Field Order -Progressive, Upper or Lower? (Interlacing?)

Hi there,
I am fairly new to exporting videos in premiere pro and wanted to ask any experienced knowledgable users what the
field order in the export box does if changing between progressive, upper or lower? I have read up on interlacing and de-interlacing as i noticed that my clip when played on the computer shows these horizontal interlacing lines when exported on the default 'upper' field order option and as a test I exported with 'progressive' and the lines had disappeared but I'm wondering if exporting it in progressive reduces the quality of the video in any way?
This video is to be played on an HD TV most likely for a meeting.
Reading up that some TVs will automatically de-interlace a clip, does this mean that
a) I should just leave it interlaced under 'upper' option and know that the horizontal lines won't appear on the TV? (still need to test this)
or
b) Just export as progressive as I am entirely wrong about the TV and the horizontal lines will show up on HD TVs unless I export with progressive?
I am pretty confused!
Please, I would appreciate any advice on this?
Sorry if i'm wrong on the things i've said, I am very new to all of this!
Thank you!

Hi Jess565,
Thanks for using Adobe forums,
You can go ahead and export as Progressive and it will not effect the quality of your video.
Happy Editing,
Sandeep

Similar Messages

HD Upper or lower interlace or not that is the question

Ok Im a bit confused and cannot seem to get a straight direction on this. I shoot in 30fps 1080i, I capture in HD via firewire, I edit and when outputting for regular DVDs do I encode UPPER FIELD first since the source media is HD or LOWER FIELD first because it is doing to DV.
When encoding with Media Encoder should I check the deinterlace button when encoding HD for a DV project going to encore or not check it...that is the question.
Where is my Commedore 64 when I need it?

Choose the correct field order for your
export format when exporting, in this case DV.
Choose progressive/interlaced depending on your export format when exporting. Since DV is interlaced, do not de-interlace.
Who needs a Commodore 64 when you have a Vic 20! ;)
Cheers
Eddie
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Forum FAQ

Upper or lower?

I have shot some PAL 1080p25, completed my project and wish to encode Bluray.
I understand that PAL 1080 progressive is not supported by the Bluray spec (it does not appear in the list of presets), so I selected HD 1080i25.
I see that the Basic Video Settings show the Field Order as Upper First.
I always thought that PAL required lower first.
Would a guru please confirm that1080 progressive is not available for PAL BluRay,
and whether I should change the field order to upper or leave it at lower - as the preset has it? Thanks

PAL SD is lower field.
PAL DV is LFF, So is NTSC DV. But DVDs, which are also Standard Definition, can be either Upper or Lower, whether PAL or NTSC. I think saying "PAL SD" on this is too broad a stroke.

The definitive field order list for all formats

WANTED: The definitive field order list for all formats, NTSC and PAL.
I have seen several such lists, but are they trustworthy?
This one http://www.dvxuser.com/V6/showthread.php?t=125817 looks promising, but, for instance, how can HDTV 1080/24p have a field order of upper field first? - Isn't "p" without any fields?
Anyway, if someone has seen such a definitive list, preferrably from some "official" source, please share.
Thanks

Hi kalione,
We’re always looking for ways to make browsing BestBuy.com easier. With the recent merger of the My Best Buy website into the main BestBuy.com page, it sounds like there may have been some changes to how you can view upcoming games! My apologies if there has been an added element of difficulty here.
The method that zztoluca has explained is actually how I generally check for pre-orders we have listed, as I like looking at them by individual platform. If you start at the main “PRODUCTS” tab at the top of the main site, choose “Video Games, Movies, & Music” and then choose the console of your choice. Once there, there should be an option on the left under the “Games” section for browsing by Pre-orders. Here is an example of pre-orders listed for Xbox One.
I hope this helps! Keep an eye on BestBuy.com as it’s constantly changing and evolving.
Cheers,
Brian|Senior Social Media Specialist | Best Buy® Corporate
Private Message

Compressor Saying Progressive on Upper Field Order Footage?

Hi all,
I have Upper field order 10Bit Uncompressed PAL footage in a proper timeline.
When I export it (not self contained) and open it in QuickTime or FCP, all is well.
So is it odd that when I add the file to Compressor and select it, in the Inspector the Field Order is set to Progressive? It is a drop down menu so I can select Upper, but then it asks me to save it which I chose not to do. If I add an MPEG-2 preset to it, it "auto" detects the file and says Progressive.
What's the deal? Should I simply modify the MPEG-2 preset drop down menu to Upper before I submit the batch?
Thanks,
Jason
G5 Quad 2.5Ghz, 30" Cinema HD Display, Final Cut Studio, CS2 Suite Mac OS X (10.4.9) Powerbooks, other Powermacs, iBooks, iMacs, etc...

OK, here you are,
Original footage :
Original Footage Interpretation:
Render Settings :
Output Module Settings :
Format Options :
Re-imported Footage :
Interpretation of re-imported footage :
The End and Thanks~~

Interlaced footage in secondary preview - wrong field order.

I just got CS5 Production Premium and an EVGA GTX 465, which is basically a GTX470 with less CUDA cores (352 instead of 448). I added the card to the list in the Premiere CS5 txt file (the so called hack) and everything seems to work perfect except for one thing. When I play back interlaced footage that I shot with either of my two AVCHD cameras (Canon HF100 and Panasonic AG-HMC40), the footage in the TV set (which is setup as my second monitor) will play with the fields in the right order but after a few seconds it will start playing as if it were progressive, or as if the fields were in the wrong order. Then, eventually, it will go back to play the fields in the right order, and then the wrong order, and go back and forth like that. It switches every ten or twenty seconds. This happens both when the footage is played back in the source window and in the timeline.
Thanks to the GPU acceleration, it plays smoothly always even with added effects and even with different tracks at different opacity levels (I tried three tracks, one at 25%, another at 50% and the other at 100% and it played without skipping a frame), but I don't understand why it doesn't always send the right field order. I wonder if it has anything to do with the cable that goes to the TV set, since it's DVI on the end that I connect to the video card, and HDMI on the other end. Regardless of that, I purchased the cable from Monoprice and it's a very thick, well shielded cable. The card comes with a mini HDMI output, but the cable that comes with it is not long enough to reach the TV. Still, I'm not sure that it would make a difference.
Is this happening to any of you? Could this be a problem with the card itself, with my footage, or with Premiere?
Note: I had switched the "Multi-display/mixed-GPU acceleration" to "Compatibility mode" in the Nvidia control panel and it didn't make a difference in anything related to CS5, whether it's this particular problem or anything else.

JSS1138 wrote:
We should probably just get the details, instead of speculation on what hardware is being used.
Oh, the system is pretty fast, but Premiere always took a huge toll when external preview was enabled, it was like that in CS3 and CS4 as well. But here are my system specs just in case:
AMD 1090T @3.8 Ghz (stable)
16 GB of DDR3 G.Skill RAM
Gigabyte GA-890FXA-UD5
Western Digital 1.5 Gb Black Edition (as one of the video drives, the OS drive is a standard WD)
EVGA GTX465 1 GB
So while this may not be the fastest computer in the world, it's more than fast enough for HD, with 6 cores and 16 GB of RAM.
This is something that's either wrong with Premiere's design, but maybe there's a workaround, which is what I'm trying to get to. I've been trying many things in the "Manage 3D" section of the Nvidia control panel, but nothing seems to work. VSync on or off, Triple Buffering, etc, etc, the problem is still there.
Obviously if I right click on the monitor window and instead of "Both Fields" I choose either first or second field, I get just that, but I don't see why do I have to edit interlaced video with just one field instead of both.

*** Upper or lower fields?

I'm working with HDV footage which I know is meant to be set at upper fields, while DV is lower fields. I'm trying to output my HDV footage to DVD by dropping it into a 16:9 DV sequence and rendering it. My question is, because I'm now going to DV, should I change the field order to lower or leave it as upper?
On a side note, I've already sent my HDV footage to DVD another way and have had pretty good results. I went from my HDV sequence > Compressor > 90 min best setting 16:9. The footage looks really good but by eyes seem to be telling me that there is a slight bluriness. Doesn't look bad at all, just quite different. In trying to get the best DVD possible, I'm going to try the DV sequence > render > compressor > DVD method....
Back to the original question. Does anyone know what I should do about the field order?

Anyone?

For Encore SD DVD 29.97i, What Field should video be in, upper or lower?

Been awhile since a compressed to DVD in Encore. I believe the field order of my Mpeg 2 from premiere should be lower field. Can anyone confirm this? Just wanted to double check.

As always, the field order of your exported file should match the field
order of your source footage. Encore can handle either upper first or
lower first.
-Jeff

Cannot get rid of the horizontal lines (field order or interlacing?)...

OK- I have footage which is 25fps DV Pal 720/576 (was shot on tape, 4:3 letterboxed), lower field/even which I am editing into a short 25 second sequence which needs to be 16:9 (as my final project will be that, and this footage/sequence is the only 4:3 one in the ten to be used).
The current sequence I have worked in is showing up as 25fps DVCPRO Pal 1280/720 also lower field/even and it is working OK (NO idea how!) except for the clips I am shrinking for a multiple screen section- they are shrunk to 45% and quite interlaced looking- meaning that I am seeing quite bad horizontal lines even in the playing back of the sequence, before export.
Notably one clip is FINE- it is different in that it has been "grown" to 180% because of the fact that it was 4:3 letterboxed and I needed it to appear 16:9. I see no interlacing/field order issue...
What do I need to do in order to "fix" this now that I have a gorgeous sequence and cannot export it to look like anything decent?
I feel I do NOT understand the settings I should set up for capture, working and export- I am just stabbing in the dark here. I guess a problem I have is that while I learn super fast when shown to do something I don't make the connection when reading manuals well. In other words- if it is not a response to an issue I have I cannot tell that it is the answer I seek. I am so despondent.
Ideally I would need to be able to fix the mess as the work I have done is long and hard (I am not really a bad editor- creative but clueless when it comes to setting things up right, it would seem!). Please and many, many thanks.

Thanks for that. It was a horrible blow as he had just been nominated for his first BAFTA and I was so hopeful that he would take me on as an apprentice...
OK- the issue will be one most students creating showreels will encountering as we don't tend to shoot ideal footage, on different cameras we don't "know", and certainly don't have a say about how it is ingested. So it is a case of doing the best we can with what we have.
I ended up dealing with it by using Compressor to "reconform" the footage I was using and to also use a 30%/45% scale-down of each of them and made a multi-clip collage of the material. The "problems" are almost lost in the scaling down, so I am OK with it.
Of course there is still the problem that if I move from the college's Avid system to my home set up of Final Cut Pro I get very annoying issues also with the Avid's exports (QT6) showing up as 5:4 instead of the 16:9 it was exported as!

HDV to DVD interlace field order - depends on export path!

Summary: Export... -> Using Compressor versus compressing an Export... -> QuickTime Movie file, produces different field orders in the resulting MPEG.
In Detail: Here is my HDV to DVD (MPEG2) process;
Create a DV sequence, and drop the HDV into it, it gets resized, and has a filter to shift the fields by +1 added to it, and is scaled to the correct size for 4:3 (letterboxed) or 16:9 (fills 720x480) - which is fine.
Set the Quicktime Video Compressor for the sequence to 'None', and set the Video Processing -> Motion Filtering Quality to 'Fastest (linear)' as I don't like what Normal or Best does to the image (makes it pixally, check in the canvas).
Now, if you Export -> Using Compressor, and setup a 2-pass mpeg 2 encode, you get a very good image, no via - DV artifacts. I also add the channel blur, set to 1 on all channels, if its too sharp - channel blur does not blur between fields, like flicker filter does, so the motion is not compromised, and looks excellent, but it stops sharp still images from flickering.
However, this is really slow, FCP is tied up, and for a 2 pass encode, any blur or colour filters get applied twice, its also harder to hand this off to a second machine to get on with.
So, logically, you would instead, Export... -> QuickTime Movie... -> Current Setting, Make Self Contained and then load that into Compressor, apply the SAME settings you did Using Compressor... At which point, the FUN begins.
I have finally narrowed down, that this changes the field order, although I nearly went mad discovering it - every time I thought my little 10 second test worked, (exported from the timeline) I would save the whole thing out and compress it, only to find, the interlace order changed, and now needed the field shift removed! And, because my little test worked, I would then do the whole thing, some 20+ hours later, only to find it was wrong!
Export... -> Using QuickTime Conversion... is the same as QuickTime Movie...
Anyone else with experience of this ? It was maddening! But I think I am over the worst of it now! Is there any solution for unifying this for all export methods ?
When it works DVD's encoded from HDV look amazing.
When it works.....
FCP 5.0.4
Compressor 2.0.1
PowerBook G4 Mac OS X (10.4.4)

Hi Ben,
Ignore the Apple-0 (zero) part - that's just the key shortcut for the sequence settings. (press the Apple Key, and a Zero key with a sequence selected)
So, from the top: (although I'm not in front of my machine right now, so this is from memory)
Create a new DV sequence, 4:3 or 16:9.
Drop the edited HDV sequence into the DV sequence.
De-select the HDV sequence in the DV time line, bring up the Sequence Settings Dialogue for the DV sequence. (make SURE it isn't the sequence setting dialogue for the HDV sequence)
In the sequence setting dialogue, change the codec from DV to None (note - not the same as Uncompressed). If it's currently HDV, you have the wrong sequence, leave it as HDV, close the dialogue, and bring up the setting for the DV sequence.
On the 'Video Processing' tab, for the DV sequence, set the 'Motion Filtering Quality' to 'Fastest (linear)'
Choose OK to close the settings dialogue.
If you want to, and it depends on your footage, add the following blur filter to the HDV sequence in the DV timeline:
Select the HDV sequence in the DV timeline, right click (or hold ctrl key, and click) on the HDV sequence in the DV timeline, and choose the top item in the pop-up menu, 'Open' (in viewer). Click the filters tab of the viewer, you will see the Shift Fields filter, set to +1, added by FCP, add the channel blur, above the shift fields filter. Set the blur to 1 on each channel. I prefer this to the Video -> Flicker Filter, as channel blur does not blur between fields, so it does not blur motion.
I discovered this by accident
Now Save, the following sometimes crashes FCP. Check it in the Canvas viewer, set to 100%, with the channel blur, around text and sharp contrast areas, you get a nice soft blur, turn off that filter if you think its too much.
On to the encoding:
The simplest step, is to choose the DV timeline, and export via compressor. Pick a 2 pass MPEG preset, that matches the 4:3 or 16:9 of the sequence, and submit. This takes a while, on slower machines.
The alternative, which can reduce the time, is to export the DV sequence as an uncompressed QuickTime file - this does not change the quality at all - but can speed things up, because FCP is quite slow at delivering frames to Compressor, compared to Compresser just reading the frame from an uncompressed file, Compresser has to read them twice for 2 pass MPEG encoding. However, you need a lot of fast disk space to store the uncompressed footage.
Hope this helps.
Keep the replies / mail on these boards, that way they stay useful to all!
It was great weekend in Vancouver, wasn't it ?
Hit the beach on Sunday, good times

Field order / interlacing problem

I convert my mpeg video source files using dropDV, then cut the clips in iMovie.
If I create a dvd using iDVD and watch it on my tv, there is a nasty shaking effect which is more visible when either the subject or the camera is moving.
Someone recently told me this problem might be caused by the field order being inverted.
Can anyone confirm this, or has anyone experienced similar problems?
Any suggestions how to overcome this problem?
(So far the only attempt that has not failed was when I exported to iPod .m4v from iMovie and used this file in iDVD... the problem was solved, but of course the resolution is much lower)
Thanks for your comments!
Peter
Mac OS X (10.4.7)

welcome Peter to the  board …
yepp, your discription sounds like a odd/uneven problem...
I'm not familiar with any prefs/settings in dropDV, but I onced solved simliar problems with the free tool JES Deinterlacer

HD-SD mpeg2 field order

Hi everyone,
I'm working on the HD show using ProRes(HQ) HD with Upper Field & need to make a SD dvd; so which field order am I need to choose?
Am I need to set the field to LOWER since it's SD? or just leave it at "same as source" which is upper field in the HD movie.
I know DVD can play progressive, but what if our source is upper field? any conflict w/NTSC spec?
thanks.
J

Upon further inspection (viewing the DVD on a CRT) it looks like the fields are ok after all.I wa seeing the fields in simulator, which is normal, but the field order looks correct on the final disc.
I am noticing one very strange effect on a clip that has been slowed down, however, where the fields seem to be getting interpreted in the wrong order, resulting in a back-and-forth motion. Again thie clip is interlaced SD in an HD sequence.

Totally confused about mixing videos with different field orders.

I have PPcs5 on the pc.
I edit for many different shooters. As such I get everything: Progressive, upper field , lower field . Not to mention from a zillion different cameras & different resolutions.
I output 95% so far to dvd ntsc, 5% BR.
I get dv tapes on some & HD files also.Many times I get a mixure of both on each job. Also Iphone HD files too. Going crazy trying to fiquer out how to set up my sequence when I have upper field or progressive by themselves & also when they are mixed with lower field dv foot...Do I force everything into a lower field seq if going to dvd?
Do I have to deinterlace anything?
If I drag a clip to the new "create seq" icon, it will match the clips properties but is that correct if its a progressive only project or an Upper field project going out to dvd ntsc?
Do I need to RT click on the clips in the project window & "interpet Footage" & force it into a lower field there 1st? Is there a difference between setting up a seq to be played on a progressive DVD player hdmi to a prog TV as apposed to setting up a seq for a non hdmi or non progressive tv?
Does outputting to dvd automatically force it to lower field ?
If my seq isnt set up correctly I notice a big interlace problem when the cams pan from side to side, especially when there are multiple cams with different field orders. Have been unable to find any good discussions or articles on the topic.
How do you guys do it without going crazzzzzzzy?Are there rules? What are the rules? A rule book would really help:-) I Yern for the old DVCAM/DV days:-)

DV is always lower and HD is upper or progressive.
As you are having all fields in one timeline i would make it progressive.
Premiere does a good job in deinterlacing.
Only use Interprete footage when the footage is interprete wrong.
Set up a progressive timeline and drop everything in it. If a clip does not behave correctly you can change fields in the Field Options.
Export from Premiere and import into Encore. That is what i would do......

Field Order/Dominance question

I've been noticing that spots I've produced that air on my local cable network appear to be having problems with jerky movement of elements created in Motion. I thought that maybe the field order was set wrong on my Motion projects. (I should add that I'm doing "the big no-no" by only monitoring these on my computer and not on a TV monitor. I know, I'll have to remedy that someday.) Anyway, I'm using the "NTSC Broadcast SD" preset and that means field order is lower/even. I'm definitely rendering these out with field rendering on (Apple ProRes, btw) as I can see the interlace combing when viewing the output file.
I thought I'd try an experiment by creating a Motion project that would expose interlacing problems in the worst way and then render it out of Motion three ways: lower, upper and none. I then encoded these to mpeg-2 using Squeeze and burned them to a DVD (in DVDSP) to view on my consumer DVD player and SD television. (Remember, that's the only way I can view them played back interlaced...) To my surprise both the upper and lower movies looked terrible and the one rendered with no field dominance looked the best.
What gives? Any ideas? Does this seem right?
Thanks!
--Kurt Cowling

Wow Iain, you know waaaay more about this than I do. In fact, I asked a question in the iDVD area of this board many moons ago regarding whether or not there was some sort of metadata or tag that let iDVD know if the incoming file was interlaced or progressive and the response was basically "I don't know for sure, but I don't think so".
Anyway, I can confirm what you say regarding the output of ProRes files. The content is interlaced, but when clicking the deinterlace button in the advanced area of QuickTime player nothing happens.
I tried as you suggested and opened the "Advanced..." area of the output settings in Motion and found that interlace was indeed not checked in the ProRes settings. When I output a file after checking that box I can also confirm that the deinterlace button in QT player did actually deinterlace the display of the file.
I normally output my Motion projects in several layers and bring them back into FCP (as rendered video, not Motion files) to composite them with the underlying camera footage. (Makes later changes and updates easier to deal with for my workflow.) I then export the composite out of FCP as uncompressed SD and then proceed to encode for FTP delivery from there (usually H.264). I opened a recent uncompressed file that was output from FCP and found that it suffered from the same problem, namely that the file was not tagged as interlaced, even though the content was interlaced.
I then opened one of the H.264 files that was encoded from the uncompressed master. Same issue again.
The one thing I haven't tried (yet) is outputting my test project from Motion as described in my first post (but with the files tagged correctly this time!) and see if the DVD that gets burned plays correctly. I will try this in the next day or two.
I don't know what happens to my files after I FTP them to the cable provider, but I assume they must transcode them from H.264 into their system. If the files aren't tagged as interlaced then their system is probably treating them incorrectly, as well.
This brings me to the final question(s) that may solve all of this for me:
Is there a way to change just the metadata/tag in an existing QuickTime file (so that it is tagged correctly as interlaced) without having to re-render from the beginning? Also, It appears that FCP may suffer from the same issue since it obviously uses QT to export, just like Motion. If I correctly tag a file rendered from Motion and then import it into FCP and FCP doesn't then pass the correct tag on output to uncompressed I still have the same problem. Or, if FCP tags the uncompressed file correctly, but QT doesn't pass this along to the H.264, I'm still screwed. Hence, my question at the top of this paragraph! I think I really only need the last file I handle before FTPing to have the correct tag, since the content has been fine all along.
Thanks so much Iain for looking into this! I would never have found this on my own. I'm not exactly sure if this is a bug or just a bad implementation, but this seems like a bad oversight for sure and not something that could be figured out from reading the manual.
--Kurt
p.s. I will try some more experimenting with this and hopefully can come back and marked this thread as "question answered" since a workaround seems doable. Iain, would you be willing to submit this to Apple as a bug report? You seem to have a much better handle on this than I do.

Need to setup Premiere CS6 sequence for two file types with different field orders

I have a client who has shot video for me using two cameras, one camera was set to progressive, and the other to interlaced upper field first. I need to use both file types in the edit and have been struggling to set up the sequence to get the best look for the end product, a DVD. I have several videos to do for her that were all shot in the same way, so I need a solution!
I would appreciate help figuring out how to set up this work flow from beginning to end.
Should I convert one of the files from the beginning so they match field orders before going into a sequence? Or do I just need to do some adjusting of the files once they are in the sequence? Is it just as simple as changing the transcode settings to favor the upper field first? I'm definitely having issues once the video is transcoded in Encore and you can see a lot of jagged edges and lines especially during movement. My client isn't happy and I've tried several workarounds, but to no avail.
Here are the two file types I have:
File extension: .MOV
H.264, 1920x1080, Linear PCM, 16 bit little-endian signed integer, 48000 Hz, stereo
FPS 29.97
No Fields: Progressive Scan
File extension: .MTS (my Mac finder can't read these files, but they are read in Premiere)
Image Size: 1920 x 1080
Frame Rate: 29.97
Source Audio Format: 48000 Hz - compressed - 6 channels
Pixel Aspect Ratio: 1.0
Upper Field First
I am using Adobe Premiere CS 6.0.2
Encore 6.0.1
Media Encoder 6.0.2.81
I am running it on an iMac 27-inch, Mid 2011
with Mac OS X Lion 10.7.5
Processor 3.4 GHz Intel Core i7
Graphics AMD Radeon HD 6970M 1024 MB
I've just been setting the sequence to match the .MOV files since they look much better than the .MTS files. I've done the opposite as well, setting the sequence to match the .MTS files and it doesn't seem to help. I've also changed the field order of the files once they are in the sequence by changing the field options and have tried converting the .MTS files in the Media Encoder, but nothing I've done has worked.
Any help would be so appreciated! The client I have is a photographer, so she wasn't aware of this issue when she first shot these videos. So I have 10 videos with these issues I need to get back to her, hopefully issue free! I'm struggling as an editor because my last job I was using FCP and was working with videographers who knew what they were doing, so I've never faced such problems before. Plus I'm new to the Adobe software. Not a good combination. Please forgive me if I didn't give all the information you need. I will happily respond with whatever more information you may need to help me out!
~KTrouper

I wonder if you could do your edit ignoring any visual issues of the interlaced footage but keeping the different sources separate ( checkerboard edit Vid 1/ Vid 2 )
Lock it down then export the interlaced part of the edit as a Digital Intermediate.
Maybe Export the other source as well to the same codec. DI
Bring them back together in a New Sequence. You wold have to deal with the black spacing.

Field Order -Progressive, Upper or Lower? (Interlacing?)

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