Message to Old Toad regarding DB back-up automator

Hi Old Toad,
I have downloaded the automator you made in order to back-up the iPhoto library. I am just confused on one thing, even after reading the README file.
You wrote: "When launched, this Automator work flow application will copy the iPhoto
database file, Library6.iPhoto, from the iPhoto Library package to the Pictures
folder replacing any previous version of it there."
I understood from the tip you wrote in each of your answers on the forum, that the automator you create, when running, makes a back-up of the library when needed. However, when I read the README file, I understand that it helps in RESTORING the original file if corrupted since it replaces the library located in the picture folder. I am afraid to run it if it replace my current library in the pictures folder, loosing all my pictures/books/etc.
Could you please clarify? Thanks!

Welcome to the Apple Discussions.
I'm not OT but as his younger and better looking pal...
When you run the Action it creates a copy of the database file.
That copy is put into your Pictures Folder. If there's a previous copy already there, that will be overwritten. It does not move or in any way affect the running db file within your Library, it just copies.
Then should you need to restore a damaged db file, you can move this copy into the pkg file and you're off an running again.
Regards
TD

Similar Messages

Do I need Old Toad's Library back up when I have Time machine?

I should be able to find the old Library in the past? What happens when the database is corrupted but I have a lot of new pics?

Yes
1 - the price is right (free)
2 - it is more current (you should save before and after pretty much anything you do - just like a save in Word or excel
3 - it is a small file so recovering it is easy compared to recovering the whole library
LN

Another question for Old Toad (or anyone else) about backing up iPhoto

Obviously, I am not understanding what I am supposed to do or see when I try to backup my iPhoto library.
My iPhoto Library folder is in "Pictures".
I have downloaded the "iPhoto db File Backup" and put the icon in the dock.
Now, what do I do to perform the backup? I tried opening iPhoto and highlighting Library in the Source pane, then I tried highlighting all the pictures in the library, then I tried highlighting the iPhoto Library folder in Pictures and clicking the db file backup icon in each case. Nothing happened - at least I don't think anything happened. I was expecting a second folder with the title "iPhoto Library copy" or something like that to appear. What should I look for?
Also, when I opened my iPhoto Library folder, I found the following among the list of all the rolls of photos:
Library.iPhoto
Library6.iPhoto
When I clicked on each of them, my entire library of photos opened along with the following message:
Unreadable files: 1
The following file could not be imported. (The file is in the iPhoto Library folder.)
/Users/my name/Pictures/iPhoto Library/Library6.iPhoto
I don't understand what this means and what I did - or shouldn't have done. If I did something wrong, can I undo it?
Finally, I also saw the following and tried to open them to see what they are, but couldn't. A message window said I had to choose an application that would open them and I didn't know what to choose. What are these three items?
Thumb32Segment.data
Thumb64Segment.data
ThumbJPGSegment.data
I'm keen to backup all the photos I have so would appreciate whatever help/explanations readers can give me with all of this.
Sauble

sauble
What are you trying to back up specifically:
Your Photos Only
or
Your iPhoto Library (this includes Albums, books, slideshows, etc)
or
Your database file.
Old Toad’s wee application is designed to back up the database file only. It’s intended for use when you’re organising the photos in your Library and it’s a handy protection against damage if the app crashes. But it does not back up any photos.
To back up you iPhoto Library:
Make a copy on another disk of the iPhoto Library in your Pictures Folder. Copy it as a single unit. Using a Back Up utility such as DejaVu or Chronosync you can make incremental copies - that is, as you make changes to the Library the original back up is updated. (There are many, many back up utilities: search on MacUpdate.)
To back up your Photos only
Select them in the iPhoto Window and go File -> Export, select the version you want (Kind: Original or Kind: Current) and export them to another disk.
Note that none of these involves rooting around in the iPhoto Library itself. There are no user serviceable parts there. Any time you go in there you risk damaging the Library.
Library.iPhoto
Library6.iPhoto
Are the main database files. You’ve done no damage I would guess. There is no way of reading those files unless you’re a programmer.
Thumb32Segment.data
Thumb64Segment.data
ThumbJPGSegment.data
These are cache files. Iphoto needs them but there’s no reason for you to open them. Even if you did they’d make little sense to you.
The iPhoto Library is a bit like under the bonnet in your car. Fine if you know what you’re doing, but a lot of folks are better off staying out of there.
Regards
TD

I did my ios7 update and lost all my old text messages, how do I get them back?

I did my ios7 update and lost all my old text messages, how do I get them back?

Try this
http://support.apple.com/kb/HT1414

Misc questions - Old Toad - back up to dvd's and iphoto database files

Old Toad
Burning dvd's for back up.
I see that if I command-click Event folders the size increases down where it says information in the left bottom corner. Keep it to 4gig or less for each dvd. That works for me. When doing this does it also save any keywords etc.
I would happily go through my library this way to get a secure iphoto archive. Safest way... no?
If I did have to restore from these, what happens... is it like re-importing them, like Import to library under file menu.
(I haven't decided on an external back up HD system yet. Plus they can fail too. Right now I have 3 computers, they can talk via ethernet. One has an additional internal which i've been using to back up Mail, Ical, Address book, and other info like plist etc. Including my wife and 2 kids, I have 4 users to manage.)
Thanks for any advice you have.
ps./ I went to your site. What's up with this font - HelveticaNeue.dfont. Do I need this?
I downloaded the iphoto db back up. Will readme to figure out. (where exactly does the iphoto database file exist)
Thanks again.
Dave Stamm

David:
If you use the Share->Burn menu option you will preserve the keywords, comments and titles.
Burning to DVD is a good way to archive the photos for later use in iPhoto if necessary. To get those photos back into an iPhoto library just mount the disk with iPhoto open. It will show up in the left hand pane under the Events and Photos icon. Drag the entire disk icon or drag individual albums or events (not shown in the video screenshot below) onto the Events icon like this.
However, for a way to quickly recover from a damaged library I suggest a backup copy of the library on a second hard drive. You can perform incremental backups of the library, copying only new or editied files, with a backup application like Synk. It only takes about a minute or less to perform an incremental backup. There are several other backup applications that can do incremental backups on iPhoto Library packages. Yes external HDs can fail but having both fail at the same time would be unusual unless you were to experience a power surge that would blow everything powered up. I have an external HD that I only turn on when I do a backup of specific files and folders (in addition to Time Machine), daily or every other day.
The Helvetica Neue font is what iPhoto 8 uses for Event titles, the number of photos selected and being dragged, etc. If it is missing or deactivated you wouldn't be able to change Event names or click and drag photos. If you're not having that problem there's nothing to worry about.
The database file resides inside the iPhoto Library package which is in the Pictures folder (default location).
OT

In IOS7; I am trying to delete a picture from an old text message conversation, and it keeps coming back in a second. Why?

In IOS7; I am trying to delete a picture from an old text message conversation, and it keeps coming back in a second. Why?

Turn off, and on your device again; and how are you deleting the picture?b From where :O

After ugrading to Firefox 4, I can not go to my job e-mail website. I get the message: ssl_error_renegotiation_not_allowed. No problem with the old version of Firefox. Can I have the old version of Firefox back?

After ugrading to Firefox 4, I can't go to my job e-mail website. I get the message: ssl_error_renegotiation_not_allowed. No problem with the old version of Firefox. Can I have the old version of Firefox back?

See:
*https://wiki.mozilla.org/Security:Renegotiation

Old Toad's automator workflow to backup Library6.iPhoto database

Dear Old Toad,
I just today downloaded your workflow to backup the iPhoto database file, and am having problems making it work.
When I run it, either from the dock or the script menu, it launches Automator but then closes without doing anything. I don't get a confirmation screen, and no copy of the database is created.
So I opened it in Automator to see if editing it would help, even though my library is already named iPhoto Library and stored in user/pictures. When I dragged it onto the Automator window, there was only 1 action (Get Specified Finder Items) instead of the 4 that show up in the ReadMe. When I dragged it onto the Automator app to open it, I got nothing.
I downloaded it via Firefox 3.0.1 and got a 1.1MB zip, and I tried downloading it twice in case it had corrupted in the download, but no change with the second try. Downloaded from here:
http://web.mac.com/toad.hall/ToadsCellar/ToadsCellar.html
Running OS 10.4.11, iPhoto 7.1.5, on a G4.
Something else I can try?
Thanks,
Daiya
Message was edited by: Daiya

Yes. Run the application like you would use the Save command in other applications, often. Running it again will overwrite the current backup copy with a new backup that will include all changes you've made to your library, new pictures, deletions, slideshows, books, etc.
I suggested keeping it in the dock so you can quickly run it after any changes you've made to the library. Being in the Dock makes it more convenient than having to go into the Application folder and launching it from there.
TIP: For insurance against the iPhoto database corruption that many users have experienced I recommend making a backup copy of the Library6.iPhoto (iPhoto.Library for iPhoto 5 and earlier) database file and keep it current. If problems crop up where iPhoto suddenly can't see any photos or thinks there are no photos in the library, replacing the working Library6.iPhoto file with the backup will often get the library back. By keeping it current I mean backup after each import and/or any serious editing or work on books, slideshows, calendars, cards, etc. That insures that if a problem pops up and you do need to replace the database file, you'll retain all those efforts. It doesn't take long to make the backup and it's good insurance.
I've created an Automator workflow application (requires Tiger or later), iPhoto dB File Backup, that will copy the selected Library6.iPhoto file from your iPhoto Library folder to the Pictures folder, replacing any previous version of it. It's compatible with iPhoto 6 and 7 libraries and Tiger and Leopard. iPhoto does not have to be closed to run the application, just idle. You can download it at Toad's Cellar. Be sure to read the Read Me pdf file.
Note: There now an Automator backup application for iPhoto 5 that will work with Tiger or Leopard.

Can't install iLife 11 (Old Toad)

This is a new topic specially opened for Old Toad.
My english was not as good as I thought when I did open a discussion saying that my legal copy of iLife gave me that error message. I'm not stealing anyone by downloading another .dmg of iLife and trying to install it (getting error as well). I purchased my copy of iLife one day, and I can have so many copies of it as I please, can't I? All the software I have installed in my genuine OS X Snow Leopard is NOT from pirate sites. Let's keep this perfectly clear, so we can follow this discussion correctly. All the purpose was trying another .dmg, the one in the DVD might be damaged, but was not the case, fortunately.
Next time, please, ask before closing a topic of an user. Repeat: my LEGAL copy of iLife, ie, my DVD on Install Software gives me the error message I linked in the previous topic. Can we follow this discussion, please?
Thank you/Gracias, Carlos.

That software install disk should be able to install the orignal version of iPhoto that came preinstalled with your MPB. However if your library has been upgraded to iPhoto 9 (11) you will have to find a way to install iPhoto 9 from the iLIfe disk.
However, you could downgrade your library to the version that came with your MPB using the directions in this iPhoto Library Manager webpage: Fat Cat Software - iPhoto Library Manager Help - Downgrading a library to an earlier version of iPhoto
If you can get access to another Mac try your iLife 11 disk on it to see if it's a disk issue or an issure with your MBP. If it's a problem with your MBP and since we've tried most fixes I know of you may have to reinstall your system after backing up your HD first.
If you find that the iLife 11 disk is bad they you will need to get it replaced from where you purchased it originally.

Earth to Old Toad: Library6.iPhoto

dear old toad
have read your little tip about backing up the 'Library6.iPhoto' file to avoid possible catastrophe. does this just apply to iphoto 06 users upgrading to iphoto 08? or is it for us iphoto newbies as well?
thanks
green frog

That file is the heard of the iPhoto 6 and 7 libraries. It contains all of the information regarding files, books, slideshows, edits, etc. If it gets damaged you library may look like it doesn't have any photos in it at all when it really does. Having a current backup copy of it will let you easily and quickly reset the library to the point in time that the backup was make.
Of course Time Machine makes hourly backups of your entire disk (if setup that way) but you might have added photos, books or did a lot of editing/organizational work in the library since the last TM backup and if there's an interruption causing the file to be damaged you will have lost all of that work. Using the Applicator application that I created like a Save function that other applications have will let you stay current so as to not lose any data or effort.
TIP: For insurance against the iPhoto database corruption that many users have experienced I recommend making a backup copy of the Library6.iPhoto database file and keep it current. If problems crop up where iPhoto suddenly can't see any photos or thinks there are no photos in the library, replacing the working Library6.iPhoto file with the backup will often get the library back. By keeping it current I mean backup after each import and/or any serious editing or work on books, slideshows, calendars, cards, etc. That insures that if a problem pops up and you do need to replace the database file, you'll retain all those efforts. It doesn't take long to make the backup and it's good insurance.
I've created an Automator workflow application (requires Tiger), iPhoto dB File Backup, that will copy the selected Library6.iPhoto file from your iPhoto Library folder to the Pictures folder, replacing any previous version of it. It's compatible with iPhoto 08 libraries and Leopard. iPhoto does not have to be closed to run the application, just idle. You can download it at Toad's Cellar. Be sure to read the Read Me pdf file.

Old Toad! I'm Missing the expected DPI lines in iPhoto 6 .plist File

Old Toad:
Using Pref Setter to examine my iPhoto 6's com.apple.iPhoto.plist, I have discovered something very strange. Some of the lines you say we should edit are outright missing from the file. See below for lines present and not present in my plist:
BookTargetDPI - 300 (present)
BookTargetImageDPI - 150 (not present)
BookTargetMediumDPI-300 (present)
BookTargetMediumImage - 150 (not present)
BookTargetSmallDPI - 300 (present)
BookTargetSmallImageDPI - 300 (not present)
The "low DPI" lines are outright missing, even after searching with Pref Setter's nice search function. Could this be the very reason that so many people are complaining about books coming back from Apple with such low quality? Should these non-present lines be added into to our iPhoto 6 plist? This could resolve the book quality issue...My most recent book was lousy and I sent it back.
Thanks!
STEVE

Steve:
I just brought up my pref file for a new library and it is missing those particular keys also. Maybe the 6.0.2 update did away with them. It looks like iPhoto is assigning 300 dpi to all portions of the book uniformly and got rid of the image dpi settings. The three book target image keys is set at 300 and probably applies to images as well.

Old Toad? -- Rebuild iPhoto Library and lose NOTHING!

Hi,
Any help will be very much appreciated (I'm particularly hoping the old toad will be hopping over to this thread)...
I'm running iPhoto 6 and have been using iPhoto since version 3.0. I have a library of about 10,000 photos which I have meticulously organised and catalogued. I don't use albums, but eveything is organised by film rolls and every photo has keywords (names of those photographed, which I access via smart-albums), ratings, comments, and titles.
My iPhoto library, though working perfectly, is a complete mess. I can manually see dozens of duplicates (often whole folders) and it's driving me barmy...
In iTunes, I can simply copy all of my music files to a backup disc, delete all iTunes related stuff from my HD, then re-import. I lose star ratings, albums and playcounts but my careful cataloguing is preserved and I have a pristine library.
I have a feeling that old versions of iPhoto didn't allow such re-importing. How about now? Is there a way to just save the photo files, trash everything, and re-import. What would be lost? It would be a disaster of epic proportions if I lost (a) titles, (b) comments, (c) *most importantly* keywords...
I don't care about albums, and smart albums are easy to re-create. Is what I am suggesting possible?
Thanks in advance,
Steve.

Steven:
The _2 is generated when a photo with the same name is added to a roll that already has a file by that name. If your camera has the option to turn off resetting the numbering process on each new set of photos I suggest you do so. That will avoid duplicate image file issues that can crop up when trying to export photos to a folder.
As far as the duplicates, the thumbnails don't take up much room and the modified files are only when you edit one. If you want to regain that space just do a Revert to Original and the modified file will be deleted. Many of the modified files are portrait orientated images that have been taken by a camera with the auto-rotate option. There's no way around it unless you turn off the option, upload to the desktop and then physically rotate with a 3rd party application before importing into iPhoto.
What with the low cost of external FW hard drives these days it's not expensive to have a decent sized backup drive that you can store older or not immediately needed photos in a separate library and then use iPhoto Library Manager to move between the two and copy photos between them without losing the keywords, comments, etc. Or you can use iPhoto in its alias mode with the source files on the external HD and only a very small library folder on your boot drive. I have 27,000 image files on my external HD and the library folder for it is only 1.7G. See these Tutorials for more about the alias type of library.,
Do you Twango?
TIP: For insurance against the iPhoto database corruption that many users have experienced I recommend making a backup copy of the Library6.iPhoto database file and keep it current. If problems crop up where iPhoto suddenly can't see any photos or thinks there are no photos in the library, replacing the working Library6.iPhoto file with the backup will often get the library back. By keeping it current I mean backup after each import and/or any serious editing or work on books, slideshows, calendars, cards, etc. That insures that if a problem pops up and you do need to replace the database file, you'll retain all those efforts. It doesn't take long to make the backup and it's good insurance.
I've written an Automator workflow application (requires Tiger), iPhoto dB file backup, that will copy the selected Library6.iPhoto file from your iPhoto Library folder to the Pictures folder, replacing any previous version of it. You can download it at Toad's Cellar. Be sure to read the Read Me pdf file.

Mail only imports a few messages from old version...

Hi there!
Just got my new machine and am in the process of copying all my stuff over from the old one.
I have 7 email accounts, all of them POP except one, my Hotmail account which uses Daniel Parnell's httpmail plugin so I can send and receive from within Mail.
I used the normal 'import mailboxes' command and successfully imported everything into the new version of Mail (I was using Mail previously as well, on 10.3.9) except for the inboxes of 2 accounts.....the Hotmail account and one of the POP accounts. On these, it imports about 50 of the most recent messages and ignores the rest. I tried several times and always get the same result! I know the mail is there, it shows when I open Mail on my old computer....but it just refuses to import into the new version of Mail.
These are also my oldest email accounts.....with the most messages.....could that have something to do with it? The largest account has about half a gigabyte of email in it.
Any suggestions or advice would be greatly appreciated! Anyone else have this problem???
Thanks in advance...
Steve.
Macbook Pro 17"/Dual 2.33 Mac OS X (10.4.8) 100 gig 7200 rpm HD, 2 GB RAM

I have a variation of this same problem.
HISTORY:
Yesterday I began to create a new mailbox to be stored on my Mac for Sent Mail from 2006 to be transferred from another existing Sent Mail mailbox (also on my Mac) that, via Mail Rules, I have all sent mail from a single AOL account archived in--I wanted to begin feeding the last days of 2006 mail into it, and then let the pre-existing Sent Mail collect messages for 2007. The 2006 file was just over 125 MB, and along with a 2005 Sent Mail file and a 2005 Received Mail file of AOL archives, was to reside in a parent folder for AOL, simply called AOL Past Mail. Simply put, I have separate annual Sent and Received mailboxes stored on my Mac for two of my three e-mail accounts within larger folders labeled Past Mail for each account.
In a long story made short: I went to Rename (under Mail>Mailboxes menu) the parent mailbox from "Past AOL Mail: 2005" to "Past AOL Mail: 2005-" (thus with a dash to let that folder be open-ended for subsequent annual mailboxes to be added for each year). I got a message that Mail could not rename the box, and the next thing I know, there is my old Parent mailbox/folder (Past AOL Mail) whited out with four blue mailbox/folders filed within it (these included 2 folders for Received Mail for 2005 and 2006 and the Sent Mail folders for the two years). When I selected the whited out parent folder or one of the blue-colored sub-folders (the Sent and Received mailboxes) it said I had "0 Messages" in each.
After initial panic, I realized that I had my entire hard drive backed up (just up to the day before--this is a complete bootable clone of the laptop that these mailboxes are on, made by SuperDuper! software). After reading Mail Help (and BEFORE coming to this discussion forum), I tried to do an Import Mailboxes (under File in Mail menu) from the external back-up HD (over the standard FireWire 800 cable connection) by choosing the "Other" option.
The Import began smoothly enough but when it finished it had only copied mail from Jan. 1-April 10, 4:00pm. I repeated this process several times (even once with a second back-up HD that was not quite as recently updated, and once with the "Mail for Mac OS X" option) and every time got 229 messages of exactly those dates and time. Yet the messages in the "mbox" on the back-up HD clearly showed over 1,000 files dated through Dec. 24.
THE CURRENT PROBLEM:
Now what was once a single archived mailbox of AOL mail from Jan. 1-Dec. 24 exists in three separate locations--at least the files exist.
1) LaCie back-up HD: April 10, 11:45pm-Dec. 24 (Oddly the efforts to "Import Mailboxes" under Mail>File seem to have removed the 229 messages that were partially imported.)
2) In various Import Folders "mboxes": Jan. 1-Apr. 10, 4pm.
3) On the IMAP server (AOL), which can be dragged to any reassembled folder on my desktop, if done before the messages expire on the AOL server:
Dec. 1-current.
QUESTIONS:
1-Instead of deleting the whole Library>Mail folder from my laptop, can I just remove the broken folder I am trying to reconstitute from Library>Mail, and replace it with the (nearly) complete folder from the back-up?
2-If I were to do step 1 above, should I remove all other files from the mbox folder (Info.plist, content_index, and tableofcontents) that I am draggin in from the back-up, or leave them?
3-Having read the suggested steps for similar, but it seems significantly different, problems in this thread, my big concern is with the ~/Library/Preferences/com.apple.mail.plist. I don't want to remove it from my laptop if there is a risk that other perfectly good mailboxes on the laptop would be adversely affected. If it is necessary to allow Mail to read the full mbox being transferred from the back-up, would there likely be any difference in the com.apple.mail.plist from the back-up, which was made just 7 hours before this whole nightmare happened?
Enormous thanks for any guidance you can give to this.
--Laird Ellis
PowerBook G4 15" 1.5GHz/80GB/512RAM; PB 12" 1.5GHz/100GB/1.25GB RAM Mac OS X (10.4.8) iPod 40GB; Wireless Mighty Mouse/Wireless Mouse
PowerBook G4 15" 1.5GHz/80GB/512RAM; PB 12" 1.5GHz/100GB/1.25GB RAM Mac OS X (10.4.7) iPod 40GB; Wireless Mighty Mouse/Wireless Mouse

Re: OT: The Old Toad Quiz (Aug 21, 2006)-Real tough

Yeah. I'm not sure how keen I am on that, nor am I
particularly keen on
Charon. To me a planet should be an independently orbiting
body, but I
understand how I'm kinda splitting hairs there. Will we
eventually have
planets orbiting moons?
I don't get why they don't just call the small ones
"planetoids" and be done
with it. I know I sure don't want to have to remember 113
names of the
planets. ;)
Either way, what a fascinating time to be alive, when so many
fundamental
discoveries are being made. Just when we thought we knew it
all, it seems
like there's always an advanced course. :O)
(that dark matter stuff is pretty exiting, as well)
"Gary White" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]..
> On Wed, 23 Aug 2006 09:12:09 -0500, "crash"
<[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
>>And isn't that phenomenal? Talk about a once in a
lifetime thing -
>>y'know,
>>Alex, when I was a boy there was only 9 planets, not
26.... (or 7)
>>
>>Too cool
>
>
> Exactly. What's more, if the proposal that causes more
to be recognized
> is adopted, one widely respected astronomer has
suggested that we could
> wind up with hundreds.
>
> Gary

Piece of cake.
Old Toad Quiz: October 23, 2006
Score: 100 %
Well done, you are bloody brilliant!
Dan Mode
--> Adobe Community Expert
*Flash Helps*
http://www.smithmediafusion.com/blog/?cat=11
*THE online Radio*
http://www.tornadostream.com
*Must Read*
http://www.smithmediafusion.com/blog
"Mick White" <[email protected]> wrote in
message
news:ehm6fe$efj$[email protected]..
>
http://www.mickweb.com/quiz/index.html
>
> Please check for typos or errors of fact.
> This quiz may be easier than most.
>
> Passing Scores:
> USA: 50%
> ROTW: 40%
>
> Thanks.
> Mick

OT: The Old Toad Quiz (Nov 20, 2006)- Not so tough.

http://mickweb.com/quiz/index.html
Please check for typos or errors of fact.
This is a gentle quiz...
Passing Scores:
USA: 50%
ROTW: 40%
Thanks.
Mick

Piece of cake.
Old Toad Quiz: October 23, 2006
Score: 100 %
Well done, you are bloody brilliant!
Dan Mode
--> Adobe Community Expert
*Flash Helps*
http://www.smithmediafusion.com/blog/?cat=11
*THE online Radio*
http://www.tornadostream.com
*Must Read*
http://www.smithmediafusion.com/blog
"Mick White" <[email protected]> wrote in
message
news:ehm6fe$efj$[email protected]..
>
http://www.mickweb.com/quiz/index.html
>
> Please check for typos or errors of fact.
> This quiz may be easier than most.
>
> Passing Scores:
> USA: 50%
> ROTW: 40%
>
> Thanks.
> Mick

Message to Old Toad regarding DB back-up automator

Similar Messages

Maybe you are looking for