Color management Tiger 10.4.8

Just updated OS today.
How do you change in the print dialogue:
Printer features - Colorsync - Color Conversion - to Printer?
That option is grayed and pring color is not accurate.
Before the update, I had no problem with Tiger 10.4. setting
No Color Management.
I am using the Epson Stylus Photo 1280.
Thanks.

Similar Messages

Print Color Management Problem w. Photoshop Elements and Tiger/Leopard

Has anyone tried printing with ICC profiles through Photoshop Elements 6 for Mac? Apparently, it does not work on Tiger nor Leopard? My prints look very dark and over-saturated.
The Datacolor folks, who make the Spyder3 calibrators I'm using, say my prints look like they are being "double color managed," possibly once by PSE and once by the printer driver (even though it's turned off).
Over at the Adobe Forums some say it's a problem with Leopard. I'm not so sure, because I found that printing color management works fine on a Mac with Photoshop Elements 4.01 and Tiger. Any comments? Thanks.

Aha! Got it. Adobe has confirmed that the problem is on their end. PSE 6 is double color managing the images. Here's what one user got in reply from Adobe on the subject. There are two separate answers:
Thank you for contacting Adobe Technical Support.
After consulting with my colleagues about the issue you raised, I can let you know the following:
The issue is both on our as well as the driver software side and the workaround we have given is the best available at this time. This issue is affecting all printers, not just Epson or Canon.
The soft proofing effect that you are seeing in the print preview is indeed an attempt at soft proofing. However since Photoshop Elements managed prints are incorrectly double colour managed it is not as useful as it was initially designed.
As to the exact details of why this occurred, we have no official information.
We believe that this will resolve the issues you are experiencing, however, should the reply not help solve the problem, please contact us again, quoting the case number given above, and we will re-open the case.
Answer # 2
We have had word back from our engineers regarding your issue.
The Photoshop Elements team are aware of the problem and are working with Apple and the printer manufacturers to get this to work correctly. In the meantime, the only workaround is to switch off colour management in Photoshop Elements and let the printer handle the colour management.
Unfortunately we can not make an estimation as to when a fix will be provided. We will close the case for the time being as there really is nothing more we can do about this issue besides offering the suggested workaround. Closing this case does not mean that the research will stop however and the engineers are working on a solution to this.
As the tech noted, let the printer handle the color instead. Tell PSE not to manage color so it is the step sending the data unaltered. When the print dialogue comes up, under the Color Correction heading, change the pull down menu to "ColorSync". In the menu below that, choose the correct profile for the paper you're using. If the Brightness menu is still active, look for any choice that allows you to turn it off. If none exists, leave it on Normal. If the options below that for Color Balance and Intensity are not grayed out, make sure they are at the center positions (no effect).
These steps are the same as before, except you're doing them in reverse. Photoshop is doing nothing and the print driver is handling the ColorSync chores rather than the other way around.

How I can set Leopard to use the color management mixture that Tiger uses?

I have recently bought a new Mac with Leopard installed. My old Mac is running Tiger. Unfortunately the color management default settings in Leopard are different than in Tiger, so this is completely messing up my calibration. Can somebody please tell me how I can set Leopard to use whatever color management mixture that Tiger uses? - Thanks.

I already have set FF to No Proxy. This made FF work again, but not any of my other internet programs, programs that don't have the option to set to no proxy, they rely on the system settings. So I need to know how to reset my system settings back to their default values. This will allow all my net progs to access the net again, including FF using the Use System Settings option. Since FF has an option to use system settings, this is a somewhat FF related question. I need to get all my net programs working again, not just FF! And, if my system settings are restored, FF will work using the system settings, and all my other progs will work too.

Color management in Photoshop Elements...

Hello all
I know this is an Apple forum, but I also know many of you use Photoshop Elements as well, and I think there is a wealth information here.
So, I am very perplexed about something in PSE. I currently have PSE3 for Mac (although the version should not matter for my question).
My question has to do with the color settings in PSE preferences. As you know, one can choose No Color Mgt., Limited Color Mgt. = sRGB, or Full Color Mgt. = Adobe RGB. When I choose full color mgt., overall tones are VERY red. When choosing limited color mgt., colors are slightly red, and no color mgt., colors are fairly neutral. This is all by default. I know how to clean up the color casts, but for general printing, where should I be? I typically only print 4X6 or occasionally 8X10, nothing professionally. When printing, what is the ideal, or preferred Source Space? I have found that if the source space is the same as how the image is tagged, things look pretty good. I also keep the Print Space set to my monitor settings which is the iMac profile. I suppose the issue is that I do not want to have to constantly correct the reddish tones for every photo I manipulate in PSE, although I typically do.
So my basic question is this: What settings are you using in the PSE print dialog box that give you the best looking prints, i.e., source space, print space? How do you color manage you photos? And, what are your color settings in preferences?
Many thanks in advance…

mikwen:
If you compare the sRGB and Adobe RGB color profiles with ColorSync Utility you'll see that the Adobe profile is much wider. I understand it is used for high end CMYK printing or similar. The Adobe profile gives me a much darker onscreen image. Haven't printed with it in quite a while so don't remember what the output was.
Apple uses the sRGB profile in their books and other printed products. So I've setup PSE to use the sRGB profile and set my monitor to sRGB but with a 2.2 gamma. That seems to work for me.
I don't know which camera you have or what color profile it embeds but the Canon's, and others, have a camera profile that is very close to the sRGB. If you installed the software that came with your camera it probably added the camera's profile to the system and you can view it with ColorSync Utility.
Do you Twango?
TIP: For insurance against the iPhoto database corruption that many users have experienced I recommend making a backup copy of the Library6.iPhoto database file and keep it current. If problems crop up where iPhoto suddenly can't see any photos or thinks there are no photos in the library, replacing the working Library6.iPhoto file with the backup will often get the library back. By keeping it current I mean backup after each import and/or any serious editing or work on books, slideshows, calendars, cards, etc. That insures that if a problem pops up and you do need to replace the database file, you'll retain all those efforts. It doesn't take long to make the backup and it's good insurance.
I've written an Automator workflow application (requires Tiger), iPhoto dB File Backup, that will copy the selected Library6.iPhoto file from your iPhoto Library folder to the Pictures folder, replacing any previous version of it. You can download it at Toad's Cellar. Be sure to read the Read Me pdf file.

Color management tech specs

Do they have any color management and image quality advice anywhere
for the new books?
I already know how I would set them up, just would like to see something from Apple.

Tom:
Here's what Apple sent me when I asked them about book media quality:
I contacted Apple and asked for information that I could pass on. Here's the reply I received from Apple:
"Thank you for contacting the Apple Print Products Customer Service.
I understand that you would like to know the printing process that is used and the color mode the files should be in, so you can better advise users in the iPhoto forum.
iPhoto version 4 or later, allows you to import and print files through the Apple Print Product service as RGB, grayscale, or CMYK color space. JPEG files with RGB color space are recommended for best results.
While iPhoto 2 can import files of various formats, including RGB color, grayscale, and CMYK, this version requires JPEG files with RGB color space when printing photos and books.
For more information regarding iPhoto 2, please visit the following article:
iPhoto: Color, Black and White Prints Appear Garbled or Distorted
For more information regarding iPhoto 5, please visit the following article:
http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=165501
Here are some of the technical specifications for the books, cards, and calendars. I hope this gives you an idea about their quality and form.
BOOKS
All iPhoto books are printed using acid-free paper for long-lasting image quality. The photos are printed at a high resolution (300DPI if you use iPhoto 6). There is no external modification--such as sharpening or contrast adjustment--of the photos; what you see in the application is what is printed in the book.
Hardcovers Books
The cover is hard-bound and covered in linen. You select the linen color during the book-ordering process. The hardcover books have a solid, stiff binding that is glued and crimped. The internal pages, measuring 8.5 x 11 inches, are printed on McCoy 100# Text Gloss paper stock.
Softcover Books
The softcover books come in three sizes:
- Large 8.5 x 11 inches
- Medium 6 x 8 inches
- Small 2.6 x 3.5 inches
All of the softcover books have internal pages that are printed on McCoy 100# Text Gloss paper stock. The large softcover book has a white cover (Kromekoteplus Folding Cover, 16 point) with a cutout on the front that reveals the cover-page photo in the book. The covers for the medium and small softcover books have the cover image and title printed directly on the cover. All of the softcover books have a glued binding and feature a thick cover of McCoy 100# Cover Gloss paper stock.
CARDS
All cards are printed on McCoy 120# Silk Cover paper stock. The postcards measure 4 x 6 inches, and the greeting cards measure 5 x 7inches.
CALENDARS
All calendars measure 8 x 10 inches and are printed on McCoy 100# Silk Cover paper stock.
To ensure the best print quality, we have chosen to use Kodak NexPress technology. The press uses a dry toner, which is fused to the surface of the paper. Please see NexPress' site for more information:
KODAK NEXPRESS 2500 Digital Production Color Press
I hope you find this information helpful in answering questions on the iPhoto forum."
Do you Twango?
TIP: For insurance against the iPhoto database corruption that many users have experienced I recommend making a backup copy of the Library6.iPhoto database file and keep it current. If problems crop up where iPhoto suddenly can't see any photos or thinks there are no photos in the library, replacing the working Library6.iPhoto file with the backup will often get the library back. By keeping it current I mean backup after each import and/or any serious editing or work on books, slideshows, calendars, cards, etc. That insures that if a problem pops up and you do need to replace the database file, you'll retain all those efforts. It doesn't take long to make the backup and it's good insurance.
I've written an Automator workflow application (requires Tiger), iPhoto dB File Backup, that will copy the selected Library6.iPhoto file from your iPhoto Library folder to the Pictures folder, replacing any previous version of it. It's compatible with iPhoto 08 libraries. You can download it at Toad's Cellar. Be sure to read the Read Me pdf file.

Iphoto books -- color management & sharpening

I have recently decided to try to print photos from a trip to New Zealand as an Apple iPhoto photo book. (I am using the latest version of iPhoto 6.XXXX.) I have a few basic questions that I'm having a hard time confirming answers to: (1) I read on a discussion forum somewhere (not sure where) that iphoto photo books are color managed to sRGB color space. Can anyone confirm this? (2) To keep my photos in sRGB, I am saving them from Photoshop as sRGB files. When I import the images into iPhoto to make a photo book, I am pointing to them only, rather than having the files recopied into the iPhoto database (save space on my hard drive). I assume this should work to preserve sRGB color space? (3) I do not plan on making any edits of photos in iPhoto itself, although some will presumably be resized by the program given that they will exceed 300 dpi. (4) For sharpening, I plan on saving all my files at 300 dpi and sharpening based on an 11" print. (I'm going to print an 8 1/2" x 11" book.) For photos that are smaller than full page size (i.e., 2 or more photos per page), I assume they'll get downsized in iPhoto, so sharpening won't be perfectly maximized, but this should work pretty well, I hope? Any other suggestions/tips about a work flow? I looked at Amazon for an instruction book on iphoto but the only one I found (the "missing manual" by pogue), only has part of a chapter devoted to iphoto books. If someone tells me that this book, or another, will answer all of these types of questions, I'll buy it. Oh yeah, one more question, is there different quality paper used in the single side photo books vs. double sided photo books (both hardcover). From what I could tell, the single sided paper must be thicker because it permits less photos per page. Any other differences? Thanks in advance, Howard

Howard:
Welcome to the Apple Discussions. Apple does prefer the sRGB color space. As far as dpi, just provide the largest pixel dimension file possible. If you want the files to fit the frames in each page exactly the crop to the 4:3 ratio beforehand. However, you can use non 4:3 files. If one is added to a frame it will be scaled to fill the frame, losing some of the image on the larger side. To get the entire photo in the frame Control-click on it and select the Fit photo to frame option.
I believe the same paper is used for single or double sided. Here's what Apple sent me regarding book materials and quality:
I contacted Apple and asked for information that I could pass on. Here's the reply I received from Apple:
Thank you for contacting the Apple Print Products Customer Service.
I understand that you would like to know the printing process that is used and the color mode the files should be in, so you can better advise users in the iPhoto forum.
iPhoto version 4 or later, allows you to import and print files through the Apple Print Product service as RGB, grayscale, or CMYK color space. JPEG files with RGB color space are recommended for best results.
While iPhoto 2 can import files of various formats, including RGB color, grayscale, and CMYK, this version requires JPEG files with RGB color space when printing photos and books.
For more information regarding iPhoto 2, please visit the following article:
iPhoto: Color, Black and White Prints Appear Garbled or Distorted
For more information regarding iPhoto 5, please visit the following article:
http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=165501
Here are some of the technical specifications for the books, cards, and calendars. I hope this gives you an idea about their quality and form.
BOOKS
All iPhoto books are printed using acid-free paper for long-lasting image quality. The photos are printed at a high resolution (300DPI if you use iPhoto 6). There is no external modification--such as sharpening or contrast adjustment--of the photos; what you see in the application is what is printed in the book.
Hardcovers Books
The cover is hard-bound and covered in linen. You select the linen color during the book-ordering process. The hardcover books have a solid, stiff binding that is glued and crimped. The internal pages, measuring 8.5 x 11 inches, are printed on McCoy 100# Text Gloss paper stock.
Softcover Books
The softcover books come in three sizes:
- Large 8.5 x 11 inches
- Medium 6 x 8 inches
- Small 2.6 x 3.5 inches
All of the softcover books have internal pages that are printed on McCoy 100# Text Gloss paper stock. The large softcover book has a white cover (Kromekoteplus Folding Cover, 16 point) with a cutout on the front that reveals the cover-page photo in the book. The covers for the medium and small softcover books have the cover image and title printed directly on the cover. All of the softcover books have a glued binding and feature a thick cover of McCoy 100# Cover Gloss paper stock.
CARDS
All cards are printed on McCoy 120# Silk Cover paper stock. The postcards measure 4 x 6 inches, and the greeting cards measure 5 x 7inches.
CALENDARS
All calendars measure 8 x 10 inches and are printed on McCoy 100# Silk Cover paper stock.
To ensure the best print quality, we have chosen to use Kodak NexPress technology. The press uses a dry toner, which is fused to the surface of the paper. Please see NexPress' site for more information:
KODAK NEXPRESS 2500 Digital Production Color Press
I hope you find this information helpful in answering questions on the iPhoto forum.
Do you Twango?
TIP: For insurance against the iPhoto database corruption that many users have experienced I recommend making a backup copy of the Library6.iPhoto database file and keep it current. If problems crop up where iPhoto suddenly can't see any photos or thinks there are no photos in the library, replacing the working Library6.iPhoto file with the backup will often get the library back. By keeping it current I mean backup after each import and/or any serious editing or work on books, slideshows, calendars, cards, etc. That insures that if a problem pops up and you do need to replace the database file, you'll retain all those efforts. It doesn't take long to make the backup and it's good insurance.
I've written an Automator workflow application (requires Tiger), iPhoto dB File Backup, that will copy the selected Library6.iPhoto file from your iPhoto Library folder to the Pictures folder, replacing any previous version of it. You can download it at Toad's Cellar. Be sure to read the Read Me pdf file.

Problem with Epson 2400. No color management settings

All of a sudden when I try to print from Aperture (or Photoshop) and I select "Print Settings," the window that opens only shows Printer and Presets. There is no third menu for Color Management or Print Settings — which are crucial to my printing.
I have downloaded and installed the latest Epson driver for Leopard. Still I can't get the full menus.
(No trouble on G4 PB with Tiger)
I would deeply appreciate any assistance in solving this problem .
Thanks, Susan

Hi Susan,
Yea, I'm having the same problem. All of a sudden I can't get the printer settings button to work to get through to colour management and advanced print settings. It means I can't set up new pre sets. Only happened in the last few days???
Will

Color management: Response and addendum

In course of seeking answers to my own question (5/21--photo displays), I saw a whole series of discussions about color and monitor calibration. (Have not but will read.) Although a two-year newbie to Elements, this is one area I believe I have acquired some expertise after many discussions and meetings with professional color lab owners, techs, photo store photographers, and techs at the leading colorimeter makers, so I can share some thoughts with all. Hopefully, it will not mislead--I also have a question for y'all set out at bottom:
     1. Anyone interested in color issues should (polite form of must) buy themself a copy of Bruce Fraser, Murphy and Bunting's Color Management. I have only made my way a small part thru, but it is an eye-opener and essential reading for anyone involved with photography. Even if you do have to read it several times over to understand fully.
     2. I had some bad tech support experience with my first colorimeter, and nothing but good results and support with the second (Eye One Display 2, made by X-Rite).
     3. When I first started doing Elements editing, I was very disappoionted with the diffence between what I was seeing on monitor and what was coming back from processor. That is another world of explanations. But that is the origin of my having sought over many months good advice, and there is much bad or ignorant advice out there.
     4. (And BTW, is there ever a difference in color production as one goes up ladder from Walgreens/CVS to Wolf (the first two named are sometimes in reverse order) to local higher quality camera store (no chain), to professional photgraphy color lab (and even between some of them!)
     5. In trying to replicate as much as possible what I see on monitor (and I replaced my entire computer and monitor in order to maximize my photography) I make adjustments to monitor in conjunction with colorimeter so that I am within the X-Rite suggested ranges on that end and yet reasonably close to the processed print.
     6. Even with all that, I do some tweaking of photos at end of editing process in order to further the replication process. It has been a process learning the variable extent I can do this, but because some of this gets into "thou shalt not's" and other frowned upon techniques, I will only say that one must make one's own decisions, balancing factors etc.
     7. I am reminded to do a resetting of the colorimeter every three weeks--I generally go 4-6.
If I can help, let me know--because my inbox gets flooded when I click the get email option, I am going to check the forum for next few days. Hopefully there are many far more knowledgeable than I who may give me new insights.
Now for my question: Our son is going thru the Mac vs. PC debate after his laptop died of old age. Which brought me to google "mac vs. PC" (some good pieces there--one entitled "PC vs. Mac: the Straight Scoop" and the Popular Mx article. Both very balanced. I have too many other pursuits so after listening to the debate over the years, had decided I can do without. BUT:
Q.No 1: Is there any consensus among photoshop/elements users in favor of one over the other? (Some refs to better apple monitors caught my attention, although in light of colorimeters etc., I don't know that it would really do that much).
Q.2: Assume there was some very strong reason to switch to Mac, what happens with all the photos now stored? (It would have to be an extraordinary reason to get me to go through al the hassle of switching all my programs so I am >90% certain I would not, but just wondering if I am a missing participant on another "fourth dimension".) Thanks.

I've got the Epson Stylus Pro 3880 and Color Handling > Color Mode is grayed-out in CS2 and CS3 using the Mac driver 6.6 on OSX10.5.8. I'm not sure why that part of the driver's print dialog is disabled, but no matter. Take a look at my screens below ( note: these are from Tiger OSX10.4.11 via CS2, but should apply to your arrangement:
Above just use the RGB from your PS Color Settings, here I set it for Adobe RGB and whatever paper you are using...
And above I set Color Management using "Color Controls" and again, the reference to Adobe RGB in the "Mode".
So, I believe I would use the Color Management > Printer Manages Color ( see next screen shot below from OSX 10.5.8 and CS3 )...
In all dialogs, Adobe RGB is used mainly because it was established in the document's Color Mode Settings from Photoshop.
Try these settings above, they work for me.
Message was edited by: John Danek

Color management, PS5 and Epson 3880

Hi
I need help with printing on my new 3880 through Photoshop CS5 on an iMac 10.6.8. Using Photoshop CS5 as 'color handling'-- the color mode is greyed out (can't change it) in the print settings. How can I change the color modes? Mostly turn off color management so I can use ICC printer profiles?
Thanks
L

I've got the Epson Stylus Pro 3880 and Color Handling > Color Mode is grayed-out in CS2 and CS3 using the Mac driver 6.6 on OSX10.5.8. I'm not sure why that part of the driver's print dialog is disabled, but no matter. Take a look at my screens below ( note: these are from Tiger OSX10.4.11 via CS2, but should apply to your arrangement:
Above just use the RGB from your PS Color Settings, here I set it for Adobe RGB and whatever paper you are using...
And above I set Color Management using "Color Controls" and again, the reference to Adobe RGB in the "Mode".
So, I believe I would use the Color Management > Printer Manages Color ( see next screen shot below from OSX 10.5.8 and CS3 )...
In all dialogs, Adobe RGB is used mainly because it was established in the document's Color Mode Settings from Photoshop.
Try these settings above, they work for me.
Message was edited by: John Danek

Color Management : Rendering Intent Grayed Out

Currently running Lightroom vers 1.3.1. on a MAC mini 1.25 GHz Power PC G4 with Tiger 10.4.11. Not much RAM and not much of a printer. But totally enjoying Lightroom. My point is that prior to upgrading to the latest version of Lightroom I had no issues with Lightroom. None that a new Mac with more RAM and processing power plus a higher end printer couldn't handle much better. But to my point I use to be able to select between Perceptual and Relative in rendering intent. Now I don't have the ability as it has been grayed out after having chosen "Managed by Printer" in Color Management prior to printing. Have I missed checking something in preferences or haven't done correctly?
Thanks

WOW! If the spirit of Christmas lives. I was just going over the Lightroom Tutorial with yourself and Michael Reichmann and listening to the both of you discuss Color Management settings, profiles and render intent. And low and behold who should reply just seconds after I closed the quicktime file and checked to see if I there was a reply to this message! Yikes!
Thanks for the info!
By the way have thoroughly enjoyed the Tutorial!

Vista color management & CS3

Two weeks ago I wrongly faulted my new Dell 2707WFP monitor for its high contrast and saturation after many failed profiling attempts using the Spyder2Pro with the updated Vista software. I'm still at a loss as to why images are dark and overly saturated in Photoshop, Bridge and Lightroom. They were all fine on an older Dell system running XP home and CS2. I've gone so far as to purposely inflict various gamma curve settings in Spyder to bump up the low end luminance but resulting profiles still show images clipped in the low end and overall saturated even as the desktop and the PS interface turn a sickly pale.
I'm new to CS3 and Lightroom and so I'm not sure if the following is normal. When I view a NEW batch of images that were not previously viewed in Bridge, they are normal looking, however when I click on a thumbnail, it then reverts to the same garish contrasty version that I see full size in the above adobe software when opened. The same thing happens in the WINDOWS PHOTO GALLERY viewer but NOT in WINDOWS EXPLORER. In Explorer the thumbs are as they should be...normal, and if I open them in Microsoft OFFICE PICTURE MANAGER or in Quicktime PICTUREVIEWER, they open as normal images.
All this sounds like a profile issue of some kind, but as far as I know, everything appears to be set correctly in both PS and the profiling software. However, Im not sure about the system settings regarding profiles. In the Windows COLOR folder all the profiles are where they should be and I can select which one to load using the Spyder Profile Chooser. And again, I do restart PS when I change a profile. Could this be some kind of Vista bug??
Other notes:
If I do a screen shot and paste it back into PS, it turns DARKER than the original file.
When I do additional calibrations I restart PS to load the latest profile.
All files tagged sRGB and in sRGB workspace. PS shows this correct space and likewise the correct monitor profile in COLOR SETTINGS
ATI CATALYST CONTROL CENTER fails to run on bootup so windows shuts it down. No fix that I can find for this.
Running Vista Home Premium on a Dell Inspiron 530 E6550, 4GB memory, Radeon HD2600XT
Thanks again for your help!

Found this on the DATACOLOR site in their SUPPORT CENTER:
Incorrect Color outside Photoshop on Wide Gamut Display
Solution >>I just purchased a Dell 2407 HC display, considered wide gamut and the spyder 3 elite. I've used the spyder 3 to calibrate the monitor. In photoshop whenever I "Save for Web" or "Save as" in the sRGB color space, I wind up with over saturated oranges and reds. I'm needing to save in the sRGB for web work. My working color space is set to sRGB which looks fine when editting in photoshop, but as soon as I save it out of photoshop the reds and oranges are over saturated. I purchased the spyder 3 because of the wide gamut support, is there something I'm missing in calibration?
The display profile is not at fault here. The ICC profile for the display tells any application that uses color management what the color values for the display are. Thus Photoshop, which is using the profile, corrects for the colors on screen, giving correct results. A non-color managed application (such as Internet Explorer for Windows) would not use the profile and thus the colors would be oversaturated on your wide gamut screen. This is not the fault of the profile (that would make the color look wrong in Photoshop, where the profile is being used), but the lack of a profile (which makes the color look wrong in non-color managed applications).
This is the problem with using a Wide Gamut display for viewing in non-color managed applications. A typical gamut display is not color correct in such applications, but is at least approximately correct; a wide gamut display is noticably oversatured in some colors. On the Mac many applications, including web browsers and OS utilities, are color managed, so it is less of an issue than on Windows.
Article Details
Article ID: 723
Created On: 10 Jan 2008 07:31 PM
So if the color is off outside PS, then its not the fault of the profile. My problem is the image is off INSIDE PS, and by the same reasoning, then the profile is at fault. If the profile is to blame, is this a Spyder issue or Vista issue? So far noone seems to know anything including Adobe tech support and Dell. Been waiting 2 wks to hear from the Spyder people.
Would really appreciate some input on this. thanks.

Printing with HP B9180 and Photoshop Elements 8 and Color Management

I've got a bit of confusion about certain settings in the printing process and I've posted a rather long discussion of my 'issues' and confusion. I hope someone can give me some guidance here. I've seen a lot of these issues addressed in many places but I can't seem to find an integrated response. Thanks to anyone who takes the time to read and respond.
Color Management Questions
My problems started when I was getting pictures that were too dark from my HP 9180 printer after having gotten very nice prints for a long time. I had obviously started to do something differently inadvertently. The only thing I think that is different is that I got a new 23 inch monitor, which does produce much brighter on-screen images. So, I started to do some research and know just enough about color management to be slightly confused and have some questions that I hope someone can give me some help with.
Equipment Background
I use both a Canon 20D and a Canon PowerShot SD600 camera. Both have the default color space as sRGB, although the 20D can be also set as RGB.
I also use Photoshop Elements 8, where there are a variety of settings possible for printing.
My monitor is an HP S2331, whose color space is sRGB and cannot be reset to RGB (I think) except for temperature; the default is 6500K.
My printer is an HP Photosmart Pro B9180 Printer, where there are also a variety of settings possible.
I’m running XP-Pro.
Here’s Where I Get Confused
Everything I have read about color management (various web sites, forums, books, etc) says to have the image, monitor, and printer all in the same color space.
Everything I read about PSE 8 (same sources) says to set PSE 8 to ‘Always Optimize for Printing’ under Edit>Color Settings in order to get the best prints. This displays photos based on the Adobe RGB color space.
I am taking pictures in sRGB, and telling PSE 8 to process them in RGB by selecting ‘Always Optimize for Printing’. Is this something I should be concerned about? Should I reset my camera for RGB?
Further, by selecting ‘Always Optimize for Printing’, I am setting PSE 8 for RGB while my monitor displays sRGB. Is this an important issue or is it also much ado about technicalities that an amateur should not worry about? It does violate the ‘keep them in the same color space’ rule.
Next, when I go to File>Print and get the Print window and then do the Page Setup and Select Printer, I then go to More Options in the lower left of the window. Under the More Options window, I select Color management and select Photoshop Elements Manages Colors. Next, there is Image Space, which is fixed and not subject to selection from a drop down menu.
I understand that this is the image space of the image I took with my camera and that information is embedded in the image. Correct?
Next, there is Printer Profile. But, from what I have read, this is where the IEC profile of the paper being printed on is supposed to be selected, isn’t it?
Shouldn’t this more appropriately be called Paper Profile, or Printing Media Profile? Further, this drop down menu appears to be somewhat erratic, sometimes showing all of the paper profiles I believe are loaded, sometimes not. It also shows listings such as Working RGB-Adobe RGB (1988), Adobe RGB 1988, Dot Gain 10%, 15%.... along with a lot of paper profiles. Aren’t those profiles unnecessary here?
I’ve used both Relative Colorimetric and Perceptual Rendering and am happy with either one.
Next, when I go to Printer Preferences, in order to “…disable color management in the printer preferences dialog”, under the Color Tab, I select Application Managed Colors from the Color management drop down menu, and also have the option of selecting ColorSmart/sRGB and Adobe RGB (1988).
Is there any time when I should use either ColorSmart/sRGB or Adobe RGB (1988)? If I were staying with my camera’s sRGB setting, given the fact that the monitor is sRGB, would the appropriate selections be ‘Printer Manages Colors’ and ‘ColorSmart/sRGB’?
Finally, under the Features Tab, I go to look for the same paper I selected under Printer Profile (Question 4 above). If it is one of the pre-loaded (by HP) profiles, it is there, but if it is a profile I downloaded, say for an Ilford paper, it isn’t listed, and I need to guess at an equivalent type of paper to select.
Is there any way to get that listing to appear under the Paper Type drop down menu?
I know that this is a long post, but it helped me to clarify my ‘issues’. Thank you for any and all suggestions, answers, guidance and help.

RIK,
Some printers have long names, esp. HP printers, and PSE gets ":confused." In control panel>devices and printers, right click on the default printer, go to printer properties, and rename the default printer to something short, e.g. "Our Printer." That may fix it..

How do I get color management options in PSE9?

I have been trying to print pictures on an HP printer and when I do they come out fairly red and pink. When I go under more options under printing and select color management the only option that I have to adjust is print space. I have a PSE9 book which shows that I should have color highlighting, image space, rendering intent as options but they do not appear. I have tried many different solutions but nothing has helped, same results. My file formats are in RAW but I also tried JPEG which ended with the same result. I was thinking of reinstalling the software but wasn't sure if I would lose all of my files.
Thanks,

TXGB Packer a écrit:
Sorry, I meant color handling. However this is the screen that I was talking about. The only option that mine shows is image space. I want to know how to get the rest of this information to show up. I believe once I get this fixed I should be able to make prints with the correct color balance.
Do you mean 'color editing or correction' rather than 'color management' ? Correcting the color balance may be done in either of the quick, guided or full mode. If so, which mode do you use ?

Confused about Color Management in CS5 (Photos appearing differently in all other programs)

I recently noticed this and it's been driving me crazy; when I view photos in Photoshop CS5 they appear significantly lighter/more washed out than when viewed in other programs like Zoombrowser, Digital Photo Professional or just in a regular Windows folder using Filmstrip mode (Windows XP). When opening the same photo in both CS5 and Zoombrowser and switching back and forth between the two windows the difference is very apparent...for example, one of the photos I compared was of a person in a black shirt -- in CS5 (lighter/washed out) the folds in the shirt were very obvious, but in Zoombrowser (darker, more contrast/saturation) the folds were nearly invisible and it looked like just solid black. Now, after messing around with the settings in both Photoshop and in Zoombrowser I've found a few ways to get the photos to look the same in the two programs; one way gives them both the lighter/more washed out appearance and another way gives them both the darker appearance with more contrast and saturation. My problem is that I'm not sure which view is accurate.
I use a NEC MultiSync LCD1990SXi monitor with SpectraView II calibration software and calibrate it every 2 weeks using these calibration settings (screenshot): http://img52.imageshack.us/img52/8826/settingsx.jpg
In the SpectraView II Software under Preferences there's an option that says "Set as Windows Color Management System Monitor Profile - Automatically selects and associates the generated ICC monitor profile with the Color Management System (CMS)." This option is checked. Also, when I open the Windows' Color Management window there's only one option displayed, which is "LCD1990SXi #######" (the ####### represents my monitor's serial number).
I assume the above settings are all correct so far, but I'm not sure about the rest.
Here are my current default Color Settings in CS5 (screenshot): http://img97.imageshack.us/img97/666/photoshopcolorsettings.jpg
Changing these settings around doesn't seem to make the photo appear much different. However, when I go to Edit -> Assign Profile, then click off of "Working RGB: sRGB IEC61966-2.1" and instead click Profile and select "LCD1990SXi ####### 2011-06-21 18-30 D65 2.20" from the drop-down menu, the picture becomes darker with more contrast and saturation and matches the picture in Zoombrowser. Also, if I select "Adobe RGB (1998)" from the drop-down menu it's very similar in terms of increased darkness and contrast but the saturation is higher than with the LCD1990SXi setting. Another way I've found to make the image equally dark with increased contrast and saturation is to go to View -> Proof Setup -> Custom and then click the drop-down menu next to "Device to Simulate" and select "LCD1990SXi ####### 2011-06-21 18-30 D65 2.20" again.
Alternatively, to make both images equally light and washed out I can go to Zoombrowser -> Tools -> Preferences and check the box next to "Color Management: Adjust colors of images using monitor profile." This makes the image in Zoombrowser appear just like it does in CS5 by default.
Like I said, I'm confused as to which setting is the accurate one (I'm new to Color Management in general so I apologize for my ignorance on the subject).
It would seem that assigning the LCD1990SXi profile in CS5 would be the correct choice in order to match the monitor calibration given the name of the profile but the "Adjust colors of images using monitor profile" option in Zoombrowser sounds like it would do the same thing as well. Also, I've read that Photoshop is a color managed software whereas Zoombrowser and Windows Picture and Fax Viewer are not which makes me think that maybe the lighter/washed out version seen in Photoshop is correct. So which version (light or dark) is the accurate one that I should use to view and edit my photos? Thanks in advance for any help or info.

Sorry for the late reply;
But before we go there or make any assumptions, it's important for
you to determine whether you're seeing consistent color in your
color-managed applications and only inconsistent color in those that are
not color-managed. For that you'll need to do a little research to see
if the applications in which you're seeing darker colors have
color-management capability (and whether it is enabled).
I opened the same picture in 7 different applications and found that the 6 of the 7 displayed the photo equally dark with equally high contrast when compared to the 7th application (CS5). The other 6 applications were Zoombrowser EX, Digital Photo Professional, Windows Picture and Fax Viewer, Quicktime PictureViewer, Microsoft Office Picture Manager and Firefox.
However, at least two of these programs offer color management preferences and, when used, display the photo (from what I can tell) exactly the same as Photoshop CS5's default settings. The two programs are two Canon programs: Zoombrowser EX and Digital Photo Professional. Here's the setting that needs to be selected in Zoombrowser in order to match up with CS5 (circled in red):
And here's the setting in Digital Photo Professional that needs to be selected in order to match up with CS5 (again, circled in red):
*Note: When the option above "Monitor Profile" is selected ("Use the OS settings") the image is displayed exactly the same as when the monitor profile is selected. It's only when sRGB is selected that it goes back to the default darker, more contrasty version.
So with the red-circled options selected, all three programs (CS5, ZB, DPP) display the images the same way; lighter and more washed out. What I'm still having trouble understanding is if that ligher, more washed out display is the accurate one or not...I've read several tutorials for all three programs which only make things more confusing. One of the tutorials says to always use sRGB if you want accurate results and *never* to use Monitor Profile and another says that, if you're using a calibrated monitor, you should always select Monitor Profile under the color management settings...so I'm still lost, unfortunately.
What I also don't understand is why, when the monitor profile is selected in CS5, the image is displayed in the dark and contrasty way that the other programs display it as by default but when the monitor profile is selected in Digitial Photo Professional it displays it in the lighter, more washed out way that CS5 displays it using CS5's default settings (sRGB). Why would selecting the monitor profile in DPP display the photo the same way as when sRGB is selected in Photoshop? And vice versa...why would selecting the monitor profile in Photoshop display the photo the same way as when sRGB is selected in DPP?
I feel like I'm missing something obvious here...which I probably am. Again, I'm very new to this stuff so pardon my ignorance on the topic.
By the way, I find that the way that the non-color managed programs (Windows Picture and Fax Viewer et al.) display the photos is more aesthetically pleasing to the eye than the duller, more washed out display that CS5 gives the photos, but ultimately what I want to see in these programs (especially PS5 where I'll be doing the editing) is the accurate representation of the actual photo itself...i.e. what it's supposed to look like and not a darker (or lighter) variant of it.
So just to reiterate my questions:
Why does selecting Monitor Profile under the color management settings in DPP give the same display results as the default sRGB profile in CS5 and vice versa? (CS5 with monitor profile selected having the same display results as DPP with the sRGB profile selected)
When using CS5 with it's default color management settings (sRGB), using DPP with the Monitor Profile selected, and using Zoombrowser EX with "Adjust color of images using monitor profile" selected this results in all three programs displaying the same lighter, washed-out images...is this lighter, more washed-out display of the images shown in these three programs the accurate one?
I noticed when opening an image in Firefox it had the same darker, contrasty look as the other non-color managed applications had. Assuming that the CS5 default settings are accurate, does this mean that if I edit a photo in CS5, save it, and upload it to the internet that other people who are viewing that image online will see it differently than how it's supposed to look (i.e. in a non-color-managed way?) If so, this would seem to indicate that they'd see a less-than-flattering version of the photo since if their browser naturally displays images as darker and more contrasty and I added more darkness and contrast to the image in CS5, they'd be seeing a version of the photo that's far too dark and probably wouldn't look very good. Is this something I have to worry about as well?
I apologize for the lengthy post; I do tend to be a bit OCD about these things...it's a habit I picked up once I realized I'd been improperly editing photos on an incorrectly calibrated monitor for years and all that time and effort had been spent editing photos in a certain way that looked good on my incorrectly calibrated monitor but looked like crap on everyone else's screen, so the length and detail of this post comes from a desire to not repeat similar mistakes by editing photos the wrong way all over again. Again, thanks in advance for all the help, it's greatly appreciated!

Color Management

Though color management is very important when using Photoshop some aspects of it though is a waste of money for me. You see I'm like 10% of the men is the world am a little colorblind. This does not mean I do not see colors I see color quite well. Perhaps my color world is a more pleasing one then yours. I only calibrate my displays using web test pages and software tools. Perfect color on a screen has little value for me. People also have different taste when it comes to color when it comes for images many prefer over saturation then true life like looking images. Even when it come to black and white images. I have even heard people criticise Ansel Adams image as not being right. Ansel of course was creating art not mer real look pictures. Most of us have see Ansel Adams's images in books and print. If you have not seen a print made by Adams's himself you have not seen what he is famous for.
Being colorblind I do color correcting more by the numbers then by trusting colors my eyes see. I may transpose numbers from time to time I can still see them and use them for fixing color problems. I also have problems understanding many articles written about fixing colors when they state you fix image by finding neutral gray areas in the image. While that is true if the image has a color cast those areas will not be gray till the image's colors are corrected. Anyway I do numbers better then color. When it comes to art colors used is up to the artiest and their vision. Still I want my images to look good for people with normal color vision they look good in my world too. Ansel did color too but BW was where his love and ART is at.
Photoshop is also a toy and can do a great job with numbers for you. Using the gradient tool and square images you can get perfect black and White and color gradients. Using these you can see how Photoshop is able to blend thing. When you add to this blend if gray with its sliders that can be split you will find you have more the a toy at hand.
Playing around with Photoshop can be very educational here is a little example.
Simple gradients created in ProPhotoRGB 16 bir color and saved for the web in PNG-24 converted to sRGB.
Now to blend them and animated gif is not going to heck it for the web. CS6 does some video and color mangement what will it do with 16bit ProPhotoRGB???
How well does this web sit embed video??? only allows some web sites
how about a link to mine http://www.mouseprints.net/old/dpr/BlendingModes.mp4

Hi craigpop1,
So we can better assist you, please let us know what operating system is on your computer (version of Windows or Mac OS X), as well as what type of paper you are planning to print on.
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Color management Tiger 10.4.8

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