HVX-200 and P2 rant

It's really becoming a pain for me to work with Premiere and After Effects CS4 so I gotta vent a little.
I'm doing Post FX and Color Correction in After Effects. I edited the movie in Premiere CS4 (started a bit in CS3 but movied over).
Ok I shoot 24pa (with is basically 24 progressive frames captured though 60i). In CS 2,3 Premiere and After Effects both removed the extra frames automatically.
Now since Late last year, I have to remember 'interpret footage' and check the box in Premiere. OK so I can lasso a bunch of files at once and do it in one shot. But all the time I bring in new clips and sometime I forget to 'check the box'
Or worse, MEDIA BROWSER makes searching through P2 clips a breeze. Hell I can even pick in and out's with dragging the clip in. Except, I have to remember to 'Interpret footage' for each one I pull in.
Ok I'm whining..but it gets worse!!!
There's that great 'replace with After Effects' feature. Being able to fix a shot in AE makes editing so much easier for me.
Except you have to do the 'INTERPRET FOOTAGE' DANCE AGAIN!!!!!!! Even if you did it in Premiere already. And this time it's not so easy, more clicks. But I'm, only doing one or two shots at a time in Premiere so it's not that annoying.
So the cut's done (locked), let's finish the color correction in AE where I have much more powerful tools available and 32 bit float.
Before I knew what I'm about to tell you I had 45 shots in a 10 minute reel as separate AE files.
WTF When I 'import Premiere pro project' in AE. Every single AE file in the project is MISSING. I have to manually tell it where each file is located.
That was 8 months ago. I still use AE to finish almost everything I do but I'm disappointed in Premiere. I'm actually thick enough to hope 4.1 gets something right, I'm afraid there to worried about RED.
Rant's over for now.

First and foremost, watch this tutorial:
P2 Workflow Tutorial
1. They stay the same size. All that happens is that a quicktime wrapper is wrapped around them, and audio and video are combined. No loss is quality occurs.
2. A SATA RAID will do you fine, but honestly I have been editing this and Varicam footage using 2 G-Raid firewire 800 drives. You need at least a firewire 800 drive, but I'd recommend a SATA Raid. Sonnet, Weibetech, Firmtek and Burly boxes...all work well.
3. Copy the P2 cards to field drives. Bring them in and transfer to firewire drives. These drives are your TAPE MASTERS. Do not erase these, do not lose these. Store these as your would field masters. I myself use internal SATA drives in a single firewire case that I swap out the drives. Cheaper than multiple enclosed drives. From there you import to your Media drives...your SATA Raid.
4. No need to offline. DVCPRO HD really doesn't take up that much space...roughly twice what DV takes. Oh...you are going 1080 24p. That takes 42.12 GB/hour DV takes about 13GB/hour.
5. Editing at full resolution is fine and easy. But you will not be able to get away with firewire 400 drives. As I said, FW800 or greater. 1080i might require more, thus the need for the SATA Raid.
I believe that you need at least a Dua 1Ghz machine for DVCPRO HD, and you have that...and you have enough RAM...so you are good. The only choking point you will have is render times. Especially when compressing for DVD. 90 min show took me 14 hours...oof.
And read my Blog about working with the HVX...click on Underdog to get there.
Shane

Similar Messages

Panasonic HVX-200 and FCPX import issue

I'm using a Panasonic HVX-200 and having trouble importing the data from the P2 cards into FCPX. I get this error message: The following clip encountered an error during import and is still referencing media on the camera: The files play as long as the camera is connected, which is useless in the long run.

I was on the phone today with several terrific Apple techs for about five hours and we may have gotten to the bottom of this.
FCPX works well with many different recording formats of the HVX 200 and the p2 cards. But I have had issues with importing 720/30PN footage. It just would not work.
After many hours of trouble shooting with me on the phone, the Apple tech was able to replicate the problem on an HVX 200 at their office.
Apparently FCPX works with HVX 200 1080i, 480i, just about any footage except the 720 set.
He opened an inquiry with the FCPX engineering department and they are looking into it.

HVX 200 and FCP 4.5 - workflow RAIDS?

Hello,
I am about to embark on a show editing footage captured on the Panasonic HVX 200, shot in 1080i/24p. This will be my first time working with the P2 cards and setting up a raid array catering to the specifics of this project. The show was captured on those P2 cards. The shots are totaled at 1.5TB of MXF files. I have many questions. First off
1. What happens to the MXF files when FCP unwraps them, do they get bigger or smaller
2. What is the most efficient raid set up to edit on, in terms of speed and transfer rate
3. What is the most efficient back up system?
4. Will an offline edit be troublesome, due to the time code on the P2 cards
5. Will I need to edit at full resolution? What is the data transfer rate at full res? Will 400fw drives be able to handle this, or do I need 800, or even an esata raid solution.
Please suggest any gear, or certain models of drives. I am looking for the cheapest solution w/out compromising performance
I will be editing the show on a power Mac G5 1.8 GHZ, 3.5 GB of ram, do you think I need more ram? Is my computer fast enough to edit this sort of a project?
Thanks for the input, you guys and gals always come through
Take Care
Anon
Post Response

First and foremost, watch this tutorial:
P2 Workflow Tutorial
1. They stay the same size. All that happens is that a quicktime wrapper is wrapped around them, and audio and video are combined. No loss is quality occurs.
2. A SATA RAID will do you fine, but honestly I have been editing this and Varicam footage using 2 G-Raid firewire 800 drives. You need at least a firewire 800 drive, but I'd recommend a SATA Raid. Sonnet, Weibetech, Firmtek and Burly boxes...all work well.
3. Copy the P2 cards to field drives. Bring them in and transfer to firewire drives. These drives are your TAPE MASTERS. Do not erase these, do not lose these. Store these as your would field masters. I myself use internal SATA drives in a single firewire case that I swap out the drives. Cheaper than multiple enclosed drives. From there you import to your Media drives...your SATA Raid.
4. No need to offline. DVCPRO HD really doesn't take up that much space...roughly twice what DV takes. Oh...you are going 1080 24p. That takes 42.12 GB/hour DV takes about 13GB/hour.
5. Editing at full resolution is fine and easy. But you will not be able to get away with firewire 400 drives. As I said, FW800 or greater. 1080i might require more, thus the need for the SATA Raid.
I believe that you need at least a Dua 1Ghz machine for DVCPRO HD, and you have that...and you have enough RAM...so you are good. The only choking point you will have is render times. Especially when compressing for DVD. 90 min show took me 14 hours...oof.
And read my Blog about working with the HVX...click on Underdog to get there.
Shane

Panasonic HVX 200 and Importing

I have recently baught a new Imac 2.0GHz Intel Core 2 Duo with 1 GB ram. When i try to import P2 cards using my camera into the computer the P2 wont display on the desktop. I also have an older version laptop thats running the new FCP 6.0.2. When using that computer it works fine. After i connect my camera and press the button on the camera the p2 cards display on the desktop and i have no problem importing. On the new Mac it wont even show on the desktop, or when i go to FCP 6.0.2 it wont show there either. On the camera it says disconnect instead of connect, this is when iam connected to the new imac. On the old apple laptop it says connect as the status when i am connected, which is what it should say.
I know its weird, buh im having a hard time understanding whats the problem. I have installed all updates from apple and still no go. please help. thank you

I have used panny's P2CMS and love it. I use it all the time to check clips and files after I copy them over to external drives to verify that my files are good before I wipe the cards. Here is a link with all the panny downloads.
http://panasonic.sixbullets.net/
Good Luck
Al

Final Cut and HVX 200 issues

Forgive the new guy question, but:
I shot something on an HVX 200, and am trying to cut it on FCP 5.14. Unfortunately, the great Mac Gods had other ideas.
While I can see my work in the P2 viewer window, only a few of the clips will import into Final Cut Pro. And when they get there, I cannot view them (FCP is telling me that my DVCPro 720p60fps is [missing], does anyone know where I can download one?). Also, I want to drop frame down to 24p, but the feature that my Workflow documents tells me is under tools simply isn't there.
Help! Any advice or info would be most helpful.

changing the frame rate after it's shot doesn't work. you need to set the frame rate while shooting. in the hvx200 there is no need of a tool to remove frames to give you a frame rate converter 'cause it does it in camera in "pn" modes. that tool is more for varicam footage that you have injested and need to extract the rates that were printed in the user bits for "OFFSPEED" shooting. like 48 over 24 gives you half speed slo mo. be aware that audio won't be part of the resulting conversion.

HVX 200 P2 Workflow

Hi All:
I have a project that will be shot on the HVX 200 at 720p PAL. They are shooting in Berlin, I am cutting in the US.
I thought they could give me quicktimes thru media Manager in OfflineRT HD - 25 posted on my FTP site.
I would later send back and EDL or XML for them to do the online in London.
My problem is that they don't know if they will finish on a Flame or an Avid DS, so I don't know how either box can read in the EDL or XML for the final conform from the P2 media.
Has anybody done any jobs on FCP with the HVX 200 and finished in another system that is not FCP?
Thanks,
Gualex

This is tricky enough when you have footage on TAPE...tapeless will be QUITE different. So you want imported QTs that are media managed to OFFLINE RT...then to match back to Avid or Flame. Oof. If you do that...test test test. I myself don't like complications. The less complicated you can make things, then better.
Have them nail down how they will online. That will pretty much determine what workflow you set up. And given the two choices, I'd avoid using FCP for this at all. Use Avid. It is cheaper now, $2500 for the software media composer, and I hear it is quite good (I have 2.8, awaiting 3.0). This way, if you online on an Avid, no problem...they should relink to the masters easily. And transcoding from full res to offline codecs is pretty simple. And I know there are ways to get from Avid to Flame in place...just not sure about the tapeless workflow in this case however. It bears testing...lots of it.
Shane

Does Premiere Elements support DVCPRO-HD? How do I ingest and work with HD-footage from HVX-200?

Hi there,
I work with Premiere Elements 11 on a windows PC, and I try to ingest HD-footage from Panasonic HVX-200 Camcorder. Premiere Elements only recognizes thumbnails, but not the footage itself? What do I have to do? Or does Elements only support SD-footage? Do I have to install DVCPRO-HD Codec? Where do I get it then?
Thanks for your help!, yours Mike

Welcome to the forum.
PrE does support HD material, just not all of it.
With DVCPRO HD on P2 media, I am not sure that you will be able to work directly with the media files from your Panasonic in PrE. This is the list of supported formats: http://help.adobe.com/en_US/premiereelements/using/WSeffff8bffc802084-1665492e133c9c19956- 8000.html#WS300DE01D-F057-4639-96D1-F99EEE163C24
PrPro can Import and edit DVCPRO HD on P2 media. The Panasonic P2, along with its metadata is supported: http://www.adobe.com/products/premiere/extend.html
Good luck,
Hunt

Difference Between 720p30pn and 720p30p on HVX-200 for Music Video Shoot

I'm shooting a music video on the HVX-200. I'm new to the camera and the manual offers little explanation as to the difference/advantages/disadvantages between 720p30pn and 720p30p recording format. I want to shoot VFR (variable frame rates) and mix it with the footage which I think only works with the 720p30p recording format.
Does anyone know the differences/advantages/disadvantages of 720p30pn and 720p30p?
As I'm going for the "film look" of 24fps, which setting on the camera do I use? I'm assuming that I use the 720p30 recording format setting and not the 720p24 as I'm obviously not outputting to film, but then again, I could be wrong.
I do know when I was testing the P2 workflow that when I was doing the VFR (variable frame rate), it was unplayable even with rendering on FCP 5.1. I'm sure I had some funky disconnect between the recording frame rate and sequence settings on FCP. Does anyone know which recording format works integrating both footage shot at 1x and variable and what is the corresponding sequence setup settings on FCP?
Thanks for the help.

Why not shoot 720/24pNative for the "film look."
With the default frame setting in the video or the film mode?
You will mimic part of the "film look" out of the cam rather than addressing it in post, and you increase the amount of footage that can be recorded to a p2 card by recording only 24 frames rather than an over 60 recording.
Play with the scene files for the look you want to add to the "film look."
Remember that the shallow DOF characteristic of the "film look" can't be readily achieved with a stock HVX200.

Output to P2 cards on Panasonic HVX 200

When I print to video using the DVC Pro HD Firewire to a Panasonic HVX 200, the audio goes into mono mode, even though the original file is in stereo. I have a big presentation to more than 400 on Friday. Any thoughts about how to fix this? Here's what I've tried:
1. Went to audio/video settings:av devices. The options button doesn't let me make any changes--and shows eight channels of audio. (When I do print to video and select built in audio, it does play on my computer speakers in stereo.)
2. I've also tried to go into User Preferences:audio outputs. The only thing I could change was the grouping (stereo or dual mono) There was an option fo rchanging the outputs to more than 2, but I don't believe that would work.
If I can't I'll probably need to show it as a DVD instead of in high def., which would be very disappointing.

720 pN24 records 24 frames/sec not 29.97 with pull down added. This means there is a longer time between each progressive frame than people who are used to viewing standard video can get a grip on. It can look "stuttery".
Camera movement while recording at cinematic rates requires very smooth, very deliberate moves as well as attention to the shutter settings.
There is a formula (someplace) that relates camera panning movement to field of view to frames per sec to shutter.
x

Slow motion hvx 200

hi
have been out testing with the hvx 200 trying to get a slow dreamy effect in camare. whats the right way to go about it.
we chage the frame rate to 32 37 50 what the hvx 200 would let us do and the thing is all of the above came out as 50fps in fcp apart from 25 which came out as 25 fps. we are not recording to p2 card but to a firestore and i belive we don't have to do any thing there or am i wrong!
ok taking the fottage into motion and using timeramp is one great way to go but in camare is all ways best. any tips would be great to recive on how to do it.
cheers
trevor with a bad cold

Are you trying variable frame rates on the same drive (firestore)? If so, I think you have to shoot your slow mo stuff on to the firestore then off load the footage and switch back when you have what you need.
...If I read your question right.
Caleb

2 hvx 200 shoot with 4 firestores what is transfer time of firestore to mac

2 hvx 200 shoot with 4 firestores. Firestores are 100gb models. Transfer will be done with macbooks 2.0 2gb ram, macbook pros 2.xx 2gb ram, and a possible powerbook g4 ????processor, ??ram. How longshould it take in your experiences to transfer a pretty full drive 80-99gbs hypotheticallt ro any of these machines.
Thanks.

No we did not have a shortage of HD space we had two cpu, 4 firestores for a couple hr concert. The firestores ended up taking 1.5 closer 2 hrs to download. We lost 1 camera for 20-30 minutes due to lack of firestore space.We probably would of been fine except one of the firestores was acting funky. That is one of the drawbacks of being low budget. We should of had 6 firestores but $ is a reality and a pain. Overall though things went quite well. We recorded timecode via wireless to the cameras and and audio to a 744t and DV40 fostex and will be syncing it at Sony tomorrow. I'm sure there will bee breaks as wireless is wireless.
thanks

Capturing 24p from the HVX-200

I just filmed some footage, with the Panasonic HVX-200. I filmed in 480/24p on a tape. when capturing it in FCP do I choose DV50-NTSC 24p, or DV-NTSC 24p in the easy set up menu? I think its DV50, Im just not 100% sure. IF anyone can help me out I would really appreciate it.
Stephen.....

Yup...pretty sure...
#23 Differences between 24p and 24pA
Shane's Stock Answer #23
Quoting Ken Stone's site found at:
http://www.kenstone.net/fcphomepage/24p_in_FCPnattress.html
24p Normal
When shooting in 24p Normal, the camera is adding normal standard 3:2 pulldown to the video, which results in 24p footage designed to work with any non-linear editing suite and it will play back and look good directly to any NTSC monitor. You can use 24p Normal footage just like normal video from any DV camera, and everything will work fine, but obviously, the footage will have a film look to it. If you’re just going straight back to NTSC video tape, then using 24p Normal is the simplest, easiest workflow. No special treatment of the footage is needed and you really can just edit as normal.
24p Advanced
Before you shoot 24p Advanced, you should fully understand it’s workflow implications. If you watch 24p Advanced footage before you’ve removed it’s pulldown, then it will look a bit jumpy and jerky. This is totally correct, because 24p Advanced is not designed to be viewed as is.
To use 24p Advanced and gain all it’s advantages, you should know that you cannot edit it as is (as this would leave it’s jerky looking pulldown intact), but you must first remove it’s pulldown. Final Cut Pro will do this for you, leaving you with the 24p footage without any of the extra “padding” fields that are added to make it’s frame rate 29.97fps. Now that your footage is 23.98fps, it must be edited on a 23.98fps timeline, and this can cause problems if you, for instance, want to include other footage, B-Roll, or stock footage, that comes from a different source. However, once you have your finished edit at 23.98fps, you can make a 24p DVD, which will allow you to compress your MPEG2 less than if you were making a normal 29.97fps NTSC DVD, and hence attain higher picture quality. Similarly, if you’re making a web movie, you will find it easier to get a higher quality result from 23.98fps media than normal NTSC media. 23.98fps movies are also easier to take out to film that 29.97fps movies.
If you are editing in a 23.98fps timeline, Final Cut Pro will add pulldown on the fly, over Firewire, so that you can see your movie on a normal NTSC monitor. Similarly, it will add pulldown when going back to DV tape. However, this will not work on a non-DV format output, say to Digital Betacam, and slower Macintoshes do not have the power to add 3:2 pulldown in realtime, falling back to lower quality pulldowns which although are not too bad while editing, will not make the final project look as acceptably good on television as a final product.
What that tells me is that 24P just adds a "look" of 24 fps to the footage that resembles that of telecined film, but that you work with normally at 29.97fps. Or, if you want to, you can add a reverse telecine and work at 23.98. Either way.
BUT, with 24PA, the footage looks jittery when played on the tape. So sure, you can work with it and output it to tape, but that tape is useless to anyone OTHER than someone who can capture it and perform a reverse telecine to work with it. It will not work as a Master tape for any viewable purpose: Broadcast TV, projected video from tape, a master tape for dubbing purposes. So, in effect, it is useless as a tape master, and should be avoided.
If you want to have a tape master, shoot and edit 24P at the 29.97 framerate.
Shane

Can I shoot slow motion on HVX-200 keeping 1080i/24P without FCP Conversion

I've been reading many threads, but haven't figured if you can actually shoot true 1080i/24P on my HVX-200 with menu frame rate set to 60fps/shutter 60fps. The times I've tried it shows 24P in the menu frame rate and will not playback on the P2 in true slow motion so I can import into FCP slow motion at 1080i/24P without conversion.
From everything I've seen it shows it has to be in 720/24P with menu frame rate at 60fps/shutter 60fps which will let it playback on the P2 in slow motion.
Any suggestions? We want to shoot everything in 1080i/24P but see instant playback in slow motion without conversion mostly for music videos.
Thanks, Paul
www.IllusiveMedia.com

haven't figured if you can actually shoot true 1080i/24P on my HVX-200 with menu frame rate set to 60fps/shutter 60fps
You can't. 720p is the only format that is 60fps. 1080i is 30fps.
From everything I've seen it shows it has to be in 720/24P with menu frame rate at 60fps/shutter 60fps which will let it playback on the P2 in slow motion.
Correct. You can only shoot in-camera slow motion at 720p60, using the 24p setting. And this is also the way to shoot so you can slow it down later with Cinema Tools or in FCP. It must be 720p60. Again, 1080i is 30fps only. Even 1080p...30fps with DVCPRO HD.
Any suggestions? We want to shoot everything in 1080i/24P but see instant playback in slow motion without conversion mostly for music videos.
Sorry, if you want to shoot smooth slow motion, you need to shoot 720p. If you must shoot 1080p, then you need to invest in good post slow-motion options, like Twixtor.
Shane

HVX-200 can't mount using the iMac Firewire 800?

My specs are Mac OS X 10.6.6 , iMac 2.8 i5 with 12GB of ram.
I'm trying to mount an HVX-200 Panasonic using P2 cards on my new computer via the iMac's Firewire.
Each time I connect, load up the camera. It always gives me a disconnect message on the camera. I can't mount my camera at all! I tried this using a Firewire 400 setup on a friends older machine, no problem.
Btw, I had to by a $40+ 9-pin to 4-pin Firewire cable on the Apple store and pay shipping just to find out all this is not working...
Any suggestions here?

That cable is fine with the iMac - I am more concerned with your camcorder; see page 10 of the FAQ:
+Does 24PN have a IEEE 1394 (Firewire) mode?+
+No, 24PN (and 30PN) modes do not transmit data over the IEEE 1394 (“firewire”) interface. The P2 HD camcorders only transmit SMPTE-compliant data streams over the 1394 interface, and 24PN/30PN recordings are unique modes that do not comply to established streaming protocols. Accordingly, 1394 output is disabled when using a Native mode.+
As I said, I know nothing about your camcorder, but I think it is time for you to contact the mfr and/or the store where you bought it and ask questions about these data streams and FW compliance. In the link I sent previously (description of such a cable) it said that both devices must be compliant and, according to these FAQs, it may not?

HVX-200 import blurry (double-images) into CS4?!

I am using Premiere CS4 and I imported footage from Panasonic HVX-200 shot at 720PN 24p format.
I am importing using the 720P 24P DVCPROHD preset.
For some reason all my footage comes out blurry (I see double images when a subject moves, as if I have frames blending together)
Can someone tell me what may be causing this?
Thanks,
Aza

No red line, I did render the clips... After checking just now, I only see it in the program monitor, the source monitor appears fine.
Here are the sequence settings I used (copied and pasted directly from the settings window)...
General
Editing mode: P2 720p 60Hz DVCPROHD
Timebase: 23.976fps
Video Settings
Frame size: 960h 720v (1.3333)
Frame rate: 23.976 frames/second
Pixel Aspect Ratio: HD Anamorphic 1080 (1.333)
Fields: No Fields (Progressive Scan)
Audio Settings
Sample rate: 48000 samples/second
Default Sequence
Total video tracks: 3
Master track type: Stereo
Mono tracks: 4

HVX-200 and P2 rant

Similar Messages

Maybe you are looking for