Disk Utility: for bad blocks on hard disks, are seven overwrites any more effective than a single pass of zeros?

In this topic I'm not interested in security or data remanence (for such things we can turn to e.g. Wilders Security Forums).
I'm interested solely in best practice approaches to dealing with bad blocks on hard disks.
I read potentially conflicting information. Examples:
… 7-way write (not just zero all, it does NOT do a reliable safe job mapping out bad blocks) …
— https://discussions.apple.com/message/8191915#8191915 (2008-09-29)
… In theory zero all might find weak or bad blocks but there are better tools …
— https://discussions.apple.com/message/11199777#11199777 (2010-03-09)
… substitution will happen on the first re-write with Zeroes. More passes just takes longer.
— https://discussions.apple.com/message/12414270#12414270 (2010-10-12)
For bad block purposes alone I can't imagine seven overwrites being any more effective than a single pass of zeros.
Please, can anyone elaborate?
Anecdotally, I did find that a Disk Utility single pass of zeros seemed to make good (good enough for a particular purpose) a disk that was previously unreliable (a disk drive that had been dropped).

@MrHoffman
As well pointed your answers are, you are not answering the original question, and regarding consumer device hard drives your answers are missleading.
Consumer device hard drives ONLY remap a bad sector on write. That means regardless how many spare capacity the drive has, it will NEVER remap the sector. That means you ALWAYS have a bad file containing a bad sector.
In other words YOU would throw away an otherwise fully functional drive. That might be reasonable in a big enterprise where it is cheaper to replace the drive and let the RAID system take care of it.
However on an iMac or MacBook (Pro) an ordinary user can not replace the drive himself, so on top of the drive costs he has to pay the repair bill (for a drive that likely STILL is in perfect shape, except for the one 'not yet' remaped bad block)
You simply miss the point that the drive can have still one million good reserve blocks, but will never remap the affected block in a particular email or particular song or particular calendar. So as soon as the file affected is READ the machine hangs, all other processes more or less hang at the same moment they try to perform I/O because the process trying to read the bad block is blocking in the kernal. This happens regardless how many free reserve blocks you have, as the bad block never gets reallocated, unless it is written to it. And your email program wont rewrite an email that is 4 years old for you ... because it is not programmed to realize a certain file needs to be rewritten to get rid of a bad block.
@Graham Perrin
You are similar stubborn in not realizing that your original question is awnsered.
A bad block gets remapped on write.
So obviously it happens at the first write.
How do you come to the strange idea that writing several times makes a difference? How do you come to the strange idea that the bytes you write make a difference? Suppose block 1234 is bad. And the blocks 100,000,000 to 100,000,999 are reserve blocks. When you write '********' to block 1234 the hard drive (firmware) will remap it to e.g. 100,000,101. All subsequent writes will go to the same NEW block. So why do you ask if doing it several times will 'improve' this? After all the awnsers here you should have realized: your question makes no sense as soon as you have understood how remapping works (is supposed to work). And no: it does not matter if you write a sequence od zeros, of '0's or of '1's or of 1s or of your social security number or just 'help me I'm hold prisoner in a software forum'.
I would try to find a software that finds which file is affected, then try to read the bad block until you in fact have read it (that works surprisngly often but may take any time from a few mins to hours) ... in other words you need a software that tries to read the file and copies it completely, so even the bad block is read (hopefully) successful. Then write the whole data to a new file and delete the old one (deleting will free the bad block and ar some later time something will be written there and cause a remap).
Writing zeros into the bad block basically only helps if you don't care that the affected file is corrupted afterwards. E.g. in case of a movie the player might crash after trying to display the affected area. E.g. if you know the affected file is a text file, it would make more sense to write a bunch of '-' signs, as they are readable while zero bytes are not (a text file is not supposed to contain zero bytes)
Hope that helped ;)

Similar Messages

  • Surface scan/test for bad blocks on hard disk?

    Comming from the Windows world here... What is the recommended utility for this in OSX? Is TechTool Pro the way to go? Something else?
    Thanks!

    Thanks, I saw this software as well, however I do not see any mention of a surface scan feature on the website. Am I missing something?
    Thanks.

  • Disk Utility hangs while initializing internal hard disk in Core Duo iMac

    I have a 20" Core Duo iMac. Recently the internal hard drive crashed ("invalid B-tree node size" or something reported when Disk Utility tries and fails to repair it). I have all my data on an external hard disk used as a Time Machine volume, so recovery is not my issue. Initially I picked the write zeroes once security option and chose to erase the internal hard disk. Realizing this would take too long, I clicked on skip, and Disk Utility appeared to hang. I quit and restarted Disk Utility, and chose the "don't erase" security option, but when I go to erase the drive it appears to hang while at the "partitioning" stage and doesn't seem to get any further. There is motion in the progress bar, but no additional progress after about an hour. Disk Utility shows the disk but no volumes underneath it (whereas immediately after the crash, it showed an unmountable volume labeled "disk0s2").
    Why would Disk Utility be taking so long and not making any progress? How can I reformat this disk if Disk Utility is not able to? Incidentally, I am running the Disk Utility that comes with OS X 10.4.8, since that is the OS X version on my portable hard drive that I booted from. I also tried using Drive Genius to initialize the hard disk, but it also appeared to hang with no progress.

    It is possible the drive has failed, but to be sure start by turning off the computer. Wait five minutes. Then do this:
    Extended Hard Drive Preparation
    1. Boot from your OS X Installer Disc. After the installer loads select your language and click on the Continue button. When the menu bar appears select Disk Utility from the Installer menu (Utilities menu for Tiger or Leopard.)
    2. After DU loads select your hard drive (this is the entry with the mfgr.'s ID and size) from the left side list. Note the SMART status of the drive in DU's status area. If it does not say "Verified" then the drive is failing or has failed and will need replacing. SMART info will not be reported on external drives. Otherwise, click on the Partition tab in the DU main window.
    3. Set the number of partitions from the drop down menu (use 1 partition unless you wish to make more.) Set the format type to Mac OS Extended (Journaled.) Click on the Options button, set the partition scheme to GUID (only required for Intel Macs) then click on the OK button. Click on the Partition button and wait until the process has completed.
    4. Select the volume you just created (this is the sub-entry under the drive entry) from the left side list. Click on the Erase tab in the DU main window.
    5. Set the format type to Mac OS Extended (Journaled.) Click on the Options button, check the button for Zero Data and click on OK to return to the Erase window.
    6. Click on the Erase button. The format process can take up to several hours depending upon the drive size.
    Be sure to boot from the OS X installer DVD, not a backup clone.

  • Disk Utility and Bad External Drive

    I have a drive that has just suddenly started to not be recognised by the system. It's a pain but no big deal as I didn't have much on it. However, I don't want to just give up on 200GBs of space and tried to erase/partition it. Nothing happens though, the progress bar fills up by about 2mm and then hangs, left it overnight, everything. The thing is the drive is still seen by DU, so does anyone have any other suggestions or recommendations for recovery software? Any help would be mucho appreciated....

    TechTool Pro 4.6.2 is what I use now after 8 yrs of Disk Warrior.
    Data Rescue II is one option if you don't have files backed up.
    SuperDuper is great for cloning and backup, once you are able to.
    A couple of backups (don't put all your eggs in one basket), too.
    http://www.macsales.com/firewire/
    With a new drive, it sometimes makes sense to zero the drive first. Formatting just tests the first and last 100 sectors for bad blocks. TechTool can test media for bad blocks but not map them out, zero all 'might' or there is Intech Speedtools.
    http://www.speedtools.com
    Sorry TimeMachine isn't current.
    The first time you have a hard crash is when you want to do Safe Boot or FSCK, or boot from an alternate drive immediately and trash the most recent temp and cache files (web browers etc).
    Leopard Cache Cleaner can 'clean' caches even while booted from another drive. Having that emergency boot drive/partition is therefore essential for running DW and other programs.

  • Disk Utility won't recognize new hard drive

    Hello,
    Thanks for taking the time to read this.
    The original hard drive (80 GB) went bad, so I replaced with a new 160 GB Western Digital one. I formatted the hard drive using Disk Utility from the Mac OS X Disk. It worked the first time I booted into Leopard (I just booted up to make sure the OS loaded...didn't install any new software and/or hardware).
    Then I shut it down and started it back up, and the computer didn't recognize the hard drive. I inserted the Mac OS X disk and ran Disk Utility, but the hard drive was not recognized.
    So now I'm thinking the new hard drive was also bad. So, I ordered another one (Seagate 160 GB) and it to was not recognized when I ran Disk Utility from the Mac OS X disk.
    When replacing all of them, I followed directions I found here and other websites. They all said to do it the same way, so I'm assuming the directions for replacing a hard drive in a laptop were correct.
    I searched Google and found several posts suggesting using an application called Disk Warrior, but from my understanding, you cannot run it from a disk, it needs to be installed, which is obviously impossible since the hard drive isn't recognized.
    Then I ran Open Firmware and did "devalias" from the prompt. From what I can tell in the list of hardware, the hard drive is recognized, but I am not sure. I took a picture of the screen printout but do not see an option to attached it to this post. Therefore, I'll just tell what it said for now and will create an image hosting account so I can add a URL for it later.
    In the list, "hd" is in the left column and in the right column of the same line is "/pci@f4000000/ata-6@d/disk@0" (without quotes).
    If anybody has any suggestions, they would be greatly appreciated.

    Welcome to the Apple discussions.
    I've replaced a few hard drives, and in instances where it's not recognized, it's either been a cable connection issue or I've seen others with a jumper issue. Either the hard drive to logic board cable isn't properly set, typically on the logic board side, or a jumper was left on the drive, where typically you can just remove it. I haven't personally had the cable fail, however, that's possible too.
    When you pulled the large plug from the back of the original hard drive, did you do it very carefully? It's not like a desktop hard drive plug that you can just pull out ... it needs to be wiggled out, gently. I have a hard time believing two new drives would be essentially DOA, although the first one worked for a bit, which leads me to wonder about the physical connections.
    Since you have your original OS X disks, you could try running the Apple hardware test to see if it gives you any error message(s).

  • How do I access Disk Utility for 10.7.1?

    How do I access Disk Utility for 10.7.1? I found it in the forums a few weeks ago, used it, then lost the directions. This is a last ditch attempt
    to use OS Lion. I parted my hair incorrectly when I installed and have been plagued by the dread rainbow spinning ball in EVERY application. Yes, every. Name one, Safari, Firefox, Text Edit, Mail, Excel, Word, iTunes, Garage Band, Calculator, Calender, iPhoto....yes, every, and I cannot
    find a solution that works. I have back up files on two different hard drives 500 gig and 1 terrabyte with all my music, photo and writing files.
    I am a writer and a musician so imagine the frustration. OS 10.6 is an option of course. My dedication to Apple and each new OS is deep so
    I am hoping that somehow there will a fix, an upgrade, something that does not require me to go bac to the much more endangered species named OS.
    hahhaa! Just stalled waiting for the ball to finish with it's random spinning.... SO, this is like a last desperate .... it just did two more stalls.
    NO OTHER apps running, just little Firefox holding on for dear life, last desperate request for a fix.
    MacKeeper has been great in sending helpful directions for getting the Antivirus to work after it mysteriously decided to stop working, Quite MacKeeper,  go to Activity Monitor, force quit helper, start up MacKeeper and run program. It works!
    SO before my third stall stops me, please post directions to open disk utility in administration mode so that I can do any further repairs that have not worked by using it from the open system. Also keychain synching stopped working with Lion.
    Thanks to any and all who can help.

    Press and hold Command-R keys and reboot. You'll then start up in the Lion Recovery HD. You'll find Disk Utility there.
    Command-R to the rescue.
    Just hold down Command-R during startup and Lion Recovery springs into action. It lets you choose from common utilities: You can run Disk Utility to check or repair your hard drive, erase your hard drive and reinstall a fresh copy of Lion, or restore your Mac from a Time Machine backup. You can even use Safari to get help from Apple Support online. And if Lion Recovery encounters problems, it will automatically connect to Apple over the Internet.

  • Since I upgraded to Lion 10.7.2, my external HD is no longer visible in AirPort utility (in the AirPort disks tab). I also installed the AirPort utility for iOS5, it reported a disk problem, but running Disk Utility on the Mac showed no issues. Help!

    To expand on the question, I have performed the following steps:
    1 - Unplugged external drive (1TB WD MyBook) from the Time Capsule
    2 - Reconnected it. At this point, AirPort utility for iOS5 reported a problem with the disk (Time Capsule light was blinking Orange)
    3 - Unplugged external drive, connected it to MacBook Pro, ran Disk Utility. It found no problems (disk visible straight away on the MacBook Pro).
    4 - Reconnected to Time Capsule - still doesn't show up under the "Disks" option under Air Port utility. Or rather, the hardware is visible (i.e the physical disk) but not the volume.
    5 - I tried another external hard drive, and the volume also doesn't appear in the Disk section under the AirPort utility.
    The WD disk is formatted as Mac OS Extended (Journaled).
    This is a big problem for me, as the drive houses my iTunes library.
    Anyone else had a similar problem? It all worked flawlessly until last week.

    I love computers.
    Have managed to fix this already. Been working the issue for a few days now, and a few minutes after writing the above post I decided to reset the Time Capsule to factory default settings.
    After entering all my details again (used same network names, passwords etc) the Time Capsule was rebooted. When it came back on line - guess what? Yep, the MyBook WD drive is now visibile. I can connect via the network from my other machines to the drive, and iTunes is back.
    So - thought I would post my resolution in case it helps others.

  • Disk utility can't find iMac hard drive

    I had to power off my iMac by Pressing the power key and holding it several times over the last few weeks. The last time it wouldn't reboot - I'd just get an apple icon. When I tried a safe boot I'd get the icon and it would change to a no entry sign.
    Next I started up from the snow leopard installation disk with the intent of repairing the iMac disk. The installation disk worked but when I opened disk utility it only found the installation disk. It didn't find the iMac disk.
    Do I need to make a trip to the Apple store or is there something else to try?

    Version:1.0 StartHTML:0000000105 EndHTML:0000004136 StartFragment:0000001438 EndFragment:0000004100                    
    Oh Gosh, I am having this same problem too. I normally do not shut down ever, I reboot often because I have to due to bad wireless reception.  Last month, I did a full shut down and unplug due to a terrible storm coming in. When I went to boot up, it took very long and I had booted from my external bootable drive. My saving grace is that since crashing my emac in 2006, I am a rabid "backerupper" (made up my own word).  I have been using lacie’s Silverkeeper to make bootable back ups just in case. So When I tried disk utility, it did not see my drive. I used my third party software "Disk Warrior" by Alsoft, it saw my drive, and then I unplugged my external and then booted again from the Snow Leopard DVD and was able to repair.  All was well until this weekend.  We had a storm come trough quickly and we lost power, now I have the same problem you do but this time Disk Warrior does not see the disk either.  I am going to dig around for a while before I hit the Genius bar.  I fear the drive is fried. And for me I am not certain   this will be worth the dollar amount to replace since this is a 2006 and not upgradeable, but I will check with an outside vendor for price for the drive so I know what I want to do if in fact the Genius bar cannot see the drive either.  I do hope you have a back up version, and would suggest having third party software to take a chance to see if you can find your disk.  My imac is an Intel duo core 2 GHZ and from what I can tell model number A1174.  To get help from the smart people here it would be useful for you to post the rest of your specs.   If you don't know the exact model, you can check everymac.com and plug in your serial number.   Under the computer stand you will find the serial number and the emc number and you can find out from everymac.com what exact model you have.   If I find anything I will come back to this thread and report in.  Good luck to you.

  • Can one PPC Mac run Disk Utility for another's HD?

    I have a PPC PowerBook that needs help. The Admin users are getting corrupted for some reason. I can still use other Users in Safe Mode.
    I have another good PPC G3 desktop. Both running 10.5.8.
    I can mount the bad HD on the good Mac's desktop but I can't run Disk Utility for it.
    I've mounted with Ethernet and USB. Do I need Firewire? Do I need do try to use Target Mode?
    Basically, I'm trying to use the good Mac as a startup disk for the bad one, I think.
    Easy way? Thanks! JP
    ps: My hunch is Firewire. I don't have any so I'm going to buy a cable soon. Unless someone here stops me! : )

    Yes, you need Target Mode Firewire on both, a FW cable, then Disk Utility should be fine from one to the other.
    Target mode...
    http://support.apple.com/kb/HT1661
    Sometimes Laptops need to have the FW cable unplugged & replugged after they'e in t mode to have it finally show up.

  • Mac pro 13'' harddisk makes noises when writing and reading data, but Techtool scanning result shows no bad blocks in the disk, that is normal?

    I bought my Mac pro 13 inch, i7 processor and 750G storage 20th November 2012. But I found when copy into or out the Mac, the harddisk makes noises, like bitting something. I thought there are bad blocks in the disk, but the result of Techtool scanning is no bad blocks in disk, and giving a passed conclusion.
    I went the apple store for testing, and the repairmen told me there are two choices available for me:1) replace the harddisk 2) back to the store i bought machine from for a new one. i think that the machine only bought few days, it had better not be disassembled, so i went back for a new one. unfortunately, the new one makes more noises than my old one. i don't know why like apple named brands notebooks have such problems.  did you undergo this experience ?

    All of the HDDs, be they in my MBPs or enclosures are barely audible.  I would say the you deserve no less.  I suggest that you do not leave until you are satisfied with a near silent HDD.
    Why you got two in a row is a puzzle, but then some people beat the odds and win the lottery.  In your case the results are not exactly positive.  All HDDs eventually fail, and some fail sooner than others.  At least you should start with a quiet one.
    Good luck.
    Ciao.

  • HT2055 Disk Utility for OS X 10.9.2

    I need a Disk Utility for OS X 10.9.2 to add disk space to a partition and fix permissions.

    You will find Disk Utility in your Utilities folder.
    Repair the Hard Drive and Permissions - Mavericks, Lion/Mountain Lion
    Boot to the Recovery HD:
    Restart the computer and after the chime press and hold down the COMMAND and R keys until the menu screen appears. Alternatively, restart the computer and after the chime press and hold down the OPTION key until the boot manager screen appears. Select the Recovery HD and click on the downward pointing arrow button.
    Repair
    When the recovery menu appears select Disk Utility. After DU loads select your hard drive entry (mfgr.'s ID and drive size) from the the left side list.  In the DU status area you will see an entry for the S.M.A.R.T. status of the hard drive.  If it does not say "Verified" then the hard drive is failing or failed. (SMART status is not reported on external Firewire or USB drives.) If the drive is "Verified" then select your OS X volume from the list on the left (sub-entry below the drive entry,) click on the First Aid tab, then click on the Repair Disk button. If DU reports any errors that have been fixed, then re-run Repair Disk until no errors are reported. If no errors are reported then click on the Repair Permissions button. When the process is completed, then quit DU and return to the main menu. Select Restart from the Apple menu.

  • Can I use Disk Utility to erase Apple TV hard drive?

    Can I use Disk Utility to erase Apple TV hard drive?

    I don't know, but I doubt it can be done using Disk Utility. I suggest you consult the user manual for it or see if there is a Reset option in the onscreen menues. If you don't have a manual, then you will find one at http://support.apple.com/manuals.

  • The finder window for an external USB hard disk suddenly started separating files by time (today, yesterday, etc.) and stopped allowing me to change column width, order, etc. Also the header bar shifted to flat white from gray.

    The finder window for an external USB hard disk suddenly started separating files by time (today, yesterday, etc.) and stopped allowing me to change column width, order, etc. Also the header bar shifted to flat white from gray.
    All was normal until the icon for the disk stopped showing up on the desktop when I would plug it in. I rebooted the computer, and the disk icon now shows up but this new look to the finder window started as a result. The hard disk does not have this problem when I use it on another Mac running Snow leopard. Also, two other external hard disks that I use on this computer running lion 7.4 still have the normal header bars with columns that can be reordered, etc.
    I have tried looking in preferences and other places but have not seen this discussed. 

    Well duh - I finally figured out that somehow in the View options for the hard drive, the "arrange by" option had been changed to "by date" from "none". Not sure how that happened, I had never used the "view options" menu tem before. Changing "arrange by" back to "none" gets the gray column headers and the collapsible folder icons back. 

  • I have an MacBook Pro 10.6, using disk utility I tried to verify my disk, but it came up with the message, please use your start up disk, I tried this, starting the computer up and pressing C, but it ejected the disk, the same thing happened while I runni

    I have an MacBook Pro 10.6, using disk utility I tried to verify my disk, but it came up with the message, please use your start up disk, I tried this, starting the computer up and pressing C, but it ejected the disk, the same thing happened while I running the computer. Is the hard drive damaged as laptop doesn't seem to recognize the start up disk ? If so, I presume I will have to put in a new one.
    There haven't been any problems with the computer, apart from a sticky curser,I have run a permissions programme from disk utility, there were a lot of different ones, but it seem to be able to fix them.
    Any comments or ideas ?
    Thank you in anticipation.

    First backup your users files off the machine to a external storage drive (not TimeMachine!)
    Most commonly used backup methods
    Next to startup from the disk, have it inserted, hold c or option/alt (wired or built in keyboard) and then boot the computer and or select the disk when it appears and click the arrow.
    Disk Utility is under the Utilities menu on the second screen.
    Step by Step to fix your Mac
    If you used the wrong 10.6 disk, it will spit it out or have issues, use the one that came with that machine or if it's defective, call Apple for a new one.

  • Would like to add additional hard disk besides physically installing the new hard disk anything else need to be doing?

    would like to add additional hard disk, besides physically installing the new hard disk anything else need to do?

    If it's a generic SATA HD you'll probably need to format it for Mac using Disk Utility.

Maybe you are looking for

  • Enhancing F4 Search Help Issue - Standard Component

    Hello All, We have a requirement in SRM to customize couple of standard Search helps attached to the Webdynpro components. As such I know the concept of how we can handle this requirement but hitting an issue. Standard Working scenario - 1) Standard

  • [SOLVED] Blank screen after SLiM login

    Hello everyone, I'm very new to Arch as of a few days ago and I have been attempting to set it up in just about all the free time I can spare. I think I've spent about 20 hours total trying to get things up and running. I am attempting to run Arch wi

  • Poor Image quality/Slideshow/iMovie to iDVD

    I placed about 150 jpegs as clips in iMovie HD (v.5.0.2). I made them all 3.25 seconds long and gave them all a short overlap transition. I set them to music and exported to iDVD (v.5.0.1). Once the DVD was burned, I viewed it with disappointment. Br

  • Help on Radio Function... please answer

    On itunes under radio, I found a radio station I like but what do I do, or need to get that station to play on my ipod?!?!

  • Photoshop elements wont download on mac

    i purchased photoshop elements 11 for my mac osx 10.8.2 and its not downloading. ive also tried downloading the trial version so that i can just punch in the product key after but it wont download all the way keeps saying theres an error. need help o