Aperture vs Adobe Camera Raw

Hey,
So, lately I've been shooting in RAW and have finally found some time to process some of the images. I am a Mac user, so I have the option of using either Aperture, or Adobe Camera Raw (Lightroom). Can someone please explain to me the main difference between the two programs, in terms of their ability to retouch/edit RAW images. I've had experience with Adobe Camera Raw (through photoshop cs6) and believe it is an excellent piece of software, does Aperture provide the same kind and quality of tools. The reason I am asking is because while I need a program to help process the RAW files, I also want to organize them in a library where I can see my edits. I am currently using iPhoto and I like the way it works.
So to summarize the question, is aperture as good at processing/editing RAW images as Adobe Camera Raw? If not, why, what are the differences?
Thanks!

So to summarize the question, is aperture as good at processing/editing RAW images as Adobe Camera Raw? If not, why, what are the differences?
Much of the difference between the two has to do with the way brushes work (for local adjustments) and some features.
Brushes:
In ACR, the adjustment brush works as a multi-parameter brush where you brush in strokes and can adjust quite a few parameters after adding the brush stroke (e.g., exposure, highlights, shadows, sharpening, noise reduction, clarity, saturation, etc.). ACR adds a 'pin' for each new adjustment which can then be selected to change the parameters of that adjustment.
In Aperture, you use what is called a 'brick' which is a panel dedicated to the type of adjustment (e.g., enhance, highlights & shadows, edge sharpen, noise reduction, etc.). In this case, you use each 'brick' (or panel) to change the brushed in parameters for that specific type of adjustment.
In summary; you can add or change more parameters in ACR with one brushed adjustment than you can in Aperture, but both can add or change the same parameters (with the exception of exposure, which Aperture doesn't currently do as a local brushable adjustment).
ACR has arguably better sharpening and noise reduction control. ACR also has a gradient tool and lens distortion correction which Aperture currently lacks.
I do find that brush speed is about the same with a lot of adjustments added, with Aperture getting better marks overall.
All that said, I would be surprised if Aperture didn't receive some of the tools it currently lacks in the future.
As far as RAW decoding goes, Aperture relies on the OS X camera RAW compatibility feature to render RAW files, so you will already have a sense of what that default render is like with iPhoto and Preview. Aperture can alter those parameters either as a RAW fine tuning preset that you create or with the adjustment bricks.
FWIW, I have been using Adobe ACR at work (on Windows) since it's inception; and while I like the results with some images with regards to highlights, shadows, sharpening and noise, I can get there faster with Aperture. I also don't agree with Adobe's new rental policy for the CC line, so won't be investing in their products anymore. I quite like the 'App Store' paradigm.
Hope that helps.

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Does Aperture use Adobe Camera Raw in any way?

Does Aperture use Adobe Camera Raw in any way? Is it important than I upgrade ACR if I do not use Photoshop?
Jerry

Thanks for the relies, guys!
I suspected that there was no connection between Aperture and ACR, but wanted confimation of that fact. You've answered my question.
Thanks again,
Jerry

Aperture and Adobe Camera Raw

I would love to set up Aperture to allow me to edit images in Adobe Camera Raw. I can open images from Aperture in Adobe Camera Raw by setting Adobe Bridge as my external editor, but none of the adjustments are saved in Aperture. From Bridge, I can also save the file as a dng file that Aperture should be able to read and save it in the numbered folder where Aperture placed the original raw image, but the saved dng file doesn't show up in Aperture. Apparently Aperture can't see any images in its own folders if it didn't place them there.
I also tried making my adjustments in Adobe Raw, saving it as a dng file and then importing it into Aperture. This is not ideal, as it would be convenient to do the Adobe Raw adjustments from within Aperture, but it does allow me to import the edits into Aperture. Aperture does something odd in this case. When I open the imported dng image in Aperture, at first it displays it with the edits I made in Adobe Raw but after a few seconds reverts to the originla raw image. I can't figure out how to recover the adjustments.
Can anyone fill me in on the nuances of Aperture in this workflow? Is there some way I can at least make the raw edits in Adobe Raw and make them available in Aperture.
Some of this may be my ignorance. For some reason, I have never been able to fully grok the whole version/master process in Aperture, never quite sure how to move between versions and masters. I suspect that some of my issues with the imported dng files is a version/master thing that I am not understanding.
I'm beginning to wish that I had set Aperture up to use external folders rather than place my files in the Aperture database. I think if I had done this it might have eased my current issues.
Is there any way to export an Aperture database so it exports the images into folders that correspond to projects and folders in Aperture? I suspect not, but . . . one can wish.
Any help with any of this would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
--Kenoli

Kenoli Oleari1 wrote
If this is what is happening, it means Aperture can interpret the ADR data, but chooses not to. If I could get it to use that data, it could solve most of my issues.
In the Adobe Camera Raw preferences, there is a section called: 'DNG File Handling'. You can (and may already have) select the option 'Update embedded JPG previews' and use the drop down to select either Medium or Full Size. The result should be (in Bridge at least) that adjustments you make in ACR and then either click 'Done' to save to the .XMP file inside the DNG file or click 'Open' to launch and render the image in PS for further work.
The result should be an updated embedded JPEG inside the DNG file that can be used by any program that can read DNG and is set to use an embedded JPEG.
In testing on my machine a couple of years ago on Snow Leopard, the OS X included program Preview did not show the updated previews though. It only displayed the original RAW data. I assumed it either was not set to show any embedded JPEG preview, or was simply not designed to be compatible in that way. Preview uses the same digital camera RAW compatibility function of OS X that Aperture uses. So it did not surprise me to see that it was not working in Aperture at that time. This was either a later version of AP 2 or early version of AP3, but I can't remember for sure.
It was my understanding that the purpose and function of dng files is so that raw edits made by any software could be accessed cross platform through the open source dng file. If Aperture simply chooses to ignore that data, it defeats the purpose of dng.
My understanding of DNG is that it is an archive type file made of (1) a RAW conversion which holds the decoded RAW data, (2) any .XMP file that has been created by the decoding software as well as; (3) ITPC and EXIF metadata and some other info such as ICC profiles and the JPEG preview. You can also opt to include the original RAW file.
I don't know the extent to which Aperture is designed to support the DNG file though. Does it handle it like a PSD file where it retains the full file content, but only supports displaying it in a limited fashion (e.g., no transparency)? Or should it actually read the .XMP data file and render it based on that info? I don't think this is the case as the .XMP data that pertains to adjustments made by another RAW decoder doesn't seem to be compatilble with the way Aperture is handling adjustments.
You could certainly test the embedded JPEG in a DNG file by making and saving some changes to the copy of a file in Finder and then comparing the original DNG to the adjusted one using the Preview program. If the changes are not shown, then the issue (or lack of one depending on Apple's point of view) is with the OS X digital camera RAW compatibility function (which they update for new digital cameras periodically).
If Preview does show the changes, you could then import both the original and adjusted DNG into an Aperture library (even a new test library) and see if it displays the differences. If it does, then this would point to an issue with sending a file from inside Aperture to an external program and then saving back (assuming this still fails to work as you expect).
Sorry I don't have more. I decided not to go with DNG and just archive with RAW and JPEG depending on what I end up wanting to do with the images.

Can I edit my RAW files from Aperture in Adobe Camera Raw in CS5?

I like Aperture for organizing my files and doing simple adjustments. I purchased CS5 and will be taking a class to learn more complex editing. Is there a way to store my photos in Aperture and get them into CS5's Camera Raw in the RAW format? When I try to do that they are tiff or jpg.

In the preferences you are able to select which file type you would like to export to an external editor, the assumption is that you have made basic corrections and accept the RAW processing in Aperture so want to work with a tif or jpeg.
If you are wanting to start from you camera RAW file, ie no processing, you will need to actually export the master file and work from it.
Tony

Adobe Camera Raw and Aperture

Ok.. Please correct me if I'm wrong, because if what I am saying is actually true, then Aperture has some seriously frustrating issues.
I use Aperture 3 to organize my photos and to do minor corrections, but the majority of my photo editing takes place in Photoshop CS5. I shoot in Raw so I expect to be able to use Adobe's wonderful Camera Raw plugin before opening a photo in Photoshop.
Aperture gives you the ability to edit a photo in Photoshop and have the edited photo go back into Aperture. Thats a great feature. Unfortunately, it seems that if I try to send a raw photo from aperture to photoshop, it will not open in the Adobe Camera Raw plug in. It simply opens in photoshop. If I just drag the thumbnail from aperture into photoshop, it will open the camera raw dialogue and everythings great.. but if I do it that way, it will not update in aperture once I am done editing.
It would be totally fine if I could just save the photoshop file and reimport it into aperture, but when I do that, it just shows up as a blank white photo, instead of the actual photo.
So long story short there is no way to use Aperture AND adobe camera raw. I don't want to use Bridge.
or is there???? Please give me a solution here or I want my money back.
Or is there a way to reopen the camera raw function in photoshop, once the photo is already opened?
Thanks for your help!

I understand your concern, as I wondered the same thing. You might want to read http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?messageID=11666552&#11666552
regarding a possible workflow for your situation (altho' they are using CS3, not CS5).
I use CS4 but want to move to CS5 to get the additional features of ACR (excellent noise reduction, lens-specific aberration controls, etc.) Thus, my interest in using ACR vs AP3 for some of my images.
I know now that AP3 is doing RAW processing at the moment of import, and that 'file' is no longer able to be processed by ACR via AP3. I was wondering about your trick of dragging the thumbnail to Photoshop and having it open in ACR. I cannot duplicate this, and I've tried different methods. If I could do this, that would be half the battle. (Can you enlighten me?) I will also take a look at Catapult.
I know of no way to open ACR while an image is open in Photoshop (APS). The plugin seems to kick in only when you open it from Bridge or the Finder.
Regarding the blank white photo, I'm assuming it is a PSD with no thumbnail. I have seen this when I import 'old' PSD's into AP3. I fixed this by going into the Preferences in APS, under File Handling/File Compatibility make sure you set 'Maximize PSD and PSB File Compatibility' to 'Always'. Then, you must open the blank white photo files and Save As... the same file name to overwrite the blank one. You should then see the thumbnail. (Also in APS Preferences, set File Saving Options, Image Preview to 'Always Save').
Granted, not having the option of easily using ACR is a tough pill to swallow for those of us who are in the Bridge/APS camp. I will readily forgo the 'pleasures' of using Bridge for AP3. I will NEVER give up APS since I need layers and graphic/text capabilities it offers. So a smooth interaction between AP3 and APS is a must for me. However, AP3 offers so much more than Lightroom, that I won't look back, now that I've made the switch. Good luck!

Selection in Aperture , processing in ACR ( Adobe Camera Raw )

I'm trying to figure out if there is some way to see my ratings from Aperture in finder - on original master files.
I understand "holy raw" policy and I have been following the threads about painfull renaming techniques
( obvious workarounds ).
Seeing my in Aperture rated raw files in finder is crucial for me because I want to use Adobe Camera Raw for processing .
I might also use DPP or Capture One for this in some situations.
(I prefere Aperture for selection work , I love loupe )
So is there som simple way to do it ?
One way would be for example if you could give a
color label ( visible in finder ) to selected master files .
That would be fine for me .
And as I understand wouldn't make any changes to the original file ( so it would stay "untouched" ).
Thanks for any suggestions.

Just re-read your first post and realised that you want to apply a Finder label to every RAW file based on rating. This is doable, but would require someone to write an app or script, like Adam Tow's app that moves metadata between Aperture and iView.
The rating for each image is held in the OriginalVersionInfo.apversion file next to each RAW file:
<key>mainRating</key>
<integer>0</integer>
If you are only grading into two categories and Bridge is doing what you want, then there is no reason not to use Bridge, it's likely to be faster for you, which is the main thing.
Time - setting up a hot folder takes about ten minutes, and I'd never done one before. On the other hand I know my way around Automator etc., as should anyone dealing with large numbers of images. Most of the extra steps are to bring the converted file back into Aperture, automatically linked with the RAW file as a version.
Here's to hoping that the conversion quality gets better fast!
Ian

Aperture export to Adobe camera Raw

I have been unable to get Aperture to function fast enough for raw editing
Does anyone know of a simple automation script that when I export a Master file out of Aperture to say a special folder the raw image will be automatically opened in Adobe camera raw?
Thanks,
Christopher.

I'm seeing alot of info on the Hot folder for getting images into Aperture. But nothing going the other way. All of this "apple scrip, folder actions, automater" stuff is a bit overwhelming.
I believe I need a script that will open a raw file in Photoshop ( photoshop should see that it's Raw and open ACR first.)
I guess the script should be "open this file with this application" but I don't know how to write that.
the next step I believe is to attach that script as a folder action
So when I export a master file out of Aperture to this "Hot Folder" the script will run that simply opens it in ACR.
can anyone help with this?

Why external editor Cs5 doesn't open in Adobe Camera Raw window?

I am workning in Apertute 3 and I want to edit some photos in Photoshop Cs5. I am working with RAW files, but when I want to open the file in external editor, it doesn't open in Adobe Camera Raw so I am loosing the Adobe Camera Raw adjustment abilities. Is there perhaps a way how to set up Aperture to comunicate with Photoshop Cs5 so it opens photos in Camera Raw window? I think in previous version of Aperture this was possible. Thanks.

Editing in the external editor (from within aperture) is only possible for Versions, not for masters, afaik. Since it would be pointless to export a Version again in some raw format, Aperture offers high quality lossless formats to export versions - tiff and Photoshop psd.
If you want to do the raw processing externally, you will have to edit the master image file:
export the master, or reveal a managed master and copy it to Photoshop, then reimport it.
To edit the master in Photoshop and to reimport it, you could use an automator service: I put a sample workflow and some instructions on how to use and modify it on this page: feel free to modify it according to your needs.
Additional External Editor in Aperture:
http://dreschler-fischer.de/FAQ/Scripts_Services/Entries/2012/1/12_Additional_Ex ternal_Editor_in_Aperture.html
Regards
Léonie

Open with External Editor Adobe Camera Raw = HOW?

When I export a RAW file to the External Editor (I've chosen Photoshop CS3) I would like for it to open in Adobe Camera Raw, just like any RAW file that I open in Photoshop outside of Aperture.
However it bypasses Adobe Camera Raw and opens directly in Photoshop.
I have the "Prefer Adobe Camera Raw for JPEG files" and "for Supported RAW files" boxes checked in the Photoshop Prefs.
I see some chatter about Hot folders and Automator around here, but no definitive answer/workaround.
If Aperture doesn't support exporting to Adobe Camera Raw, it is a HUGE leg-up for Lightroom in the RAW workflow department.
Please tell me I'm missing a checkbox somewhere... Thanks.

buttermaker wrote:
Please tell me I'm missing a checkbox somewhere... Thanks.
You're not missing a checkbox, you're missing a fundamental issue of how Aperture (and LightRoom for that matter) work.
When you use the Open in External Editor command, Aperture will convert the RAW file, apply any adjustments you have made, and send the resulting PSD or TIFF file to the external editor.
The original file is NOT sent and there is no option to do so. Why not? Because Aperture Versions do not exist as discrete image files - the adjustments are shown on-the-fly each time you view it, saving on the space taken up by multiple TIFF/PSD/JPEG files for each Version. As ACR uses a totally different RAW conversion & adjustment engine from Aperture, Aperture wouldn't be able to display any changes made in ACR without including the entire conversion engine of ACR, which Adobe might not be too happy about...
In other words, if you want to use a different RAW convertor you will have to export the Master, convert it in the other app, and then import the resulting 'normal' image file back into Aperture. The same is true for LightRoom.
Ian

Using Adobe Camera Raw as External Editor

I've recently purchased Aperture 2.1 and am very pleased with everything thus far. I capture the majority of my photos in the RAW format (Nikon NEF specifically), and the one thing I'm trying to work out is this - with iPhoto I am able to choose Adobe Photoshop as my 'External Editor,' and when opening an image for adjustments, iPhoto sends the the picture in its native format. Consequently, RAW formatted images open with the Adobe Camera RAW plug-in, jpegs right into Photoshop and so on. With Aperture I notice that I am still able to select Photoshop as my 'External Editor,' but instead of sending the native format, Aperture allows only the 'temporary' format options of TIFF and PSD (8 and 16-bit). Needless to say, the files open directly into Photoshop -instead of the Camera RAW plug-in that I would prefer for my RAW files. Does anyone know of any work-arounds or possible solutions to this issue?

iPhoto has no RAW conversion controls, but just makes a copy of the file for iPhoto edits.
When you choose to edit it in photoshop, it sends the original over to Adobe Camera RAW. This is NOT a non-destructive workflow.
Aperture has its own RAW converter- a quite good one- so the need for ACR is removed, and the workflow IS non-destructive. You should only be going to Photoshop for the things that Aperture is not designed to do like compositing and hi-end retouching
The only work around is to export the master then open it in ACR, but that workflow would be senseless.
Honestly, if you prefer ACR, then you should be using Bridge or Lightroom for DAM as well.
DLS

Opening in adobe camera raw??

Some times I want to open in adobe camera raw and then have the changes automaticly applied back in aperture with out having to save and export the file. I thought I would be smart and have bridge be my external file editor but then when I am done I do not see the changes in aperture

Not possible to do it automatically. Aperture uses a different RAW processor than ACR. If you want to process in ACR then you can save out of it as a TIFF or PSD and manually import that file into Aperture.

Aperture versus Photoshop Camera RAW

What would you choose to convert RAW files into JPG after applying image adjustments ? Aperture or Photoshop Camera RAW?
I have tried with Adobe Camera RAW and i obtain fair results.
I have not been able to apply adjustments to several files at the same time in Aperture. I t looks that aperture would be e btter program to catalog, adjust and export files.
What do you recommend?

bonsorte wrote:
What would you choose to convert RAW files into JPG after applying image adjustments ? Aperture or Photoshop Camera RAW?
I am a very long term PS user. I prefer Aperture and find it much faster, even though after thousands of hours with the app I am more proficient with PS. Aperture however does require strong MacIntel hardware for best performance.
As to RAW conversion, IMO Aperture does a slightly better job than ACR.
-Allen Wicks

I am unable to open raw files from my Canon T1i in Adobe Camera Raw of my version CS3 of Photoshop. I have tried to update my ACR by downloading version 4.6 from the Adobe website but I am still unable to open raw files, just JPEG. Is there a way to use

I am unable to open raw files taken on my Canon Rebel T1i in my version of Photoshop CS3. When I import raw files into Bridge they come up as patches with CR2 on them and when clicked on, a notice comes up stating that Photoshop does not recognize these files. I tried to update my Adobe Camera Raw by downloading version 4.6 from the Adobe Website, but when I clicked on the plus-in, I got another message that Photoshop does not recognize this file. I spoke with a representative from Canon who said that I could not update CS3 and that I should subscribe to the Cloud. I would prefer to use my CS3, if possible. Can anyone advise me what to do?

The T1i was first supported by Camera Raw 5.4 which is only compatible with CS4 and later
Camera Raw plug-in | Supported cameras
Camera Raw-compatible Adobe applications
Some options:
Upgrade to CS6
Join the Cloud
Download the free Adobe DNG converter, convert all T1i Raw files to DNGs then edit the DNGs in CS3
Camera raw, DNG | Adobe Photoshop CC

Opening tiff photos in Adobe Camera Raw

I can not open my tiff files / photos in Adobe Camera Raw. I am using CS6 that has been completely updated with all the current updates. I go to Bridge, highlight a tiff thumbnail photo and go up the file drop down menu. The open in raw selection is grayed out and I can not select it. It works fine with jpeg files, and I can open raw files without problems. It just won't work with tiff files. I have gone to preferences and selected the option to open all supported tiff flles but this did not work either.
I have uninstalled Photoshop and Bridge and reinstalled it and updated it all again and it still will not let me open tiff files in Camera Raw.
Any ideas?

I am more apt to beleive the issue is with the tif files themselves. Not all tif files are equal. It depends on the compression, bit mode and so forth. Can the tiff files be opened in photoshop? if so, then that just maybe the problem. if not, then the file itself maybe corrupt. But I am leaning towards the settings used when saving the file.

Currently Have Photoshop CS3 & Adobe Bridge CS3 2.1.1.9. According to Adobe, Camera Raw 4.6 supports Nikon D810 NEF files. I have downloaded Camera Raw 4.6 Update. When I try to open Nikon D810 NEF files, I get photoshop error that says "cannot complete

Currently Have Photoshop CS3 & Adobe Bridge CS3 2.1.1.9.
According to Adobe, Camera Raw 4.6 supports Nikon D810 NEF files. I have downloaded Camera Raw 4.6 Update. When
I try to open Nikon D810 NEF files, I get photoshop error that says
"cannot complete request your because it is not the right kind of
document. These NEF files wont open in Bridge at all. What am I doing wrong?

Camera Raw plug-in | Supported cameras

Aperture vs Adobe Camera Raw

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