Background rendering? Oh REALLY? Who's Apple kidding?

One of the things I was looking most forward to, was - to quote the infamous Supermeet presentation: "Never ever have to wait for rending no more!"
It's just that, to my best knowledge, there really is absolutely NO background rendering going on NOR is it any different from the auto rendering we had in FCP 7. Just at bit more automatic, perhaps.
To me, the definition of af background task is something that continues while you continue your work. I'm positive that most people hear this in FCP X as in "so it will do the rendering in background, so you don't have to wait for it".
But wait........
- If it's a background process, while does it stop when we continue working ? That's no background task to me! Is it?
- If it's something so new, that it has to be accompaniet with "never have to wait no more", why is it almost 100% the same as we already had in FCP 7?
Two me, there seems to be only two very small differences:
- in FCP X you can set the time limit where in FCP 7 you had to stick to the, what, 15 minutes delay in this process starting automatically
- in FCP X you can pause the rendering temporarily just by doing anything in FCP X, where as in FCP 7 you had to click cancel to halt it
So the conclusion to is, that you most definately still have to wait for rendering, as you cannot finish you project before you completed the wait........
Background rending? Oh REALLY? Who's Apple kidding, anyway?

why is it almost 100% the same as we already had in FCP 7?
This is just incorrect. First, the technology in FCP is vastly superior to 7. The speed is substantially faster. It is not analogous in any meaningful sense to auto render. In addition, once render initiates, it does not actively have to be stopped by the user to continue working, nor does it have to be re-initiated. The process is seamless.
Indeed calling it background rendering is marketing hype and it is not in background in any true sense. However, it's relationship to what happens in 7 is zero. The two differences are minor. The real differences are in the processes ability to access new techology, using more RAM, more processor power, more graphics processing, and more modern OS technolgies. That's the real difference.

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Does background rendering stop all waiting for it?

I have some "pre-sales" questions about Final Cut Pro X.
1. I have a Sony HDR-XR500 camera, and so when I import it into FCP X, the video would be transcoded to QuickTime on import, and optimized to ProRes.
Using the type of video described above, if I were to apply a green screen effect to it, as well as adjust the video's lows/mids/highs, would I immediately be able to play back the green screen video without waiting for any rendering, and without any jumpiness in the video?
You see, I am used to waiting long periods of time with Final Cut Express 4 for rendering to finish, before I can smoothly see the green screen effect. But reading about background rendering etc. with Final Cut Pro X sounds very good, and I was just wondering if it is really true that I no longer need to wait for rendering to complete to see the green screen effect run smoothly?
Note: I have a 64-bit Intel Core 2 Duo Mac.
2. Is Final Cut Pro X's green screen filter as good as Final Cut Express 4 was or better?

Hello Hope4You,
In reply to your question, "So would you recommend FCPX at this point?" Ahhhhh.....now there's the million dollar question. It's a question that has sparked some very heated debates, some with over 120,000 views!
All I can give you is my experience. This is where I'm coming from: I've been editing on a "prosumer" level for about 4 years with FCE. I bought FCPX about a week after it first came out. I've been "experimenting" with it for over 30 hours. I run FCPX on my iMac (10.6.8 with a 3.06 GHz processor, Intel Core 2 Duo with 4 GB of memory). I use a LaCie external hard drive.
In those 30 hours I have never had the system crash, no spinning beach ball and everything has worked the way it should (there are others on this forum who have had problems but I don't know what their specs are).
For me FCPX is not buggy. It is missing some key "pro" features that were in FCP7. In my opinion probably most if not all of these features will be added over time with updates. Coming from FCE4 you are going to really like some of the more powerful features in FCPX that were not in FCE4. If you are like me I think you will find the UI (mainly the timeline) to be odd at first, it's really more like iMovie. As the world is full of change these days (remember the good old days when banks had customer service?) it's a good thing to learn new things.
Based on that I would go for it. I believe for you it will be a great step up.
MIke

Stalling:Error in background rendering so switching to foreground rendering after 0 frames completed

Our facility is running AE CS6 ver 11.0.0.378 on 8 core Mac Pros with 32 Gb ram running OSX10.6.8
using Thinkbox Deadline 5.2 for distributed rendering to other 8 Core Mac Pros with 32 Gb ram.
The issue is that we are in crunch mode trying to deliver 4K comps (soon to be 8k comps) and we are experience substantial
delays 10-20 minutes after the AERENDER starts, but before it starts doing any fruitful rendering.
We are reading from and writing to Quicktime movie files (which normally works just fine for us) and thus the entire frame range needs
to get computed on a single host.
The symptom is that many comp jobs (but not all) stall for a while with no apparent actibity before spitting this messgage, but then happily
and swiftly complete each frame in a second or less with no errors:
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS:   There is an error in background rendering so switching to foreground rendering after 0 frames completed out of total 576 frames.
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: 00001 (1): 20 Min, 16 Sec
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: 00002 (2): 1 Seconds
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: 00003 (3): 0 Seconds
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: 00004 (4): 1 Seconds
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: 00005 (5): 2 Seconds
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: 00006 (6): 1 Seconds
Given that the delay, seems to be related to the number of frames (350 frames creates a 10 min stall and 576 frames creates a 20 minute stall), it seems like it's trying to do something for every frame in background mode, before it gives up and does them quickly
in foreground mode. During this time, there doesn't seem to be any signficant CPU or Network or IO activity. I looked for command line args that might force AERENDER to foreground mode, but didn't find anything.
Here's what the digested submission args look like.
0: INFO: Startup Directory: "/Applications/Adobe After Effects CS6"
0: INFO: Process Priority: BelowNormal
0: INFO: Process Affinity: default
0: INFO: Process is now running
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: 12/6/12 10:37:54 AM PST: Starting composition sc20_assem_R_v57 .
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Render Settings: Best Settings
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Quality: Best
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Resolution: Full
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Size: 1200 x 860
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Proxy Use: Use No Proxies
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Effects: Current Settings
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Disk Cache: Read Only
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Color Depth: Current Settings
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Frame Blending: On for Checked Layers
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Field Render: Off
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Pulldown: Off
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Motion Blur: On for Checked Layers
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS:
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Solos: Current Settings
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Time Span: Custom
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Start: 00001
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: End: 00576
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Duration: 00576
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Frame Rate: 23.976 (comp)
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Guide Layers: All Off
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Skip Existing Files: Off
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS:
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Output Module: APR_422HQ - Millions
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Output To: /Volumes/Renders/Scenes/20/sc20_assem_R_v57_r1_2k.mov
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Format: QuickTime
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Output Info: Apple ProRes 422 (HQ)
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Output Info: Spatial Quality = 100
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Include: Project Link
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Output Audio: Off
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Channels: RGB
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Depth: Millions of Colors
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Color: Premultiplied
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Resize: -
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Crop: -
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Final Size: 1200 x 860
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Profile: -
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Embed Profile:
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS:
0: STDOUT: PROGRESS: Post-Render Action: None
We're under the gun to get this production delivered, and these delays are killing us. I worry when we switch to 8K comps
that the "fruitless delay time" will just get longer.
I'm currently trying to correlate the plug-in assortments in effect for the shots that exhibit this behaviour. Clearly in "foreground mode" the machines are capable of rendering the shot quickly.   We've speculated, that posibly some plugins may be GPU or OpenGL accelerated (these machines have ATI Radeon HD 5770 cards) despite the fact that AERENDER probably doesn't require special graphics cards).
Anyone have any ideas, especially if there is some way for force the foreground mode from the start?
Regards,
Jay Production IT Support.

Just to follow up, Our compositing supervisor was still convinced that running with MP was the way to go, so I worked
with him to run some benchmarks on medium and heavy shots that we determinied would trigger the issue in -MP mode.
The test scene was about 50 frames in length, and we ran it on the same hosts with -MP on and -MP off, and also ran a
version of bundled frames (10 frames per host/task) and another where we did all 50 frames on a single host (with and without MP).
Interestingly, in every scenerio of these 4 cases, the version with -MP on, was 2-15% faster (despite the 10-11 minute delay at the start in MP mode).
His conclusion was it's still faster with -MP mode ON, and requested that I continue to explore for patches or theories how we might get around the delay.
Have read links:
http://forums.creativecow.net/thread/2/1025525
http://helpx.adobe.com/content/help/en/after-effects/using/memory-storage1.html
Regards,
-Jay-

What is background rendering? Should I use it?

Sorry for the probably very basic question, but I recently started using Premiere Elements 8 (was using 3 before) and I am not totally clear on the purpose of background rendering even though I have read the faq's and Adobe help descriptions of it.
Is it just for viewing the clips once they are in the movie? Or does it actually affect the final product? Do I need to wait for background rendering to complete or do it by pressing entere before I watch a clip that I have just placed into the sceneline or timeline? Just would like to know what the general purpose of this is and whether I should use it.
(Right now I am working with some old Motion Jpeg files which I have convereted to DV-AVI, but later I plan to use mostly mts files from my camcorder.)
Thanks in advance for your help.

Tech_Savvy,
Good explanation on Rendering.
Some folk do it constantly for that smooth playback. Personally, I will only Render small sections (by setting the WAB), when I am working on Keyframes, of custom animations and Transitions. These, I want to see as smoothly as playback will allow.
The drawback to Background Rendering is that it does take resources. On a fast computer, the user might never even know that it's going on. With a slower computer, the GUI will seem to hang, while this Background Rendering is going on, and any change will trigger it. I do not have PrE 8, but would turn this off, even on my very fast workstation, and manually Render, just the sections I need to preview, when I need to do so. That's just me.
Going back many years, Pinnacle added this feature to Studio. It caused so many problems, though I have to admit that computers were a lot slower then. Most users could do nothing in the program, while the Timeline was being Rendered. Everyone, who I knew, turned it off and never looked back.
Thanks for the inclusion,
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Background rendering when iMac is in standby mode

After I have imported a video file from my Sony HDR Z1 FCP X starts to render in background mode, when I am using the iMac all is fine but if I leave it overnight and the iMac "goes" to sleep" the rendering also stops. Is there a way to stop this so I can leave the machine to complete what it is doing before it goes to sleep?

When the machine is asleep, it is asleep, period.
If you want to give it time to finish rendering before it goes to sleep, open System Preferences->Energy Saver,
click on the "Schedule..." button and set a time for it to go to sleep.
Note: Depending on your mac and the content you are editing, you may not need background rendering at all. Many people prefer to leave background rendering off, and only render specific portions if the playback is not smooth (for instance if you have some effects on a given clip, that your mac cannot play well without rendering, you may want just to render that clip).

Background Rendering in FCP 10.2 is not working

Is anyone else having an issue with background rendering not working in the new FCP 10.2 version?
In fact even the render all function doesn't seem to be working properly since I upgraded. It only appears to be rendering small pieces at a time.
It won't render the whole project out like it's supposed too. Have to keep pressing the Control, Shift, R keys over and over to get it to completely render out the sequence.

Try turning off BG Rendering and turning it back on.
If you have multiple projects in a single library, try another existing project or create a test project; (add some clips with effects to get render bars). If they render, select the first project and choose Delete Computer Generated Project Files.
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Background Rendering - Any way to curb the percentage of processor that Final Cut uses when rendering?

When Final Cut X tires to render something on my machine it literally maxes out all 8 cores, sometimes it takes 15-20 mins to process edits I make to the frames, making my wholemachine freez up. Is there a way to cap the amount of processor the FCX is using for rendering? It wiould be ideal if I could set this at 50% or something, so i could at least work on other projects while my machine is rendering. I made global edits to the whole video I am working on that involve keying and transforms on the frames, so everytime i make an edit early on in the movie, it seems to be re-rendering the transform and key effects through the whole movie. Its a pain!
Next time, I'm going to have to use proxy media. Hopefully that will help.

If your system can handle native rendering, then turn off background rendering and only render when you need to.
If you system is stuggling with native rendering, convert to Pro Res, again keeping background rendering off.

Background rendering question...

I have several 30 minute FCPX projects and all of them have lots of background rendering to do still. (color corrections and the like)
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Advice?
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Corrupted clip freezing FCP X during background rendering.

When I open a particular project, the background rendering starts up and gets to 35% where it then freezes the whole job.
Had to do a Force Quit.
This first occured during colour/exposure modifying, btw.
On start up of FCP I can review the video in the project window and see that a small part of one clip is corrupted, but as soon
as I open FCP (10.0.7) it attempts the backgound render before I can stop it, there-upon freezing.
Can the particular offending clip be successfully removed before I open FCP?
15" MBP with retina display, OSX 10.8.2
Thanks in advance.
Andrew

BenB
Thanks for that - "selected", but not "opened" I see.
Also, I reckon they should change the confusing menu item "Project Properties" to straight "Projects" Yes-No?
RussH
The particular clip would jump around - black frames-out of position frames -staccato playback.
As I said, this was after I'd tried colour adjustments that wouldn't render beyond a certain point.
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I do have the very handy Event Manager X.
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Why turn on background rendering?

So I have a 16gb ram macbook pro retina. I am editing native avchd 720p video in my timeline. This computer will pretty much play back anything with no hickups, even if it needs to be rendered. My question is, if in the end I am going to DVD, why does FCP even need to render if it isn't rendering to mpeg2 format? Is there any reason I wouldn't want to turn off background rendering since I want to export to MPEG2? Thanks!

If you computer is fast enough for realtime playback without rendering you don't need to render before exporting.

Background rendering.

Hi, I've started using the trial version of Final Cut Pro X and have a question...
Background rendering is taking up LOADS of disk space.
Why isn't the rendering overwriting itself?
A 5 minute film shouldn't have to fill over 65GB of disk space, should it?
And, is it possible to delete a clip in iPhoto, that has been imported to
the project in Final Cut Pro X without it dissapering in the project as well?
Best regards,
Adam.

adji00 wrote:
And, is it possible to delete a clip in iPhoto, that has been imported to the project in Final Cut Pro X without it dissapering in the project as well?
As Tom said, this depends how you imported it. If you're not sure, select the clip and press Shift+Cmd+R to reveal the clip in Finder.
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Background rendering? Oh REALLY? Who's Apple kidding?

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