Does Time Machine Ever Delete All Traces of a File?

I have a question.  I have read up on Time Machine on various articles, posts, and documents across the web and I am having a hard time understanding exactly how time machine deletes files.
When a disk is full, does Time Machine ever make the decision to delete the last copy or version of a file, therefore completely erasing it off the disk forever?  I know that Time Machine deletes older versions of files, but will it ever completely delete the last, final backup of a file to make space?  If so, I can't imagine using Time Machine as a true piece of backup software.  It seems like it would be useful in restoring your computer in an emergency, but as far as backing up files, it seems that it would be catastrophic, because it may choose to delete the last remaing version of a file to make space and you end up losing that file for ever.
Here is an example:
I create a file X.doc
Time Machine backs it up.
I modify X.doc
Time Machine backs up the copy, keeping both the original and the new copy on the backup drive.
I modify X.doc yet again.
Time Machine drive runs out of space. Time Machine deletes the oldest version of X.doc and backs up the new copy.
I create 10 more files unrelated to X.doc
Will Time Macine remove all remaining versions of X.doc to make space for the 10 new files???
I hope I am making sense.

Derek Doublin1 wrote:
Will Time Macine remove all remaining versions of X.doc to make space for the 10 new files???
The worst TM can do is delete all your older copies of files, not the most recent version.
If the drive is full, then it can't accept any more files period.
If you had a full 100GB boot drive and a 100GB TM drive, the TM drive would be a copy of the boot drive with no room for saved states.
If you changed a file on the full boot drive, then TM updates that file on it's full drive, there will be no copy of the previous version of that file.
TimeMachine makes for a poor pernament backup system, because lets say you do a major files addition to your boot drive, TM backs that up and can go ahead and delete files you realized you accidentially deleted just a few short days ago.
It's better than nothing and works ok for newbies, but more seasoned types use many backup methods in addition to TM, because corruption creep is possible with TM as well as malware as it's hooked up so often, in a lot of cases all the time.
Most commonly used backup methods

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    Dec 26 09:48:06 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[216]: Backing up to: /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb
    Dec 26 09:48:07 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[216]: Node requires deep traversal:/Volumes/Untitled 1 reason:must scan subdirs|
    Dec 26 09:48:07 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[216]: No pre-backup thinning needed: 322.5 MB requested (including padding), 155.78 GB available
    Dec 26 09:48:07 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[216]: Copied 1 files (0 bytes) from volume Untitled 1.
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    Dec 26 09:48:09 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[216]: Copied 7 files (93 bytes) from volume Macintosh HD 1.
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    Dec 26 09:48:24 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[216]: Copied 13 files (93 bytes) from volume Macintosh HD 2.
    Dec 26 09:48:34 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[216]: Copied 19 files (93 bytes) from volume Video.
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    Dec 26 09:49:03 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[216]: Backup deletion was canceled by user
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    Dec 26 10:19:49 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Starting standard backup
    Dec 26 10:19:49 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Backing up to: /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb
    Dec 26 10:20:13 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: No pre-backup thinning needed: 329.7 MB requested (including padding), 155.78 GB available
    Dec 26 10:21:23 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Copied 947 files (5.8 MB) from volume Macintosh HD 1.
    Dec 26 10:21:25 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Copied 953 files (5.8 MB) from volume Macintosh HD 2.
    Dec 26 10:21:28 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Copied 959 files (5.8 MB) from volume Video S3.
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    Dec 26 12:19:52 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Copied 8.2 GB of 8.2 GB, 3384 of 3384 items
    Dec 26 13:19:52 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Copied 20.5 GB of 20.5 GB, 3409 of 3409 items
    Dec 26 14:19:54 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Copied 34.7 GB of 34.7 GB, 3442 of 3442 items
    Dec 26 15:19:55 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Copied 54.8 GB of 54.8 GB, 3478 of 3478 items
    Dec 26 15:51:26 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Copied 3496 files (67.5 GB) from volume Macintosh HD 4.
    Dec 26 15:54:17 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Starting pre-backup thinning: 718.12 GB requested (including padding), 88.27 GB available
    Dec 26 15:54:17 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Found partially deleted backup - trying again to delete: 2009-11-26-214614
    Dec 26 15:54:39 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-11-26-214614: 88.36 GB now available
    Dec 26 15:54:39 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Removed all 1 expired backups, more space is needed - deleting oldest backups to make room
    Dec 26 16:08:32 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-08-31-214215: 102.34 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:09:50 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-09-12-204919: 104.33 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:11:08 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-09-20-200117: 105.00 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:11:57 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-10-04-162511: 105.11 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:13:53 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-10-11-095448: 111.18 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:15:17 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-10-18-194956: 112.30 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:16:36 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-10-25-143128: 112.59 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:18:54 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-11-01-150819: 113.80 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:19:42 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-11-08-210648: 114.44 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:25:48 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-11-15-084242: 125.84 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:28:19 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-11-23-124658: 125.93 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:29:20 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-11-27-075219: 125.94 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:31:08 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-11-28-000354: 125.97 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:32:41 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-11-29-101726: 126.17 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:33:13 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-11-30-212802: 126.17 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:34:12 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-12-02-205548: 126.18 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:36:42 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-12-04-180748: 126.69 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:37:58 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-12-06-164628: 126.70 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:40:57 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-12-07-203807: 126.95 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:42:15 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-12-12-103818: 127.03 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:43:08 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-12-14-194223: 127.05 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:43:36 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-12-15-213301: 127.05 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:46:56 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-12-17-203032: 128.20 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:48:15 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-12-18-203635: 128.21 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:49:06 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-12-21-173338: 128.22 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:49:57 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-12-24-194134: 128.23 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:50:17 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-12-25-150955: 128.23 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:50:58 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-12-25-164942: 129.26 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:51:18 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-12-25-173957: 129.26 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:51:45 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-12-25-183843: 129.26 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:52:23 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-12-25-202250: 129.27 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:52:25 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Deleted backup /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb/Simon Jordan’s Mac Pro/2009-12-25-210738: 129.27 GB now available
    Dec 26 16:52:25 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Error: backup disk is full - all 33 possible backups were removed, but space is still needed.
    Dec 26 16:52:25 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Backup Failed: unable to free 718.12 GB needed space
    Dec 26 16:52:31 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Backup failed with error: Not enough available disk space on the target volume.
    Dec 26 17:18:45 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Starting standard backup
    Dec 26 17:18:46 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Backing up to: /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb
    Dec 26 17:19:33 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Starting pre-backup thinning: 878.33 GB requested (including padding), 129.27 GB available
    Dec 26 17:19:33 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: No expired backups exist - deleting oldest backups to make room
    Dec 26 17:19:33 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Error: backup disk is full - all 0 possible backups were removed, but space is still needed.
    Dec 26 17:19:33 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Backup Failed: unable to free 878.33 GB needed space
    Dec 26 17:19:38 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[233]: Backup failed with error: Not enough available disk space on the target volume.
    Dec 26 18:04:50 simon-jordans-mac-pro [0x0-0x45045].backupd-helper[853]: Not starting Time Machine backup after wake - failed to resolve alias to backup volume
    Dec 26 18:07:02 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[893]: Starting standard backup
    Dec 26 18:07:03 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[893]: Backing up to: /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb
    Dec 26 18:07:24 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[893]: Node requires deep traversal:/Volumes/Q reason:must scan subdirs|
    Dec 26 18:10:05 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[893]: Node requires deep traversal:/Volumes/N2 reason:must scan subdirs|
    Dec 26 18:10:08 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[893]: Starting pre-backup thinning: 1.48 TB requested (including padding), 129.27 GB available
    Dec 26 18:10:08 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[893]: No expired backups exist - deleting oldest backups to make room
    Dec 26 18:10:08 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[893]: Error: backup disk is full - all 0 possible backups were removed, but space is still needed.
    Dec 26 18:10:08 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[893]: Backup Failed: unable to free 1.48 TB needed space
    Dec 26 18:10:14 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[893]: Backup failed with error: Not enough available disk space on the target volume.
    Dec 26 18:13:18 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[893]: Starting standard backup
    Dec 26 18:13:19 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[893]: Backing up to: /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb
    Dec 26 18:13:38 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[893]: Node requires deep traversal:/Volumes/Q reason:must scan subdirs|
    Dec 26 18:15:52 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[893]: Node requires deep traversal:/Volumes/N2 reason:must scan subdirs|
    Dec 26 18:15:59 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[893]: Starting pre-backup thinning: 1.05 TB requested (including padding), 129.27 GB available
    Dec 26 18:15:59 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[893]: No expired backups exist - deleting oldest backups to make room
    Dec 26 18:15:59 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[893]: Error: backup disk is full - all 0 possible backups were removed, but space is still needed.
    Dec 26 18:15:59 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[893]: Backup Failed: unable to free 1.05 TB needed space
    Dec 26 18:16:05 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[893]: Backup failed with error: Not enough available disk space on the target volume.
    Dec 26 18:51:41 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[274]: Starting standard backup
    Dec 26 18:51:41 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[274]: Backing up to: /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb
    Dec 26 18:52:10 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[274]: Starting pre-backup thinning: 877.95 GB requested (including padding), 129.27 GB available
    Dec 26 18:52:10 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[274]: No expired backups exist - deleting oldest backups to make room
    Dec 26 18:52:10 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[274]: Error: backup disk is full - all 0 possible backups were removed, but space is still needed.
    Dec 26 18:52:10 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[274]: Backup Failed: unable to free 877.95 GB needed space
    Dec 26 18:52:15 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[274]: Backup failed with error: Not enough available disk space on the target volume.
    Dec 26 18:53:22 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[274]: Starting standard backup
    Dec 26 18:53:22 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[274]: Backing up to: /Volumes/Time Machine Backups/Backups.backupdb
    Dec 26 18:53:36 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[274]: Starting pre-backup thinning: 877.95 GB requested (including padding), 129.27 GB available
    Dec 26 18:53:36 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[274]: No expired backups exist - deleting oldest backups to make room
    Dec 26 18:53:36 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[274]: Error: backup disk is full - all 0 possible backups were removed, but space is still needed.
    Dec 26 18:53:36 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[274]: Backup Failed: unable to free 877.95 GB needed space
    Dec 26 18:53:41 simon-jordans-mac-pro com.apple.backupd[274]: Backup failed with error: Not enough available disk space on the target volume.

  • Time Machine has deleted all backups except one..?

    (Snow Leopard 10.6.8) Mac Pro.
    I've been backing up for at least 2 years using Time Machine on an internal 500Gb drive. Today I get a message saying the drive is full and when I check all backups over the last 8 months (approx) have gone. The only backup surviving is the one it did just before the message popped up. Have tried Repair disk and Disk Warrior, but they're still gone. Is this most likely to be a failing drive issue? And is there any chance I can recover them?

    Time Machine will not delete your old backups unless it starts to run out of space on the hard drive......or.....your backups have become corrupted and Time Machine cannot repair them.
    In the latter case, a message like this will appear on your screen:
    Do you recall seeing this message recently?

  • Why does Time machine not delete old backups

    I dont understand Why time machine is not deleting old backups. As it worked first time with the same size backup drive as the drive its backing up, I assumed it would just delete the old backup as needed. Do I need a bigger backup drive?

    Roglee wrote:
    I just want it to delete the old backup & replace it so i just have a copy. I guess i could just re format the drive each time but that just seems a waste of my time when TM should do this for me!
    If this is all you want to do, turn off Time Machine, download SuperDuper! and use it for free. This will clone whatever drive you want and the free trial will erase your back up drive each time. I can't remember if it will let you choose what to back up or if it wants the entire drive. Also, I'm not sure if the Scheduler works with the free trial. Below are some verbiage for SuperDuper!. Looks like if you want Scheduling you will have to purchase a license.
    Download Now! 
    You can download SuperDuper! v2.7.1 right now and back up and clone your drives for free— forever! 
    Buy Now!
    Buy now to unlock scheduling, Smart Update (which saves a lot of time), Sandboxes, scripting and more!
    Time Machine will keep making back ups and when it determines it needs space, it will delete older back ups. But it doesn't delete older ones each time it backs up.

  • Does time machine retrieve deleted trash?

    I think i may have accidentally deleted some pics used for wall and screen savers but not sure which ones, i have 15gb in the trash and would like to empty it but if anything were to go wrong would i be able to retrieve deleted trash files from time machine?

    I do not think that Time Machine backs up your Trash folder at all. See this thread:
    http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=1208460

  • Does time machine "restore" change all subsequent versions?

    Hi all,
    This evening I some how accidently "restored" a document I had been working on to a version I started about a month ago.  I honestly have no idea how this happened since I hadn't even opened Time Machine when noticed the document was the old version (the program and document had been open on my laptop for days). Anyway, I thought maybe I could just go back to the version from yesterday or a few days ago, but it seems that once today's version is restored to March 28th's version, all subsequent versions are also restored.  Is this right?? Am I missing something here?  If there is any way to find a previous version of this document (that is not the March 28th one!), I would be estactic.
    Thanks!

    Your backups never change. Restore again from a snapshot taken just before the unwanted restoration.

  • DOES TIME MACHINE EVER SLEEP?

    I've just noticed that if you enter into the time machine backups it shows backups having been done every hour for the last 24 hours. But during some of that time the computer has been in sleep mode, eg: overnight. Is this something new in OS10.7?, or is it because I've changed connections from wi-fi to direct network? - I'm sure it didn't used to do this. Seems strange, because surely nothing is going to change and need backing up whilst it's asleep......?

    KJ W wrote:
    during some of that time the computer has been in sleep mode, eg: overnight.
    your Mac might be waking from sleep to perform the backup.
    Mac OS X v10.6: About Wake on Demand

  • Does reloading OS permanantly delete all of the log files

    I'm selling my early 2009 MBP. I'm not that concerned with the hardrive cause there's not much on it and nothing that cant's be seen by someone else. I've never kept any personal numbers or photos or anything. So I'll probably do a simple cleaning and let it go. I do want to make sure all of the log files are gone and can't be recovered. I'm reinstalling the OS will this do it?

    The newly-created log files don't contain the data of the previous ones and will be deleted when you erase the entire drive. As long as you've securely erased the previously-created ones, that part of it is done.
    (126570)

  • HT201250 How does Time Machine allocate backup data.

    I have over 150GB to back up with time machine and only 256GB HD to use, does Time Machine back up all files each time or only files updated after the last backup?

    Time Machine first makes a full backup, and then, it makes incremental backups backing up only the files that have changed since the last backup. When the Time Machine drive gets full, Time Machine will start deleting old backups in order to be able to make new backups. If you want more information about Time Machine, see > http://pondini.org

  • HT3275 does time machine back up email?

    Does time machine back up all the emails in your apple mail?

    Yes, assuming of course, that you have not specifically excluded Mail from backups.

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