world?.I can see how you can do it if you are saving for web because you can preview it in a browser, but is it possible to do this with TIFs and PSDss please?
    I have a wide colour gamut display and even with it set to sRGB colour mode emulation, sRGB tagged images that look correctly saturated in Photoshop look oversaturated once out of it and in an uncolour managed environment - particularly the reds. If I can replicate this environment in PS I can edit the colours to make them more neutral looking.
    Thanks.

    I think you are very wise t have x2 sRGB displays.  If a large sRGB display had been available I would have bought it.
    Could you bear to help me with another - display issue,please?
    As part of the work I do I have to make screen recordings of images being produced for the magazine.  I use Camtasia for this and they insist on a 1024x768 resolution.  This has been no problem in the past with my standard sRGB display (NEC 2490/2) because the aspect ratio was right for it.
    The aspect ratio was not right for the Spectraview display (2560x1440) so I used the original 2490 also attached to my graphics card to make the recordings at 1024x768.
    Now, something has changed in the arrangements and when I set the 1920x1200 display to 1024x768 the image stretches as if it were in the wide display.  I am defeated as to why the standard display can no longer show 1024x768 at the correct aspect ratio.
    I am not aware of having changed any W7 settings - both displays are recognised. Though I do notice that under the "advanced settings for the W7 resolution window, and under the "Monitor" tab, the 2490 is not available - only the wider display (271) - here is an image that shows this:
    When you open the "Colour Management" tab all the resolutions are available for  the 2490/2 but as I said, when you select the 1024x768, it appears as it would (and does) on the wider display.
    Can you suggest what I've done wrong and how I might fix this, please.
    Thanks.

  • Colour management in CS6 for Internet

    Hi, I am using CS6 but I am having trouble with my colour management for web pages.  When I save the CS6 image for web and view it I always have to go back in and reduce hue by -20 to get colours on the web that I see originally in CS6.
    Workflow: Windows 7, Capture camera RAW Adobe RGB, in CS6 color settings Adobe RGB (1998), work image in Adobe RGB but if target web I view proof colors internet standard RGB, finally i edit conver to profile sRGB, using Adobe color engine on perceptual intent.  I then save for web.  When I view the images on the web or microsoft office 2010 the colours are too vivid, I have to go back into CS6 and decrease hue (especially reds) by around -20, to get on the web what I originally saw on CS6.
    Any help most welcome.  Steve

    Agreed.
    With a wide-gamut monitor like the Eizo CX240, Firefox is definitely the best browser, with gfx.color_management.mode set to 1, as twenty-one describes.  It's the only way of seeing correct colours of untagged photos or graphics (most of which will be sRGB, i.e. quite different from the Eizo's colour space). 
    But bear in mind that many Windows programs are not colour managed, including Microsoft Office and the Windows desktop.  As you found, colours are going to be over-saturated on a wide-gamut monitor unless colour-managed - that is, the monitor has to be correctly profiled/calibrated (as yours is) AND the program displaying the colours has to use colour management. 
    PS - you didn't mention this, but check if your xrite software is creating "v2" or "v4" profiles.  If the software doesn't give that as a choice, then it's almost certainly creating v2 profiles.  Some software misbehaves with v4 profiles, and I recommend v2.  However, if you are using v4 and get any problems, try v2 just to eliminate that. 

  • Hot and Controversial - Colour Management

    Ok, having spent weeks, if not months, trying to get my head around 'colour management' (not easy at my age), I wonder if the entire subject has been overly complicated by the *experts* in this field and whether it really is as important as it is made out to be - to the average user that is.
    I'll start with 2 assumptions - please correct me if I'm completely off-base here: (a) the strength of any chain is measured by the strength of the *weakest link* and (b) the facility of allowing me to choose sRGB or Adobe RGB within my camera (Canon 30D) is irrelevant having set my camera to shoot RAW as this format does not have an associated in-camera colour profile.
    Having downloaded the RAW images from the camera to my computer my first visual sighting of them is as appears on the monitor. Now the importance of having a correctly calibrated and profiled monitor is clear to me, and in fact is something that I have done using the EyeOne display2. So far so good, but here now is what I perceive as the *weakest link* in the entire setup because the colour gamut of your average monitor (mine can be considered average) has no wider gamut than sRGB, and this is a physical characteristic of the monitor - I can't change it even if I wanted to. I believe there are monitors that will display a larger gamut than this but they are in the region of several thousand pounds sterling - way beyond my reach. The same reasoning, to my way of thinking, can be applied to the printer. Even using the correct printer profile to match the ink and paper in use, the output to the printer is still rendered to something approaching the sRGB colour space in your average printer.
    So, we come to the crunch. When in Lightroom (or Photoshop for that matter) I look at the colour preferences I read the following when clicking on sRGB, 'the sRGB colour space cannot encompass the full range of colours available within Lightroom'. Well that's all well and fine, but if my monitor is unable to display let's say the entire ProPhoto colour gamut what's the point in choosing this option anyway?
    As mentioned previously, the weakest link in my setup is the monitor. Wouldn't I be far better off setting up my entire colour management workflow to reflect this weak link i.e. setting the working space in both Lightroom and Photoshop to sRGB. To me this at least would maintain consistency. Is my reasoning correct, are the *experts* really making this subject more complicated than necessary for the *average* user not having monitors and printers costing 'X' thousands of pounds or am I really missing something - not seeing the wood for the trees so to speak?

    >the colour gamut of your average monitor (mine can be considered average) has no wider gamut than sRGB
    Very true. Most current LCD screens have a smaller gamut than sRGB indeed. There are wider screens approaching aRGB, but they are expensive. They are worth their price though.
    >Even using the correct printer profile to match the ink and paper in use, the output to the printer is still rendered to something approaching the sRGB colour space in your average printer.
    untrue. Almost all printers use a CMYK type color space and often they have a few extra inks making it wider. CMYK can reproduce many colors that sRGB cannot, such as (obviously) saturated yellow, cyan, and magenta. aRGB encompasses more of these colors, but only ppRGB encompasses all of the colors even a cheap inkjet can produce.
    >So, we come to the crunch. When in Lightroom (or Photoshop for that matter) I look at the colour preferences I read the following when clicking on sRGB, 'the sRGB colour space cannot encompass the full range of colours available within Lightroom'. Well that's all well and fine, but if my monitor is unable to display let's say the entire ProPhoto colour gamut what's the point in choosing this option anyway?
    There is no color space setting in LR, so I am not sure what you are talking about. You can choose a colorspace upon export, but I have not seen that dialog before. In PS you can set it. The point is that the colors that are outside your monitor's gamut are often simply more saturated versions of the colors on your display. You simply want to be able to print them and not throw the data away to start with. LR has a philosophy of not throwing anything away until you export, print, etc. It always keeps the data and reinterprets all the way from the RAW every time you make a change. This also means converting to your monitor's color space, be it sRGB or other, for display.
    >are the *experts* really making this subject more complicated than necessary for the *average* user
    ? There are no shortcuts in getting correct color. Color vision is a rather complex problem. That said, getting correct color on the screen and on your output is not hard at all. LR makes color management extremely simple by not even giving you a confusing dialog such as PS does. On the Mac, this is completely transparant and on windows, the default sRGB monitor profile should get most people close enough. Most problems in color management come from people setting up PS incorrectly, or doing a half-baked monitor calibration. Also there is a widespread problem in bad printer drivers and bad printer color profiles. It also doesn't help that the most widespread browser is
    color-stupid.

  • My problem is that after printing the first photo or picture, when I come to print a second, both the Colour Management and Epson Colour Controls are greyed out and showing No Colour Management

    I have recently purchased a Mac computer (updated to Maverick) to go with my Epson Stylus Photo RX500 printer which has given excellent service with my old Windows computer. However, when trying to print pictures or photos via Photoshop Elements 11, the best results I can get are using the Colour Management and Epson Colour controls in the printing options box.
    My problem is that after printing the first photo or picture, when I come to print a second, both the Colour Management and Epson Colour Controls are greyed out and showing No Colour Management, The only way I can reset the controls is to shut down the printer and computer and restart.
    Could there may be a setting somewhere that I need to adjust please?  I have been in touch with Epson and they say that the Epson Colour controls are part of the Photoshop Elements software but a post on the Adobe forum brought no results and I am unable to contact Adobe.
    <Edited by Host>

    Hello Garry. Thanks for the reply. I guess I should have used a different title from "How do I post a question?" That should come after trying to resolved the colour settings first. However, to answer your question, after experimenting with all the different settings in Photoshop Elements and Epson software, I now start with PSE11 Colour settings then click "no colour management" then after clicking Print, I choose "More Options/Colour Management/Colour Handling/Printer Manages Colour" then I choose "Page Setup/Layout/Colour Matching" which then shows Epson Colour Controls but I also choose "Layout/Colour Management" which then shows "Colour Controls/Mode" I then of course choose an Epson printer profile depending on the paper I am using. I get good results but as I said, the Colour Matching and Colour Controls are then greyed out. Hope that makes sense.

  • A Colour Management tutorial from an amateur

    Archiving at the end of a long project I came across a document I assembled at the start when I wanted to teach myself about colour management. I spent several weeks reading, experimenting and putting together these notes, but it all came to nought. To quote from the notes:
    …I chose not to use colour management when printing my books on a Xerox iGen3. I converted the InDesign files to PDF with all colour management turned off, and asked the printer to print ‘direct’. The iGen RIP converted RGB images to CMYK, and CMYK images were printed as per the colour numbers. Using certain colour settings for my monitor, and for Photoshop and InDesign, I was able to obtain a very close match between what was on screen and what was on paper without the need for profiles…
    I've asked a fair few questions here over the years, and this forum has been a great help, but I rarely offer anything in return. Well, here's a little something that some people might find useful. A mob of information about colour management, collated from various sources with my tuppence worth here and there to make it flow. It was put together before my InDesign days when I used Pages, so forgive the mediocre layout.
    Colour Management (450k) can be downloaded here: http://www.mediafire.com/?86edp6742ac6zlv (If Peter Spier is reading this: Peter, that's a hot link now; I've upgraded my Mediafire account so there are no more banners).
    If anyone visits here in the future and that link doesn't work (which will happen if I upload a new version), try this one, a link to the folder: http://www.mediafire.com/?an9n0o36nymwv
    Please let me know if there are any gross errors in the PDF and I'll fire up Pages and correct them.

    geoffseeley, Welcome to the discussion area!
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    I believe that indicates that you do not have wireless encryption enabled. If you enabled wireless encryption, the light should turn green.
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    The AirPort Extreme base station (AEBS) has no special features to support video/audio directly. iTunes has nothing to do with the AEBS.
    The AirPort Express (AX) has an audio out port for streaming music from iTunes.

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