From client/server forms 6i to ... what?

I'm a developer who comes from the world of client/server oracle forms 6 vs Oracle 8i database, so I feel a bit lost in this web and 10g mess (maybe the mess was the prior 6i).
I'm stuck manteining an application in that architecture, but I'd like to reach for the state of the art in oracle, so I downloaded and installed this xe edition (which was surprisingly easy!) for redhat.
Now I would like to know where to go next, and this step I suppose is to try to generate a form and make it run against this new database. Here come my questions:
1. Is it possible to run forms against 10g xe? What do I have to install for this forms being served via web? Do they have to be generated with developer suite 10g?
2. Why isn't there options in the apex admin system for creating tablespaces and datafiles? Is this version limitated to the default USERS tablespace?
3. This one is more ... phillosophical: Are oracle forms and reports a technology which is "endangered" in front of java or others? Would you recommend me not to keep going with forms and reports as my future development tools?
PD: I apologize for the possible offtopic and also for my english.

Forms Client/Server is out of support, and pretty much dead.
Forms via an Application Server is alive and Oracle's position is that it isn't going away but will get more integrated with Java. However the general view is it isn't a technology that people are using to build new applications.
Java/ADF Faces/JSF/JDeveloper is one of the approaches for front end application building.
Application Express (Apex) is another.
They each have advantages and disadvantages, and what the job market will be like for those skill sets is debatable (though obviously Apex is purely an oracle skillset)

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Calling Web Form from Client-Server Form

Hi. I have an existing Client-Server Form (6i) still in production that needs to call a Web Form and pass it a parameter. Obviously I can't use Call Form or New Form from the client-server version, but can I somehow issue a command line (including a parameter) that opens the Web Form? Any suggestions for accomplishing this?
I can create a command line like this, but have no idea how to pass a parameter to my Web Form. The Web Form named participants which has a Parameter defined named 'p_participant'.
*"C:\Program Files\Internet Explorer\iexplore.exe" http://9.35.32.206:7777/forms/frmservlet?form=participants*
I can also create a command line to open a web form like this to:
*"C:\Program Files\Internet Explorer\iexplore.exe" http://9.35.32.205:7777/forms/html/sas2.htm*
Where the sas2.htm looks like this:
*<html>*
*<body onload="document.menulaunch.submit();">*
Launching File Generation...
If the application does not load in 30 seconds then click the button below:
*<form name=menulaunch action=http://9.35.32.205:7777/forms/frmservlet?config=FileGeneration method=post>*
*<script>*
var wshshell=new ActiveXObject("wscript.shell");
var username=wshshell.ExpandEnvironmentStrings("%orauser%");
var pw=wshshell.ExpandEnvironmentStrings("%orapass%");
document.write("<input type=hidden name=userid value="+username+"/"+pw+"@sparc20*>")*
*</script>*
*<input type=submit value=Launch>*
*</form>*
*</body>*
*</html>*
Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Edited by: Buechler on Apr 8, 2009 8:58 AM

Simply add to your URL as follows:
http://9.35.32.206:7777/forms/frmservlet?form=participants&otherparams=p_participant=<SOME VALUE>I assume you plan to use HOST to make this call. I would recommend something like this:
HOST ('cmd /c start iexplore.exe "http://9.35.32.206:7777/forms/frmservlet?form=participants&otherparams=p_participant=<SOME VALUE>"');

Run a report in reports server calling it from a client/server form

How can I run a report in reports server calling it from a client/server form ?
Thanks

In client server mode you can use RUN_PRODUCT built-in. Lookup help for this built-in for more details.
Best of luck!

Client\server Forms

Oracle Forms6i in a client\server environment is a great product that still works very well for us. We do not need (or want) a web-based solution. Our system only needs to support our in-house users (about 400 currently).
I am very disappointed in the direction that Oracle is forcing us to go (web-based) if we want to stay with the Oracle tools that we know well. This isn't so much a request for help, it's more an attempt to communicate to the Oracle Forms manager(s) that going away from client\server is very disappointing to us and looks to be a bad business decision.

Mark,
I must appologize, but I though that things are easier to search and find on this forum. I tried for half an hour but wasn't able to spot the main thread ;-(
The summary of it is that there was a big discussion on this forum after Oracle announced its desupport date for Forms and Reports client/server (sometime in July if I remember well). Along with this desupport date there was a discussion whether or not Oracle Forms supports XP. The initial decision of not supporting XP was reverted and XP now is supported since patch 13.
For client/server the desupport date is January 1st 2005 for error correction and January 1st 2008 for extended assistance support. Thus Forms6i client/server will be around until end of 2007.
Most discussions on this forum were about the cost going with moving Forms to the Web, especially keeping in mind that client/server runtime was for free.
Another issue was the size of the Oracle9iAS installation which is 6GB all in all though Forms users may not use all the Oracle Application Server components.
Last but not least, many customers didn't feel ready to move their applications to the Web in this period of time, especially those that run character mode applications.
The installation issue gets fixed with the upcoming Oracle Application Server 10g which has a installation option that only installs the software required to run Forms and Reports.
The migration is assisted by a Forms Migration Assistant in Forms9i as well as material that we compiled and published on OTN. The WebUtil library finally was developed to close the gap between client/server functionality and teh Web functionality.
I can't talk about pricing, because this is not in the scope of my professional work, but OTN offered a special upgrade promotion for Forms users when moving their applications to teh Web.
Client/server as it is in Forms6i will not come back, this is how it seems.
There have been discussions on this forum if one could simulate client/server using the Forms Web components installed on a local client. Webstart was mentioned as one possible solution as it would allow you to have Forms applications started and run from an icon on the user desktop. Currently there are some investigations in Forms development going into this direction.
The majority of customers that posted their opinion on the client/server desupport did not like the client/server desupport plan at all.
The OTN forum postings where brought to Oracle senior management attention by Forms Product Managers monitoring this list.
The benefit of a Web only version of Forms - and you may disagree - is integration with the J2EE stack Oracle has within Oracle9iAS and OracleAS 10g.
J2EE is a technology that more and more customers evaluate for future development efforts. Having Forms integrating with J2EE applications(as seamlessly as possible)is the best way to make sure that Forms users can leverage their investment in the Forms technology. Even more, you can extend Forms applications with J2EE or have it communicating with it (the same applies to Reports)
Many new features that we implemented in Forms6i and Forms9i worked on the Web only (SSO, Enterprise Manager monitoring, client side Java etc).
Mark, hope that this summary gives you a good idea of what the discussions were about and that we do care of what customers do with Forms.
Just in case that I missed an argument or presented it too positive (my memory is subjective and not perfect), I am sure that the forum members which already contributed to this posting will add additional comments. Others may join in too.
Frank

Distributing client/server forms app

Hi
I am distributing a client/server forms/reports app that calls stored database procedures.
Does anyone have information on best-practice for version-control/distribution of upgrades etc? What is a good model to follow? At the moment I am using CVS but it is getting very complicated knowing which client has which version of a form/report/procedure
All input appreciated
Jim

Thanks Damisetty,
How have you handled when installing in different versions of Windows, i.e. if you prepare the installation on Windows 2000 does it work for installing on Windows XP or the other way around?
Besides the technical issue, there is the licensing issue, have you used this method for customers that just buy the DB, without forms?
Could any of the Oracle folks throw some light on the subject?
Regards.

Convert client/server form into portal

Is it possible to convert an client/server form developed in Forms 6i into Portal form

Partha,
Sorry, there is no such utility exists at the moment.
Thanks,
Dmitry
null

Authentication in Client/Server form Application

Hi
My client/server application is not using oracle authentiacation, I have maintained user table from that user is authenticated, but any user logins in a application it uses same oracle username/PWD which I currently hardcoded in a forms 6i (C/S type on logon event) application.
My client is located in different geographicaly location, when I change oracle database password I need to compile client application and diployed it again.
Is there any way that I can avoid this. I don't want to give database Un/Pwd to any client user. He only have application username and password.
Thanks
Sudarshan

Hello,
While installing developer you can select components to
Install, Options listed are Forms runtime and Reports runtime.
and it will make your work done.
Adi

When is client/server forms finished?

Which is last database, where is possible run forms with client/server architecture? Of cource with guarantee ORACLE.
We have forms version 6 in client/server, who are running on database 9.2i and we need move to database 10g.
Thanks...

user12240408 wrote:
Unfortunatelly forum doesn't solve my question. There are answers for solution with forms *6i* , but we have developed forms *6* only for client/server architecture.So if you are unable to search the answer, then you can create a new post in forms forum with your question. If someone has the answer, you will get some reply.
You can also find the forms form here under category "Developer Tools"
http://forums.oracle.com/forums/main.jspa?categoryID=84
Hope this helps.

Invoking UNIX executables from client side forms

Has anyone had any success invoking UNIX executables from forms without using "hosted" rsh and/or rcp commands? There are too many of these UNIX executables to convert to PL/SQL procedures. Have developed a technique using dbms_pipe package but requires a daemon on UNIX side. Any thoughts or sugesstions? Thanks.

I have done alot of this and the only way that I know of is using dbms_pipe. It looks alot harder than it really is. Also you may want to look at using Forms Server on your database server. I know that you can use the host command, which if running on your database server will send the command to your unix server.

Distributing runtime client/server forms?

I know C/S forms is not supported any more, but C/S forms runtime doesn't require a client license and that is still an advantage.
I want to know if there is some way to create an installation package, that could be distributed to customers and included the forms/reports runtime along the application forms/reports executables, so the customers don't have to buy a forms license.
Thanks in advance.

Thanks Damisetty,
How have you handled when installing in different versions of Windows, i.e. if you prepare the installation on Windows 2000 does it work for installing on Windows XP or the other way around?
Besides the technical issue, there is the licensing issue, have you used this method for customers that just buy the DB, without forms?
Could any of the Oracle folks throw some light on the subject?
Regards.

Creating a hyperlink in Forms 6i Client Server

I need to create a link to a webpage from a 6i Client Server Form. I would also like not to have to specify a certain browser. Some people using this may have IE and others Netscape.
Any ideas?

I don't know if this is exactly what you're looking for but see the hyperLink java bean http://otn.oracle.com/products/forms/

WARNING - Oracle intends to desupport Forms client server mode

When Forms 6i becomes desupported you will have to move to Forms 9i. Forms 9i runtime can only be run in web mode from a web browser. You will not be able to run client-server forms in native operating systems such as Windows or Unix. The forms will essentially run on the application server with Java applets to being sent to your web browser. Links to third party products will no longer work with host commands executing on your local machine. You will have to include Java code to make local commands work.
The transition from Forms 6i client-server to Forms 9i web mode will be one of the most painful upgrades Oracle has ever inflicted on its customers.
Essentially, Oracle is trying to palm us off with running forms from web browsers whether we or our customers like it or not. Java seems to be creeping in. I suspect Developer will eventually turn into JDeveloper, as they will not want to support two products. Easy one line statements and built-ins will be replaced by hundreds of lines of Java nonsense. Developer will move from a 4GL RAD environment to a cumbersome bloated 3GL Java environment.
You can stop this happening if you want to keep you customers happy by:
1. Sending Oracle enhancement requests to allow Forms 9i to run in native client-server mode.
2. Complaining to your Oracle sales contact.
3. Asking difficult questions at Oracle user groups.

Duncan et al.,
I've been wondering why exactly a Forms9i app. needs to run in a web page? Why could the applet not be deployed in a more "standalone" fashion, i.e., an independent application window. This would at least offer the appearance of a native application, complete with the new Java look-and-feel.
If Oracle really wanted make their customers happy, they would then take the next step and come up with a way to embed OC4J into a client-side deployment executable, which would then effectively allow for a 2-tier client-server architecture.
It seems to me that 2-tier/3-tier each have their place in the world, depending on the situation. In the extreme "2-tier" example would be an application that is to be deployed on a single client workstation. It would be hard to argue that a separate application server ought to be used. On the other extreme, anybody who has tried to manage the deployment--and upgrade--of a large number of Forms clients is very attracted to the prospect of only having to maintain and upgrade a few application servers.
I agree with the direction of the product as far as replacing Toolkit2 and the native runtime with the JRE. The advantage of on-demand updating of application code is compelling. The capability of moving application logic to the middle tier is extremely useful. Platform independence is now done using the "universal" JRE instead of TK2.
If the product could maintain the client-side processing capability--without resorting to Javabeans--it would be just that much stronger. As an application architect, I want to be able to design the application to allocate the work where it makes the most sense, either on the client, the application server, or the database server.
How hard would it be to put this client-side processing capability back into the product?
Regards,
Bruce MacDonald

Forms 6i client/server questions

Hi, I have three questions:
1) Is Patch 17 for Forms6i cumulative? (we have patched up to patch 13)
2) After applying patch 17 do we need to recompile all of our forms?
3) We are connecting from 6i client/server forms to a 10.1.4 database, is there a recommended Oracle client? (we are very behind and still running a very old version and I'm trying to get information to move forward)
Thanks.

Patch 17 is designed for the 10g database. There is no hint, that a 9i-db is better than a 10g. Use 10g.
I always recompile all (!) libs, menues and forms after installing a new patch. It's better to do that once, than to search for failures, that result from patching.
try it
Gerd

Oracle connection from remote server where oracle client is installed not happening.

Hi ,
I am facing problem today , that i am not able to reach oracle DB from other machine where i have installed Oracle clinet few months ago. Same was heppeing till yesterday.
OS: Windows
Version: 11G
Oracle DB TNS:
# tnsnames.ora Network Configuration File: C:\app\oracluadmin\product\11.2.0\dbhome_1\NETWORK\ADMIN\tnsnames.ora
# Generated by Oracle configuration tools.
DFCCDB =
(DESCRIPTION =
    (ADDRESS_LIST =
      (ADDRESS = (PROTOCOL = TCP)(HOST = 10.199.4.130)(PORT = 1521))
    (CONNECT_DATA =
      (SERVER = DEDICATED)
      (SERVICE_NAME = dfccdb.dfcc.co.in)
ORACLR_CONNECTION_DATA =
(DESCRIPTION =
    (ADDRESS_LIST =
      (ADDRESS = (PROTOCOL = IPC)(KEY = EXTPROC1521))
    (CONNECT_DATA =
      (SID = CLRExtProc)
Output from DB server:
C:\Users\oracluadmin>tnsping DFCCDB
TNS Ping Utility for 64-bit Windows: Version 11.2.0.3.0 - Production on 28-JAN-2014 14:51:22
Copyright (c) 1997, 2011, Oracle. All rights reserved.
Used parameter files:
C:\app\oracluadmin\product\11.2.0\dbhome_1\network\admin\sqlnet.ora
Used TNSNAMES adapter to resolve the alias
Attempting to contact (DESCRIPTION = (ADDRESS_LIST = (ADDRESS = (PROTOCOL = TCP)(HOST = 10.199.4.130)(PORT = 1521))) (CONNECT_DATA = (SERVER
= DEDICATED) (SERVICE_NAME = dfccdb.dfcc.co.in)))
OK (0 msec)
C:\Users\oracluadmin>sqlplus SYS AS SYSDBA@DFCCDB
SQL*Plus: Release 11.2.0.3.0 Production on Tue Jan 28 14:56:15 2014
Copyright (c) 1982, 2011, Oracle. All rights reserved.
Enter password:
Connected to:
Oracle Database 11g Enterprise Edition Release 11.2.0.3.0 - 64bit Production
With the Partitioning, OLAP, Data Mining and Real Application Testing options
SQL>
Clinet server TNS:
DFCCDB =
(DESCRIPTION =
    (ADDRESS_LIST =
      (ADDRESS = (PROTOCOL = TCP)(HOST = 10.199.4.130)(PORT = 1521))
    (CONNECT_DATA =
      (SERVER = DEDICATED)
      (SERVICE_NAME = dfccdb.dfcc.co.in)
Output from client server:
C:\Users\gisadmin>tnsping DFCCDB
TNS Ping Utility for 64-bit Windows: Version 11.2.0.1.0 - Production on 28-JAN
014 15:06:18
Copyright (c) 1997, 2010, Oracle. All rights reserved.
Used parameter files:
C:\app\gisadmin\product\11.2.0\client_1\network\admin\sqlnet.ora
Used TNSNAMES adapter to resolve the alias
Attempting to contact (DESCRIPTION = (ADDRESS_LIST = (ADDRESS = (PROTOCOL = TC
(HOST = 10.199.4.130)(PORT = 1521))) (CONNECT_DATA = (SERVICE_NAME = dfccdb.df
.co.in)))
OK (10 msec)
C:\Users\gisadmin>sqlplus SYS AS SYSDBA@DFCCDB
SQL*Plus: Release 11.2.0.1.0 Production on Tue Jan 28 15:06:36 2014
Copyright (c) 1982, 2010, Oracle. All rights reserved.
Enter password:
ERROR:
ORA-12560: TNS:protocol adapter error
Enter user-name:
Thnaks....

Hi,
Refer the logs:
<msg time='2014-02-11T10:43:10.455+05:30' org_id='oracle' comp_id='tnslsnr'
type='UNKNOWN' level='16' host_id='DFCC-GISDB-01'
host_addr='10.199.4.58'>
<txt>11-FEB-2014 10:43:10 * (CONNECT_DATA=(SERVICE_NAME=dfccdb.dfcc.co.in)(CID=(PROGRAM=C:\app\gisadmin\product\11.2.0\client_1\bin\sqlplus.exe)(HOST=DFCC-GISAPP-01)(USER=gisadmin))) * (ADDRESS=(PROTOCOL=tcp)(HOST=10.199.4.55)(PORT=25229)) * establish * dfccdb.dfcc.co.in * 12514
</txt>
</msg>
<msg time='2014-02-11T10:43:10.455+05:30' org_id='oracle' comp_id='tnslsnr'
type='UNKNOWN' level='16' host_id='DFCC-GISDB-01'
host_addr='10.199.4.58'>
<txt>TNS-12514: TNS:listener does not currently know of service requested in connect descriptor
</txt>
</msg>
<msg time='2014-02-11T10:43:58.706+05:30' org_id='oracle' comp_id='tnslsnr'
type='UNKNOWN' level='16' host_id='DFCC-GISDB-01'
host_addr='10.199.4.58'>
<txt>11-FEB-2014 10:43:58 * (CONNECT_DATA=(SERVICE_NAME=dfccdb.dfcc.co.in)(CID=(PROGRAM=C:\app\gisadmin\product\11.2.0\client_1\bin\sqlplus.exe)(HOST=DFCC-GISAPP-01)(USER=gisadmin))) * (ADDRESS=(PROTOCOL=tcp)(HOST=10.199.4.55)(PORT=25230)) * establish * dfccdb.dfcc.co.in * 12514
</txt>
</msg>
<msg time='2014-02-11T10:43:58.722+05:30' org_id='oracle' comp_id='tnslsnr'
type='UNKNOWN' level='16' host_id='DFCC-GISDB-01'
host_addr='10.199.4.58'>
<txt>TNS-12514: TNS:listener does not currently know of service requested in connect descriptor
</txt>
</msg>
<msg time='2014-02-11T10:44:33.120+05:30' org_id='oracle' comp_id='tnslsnr'
type='UNKNOWN' level='16' host_id='DFCC-GISDB-01'
host_addr='10.199.4.58'>
<txt>11-FEB-2014 10:44:33 * (CONNECT_DATA=(SERVICE_NAME=dfccdb.dfcc.co.in)(CID=(PROGRAM=C:\app\gisadmin\product\11.2.0\client_1\bin\sqlplus.exe)(HOST=DFCC-GISAPP-01)(USER=gisadmin))) * (ADDRESS=(PROTOCOL=tcp)(HOST=10.199.4.55)(PORT=25231)) * establish * dfccdb.dfcc.co.in * 12514
</txt>
</msg>
<msg time='2014-02-11T10:44:33.136+05:30' org_id='oracle' comp_id='tnslsnr'
type='UNKNOWN' level='16' host_id='DFCC-GISDB-01'
host_addr='10.199.4.58'>
<txt>TNS-12514: TNS:listener does not currently know of service requested in connect descriptor
</txt>
</msg>
<msg time='2014-02-11T10:45:24.662+05:30' org_id='oracle' comp_id='tnslsnr'
type='UNKNOWN' level='16' host_id='DFCC-GISDB-01'
host_addr='10.199.4.58'>
<txt>11-FEB-2014 10:45:24 * (CONNECT_DATA=(SERVICE_NAME=dfccdb.dfcc.co.in)(CID=(PROGRAM=C:\app\gisadmin\product\11.2.0\client_1\bin\sqlplus.exe)(HOST=DFCC-GISAPP-01)(USER=gisadmin))) * (ADDRESS=(PROTOCOL=tcp)(HOST=10.199.4.55)(PORT=25280)) * establish * dfccdb.dfcc.co.in * 12514
</txt>
</msg>
<msg time='2014-02-11T10:45:24.662+05:30' org_id='oracle' comp_id='tnslsnr'
type='UNKNOWN' level='16' host_id='DFCC-GISDB-01'
host_addr='10.199.4.58'>
<txt>TNS-12514: TNS:listener does not currently know of service requested in connect descriptor
</txt>
</msg>
<msg time='2014-02-11T10:48:00.819+05:30' org_id='oracle' comp_id='tnslsnr'
type='UNKNOWN' level='16' host_id='DFCC-GISDB-01'
host_addr='10.199.4.58'>
<txt>11-FEB-2014 10:48:00 * (CONNECT_DATA=(CID=(PROGRAM=)(HOST=)(USER=oracluadmin))(COMMAND=status)(ARGUMENTS=64)(SERVICE=LISTENER)(VERSION=186647296)) * status * 0
</txt>
</msg>
<msg time='2014-02-11T10:48:14.547+05:30' org_id='oracle' comp_id='tnslsnr'
type='UNKNOWN' level='16' host_id='DFCC-GISDB-01'
host_addr='10.199.4.58'>
txt>11-FEB-2014 10:48:14 * (CONNECT_DATA=(CID=(PROGRAM=)(HOST=)(USER=oracluadmin))(COMMAND=services)(ARGUMENTS=64)(SERVICE=LISTENER)(VERSION=186647296)) * services * 0
</txt>
</msg>

Speed Oracle forms (web based) versus client server

2 years ago we've tested forms 9i
Everything went very smoothly:
We had no problems in converting our old forms to 9i.
We've installed a new database on a new server and we've installed a application server on a second server (Both servers had 2 CPU's and 2GB of memory).
In short everything worked perfectly ... except the speed.
Oracle forms (web based) are a lot slower than client-server forms on a LAN, so we kept developing client-server.
We just use forms on our own local network (100Mbit) but
we use a lot of triggers in our forms (perhaps the reason for the poor performance?)
Has anything changed?
Is it now possible to use web based forms, that are at leased as fast as client server forms?

OK, I agree: changing the form (more views, less post-query, more pl/sql on database) will improve performance.
But then I have to recreate every form (> 1000), so then converting c/s to web is not just recompile.
We don't use images in our forms, the database is connected to the application server with a gigabit line. We did tests when even the client was on gigabit, but c/s remains faster. We did the test with just 1 client. and we have never experienced a bottleneck on the network using c/s (even with post-query on millions of records)
So 1 database (2 Xeon CPU's 2GB RAM), 1 App server (2 XEON CPU's, 2GB RAM) and 1 client (XEON workstation, 512MB RAM) using web forms on a gigabit network is slower than the same client using forms (c/s) without an appl. server. => A lot more hardware for less performance?
In short my question: is the latest version of forms faster than the previous version?
Can webforms have the same performance as client server?

From client/server forms 6i to ... what?

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