CS3 printing too dark - works in CS2

Hi,
I've just upgraded to CS3 and everything seems to work EXCEPT printing. The pictures print but are much much too dark compared to CS2. The CS2 photoshop prints are what I see on the monitor and has worked for a couple of years.
I've tried to make all the CS3 settings the same as CS2 but I must be missing something.
I've set the print setup to:
"Let Printer determine Colors" and "relative colormetric" so that the printer applies the ICC profiles, not Photoshop.
I make sure the printer driver dialog is set to "ICC" and "relative colormetric".
I've set the "color settings" under edit to be the same as my CS2 settings.
In everything I'm using the same color spaces in CS3 that I use in CS2.
So, what have I forgotten?
Thanks

> So, Eric, you are saying we need to Convert to a space (or gamma) in
> Photoshop before Command+P -- because the Epson Adv B&W driver will
> assume a color space/gamma -- what would that assumption be based on
> (gamma of our Mac default MonitorRGB)? Assuming I am not talking
> about feeding the Epson grayscale.
Yes.
The ABW driver wants to be fed gamma 2.2-encoded image data.
This is why my standard recommendation for printing to the ABW driver __ONLY__ is to use:
Color Handling = Photoshop Manages Colors
Printer Profile = Adobe RGB
Rendering Intent = Relative Colorimetric
Black Point Compensation = Enabled
Why does this work? Because no matter what your image working space is (e.g., sRGB, Adobe RGB, ProPhoto RGB, Apple RGB, ColorMatch RGB, etc.), doing this will cause your image data to be encoded in gamma 2.2 before the data gets passed off to the driver. (Adobe RGB has a gamma encoding of 2.2.)
The same workflow will work in Lightroom, too. You just need to check the "Display Profiles" checkbox in Lightroom to access Adobe RGB when selecting a printer profile.
If you are in grayscale mode instead of RGB mode, choose "Gray Gamma 2.2" instead of "Adobe RGB" for the printer profile.
However, the catch is that -- as noted in this thread -- there is currently a glitch, which we (Adobe + Apple + Epson) are investigating. One of the symptoms of that glitch is that the above suggested workflow does not work on Leopard.
> Does this CS4-Apple-Epson issue have anything to do with some users
> reporting dark prints in Photoshop Manage Color - No Color
> Adjustment Epson workflow? -- For example, someone using 1.8 gamma
> Monitor RGB...
Unlikely.

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Once again: prints too dark after upgrading CS3 to CS5

Hi, I know this has been discussed before, but I haven't found a solution to my issue in the existing threads. I am most likely missing something obvious, and perhpas someone here can point it out to me.
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Thank you for the help! Here are the screen shots. I printed the wacked image from CS3 and CS5. In CS3 everything looks right, i.e. the soft proof matches the print. In CS5 the soft proof looks the same as in CS3, but the print is dark. A photo of the printout is attached at the end.
CS3:
CS5:
Result:

Simple workaround for Epson 3800 printing too dark

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Just sorted my problem using the suggestion on this site>
http://www.photographyri.com/index.php/2008/11/11/photoshop-cs4-vs-cs2-print-engine-proble
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That something is up is suggested by this wrinkle. In this case I am printing using advanced b/w. If under color handling I choose "Printer Manages Color" and go into the b/w advanced setup, it's still too dark. If instead I choose "No color management", then make my choices in advanced b/w, it works fine.
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> So, Eric, you are saying we need to Convert to a space (or gamma) in
> Photoshop before Command+P -- because the Epson Adv B&W driver will
> assume a color space/gamma -- what would that assumption be based on
> (gamma of our Mac default MonitorRGB)? Assuming I am not talking
> about feeding the Epson grayscale.
Yes.
The ABW driver wants to be fed gamma 2.2-encoded image data.
This is why my standard recommendation for printing to the ABW driver __ONLY__ is to use:
Color Handling = Photoshop Manages Colors
Printer Profile = Adobe RGB
Rendering Intent = Relative Colorimetric
Black Point Compensation = Enabled
Why does this work? Because no matter what your image working space is (e.g., sRGB, Adobe RGB, ProPhoto RGB, Apple RGB, ColorMatch RGB, etc.), doing this will cause your image data to be encoded in gamma 2.2 before the data gets passed off to the driver. (Adobe RGB has a gamma encoding of 2.2.)
The same workflow will work in Lightroom, too. You just need to check the "Display Profiles" checkbox in Lightroom to access Adobe RGB when selecting a printer profile.
If you are in grayscale mode instead of RGB mode, choose "Gray Gamma 2.2" instead of "Adobe RGB" for the printer profile.
However, the catch is that -- as noted in this thread -- there is currently a glitch, which we (Adobe + Apple + Epson) are investigating. One of the symptoms of that glitch is that the above suggested workflow does not work on Leopard.
> Does this CS4-Apple-Epson issue have anything to do with some users
> reporting dark prints in Photoshop Manage Color - No Color
> Adjustment Epson workflow? -- For example, someone using 1.8 gamma
> Monitor RGB...
Unlikely.

Photos Print Too Dark

I've read a similar thread about this but didn't understand the suggestions.
I'm new to cs3 indesign and have windows xp. I've prepared a newsletter with colors photos saved as pdf which are being printed for black and white newsprint. The photos come out way too dark and lightening them only washes them out. Is there a setting I'm suppose to be using when saving to pdf? If I need to change any settings for the images could you please give me step by step instructions?
Michael Baribeau

> The photos come out way too dark
This is called dot gain. Different printing devices print dots
differently. Some throw a bunch of ink (or toner) at the paper, while
others are more conservative. You need to talk to your printer and
prepare your pictures specifically for his press. Ask about color
correction. And yes, when you're talking about color correction, black
is a "color".
And if you're starting with color pictures, convert them to grays first.
You're letting the output device decide how to convert colors to grays.
If you do it yourself, in Photoshop, you'll get a much better idea of
what it will look like on paper.
> lightening them only washes them out.
Washes them out onscreen, or washes them out in the final printed
output? Work with the numbers, not what you see onscreen. Dot gain means
that, for instance, the dots that make up a 90% black will run together
on press, effectively printing at 100%. Dots that make up a nice 50%
black will probably yield an effective 54%. On press, darks usually get
darker, midtones usually get a littler darker, and very lights get
whiter. So you compensate for that by color correcting: lightening the
darks, lightening the midtones a little, and darkening the
almost-whites. Different kinds of presses (and different presses,
different papers, even different press operators) experience different
amounts of dot gain.
In Photoshop, you want Image > Adjustments > Curves, and the exact curve
depends on numbers you would get from your printer. After you get a
curve you like, you can save it as a .ACV file for that printer, using
that print process.
> Is there a setting I'm suppose
> to be using when saving to pdf?
What program are you using to save your photos to PDF? Why PDF? Why not
TIFF, or PSD, or even Photoshop PDF (PDP)?
Kenneth Benson
Pegasus Type, Inc.
www.pegtype.com

CS3 printing too dark - works in CS2

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