Help + Opinions: MBP Overheating + Testing. Inconclusive.

Hey guys,
So I've been reading for the last two days about the MBP overheating and there seems to be significant descrpencies from user to user. Some users swear that their MBP never gets over 60˚C (all temperatures below will be shown in ˚C) and others swear that their normal operating temperature even while browsing the internet is 75˚C +. Nonetheless, over the last few months I've noticed that my MBP is running very hot and w/ in the last two weeks I have seen it actually shut down due to temperature at 3 times. I live 2,000km from the nearest Apple Store (China) so unfortunately, at least for a while, Genuis support is out of the question. It's become quite an issue because my a professional photographer who generally has PS3 and LR3 open at the same time, which didn't use to be a problem
I'd very much appreciate some educated and thoughtful input into this subject and see what you guys would suggest to maybe alleviate the problem
Conditions
- MBP elevated about 1 inch attached to 21 inch monitor
- About 2 months ago I upgraded to Snow Leopard - didn't notice this issue right away but the upgrade is noteworthy
- Notice constant temperatures between 65˚C and 85˚C while only browsing the internet, being the same under both testing conditions - averaging closer to 70˚C
- My fans hardly ever go below 6200rpm - annoying and bad.
- The MBP is 13 months old
- I absolutely cannot play any graphic intensive game for more than 10 minutes w/o a forced thermal shutdown... sad.
- Already reset crm(sp?)/fan controls and the PRAM - helped a little under idle conditions.
- All OpenGL support in PS3 is turned off
Test #1 - "Better Battery Life"
- I took two sets of readings on these tests: The Computer temps + Processes, both w/o load and under load
- I let the computer idle for about 5 minutes before taking any readings
- Notice the temps while having one document open in PS
- Fan on max, 6200RPM most of time, bottoms out around 4200 RPM once the CPU drops to around 59˚C
http://brianhirschy.com/mbp/mbpnhigh.jpg
Test #2 - "Higher Performance"
- I took two sets of readings on these tests: The Computer temps + Processes, both w/o load and under load
- I let the computer idle for about 5 minutes before taking any readings[/
- Notice the temps while having one document open in PS
- GPU Diode seems to be 15-20 degrees HOTTER while everything else remains the same
- Fan on max, 6200RPM all the time, no matter the temp
http://brianhirschy.com/mbp/mbphigh.jpg
Strange Conclusion
If feels as if the computer actually runs cooler and faster under the "Better Battery Life" option. I feel that the GPU Diode is actually heating the computer more than necessary esp. in non-graphic intense situations. I'm tempted to run the computer under the "Better Battery Life" vs "Higher Performance" option. Strange conclusion, I know.
General Questions
+- Aside from the issue at hand, how would it be possible to see better performance under a 'lower performance' setting - ie, better battery life.+
+- I'm finding it very difficult on the internet to see if this is w/ in the range of normal operating temps+
+- What does the 'Higher Performance' option in Sys Pref -> Power Mang. actually do? Seems to just prime the GPU+
+- Is it entirely possible that I'm just NOT going to be able to game on this rig due to overheating? Seems like that's an issue.+
+- Have other users noticed that the fans just simply don't turn off when on "Higher Performance" setting?+
Nonetheless, if you've gotten this far, I appreciate your time and thanks for reading through this. I know there are many threads on this issue, but none are conclusive and most don't provide any supporting evidence to suggest there is a heat issue. As an experienced MR forum user, I wouldn't be rehashing an old issue if there wasn't a reason for it.
Thanks again,
Brian

If feels as if the computer actually runs cooler and faster under the "Better Battery Life" option.
It does run cooler. The Better Battery Life setting invokes the lower-powered GPU, which uses less power and generates less heat. Faster? Not likely — but under many conditions and workloads it won't be any slower.
I'm tempted to run the computer under the "Better Battery Life" vs "Higher Performance" option.
Go ahead. You may find that your workflow doesn't suffer perceptibly or at all.
Three things that can cause your machine to work extra hard and generate lots of extra heat are inadequate RAM, an overly full hard drive, and a runaway process hogging CPU cycles without your knowledge. If you don't have at least 4GB of RAM, upgrade to 4, 6, or 8GB: the more the better for your purposes. If your hard drive is more than 80% full, you need a bigger one, given your photo applications' demand for scratch disk space. To make sure you don't have something running in the background that's jacking your computer's temperature up, follow the procedure described in this article:
http://support.apple.com/kb/TS1473
If you have USB external hard drives connected most or all of the time, switch to FireWire drives. USB imposes an extra processing load on your CPU that FireWire does not.
Finally, if you are running your machine in clamshell mode (with its display closed), open the display. It will cool itself more efficiently that way.

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    I went through similar issues with my MacBook Pro. The ultimate solution did not rely on Apple, but on self-service. Internally speaking, your MBP has a well-designed cooling system that places the CPU (primary heat source, on the back left), northbridge (back center), and GPU (secondary heat source, back right) parallel, along which a heatpipe assembly runs directly across those. At the ends of those heatpipes are copper heatsinks with a flat fan blowing air directly through the heatsink.
    It's an excellent design, sucking heat away from the center, out to the heatsinks, and shooting it out the single, difficult-to-block vent in the back, and drawing air in from the keyboard region. Pretty crafty.
    In the design of this, when you observe it, you see thermal sensors taped or glued to the bottom of the chassis and to the heatpipe itself. These temperature sensors are for fan regulation purposes. While the CPU has internal temperature measurement, the GPU from ATI I don't belive does - and naturally, neither does the Intel northbridge. To effectively measure the temperature of the system's hot components, the temperature sensors are employed. Unfortunately however, the sensor on the heatpipe that primarily controls the fans is on the far far outside, roughly halfway between the ATI GPU and the heatsink nearest to it.
    If you'll imagine along with me, this means that the fans are basing their speed on measurements being taken from a location the farthest away from the primary heat source as possible, and in addition, close to a heatsink, which is cooling the heat, providing lower temperature readings. Optimally speaking, it would have been better to put the sensor in the center between the CPU and GPU, or at least on the inner section close by the GPU. This is not the case however, and is largely why the system is so very slow to queue up fan speed when the CPU hits high load.
    In addition, some feel MBPs sometimes employ too much thermal paste, causing issues - I think this issue has been mostly resolved by now, and wasn't an issue on my initial unit.
    Ultimately, disconnecting the thermal sensor located on the heatpipe is an affable solution, as this would kick the fans into full gear 100% of the time, resulting in temperatures of 88F idle, and ~140F under load. I'm pretty sure Apple would cry foul at that sort of chassis opening and internal tooling, so the above is mostly for your information.

  • MBP Overheating & Fan issue--strange

    So...here it goes....
    Quit all my applications this afternoon and closed the lid on my 15" MBP to put the thing to sleep (around 4 pm). Placed said MBP in my computer bag and headed home. Went to get it out of the bag (7:30 pm) and found that the entire compartment was really hot and the computer was screaming hot (everywhere) & the fan was running endlessly! This is the first time anything like this has happened with this laptop.
    I did update the firmware to deal with the fan well over a month ago & my OS is completely up to date...
    Anyone know what could have caused this?? I'm a bit concerned that this could have led to a major meltdown or battery ignition (considering the isulation of the computer bag!)
    Any insights would be welcome--

    I just received my MBP C2D and as soon as you hit the power button, the fans come on and don't shut off. Its extremly loud. Sounds like a jet engine. I tried everything to stop it. I installed SMC Fan Control, Fan Control, and Core Duo Temp. The fan controls seem not to affect my fan rpm speed. Core duo temp says my core temp fall between 30C and 45C always. Every few hours (like 4-6 hours) the fan will shut off for 1 sec and then start up again and sometimes stutter on and off. Occasionally the fan will shut off for awhile after like 12 hours, until my MBP goes to sleep and then when it wakes, the fan comes on at full speed and remains on forever. I can shutdown the MBP and as soon as I hit the power button the fans come back on. I ran the apple diagnostics rom cd1 and all passed. I did notice after I entered the test that the fan speed went way down until you could barely hear it but I knew it was on. I suspect that my fans are stuck on at wide open rpm. I wonder if software may have a fault that could cause this. My MBP software is all up to date. Any tricks out there to diagnose this problem or fix it? Please help!
    MacBook Pro 17 C2D   Mac OS X (10.4.8)   Ipod Video 5G

  • Help:My MBP died. Does it pay to fix it?

    My mid-2009 13" MBP died the other day. Was stuck on grey startup with circle and slash through it ( like international no sign that you would see for smoking but in grey). After posting about it all were in agreement that my Hard Drive was probably the issue. Received my new Crucial SSD today. Installed it no issue. Formatted it no issue. Tried to restore from Time Capsule and was told that my backup was corrupted. Not too worried as I had everything backed up and had the disc for the 10.5. Leopard that originally came with the computer. Thought I would install the OSX then go through the process of upgrading and installing everything else.
    I had just successfully completed the new installation of the OSX (absolutely no issues). I then received an error message and the machine shut down with the darkening curtain coming in top to bottom. Now, it will power on to the Apple logo but no spinning time clock below. Cannot boot to recovery by Command-r.
    Thoughts about what could be wrong? Seems like an issue bigger than my hard drive. Does it pay to put money into this computer at this point? I am sure just having someone diagnose the issue will be several hundred dollars.
    Thanks for all your thoughts.

    Scottadel wrote:
    .....had the disc for the 10.5. Leopard that originally came with the computer. Thought I would install the OSX then go through the process of upgrading and installing everything else.
    First off you installed 10.5 on a machine that the firmware has been changed.
    Believe it or not, you could have installed 10.6 from the disk too, it's a full OS X 10.6.3 minus the free iLife, just hold the option key to boot from it. This would have been better as 10.5 has been mothballed basically.
    You can extract your free iLife from the 10.5 disks with Pacifist from CharlesSoft.
    Thought I would install the OSX then go through the process of upgrading and installing everything else.
    Does this mean you installed 10.5, then upgraded to 10.6, then upgraded to 10.7?
    I then received an error message and the machine shut down with the darkening curtain coming in top to bottom.
    That's a kernel panic. Could have come from third party software (if you installed it), or else it's bad OS X install somewhere along the line.
    Now, it will power on to the Apple logo but no spinning time clock below. Cannot boot to recovery by Command-r.
    Command r "Recovery Partition" only works in 10.7 and 10.8, so if 10.7 didn't get installed, you don't have one as it's a new boot drive.
    If you only got 10.5 on that machine it could be because 10.5's time there was no SSD's.
    You need to use the 10.6.3 disk, erase the entire drive and format OS X Extended Journaled, install 10.6.3 and Software Update to 10.6.8. before doing 10.7 or 10.8.
    Check out my User Tips here
    https://discussions.apple.com/community/notebooks/macbook_pro?view=documents
    BTW Apple can't help you as it's your SSD. If you want them to take care of it, remove the SSD and have them place their own new hard drive in there, test the machine and install 10.7 or 10.8, then if the machine is fine, take it home and use Carbon Copy Cloner with SATA to USB adapter, erase and clone to the SSD and try that.
    Also because SSD;'s are rather new, there might be some more tricks like enabling TRIM etc. on them or it could be a problem with that particular SSD and Macs.
    See MacOwnersSupportGroup, they have more experience with SSD's.

  • Please Help!  MBP Won't Turn On... T_T

    So, my beloved MBP (2.4Ghz Core 2 Duo) finally bit the dust after years of service. Today, after work, when I press the power button, the sleep light turns on and I hear the faint sound of hard disk activation for a second. The screen stays black and there is never a startup chime. I've changed the RAM and hooked it up to an external monitor, but the monitor gets no signal and the MBP still does not turn on (same symptoms). After I leave it like this for 30+ minutes, nothing changes, but the laptop does get warm.
    So, is the motherboard dead? Please help!!!

    Although the lack of a startup chime bodes of other things, it may well be worth taking in the computer with this Apple article in hand:
    http://support.apple.com/kb/TS2377
    Your MBP has the nVidea 8600M GT chipset that is the subject of the Apple Repair Extension Program (REP) that the article details. Apple Stores and AASPs have a test gadget that will determine if the nVidea chipset has failed. If it has, the repair is free to you for a period of four years from date of purchase whether you have AppleCare or not. The repair consists of installing a new logic board.
    As you are in NYC, there should be an Apple Store nearby.
    If they determine the chipset has not failed, then you have the option of asking for a "Depot Repair." This is a flat fee service that pretty much fixes anything they find wrong as long as the case does not show evidence of damage. The fee is around US$300--much cheaper than a new computer. I do not know if the replaced DVD drive will negate your qualification for this service.
    One late-breaking thought: if you use headphones, can you here the startup chimes?

  • At what temperature should I start worrying about my MBP overheating?  Anytime I do video or most java stuff, it cranks up to about 180

    15" 2007 MBP
    I know these tend to run hot, but when it burns on the touch, I'm concerned something is overheating. Other than a dead battery (that I'm replacing), EVERYTHING else about the machine runs great.  Should I be concerned, or just pay extra attention to providing free flow of air around the underside of machine and the fan output?
    Thanks!
    -Shane

    You're my personal genius bar! Yes, the CPU is running hot.  I have the iStat Nano widget and it lists CPU, GPU Diode, GPU Heatsink, Heatsink 1, and Heatskink 2 all listed separately but within about 10ºF of one another. Average temp hovers around 115ºF, but 180ºF is about as hot as it gets.  Seems outrageous to me, but I'll take your word if that is perfectly normal for some processes.
    Thanks for your help tonight!

  • MBP overheating when running any app using webcam - Skype - Photobooth

    My MacBook Pro (2007) overheats each time when using skype. checked and the same applies to photobooth.
    My MBP's screen was freezing up as the unit heated up using Skype. I initially thought it was the purchase of a 2560X1440 monitor forcing my graphics card to work harder but the problems are replicated even without my external monitor.
    Apple replaced my motherboard/graphics card for the second time yesterday as it was apparently among the defective nVidia units. I took the opportunity to upgrade my hard-drive to 500GB (from 320). My fans and heat sinks were also cleared of all dust.
    I restored my system from time machine.
    When running skype or photobooth, the unit immediately begins to heat-up again.
    I have checked the forums and have installed fan-control to no avail. I have also checked activity monitor with the following results:
    Initially mdcontrol and mds were running 90%+ cpu causing temperatures to spike up over 90 celsius (190+ fahrenheit). they have dropped off now, seems spotlight index needed to be finished after restoring my system.
    With a test of photo booth now, it uses 76% of CPU. Temperature rapidly ramped up to over 74 Celsius (161) with fans at over 5400 RPM. I also have a massive 22cm laptop cooling fan to help out. The system stays at these high temperatures as long as the webcam is running using photobooth or skype. The system drops to "normal" temperatures immediately after dropping webcam useage.
    I have also added an external webcam to see if the problem repeats (Logitech C510). The problem seems worse with temperatures immediately spiking to over 95 degrees Celsius (203 fahrenheit). It is an HD camera so i guess it needs more processing bandwidth.
    I would add that the temperature spike is occurring on CPU A (according to iStat Nano). The GPU Diode rises to but did not jump over 70 Celsius.
    The problem thus appears to be software linked.
    I use skype continuously for work so this is a major issue. There has been a recent update to Skype but my machine was running hot and crashing before then as well.
    At least now with the new board it is not immediately crashing my machine but it is only a matter of time until it begins to fail as well.
    Is anybody else having these problems? Any fixes? This is not normal, it did not occur in the past (at least I don't recall this).
    Thanks

    Allan,
    Thanks will look at disabling spotlight. I don't use safari so there should not be a problem there.
    Main issue is still Skype (can replicate effect with photobooth). Seems that webcam use and skype (iSight or external webcam) will rapidly spike temperatures and cpu use.
    One of the threads mentioned the OnyX utility helping solve the issues. I ran this to clear a lot of things from my machine.
    It seems to have solved many of the issues (though I don't know which was the culprit). Whatever it was came from my original user files/settings as these were the only elements I transferred following my full reformat and reinstall.
    My machine - with fan control and external laptop cooling fan - now stays below 70 degrees though the internal fans are then running at 5700rpm (aggressive settings used). CPU use for Skype at around 76%. Just had a 20 min skype call to test that.
    So OnyX may have solved the problem. My thanks to the developers. May have been able to save replacing the mother board and a full reinstall as a result.

  • MBP overheating -bad-

    I can't seem to find anywhere on the internet that says what a good temperature for a MBP is, but I feel like mine is ridiculously overheating. I -do- play World of Warcraft, which is the -only- game I play on this computer. I installed one of those programs that tells you how hot your computer is, and it peaked at 201 degrees Fahrenheit.
    What do I do? I don't want anything to fry. It hasn't shut off or anything, and I changed the settings on that program so the fan runs a little faster in order to keep my computer cool.
    I have a genius appt on Monday, but is there anything I should try to keep it cool until then? I don't have AppleCare anymore, so I'm terrified of having to replace something.

    xxMagic --
    Welcome to Apple Discussions!
    We're not staff, but other Mac users here, asking questions and sharing solutions.
    This seems to have something to do with your last post on Fan Noise:
    Click Below:
    http://discussions.apple.com/message.jspa?messageID=12658274#12658274
    You were advised there to run the Hardware Test . . .
    If you can't do that, then don't play WOW on there til after Monday.
    What happens when you shut it down and wait 5 minutes or so? Does it cool down?

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