Beefing Up a Dual 867 Mirrored Door

Hi Gang
I just picked up a used G4 Dual 867 Mirrored Door. I'd like to have it around as a backup for my G5 Single 1.8 - I'm about to get a new Hard Drive for it. Was wondering about the Seagate 500 Gig below. After I successfully install the new drive, was wondering if I should add some other features?
Think it might make sense to get the OWC Processor upgrade? With this upgrade, even though it might be faster than my old G5 single, it still can't go above 2 Gigs of RAM.
G4 Dual Specifications;
http://support.apple.com/kb/SP63
500GB Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 Ultra ATA/100
http://eshop.macsales.com/item/Seagate/ST3500630A/
Sonnet Encore/MDX G4 Duet Dual 1.8GHz Processor Upgrade
http://eshop.macsales.com/MyOWC/Upgrades.cfm?sort=pop&model=169&type=Processor&T I=3140&shoupgrds=Show+Upgrades
ATI Technologies RADEON 9800 PRO MAC EDITION
http://eshop.macsales.com/item/ATI%20Technologies/100435068/
Thanx for your opinions
Mike

Hey Kenichi - ole wise one
Restraint is a great idea especially when your're broke. I really didn't want that processor upgrade when I saw how much it was. I will however pick up that Seagate 500 Gig HD, and maybe I'll spring for the Radeon 9200. That's a reasonable upgrade for still under $200.
I also have a G4 733 Quicksilver with this upgraded processor;
http://eshop.macsales.com/item/Other%20World%20Computing/MEG42M1200/
It works great, but I think the Dual 867 I just picked up may still beat out the Quicksilver even in it's current configuration?
I never cared for the iMac design, (with it's hardware built into the screen housing)
Thanx
Mike

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Quicktime movies choppy on dual 867 mirror door

Was going to sell my old machine to a kid who wanted to use it to edit home videos, but to test it out, all his camcorder short QT movies (.mov & downloaded to hard drive) played choppy. Audio was okay.
Stock machine except added 1GB memory. I don't remember it being that bad.
I've got Leopard 10.5.8 on it, but these QT movies played the same on Tiger (most recent version).
VLC makes no difference.
Out of luck?

Hi-
The X800 XT is a flashed FireGL X3.
It was flashed using Graphicellerator tools in 10.3.9 Panther.
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Darn thing runs real hot with the OEM clock settings, and required finding a rare ATI Silencer for it.
I 'spose that I could have tuned the clock settings down, but that wouldn't be any fun, now would it?
There really isn't a dumbed down version, but I'll try:
For ATI cards, iflashing just requires the right card, the right ROM, another Mac that can be connected to using VNC and allow Screen sharing.
Geforce cards must be flashed in a PC.
The PC card is installed in the networked machine, machine started, and then the ROM is dumped using a dumper utility from the Graphiccellerator kit.
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Run the permissions script (included in the utilities kit) and then flash the card.
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Can no longer boot to OS 9.2.2 on a Dual Processor Mirrored Door G4?

Hope someone can put me out of my misery...
I've been running my Mirrored Door (MDD) Dual G4 for years and have always booted into OS 9, but today, the Mac has decided to boot to OSX.
From the Startup Disk Control panel in OSX, I have selected the OS9 system folder as the startup system, but after a restart, OSX still loads. However, on a restart, I notice that I get a quick OS 9 smiley face along with the question mark before it boots into OSX.
The thing is that when OSX is up and running, I can start Classic manually and OS runs OK so I presume the OS 9 Sytem Folder is OK.
Is there something I can do to get the boox booting back to OS9?
Thanks in advance.

If you still have issues after following Kenichi's excellent advice, let us know if you changed anything, ie. added a new disk, added a new application, moved disks, moved the OS9 System Folder, etc.
a guaranteed-to-work very last resort is to
let it boot into OSX,
backup the OS9 System Folder to a subdirectory (make sure it's not in the top level of the boot disk).
use the MDD restore cd's to perform a partial restore, in which you select to restore OS9.
You would then need to re-install any other updates to OS9 since 2003, usually iTunes, QuickTime, etc. There's a definitive list of 6 updates that we keep posting in these forums, but I just can't remember them just now.
- hang on ... Carbonlib v1.6, iTunes v2.0.4, QuickTime v6.0.3, Authoring Support v1.1.9, AppleScript v1.8.3 and MRJ 2.2.6 (Java).
Plus any printer / scanner drivers you may need. But all of these could probably be salvaged from the backup you made of the OS9 System Folder.
If you're like me, I backup the OS9 System Folder every week and keep 4 generations. Mine is about 300MB, 92MB compressed, worthwhile in these days of 120GB-500GB disks.

I Have a silver w/Mirror doors dual 867 running OSX10.2. I try to install OS9.2.1 I get "THIS PROGRAM CAN NOT RUN ON YOUR COMPUTER" Message I need to be able to run Classic.

I have a powermac Silver with mirror doors 867 dual processors running OSX 10.2 no problem there but I need to run Classic but when I try to install OS 9.2.1 I get a "THIS PROGRAM CAN NOT RUN ON YOUR COMPUTER" message.

Your G4 (MDD) dual 867MHz model Mac requires the model-specific version of OS 9.2.2 which originally came with that machine. It can not use any other version of OS 9.
The model-specific version of OS 9.2.2 can be installed using the original disk set which came with that machine; that disk set boots to OS X 10.2, but the installer on it can install OS 9.2.2 (Classic) as an option.
There is no stand-alone install disk (such as a retail, i.e. white-label, CD) which can be used to install Classic on that model G4.

Can no longer boot to OS 9 with Mirrored Door Dual processor G4?

Hope someone can put me out of my misery...
I've been running my Mirrored Door (MDD) Dual G4 for years and have always booted into OS 9, but today, the Mac has decided to boot to OSX.
From the Startup Disk Control panel in OSX, I have selected the OS9 system folder as the startup system, but after a restart, OSX still loads. However, on a restart, I notice that I get a quick OS 9 smiley face along with the question mark before it boots into OSX.
The thing is that when OSX is up and running, I can start Classic manually and OS runs OK so I presume the OS 9 Sytem Folder is OK.
Is there something I can do to get the boox booting back to OS9?
Thanks in advance.

Hi-
You may need to repair your OS 9 volume, or, may need to rebless the OS 9 system folder.
Follow the instructions for OS 9 in this document.

Internet sharing: iMac and G4 PPC Dual Mirror Door via firewire, fire sharing works fine with this set up now need internet sharing

I have already set up file sharing thanks to a query last year, now I need to set up internet sharing, I am using a firewire connection and my ISP has confirmed that their should be not problem in internet sharing between my iMac and my G4 PPC Dual Mirror door but after trying different combinations in the sharing set up I am still drawing a blank on this connection, any help would be appreciated

You have set up file sharing by firewire, right? Now you want to share your iMac's Internet connection with the G4. Does the G4 have an Airport wireless card? If so, set it up that way in System Prefs under Internet Sharing. If the G4 doesn't have an Airport card then you'll need to do it by Ethernet, as in this article http://www.maclife.com/article/howtos/how_share_your_wireless_internet_connectio n_ethernet. But if you do it by Ethernet then your iMac would need to be connected to your modem wirelessly, not by Ethernet, b/c you need the iMac Ethernet port for the connection to the G4. Hope this makes sense.

My G4 DUAL mirror doors MAC shuts down by itself please HELP

I have a G4 dual mirror door. it will just power down by itself. The place where it plugs into the back of the computer is very loose and is the culprit -- what is this even called and what do I need to fix it? is it the power supply?
thanks!
sue

Welcome to Apple Discussions!
Yes it is part of the power suppy. You might want to check one of these used and refurbished outlets for parts that are listed in my FAQ*:
http://www.macmaps.com/usedrefurbished.html
* Links to my pages may give me compensation.

Dual 1.25 G4 Mirrored Doors Replacement Fan Kit

Where can I get one of the replacement fan kits Apple was offering for the Mirrored Door (Wind Tunnel) computers?

I would like to add the specs of the stock fans, so you can use a comparison page to search for fans, that meet the airflow, but are lower in noise.
MDD Single CPU:
60 x 25 =         42,25m3/h    / 38dB(A)
60 x 10 =         29,24m3/h    / 35dB(A)
120 x 38 =         180m3/h      / 49dB(A)
MDD DUAL CPU:
60 x 25 =         64m3/h    / 47dB(A)
60 x 10 =     ?
120 x 38 =     (ca. 110-) 258m3/h variable speed fan     / 53dB(A) (you can include 120x25 fans, too, when you search)
But keep in mind, that manufacturers test are all different and the specs of different manufacturers are not really comparable. Also static pressure plays a role, if a fan has the same airflow, but higher static pressure it will cool better. But that is all theoretical.
Best thing you can do is buy a used fan controller with temperature sensors on Ebay and put it outside the MDD case, route the cables through one of the PCI-Slot-covers or through the air holes. I think temperature is only given for the CPU from the MDD itself (via menumeter or something similar). This is why, if you want to do it accurate, you will have to use a fan controll, because fo the temperature sensors.
Because, putting a fan in, that claims to have the same airflow as the stock fan and will be quieter does not mean, it really hass the same airflow. Your system might be quieter, but hotter.
On the other hand, the fans are chosen by Apple, so that the worst case scenario is taken care of (person loading the CPU 100% and sitting in the direct sun *jokingly*. In other words, it does not need the 250m3/h (devide m3/h by 1,69 to get the american cfm number or use this http://www.elektrosil.com/fileadmin/templates/html/luftdurchsatz.htm )
Also read this: http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1561305
Read here: http://www.xlr8yourmac.com/systems/g4_mirrored_drive_doors/noise_reduction/g4_dd r_noise_reduction.html
Back in the days there was a private person working together with ebm-pabst (the manufacturer of one of the stock fans and long time so called industry-leading manufacturer, not today anymore, though, but they still have the reputation), they tried to not only lower the noise by fan choice, but measuring what wavelenghts add up for the subejctive noise impression. (While two fans might be 20dB(A) you might find one quieter, becasue it is a hizzing sound instead of a buzzing sound...).
I find that appraoch very good. One should contact the person that asked pbm-pabst, if they went any further!
All G4s suffer a design flaw, that is, that it pushes a considerable amount of the heat out through the PSU, which is, why you have the loudest fans there and there is no much variety in choosing different fans.

Dual 1.25 mirror door G4 door stop

Dunno if anyone can help, offer advice or share a similar bad experience with me..
I bought a lovely new mirror door G4 a couple of years ago, upgrading from my trusty old beige G3 so that I could really get the most out my recently purchased Logic Pro setup.
I was new to OS X and wasnt sure what to expect, so when I started getting occasional kernel panics I wasnt too worried, thought it was just one of those things.
But fairly quickly they started to become quite tiresome, and after chatting to other friends with similar machines I learnt that this wasnt normal behaviour.
I did a bit of research and discovered various things that could be triggering it, and systematically went through my list.
External devices - gone. P-Ram - Zapped. Disc doctor - Run. Ram removed and changed - Done. Powersupplies - changed. system rebuilt - done. HD erased and reinstalled - done.
nothing.. the kernel panics continued.
I even got them reinstalling the basic OS!
After 5 months of this and not much joy from the original reseller, they reluctantly took it back for a check up.
"We checked it, reinstalled the system and it all seems fine now"
Day one.. kernel panic..
Reinstalling Logic and all my other apps.. kernel panics..
Back onto the reseller..
"but it seemed fine here... "
I suggested the Ram again, so some more was sent out. (after a couple of months of waiting)
Same problem. Kernel panics galore.
Ok, so we're a year in now, and my warranty has run out.
Apple kindly extend it and the machine is eventually taken in by another reseller who seem to thoroughly go over it and find problems with the logic board which they replace.
Im slightly more optimistic with these guys who seem wholly more professional, but unfortunately the problems continue.
approaching 15 months now..
I do more research. Swap the Ram with my work machines and whammo, they kernel panic! I'm sure I've sussed it this time and speak to Apple who extend the warranty again.
I speak to the original resellers and explain the problem and specify the top end Kingston Ram as being the only brand that I have read that works 100% with the Power Mac G4's which they agree to replace my old ram with and so another long wait begins..
This takes almost 3 months to arrive.
I set it up, fire up the machine and start reinstalling software...
kernel panic.
I am gutted. Nothing left to try.
I speak to Apple again and they really strike the final nail into the coffin this time by telling me, Im sorry, your warranty has run out, theres nothing more we can do.
This goes on for a few calls with me getting more and more irate, until I manage to get the details of a physical customer relations department that I can actually write to.
So, October 2005 and I write a lengthy letter and include 2 years worth of email correspondance between me and various resellers outlining the problems I have been having.
No reply, so November I write again...
No reply, so December I write again...
No reply, so I call them up to find out whats going on, only to be told that they have no record of recieving anything, the mail must have been lost, oh and you're out of warranty?! But I will not take this as closure on the case, so they suggest to fax them.
So, I fax over all the letters and sit back waiting for the swift reply I am promised.
No reply! So, a week and a half later, today, I call again and guess what..
Yes, we are still waiting for your fax to arrive?!
I explained that fax's where generally a fairly instant device and that it wouldnt take a week and half to get there (this is technical support?)
Oh yeah, one bit of priceless support that I got was after returning from holiday last year and continuing with my enquiries, and I was told that sometimes electrical devices stop working if they arent turned on for a couple of weeks?!!! I had to ignore that one. Are they mental?!
So now here I am, on hold, for an hour so far, waiting to be put through to an imaginary senior representative who will no doubt just tell me what Ive already been told a dozen times..
anyone experience anything similar?
Should I drop it off the roof and go to pc world and buy a dell?
aghhh...
Thanks for listening.. needed a vent for my rant!
M

Hey
Yeah, it was more of a rant than anything.
I'd been on hold for an hour to the customer support line and whilst waiting browsed onto the site and felt the need to relieve some pent up anger.
I've used the Apple disk utility to run the hardware and disk checks.
I used one other system profiler app when I first got it, but to no avail, and was warned away from Norton very early on so havent touched that.
It turns out after talking to support that absolutely everything was replaced, so Ive basically got a new machine, apart from the casing and electrics, so maybe the problem lies within the construction.
I did try running the mac with OS X, and I did indeed still get the panics, I also experienced panics whilst trying to install OS X onto an erased drive with no extra ram, peripheral devices, pci boards.... nothing...
Hopefully now apple will see that Ive actually been trying to revive a lemon and it is beyond repair and help me out.
To really rub my face in it, my monitor is now on the way out too!!
I think in 2 years, I must have got about 2 months use out of the machine and it is determined to either send me grey or turn me to PC.
Every time I power it up, I have to half prepare myself for the grey screen to slowly descend across my desktop revealing the oh so familiar restart message.
Will it ever end?!!
M

2nd Gen Ipod Shuffle is not recognized by Power Mac G4 Mirror Door

When I first bought my Shuffle and connected it to my G4 it worked flawless, i put my music on the shuffle and charged it . About 3 weeks later i went to put some new music on it and i plugged it into the dock (iTunes usually comes up automaticly and it shows that my shuffle is connected to the computer), this time it didnt open iTunes and the ipod icon didnt show up on the desktop, i tried taking it off the dock and unplugging it from the computer then plugging it back in and it still wasnt getting recognized. My ipod still plays music fine but when i connect it to my G4 it just blinks amber once and then thats it, nothing happens. Anyone else have similar problem? I cant figure it out.
Power Mac G4 Mirror Door Mac OS X (10.3.9) Power Mac G4 dual 1 GHz prossesors,1.5 GB of RAM, and 200 GB HD

When I first bought my Shuffle and connected it to my
G4 it worked flawless, i put my music on the shuffle
and charged it . About 3 weeks later i went to put
some new music on it and i plugged it into the dock
(iTunes usually comes up automaticly and it shows
that my shuffle is connected to the computer), this
time it didnt open iTunes and the ipod icon didnt
show up on the desktop, i tried taking it off the
dock and unplugging it from the computer then
plugging it back in and it still wasnt getting
recognized. My ipod still plays music fine but when i
connect it to my G4 it just blinks amber once and
then thats it, nothing happens. Anyone else have
similar problem? I cant figure it out.
Is the Shuffle dock connected to one of the REAR USB ports? What does Apple System Profiler say about the USB tree? Does it show the Shuffle?

Mirrored doors G4/ great computer, but some questions --- keep or retire?

Would appreciate anyone who could give me some advice here. I still have the Power Mac Mirrored Door G4/1.0 GHz Dual Processor running (purchased in 2002). It's not my only mac, but I still use this one for some tasks. It's running 10.2.9. As is, will leopard make this run even slower than necessary? (512K ram)
Just saw a warning notice that I'm about to have a drive failure. (the one hard drive/ ata). The warning (either from tech tools pro or disk warrior) may be true-- don't know. The computer still runs great.. no signs of failure, except that I probably need to get rid of 10.2.9.
If/when the drive does fail, is it worth replacing the hard drive? If yes, what's the maximum size to replace it with? Can you tell me the exact specs to look for? The original is a seagate...use that brand again?
I only have 512K ram in there. Upgrade at the same time I do the hard drive?
As is, 512K RAM, if I install leopard is it going to be VERY VERY slow?

Hi! Your machine can handle large ata drives probably up to 750gb without any problems. It has 4 ram slots so sticking 4 512mb sticks of ram brings you to 2 gigs and it won't be too slow on Leopard. It won't be as fast a a G5 or MacPro but it will run Leo just fine. 4 sticks of RAM will cost about 65 bucks and a new 500 gig hard drive will cost 80 bucks or so. So for about 150 bucks you can move up in the world. I often buy new hard drives off eBay for less money for projects myself. Tom

Best FW800 card for G4 Mirror Door?

I've got a Dual 1.25, 1.5G Ram mirror door G4, and I've got a Cinwave card installed on it as well (don't know if that matters or not.) Anybody got any advice on which fw800 is going to be best for me? I'm planning on buying a G-Tech G-Raid for additional storage for this system and capturing in 8-bit Cine YUV codec.
Thanks for your help

We've had great success using FW800 products form Granite Digital. Both PCI cards as well as FW bridges to make my own drive enclosures.
http://www.granitedigital.com

Air Port Extreme and G4 Mirror Door

I would like to add a G4 Mirror Door to my wireless network. What kind or card or device would I need to install in the G4 to get it to connect to the network?
Here are my specs:
Wireless router: Export Extreme Base Station 802.11N
G4: OS 10.3.9; Dual 1.25 GHz PowerPC G4 1MB L3 cache per processor; No airport card insalled.
G4 Mirror Door Mac OS X (10.3.9)

Hello Joel Tarbox. Welcome to the Apple Discussions!
The Power Mac G4 w/ the Mirror Drive Door uses the original AirPort Card. Unfortunately, Apple no longer provides this card. However, you'll find a number of other Vendors that do with a quick Google-search.
(ref: http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=26259)

G4 Mirror Door Video card

We have an older G4 Power Mac that we use for Video editing. Recently upgraded to FC Studio, Motion 3 wil not run on this machine due to Video card not supporting open GL. Our IT depart purchased a ATI Radeon 9600 Pro PC/Mac edition, they were told it would work.
The machine will boot, but ther is no display visable.
Is this machine capable of running this software? IF so which Video card do we need to purchase?
Info:
G4 1.42 mhz Mirror door
OSX 10.4.10
Motion 3
Curent vid card AGP ATI Radeon 9000 pro
New Vid card ATI Radeon 9600 PC/Mac (no display)
TIA
Bob

ATI does have a 256 meg VRam 9800 card built specifically for the 2x/4x agp PowerMac G4's like yours and I bought mine through OWC, although I don't see it currently listed for sale. It would be a better choice than the 128 meg vram card, if you can find it.
That being said, I wouldn't bother to even load FC Studio 2 on this powermac of yours. Motion 3 will barely operate and FCP will launch and then laugh in your face. It's not a pleasant experience; I know firsthand as I loaded Studio 2 on my Quicksilver G4 dualie as a test while awaiting delivery of my Mac Pro last summer. You desperately need to update/upgrade your hardware.

Need recommendations on improving my G4 mirror door

Machine has been running great since I bought it, but I've about cleaned up all I can to my original 80GB HD and now am running about 6GB free space. Things aren't as snappy as it was before as booting I get the blank desktop for awhile while the beachball spins till all the icons show up. Rather annoying having to wait for a simple system really...sooo, I want to do what I can to speed it up.
1. I'd like a larger HD. I haven't shopped in ages, so I'm a bit rusty on my technologies like SATA and such. I know this is pre-SATA, so am I still able to find a compatible drive for this machine? If so, which one is a recommended fast one? I've never been able to really play with Final Cut Express so I want something that would be fast and better. Can I get SATA on this if possible?
2. I have a WD external "Book" drive. It takes a good few minutes before the d%mn thing shows up on my desktop, which is another annoyance. My work PowerMac G5 externals are always on right away. Is it just the age of my machine? It shouldn't take more than a minute but sometimes, it doesn't even show up even after connecting/disconnecting the USB 2 cable. I am using a USB 2 PCI card (got it at the now defunct CompUSA, but mac dude at the store said this was compatible w/ all the macs he sold...CompUSA brand though). I notice my System Profiler will beachball for a long time then when it stops, then I am able to view my "Contents > Hardware > USB" and see the ports.
3. The beachballs are driving me nuts. The machine is old so I don't want to really spend too much more money, but I want to be able to survive wait times and speed things up till I can afford a new machine. Is it better just to get a Core Duo 2 Mini and forget this one? I find I use external drives now anyways, but I can't really stretch the $1K mark for a low end iMac. But the speed difference is much better on the base iMac than a Mini, but then again, if I'm "getting by" with this old G4, a Mini is light years ahead right? Any advice? $799 is a big stretch, so I'm looking at these cheap tweaks for my machine now. My main thing is to get a bigger HD and stop the beachball spinning.
Let me know which hardware I need, as I don't know what is still "compatible" with this older box.
Also, are there any good hardware upgrades for this? I notice for the older PMG4s but mirrored door seems to have no CPU upgrades. I only own a single one, is there a dual one for this, or even an Intel for it?
Thanks for any help offered!
Message was edited by: applrob

How much RAM do you have? You should max it out.
*How Big a Hard Drive Can I Put in My iMac, eMac, or Power Mac?*
http://lowendmac.com/macdan/05/1024.html
Look at these links
Mac Tune-up: 34 Software Speedups
http://www.macworld.com/article/49489/2006/02/softwarespeed.html
52 Ways to Speed Up OS X
http://www.imafish.co.uk/articles/post/articles/130/52-ways-to-speed-up-os-x/
Tuning Mac OS X Performance
http://www.thexlab.com/faqs/performance.html
11 Ways to Optimize Your Mac's Performance
http://lowendmac.com/eubanks/07/0312.html
The Top 7 Free Utilities To Maintain A Mac.
http://mac360.com/index.php/mac360/comments/thetop_7_free_utilities_to_maintain_amac/
Mac OS X: System maintenance
http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?messageID=607640
 Cheers, Tom

Beefing Up a Dual 867 Mirrored Door

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