Cable Cards

I am trying to upgrade my Tivo and in order for it to work, I need to get a cable card from Verizon. Over the phone, I was told that a Verizon installer would have to come to my house and that it would cost $80. That is the most ridiculous thing that I have ever heard. Seriously? Has anybody heard of somebody getting a cable card and installing it themselves to save money?

Basically when ordering, you have to just smile and nod.
the reps over the phone deal with them so rarely that there is really bad information that they have or give.
its 3.99 a month
a tech has to install it no matter what the rep tells you.  if they place your order and tell you no truck roll, then just smile and nod and make sure to give them a good number to reach you at, because a tech will end up giving you a call and asking when he can meet you.
and there is no truck roll fee associated unless they do additional wiring. 
don't bother arguing with the rep about it because they will remain clueless, and you will spend way more time on the phone then you want.   

Similar Messages

  • Question regarding ONT connection via Ethernet and Cable cards

    Hi,
    We recently upgraded to Fios Quation 150Mbps/65  plan. We are not getting the advertised speeds (we only get like 5mbps upload) so verizon is sending a tech to switch the ONT connection from coax to ethernet.
    I have 2 questions regarding this new setup:
    1. If the ONT communicates with the Fios Actiontect router via ethernet instead of coax from now on, How will the set top boxes and Tivo-esque cable card powered device I currently have connected to coax, talk to the verizon system from now on, if coax is taken out of the equation? Will fios signal still flow through the internal coax wiring of the house? And moreover, I was under the impression that coax was the way set top boxes communicated and derived independent ip addresses from the Fios router, for on deman purposes and what not. How will this work from now on?
    Quiestion 2.
    Right next to the wall where the ONT sits, theres's a basement office where we have a PC that connects to the Fios system  via an Actiontect MoCa adapter (ECB2500C) which I assume derives it internet connection from the Fios Actiontec router which sits upstairs in the living room. 
    Again, with the Coax about to be disabled next Friday in favor of ethernet connection from the ONT, I assume this PC will be left without internet because of the lack of internet signal in the coax? Is this correct? 
    Question 2.5 If my above assumption is correct, since this office is right on the other side of the wall where the ONT sits outside the house, would it be possible to run an ethernet wire through the wall that connects straight from the ONT to an ethernet switch inside the office, from which I would derive a connection for this basement PC (properly firewalled of course) and then, from said switch, continue running the ethernet wire that would ultimately reach the Actiontec Fios router upstairs from which the rest of the house derives it's internet?  and would this setup affect in any way the propper functioning of the cable boxes in the house?
    I'd appreciate your input and any help you can provide so I can have a ballpark idea of what to tell the Fios guy to do when he comes on Friday.
    Cheers.
    Solved!
    Go to Solution.

    It's not valid to have two devices connected to the ONT, PC and VZ Router.  Must be a single device. The ONT locks onto the MAC Address of the first device it sees. Since you have TV you should have the VZ router as the internet facing router.
    Other options:
    1.  Have the VZ Router located next to the PC in the basement and then use Wireless for all other PC's.
    2.  Have the VZ Router located next to the PC in the basement but run one wire upstairs and connect a switch where other PCs and devices can connect via a wire.
    Hope that helps.

  • Can someone help me understand how I can use cable cards with external digital tuners?

    Here's my situation.  I currently have a PC with an internal TV tuner card.  I connect the internal TV tuner card to a standard QIP2500-2 Set Top Box.  I've never been very happy with this setup, although it mostly works.  But,  I can only record or watch one channel at a time.  In addition, changing channels requires a silly IR blaster so changing channels from Windows Media Center uses the IR remote signals to change channels on the set top box.
    I was thinking I could use a product like this together with a cable card from Verizon, eliminating the set top box.  I read the FAQ here but I am still unclear about how cablecards work and what capabilities they enable.  My questions are:
    1) The FAQ says using a cablecard eliminates the use of the online TV guide.  How then does one schedule recordings in windows media center?  It would seem silly to have to still have a STB just to get the program guide.  What do others do about this?
    2) Are the cable cards provided by Verizon compatible with the above product shown in the link?  The Verizon FAQ says the device must be marked "DCR" to be compatible, but looking at all the digital tuner products at NewEgg, none of them seem to be marked with "DCR".  They say, "m-CARD".
    3) What are others out there doing to utilize FIOS TV with a computer and not have a set top box?
    Thanks for any insight!

    I haven't used the SiliconDust product, but I have been using a similar product by Ceton, for nearly five years.
    By inserting a CableCARD into the tuner, you would have access to the same channels as a set-top box. You rent a cableCARD from Verizon, just like you'd rent a set-top box from them. I have an m-card, which just allows multiple channels to be tuned at once, unlike the older s-card.
    You do, however, lose Pay Per View and on-demand programming. For me, it's not a great loss.
    The program guide is handled through Windows Media Center, which holds programming data for the next 14 days. You schedule your recordings there. It's also smart enough to reschedule shows, if there's a recording conflict (too many scheduled shows, not enough tuners)
    Although you can contunue to use an IR blaster (I use one), you can also get a Media Center companion app from Ceton. It doesn't require a Ceton tuner...it will still control Media Center. The app costs a few bucks, but it's worth it. They make it for Android and Apple, and maybe Windows Phone. It will let you manage your schedules, and use your phone/tablet as a remote control over WiFi.
    Buy a big hard drive to hold your scheduled recordings. Expect to use an average of 10-15 gigabytes per hour of HD recording. The beauty of this system, is that you can just add another hard drive whenever you need more space, sonething the STB's won't let you do.
    For service in other rooms, use an Xbox360 if you have one. Or, buy a Ceton Echo extender (again, doesn't require a Ceton tuner). Don't use Wi-Fi for your extenders. Wired Ethernet is a must...most wireless won't be able to keep up.
    Hope this helps.

  • Where can I get my cable card????

    I'm trying to fix one of my box but is asking me to "re-install my cable card"

    yuleme wrote:
    I'm trying to fix one of my box but is asking me to "re-install my cable card"
    What type of Box?
    What Model?
    Is this a TiVO or a third party, non Verizon box?
    If it is not a Verizon box and you need a cable card, you can order it from Verizon sales or login to myverizon.com and you can order it online.
    If it is Verizon hardware, contact tech support.
    http://www22.verizon.com/content/contactus/

  • Picture with no sound - Cable Card

    has anyone turned to a channel where the picture was on display, but not the sound?
    I know it's not my TV/sound system, b/c as soon as I change the station, the sound returns.
    this has only appeared on one tv, my plasma with a cable card, and only on one channel: channel 1 - MASN 2 (baltimore area).
    my other tvs with the boxes do emit sound on this station, so I presume it has something to do with the cable card.
    You've got to be very careful if you don't know where you're going, because you might not get there. --Yogi Berra

    Loose coax  could  be an issue but not likely. If the coax was loose or bad then most likely you would have other symptoms. BUT you cant totally eliminate that as a possibility until you reseat it. maybe as a last resort...
    If you are only having that issue with just that one channel and no others, and all other tv's are coming in correctly then it is likely an issue with the card itself.
    I have a feeling that it is likely a glitch in the card as channel 1 is an unusual channel. Most tv's, VCR's, DVR's and such by default dont look for a channel 1 because channel 2 is usually the first channel anywhere, In fact my tv wont turn to channel one at all. So it may have to do with the fact that we are tuning into a channel that is not normally an accessible channel. Or now to think of it, that may also be an issue with the tv itself by the same reasoning, it may not have the sound due to that is not a channel normally tuned into by tv's... Has it ever worked on that tv? If not, try calling the tv manufacturer and ask if the tv will have any issues with channel 1.  All your other tv's are using standard inputs and the STB is doing the decoding, but with a cable card, the tv itself is having to tune to an unusual channel.

  • FIOS And TIVO Series # and Cable Cards

    I recently lost one tuner on my series 3 TIVO HD.  Asked for re-activation and eventually a new cable card to restore the lost tuner.  After the second visit I had nothing on either tuner.  Techs claim they have never been trained on cable cards, inventory is not controlled so they know good ones from bad ones, there is no way to test a cable card in their shops.  After and extended discussion and a visit by two senior techs and a supervisor I got back a few channels on one tuner.  I get only locals up to channel 50, USA.  I get the locals in both SD and HD so I know the tuner is working. 
    I went to the Tivo Community Bulletin Board to see if anyone else had this problem.  I found that on December 4, 2009 in Western New York TIVO owners with cable cards lost all channels above 50.  This was resolved in about one week and was clearly a back office problem with FIOS software used to authorize the cards.  I thought I could go to the national FIOS support center and get my problem fixed in the same way since this appears to be an identical problem.  NO SURPRISE. 
    Verizon national FIOS technical support refused to investigate the problem or solution with Western New York.  The one and only thing the tesch would do was to order another truck roll without any attempt to contact their center in New York.  At one point he said he did not have the telephone number and could not look it up (Verizon is one of  the largest phone companies in the country and they have no way to find an internal number in the same FIOS support organization??   
    I have a lot of respect for the techs who try to solve problems (not this one) and I expect this will be resolved once I speak to a supervisor, but why doesn't Verizon provide adequate support and training to their techs on TIVO and cable cards.  I suppose they just want to continue to push their own HD STB by making it so hard to use anything else that you eventually just give up. 
    In my humble opinion Verizon, along with the other cable providers so abuse the process of installing third party equipment that they should be prohibited form selling or renting equipment.  They should provide only the service and equipment, as was the case with ATT, should be divorced from service.  That process revolutionized phone service and it could do the same for television service. 

    well without a lot of reports from other customers in your area, they are going by the assumption that it is not an outage, and that there is no sizeable amount of customers experiencing the same issue, so they are treating it as an individual case basis.   You're right the Tech's don't have a lot of training on tivo's because they aren't supported items.  They rely on tivo technical support to support their own product.   The cable cards are a simple thing to verizon.  make sure they are activated - possibly send you a new one if their is suspicion that the cable card is bad, and 'possibly' a field tech.  field tech's aren't a whole lot of good as you have come to experience, because they are not tivo technicians. they are fios technicians and they support their own product.   
    I would reach out to the tivo bulletin boards and post your issue there, and see if there is a consensus as to what the problem is, maybe one of them have had a similiar issue.  Please remember that absent any other reports in your area, that verizon can't consider it a back end thing, if it were it would naturally affect multiple tivo customers in an identical fashion.  
    Is it possible it's the tivo box itself?  tivo's go bad just like any other piece of hardware.   
    Also keep an eye on this forum post of yours, there are others here with tivo's that have a good deal of experience, and may have ran into the problem themselves,   they may be coming along and reading the posts soon I would hope.  
    another great resource is the dslreports.com forum for issues like this.
    give them a shot too.  http://www.dslreports.com/forum/vzfiostv
    sorry about all your trouble, but for the record, if your cards only get channels upto 50 it sounds like a reactivation of those cable cards would correct it.    I can imagine that if you have talked to a supervisor and a few technicians that they would have tried that, but if you are unsure that they did, I would call back in to tech support again and ask them if they can deactivate and reactivate the cards.      normally when a verizon dvr gets 1-50, it is that same issue.   if they haven't replaced the cable cards, I would pursue that, if the reactivations don't help.

  • I ordered a cable card, and I'm not sure if I'll need a tuner adapter as well?

    I ordered a cable card (from Verizon) to use with "Hauppauge WinTV DCR-2650 Dual Tuner Cable Card Tuner" and a PC running Windows 7 Media Center (it passed the test.)
    My question is, do I need to order a tuner adapter (not sure what this is) to make my setup work?
    I'm thinking that a tuner adapter is used when you don't have a cable card, is this correct? So that you could get SD stations like you would from a cable company with out a box.

    Welcome to the Apple Support Communities
    Most of the times, when you spill liquid on a computer, something gets damaged. It may the keyboard, it may the trackpad or it may the logic board. In your case, I hope that only the keyboard got damaged, because the logic board is the most expensive part of the MacBook, as near everything is soldered onto the logic board.
    I recommend you to make a backup of your data and take the computer to an Apple Store or reseller to get it diagnosed and repaired. It's probable that your computer will stop working soon because of the water, if it got onto your logic board

  • When will Verizon deploy the new M series cable cards.

    I have read that verizon will be switching over to the newer multistream M series cable cards. When can we expect them to be available and also will the cost be the same as the current s cards.
    On  the same note why is Verizon charging $3.98 each for the current s cards whrn most cable companies only charge about $2~$3 each. That wont be so bad if the price stays the same for the M cards because only one is required for 2 streams. It sort of looks like verizon is trying to discourage the use of TIvo's and Cable card computers (MCE) by over pricing the cable card rentals.

    My main question is has Verizon anounced a price for M cards. As I said befor $3.98 each ($7.98 for 2) S Cards is too much. I certainly hope they dont charge $7.98 for one M card just because it can do the same as 2 S cards. I beilive Vierizon is trying to discourage Tivo & MCE cable card users by artificialy over charging for cable cards.
    Message Edited by Davefred99 on 08-08-2008 11:30 PM

  • Cable Card issue: Can't view premium channels

    I recently switched from Comcast to FIOS, and have been very happy with the new services so far.  One thing that has been driving me crazy however, is that I can't get my cablecard to view any of the premium channels I subscribe to.  
    It looks like there's an issue with activation, but everytime I call the FIOS tech support they say that it looks good on their end.  However if I look at the status of my cable card it says:
    Authentication:  Success
    Authorization:  Needed
    If I look at the log for my device when I try  to tune a premium channel, it shows:
    20121224-17:16:58 CableCARD: Tuner0: vchannel 850 (225MHz-734) access = not-subscribed
    I'm using a HD Prime Homerun network tuner, however I also have a STB in the house, and it tunes those channels perfectly.  
    The FIOS tech support guys/gals I've talked with, don't seem to be too up to speed on cable cards, and even tried to forward my call to TIVO support (the TIVO support person was just as confused as I was, since I told them that it wasn't a TIVO that I was using).  
    Any ideas?  
    Edit:  Also wanted to add, that one FIOS support tech suggested that the card was defective, so I did swap out for a new card, but the new card is acting exactly like the old one.

    Hubrisnxs - Thanks for the message. . . I've definitely been giving those numbers out everytime I call in, but maybe I just need to keep trying until I get someone who can push the magic buttons.  I know these cable cards are somewhat finicky, but it's definitely frustrating to spend hours on the phone without getting things working.

  • Cable cards for Tivo box: two different chat reps say VZ no longer offers Cable Cards.

    Hello All,
    I've just moved to the Philly area and am in the process of getting Fios installed. I've asked the on-line chat reps about getting a cable card for my Tivo Premier and two different reps say "Jasper(23:51:37): I apologize but you would be unable to order a Cable Card as we do not provide Cable Cards anymore."
    Yet, I see questions about cable cards and Tivo tuners. Where can I obtain a Cable Card?
    Thanks, Scott
    Solved!
    Go to Solution.

    They have cable cards the rep probably just doesn't know how to add it to the account.

  • Shipping & handling for Cable Card

    I wonder why Verizon wants to charge me $19.99 for th shipping and handling of a Cable Card. 

    javito wrote:
    I wonder why Verizon wants to charge me $19.99 for th shipping and handling of a Cable Card. 
    Hello,
    One can order FiOS TV equipment:
    online by signing into one's account via verizon.com,
    over the phone by calling 1-800-837-4966, OR
    at a local FiOS TV store
    The STB can either be mailed out directly to your home with a shipping fee, or you can request pick up at the local FiOS store (call first to check whether they have them in stock).  
    Here is a list of local FiOS TV stores: http://www22.verizon.com/support/residential/tv/fiostv/general+support/account+issues/questionsone/8...
    Hope this helps!

  • Tivo Cable Card issues

    I am having a serious issue with getting a cable card paired to my TiVo box. After 2 ½ years I lost most of all my channels on 7/3 and it has not worked since then. I was out of town from 7/3-7/10 and was not able to contact Comcast about this issue until 7/10. On that date the phone rep was unsuccessful of correcting this issue so she suggested that I return the card to a local office and get a replacement.
    On Sat 7/11 I picked up the replacement card as well as 2 additional cards. After working with several reps over 3 hours none of the cards could be paired with the box. So, the last rep I spoke to scheduled a tech visit on Sunday 7/12. The tech checked all the cable wires and found no connection issues. He tried for over 2 hours trying to pair the cards I had and a new card he brought with no success.
    While the tech was at my home, I called TiVo tech support that walked us through the process to determine if the card was paired correctly. They advised us that Comcast should correctly pair the card to the TiVo box. Now, I returned the last card to Comcast and picked up 2 cards. I’m up to 7 cards now. Before, I attempt to pair these cards; I would appreciate if someone at Comcast who knows how to correctly pair cable cards to TiVo boxes assist me with this process.
    Please advise the correct # to call for cable card activation.

    Hi sdeebrad, while looking at your account I am seeing two cable cards that aren't paired to any hosts. Can you please provide me the following via private
    message?
    Card S/N
    Unit Address
    Host ID
    Data ID
    Thank you
    You can click on my name (ComcastPhill) and click on “Private Message Me”.
    At the top of each Forum page you will see a small envelope
    This is the icon for Private Messages, referred to as ‘PM’s’. A Private Message is a way to communicate in private, to another User, Moderator, or Administrator out of public view in the Forums.
    The gray envelope icon will have a number next to it if you have any new messages waiting.
    To open a PM to read it, double click on the envelope. If you click on the white envelope a window will open with tabs for your Private Message Inbox, Sent Messages, Friends, Ignored Users, and Compose new Message. You can also access this area by clicking on the Username in a Thread or post. By default, Private Messages are enabled. You can disable this feature in My Settings>Preferences> Private Messenger.
     

  • Access cable card from multiple PCs?

    I've got several PCs on my home network.  I instsalled a cable card on computer A.   Is there a way I can watch live TV or program the card from computer B?

    KaLin wrote:
    PJL wrote:
    You will note a blank post from me immediately before this one.  This happened when I tried to cancel the post but the forum software posted a blank post anyway.
    I pointed this type of error out to the site administrators over six months ago, but it was never corrected.
    So pardon my blank post -- blame it on the Lithium software that runs this site.
    We have tested this across multiple browsers and boards here on the community and cannot replicate the error that you're getting.  Unless we can verify there is a bug in the software, we can't file a support case with the developers on it.
    KaLin, you need to refer to the community leaders forum for the post about this. 
    Your testing apparently was not thorough enough.  I am running Windows 8 with IE 10, and other with it have the same issue.
    Let's not hijack this thread further.  I apologize to the OP for responding off subject.

  • Cable Card Issues/Nig​htmare

    Good Evening,
    I'm running out of options at this point (and time). In a nutshell, I have yet to have my cable card "activated".
    Issue History:
    I have had issues since I started my subscription to FiOS, sadly.
    1.) I originally placed an order for my FiOS triple play bundle two or three days before moving into my new place. Shortly afterwards, I found the option for a cable card and called the verizon employee I spoke with was happy to change my order to only include a cable card and SD set top box, as opposed to the HD DVR I had originally ordered. I received my order confirmation number and UPS shipping information, and it was due to arrive March 15th (Friday). When March 16th rolled around, I called Verizon to enquire as to why my shipping information still said something along the lines of "A UPS label has been created, but the facility has not yet received your order".
    2.) The verizon employee I talked to agreed to have a tech come out the next day (Sunday). The tech was going to install my wireless router and my CableCard for me. I had a whopping time frame of 8am to 9pm that the tech may show, which is inconvienient when you are moving into a new house. Regardless, the tech came and was very friendly. He installed a splitter on to one o my coax connections and added a the Verizon router and we plugged the CableCard into my HDHomeRun TV Prime tuner.
    3.) Assuming all was well and that I could call in to activate the CableCard, I told the tech all was well. I had to get windows media center running and a few things on my end. After getting to the CableCard activation screen, I called to get my CableCard activated. I had to wait on the tech support line for about an hour due to the fact I had no activation code.
    4.) After talking to about five different technical support representatives, I still can not get my CableCard activated. All of the technical support reps have stated that they will activate the card and that it may take 30 minutes to activate. Otherwise, they state that the card is already "activated". Regardless of what their system says, my CableCard is still coming up as not activated.
    In summary:
    Currently, when I few my cable card status, I see this:
    Card Authentication
    success
    Card OOB Lock
    success
    Card Activation
    none
    I also have access to my CableCard ID, Host ID, and data ID. I have my card's UnitAddress and Card serial number handy as well. My Verizon FiOS internet works fine. I've read on the internet that others have had similar issues getting their cable card connected. If anybody has any suggesitons or is willing to look into this in a little more depth, I would appreciate it. At this point, I am out of options and I can't spend another two nights talking to technical support =(.

    When you call tech support, it's been mentioned on numerous forums, that verizon and cable card providers define activation differently.  So when you call verizon ask them if its  activated, and if they say yes, then ask them if they can validate the card - that should be special info for them, that they treat it differently, and they do a validation with all the new current info.
    gl

  • Multstream Cable Card Programming and TiVo

    Good Morning,
    I am hoping someone can help me with an issue I am having with getting our the second tuner to work on TiVo box.  We have a TiVo Series 3 HD box wit a Motorola Multstream Card.  About 4 weeks ago our original box stop working and TiVo shipped a new one.
    When we received the new box the original card would only display one tuner.  When I contacted TiVo they felt it was a problem with the card because the authorization information does not display on "Conditional Access" screen.
    It is my understanding that the authorization is performed by the technician or at the office.  It is very important that the pairing of this information is performed correctly or the box will not work.  I saw the authorization information at one point and then when I went back in 10 minutes later it was gone.  Would this be an indication of a bad card or a bad TiVo box?
    Solved!
    Go to Solution.

    dmeashar wrote:
    Your posting suggests that the box is defective.  What leads you to this conclusion?  TiVo is adamant that the problem is with the card.  Their technicians state that the TiVo box has no control over the tuning functions.  Their logic is the following: Since we are receiving all channels on one tuner and only a gray screen on the second tuner the fault lies with the adapter card.
    FYI, we are experiencing inconsistent display of data on the Conditional Access Screen.  Frequently there are only 4 lines of information when 9 lines should be present.  TiVo contends that the missing lines are consistent with an adapter card that is going bad.  This missing lines of data contain the authorization information required to display the second tuner.
    Thanks for your help, from my discussions with TiVo and Verizon is seems that this card has presented a number of problems for both organizations.  With all of the finger pointing between the two organization, think I might try to check with the card source.   Motorola might be able to provide some insight.
    Motorola does not provide any support to end-users.  You're not going to get anything from them.
    Have you verified that you have a good signal?  Are you seeing a 90-100 signal on your TiVo?  Some installers added significant attenuation to older TiVo installs, and that is no longer necessary with version 11.0d of the Tivo software.  With the current TiVo software, attenuation usually hurts more than it helps.  If you've got a borderline signal in the 50s or 60s due to substantial attenuation, that could prevent one tuner from locking on to channels (since tuner sensitivity differs slightly).
    There is a way to rule out the TiVo hardware as the cause.  To do that, you would remove the CableCard and run a Channel Scan under Settings -> Channels.   This will add a list of QAMs to your Channel List.  After the channel scan, open the Channels List under Settings -> Channels and enable (check) the QAMs from 71-74.  These are the unencrypted local channels.   Attempt to tune a different QAM in the 71-74 range on each tuner; if you can do that, you know the TiVo hardware is fine and the CableCard is the problem.  If you can't do that, then you know there is a problem with the box.
    If you are the original poster (OP) and your issue is solved, please remember to click the "Solution?" button so that others can more easily find it.

Maybe you are looking for

  • Need to run firefox 3.6 because of un-supported plugin.

    Hello, I am looking for advice on how to run Firefox 3.6 as securely as possible. Yes I realize that is an outdated and insecure, but I have no choice. I use a commercial product called Kurzweil Reader. It is a screen reader designed specifically for

  • I have version 36.0; however, I continue to get notice it is out of date. What should I do now?

    I will try this again, the dialog stated I did not have permission to access. I refreshed FireFox because I was having some lag issues with the browser. After it was reset I now get the following: "Looks like you're using an older version of Firefox.

  • LOOKUP for accounts in %ACCOUNT_SET%

    Hye.  I try to do a easy scriptlogic  but I get error. I have an input report witth  3 accounts (5700,5710,5720) as lines and 2009.JUN and 2009.JUL as columns. I introduce data in month 2009.JUL in input report  and I use LOOKUP in a Script Logic Def

  • I CANT HEAR ANY SOUND FROM MY HP PAVILIION DV5

    I CANT HEAR ANY SOUND FROM MY HP PAVILIION DV5 IT STARTED WHEN I PLUGGED IN MY MP3 HEADPHONES INTO MY PAVILION DV 5 LAPTOP AND IT WAS OK I HEARD SOUND THROUGH THE HEADPHONES BUT WHEN I PLUGGED IT OUT I COULDNT HEAR SOUND ANYMORE FROM MY PC BUT IF I P

  • Hidden Characters Displaying Wrong

    So ever since I started using CS4 my InDesign will sometimes show my hidden characters improperly. There doesn't seem to be any consistency in when it happen. The only common thing I can think of is that it sometime happens after I open an Illustrato