Frame rate conversion distorting footage. Help!

Hi,
I use a canon zr850 to shoot and edit with iMovie. I'm stuck at 15fps with the canon and I'm getting horizontal lines of the frames in my iDVD movies. I think this is because of the frame rate conversion. Here are some screen shots...
This is what the frame should look like according to quick time player (smooth, no horizontal lines):
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1126/1409952255bbdc9441e4o.png
This is what I get after burning to DVD using iDVD:
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1062/14099529376759f15e6bo.png
Yeah, the original is 16:9 and the iDVD pic isn't displayed right. ...doesn't matter. It happens in my 4:3 movies too.

Can you eleborate on that? I have a similar problem. I export from Final Cut HD to Quicktime and the footage looks fine. But when I import into iDVD, I get the same horizontal lines.
What part of the process did you change to get rid of the lines?

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Frame rate conversion problem

I need to edit a Keynote presentation into some footage of a workshop. The workshop footage is h.264 from a Sanyo camcorder that I've transcoded into Apple Intermediate Codec at 29.97fps. The Keynote presentation is a ProfCast recording made during the workshop, so the two should be in sync. I'd like to combine the two into a multiclip and switch from one to the other. But the Profcast recording is 30fps and FCP won't let me make a multiclip because the clips have a different frame rate. I've tried to export the Profcast to 29.97 in QTP but it always comes out as 30fps,
How can I translate the Profcast footage from 30fps to 29.97?
Ralph

You have mentioned DVD and now 24p Broadcast.
"I trust this more than letting FCP's rendering engine do the frame rate conversion."
Somewhere this will happen.
I don't know of any broadcasting in 24p?
If someone knows please set me straight. If you're outputting for broadcast it most likely will be (HD Cam) 60i or 50i.
I do understand a lighter load for Compressor (20%) and that is logical.
As far I know 24p is just for a film out.
I do hope you find the answer to your questions and report back as to what works for you and how you delivered this project.
Good Luck
Z1

Frame rate conversions with DVCPROHD

Where can I get a decent, straight forward answers to questions on capturing HD material via Kona onto my FCP. I am mostly interested in frame rate conversion methods when capturing from AJ-HD1200A Panasonic deck via BNC. I have searched the web and have found limited answers. Apples pdf on DVCPROHD frame rate conversions do not address many glitches that pop up.
Is there a web source on this. I'm not looking for a technical book or manual.
I just need simple answers if possible.
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So...
Is there a procedure to follow on the process of frame rate conversions, either with compressor or Natress, which I dont have btw.
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Frame Rate Conversions Nightmare!

Hello Everyone. I'm in a pickle! I have multiple formats and frame rates that I am trying to combine into one project. I have at my disposal an HDW-f500 HDCAM deck and a Kona LHE card. I have projects that include PAL SD, HDV 1080i60, Apple HDV 1080i50, HDV 720p24, and ProRes 1920 1080, and XDCAM 720p24.
This is a global project that I have been charged with combining into one output. I don't know what the final output has to be, but I am looking at moving toward HDCAM 23.98psf. But, if anyone has a contrary suggestion, I am open to it.
So, what is the workflow here? Can I spit each to tape at their respective framerates and then reacapture them all use the Kona LHE to 23.98 ProRes HD? If so, what is the setup required. I am nearly at the end of my rope with this. Any and all help is greatly appreciated

HOLY COW....what a mess! I certainly don't envy you in this task.
You have the wrong capture card for the task. The Kona LHe captures analog, but won't convert 720p to 1080, or 1080 to 720...nor upconvert SD to HD. Only the Kona 3 can do that. But it cannot do any frame rate conversion...no 29.97 to 23.98.
With the Kona 3 I capture at the native rate, then either use Compressor to convert (29.97 to 23.98), or Cinema tools to conform (25 to 23.98). And I capture everything to the SAME codec...DVCPRO HD or ProRes.
Gotta get a Kona 3.
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Frame rate conversion?

Hello,
I need to do a frame rate conversion and interlace of 24P to 29.97 interlaced for inclusion into A 29.97 timeline.
I'm on Win 7 and CS6.
Is any plugin required with CS6?
Or, can After Effects do it alone?
If a plugin is required, what is the best one for quality?
Or what stand-alone utility is most highly recommended? I thought I'd read on a Google search that Twixtor or "Magic Bullet" by Red Giant. I just spoke to Red Giant and they said they have nothing that does this.
Thanks!
wsmith

Thanks, Jim.
I've heard this is now possible. I guess I'll do this in Premiere if it comes to that. The actual editor is on FCPX and resides in Stokholm, while I'm here in the U.S.
I've been told that FCPX can also just conform it as well as a Premiere CS6 can. True?
For some reason they are having a audio sync issue with audio which was recorded externally, at 29.97fps.
That editor is not a pro and I'm tentatively under the assumption that problem section of the timeline is related to one camera out of two, which was recording in 24P when it should have been set to 29.97.
The timeline has all video and all externally recorded audio in 29.97, except for a one section of video that is 24P.
I think their problem is loss of sync between that 24P section of video and the corresponding 29.97 external audio.
Is it possible that even if FCPX properly conforms the 24P camera section to 29.97 properly, there could still be a loss of sync the corresponding external audio for that section?
That's the only plausible reason I can think of currently. That's why I'm thinking that a conversion before importing into the program may be the correction needed
In other words, is video that is automatically conformed to a timeline's settings going to sync with externally recorded audio that already matches the timeline settings?
Thanks!
wsmith

DVCPRO HD Frame Rate Conversion add noise

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Sorry, but I do this a lot and I can't say that I have seen this issue.
What version of QT are you running? What OS?
Since all FCP is doing is transferring frame for frame making 60 frames into 24...data copying with no recompression, I don't see how the lens could be the issue. Step thru the 60fps frame by frame, then the same frames on the 24p footage...see if the distortion is the same. with the 60fps it goes by so fast you might not be seeing it.
Shane

Poor Result using Panasonic Frame Rate Converter. Please Help!

Hey All,
Myself and a crew of other university filmmakers shot some footage at 720P and 60 FPS on the Panasonic HVX-100 with the hopes of converting it to 24fps for smooth slow motion. We are using FCP 5.1.2 and the panasonic DVCPROHD Frame Rate Converter Tool. I am almost certain I am using the correct workflow for this, but the result yields footage that seems to be at the right speed, but is very jumpy, as if its only playing every 4th frame or so. I tried exporting the footage off the timeline as well to check and make sure it wasnt a playback problem, and it wasnt. It appears as if the converter is working incorrectly. This slow motion is vital for our project and I'm at my wits end trying to figure it out. Any help?

Ok. I tried converting making sure that i didnt remove any frames on the import from the raw P2, as well as for the export. i tried all the combos of this. I still get the jumpy slow motion because of repeatyed frames. I did notice a combo in these repeated frames, it will play 3 of one frame, then 2 of another. could this be a pulldown problem somewhere?
could you guys outline the settings you use to import (capture and editing timebases) as well as to edit on, and to process slow motin. I just want to make sure im not missing anything.
The help is SO awesome. thanks for trying to work through this with me.

Frame Rate Conversion Question...

I have a bit of a mess here. I shot a film on the Canon XL2 at 24p. I digitized the footage in my old Avid system as a 23.976fps project and edited the entire movie. When I burned the movie to disk it had all kinds of skipping problems with the image. I wasn't sure what I had done wrong because if you shoot at 24p it should have been fine as a 23.976 project in Avid. But the XL2 apparently records at 23.976 fps, while inserting 6 frames every second to create a 30fps master tape. So I was supposed to import the footage into a 30i project. I've subsequently shot a short on the XL2 and digitized it at 30i and it turned out fine.
So here's my question. I have since switched over to FCP and I know with Automatic Duck I can convert the project from an Avid to a FCP project. However, I'm still going to have the frame rate problem. Does anyone know what my options are here? Is it possible to create a 30i project, bring in the 23.976 sequence and recapture the footage at the correct frame rate?

I have since switched over to FCP and I know with Automatic Duck I can convert the project from an Avid to a FCP project.
Automatic Duck doesn't do project conversions. Only sequence conversions. It won't do all the media, or bins. Only the media in a sequence.
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With Canon XF100, canfootage shot at a higher bit/frame rate than other footage be edited together?

If you start recording footage at the highest quality bit/frame rate for a project, then realize it's going to take forever to render and eat up a lot of space, can that footage be edited with footage shot at a lower bit/frame rate? Or will there be an obvious difference in quality? Trying to decide if it's best to switch rates now...
What would the best bit/frame rate setting be to shoot high-definition footage?
Thanks!

Were you shooting on the Panasonic HVX-200 onto P2 cards in 720pn mode?
Yes, that's correct.
you should still make a DVD and watch the movie on a TV
I will do that; thanks for the advice.
if you are having these problems on your computer, there's always a chance that your client will have problems showing the file on the unknown computers
That has been a big part of my cause for concern. My friend (the one I'm working with on this project, who owns the equipment we're using) would prefer to burn it to a Blu-ray disc, but unfortunately we don't have access to a Blu-ray burner. So I'm thinking we should provide it as both a DVD and as a QuickTime file, to cover as many bases as possible.
Thanks again for your patience with novice questions. I've looked for books on these kinds of things, but everything I've found seems to either be written at the extreme beginner level ("this is how you upload video onto your computer"), or the extreme advanced level. Perhaps I haven't been looking in the right places; if you can suggest some good reading materials on this kind of thing, that would be great.

Frame rate Conversion Upon Import

Hello All,
Strange things in my FCP Studio. I converted an mkv file to Prores422 frame rate 23.976 using QT 7. When I import it the Vid rate says its at 10fps???? The info tab in quicktime says the frame rate is 23.976. Then it makes me render???
Also, I should be able to mix prores422 and prores422(HQ) in the same sequence without having to render,(assuming my sequence settings are correct?) Thanks in advance.
JY

Files converted from non-camera masters sometimes need a hit on the side. use CINEMA TOOLS to CONFORM the footage to 24. That'll do it.

Can I disable the audio pitch adjustment when using frame rate conversion?

We have a mov file containing digitized film material with audio scanned at 25 fps (1 frame film for 1 frame video) while the film should be 18 fps.
So both video and audio are too fast.
Compressor provides the framerate conversion so source plays at x frames per second.
This works well for video but the audio slowed down remains the pitch it has in the original speed. A great feature but an unwanted result in this case.
Audio should be at a lower pitch since it was recorded too fast.
Can we disable the pitch adjustment, when using rate conversion, so the pitch is corrected (lower) as well?

Hi Jason
This does sound tricky - the only other suggestion that I can add to David's is to use the smallest GOP setting you can, I'm in PAL land so the default is 12frames but I push it down to 7, this forces more I-frames into your mpeg. It makes the file size higher but in a project your length it doesn't matter. Make sure you encode your audio to .ac3 (use the Dolby 2.0 preset in compressor). Although David's limit is 7.4, if I'm not playing back on a laptop I'll set my CBR to 8Mbps (in Compressor CBR is called 'one-pass').
Once you create your mpeg, play it back in Quicktime first to make sure there are no artifacts full screen (with Simulators reduced size sometimes artifacts exist in your orig mpeg that you may not notice).
Also as David said, DVDSP doesn't re-encode an existing mpeg so something else must be going on. Before you re-import your new mpeg, delete your DVDSP prefs and any menu mpegs that it has created.
If you have Toast, try just doing a Build, instead of Build & Format. This will give a VIDEO_TS folder that you can then burn in Toast. Use the Data tab and select DVD-ROM/UDF.
If this doesn't work I don't know what will.
Good luck!
B

Frame Rate Issue With Footage Shot on HVX

I just shot something using the HVX and the 100Gb Firestore. The assistant cameraman set the firestore to make quicktime files to be brought into Final Cut. We shot most of our footage at high frame rates. When we watched already shot files through the camera's LCD screen, things appear in slow motion. However, when I bring the quicktime files into Final Cut, they play at normal speed. How do I convert the frame rate to what we shot at? Is there some import tool that does this automatically?

Use the same tool I recommended to this guy, the DVCPRO HD FRAMERATE CONVERTER:
http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=1437829&tstart=0
See if the tutorial link works for you.
Shane

Frame rate conversion HELP

Is it true there is no way to SUCCESSFULLY apply pulldown to 24pNative footage (shot with the HVX-200 on P2 cards) OTHER than laying it to tape? I'm told it's the video card that's doing the pulldown and there's no way pulldown can be done within FCP/Cinema Tools/Compressor. What I'm trying to do is convert my DVCPRO 50 23.98 quicktimes to DVCPRO 50 29.97
I just can't come to terms with the idea that the only way I can work in a 29.97 timeline is by dumping all my 24pNative footage to tape and re-digitizing. Of course you can drop a 24pNative clip into a 29.97 timeline and render it and FCP will "pull it down" so to speak by adding duplicate frames but of course it isn't correct, nor does it look correct.

Hey Shane,
Thanks for all the help so far, very much appreciated.
THE WHOLE STORY with a happy happy ending
- shot a music vid with the HVX-200 and the mini-35 adaptor (with SLR lenses) in DVCPRO HD 720pN mode. Planned to deliver the video in standard def.
- Chose HD 720pN recording because a) wanted to be able to have the option to deliver an HD version if ever desired b) wanted to be able to use the HVX's undercranking and overcranking abilities only available in 720p mode (which look amazing and can be played back on set real time, I'm still to this day impressed by that), 3x the recording time on a P2 card at 720p 24pN versus recording DVCPRO 50 24p, and finally wanted my VFX/compositor guy to be able to work with highest res images possible (i.e. do his work with the HD dailies and deliver me HD and SD versions of the completed VFX shots ). And yep, in order to deliver an HD version of the video I would have to do a match back edit with my HD dailies and HD VFX shots but that really doesn't take too long for a 180 second show.
- Chose to work in and deliver SD because it's all my offline rig is capable of outputting (i.e. no HD client monitor, just my NTSC CRT). I know some people who cut their music vids (shot in DVCPRO HD 24p 720p/1080i who are still going to deliver standard def as it's still the requirement up here in Canada with our MTV equivalent station Much Music) without ever actually seeing what their show looks like on a client monitor (i.e. an NTSC or HD televsion) until they take their locked picture to the online suite and only then do they get to see it on a TV...in a room that costs $500-$1000 an hour (i.e. they do this cuz like me, they don't have a high end video card or HD televsion). I just don't think it's wise to not see what your video actually looks like on an NTSC monitor (for all the obvious and not so obvious reasons I'm too lazy to list and you already know), hence why I downconvert my HD dailies at the offline stage (instead of downconverting my locked/color corrected HD timeline at the online stage) so I can actually see what my video looks like on an NTSC monitor (i.e. the medium it will broadcasted in) as I edit it.
- Because I shot some DV footage with the HVX-200 (emergency shooting only remember) I know needed to work with DVCPRO 50 23.98 and DV 30p in my FCP project. After coming to the conclusion I had no way of getting my DVCPRO 50 23.98 (downconverted from my DVCPRO HD 24pN remember) into a 29.97 timline, unless I laid it to tape (popular belief at the time), I unfortunately chose to upconvert my DV 30p to DVCPRO 50 30p and then reverse telecine it (pulling out frames from orignal 30fps source material, i.e. resulting in a slightly choppy look when played back) in order to work entirely in a DVCPRO 50 23.98 timeline. Another editor agreed that unless I wanted to lay my 23.98 footage to tape (the HD quicktimes or the SD downcoverted quicktimes) I should just make my 30p material 23.98 by reverse telecining in either cinema tools or a program he suggested called DVFilm Maker. I checked out DVFilm Maker, looked pretty mickey mouse to be honest and just reverse telecined in cinema tools.
- So, Mr. Shane, after I read your post that you were looking into what compressor can do, I thought it'd be worth a double check if DVFilm Maker could turn 23.98 to 29.97 and LOOOONG BEHOLD (wipe my eyes) it has a catagory called "Post-Edit Processing" that offers the feature "Convert 24P/23.976P to 3:2 NTSC". I quickly double checked my HVX-200 manual and sure enough, 24pNative mode records the "active a.k.a. effective" frames in the 3:2 pulldown process giving you true 24fps, so surely it could be REVERSE-reverse-telecined (also referred to as "pulldown" I guess). And it bloody well can. No recompression, no visible damage what so ever, just adds 3:2 pulldown and creates a duplicate 29.97 quicktime.
All my footage (whether it was HD 23.98 or DV 30p) is now DVCPRO 50 29.97 and can be edited without loss of quality (other than it being SD which was intended for now).
And it just occured to me, if you wanna save hardrive/P2 card space while in the field, why not shoot 24pN and then pull it down in post? (that was probably a loaded question that will generate a lot of responses entitled "Actually, you idiot..." but whatev. I'm so relieved at the moment that NO sacrifices have to be made. But I'll be damned if I didn't need 5x times the hard drive space than I should of for this little music video (i.e. all the original dailies in their original codecs HD/SD, and the duplicate sets of upconverted/downconverted dailies).
Goooodnight.

Edit to tape with frame rate conversion

Hi,
I'm outputting a 23.976 sequence directly onto a 29.97 drop frame HDCAM SR tape. Seems to work fine, the 3:2 pulldown is there, timecode is OK. Since this project is to be delivered for a national television network, I'd like to know about any possible flaw in this workflow. I know I will have trouble matching timecodes if I want to make inserts on tape but apart from that...? Any thoughts about how reliable this workflow is?
Thanks!

Using a capture card no doubt, right?
I've done this more than a few times. I can even insert edit when I need to. Didn't have an issue. Because the IN point in FCP is set, and the IN point on the tape is set. And the card handles the duration conversion.
Darn reliable. I only had one hiccup in 24 outputs.
Shane

After Effects CC import "Sequence Footage" frame rate settings in "Import" preferences

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Hi Tim,
WOW! Thanks for the super-fast reply! As soon as I posted this I realised I should have mentioned that I am importing DPX files. I do import quicktimes as well but know that the footage import does not apply to a single file, only a sequence of files. But I still wonder if I may be either doing something wrong or am just a little confused. I have been using After Effects since CS3 doing compositing for film and I always use DPX sequences. I did a bunch of comparing and back and forth with AE CS6 and AECC while trying to figure this out. I always set my preferences up when I upgrade before I start working and I always set them up the same. I have been using CS6 since last July and it still works the same. What I did is imported five or six different DPX sequences, some were rendered out as 24 fps, some at 30 and some at 23.976. Assuming AE looks at the metadata to decide how to auto interpret, AE CC opened them all at their native frame rates of the just mentioned 24, 30 and 23.976 respectively, even though I told it to import at 24fps in the preferences. I also imported the same files in AE CS6 and they all opened at 24 fps like always. I know I can change the frame rate in the "Interpret footage" option, that is what I have been doing today so that I can work with footage in 24fps but since I have it set in the preferences to import image sequences at 24fps, I am perplexed as to why it does not do so, so I do not have to interpret the footage to my preferred frame rate, as is the case in AE CS6 as well as it was in CS 5.5 and CS 3. Since I was lucky enough to have an Adobe employee chime in Tim, I would be curious to see what you may find if you recreated this scenario. Would it be possible for you or someone at Adobe to set the sequence footage import frame rate to 24 fps in the preferences then try to open a piece of footage that is natively 23.976 fps in both AE CS6 and AE CC? Like I said, I certainly beleive I may be doing something wrong but I would be very curious to see what you find on your side. I would not be suprised if it imported at 24 fps in AE CS6 and 23.976 fps in AE CC.

Frame rate conversion distorting footage. Help!

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