HELP! Bad quality output after burn..

Ok, I have a movie i made. When I export from final cut pro the quality is great but once I go through DVD studio pro and burn the quality is BAD. Someone told me that I need to change the options on the encoder of DVD studio pro, if so what do I need to set it to...???

Javi,
If it is a matter of bit rate changes (I'm unsure as I am new to DVD SP)
maybe the following will help, in regards to duration and best bit rates.
http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?messageID=1870545&#1870545

Similar Messages

Bad quallity film after burning dvd with idvdv professional quality.

After making a movie in imovie and importing it in idvdv the quality is still HD
after burning a dvd with professional quality the quatity of the dvdv is very poor. Horizontal lines are dancing over the screen!!
Can anyone tell me wat is going on???

Keep in mind that all Dvd's burned through your mac and are playable on your mac as well as your set top DVD player are ALWAYS standard definition /SD. There is no way around this (that is if your intentions is for playback on most computers and most set top Dvd Players.
One of the limiting factors is apple's dvd player app. It isn't fully blu-ray compatible yet. Meaning that even if you did burn a high def. Dvd which is only playble on Sony's PS3 and most set top Blu-ray players .... the finished Dvd won't play on your mac since apple has yet to update/upgrade their DVD Player application to fully incorporate Blu-ray standards. To the best of my knowledge, apple's support is very limited here. Hence the alternative for mac users is to use Roxio Toast's Blu-ray plug in as well as Toast Blu-ray player. If you opt to go high def through Toast then the completed Dvd will NOT play on most set top dvd players but will on most Blu-ray Players as well as Sony's PS3.
Hope this advice helps but if not just come on back.
Disclaimer: Apple does not necessarily endorse any suggestions, solutions, or third-party software / products that may be mentioned in this topic. Apple encourages you to first seek a solution at Apple Support. The following links are provided as is, with no guarantee of the effectiveness or reliability of the information. Apple does not guarantee that these links will be maintained or functional at any given time. Use the information above at your own discretion.
Message was edited by: SDMacuser

Bad quality with ken burns slideshows on DVD

I've created several movies from still images using iMovie 08 (7.1.2) and its Ken Burns effect. The preview in iMovie looks really great and plays fluid.
Then I've exported the movie using the checkmark to produce a "large" video file. The result was then selectable in iDVD 08 (7.0.2).
Now I've made some nice looking menus and linked my movies to the project. The built in project preview of iDVD still showed me good looking results (the resolution was slightly decreased in order to meet DVD specs but that is acceptable).
But after burning the project to a DVD (or exporting it to an image file or VIDEO_TS folder) the quality went absolutely terrible! There are huge compression artifacts on some regions and all imported iMovie clips are studdering very heavily. Especially fast Ken Burns pannings suffer from a bad encoding quality.
It's driving me mad because those problems only appear on that part of the DVD I've created using iMovie. The (animated) menus and imported camcorder clips are playing fine in a good quality.
I've double checked the export results from iMovie (playing the produced m4v file using Quicktime and VLC) and they are absolutely fine...
Is there anything I'm missing?
The iDVD project settings are PAL, 4:3 aspect ratio and professional quality (even tried high quality and best performance at no luck). The entire project length is only ~20min...
Any help would be greatly appreciated

Okay, you are absolutely right. But it's a pity that Apple restricted the encoding engine in such a way. Users might think that a setting which is called "professioal quality" just does it job and encodes the material at this level.
I understand that a professional application like DVD SP offers a lot more settings for advanced users (without the ease of use when compared to the simple iDVD workflow) but I'm quite sure that it does this job better even with "default" settings.
For me I'm now doing those things with a 50$ version of TMPGEnc
Anyway, thanks for your help!

Last-minute help! Video quality drops after burn

I'm exporting a video out of FCP using Compressor, saving directly to the DVD format for burning inside DVD Studio Pro. When I preview the video inside DSP, it looks amazing. After I finish burning the disc and view it in DVD Player, the video quality looks horrible.
See a screenshot here:
http://www.door62.com/temp/DVD-quality.jpg
The one on the left is DVD Player, the one on the right is the preview inside DSP.
Any advice? This is actually ridiculously last-minute... Any help would be hugely appreciated

I have been having simliar trouble, esp. with textured backgrounds in the video.
Specifically, someone sitting in a board room delivering a short message (2 minutes) on camera. The background is a textured wood panel with a continuously changing color gradient.
I encode in Compressor, NTSC lower field, 2-pass VBR, 6.1 Mbps avg., 7.2 Mbps max., AIF audio. I have also tried a number of bit rate variations including CBR and AC3 audio.
I drop the clip in a DVDSP track and it looks fine in simulator. Also open the m2v in QT Pro, it looks fine.
After building, I check the TS_Folder in Apple DVD Player, and the background pulses, shifting from light to dark and is filled with artifacts. It looks even worse on a set-top player.
I have had problems like this a number of times, and end up having to use other programs on Windows to get around it. Kind of a pain.
Has anyone else seen anything like this?
G5 Dual 2.3 GHz Mac OS X (10.4.8) 2.5 GB RAM, ROM v5.2.4f1
G5 Dual 2.3 GHz Mac OS X (10.4.8) 2.5 GB RAM, ROM v5.2.4f1

DOH! Poor quality output after 4 days trying to perfect the DVD

Hi guys
I have been trying to burn a 1hr 27min .avi file (700MB) for 4 days now. Ive tried a few ways but each time the DVD has poorer quality video than the original file.
I tried:
- opening .avi file in ImovieHD and then sharing it with iDVD (it refused to burn it, after going thru the whole rendering encoding process mind you)
- going straight to iDVD (definitely it would not burn)
- opening in QT Pro and then 'stream as DV'. which i opened in iDVD and saved as disc image with menus etc. burnt using toast titanium - probably the best result so far i think)
however the dv file was worse than an mp4 file i created using iSquint from the .avi.
- have also tried just opening the avi in toast and burning from there. worse product than the previous one.
So, any suggestions? The main problem is things look quite jagged and a bit pixelated if you know what i mean. Where as the mp4 file, which ive played using iTunes and VLC, is quite smooth (but you can see there's still a bit of quality loss when sharp movements are made by the actors.(expected).
So I've lost lots of time on this stupid thing, but I just really want to sort out how to do it well once and for all.
Any help would be most appreciated.
Thanks

G'day Looneysbin
Sounds like a hardware problem. Is your drive under warranty?
For a start, try rendering your iDVD project to a disk image, instead of burning straight to disk.
Then, create a new Burn Folder on your desktop, and drag the VIDEO.TS file from the opened disk image to the burn folder (note that only an alias actually gets put in the folder).
Next, use Control-click on the Burn Folder to get the contextual menu, and select 'Burn Disc'. Follow the prompts, but burn at the minimum speed available.
This way, your apparent hardware problem won't mean re-rendering the iDVD file each time you try and burn a disc.
You can also keep the .img file on your hard drive as a backup of the disc.
You might also be having a problem with quality of the actual discs themselves. What brand are you using?
Regards
Santa

Bad Disc error after burning

Hi guys, Ive just finished making a dvd in Final Cut express and have exported all the files ready for Burning onto a dvd.
I thought i had done it correctly but after a few attempts every disc comes up 'Bad Disc' when i try to play it through a dvd player. But will play when i put it im my Mac with no probs at all.
This has been filmed with PAL sony cam (as i live in Australia) and i think i have all the settings set up for PAL in the DVD studio pro. Can anyone explain or think why this is happening?
Thanks
Nathan

Did you make an HD DVD? (Take a look at what folders are being created in you build destination, if you see something other than VIDEO_TS and AUDIO_TS, you probably made an HD DVD. Open the DVD in Finder and see if HVDVD_TS is on the disc.)
You cannot change a HD project to SD once it is HD so it needs to be recreated. In preferences you can set the default to SD.
Also, did you set a first play on the DVD?

NEED HELP WITH CHOPPY TYPE AFTER BURNED TO DVD

I have about 20 jpgs (RGB) of just copy on a black background. I've brought those jpgs into iMovie HD and they look fine.
When I render those jpgs as a movie (basically a slideshow) to a DVD and play it back on your average television...each slide of copy on a black background, comes out horrible. Grainy, pixelated, and out of focus.
Please, I need to know if there is anything anyone has tried and had work. I feel that I've exhausted quite a few methods for executing the problem...but still nothing better.
G5 Mac OS X (10.4.9)

I don't think the problem is happening in the
"burning" of the DVD, it is happening right when I am
previewing. I can see that the text I have currently
up on screen looks great, it's fine, nothing is wrong
with the copy. But as soon as I view it before I put
it to disc, it becomes completely distorted and
choppy. Like I've imported a low res file to begin
with or something.
The preview function in iDVD should be though of as a 'for position only' function. It DOES NOT represent how the final mpg-2 compressed DVD will look.
Preparing images for DVD slideshows at http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?path=iDVD/6.0/en/17.html will give you some recommendations on image sizes to use.
F Shippey

Please Help! It's Happened Again - Quality Changed in Burning

I am sorry to repost this, but I am really hoping someone can help me! I didn't get a response to the message below about the quality of my burned CD's suddenly changing, and it has happened again - again with music purchased from iTunes.
Any help appreciated!! Thank you!!
Hi all~
Though I am no computer expert, I've been burning CDs from iTunes for ages without problems until today. I purchased some songs from iTunes yesterday and burned an audio CD from iTunes today. For the first time, the quality was waaay off - with pops, semi-stutters, etc. This is true whether I play it in iTunes or Windows Media.
After looking around this forum, I changed the burn speed down to 8x (first tried at "Maximum Possible" which was my previous default setting). Same problem.
Now the odd part - to try to see if it was my internal CD burner, I manually copied the music files using Windows Explorer and burned yet another CD that way. Obviously, these are M4P files that can only be played by iTunes. However, when I opened up iTunes, it cant see that CD . . . which confused me. On the other hand, when I use Windows Explorer to manually look at the CD folder and tell it to open the music track using iTunes, it works. And then the song plays flawlessly in iTunes.
So near as I can tell, this appears to be an issue now with how iTunes is burning audio CDs . . . which appears to have changed in the last couple of weeks . . . though I dont recall having changed anything on my computer in that time.
Any help?!
Thanks - balithai
Here are the diagnostics on the second audio CD I burned in iTunes at 8x:
Microsoft Windows XP Professional Service Pack 2 (Build 2600)
Dell Inc. OptiPlex GX520
iTunes 7.2.0.35
CD Driver 2.0.6.1
CD Driver DLL 2.0.6.2
LowerFilters: PxHelp20 (2.0.0.0),
UpperFilters: GEARAspiWDM (2.0.6.1),
Current user is an administrator.
Video Display Information:
Intel(R) 82945G Express Chipset Family
Intel(R) 82945G Express Chipset Family
Connected Device Information:
DiskDrive, ST380819AS, Bus Type ATA, Bus Address [0,0]
DiskDrive, Lexar Media Inc. CF USB Device, Bus Type USB
DiskDrive, Lexar Media Inc. MS USB Device, Bus Type USB
DiskDrive, Lexar Media Inc. SD USB Device, Bus Type USB
DiskDrive, Lexar Media Inc. SM/xD USB Device, Bus Type USB
CDROM, TSSTcorp CDRWDVD TS-H492C, Bus Type ATA, Bus Address [0,0]
If you have multiple drives on the same IDE or SCSI bus, these drives may interfere with each other.
Some computers need an update to the ATA or IDE bus driver, or Intel chipset. If iTunes has problems recognizing CDs or hanging or crashing while importing or burning CDs, check the support site for the manufacturer of your computer or motherboard.
D: TSSTcorp CDRWDVD TS-H492C, Rev DE02
Audio CD in drive.
Found 10 songs on CD, playing time 35:29 on Audio CD.
Track 1, start time 00:02:00
Track 2, start time 02:41:14
Track 3, start time 06:09:56
Track 4, start time 08:18:08
Track 5, start time 11:05:16
Track 6, start time 19:35:05
Track 7, start time 22:32:26
Track 8, start time 25:18:20
Track 9, start time 27:52:66
Track 10, start time 31:48:10
Audio CD reading succeeded.
Get drive speed succeeded.
The drive CDR speeds are: 8 16 24 32 40 48.
The drive CDRW speeds are: 8.
Dell Optiplex GX520 Windows XP Pro

You keep putting dukes on threads, but never assigning them to anyone...
http://forum.java.sun.com/thread.jsp?thread=473502&forum=54
http://forum.java.sun.com/thread.jsp?thread=474087&forum=54
http://forum.java.sun.com/thread.jsp?thread=474562&forum=54
http://forum.java.sun.com/thread.jsp?forum=54&thread=473493

Bad quality after rendering

Hello guys.. why my video is having a bad quality after rendering? as you can see on this snapshots. the unrendered one looks great and sharp. but after rendering the quality is changing...
Ive tried to scaling to sequence but after rendering its going back again to poor quality..
pls help me guys! thanks
Before
After

Jruzz wrote:
ok ill try this and get back to you.. thanks man.. really
Perhaps you were unaware that Christina is a woman?
Patrick

HELP! iPhoto 08 Quality loss after edits

HELP! iPhoto 08 Quality loss after edit!
Any edited version, no matter how minor, causes the file size to be cut in half!
Original 3872 x 2592 is 3.1mb at 300dpi .
Edit version 3870x2590 becomes 1.5Mb at 72dpi.
B&W conversion 3872x2592 becomes 1.6mb at 72dpi.
Seems like a major degradation! iPhoto 6 wasn't this bad.
DPI change is not a problem but the file size change sure is!
PLEASE! any ideas before I upgrade all my files to 08. Please - don't say Aperture, it's still too slow and cumbersome. Trying to avoid Lightroom and stay within Apple sphere.

It really isn't a big degradation. There is a jpg compression when you make any edit but you might be hard pressed to see the reduction unless you're enlarging/printing the file to very large sizes. The most critical part of an image file is the number of pixels in it.
The reduction in size depends on the image content of the photos. If there's a lot of the same color, i.e. like lots of blue sky or a same color wall, that type of image will see much more compression than a very intricate photo. Also when removing the color information for a B/W conversion reduces the file size considerably. Do a Google search for jpeg compression and you'll find some very informative descriptions on how the compression is performed and what part image detail plays in the resulting file size.
You would have to compress the file a number of additional times time before you'd see the change. And with iPhoto's Revert to Original capability, you can start a new edit fresh with the untouched digital negative.
Do you Twango?
TIP: For insurance against the iPhoto database corruption that many users have experienced I recommend making a backup copy of the Library6.iPhoto database file and keep it current. If problems crop up where iPhoto suddenly can't see any photos or thinks there are no photos in the library, replacing the working Library6.iPhoto file with the backup will often get the library back. By keeping it current I mean backup after each import and/or any serious editing or work on books, slideshows, calendars, cards, etc. That insures that if a problem pops up and you do need to replace the database file, you'll retain all those efforts. It doesn't take long to make the backup and it's good insurance.
I've written an Automator workflow application (requires Tiger), iPhoto dB File Backup, that will copy the selected Library6.iPhoto file from your iPhoto Library folder to the Pictures folder, replacing any previous version of it. It's compatible with iPhoto 08 libraries. You can download it at Toad's Cellar. Be sure to read the Read Me pdf file.

Want ProRes export from After Effects. Bad Quality. What possibilities do I have?

Hey guys,
I've got a question...
I'm working on a project in After Effects and want to export it now as a quicktime movie with prores.
The movie I get, has got a bad quality and seems blurred.
I can export as animation but is there another possibility?
Need more information? Please ask!
Best regards
MumpitzOne

Did you mean to ask this on the Premiere Pro forum? Your post mentions After Effects. Are you looking for a solution using Premiere Pro or After Effects?
Also, when asking about poor quality, it's best to post an example (such as a screenshot) so that we can see what you're referring to.
It also helps if you give details about what version of the applicaiton you're using, what operating system, and so on.

Premiere Pro CS6 - Video Output (GPU) bad quality...

Hi,
I have a question about Adobe Premiere Pro CS6...
I have installed the Trial-Version and use a BM Intensity Pro to output Full-HD 1080i (50, Interlace) trough HDMI Video-Output...
The Video-Output works correctly, but if I enable the "GPU"-Acceleration (CUDA), and scale or transform a Video (for example a 3D-Transformation) the Quality of the transforming is very bad! (jerky, not "smooth", Interlace-Lines etc...)
If I deactivate the GPU-Acceleration (Software only Mode), everything is smooth and looks good!
Also if I render the Timeline, all tranformations are also smooth, only the Realtime GPU Rendering looks very bad....
What can I do?

Hi :-)
I have tested it now with another Grafikcard!
And it is exactly the same problem
I have found out, that the GPU makes a delay, after a few seconds the Transformation looks smooth/bicubic!
But on relatime-Playback its bad...
My English isnt very good, so I have some problems to describe what I mean...
If you stop the playback, it takes 2 Sekonds and then the image looks good!
But dureing the playback its very bad quality, false Interlace-Lines etc...
here are two screenshots:

Does anyone experienced bad quality when burning a DVD?

Does anyone experienced bad quality when burning a DVD?
Using OS 10.6.8 and Magiv Video in iDVD, I am having a hard time creating a decent DVD. The videos per se are fine, but the intro menu and menu text and images are extremely poor quality and hard to read. What is going on?

Hi my notes on this - might be of help
DVD quality
1. iDVD 08, 09 & 11 has three levels of qualities. (version 7.0.1, 7,0.4 & 7.1.1)
iDVD 6 has the two last ones
• Professional Quality
(movies + menus up to 120 min.) - BEST (but not always for short movies e.g. up to 45 minutes in total)
• Best Performances
(movies + menus less than 60 min.) - High quality on final DVD (Can be best for short movies)
• High Quality (in iDVD08 or 09) / Best Quality (in iDVD6)
(movies + menus up to 120 min.) - slightly lower quality than above
About double on DL DVDs.
2. Video from
• FCE/P - Export out as full quality QuickTime.mov (not self-containing, no conversion)
• iMovie x-6 - Don't use ”Share/Export to iDVD” = destructive even to movie project and especially so
when the movie includes photos and the Ken Burns effect NOT is used. Instead just drop or import the iMovie movie project icon (with a Star on it) into iDVD theme window.
• iMovie’08 or 09 or 11 are not meant to go to iDVD. Go via Media Browser and as Large (NOT HD or other resolutiona as result will suffer) or rather use iMovie HD 6 from start.
3. I use Roxio Toast™ to make an as slow burn as possibly e.g. x4 or x1 (in iDVD’08 or 09 this can also be set)
This can also be done with Apple’s Disk Utilities application when burning from a DiskImage.
4. There has to be about or more than 25Gb free space on internal (start-up) hard disk. iDVD can't
use an external one as scratch disk (if it is not start-up disc). For SD-Video - if HD-material is used I guess that 4 to 5 times more would do.
5. I use Verbatim ( also recommended by many - Taiyo Yuden DVDs - I can’t get hold of it to test )
6. I use DVD-R (no +R or +/-RW) - DVD-R play’s on more and older DVD-Players
7. Keep NTSC to NTSC - or - PAL to PAL when going from iMovie to iDVD
(I use JES_Deinterlacer to keep frame per sec. same from editing to the Video-DVD result.)
8. Don’t burn more than three DVDs at a time - but let the laser cool off for a while before next batch.
iDVD quality also depends on.
• DVD is a standard in it self. It is Standard Definition Quality = Same as on old CRT-TV sets and can not
deliver anything better that this.
HD-DVD was a short-lived standard and it was only a few Toshiba DVD-players that could playback.
These DVDs could be made in DVD-Studio Pro. But they don’t playback on any other standard DVD-Player.
Blu-Ray / BD can be coded onto DVDs but limited in time to - about 20-30 minutes and then need
_ Roxio Toast™ 10 Pro incl. BD-component
_ BD disks and burner if full length movies are to be stored
_ BD-Player or PlayStation3 - to be able to playback
The BD-encoded DVDs can be play-backed IF Mac also have Roxio DVD-player tool. Not on any standard Mac or DVD-player
Full BD-disks needs a BD-player (in Mac) as they need blue-laser to be read. No red-laser can do this.
• HOW much free space is there on Your internal (start-up) hard disk. Go for approx. 25Gb.
less than 5Gb and Your result will most probably not play.
• How it was recorded - Tripod vs Handheld Camera. A stable picture will give a much higher quality
• Audio is most often more critical than picture. Bad audio and with dropouts usually results in a non-viewed movie.
• Use of Video-editor. iMovie’08 or 09 or 11 are not the tools for DVD-production. They discard every second line resulting in a close to VHS-tape quality.
iMovie 1 to HD6 and FinalCut any version delivers same quality as Camera record in = 100% to iDVD
• What kind of movie project You drop into it. MPEG4 seems to be a bad choice.
other strange formats are .avi, .wmv, .flash etc. Convert to streamingDV first
Also audio formats matters. I use only .aiff or from miniDV tape Camera 16-bit
strange formats often problematic are .avi, .wmv, audio from iTunes, .mp3 etc
Convert to .aiff first and use this in movie project
• What kind of standard - NTSC movie and NTSC DVD or PAL to PAL - no mix.
(If You need to change to do a NTSC DVD from PAL material let JES_Deinterlacer_3.2.2 do the conversion)
(Dropping a PAL movie into a NTSC iDVD project
(US) NTSC DVDs most often are playable in EU
(EU) PAL DVDs most often needs to be converted to play in US
UNLESS. They are play-backed by a Mac - then You need not to care
• What kind of DVDs You are using. I use Verbatim DVD-R (this brand AND no +R or +/-RW)
• How You encode and burn it. Two settings prior iDVD’08 or 09
Pro Quality (only in iDVD 08 & 09)
Best / High Quality (not always - most often not)
Best / High Performances (most often my choice before Pro Quality)
1. go to iDVD pref. menu and select tab far right and set burn speed to x1 (less errors = plays better) - only in iDVD 08 & 09
(x4 by some and may be even better)
2. Project info. Select Professional Encoding - only in iDVD 08 & 09.
Region codes.
iDVD - only burn Region = 0 - meaning - DVDs are playable everywhere
DVD Studio pro can set Region codes.
1 = US
2 = EU
unclemano wrote
What it turned out to be was the "quality" settings in iDVD. The total clip time was NOT over 2 hours or 4.7GB, yet iDVD created massive visual artifacts on the "professional quality" setting.
I switched the settings to "high quality" which solved the problem. According iDVD help, "high quality" determines the best bit rate for the clips you have.
I have NEVER seen iDVD do this before, especially when I was under the 2 hour and 4.7GB limits.
For anyone else, there seem to be 2 places in iDVD to set quality settings, the first is under "preferences" and the second under "project info." They do NOT seem to be linked (i.e. if you change one, the other is NOT changed). take care, Mario
TO GET IT TO WORK SLIGHTLY FASTER
• Minimum of 25Gb free space on Start-Up hard disk
• No other programs running in BackGround e.g. Energy-Saver
• Don’t let HD spin down or be turned off (in Energy-Save)
• Move hard disks that are not to be used to Trash - To be disconnected/turned off
• Goto Spotlight and set the rest of them under Integrity (not to be scanned)
• Set screen-saver to a folder without any photo - then make an active corner (up right for me) and set
pointer to this - turns on screen saver - to show that it has nothing to show
Yours Bengt W

Problem: While creating a project in iDVD, it plays perfectly on the computer, but after burning the sound is off. Video soundtrack is not in the right place. HELP!

Problem: While creating a project in iDVD, it plays perfectly on the computer, but after burning the sound is off. Video soundtrack is not in the right place. HELP!

Have you checked out the topics at the right in the More Like This section?
OT

Bad quality after converting to PDF and direct emailing of form letters from MS Word

Hello,
when using the the "form letter" option (for creating personalized PDF files from form letters, that are then directly emailed as attachments via outlook) under the "Acrobat" add-in tab in MS Word I keep getting PDF documents with bad quality (e.g. a logo that is inserted in the document becomes very pixelated). When directly converting the same document to a PDF file using the "create PDF" option unter the "Acrobat" add-in tab in MS Word, I get a high quality pdf file with a perfectly smooth logo (very much the same as it looks in the original MS word document).
Does anyone have an idea what causes the discrepancy in quality of the pdf files that are created via the two options "form letter" and "create PDF" in the "Acrobat" add-in for MS Word?
Any help is highly appreciated,
thank you,
Hans

Maybe I have not made myself clear in the first post. What I am trying to say is, that I keep getting bad quality PDFs (e.g. pixelated logos) when using the "form letter" option (blue box in the image above) but not when using the "create PDF" option (red box in the image above) from the Acrobat add-in in MS Word. Changing the settings for pdf conversion (green box in the image above) only affects PDFs created from the "create PDF" but not the "form letter" option.
Does anyone know how to create high quality (e.g. high resolution) PDFs using the "form letter" option (blue box)?
Best regards,
Hans

HELP! Bad quality output after burn..

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