Is the JPEG compression option on TIF files lossy or lossless?

I accidentally used the JPEG compression on some important TIFF images. I usually use
no compression but didn't realise the option had been chosen. I can't easily re-scan. I have
read about lossless JPEG and with TIF considered a lossless format I had hoped this may
be the case.

Similar Messages

Is there any way to reduce the JPEG compression ap...

I'm wondering if there is any way to reduce the fierce amount of JPEG compression applied to photos taken with the 6220 classic? I'm 99.99% sure that there isn't, but I thought I'd ask anyway.
I'm a professional graphic designer with 15 years experience, and as such understand the technicalities of digital imaging better than most.
What the general public fails to understand is that ever higher megapixelage doesn't automatically equate to ever higher quality images.
The 6220 classic has a 5MP camera, which is one of the reasons I bought it, along with the fact that it has a Xenon flash and a proper lens cover. Its imaging quality also generally gets very positive reviews online.
However, the 6220 classic takes far poorer photos than my 5 year old Olympus digital camera which only shoots 4MP. Why is this? Many reasons. The Olympus has a much larger imaging chip, onto which the image is recorded (physical size as opposed to pixel dimensions), a far superior lens (physical size & quality of materials), optical (not digital) zoom, and the ability to set various levels of JPEG compression, from fierce (high compression, small files, low quality images) to none at all (no compression, large files, high quality TIFF-encoded images).
When I first used the camera on the 6220 classic (I've never owned a camera phone before) I was appalled at the miniscule file sizes. A 2592 x 1944 pixel image squashed into a few hundred kilobytes makes a mockery of having decent pixel dimensions in the first place, but then the average consumer neither cares about nor would notice the difference. They're not going to be examining & working on their images in Photoshop on a 30" Apple Cinema Display.
Is fierce JPEG compression (and an inability to alter it) the norm with camera phones, or do other camera phones (perhaps from other manufacturers) allow greater latitude in how images are compressed?
Thanks.
Solved!
Go to Solution.

Believe me, I was very aware that this was a phone with a camera attached, not a dedicated camera, before I bought it. I went into this with my eyes open. I knew the lens, imaging chip, zoom, etc, would all be grossly inferior, but given all of this, surely the phone manufacturers should help to compensate for this by adding a few lines of code to the software to reduce (or ideally remove) the JPEG compression, or at least give the user the option to do so if they want? The fierce compression just makes images obtained with compromised hardware even worse than they would have been otherwise.
It adds insult to injury and is totally unnecessary, especially given that the memory card in the 6200 classic is 1GB but the one in my Olympus is only 128 MB! It's not as if lack of storage space is an issue! On the Olympus I can only take about 8 pictures without compression (although I could obviously buy a much larger memory card). On the 6220 classic, given the ridiculous amount of compression, there's room for over 1200 photos! It would be far better to let 70 uncompressed images be stored than 1200 compressed ones. Does anyone seriously need to take over a thousand photos on a camera phone without having access to a computer to offload them? I doubt it.
Also, compressing the images requires processing power, which equals time. If they were saved uncompressed, the recovery time between shots would be reduced, although obviously writing the larger files to memory may offset this somewhat.
Just to give people an idea, an uncompressed 8-bit RGB TIFF with pixel dimensions of 2592 x 1944 takes up approximately 14.5 MB of space. (The exact number of bytes varies slightly depending on the header information stored with the file). The 3 photos I've taken so far with the 6220 classic (and that I've decided to actually keep) have files sizes of 623, 676 & 818 KB respectively. An average of these 3 sizes is 706 KB. 706 KB is less than 5% the size of 14.5 MB, which means that, on average, the camera, after is records the 5038848 pixels in an image, throws over 95% of them away.
I'm deeply unimpressed.

Changing default jpeg compression for Web Gallery files

I have created several web galleries from both Raw and Jpeg files with Iphoto '08 that suffer from serious jpeg compression artifacts. I haven't found any way to change the compression amount to reduce the artifacts. Is there actually a way?

papasteveo:
Welcome to the Apple Discussions. There is no way in iPhoto for the user to manage the jpg compression of the web gallery photos. If the option for visitors to download the photos is selected the copy that's uploaded is compressed approximately equivalent to an Photoshop quality setting of 8 or 9 out of 12. The pixel dimensions are the same as the original unless the max dimension in the original exceeds 3054. The the file is resized to 3054 max dimension.
If the gallery is just for viewing the image is resized to 800 x 600 with additional compression.
You could manually replace the file with one that you've prepared but it would be very tedious as each file has it's own folder and the file name is changed to web.jpg (viewing only) or large.jpg (download). You would have to rename each file to be uploaded to the new name and make sure it's placed in the correct folder.
Do you Twango?
TIP: For insurance against the iPhoto database corruption that many users have experienced I recommend making a backup copy of the Library6.iPhoto database file and keep it current. If problems crop up where iPhoto suddenly can't see any photos or thinks there are no photos in the library, replacing the working Library6.iPhoto file with the backup will often get the library back. By keeping it current I mean backup after each import and/or any serious editing or work on books, slideshows, calendars, cards, etc. That insures that if a problem pops up and you do need to replace the database file, you'll retain all those efforts. It doesn't take long to make the backup and it's good insurance.
I've created an Automator workflow application (requires Tiger), iPhoto dB File Backup, that will copy the selected Library6.iPhoto file from your iPhoto Library folder to the Pictures folder, replacing any previous version of it. It's compatible with iPhoto 08 libraries. iPhoto does not have to be closed to run the application, just idle. You can download it at Toad's Cellar. Be sure to read the Read Me pdf file.

Converting Tif file to GIF or JPEG

Could you provide me with an example to convert a TIF file to GIF or JPEG with the JIMI or tell me of a good link where I can learn how to do this?. I downloaded the JIMI library but I cannot find documentation or a clear example to carry out this conversion.

Do you know how the JIMI converts multi-paged TIF files into several JPEG or GIG files? The Jimireader could read only the first page of a TIF file. But I could not get the other pages of the TIF file. The code that I wrote to extract the first page was:
try {
JimiReader reader= Jimi.createJimiReader"C:/MRFleSto/4.tif");
i = reader.getNumberOfImages();
java.awt.Image img = reader.getImage();
.... more code to put the image in a call to convert it
reader.close();
} catch(Exception e){}
It turns out that i (the number of images) returns -1; never the total number of pages in the file. Also the getNextImage method of the JimiReader is "protected" (that is, removed from the class) and cannot be used.

Explain Compression Options when Saving as TIFF

Adobe PhotoShop CS5 offers three options for convertion of a RAW file to TIFF (LZW, ZIP, and JPEG).
I would appreciate if someone can help me to make sense of the following.
I do not understand which of these employ the "run-length encoding" scheme that should make the TIFF
file much smaller than the RAW file. I have used all three types of compression but the only one that
resulted in a subtantial reduction in size was the JPEG compression.
The TIFF file with no compression is actually twice the size of the raw file.
What are the LZW and ZIP compressions actually doing?
Thanks

How did you arrive at the conclusion that the tif should be smaller than the RAW-file?
jpg is a lossy compression, so best avoided uo until the final output.
As for lzw and zip (from the Help):
LZW (Lemple-Zif-Welch) Lossless compression; supported by TIFF, PDF, GIF, and PostScript language file formats. Most useful for images with large areas of single color.
ZIP Lossless compression; supported by PDF and TIFF file formats. Like LZW, ZIP compression is most effective for images that contain large areas of single color.
So image-noise for example can negate all savings and I think zip with 16bit is a problem.

Illustrator applescript jpeg export options

Mac, Illustrator CS4, Applescript
I need of a jpeg droplet that converts Illustrator files to jpegs. I was able to create one using the Image - Duplicate as JPEG.scpt script that comes with OSX by just adding .AI to the list of files to convert.
The problem is that Image Events was creating jpegs of my Illustrator CS4 files at 150ppi when i need smaller jpegs.
I changed the code to use Illustrator to open and export the jpeg instead of Image Events which does result in a 72ppi jpeg. The problem though is that i cant seem to get any of the jpeg export options to work, it seems like it just exports with default settings.
Id like to change the jpeg compression and id like to export the entire dimensions of the artboard and only the artboard. Artboard Clipping is a property under Jpeg export in the applescript references but it doesnt seem to work so i must be doing something wrong.
Any help would be very much appreciated!
Attached is my applescript.
Thanks
J

OK i changed the code and I think I got it. Instead of setting a myOptions string variable and setting jpeg with myOptions I just typed it in at the export line. I also noticed that the resolution property i put in the options was causing a problem so i took that out.
I attached it for anyone who could use it.
J

Lightroom 2 JPEG Compression Doesn't Compress

I just exported photos at 515px x ~300px as JPEGs with quality on 60 (of 100) and they are about 600kB a piece! They should be about 1/10th that size.
I know this is known LR2 issues. Is there a way to fix it?

I'm not at all surprised if LR export and PS save-for-web are not the same. PS Save-for-web has lots of options, many of which could affect the compression or metadata (and thus the size). It may even be that the jpeg compression engines in the two programs are not the same, and quality 60 may not result in identical compression.
jpeg decompression is an exact process: any decoder should produce the same image from a given jpeg file. However jpeg encoding is not defined as an exact process. Quite a bit is left to choices in the encoder, with trade-offs between processing spent on compression and the resulting efficiency of compression.

Jpeg compression for tiff image (nt gettin a view of jpeg compressd pages)

Hi All,
I have a problem of jpeg compression inside a tiff file. When I convert no. of pages in a multi-page tiff file I m not getting a view of jpeg compressed pages. I convert black and white as well as gray scale jpeg images inside the tiff file. I used Compression Group4 for black and white image and JPEG compression for gray scale image. Also set the dpi of each page. But most of the viewer doesnt support my jpeg compressed pages. When I set the quality of jpeg images to 0.1f that time I m getting a view of particular images for some image viewer.
My requirement is to show the jpeg compressed image inside the IMAGING PREVIEW 2.5 VERSION. But it doesnt support for my output tiff. As well as cant get properties of that page inside the Fax viewer except Resolution 200x200 dpi.
     If anybody has any idea to compressed jpeg image inside the tiff file, please tell me how I can compress the gray scale image using jpeg compression.
Thank you in advance
Dipak

Hi Maxideon,
Thank u 4 ur immediate reply. But my requirement is, to show d tiff file only in IMAGING PREVIEW 2.5 VERSION. I tried lots but didnt manage to get a view of JPEG compressed page. I think somewhere I m doin wrong. Somewhere I wrote wrong code, cause d properties of jpeg compressd images also not getting in Fax Viewer except DPI. I change the BaselineTIFF Tags of JPEG compressed image, but cant manage output yet. I think d problem create at d time of metadata writing. My problem is tht, tiff created using sum other soft. is suppported by IMAGING PREVIEW 2.5 VERSION, y nt mine?
Here is my code for BaselineTIFFTagSet:
if(isBinaryImage) {
             // resolution unit
             rootTiffIFD.addTIFFField(new TIFFField(base.getTag(296), 2));
             // bit per sample
             rootTiffIFD.addTIFFField(new TIFFField(base.getTag(258), 1));
             // compression
             rootTiffIFD.addTIFFField(new TIFFField(base.getTag(259), 4));
             // rows per strip
             rootTiffIFD.addTIFFField(new TIFFField(base.getTag(278), bImageImage.getHeight()));
        } else {
             rootTiffIFD.addTIFFField(new TIFFField(base.getTag(296), 2));
             rootTiffIFD.addTIFFField(new TIFFField(base.getTag(258), 8));
             rootTiffIFD.addTIFFField(new TIFFField(base.getTag(259), 7));
             // thresholding
             rootTiffIFD.addTIFFField(new TIFFField(base.getTag(263), 3));
             rootTiffIFD.addTIFFField(new TIFFField(base.getTag(278), bImageImage.getHeight()));
        }     If u have any idea 4 write a metadata of jpeg page wid jpeg compression, can u plz suggest me hw to write a metadata 4 jpeg image? Which Baseline Tags r needed to set d jpeg compression?
Thank you
-dipak

"convert colors" causes jpeg compression?

I recently had to re-install Acrobat, and since doing so whenever I run my preflight profile which is set to convert spot colors to cmyk, it's also apparently increasing the jpeg compression at the same time. Everything seems to be gaining bad jpeg artifacts after the color conversion (even when the colors being converted have nothing to do with the images).
It may be unrelated, but it also seems to be creating all sorts of ICC profile non-cmyk colors in the process. I.e., before "convert to cmyk for digital printing" I run a preflight that simply checks for non-cmyk colors. This profile warns me that there is a Pantone color in the ad. I check the separation preview and find only one or two things with Pantone colors. I then run the convert fix. The Pantone colors go away, but now there are sometimes dozens of items that are showing up as ICC profile colors, and this seems unfixable. I can't create a profile to convert them.
What's going on? Are there settings somewhere that can select the degree of (or lack of) jpeg compression? Why is it compressing the file at all? I have no such setting selected in the preflight profile. I tried creating a profile that does absolutely nothing at all but convert to cmyk, and it's still causing these problems.
This is using Acrobat 8. It's the same version, same disks, we used before, but these problems are new. I may have a setting wrong somewhere.

You are not making sense, and your methodology is fundamentally flawed.
Hitting Command+S without editing the file is NOT "saving". It's not doing anything at all. The program just idles.
You can verify this by observing that the file's modification date does not change.
Even your limited but flawed methodology will show the degradation if you change even a single pixel before hitting Command+S. Then you will be degrading the image. Just make a one-pixel change, for instance with the pencil tool, then save. That is the same as doing a Save As.
Note that in your original query you were indeed changing a file by converting it to a different color space. THAT is a change.
Independently from the above, your methodology of comparing two layers blended in Difference mode has the inherent limitation of the monitor's performance in displaying the shadows. Your monitor, no matter how high-end, will NOT show you a difference between a 0,0,0 pixel (R,G,B,) and 0,0,1 or 1,0,0 or 1,0,1 for instance. SAme goes for 1,0,2 etc., until you reach the lower threshold of your particular monitor.
There are two preferred methods of comparing two layers to see if they're identical.
Comparing allegedly identical images in Photoshop
The first one, championed by the late, lamented author and guru Bruce Fraser, is as follows [direct quote by copy and paste]:
A better way of comparing images with identical pixel dimensions is to use [Image menu >] Apply Image… > Subtract with an Offset of 128.
Difference only shows pixels that are lighter in the source than in the target (or maybe it's the other way around—I forget) where Subtract with Offset 128 shows differences in both directions.
Pixels that are identical in both images come in as RGB 128 gray, those that are different come in at a value that exactly reflects how different they are.
It also makes it much easier to spot subtle differences…
=== ===
The second one was suggested by someone in the Color Managament and Photoshop Windows forums, which follows:
(NOTE: only the methodology is of interest and pertinent, not the questionable context in which it has brought up and used.)
* 1) Open the two images to be compared in Photoshop
* 2) Move one image as a layer over the other one
* 3) select "Difference" as blending mode in the layers palette
* 4) now the whole image should appear seemingly black on the monitor
[So far this is the traditional, "time honored" method.]
* 5) select the magic wand tool with these settings: Tolerance: 0/ Anti-alias: no/ Contiguous: no/ Sample All Layers: yes
* 6) click somewhere into the formerly gray area
[This refers to an image of a Color-Checker type of card that had wide gray border around it. The test, therefore, requires a pure gray image in the image, something highly unlikely to change, in order for the magic wand to select all pure-black images (255,255,255). Such a border can easily be created around an image by increasing the canvas size and filling the newly created space with pure gray (128,128,128). ]
    Explanation: you just selected all completely black pixels (0,0,0) i.e. all pixels that are identical in both layers.
* 7) you should see "marching ants" forming rectangular patterns
* 8_) invert the selection (Shift Command I)
   Explanation: the selection now covers all the other pixels, i.e. all pixels which are different between both layers.
* 9) create a new empty layer and select it in the layers palette
* 10) set the foreground color to white
* 11) fill the selection with white (Alt+backspace on Windows, accordingly on Mac)
* 12) set the blending modes of all layers back to normal
    Explanation: you now see all identical pixels in their respective color and all different pixels in white.
This method is a lot more sensitive than the traditional one which stops at step #4 above.
Finally:
jfraze wrote:
Wow, the level of hostility is amazing on these adobe forums…
Only because people like you come in here itching for a fight, rather than to seek help. It's just the way you choose to react—and to intereact with others.
Wo Tai Lao Le
我太老了

TIF File Type Reads as PhotoDeluxeBusiness.TIFFile HELP

I use Photoshop 7 and PageMaker 6.5 with Windows XP and after connecting and installing a new Maxtor backup unit all of the .tif files on the computer are now PhotoDeluxeBusiness.TIFFile file types. This computer does not have Photo Deluxe software on it and I do not know where this new file type came from. The problem seems to only be on this computer as images opened on another computer still open as a tif.
The images will still open in Photoshop and appear as normal tif files but they are not recognized by PageMaker and thus all of the images in the PageMaker documents have become unlinked.
b Does anyone know of a way to change the file type back to a normal TIF and a way to re-link the PageMaker documents?

Find a tif file on your system. Right click on that file and select properties. On the General tab click the change button for open with. Now find the program that normally opens tif files when you double click on them.
To see the tiff extention if it is hidden:
In windows explorer, click the tools menu. Click folder options. Click the view tab. Under advanced settings find "Hide extentions for known types". Uncheck the box to see the file extentions.
Note: In the folder options you can change the properties of files extentions there as well.

Jpeg Compressed Tiff images

I am trying to open TIFF files that have Jpeg compression but QT does not support this combo. These have become very standard in the document storage world as type of thumbnail/baby image. Anyone know how to get in contact with someone at Apple to see if they can add this capability? You can view plain jpg and tiff files with QT but not the Jpeg compressed TIFFs.
Mark

Can you please post the code that you are using? com.sun.media.jai.codec.TIFFDecodeParam --> this can help you out.

Compression Options

Where are the different compression options such as, MPG-1, MPG-2, etc. in the program?

in the preferences, though I think if you want mpeg1, you have to use Compressor to do that, then drop in the files. DVDSP won't recompress them, it'll just use them.

Viewing tif files in Preview, Dropbox

I've created two image files in Photoshop, removing hidden layers, merging layers, and then flattening the layers, saving them as tif files. One is about 4 MB; the other is about 24 MB.
The 4 MB files shows up fine in QuickView and in Preview; the 24 MB file shows up with a white background and one element from one of the layers.
I've also tried this saving the 24 MB tif file in layers, preserving the alpha; same result.
Uploaded to Dropbox, both tif files show up with only one layer visible, even though the file has flattened all the layers!
Thanks for any help you can offer sorting this out. I'd like to be able to view the 24 MB tif file in Preview.

Since you can open the TIFFs on a PC, then there must be something wrong with Preview on your Mac. You can use Pacifist to extract the Preview application from your original OS X installation CD/DVD. Replace the one currently on the hard drive.
But there's quite a few other apps that will open a TIFF. Photoshop, Graphic Converter, InDesign, Quark and Illustrator to name a few. There's a bunch of free and shareware viewers you could download here.

Multi-page .tif file attaches as .jpg (1 page)

I've just changed from Entourage to Mail. I have multipage .tif files downloaded from Companies House. When I try to mail them as attachments Mail changes them to .jpg files which only have the first page of course. I can see that on the open email so it is not a Mac to Windows recipient problem.
When I resave as .pdf there is problem but that's unsatisfactory. Other files eg Word and Excel seem fine.
The solutions I've seen here seem to be the for the reverse problem.

Save aas tif file.

Freezing Finder with PSD/TIF files - HELP!

Hello everyone,
First of all, I am pretty much ******. I've invested over 2400€ for my brand new Imac and now, out of nothing, my finder in Snow Leopard OSX 10.6.4 starts to hang/freeze whenever I get into the folder with large PSD/TIF files.
It started with large TIF files. I have placed them along with other PSD projects and they range about 50-300MB each. These files are in a specific project folder. Now I get into the folder, and it doesn't matter how I view it. Either in list or symbol view. I scroll down, bam! Pizza of death or wheel of death, and no, I am not able to force quit the finder.
I am like what the ****..?! I just swapped over to the Mac. I just fell the love of the Mac slogan: "It just works". Yeah, I can feel it..
I've installed Xee image viewer before, deleted it again, no change. I even deleted Norton Anti Virus, no change, problem still exist. I've been up till around 5AM with no sleep, trying to figure out what has caused this problem. I think loosing it. I googled like mad, but there were no significant solutions.
HOWEVER, if I start up Pathfinder, and go to the projects folder, I can seamlessly view all project files PSD/TIF within the Finder and quicklook. It wont hang OSX. This is my current solution... but I don't want to use PathFinder all the time, just to get to my projects folder.
I really need your help. (x_x)
Thanks

Wow, that was a fast response, thank you.
I did remove Norton after the incidence, and yet, the problem exist.
I used to open my project files with Photoshop CS5. Before I open anything, I browse through my project data within the Finder, i.e list view + quick view, I just scroll up and down within the window to check out the data name before I open it.
Everything works just fine. I used to use Xee image viewer and I can literally open and view any image. But as soon the files get larger in size, and the more files I got in one folder - like 100+, the more it was likely, that my Finder hangs. And it still does.
It starts to freeze immediately within seconds or when I scroll down more and there it goes, spinwheel goes nuts and I have to restart my Imac (omg). I did that like 8-10 times now. I left my Mac on when I went to bed for 2h, and after I checked it again, the spinwheel didn't do anything then spin and I could not quit Finder. Everything hangs.
All I need to do, is to open my Projects folder, and boom, freeze. I thought it was due to the large TIF files. I deleted them via Adobe Bridge, because I can't go to that folder with Finder, otherwise it'll freeze AGAIN. Now I had the PSD files left, they are about 50-300MB big, and I got around 100 of them in one folder. Issue still remains.
I deleted almost everything, checked my startup icons and so forth, but I did not have the problem before, or I didn't notice it.
I can however browse lots of PSD files with smaller sizes AND as I mentioned in the above post. I can view my project folder with PATHFINDER and ADOBE BRIDGE with absolutely NO single problem.
I guess it's a Finder-Preview-PSD Extension- etc problem? I got the Mac like a month and now I got this. Gladly no one can tell me I got this issues due to some weird Trojans or "badly configured" computer.

Is the JPEG compression option on TIF files lossy or lossless?

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