Drop frames on digitize - !!

I am currently digitizing a lot of footage using Final Cut Pro 4. So far I have done over 85 hours of footage without a problem.
However, with this latest batch of tapes I am having frequent problems with dropped frames on capture. I am capturing 10 to 15 minute clips, as per editor's orders. Nothing has changed from earlier digitize sessions so I am baffled as to the cause. I need clean captures as this footage is going to be onlined for broadcast.
I am digitizing using digi-beta tapes (124), on a Sony DSR-45 DVCam deck, into my Emac, and stored on a 500g RAID drive. The DV tapes have had some time code breaks, but it is relatively minor to deal with. I have all my capture settings on the RAID drive (auto-save, thumbnails, etc). I log a tape and then digitize the whole thing, then move on to the next tape.
It is getting so the whole thing aborts capture almost every clip - very time consuming! It will get it on a second attempt each time. I have used MacSweeper to defrag, and carefully close all other applications when I am going to digitize (or try to go straight to digitize on start up, without opening any othe programs).
I have 30-odd tapes to go, so am facing a potential nightmare here. Any suggestions?
Shereen

How full is the drive getting? It needs to have about 10% free in order for it to run at optimal specs and not drop frames. That means that you need to leave between 45 and 50 GB free on the drive.
And pardon me, but digibeta tapes on a DSR-45 DVCAM deck? How are you pulling that off. I didn't think the tapes would fit.
Shane

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Dropped Frames during digitize

It's been awhile since I've had to trouble shoot, apologies if this is a novice question.
Trying to digitize plain old miniDV through Firewire, nothing fancy, has worked consistently until today, when I received this error after two trys of the deck
cueing up and trying to capture footage:
"Dropped frames were detected during the last capture attempt"
I've tried using different external drives as well as my desktop as the target drive to no avail.
I ran Disc Utility on my main Mac HD, to no avail.
I've checked other tapes, and I get the same error on everything. Even DV tapes that have worked in the past.
Any insights or hints of what to check or change would be greatly appreciated.
Thank you!

ok more details.
Capturing from a consumer Panasonic camera, using Panasonic tapes.
Easy setup: DV-NTSC (NTSC 29.97)
tried using Device Control FIREWIRE NTSC and FIREWIRE NTSC BASIC, neither worked
there is enough drive space, and I have to run out and buy another FW cable.
I'm just mystified, this set up has been tried and true for over a year.
The only thing that is different is I updated the Mac OS to 10.5.6 and hope
there is no correlation with that.
thanks.

Drop frame video to non-drop frame clip warning (again)

So my most recent search of why this warning comes up reveals no good answers (unless someone can point me to a thread I overlooked...cuz I can't narrow it down without getting threads about folks who have gotten dropped frames during capture, which isn't the same situation)...
I shoot on an XL2 (drop frame) and capture with a DSR-11. Once in a while I will finish going through log and capture (in the log and capture window), setting ins, outs, etc. but I go to batch capture and it gives me the warning. All my ins/outs have semi-colons, I haven't changed the setting on my camera since I started using it more than 18 months ago, and it doesn't happen all the time. I do have the "abort capture on dropped frames" box unchecked as well (if that matters).
99.99% of the time, I've captured and there's no problems with syncing or anything. Thoughts?
Thanks,
Jonathan

If I recall right someone suggest to have your tape playing while opening Log and Capture, but I might recall wrong
I already have the "Abort on dropped frames" and "report dropped frames" unchecked.
Don't be mistaken: Dropped frames are a totally different issue from non-drop and drop frame timecode.
Drop frame timecode drops (or better: skips) timcodenumbers while counting the videoframes. That is a system to compensate for the 29,97 frames per second in order to calculate the correct length of a clip.
Dropped frames (as in "Abort on dropped frames" and "report dropped frames") is an error. Due to some reason the hardware isn't capable to record/digitize every single videoframe to your harddisk. e.g. Your captured file will have 2000 frames, while your footage on tape had 2003. Three frames were dropped then during capture. And your video will noticeble stutter at these points.
So I'd strongly recommend to do check the "Abort on dropped frames" and "report dropped frames"-options. You don't want stuttering video do you. So if your hardware couldn't handle the videofeed somehow, it would resp. abort capture or warn you that it happened.
Rienk

Suddenly: Dropped Frames on Capture

I've NEVER had a problem with dropped frames. I installed the FCP 5.0.3 upgrade, then had massive problems with dropped frames. In fact, I can't digitize anything: DSR-11, VHS with non-controllable device, nothing. I did the entire troubleshooting routine, then finally trashed my prefs file. Problem solved! I captured everything to my heart's content yesterday. Shut down the G5 last night...turned it back on this morning. Problem is back. Trashed prefs file. Problem won't go away. I can't capture anything.
In troubleshooting, I tried my G5, my G4 Powerbook...all had the same problem. What gives?

Hi Jerry
I have the same issue with FCP 5, (dropped frames on capture.)
My setup is a brand new G5/Quadcore.
OS was installed from the factory and updated online to 10.4.3
FCP 5 Studio, (installed from the Suite disk set) updated online to current updates for the entire suite, Pro Apps updated, etc.
Memory in G5: 2GB
Storage: Xserve RAID 3.5TB, with Raid Admin 1.5 and drivers 1.5 on RAID. All fibre channel connections are via an Emulex switch, (12 port.)
Source Deck: Betacam UVW-1800, connected via component video.
Capture Device: AJA Io, (original Io) updated to 2.1 drivers.
I'm still having dropped frame, right from the get go, during capture.
I also have a G4 with FCP 4.5 HD, (OS X 10.3.9) which I also connect to the Io box, (but not at the same time) which has no issues with dropped frames.
Do you have any ideas why the G5 drops frames but the G4 doesn't?

Is my comp. screwed up? Use to work, now drops frames on capture.

is my comp. screwed up? Use to work, now drops frames on capture.
OK.
My G5
mac osx 10.4.9
processor 1.8 GHZ
Memory 1.75 GD DDR SDRAM
started to be unable to digitize footage.
It says there are dropped frame or problems with the source tape. The same tape, using the same deck, same firewire (400-800port) work FINE on my husbands G5
So I think it has to be my computer. I was working on FCP 4, and thought maybe when I installed FCP 6 it would magically get better.
So I got fcp 6 and I still have the same problem....
any help would be much appreciated.

99 times out of 100 it's that your scratch disk can't keep up with the captures... what are you capturing to? Should be a disk other than your internal startup disk. Is this DV material?
Jerry

Drop Frames stopping huge project

Trying to digitize 64 hours for a doc I shot at the Tour de France. Getting frequent drop frame stops on all tapes.
Four cameras/deck used to transfer (none successful) Sonys & Canon
Have latest OS, QT & FCP
source material: mini-DV SD
• tapes transfer perfectly on another FCP system (assume tape good)
• tapes transfer on straight QT injest no issue (assume deck, cable, QT ok)
• tapes injest on IMOVIE without issue (assume deck, cable, QT & HD ok
so ONLY A PROBLEM IN FCP
• tried scratching to other internal drives, incl OS drive
• ditched Prefs twice
• reinstalled FCP
• tried different cams/decks
• tried firewire and FW basic use settings
I was so hoping that reinstall FCP would do it & I do not know now what's left to check. it points to FCP but I've never had this problem before. ANY suggestions would be more than appreciated.
DID NOT:
• reinstall QT Pro
• reinstall OS
Michael: [email protected]

After two weeks we finally swapped out the Firewire cord which I mistakenly scratched off the bad list because both IMOVIE and QT ingested the tapes just fine. I got a shielded one. oh man, so simple!!!

Canon GL1 and dropped frames

Greetings all: I've used a GL1 for a long time, but will be selling it shortly to upgrade. My concern is this: it seems that my Sony DSR-20 has a problem with dropping frames on tapes shot with the camera. It seems to be increasing in frequencey. I had the camera factory reconditioned last year. And, a client had a similar problem and had to use a Canon camera to digitize.
Is this a Sony --> Canon issue? I want to sell the camera, but I want to know the full issue before I do.
Any experience with this is appreciated
Dual G5 tower Mac OS X (10.3.9)

this is a canon issue. root around on different forums and you find many tales of woe such as this. i like canon products in general, their broadcast glass and still cameras in particular, but i would never get one of their video cameras, toooo tempremantal and naughty when cooperating with other devices.
sell the camera, do not get another canon. my two cents.
zeb

Unable to capture files into external hard disk because of 'drop frames '

I haven't been able to capture footage from my DV camcoder thru firewire to an external hard disk in FCP because i get a message saying 'drop frames were detected'.
This happens when i selected this external hard drive as the scratch disk in FCP.
When i deslect it and select my user hard disk as the scratch disk, the capturing works perfectly. But i just want to capture all my capture files into the external hard disk, not my user hard disk.
The external hard disk's speed is 3500 - could that be the problem? Is it too slow? Its connected thru USB and it is Mac Os Extended Journaled. Its got 250gb of space, so that's not the issue.
Can anybody help me?
Thank you.

No, its a Panasonic gs180, a really good camera.
The camera itself is connected to my computer through firewire. Its the hard disk enclosure that is connected to my emac through USB. Anyway, i'm sure that's not the problem, casue like i said, the capturing works fine when i use my user hard disk as the FCP scratch disk.
The problem i have is when i try to capture footage from my camera to the external hard disk enclosure. When i press 'capture now' and press play, the playback stutters and a messsage appears saying, "drop frames detected" and the capturing stops.
I feel like i need to adjust something in FCP itself - like a preference or something - just not sure what.
Thnx for your suggestion though and if you know what i should do, please let me know.

Export Quicktime = stalling / frame rate / dropped frames

Firstly this issue isn't news. It appears it has existed since 2002 at least on these forums and Apple has done nothing.
Exporting to Quicktime:
1) Keynote makes up what seem to be consistent random frame rates on export
- Codec doesn't matter. Photo JPG, Intermediate, 8bit 422, H264
- You can set the frame rate in export / custom / settings it doesn't matter
- Having no video on a slide or having video on a slide doesn't change the problem...
- The last two items do have more information to complete their story
- If you do have a video on slide at say 25fps and export (at same rate) the random will stabilise
but it will stabilise to something bizarre, such as 23.69.
- So Keynote can wreck your frame rate it will drop frames, or even add frames while dropping
others. It is deeply sophisticated in how it destroys stuff on export.
Result
- is a stuttering output if embed video on a slide with a wrecked frame rate
- and a random frame rate if you don't have a video embed
2) The video stalls between slides
- Keynote seems to play a trick by making a single frame span multiple frames
- At the start of the first slide this seems to vary. The first frame can be between 7 and 33
frames depending on some strange internal logic only known to Keynote
- Between slides it will hold the last frame of the exiting slide usually for 7 frames and hold
the first frame of the entering slide for usually the same amount.
- No amount of change to settings such as transition delay, adding a transition, self play etc
will effect this stalling from what I can tell.
- You can analyse the reality of the issue by dropping the resulting file into Quicktime 7 and
changing the video window "time code" display to frames by clicking on it and single framing
through the video. I have Quicktime Pro for the record.
Notes:
- I have every update installed and am running 10.6.2
- I have tried it on two machines, one a clean build, server or client
- Playing the presentation direct in Keynote does not present any of the noted issues
- I have spent the better part of two weeks on the issue trying all sorts of combinations
- Video of different frames rates, sizes, codecs. All useless, don't bother.
Outcome:
- Keynote is completely useless unless you just want to play a presentation in it
- Dropped frames, stuttering video, stalling, mangled frame rates, fake frames
Solutions that aren't:
- One suggestion for video embeds is to enter a strange custom frame rate. For example a
24fps original turns into a 23.69 export, if you up the frame rate to 24.3 the resulting export
is 24fps.
This is a truly hit and miss affair and will require a lot of testing to nail it. Unfortunately I
tested the resulting video frame count in Quicktime against the original video and...
The amount of frames is not the same. Part of my assumption is that the stalled pad frames
are being considered by Keynote and it drops some frames to fake the same length, that at
least -seems- to be part of the result, but it doesn't account for all the lost frames.
- I have also tried just having one slide and exporting that. The same things happen regardless
How Al Gore managed to make "inconvenient truth" using Keynote is a complete mystery. Maybe on Tiger with some old version it used to work, yet from the forums it would appear it has never worked. This piece of software is a clear case of "it just doesn't work"
I hope you find this and stop hurting yourself trying to make this. I might hurt on a bit longer yet.

I can't answer in detail (I started with version 6, which I haven't used in years, so don't know what v5 did) but... a general comment
Software that old is very likely going to struggle trying to edit a VOB/MPG file copies from a DVD
If you are digitizing by playing the DVD through a conversion device you should end up with DV AVI which should edit well
Just what kind of files are you trying to edit?

How do I read the number of dropped frames in a 1394 session?

I'm using a C program to acquire image data using the imaq1394 library. I am dropping frames at 30FPS and want to use the imaq1394GetAttributes call with the IMG1394_ATTR_LOST_BUFFER_NB parameter to read the number of dropped frames. I am doing this at the end of the acquisition before the camera is closed. The value always comes back as 0. What is wrong? Here is the line that makes the call:
imaq1394GetAttribute(Sid, IMG1394_ATTR_LOST_BUFFER_NB, (unsigned long *) &lDroppedFrames);
Thanks in advance...

Hello spcmicro,
Thank you for the email.
For the IMAQ 1394 driver (version 1.0), the lost buffer attribute does not work properly.
- The issue is not known to the developer lead, and it will be investigated for the next release of the IMAQ 1394 driver.
Please let me know if you have any additional questions,
Alan Hagler

Dropped frames issue on a G5 2.7DP w/DV footage

Let me first tell you my setup:
G5 2.7 DP
8 GB RAM
WiebeTech TrayDock eSATA 4-bay drive enclosure w/Sonnet 4+4 eSATA PCI Card
(2) 400 GB Seagate Barracudas in the enclosure RAIDed in a striped config using Apple's Disk Utility
10.4
FCP 5
At seemingly random times, playback from the timeline will stutter and stop, thus throwing up the dropped frames dialog box. If I re-play from the same point, it will normally play. This has happened on several current projects in which I'm working in DV. I've also worked on a project in 8bit uncompressed using my Kona LS card with the same drives, and had the same error.
I've had this issue ever since I setup this system--from the first install of FCP5 to the most recent update of 5.0.3, as well as from 10.4.2 to 10.4.3. I've tried turning off the internal Airport card in the G5, and quitting all other programs.
There is a little utility that came with the Kona card to test data rate of your drives. I'm getting well over 100 MB/s Read, and slightly less write rates, so it seems like drive speed isn't an issue.
What is the weak link here? WiebeTech was nice enough to send me a replacement eSATA PCI card, and the issue hasn't gone away, so it wasn't a bad card, although I guess there could be some flaw inherent in all of the cards.
What other steps should I take to try and isolate/solve this problem? This is kind of embarrasing that I can't play DV footage on the timeline without the possibility of dropping frames--even when working with only one layer of video.
I'm capturing video to the eSATA RAID, and my project files/graphics reside on an internal SATA drive in G5 (not the boot drive--I added another seagate 250 gb). Seems like there should be enough throughput in this thing to handle basic edits, but I'm beginning to have my doubts....
Your ideas?????

Clay,
Regarding your statement "My thinking initially about my workflow was to not keep them on the same drive as the footage because my feeling is that the RAID isn't as "safe" as the single 250 GB drive I have inside the G5".
I store all of my media, GFX and project files on whatever FW drive I happen to be using for a project. I NEVER have media for a specific project on two or more drives. For safety's sake, I ALWAYS have my Autosave Vault set to my internal drive, with a relatively high save rate (every 10 min). That way if the FW drive ever failed completely, I'd at least have a recent copy of the project file to work with (even if I have to redigitize the footage or redo the GFX). All I can say is keep all of your media (per project) on one drive - it's been kind of the Bible in this industry for years, and as far as I know it hasn't changed.
As far as RAID's go, I'm no expert. But if I remember correctly, back in my old Avid days we also used to avoid having the media on different striped partitions - something else you may want to try if you're media is spread across a few stripes.
It seems like I've run across more than a few posts here regarding the same problem happening on Dual 2.7's. You may want to do a more thorough search here to see what you come up with. All I can say is I'm running FCP 5.0.3 on a G5 Dual 2.0 with only 2.5 meg of RAM and have had no dropped frame issues.
Try Matt's suggestion of playing some footage off of your boot drive (NOT recommended for everyday use!). If it works then it's got to be a problem with your RAID and not FCP.
Good Luck!
jeff

Warning: Sometimes Final Cut exports a non-drop sequence as drop-frame

Just a heads up. This has been maddening for me. On occasion I will export my program for compressor and it will be drop frame when it should be non-drop.
These are sequences which have exported fine before. There is no rhyme or reason to it. Tonight I've lost about 2 hours because of this. At least I knew to check it before compressing the file and sending it out to our contractor because it has happened in the past.
By the way shutting down FCP and opening it up again seems to cure the problem.

System req's for fcp 5
General System Requirements
Macintosh computer with 867MHz or faster PowerPC G4, PowerPC G5, Intel Core Duo processor, or Intel Xeon processor
HD features require 1GHz or faster single or dual processors (authoring HD DVDs requires a PowerPC G5, Intel Core Duo processor, or Intel Xeon processor)
512MB of RAM; 1GB of RAM for HD features (2GB recommended)
Display with 1024-by-768 (or higher) resolution
AGP Quartz Extreme or PCI Express graphics card (Final Cut Studio is not supported on systems using the Intel Extreme Graphics 950 GMA)
Motion requires the standard graphics card found in any Mac Pro, MacBook Pro, iMac Intel Core Duo, Power Mac G5, iMac G5, a 1.25 GHz or faster PowerBook G4, or a 1.25 GHz or faster flat-panel iMac.
Mac OS X 10.4.4 or later
QuickTime 7.0.4 or later
4GB of disk space to install all applications
Additional 42GB to install all optional templates, loops, content, and tutorials (may be installed on separate discs)
It would seem that you've been reasonably lucky thus far running 10.3.9

Capture on the fly dropped frame aborted capture - clip gone forever???

I foolishly set up my Macbook pro to capture the video feed live from an HVX200 camera via firewire... THE clutch interview for a client... Lo: what happens but halfway through the interview, capture aborts and error message reads "capture aborted due to dropped frames".
It's an investigative journalism project, with a hostile interview subject, so no do-overs possible.
Clip not showing up in capture scratch or anywhere else.
My question is: has anyone had any luck rescuing an incomplete clip like this? The hard drive was churning, doing computerlike things, writing, so the information is there somewhere. It's just that the "pointers" or "handles" of the clip are gone. I know with IBM/Avid there's an attic where you can get to weird and/or incomplete files - is there anything like that with MAC/Final cut? Or is this setup "all or nothing"?
Maybe someone knows about a program that can recover incomplete data, good for MAC?
I know, shame on me for capturing straight to computer - I'll never do that again.
thanks!
Jeremy

has anyone had any luck rescuing an incomplete clip like this?
Nope. The file failed to complete...QT/FCP didn't get a chance to write the end code for the clip, so it is unusable.
I know with IBM/Avid there's an attic where you can get to weird and/or incomplete files
The ATTIC in Avid terms is the same as AUTOSAVE in FCP...it saves a backup of the project bins, not the media. Not sure about the IBM attic...
I don't know of anyone having luck recovering a file that has been aborted like this. And this happens to more people that we'd like to see. Capturing one-of-a-time events straight to computer with no backup. Bombout.
Shane

How to tell if video is drop frame or non-drop frame in Encore? Need info to use correct SCC file.

Hi,
Thanks in advance. I am using Encore DVD 2.0 to add closed captions to video. I have both a drop frame SCC file and a non-drop frame SCC file. How can I tell which one to use? Can I tell from the way the timecode looks on the timeline? Do I look at the timeline timecode or the source timecode? For example, in a random area of video the timeline says 00;02;50;24 while the source says 00:02:50:20.
Thanks.

Thanks jbowden and Jim for your help. Although I'm still not real clear how Encore notes DF vs NDF (more on that below), I got my problem solved.
Regarding DF vs NDF in Encore DVD...There doesn't seem to be a real consistent method of identifying which is which. For example, Jim suggested that I look in the Project panel for the colons vs semicolons. There, the video file timecode was shown as xx;xx;xx;xx with semicolons, apparently suggesting that it is DF. However, the timeline and audio file listed in the project panel also showed semicolons in the timecode. Then, down on the timeline, the timeline was shown as xx;xx;xx;xx while right next to that it said "Source xx:xx:xx:xx" with colons! So, if I go by the project panel, the video is DF. If I go by what it says down in the timeline, the video is NDF. As it turns out, subtitles and CC only match up if I use the NDF versions of them, not with the DF versions, which indicates that my file was NDF. So, in the end, I'd say that the way the timecode is represented in the project panel didn't mean anything, at least not in this case.

Full screen preview drops frames

Hi all,
A continuation of the thread I opened here (with hardware specs for information):
http://forums.adobe.com/thread/657008?tstart=0
Whilst I resolved the tearing issue secribed in the previous thread I still can't get smooth playback on the third full screen preview display and I'd like some basic advice as to what I could do:
A couple of things I have tried - firstly I tried a basic sequence with a spinning graphic (in order to rule out any issues with disk/network access), and then also tried two screens rather than three (so only one graphic card was in operation), a 60p/30p project with screens set to 60Hz and a 50p/25p project with screens set to 50Hz.
All to no avail - the full screen preview drops frames, especially with 50p content - 25p is better but every 20 seconds or so frames are dropped. Audio is always fine, regardless of the source, BTW.
As a reminder, this is a 12 core i7 with 2 x Quadro FX3800, all unnecessary services disabled, 12Gb RAM, CS5 5.0.3, latest WHQL Nvidia drivers.
Not sure if 5.5 improves this in any regard as I'm still waiting for my licence key.
Video playback outside of premiere is perfect, 1080p50 plays fine full screen on any display through windows media player/VLC.
Any suggestions please - again I wonder if a Blackmagic Intensity or similar would help?
Has anyone else seen this behaviour? Could anybody have a go a reproducing the issue (a simple spinning or sliding jpg demonstates the issue easily and simply)
Thanks all
Sacha Goodwin.

There exist no 12 core i7's. The max is hexa-core, but in your previous thread you said Xeon X5670. So what is it?
Well spotted, my bad - it is indeed 2 x hexa-core X5670's - which of course is 12 cores in total.
I still suspect your Editshare NAS.
I'd say unlikely since - we've replaced it with something else, also:
I tried a basic sequence with a spinning graphic (in order to rule out any issues with disk/network access)
and at any rate I tried it as a local project on local disks and it made no difference.
For graphic read plain color matte and basic SD res JPG (same results with either)
What happens when you increase memory to 24 GB?
No idea as I don't have access to any - strikes me as odd though to think anyone would need 24Gb or RAM just to display a rotating still smoothly.
Premiere is showing 300Mb of RAM, total RAM in use when everything is loaded and running is 3Gb, 9Gb free sitting there twiddling it's virtual thumbs.
BTW I should also mention that this happens even on SD projects, not just HD ones. Also watching the task manager shows virtually CPU usage, no disk and no network access during playback (as I would expect). No peaks in any graphs correllating with the dropped frames. Also enabling/disabling MPE Hardware assist makes no difference.
Sacha.

Drop frames on digitize - !!

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