2.1 Battery Issue and WiFi
I updated to 2.1 when it came out and overall quite happy with it. But I am getting very mixed results on battery life.
From morning through arriving home from work the battery stays nearly fully charged. Checking email, running a few apps, watching a little video or listing to audio doesn't make much of a dent.
However once I get home the battery starts a fairly rapid drop even though I'm not using it much at home. The only difference I can see is that a home it connects via WiFi (rest of the day no WiFi is available).
Anyone else with battery issues seeing a similar pattern?
My phone lives in range of wifi most of the day, at work or at home.
I have 3g off because I don't live in a 3g area. I turn it on when I drive to the city.
On days when I'm not on the phone a lot, I get easily a day an a half out of the phone. I'd get longer, but its so darned addictive, and I use google reader a lot to follow a lot of RSS threads, and listen to music, and read my mail.
Another poster above says wifi depletes the battery. I seriously doubt this. The wifi radio uses far less power than the 3G or GSM radio. Its just so much more pleasant to use a fast reliable connection than a flaky slow one, that most people probably use the device more heavily on wifi than they do on 3G.
You are correct in your observation that the last 25% of battery goes a lot more quickly than the first 25%. That is a function of the less than perfect technology used to measure battery capacity of Lithium Ion batteries.
Similar Messages
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Poor battery life and WiFi connectivity on iPhone 5s
I have bought a new iPhone 5s 16GB running iOS 8.1.2 3 days ago. The device that I have got has a poor battery life and WiFi connectivity. I have tried lots of methods given on the internet like turned off the auto-brightness, reset the phone to default settings.
Then contacted the Apple Care for battery issue. They asked for the diagnostics to check the problem. They said its happening because of the crash of inbuilt app Springboard asked me to try "Set up as new iPhone". Even after doing all these, I am still getting battery not more than 4 hours.
This is not expected from Apple. Such an awful experience on my first iPhone buying.Puneet_Agg wrote:
I have bought a new iPhone 5s 16GB running iOS 8.1.2 3 days ago. The device that I have got has a poor battery life and WiFi connectivity. I have tried lots of methods given on the internet like turned off the auto-brightness, reset the phone to default settings.
Then contacted the Apple Care for battery issue. They asked for the diagnostics to check the problem. They said its happening because of the crash of inbuilt app Springboard asked me to try "Set up as new iPhone". Even after doing all these, I am still getting battery not more than 4 hours.
This is not expected from Apple. Such an awful experience on my first iPhone buying.
Where exactly did you buy this new 5S? -
How do I download from icloud to phone? Had battery issue and bought new one
How do I download my contacts, apps and all info from iphone to my phone? I had a battery issue and was told that buying a battery and resetting phone to original state may resolve it. It seems okay now, but I need to understand how to restore the info that I backed up on last night. Thanks.
If you want to restore from and iCloud backup you have to go to Settings>General>Reset>Erase All Content and Settings. This will erase the phone. You then go through the activation screens again and when given the option choose Restore from iCloud Backup (see image below). (Connect your phone to and external charger and wi-fi as this sometimes takes a while to finish.)
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IPhone 4s - Battery issue and poor voice quality
I had bought my iPhone in May this year. It was working fine till i think a week back battery started to drain quickly at 10% every hour. I have configured office exchange account for mail and accessing global exchange contacts, Google account as exchange for contact sync and iCloud. i dont keep any contacts on exchange, keep in Gmail only. Was Android user earlier.
I read a lot of posts and tried all solutions such as turning off timezone service in location, turn off and delete all email accounts, kept manual sync for emails, ran the battery down till switch off and charging back to 100%, removed apps i doubted could be syncing data in background, turned off locaiton service totally, turned off calendar, turned calendar notifications, turned of iCloud reminder, notes but no effect. Wifi and Siri are also off.
I notice today that I am getting small circle near operator name rather than E symbol (for edge)and at the same time voice quality of person on other end is bad too, can hear small cracking , clicking sounds, voice breaks. Otther person can hear me properly. I get back E symbol in some different place than my desk. I havent changed my desk so thats not a possibility either.
Someone had suggested queued network thread with exchange can cause the issue so Installed System Activity Monitor app but it doesn't show battery graph or which process is taking CPU or network time. Moreover, it shows 4-5% less battery level than on top in disharging mode !!
Used to get good stats of what is eating the battery in my old HTC Desire but iPhone doesn't offer such feature to diagnosis. Ideally should not be required if phone works as expected.
What do I need to do to get battery life and voice quality back? I will try voice again at home just to rule out bad network at work.
Thanks,
AshishWell, most of what you did is black magic, and has nothing to do with battery drain. But we have no way of knowing how your battery life is below what you think it should be. What are you using it for, what apps do you have, and how much Usage life do you get (settings/general/usage).
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Ios 7.0.4 battery issue and DFU mode restore
Hi guys. My iphone has an issue with its battery since i updated my iphone from ios 6.0.2 to 7.0.1 until now ios 7.0.4. I have tried many things, like turn off parallax, background app refresh, location service, mail to fetch, air drop, bluetooth, celular data, delete icloud back up from iphone, delete email acount, reset all setting, restore from back up, restore and set it as new phone, but all thoose things didn't help. Now I loose 1% for 3 minutes. Before thoose update i loose 1% about 6 minutes.
But i have been oberseving so far to know what is causing this issue. This morning i did the DFU mode restore, exatcly not recovery mode restore. After DFU restore completed, i watched every each percent of my battery begun increases to 4,30 minutes while using internet via safari. After that i restored again from my itunes backup, and the battery back to 1 % / 3 minutes while using safari with the same setting. This is first time my battery increases, and my first time i used the dfu mode restore. So far i always using itunes restore.
I guess there are something make the battery drained. I think that icloud data and email account causes this issue. But when i try delete manually my two email accounts and icloud data backup. My battery still 1% / 3 minutes.
So, are you guys have some experiences? Any ideas?
Thanks before, regards from IndonesiaI'am sorry. I'am using ios 7.0.4 now. I forget to set it before i send that post
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I PHONE 5 BATTERY ISSUE AND PHONE SHUTS OFF
MY I PHONE 5 SHUTS OFF REPEATLY AND BATTERY PERCENTAGE IS SHOWING DIFFERENT NUMBERS
I'd just like to say that ahs70's post on Dec 1, 2013 at 1:17am on Pg. 9 worked for me as well: https://discussions.apple.com/thread/5338609?start=120&tstart=0
If your iPhone's battery is acting up you need to determine if it's a software issue or a hardware/battery issue. To do that, after syncing your iPhone, erase/hard reset all data and settings from your iPhone to what it was from the factory as new. This can be found in Settings/General/Reset/Erase All Content and Settings. Then test it out for a day or two. If it's still acting up then it's likely a hardware issue and you will need to get your battery replaced. If your warranty is done than check out this link to get a battery kit to replace your iPhone battery yourself: http://www.ifixit.com/Store/iPhone/iPhone-5-Replacement-Battery/IF118-001#produc tDescription
If your iPhone is now working properly after hard resetting it than it's most likely a software issue. This battery issue only started after upgrading to the new iOs7, so it is obviously related to the update not properly installing itself. What has worked for me and many others is to manually update to iOS 7.0.4 using the full downloaded version of the update which is about 1.32 Gigs.
But first you need to find out what model of iPhone you have, click here to determine if it's GSM or CDMA: http://support.apple.com/kb/HT3939?viewlocale=en_US&locale=en_US
Then go here and scroll down to download the iOS 7.0.4 complete update for your device: http://www.downloadios7.org/download-ios-7-0-4-ipsw-file.html
Then scroll up on the download page and follow the instructions of updating your iPhone manually following the instructions below: "IPSW with iTunes"
And your done.
Problem solved.
I only posted this because it was a very frustrating problem that no one really seemed to figure out a solution for.
I hope this helps.
Emile Beaulieu -
BOSD, Battery issues and Heating problem after iOS 8 upgrade
i have upgraded my iPad mini to iOS 8. Ever since I upgraded to iOS 8 am facing blue screen issues and heating problem as well. This is really frustrating even the patch iOS 8.0.2 dint solve the problem. Are you guys listening our complaints. When will you fixing it.
The same thing happened to me on my 2012 Subaru Outback. I'm not sure this will help you since you have a Honda, but I'm posting this just in case.
I paired the audio on my car with my iPhone 6. However, when I turned the car off and back on again, the iPhone would not pair automatically. I had to manually connect the iPhone with the car. Turns out there are two separate bluetooth pairings on my car: one for phone which allows up to 5 devices and one for audio which allows only one device. So I did the second bluetooth pairing for the phone (had already done the audio), and that fixed it. YMMV -
Battery issue and warranty question
I bought my macbook pro in Dec 2007 and really love it. Fancy interface, easy usage. And after almost a year in Nov 2008, my battery went bad. Only last for 45 minutes, I check my serial and it said I'm still under warranty so I went to the nearest apple store which is in Glendale Galleria and got a free replacement battery without any problem.
Things went well until now, my macbook pro appeared to be shutdown automatically within 10 minutes of usage eventhough I still have like 90% left. I tried everything but still.
My question is, will I get a free replacement battery again ? I know that my warranty is over, but this battery I got from last Nov, so it is not even a year old. Will it work out or I have to buy a new battery ?
This is my batt info
Battery Information:
Model Information:
Manufacturer: Sony
Device name: ASMB012
Pack Lot Code: 0001
PCB Lot Code: 0000
Firmware Version: 0110
Hardware Revision: 0500
Cell Revision: 0303
Charge Information:
Charge remaining (mAh): 4935
Fully charged: No
Charging: Yes
Full charge capacity (mAh): 5361
Health Information:
Cycle count: 35
Condition: Normal
Battery Installed: Yes
Amperage (mA): 625
Voltage (mV): 12568
System Power Settings:
AC Power:
System Sleep Timer (Minutes): 10
Disk Sleep Timer (Minutes): 10
Display Sleep Timer (Minutes): 10
Automatic Restart On Power Loss: Yes
Wake On AC Change: No
Wake On Clamshell Open: Yes
Wake On LAN: No
Current Power Source: Yes
Display Sleep Uses Dim: Yes
Battery Power:
System Sleep Timer (Minutes): 10
Disk Sleep Timer (Minutes): 10
Display Sleep Timer (Minutes): 2
Wake On AC Change: No
Wake On Clamshell Open: Yes
Display Sleep Uses Dim: Yes
Reduce Brightness: Yes
Hardware Configuration:
UPS Installed: No
AC Charger Information:
Connected: Yes
ID: 0x0100
Wattage (W): 85
Revision: 0x0000
Family: 0x00ba
Serial Number: 0x003d3bf9
Charging: YesYungYang wrote:
My question is, will I get a free replacement battery again ? I know that my warranty is over, but this battery I got from last Nov, so it is not even a year old. Will it work out or I have to buy a new battery ?
Unfortunately there's no one here that can answer that question. This is a user-to-user discussion forum. As all service issues are handled on a case-by-case basis by Apple there are two people that can assist you further:
1.) The agent that picks up the phone when you call (800) APL-CARE
2.) The Genius at the Apple Retail Store that sees you for your appointment
That's the next step at this point, we can speculate here till we're blue in the face. -
HT1933 battery issues and customer services from apple store
I have been a iphone user since january 2013. i have found some issues with the battery of my iphone 5 and booked appointment several times to report to it. the problem was battery dies unexpectedly, for example it dies when it shows even arround 20% remaining sometimes. every times i have made checked it with genius bar the found no problem using there diagnostic system. On 22 december 2013 again i have done some diagnostic test with apple genius bar and they reformat everything and said problem will be solved. however again on 24 december i had to take my phone to genius bar as they problem was still there and it was died suddenly even there were more than 20% charge remaining. Then i got to the stratford apple store and showed my phone to one of the manager named Harnson. i have showed the dead phone and describe him the situation. he tried to switch it on and found that it shows no battery is low as 2% and need to charge. then he take me to genius bar to diagnostic the phone again. in the genius bar when his colleague has switched it on then it showed 24% charge remaining. then i explain that this device has no reliability. it doesn't show the actual percentage. it was 2% few minutes ago and died and now it is showing 24% without any charging. then he diagnostic it again and found no problem....
he replied to me your phone is perfectly find according to the diagnostic report. so they can not do anything about it. i was so much frustrated about the whole service. the staff at the bar was so muuuuuuchhhhh unfriendly and unhelpful. later he talked to one of his colleague and suggested me to pay 100 pound or something to replace with a new phone..
i felt so bad and i was not expect this sort of service from the world famous apple company.. staffs attitude are genuinely very bad and arrogant.
1. how can i prove that there are some problem with the battery. even they have seen that it turns from 2% to 24% without charging. the device is a fault since i bought it. but as it is not showing in the diagnostic test the refused to take any action about it.
2. bad attitude and arrogant staff made me feel even worst.
please note that this staff are nice with white people and im an asian. is that can be a reason of having bad services from apple?????????????no they gave me a new 3g 16 gig, i did ask for a 3gs....it is like for like when it comes to replacing....but i think i was pushing my, luck, but im very happy not to have paid the 139 quid, so a happy customer I am, my problem was that i was out of warranty, i did not take out the extra protection warranty ( silly yes, leason learnt... i hope so )
It was the guy who served me who was fantastic, i cannot fault him, he did not have to wave the extra monies, but he said that i seemed genuine, and the fact i did not jail brake my phone or want to, even know he prompted me to as a suggestion , maybe just maybe this all worked in my favour and the result is i have an iphone that works..... Now my issue is with O2 my telco carrier in the UK, as of Nov this year, O2 pay and go customers are in-titled to have there phones unlocked if they have had there phones for more than 12 months. My phone is 15 months old(all with O2) , so an unlock i can get, but because i have a "replacement phone", the imei number is different to what my initial phone was, they are saying i have to wait another 12 months.... I got a SMS message from O2 today that my unlock application was unsuccessful ..... because i have a different IMEI number to which i started with..... just when u think it is easy...WHAM .... so i have to take on O2 now, more phone calls etc...... Any suggestions anyone, has this happened to anyone you know ?
Cheers -
Airport card will not turn on after security update yesterday. worked normally (for the download of the update) until then. Wifi here works fine with my Macbook Pro right now so the issue is with the card / computer / software not the provider. Did the update change something?
OS 10.6.8 imac core duo. The indicator is on the tool bar but is empty.Airport card will not turn on after security update yesterday. worked normally (for the download of the update) until then. Wifi here works fine with my Macbook Pro right now so the issue is with the card / computer / software not the provider. Did the update change something?
OS 10.6.8 imac core duo. The indicator is on the tool bar but is empty. -
Macbook 2, 1 battery issues and high CPU utilization
I haven't used my macbook 2 1 (intel core duo, 2.16GHZ) for 3 or 4 months. Before it was working fine but now it says that the battery is not charging, although the laptop still works when plugged in. The power report from the system profiler is at the bottom of the thread.
I use this computer primarily for music making using native instruments reaktor, but have found that the CPU utilisation of my patches has doubled compared to when I was using them 4 months ago. 5've not got any other programs open while doing this and all the audio set up is exactly the same as before.
Will buying a new battery sort this out? Any ideas for how to bring the CPU utilisation back to how it was before?
Thanks in advance to anyone who can help!
Battery Information:
Model Information:
Manufacturer: DP
Device name: ASMB016
Pack Lot Code: 0002
PCB Lot Code: 0000
Firmware Version: 102a
Hardware Revision: 0500
Cell Revision: 0102
Charge Information:
Charge remaining (mAh): 0
Fully charged: No
Charging: No
Full charge capacity (mAh): 0
Health Information:
Cycle count: 462
Condition: Replace Now
Battery Installed: Yes
Amperage (mA): 0
Voltage (mV): 5524
System Power Settings:
AC Power:
System Sleep Timer (Minutes): 10
Disk Sleep Timer (Minutes): 10
Display Sleep Timer (Minutes): 10
Automatic Restart On Power Loss: No
Wake On AC Change: No
Wake On Clamshell Open: Yes
Wake On LAN: No
Current Power Source: Yes
Display Sleep Uses Dim: Yes
Battery Power:
System Sleep Timer (Minutes): 15
Disk Sleep Timer (Minutes): 0
Display Sleep Timer (Minutes): 15
Wake On AC Change: No
Wake On Clamshell Open: Yes
Display Sleep Uses Dim: Yes
Reduce Brightness: Yes
Hardware Configuration:
UPS Installed: No
AC Charger Information:
Connected: Yes
ID: 0x0100
Wattage (W): 60
Revision: 0x0000
Family: 0x00ba
Serial Number: 0x005a207d
Charging: NoYou can get a new third party battery fairly cheap on eBay. Every MacBook from 2006 through Mid 2009 except the Late 2008 Aluminum Unibody and the Late 2009 and 2010 White Unibodies use the same A1185 battery.
Black Batteries http://shop.ebay.com/i.html?_nkw=macbook+black+battery&_sacat=0&LH_BIN=1&_sop=12 &_dmpt=Laptop_Batteries&_odkw=macbook+white+battery&_osacat=0&_trksid=p3286.c0. m 270.l1313
White Batteries http://shop.ebay.com/i.html?_nkw=macbook+white+battery&_sacat=0&LH_BIN=1&_sop=12 &_dmpt=Laptop_Batteries&_odkw=macbook+black+battery&_osacat=0&_trksid=p3286.c0. m 270.l1313
Or for $129 from The Apple Store http://store.apple.com/us/product/MA566LL/A?mco=MTY3ODQ5OTY -
K1 youtube issues and wifi shutting off
Thought I would throw this question out there.
I was finally (after restoringmy K1) able to get all my updates complete. I have the latest version as of today on the Honeycomb.
Here is the issue...now my internet is shutting down at random for one thing. I have to go back in each time to settings and turn it back on. There seems to be more touch screen delay or nonrecognition. Finally, I can not watch a youtube video through.
Here is an example of my youtube issue...
I watch it in youtube for mobile which I got from the youtube website. The video starts fine, only takes a few seconds to buffer and then plays. It will play for about 2 to 4 minutes into the video and then it jumps to the end,stops the video and you can not rewind,restart or reset it at all. The only option is to refresh but still same thing happens. I tried using youtube yesterday and today with the same results. Here is the other catch. My son has a cheap nextbook that I decided to try the exact options on side by side just to make sure it was not our internet connection. His worked fine all the way through. Mine juped to the end and stopped. I tried a different video today...same thing.
I have read through other posts. Does anyone have fixes for these issues? Honestly, I have a few more days to actually return this. I just need to make a decision. I am just afraid that I am going to always be rittled with peoblems. However I like the tablet when it is working. I am not really sure how well all tablets work except that I know my son doesn't have the problems that I do. He really has not had a y problems and we bought ours around the same time. I have what seems like a lot of force closes when he rarely has any if at all.
Thanks for any help and imput you all can offer.Well, it is done. I returned the K1 yesterday. I just decided the bugs that I had and the constant frustrations were just not worth it. I think at this time I will just stick with my laptop.
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Zen xtra 30gb battery issue and question about headpho
frist thing is that my zen xtra 30gb is having a minor problem concerning its battery. when i charge it, the meter doesnt fill up, however when i unplug it, the correct amout on the power meter is there. what can i do about this.
second, im supposed to be getting the sony fontopia ex7 within the next few weeks, what would be the best recommendation for eq settings.
if anyone can help, it would be gladly appreciated.Whenever you get strange behaviour run a disk cleanup. To run a Disk Cleanup you need to access the Rescue Mode. To access the Rescue Mode hold down the play button and KEEP it held down, press the tiny reset switch once, and KEEP the play button held down until the player boots into the Rescue Mode. Choose Disk Cleanup from the menu. Note: Disk cleanup should not remove your tracks. It searches through the disk for files and rebuilds the index, and can be useful for correcting any strange behaviour.
If that doesn't help, you might also want to download and install the latest firmware update from Nomadworld.com downloads. Make sure to follow the instructions on the download page about how to upgrade.
If that doesn't help, then flatten the battery through normal use and recharge it fully before using it again (a full recharge takes at most about 4 hours). Do this a couple of times. Sometimes the indicators get "uneducated" and this is supposed to re-educate them. -
Envy x360 battery short and CMOS/RTC | No dedicated CMOS battery = Kafkaesque HP support nightmare
Relevant Case Number:
3015038426
Caveat:
If I'm wrong about this, I'll eat my hat with a sauce made of ultra-expensive brand-name HP ink.
Question:
Does anyone at HP want to take reponsibility for a series of the company's tech support representatives giving horribly wrong hardware information, wasting customer time and money?
Summary:
1. I have apparently experienced a short in my main battery.
2. In the x360, the real-time clock (RTC) and BIOS settings are apparently powered by the main battery, not a separate CMOS/RTC battery.
3. (1) and (2) explain why my symptoms include a CMOS checksum error and 0-set RTC on boot.
4. Three separate HP representatives have been absolutely insistent that:
(a) I have a CMOS/RTC battery that just isn't disclosed in the service manual.
(b) My symptoms indicate the need for CMOS/RTC battery replacement.
(c) This requires a 2-week+ send-in service, even though I live right next to an authorized support center.
(d) A much less intrusive main battery replacement could not help me, since I have a CMOS issue.
5. I have already had to pay $54 and change for a local shop to confirm that HP support has been, for want of better terms, full of it -- they have been BSing me by phone and live chat, and there is no dedicated CMOS battery.
6. Because of HP's intransigence, I now face the choice of either
(a) paying another $54+ to get myself a new main battery on the open market
or
(b) completely unnecessarily going without my primary work machine for weeks in order to get a new main battery for free from HP. That's assuming that the people at the service center know that replacing the motherboard won't do anything for this machine.
Hilarious and/or Depressing Support Record:
1. Symptoms
This is an HP Envy x360 15t hybrid notebook, model u011dx (G6T85UA).
It had been suspended but suddenly appeared off. It would not power on until AC power was attached.
It showed a CMOS checksum error (502) on boot, and its real-time clock did not hold the time between power cycles.
It had inconsistent problems with failed or severely delayed POST completion.
If AC power was removed during operation, it immediately died. Information about the main battery still showed up in the OS, where it appeared fully charged but never discharged at all.
The light next to the AC plug would often blink blue depending on the power state.
The machine could POST normally (except for the CMOS and RTC failures) with the main battery physically detached.
2. Call ("Amit")
I don't have a transcript of my initial call with HP ("Amit"), but here is the gist of it. My 502 CMOS checksum error implicates the CMOS battery. My steps are to attempt a BIOS upgrade. Failing that, the computer would need to be sent in for service so that the CMOS battery could be replaced. Amit described it to me as the shape of a small tablet.
3. False Hope
When I had initially called, the case was off of the PC and both sides of the motherboard were accessible so that I could try to see if there were any visually obvious problems with the CMOS/RTC battery. Naturally, I couldn't find it, and I had hoped the call would help me. In any case, Amit would need to call back in 60-90 minutes after I had the chance to take care of other things and re-connect the machine's components so that I could boot it and do a BIOS upgrade.
Just before he called back, the machine appeared for one or two power cycles to have overcome its problem. It even seemed like it was drawing main battery power for a few moments during a session with AC power detached. Amit closed the case for me pending the problems recurring.
I concluded that one of the following two things must have happened. Either:
(a) All of the problems were related to the main battery, and the main battery connector had just gotten jarred loose so that one or two pins were not contacting properly. By disconnecting and reconnecting the main battery in my search for the RTC/CMOS battery, I had solved the issue by reseating it properly.
or
(b) All of the problems were related to the CMOS battery. But by having it on AC power for testing for a little while, I had charged the CMOS battery enough to enable POST and for it to mediate the transition from AC to battery power (I know this probably isn't how it should work, but hey).
I also updated the BIOS to the newest version so that I could ensure I was following the pre-shipment troubleshooting step set out by Amit.
Fairly quickly after the second call and the closing of the case, all of the symptoms recurred. I carefully re-checked and re-seated the main battery to rule out (a) above. I then decided to run the computer on AC power for several hours to test theory (b) above. When this failed, I went back to the HP site and opted for chat support.
4. First Chat (KARISHMA BARPANDA)
Gist:
I clearly have a problem with my invisible CMOS battery. Also, this CMOS battery is absent from the manual because it isn't supposed to be user-removable, not because it doesn't exist. Note especially the exchange at 2:02.
Transcript:
Spoiler (Highlight to read)
1:38 PM Support session established with KARISHMA BARPANDA.
1:38 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: Welcome to HP Customer Support & Services for Notebook support. My name is Karishma and I will be your technical support specialist today.
1:38 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: Hi
1:38 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: How are you doing today ?
1:38 PM Adam Colligan: Hello; this is related to case 3015038426
1:38 PM Adam Colligan: I'm good; just a little confused
1:39 PM Adam Colligan: PC symptoms implicated RTC battery: CMOS checksum error on boot. But also instant death when AC power removed. Temporarily resolved after re-seating main battery cable, so chalked up to that. Now not so sure: maybe I had just partly charged RTC battery during testing. Now trying long run on AC to rule this out.Query: x360 service manual (unlike other Envy manuals) makes no mention of RTC/CMOS battery. Didn't see one exposed on board. Can you verify presence and location of CMOS batt?
1:40 PM Adam Colligan: Just to clarify: I'm not asking you to walk me through changing a CMOS battery or anything like that -- I know you want notebooks sent in for service if they need that officially. But I just want to make sure that I actually know where the thing is on this model
1:42 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: I am sorry, I can't understand you.
1:43 PM Adam Colligan: Okay, I'll back up. Have you heard of something called a CMOS battery or an RTC battery?
1:43 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: Yes.
1:44 PM Adam Colligan: Would you be able to find out where it is located on my Envy x360 15t notebook (u011dx)?
1:45 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: Alright !
1:46 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: In this situation, we need to take the notebook in free servics repair.
1:46 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: Please, provide me the complete sdhipping address along with the zip code.
1:46 PM Adam Colligan: It is not confirmed yet that the CMOS battery is actually the problem
1:47 PM Adam Colligan: I don't want to set up a service yet. I just want to know *where* the battery is attached to the board.
1:47 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: We need to replace the CMOS battery,
1:47 PM Adam Colligan: How do you know that we need to replace the CMOS battery?
1:48 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: Because tHe CMOS battery is not removable.
1:48 PM Adam Colligan: Well, in that case we're probably talking about replacing the whole motherboard. Do you mean *not removable* or just "not user removable" ?
1:48 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: We will take the notebook in service reapir and our HP certified technician will do the complete hardware diagnostic of your notebook.
1:49 PM Adam Colligan: I don't want to do anything yet except *LOOK* at the board and see if there is anything obviously wrong with the CMOS battery connection
1:49 PM Adam Colligan: I just want to know *where* it is; I don't need to actually do anything to it
1:50 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: Let me explain.
1:51 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: Let me check.
1:52 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: Please, allow me few moments.
1:52 PM Adam Colligan: Thank you
1:56 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: Thank you for staying connected. I appreciate your time and patience.
1:56 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: I am sending you a link, please go through page number 33 and 34.
1:56 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA has sent a link: http://h10032.www1.hp.com/ctg/Manual/c04513489
1:57 PM Adam Colligan: That's okay; I understand that it may take time
1:57 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: CMOS battery is not a customer replaceable part.
1:58 PM Adam Colligan: 33 and 34 refer to the main battery, not the CMOS battery
1:58 PM Adam Colligan: I know that the CMOS battery is not a customer replaceable part. However, I want to visually inspect it.
1:59 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: It is not listed there.
1:59 PM Adam Colligan: Exactly. Compare that to this manual for the HP Envy 17, page 41
1:59 PM Adam Colligan: http://www.hp.com/ctg/Manual/c02160120.pdf
2:00 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: If you are facing any issues with the battery then, we need to take the notebook in service reapir and will fix the issue.
2:01 PM Adam Colligan: Sigh.
2:02 PM Adam Colligan: Look, here is a theory. What if this PC does not have a separate CMOS battery, and it's been using power from the main battery to keep the clock and BIOS settings current? In that case, the symptoms might just be a result of poor seating of the main battery cable. To rule that out, I would like to confirm for a fact that a CMOS battery actually exists on this motherboard, and I'd like to see it with my own eyes.
2:02 PM Adam Colligan: ...before I go without my PC for days or weeks
2:03 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: The CMOS battery exsist in the motherboard and it is not a customer replaceable part.
2:04 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: You cannot see it.
2:04 PM Adam Colligan: So where on the motherboard is it?
2:04 PM Adam Colligan: It's on the motherboard but it's invisible?
2:04 PM Adam Colligan: Maybe it's under a piece of foam by the HDD indicator light? There aren't many places for it to hide
2:05 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: I would suggest you to sent the notebook in service repair, and if there will be any hardware issues, then HP technician will take care of it.
2:06 PM Adam Colligan: Please answer this question honestly for me. Is the location of the CMOS battery actually available to you? It's okay for you to say, "I don't know where it is, and I don't know how to find out where it is". But it seems like you are avoiding saying that.
2:10 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: Let me know are you facing any issues with the HP notebook right now ?
2:11 PM Adam Colligan: Yes. Why won't you answer that question?
2:24 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: I would like to inform you that, the CMOS battery is not a customer replaceable part.
2:24 PM Adam Colligan: What does that have to do with whether or not you know where it is?
2:24 PM Adam Colligan: Is there some rule that you are not allowed to say "I don't know" ?
2:24 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: That is the reason, it is not shown in the manual.
2:25 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: That is the reason, it is not shown in the manual.
2:25 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: The CMOS battery can be replaced by the HP hardware engineers.
2:26 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: So, the CMOS battery can be replaced only in our service center.
2:26 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: Do you want to send your notebook for a free service to replace the CMOS battery ?
2:26 PM Adam Colligan: I think we've established that. I am not asking you about how to replace it. I'm asking if you can find out where it is.
2:26 PM Adam Colligan: It's perfectly alright if the answer is "I don't know", but I do expect that amount of honesty
2:26 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: No, it is not listed in the manual.
2:27 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: I can understand your concern.
2:27 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: As, it is not listed in the manual, let me know how can I assist you.
2:28 PM Adam Colligan: So then the next question is: can I contact a technical support professional who can tell me where it is attached so that I can visually inspect it before committing to a service by mail?
2:30 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: This is the only technical support and you can contact our voice technical support. However, they will tell you the same thing, which I have told you.
1:38 PM Support session established with KARISHMA BARPANDA.1:38 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: Welcome to HP Customer Support & Services for Notebook support. My name is Karishma and I will be your technical support specialist today.1:38 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: Hi1:38 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: How are you doing today ?1:38 PM Adam Colligan: Hello; this is related to case 30150384261:38 PM Adam Colligan: I'm good; just a little confused1:39 PM Adam Colligan: PC symptoms implicated RTC battery: CMOS checksum error on boot. But also instant death when AC power removed. Temporarily resolved after re-seating main battery cable, so chalked up to that. Now not so sure: maybe I had just partly charged RTC battery during testing. Now trying long run on AC to rule this out.Query: x360 service manual (unlike other Envy manuals) makes no mention of RTC/CMOS battery. Didn't see one exposed on board. Can you verify presence and location of CMOS batt?1:40 PM Adam Colligan: Just to clarify: I'm not asking you to walk me through changing a CMOS battery or anything like that -- I know you want notebooks sent in for service if they need that officially. But I just want to make sure that I actually know where the thing is on this model1:42 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: I am sorry, I can't understand you.1:43 PM Adam Colligan: Okay, I'll back up. Have you heard of something called a CMOS battery or an RTC battery?1:43 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: Yes.1:44 PM Adam Colligan: Would you be able to find out where it is located on my Envy x360 15t notebook (u011dx)?1:45 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: Alright !1:46 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: In this situation, we need to take the notebook in free servics repair. 1:46 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: Please, provide me the complete sdhipping address along with the zip code. 1:46 PM Adam Colligan: It is not confirmed yet that the CMOS battery is actually the problem1:47 PM Adam Colligan: I don't want to set up a service yet. I just want to know *where* the battery is attached to the board.1:47 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: We need to replace the CMOS battery, 1:47 PM Adam Colligan: How do you know that we need to replace the CMOS battery?1:48 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: Because tHe CMOS battery is not removable. 1:48 PM Adam Colligan: Well, in that case we're probably talking about replacing the whole motherboard. Do you mean *not removable* or just "not user removable" ?1:48 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: We will take the notebook in service reapir and our HP certified technician will do the complete hardware diagnostic of your notebook. 1:49 PM Adam Colligan: I don't want to do anything yet except *LOOK* at the board and see if there is anything obviously wrong with the CMOS battery connection1:49 PM Adam Colligan: I just want to know *where* it is; I don't need to actually do anything to it1:50 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: Let me explain. 1:51 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: Let me check. 1:52 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: Please, allow me few moments. 1:52 PM Adam Colligan: Thank you1:56 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: Thank you for staying connected. I appreciate your time and patience.1:56 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: I am sending you a link, please go through page number 33 and 34.1:56 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA has sent a link: http://h10032.www1.hp.com/ctg/Manual/c045134891:57 PM Adam Colligan: That's okay; I understand that it may take time1:57 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: CMOS battery is not a customer replaceable part. 1:58 PM Adam Colligan: 33 and 34 refer to the main battery, not the CMOS battery1:58 PM Adam Colligan: I know that the CMOS battery is not a customer replaceable part. However, I want to visually inspect it. 1:59 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: It is not listed there. 1:59 PM Adam Colligan: Exactly. Compare that to this manual for the HP Envy 17, page 411:59 PM Adam Colligan: http://www.hp.com/ctg/Manual/c02160120.pdf2:00 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: If you are facing any issues with the battery then, we need to take the notebook in service reapir and will fix the issue. 2:01 PM Adam Colligan: Sigh.2:02 PM Adam Colligan: Look, here is a theory. What if this PC does not have a separate CMOS battery, and it's been using power from the main battery to keep the clock and BIOS settings current? In that case, the symptoms might just be a result of poor seating of the main battery cable. To rule that out, I would like to confirm for a fact that a CMOS battery actually exists on this motherboard, and I'd like to see it with my own eyes.2:02 PM Adam Colligan: ...before I go without my PC for days or weeks2:03 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: The CMOS battery exsist in the motherboard and it is not a customer replaceable part. 2:04 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: You cannot see it. 2:04 PM Adam Colligan: So where on the motherboard is it?2:04 PM Adam Colligan: It's on the motherboard but it's invisible?2:04 PM Adam Colligan: Maybe it's under a piece of foam by the HDD indicator light? There aren't many places for it to hide2:05 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: I would suggest you to sent the notebook in service repair, and if there will be any hardware issues, then HP technician will take care of it. 2:06 PM Adam Colligan: Please answer this question honestly for me. Is the location of the CMOS battery actually available to you? It's okay for you to say, "I don't know where it is, and I don't know how to find out where it is". But it seems like you are avoiding saying that.2:10 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: Let me know are you facing any issues with the HP notebook right now ?2:11 PM Adam Colligan: Yes. Why won't you answer that question?2:24 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: I would like to inform you that, the CMOS battery is not a customer replaceable part.2:24 PM Adam Colligan: What does that have to do with whether or not you know where it is?2:24 PM Adam Colligan: Is there some rule that you are not allowed to say "I don't know" ?2:24 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: That is the reason, it is not shown in the manual.2:25 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: That is the reason, it is not shown in the manual.2:25 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: The CMOS battery can be replaced by the HP hardware engineers.2:26 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: So, the CMOS battery can be replaced only in our service center.2:26 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: Do you want to send your notebook for a free service to replace the CMOS battery ?2:26 PM Adam Colligan: I think we've established that. I am not asking you about how to replace it. I'm asking if you can find out where it is.2:26 PM Adam Colligan: It's perfectly alright if the answer is "I don't know", but I do expect that amount of honesty2:26 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: No, it is not listed in the manual.2:27 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: I can understand your concern.2:27 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: As, it is not listed in the manual, let me know how can I assist you.2:28 PM Adam Colligan: So then the next question is: can I contact a technical support professional who can tell me where it is attached so that I can visually inspect it before committing to a service by mail?2:30 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: This is the only technical support and you can contact our voice technical support. However, they will tell you the same thing, which I have told you.
5. I pay money to have the CMOS battery checked
Clearly, I wasn't inspired by that chat. Maybe the rep was just wrong about the hardware. More likely, it was just my own ignorance that kept me from finding the CMOS battery, and so I would benefit from a real technician checking it, maybe replacing it or telling me I really did need to send it to HP for service, and also looking at the main battery circuit.
A couple of hours and $54.13 in diagnostic fees later, I had my answer from the technicians. My main battery had a short in it and needed to be replaced. There is no dedicated CMOS / RTC battery on this motherboard. The clock and BIOS use main battery power, and it makes perfect sense that the main battery fault would therefore include symptoms normally associated with a simultaneous failure of a main battery and a dedicated CMOS battery in another computer. This PC is not unique in lacking a dedicated CMOS battery. I could buy a new main battery for around $55.
Obviously, I was now thoroughly upset at HP Support. With this clearly being a main battery issue and the main battery being easy for me to replace and covered by warranty, HP could just send me a new main battery. I wouldn't even care if they wanted to tell me that swapping it myself would void the rest of the warranty period -- better than going without my PC for weeks on end. Failing that, I would probably rather even pay the money for a new battery from a retailer rather than go through the stupidity of sending this PC in just to have the battery swapped out. But now I had already paid the equivalent of that new battery cost just to get the correct information about my hardware, solely because official HP Support had given me false information -- twice!
6. Second chat ("Justine")
Gist:
So I re-connected with technical support in the hope that something could be done to make the situation right. I briefly summarized the problem and gave the case number in the webform submission not shown. Make sure you're sitting down for this transcript and have either whisky or popcorn depending on whether you work for HP or not.
Note in particular at 5:28, where my soul tries to escape my body, and 6:00, where Justine accidentally states the whole issue without actually understanding.
Transcript:
Spoiler (Highlight to read)
5:10 PM Support session established with Justine.
5:10 PM Adam Colligan: Hi Justine
5:11 PM Justine: Thank you for contacting the HP Customer Support & Services. My name is Justine and I will be your chat support specialist today. Please give me a few minutes while I review your issue description details. NOTE: For security reasons, PLEASE DO NOT send credit card information via chat. Also, If you are using a mobile device (iPad, iPod, iPhone, etc....) and experience difficulties viewing the chat window, please initiate a new chat from a Windows or Mac computer or use a different browser for better compatibility.For DISCONNECTED or failed to reconnect, we keep records for all interactions feel free to initiate another chat.
5:11 PM Justine: May I have the phone number and e-mail address associated with your HP product?
5:11 PM Adam Colligan: [redacted]
5:12 PM Justine: In order for me to assist you better, can you please provide the Product and Serial number of the system that is having an issue.
5:13 PM Adam Colligan: Are the contents of the form I filled out not sent? The SN is [redacted] . This is a model G6T85UA
5:15 PM Justine: Thank you for verifying me those information, Adam. I have read your issue description and it seems like you need help in processing a replacement for your computer's battery, is that correct?
5:15 PM Adam Colligan: Yes.
5:16 PM Justine: I apologize for the inconvenience. I will do my best to help you resolve this issue.
5:19 PM Justine: Alright, regarding the incorrect information that our tech had provided you, what is that information again, Adam.
5:20 PM Adam Colligan: My own hunch was confirmed by an independent service center that I had to pay to diagnose this problem: this machine has no dedicated RTC/CMOS battery.
5:20 PM Justine: -
5:22 PM Justine: So the issue is that you went to a local tech and they are charging you for your battery replacement correct?
5:22 PM Adam Colligan: So I wasted both a day of work and over $50 because two technical support representatives told me in no uncertain terms that I was looking at symptoms of a CMOS battery fault. And I *now* face also having to double that money on a new battery unless you guys can make it right.
5:23 PM Adam Colligan: I paid for the diagnosis because they had to go in and determine that HP tech support was, for lack of a better phrase, full of it
5:23 PM Adam Colligan: I even have a hilarious piece of transcript: 2:02 PM Adam Colligan: Look, here is a theory. What if this PC does not have a separate CMOS battery, and it's been using power from the main battery to keep the clock and BIOS settings current? In that case, the symptoms might just be a result of poor seating of the main battery cable. To rule that out, I would like to confirm for a fact that a CMOS battery actually exists on this motherboard, and I'd like to see it with my own eyes.2:02 PM Adam Colligan: ...before I go without my PC for days or weeks2:03 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: The CMOS battery exsist in the motherboard and it is not a customer replaceable part. 2:04 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: You cannot see it.
5:25 PM Adam Colligan: I had even checked the x360 service manuals and compared them to other Envy models, since the CMOS / RTC battery is specified for the other ones. Hence this (apparently completely false) gem: KARISHMA BARPANDA: I would like to inform you that, the CMOS battery is not a customer replaceable part.2:24 PM Adam Colligan: What does that have to do with whether or not you know where it is?2:24 PM Adam Colligan: Is there some rule that you are not allowed to say "I don't know" ?2:24 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: That is the reason, it is not shown in the manual.2:25 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: That is the reason, it is not shown in the manual.2:25 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: The CMOS battery can be replaced by the HP hardware engineers.
5:25 PM Adam Colligan: Apparently the truth is that it's not in the manual because *it doesn't exist*
5:27 PM Justine: I apologize about that, Adam. But to explain this properly, yes the CMOS battery is not a replaceable part. We do not ship CMOS batteries. But if you want, you can consult your local tech about it.
5:28 PM Justine: May I ask why do you want the CMOS battery to be replaced, Adam?
5:28 PM Adam Colligan: Oh my god.
5:28 PM Adam Colligan: You're going to have to just give me a moment here.
5:29 PM Justine: Okay Adam. Please take your time.
5:31 PM Adam Colligan: Before I explain again, let me just ask a question or two. Let's say that, hypothetically, HP Support thought that I needed to replace my CMOS/RTC battery. So I ship it off. Imagine that it arrives at the service center and the techs there discover that there is nothing wrong with the CMOS battery. Instead, they find that the main battery has a short in it and needs to be replaced. Would I have to pay for the replacement of the main battery?
5:32 PM Justine: Alright, first the repair process is that whatever that is we need to replace, we will. also, fortunately, your warranty covers the repair for this computer. We could send it for repair for you.
5:33 PM Justine: Whether the CMOS battery or the main battery, we will fix this computer like brand new for you.
5:34 PM Adam Colligan: And you're saying there is no charge for this?
5:35 PM Justine: Yes Adam.
5:36 PM Justine: It will be for free.
5:36 PM Justine: May I ask for your shipping address?
5:37 PM Adam Colligan: Wait; see, I don't want to do that yet. How long would the whole shipping and repair process take?
5:37 PM Adam Colligan: I've already been told that I have to go through the whole shipping nightmare even though I live right near an authorized service center
5:38 PM Justine: Okay, we will ship you a box with a return label within 2-3 business days, then the repair process would be 7-9 business days maximum. This is for us to make sure that everything will be checked and diagnosed so that when it comes back to you, it would be like brand new.
5:39 PM Justine: We could still send you the box if you want, the box would be active within 30 days, so you could decide when you want it to be dispatched.
5:40 PM Adam Colligan: See, and that's the problem: I might rather just buy a new battery for $53 rather than be without my main work machine for 2 weeks+.
5:40 PM Adam Colligan: And so here's what happened:
5:41 PM Justine: Well, if we send it for repair we can determine if it is really a CMOS issue or the main battery.
5:41 PM Justine: But it would depend on your decision, Adam.
5:44 PM Justine: Are you still there? I want to get your issue taken cared of today. Please respond if you are available to chat.
5:44 PM Adam Colligan: In order to make that choice, I needed to know whether this could really be a CMOS battery issue. If it were, then I would have no choice but to send it in, because that would mean replacing the motherboard (or at a minimum re-soldering to it...so probably replacing it). I would probably also have to spend the time before and after the shipment taking the thing apart myself and putting it back together again because I have my own RAM and my own SSD in there. And so I discussed my symptoms (which included a CMOS checksum error) with two technical support representatives. The initial one was going to take me through a BIOS upgrade attempt and informed me that if it did not resolve, it would need to be sent in for a CMOS battery replacement. I think I had already let him know that I had looked for it just to check if there was anything obviously wrong and couldn't find it, and I had wondered if there really was one.
5:46 PM Justine: Actually if it already gave a CMOS error, it is already that.
5:46 PM Adam Colligan: In the end I did upgrade the BIOS, but when it appeared to work afterward, it was a coincidence. The ticket was closed but I discovered quickly that the problem was still there. It appeared that maybe I had partially charged the CMOS battery and so just needed to try running the machine for several hours to see if it would recharge. When that failed, I contacted HP again, which is where those snippets of transcript come from
5:47 PM Connecting...
5:47 PM Connected. A support representative will be with you shortly.
5:47 PM Support session established with Justine.
5:47 PM Adam Colligan: Once again, I was assured that this really was or could be a CMOS battery issue. I specifically raised my concern that there might not even be a CMOS battery, which is why I tried to focus the conversation on getting the rep to tell me where it is. She very directly and repeatedly told me that it was there -- which meant that I had no choice between a long service and replacing the battery myself.
5:49 PM Justine: The issue is that the CMOS could have already failed so technically, even though it is physically there, the computer is not detecting it anymore. For this, since there is already an error with the CMOS, it should be replaced.
5:50 PM Adam Colligan: But between the fact that the reps had not sounded competent and the possibility that it might be worth it to replace the CMOS battery myself and void the warranty, I was still suspicious. And that's why I found myself spending $54.13 for a third party service provider to tell me what HP should have known all along. This machine does not have a separate CMOS battery. When the main battery fails -- as mine has -- it will cause all the symptoms of a main battery failure *plus* the symptoms of a CMOS battery failure, since *the main battery* powers this board's real-time clock and RAM environment memory
5:51 PM Justine: I could wait for your decision if you want to send it in for repair, Adam. I will still send you a box for the repair, that would be available for use within a month. It is still up for you to decide, Adam.
5:51 PM Adam Colligan: And now you're saying the same thing: that my CMOS checksum error (and also my clock resetting) means there is a problem with the CMOS / RTC battery.
5:51 PM Adam Colligan: Am I correct that that is what you are saying?
5:52 PM Justine: I highly suggest sending it for repair, really. In this case we could provide a proper explanation in your issue.
5:52 PM Adam Colligan: Are you or are you not telling me that I have a CMOS / RTC battery and that it might need to be replaced?
5:53 PM Justine: Every motherboard has a CMOS battery, yours have already failed so it needs to be replaced.
5:54 PM Adam Colligan: See, I think -- and the service center that just looked at it thinks -- that that statement is flat-out untrue.
5:54 PM Justine: You could replace it by yourself like what you want, but first, we do not ship CMOS batteries, and replacing it by yourself will jsut tamper the warranty.
5:55 PM Adam Colligan: And so the important question is: will HP give me a free main battery, which I can install myself without needing to send the computer off, if it turns out that you just became rep #3 to give me false information?
5:56 PM Justine: Actually, we cannot determine that without really having it physically here for further details and with sufficient tests. Our technicians will be testing it not just inside, but physically.
5:57 PM Adam Colligan: You don't need my computer in front of you in order to know whether or not this model *has* a CMOS battery. You are essentially swearing up and down that it has one. If you're wrong, then you've not only cost me the $54 I already spent but will also unnecessarily cost me two weeks+ without my computer
5:57 PM Justine: I apologize but we can only replace the battery if we have the computer in question, and we cannot do that without the error in the main battery itself.
5:57 PM Justine: Every computer has a CMOS battery, what I mean is that we have to perform tests on your computer physically to determine the real issue.
5:57 PM Justine: I apologize about that.
5:57 PM Adam Colligan: So I want to know: if it turns out that this model has no CMOS battery, will HP comp me a main battery in return for the time and money that it has already made me waste?
5:59 PM Justine: Actually, we can send you a box with a return label, so that you can decide. At this point we will just wait for your decision.
5:59 PM Justine: We will only replace or provide on the part that neede to be replaced.
6:00 PM Justine: The CMOS and the main battery has different roles, so we couldn't send you a main battery when it is a CMOS issue.
6:00 PM Justine: Is that okay?
6:00 PM Justine: May I ask for your shipping address please?
6:01 PM Adam Colligan: That. That last thing you said. That is the heart of the whole problem! If the CMOS battery doesn't exist, then you would *know* you could just send me a main battery?
6:01 PM Adam Colligan: As long as it's not costing me anything, sure, send me a stupid box. My address is [redacted]
6:02 PM Justine: If the CMOS battery doesn't exist, the main battery doesn't have anything to do with it. If it does not exist, we can send it for repair, since we do not send CMOS batteries. That is the only thing that we can do.
6:02 PM Justine: Alright, is there anything else I could help you with?
6:03 PM Adam Colligan: Oh lord. If the CMOS battery doesn't exist, then the main battery is the whole point, because it's the main battery that's supplying the power to the components that normally draw from the CMOS battery on most other systems.
6:03 PM Adam Colligan: Nope, there's nothing else. You've provided another great transcript for the file.
5:10 PM Support session established with Justine.5:10 PM Adam Colligan: Hi Justine5:11 PM Justine: Thank you for contacting the HP Customer Support & Services. My name is Justine and I will be your chat support specialist today. Please give me a few minutes while I review your issue description details. NOTE: For security reasons, PLEASE DO NOT send credit card information via chat. Also, If you are using a mobile device (iPad, iPod, iPhone, etc....) and experience difficulties viewing the chat window, please initiate a new chat from a Windows or Mac computer or use a different browser for better compatibility.For DISCONNECTED or failed to reconnect, we keep records for all interactions feel free to initiate another chat.5:11 PM Justine: May I have the phone number and e-mail address associated with your HP product?5:11 PM Adam Colligan: [redacted]5:12 PM Justine: In order for me to assist you better, can you please provide the Product and Serial number of the system that is having an issue.5:13 PM Adam Colligan: Are the contents of the form I filled out not sent? The SN is [redacted] . This is a model G6T85UA5:15 PM Justine: Thank you for verifying me those information, Adam. I have read your issue description and it seems like you need help in processing a replacement for your computer's battery, is that correct?5:15 PM Adam Colligan: Yes.5:16 PM Justine: I apologize for the inconvenience. I will do my best to help you resolve this issue.5:19 PM Justine: Alright, regarding the incorrect information that our tech had provided you, what is that information again, Adam.5:20 PM Adam Colligan: My own hunch was confirmed by an independent service center that I had to pay to diagnose this problem: this machine has no dedicated RTC/CMOS battery. 5:20 PM Justine: -5:22 PM Justine: So the issue is that you went to a local tech and they are charging you for your battery replacement correct?5:22 PM Adam Colligan: So I wasted both a day of work and over $50 because two technical support representatives told me in no uncertain terms that I was looking at symptoms of a CMOS battery fault. And I *now* face also having to double that money on a new battery unless you guys can make it right.5:23 PM Adam Colligan: I paid for the diagnosis because they had to go in and determine that HP tech support was, for lack of a better phrase, full of it5:23 PM Adam Colligan: I even have a hilarious piece of transcript: 2:02 PM Adam Colligan: Look, here is a theory. What if this PC does not have a separate CMOS battery, and it's been using power from the main battery to keep the clock and BIOS settings current? In that case, the symptoms might just be a result of poor seating of the main battery cable. To rule that out, I would like to confirm for a fact that a CMOS battery actually exists on this motherboard, and I'd like to see it with my own eyes.2:02 PM Adam Colligan: ...before I go without my PC for days or weeks2:03 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: The CMOS battery exsist in the motherboard and it is not a customer replaceable part. 2:04 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: You cannot see it. 5:25 PM Adam Colligan: I had even checked the x360 service manuals and compared them to other Envy models, since the CMOS / RTC battery is specified for the other ones. Hence this (apparently completely false) gem: KARISHMA BARPANDA: I would like to inform you that, the CMOS battery is not a customer replaceable part.2:24 PM Adam Colligan: What does that have to do with whether or not you know where it is?2:24 PM Adam Colligan: Is there some rule that you are not allowed to say "I don't know" ?2:24 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: That is the reason, it is not shown in the manual.2:25 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: That is the reason, it is not shown in the manual.2:25 PM KARISHMA BARPANDA: The CMOS battery can be replaced by the HP hardware engineers.5:25 PM Adam Colligan: Apparently the truth is that it's not in the manual because *it doesn't exist*5:27 PM Justine: I apologize about that, Adam. But to explain this properly, yes the CMOS battery is not a replaceable part. We do not ship CMOS batteries. But if you want, you can consult your local tech about it.5:28 PM Justine: May I ask why do you want the CMOS battery to be replaced, Adam?5:28 PM Adam Colligan: Oh my god.5:28 PM Adam Colligan: You're going to have to just give me a moment here.5:29 PM Justine: Okay Adam. Please take your time.5:31 PM Adam Colligan: Before I explain again, let me just ask a question or two. Let's say that, hypothetically, HP Support thought that I needed to replace my CMOS/RTC battery. So I ship it off. Imagine that it arrives at the service center and the techs there discover that there is nothing wrong with the CMOS battery. Instead, they find that the main battery has a short in it and needs to be replaced. Would I have to pay for the replacement of the main battery?5:32 PM Justine: Alright, first the repair process is that whatever that is we need to replace, we will. also, fortunately, your warranty covers the repair for this computer. We could send it for repair for you.5:33 PM Justine: Whether the CMOS battery or the main battery, we will fix this computer like brand new for you.5:34 PM Adam Colligan: And you're saying there is no charge for this?5:35 PM Justine: Yes Adam. 5:36 PM Justine: It will be for free.5:36 PM Justine: May I ask for your shipping address?5:37 PM Adam Colligan: Wait; see, I don't want to do that yet. How long would the whole shipping and repair process take?5:37 PM Adam Colligan: I've already been told that I have to go through the whole shipping nightmare even though I live right near an authorized service center5:38 PM Justine: Okay, we will ship you a box with a return label within 2-3 business days, then the repair process would be 7-9 business days maximum. This is for us to make sure that everything will be checked and diagnosed so that when it comes back to you, it would be like brand new.5:39 PM Justine: We could still send you the box if you want, the box would be active within 30 days, so you could decide when you want it to be dispatched.5:40 PM Adam Colligan: See, and that's the problem: I might rather just buy a new battery for $53 rather than be without my main work machine for 2 weeks+. 5:40 PM Adam Colligan: And so here's what happened:5:41 PM Justine: Well, if we send it for repair we can determine if it is really a CMOS issue or the main battery.5:41 PM Justine: But it would depend on your decision, Adam.5:44 PM Justine: Are you still there? I want to get your issue taken cared of today. Please respond if you are available to chat.5:44 PM Adam Colligan: In order to make that choice, I needed to know whether this could really be a CMOS battery issue. If it were, then I would have no choice but to send it in, because that would mean replacing the motherboard (or at a minimum re-soldering to it...so probably replacing it). I would probably also have to spend the time before and after the shipment taking the thing apart myself and putting it back together again because I have my own RAM and my own SSD in there. And so I discussed my symptoms (which included a CMOS checksum error) with two technical support representatives. The initial one was going to take me through a BIOS upgrade attempt and informed me that if it did not resolve, it would need to be sent in for a CMOS battery replacement. I think I had already let him know that I had looked for it just to check if there was anything obviously wrong and couldn't find it, and I had wondered if there really was one.5:46 PM Justine: Actually if it already gave a CMOS error, it is already that.5:46 PM Adam Colligan: In the end I did upgrade the BIOS, but when it appeared to work afterward, it was a coincidence. The ticket was closed but I discovered quickly that the problem was still there. It appeared that maybe I had partially charged the CMOS battery and so just needed to try running the machine for several hours to see if it would recharge. When that failed, I contacted HP again, which is where those snippets of transcript come from5:47 PM Connecting...5:47 PM Connected. A support representative will be with you shortly.5:47 PM Support session established with Justine.5:47 PM Adam Colligan: Once again, I was assured that this really was or could be a CMOS battery issue. I specifically raised my concern that there might not even be a CMOS battery, which is why I tried to focus the conversation on getting the rep to tell me where it is. She very directly and repeatedly told me that it was there -- which meant that I had no choice between a long service and replacing the battery myself.5:49 PM Justine: The issue is that the CMOS could have already failed so technically, even though it is physically there, the computer is not detecting it anymore. For this, since there is already an error with the CMOS, it should be replaced.5:50 PM Adam Colligan: But between the fact that the reps had not sounded competent and the possibility that it might be worth it to replace the CMOS battery myself and void the warranty, I was still suspicious. And that's why I found myself spending $54.13 for a third party service provider to tell me what HP should have known all along. This machine does not have a separate CMOS battery. When the main battery fails -- as mine has -- it will cause all the symptoms of a main battery failure *plus* the symptoms of a CMOS battery failure, since *the main battery* powers this board's real-time clock and RAM environment memory5:51 PM Justine: I could wait for your decision if you want to send it in for repair, Adam. I will still send you a box for the repair, that would be available for use within a month. It is still up for you to decide, Adam.5:51 PM Adam Colligan: And now you're saying the same thing: that my CMOS checksum error (and also my clock resetting) means there is a problem with the CMOS / RTC battery.5:51 PM Adam Colligan: Am I correct that that is what you are saying?5:52 PM Justine: I highly suggest sending it for repair, really. In this case we could provide a proper explanation in your issue.5:52 PM Adam Colligan: Are you or are you not telling me that I have a CMOS / RTC battery and that it might need to be replaced?5:53 PM Justine: Every motherboard has a CMOS battery, yours have already failed so it needs to be replaced.5:54 PM Adam Colligan: See, I think -- and the service center that just looked at it thinks -- that that statement is flat-out untrue. 5:54 PM Justine: You could replace it by yourself like what you want, but first, we do not ship CMOS batteries, and replacing it by yourself will jsut tamper the warranty.5:55 PM Adam Colligan: And so the important question is: will HP give me a free main battery, which I can install myself without needing to send the computer off, if it turns out that you just became rep #3 to give me false information?5:56 PM Justine: Actually, we cannot determine that without really having it physically here for further details and with sufficient tests. Our technicians will be testing it not just inside, but physically. 5:57 PM Adam Colligan: You don't need my computer in front of you in order to know whether or not this model *has* a CMOS battery. You are essentially swearing up and down that it has one. If you're wrong, then you've not only cost me the $54 I already spent but will also unnecessarily cost me two weeks+ without my computer5:57 PM Justine: I apologize but we can only replace the battery if we have the computer in question, and we cannot do that without the error in the main battery itself.5:57 PM Justine: Every computer has a CMOS battery, what I mean is that we have to perform tests on your computer physically to determine the real issue.5:57 PM Justine: I apologize about that.5:57 PM Adam Colligan: So I want to know: if it turns out that this model has no CMOS battery, will HP comp me a main battery in return for the time and money that it has already made me waste? 5:59 PM Justine: Actually, we can send you a box with a return label, so that you can decide. At this point we will just wait for your decision.5:59 PM Justine: We will only replace or provide on the part that neede to be replaced.6:00 PM Justine: The CMOS and the main battery has different roles, so we couldn't send you a main battery when it is a CMOS issue.6:00 PM Justine: Is that okay?6:00 PM Justine: May I ask for your shipping address please?6:01 PM Adam Colligan: That. That last thing you said. That is the heart of the whole problem! If the CMOS battery doesn't exist, then you would *know* you could just send me a main battery? 6:01 PM Adam Colligan: As long as it's not costing me anything, sure, send me a stupid box. My address is [redacted]6:02 PM Justine: If the CMOS battery doesn't exist, the main battery doesn't have anything to do with it. If it does not exist, we can send it for repair, since we do not send CMOS batteries. That is the only thing that we can do.6:02 PM Justine: Alright, is there anything else I could help you with?6:03 PM Adam Colligan: Oh lord. If the CMOS battery doesn't exist, then the main battery is the whole point, because it's the main battery that's supplying the power to the components that normally draw from the CMOS battery on most other systems.6:03 PM Adam Colligan: Nope, there's nothing else. You've provided another great transcript for the file.
7. In desperation, I try in vain to attract @HPSupport's attention on Twitter
Spoiler (Highlight to read)
@adamcolligan
6:20 PM - 13 Apr 2015
(1/3) Hey @HPSupport : would you make a wager with me? The question: whether 3 separate HP reps cost me $54.13 + 8 hrs' work with false info
@HPSupport (2/3) If I'm right, you send me a new battery for my x360-15t and say you're super sorry on your twitter feed. If I'm wrong...
@HPSupport then I guess no hilarious Reddit thread with support transcripts, and I'll spend like $1m on 2ml of your official ink. Deal?
@HPSupport (4/3) It's easy to resolve. Alls you have to do is know, and I mean *know*: "Does the G6T85UA have a dedicated RTC/CMOS battery?"
@adamcolligan6:20 PM - 13 Apr 2015(1/3) Hey @HPSupport : would you make a wager with me? The question: whether 3 separate HP reps cost me $54.13 + 8 hrs' work with false info@HPSupport (2/3) If I'm right, you send me a new battery for my x360-15t and say you're super sorry on your twitter feed. If I'm wrong...@HPSupport then I guess no hilarious Reddit thread with support transcripts, and I'll spend like $1m on 2ml of your official ink. Deal?@HPSupport (4/3) It's easy to resolve. Alls you have to do is know, and I mean *know*: "Does the G6T85UA have a dedicated RTC/CMOS battery?"
No response; not sure if I expected one or not.Update time! I know you've been dying to know how this has been turning out.
I provided all the requested information in response to the private message from HP staff. Nothing ever came of it; as far as I can tell, no real human being ever attempted to contact me after being "forwarded" the details of the case.
Three days after I tweeted at them, @HPSupport sent me a series of public replies. In essence, they told me to abandon useless post-sales technical support and get information from HP Sales.
Adam Colligan @AdamColligan · Apr 13
(1/3) Hey @HPSupport : would you make a wager with me? The question: whether 3 separate HP reps cost me $54.13 + 8 hrs' work with false info
Adam Colligan @AdamColligan · Apr 13
@HPSupport (2/3) If I'm right, you send me a new battery for my x360-15t and say you're super sorry on your
Adam Colligan @AdamColligan · Apr 13
@HPSupport then I guess no hilarious Reddit thread with support transcripts, and I'll spend like $1m on 2ml of your official ink. Deal?
Adam Colligan @AdamColligan · Apr 13
@HPSupport (4/3) It's easy to resolve. Alls you have to do is know, and I mean *know*: "Does the G6T85UA have a dedicated RTC/CMOS battery?"
Adam Colligan @AdamColligan Apr 13
@HPSupport No but seriously. Does the HP Envy x360 have a dedicated RTC / CMOS battery or not?
HP Support @HPSupport Apr 16
@AdamColligan Hello Adam, Eddie here. Saw your tweet. Our Product Information team will be able to assist with your inquiry. Dial:.. ^HPCare
HP Support @HPSupport Apr 16
@AdamColligan 1800-752-0900. Follow prompts for “product information”. If you prefer email click this link http://ow.ly/HYnHT .. ^HPCare
HP Support @HPSupport Apr 16
@AdamColligan Once there be sure to choose "Contact an HP sales specialist" as your subject. Let me know if you require further... ^HPCare
HP Support @HPSupport Apr 16
@AdamColligan information and/or assistance. Have an awesome day! Thanks! ^HPCare
Now, being the exhaustive give-it-a-try kind of guy that I am, I tried *both* the phone and the email path to support. I may have been told once on the phone to try the email, but it's hard to even remember at the moment. I'll just paste the email outcome here.
Me (into the webform):
HP reps have directed me to contact sales support after others in the company were unable to help with a technical product question. I need to know whether the HP Envy x360 model G6T85UA (should be board 780958-501 and main battery 760944-421) has a dedicated CMOS/RTC battery. If it does, I need to know *where* it is connected to the board. This is a fairly urgent issue for me implicating a disconnect or swap-out of the main battery while AC power is not being supplied.
HP:
Dear Adam,
Thank you for contacting the hp.com Sales Center.
I understand the you are still seeking resolution for your technical concern and I’m sorry to hear that this remains unresolved.
I'm very sorry, but our email sales team does not handle technical or product support concerns. We can only handles sales inquiries pertaining to orders placed in our store.
HP Technical Support will be able to provide you with service and support for hardware, software, and parts replacement of HP products that are still covered under warranty.
I strongly suggest that you contact the HP Technical Support Team since your matter requires technical expertise. HP Technical Support can best assist you and can be reached 24 hours a day at: http://www.hp.com/contacthp
Below is step by step guide how to obtain the webform/online form:
1. Please copy and paste this link http://www.hp.com/contacthp into a new browser.
2. Please enter your model number in the "Enter my model number" search field provided then hit the "Find my product" button to generate the result.
3. Select the correct product from the search results.
4. On the next page wait for a few seconds to load the webform.
5. Scroll down to find the webform.
5. Complete the webform then hit the "Submit" button.
6. After you fill out the online form, you will receive a Technical Support case number. You will also be able to engage with a Tech Support product specialist either by chat or they will give you a call at your earliest convenience.
By the way, I have seen a link which might help you with this concern. Here's the link:
http://partsurfer.hp.com/Search.aspx?SearchText=G6T85UA
The link shows the the HP ENVY 15-U011DX X360 CONVERTIBLE PC (ENERGY STAR) has the 780958-501 motherboard but has a different battery. It doesn't show also the RTC Battery and where you can find it. Please contact our HP Technical Support for other information.
I hope this information has been of assistance to you, Adam. Please reply to this message if there is anything further we can do. For your convenience, you may also call the HP.com Sales Center directly at 1-888-222-0029 between 7:00 AM - 2:00 AM EST, seven days a week.
Customer Satisfaction is our store’s top priority. Please tell us about your email experience today. To participate, please click on our Customer Satisfaction Survey link below.
Thank you for choosing HP. We appreciate your business.
Regards,
Regine G.
Oh dear. So technical support doesn't have technical information about HP machines, and sales support doesn't answer technical questions about HP machines and refers you to technical support. Brilliant. But by this time, I of course knew better than to actually *believe* what someone was telling me, so I used the sales phone number instead.
The sales guy was super eager to help, especially since I framed this as a problem of future use. I work on disaster vulnerability issues. If I buy Envy x360 15ts and use them in a place where there isn't AC power for a while, can I swap spare batteries into them without screwing up the BIOS and real-time clock settings?
He put me on hold two or three times for what I was led to believe were very thorough attempts to get me a totally definitive answer. And this is what someone eventually told him to tell me. All HP machines ship with CMOS batteries.
So I must have been mistaken all along, right? The CMOS battery must have stopped working at the same time as the main battery. It must just be that neither I nor my local repair shop could find my CMOS battery because we all have the wrong prescriptions on our glasses and contact lenses. Well, there's just one small issue with getting to that conclusion: what HP told me about my machine was, once again, totally false.
How do I know? Because I still didn't believe HP, and rather than shipping my compter off for weeks in the big padded box, I ordered a new main battery for a total of just over $60. I swapped it. Guess what happened, HP? If you guessed, "every aspect of the problem instantly resolved, because there never was a CMOS/RTC battery in this machine in the first place", you would win a gold star. But I'm assuming you'd also lose your job, because this particular piece of information has somehow been banished and outlawed from the minds of HP employees and contractors.
I wonder: would anybody at HP be interested in apologizing to me, much less in finding a way to make up for the $115+ I've lost because nobody at any stage to this point has been willing to act like a human being?
BUT WAIT, THERE'S GREAT NEWS
I shouldn't make it seem through this thread that HP totally lacks competence and doesn't care about me at all. Because within two hours of receiving the email from HP Sales telling me that they weren't going to do anything about my problem, I started receiving advertising email blasts full of great offers and promotions about buying a new HP laptop and other great products! Yay! I guess I'm not invisible after all. And I'm sure if I bought *more* stuff from HP, they would take care of me then. Right? -
Droid Bionic Extended Battery Issue
I dropped my phone, only about a foot and the battery pack didn't even pop out. I've had bigger crashes and couldn't believe this small crash broke my phone. Took it to Verizon. They told me the insurance deductible was $90 (what a rip off). Also the Bionic had been discontinued so they couldn't replace my phone with the same one. I already have the extended battery they upsold me on so I wanted to explore other options. My husband suggested trying my original battery. This worked. Almost paid $90 for insurance for a new phone when the fix was simple. Now I have to figure out what they will do for me since it is a battery issue and not related to my dropping the phone. Thought someone out there might want to know about this so they don't get ripped off by insurance.
How is paying $90 for a $600 phone a ripoff?
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