Mixing HDV with XDCam

Everything has been captured. The original film was shot in HDV ... to which I want to add a bunch of XDCam footage. The show is amost finished (edited on a HDV timeline).
I'm planning to run the whole show through Color for grading at the end, and will be trying to make it look as much like film as possible, or at least trying to get the 'video' look out of the HDV footage.
Wondering what my best options would be?
My first inclination would be to create a ProRes 422 HQ timeline and drop the HDV with the XDCame right into this timeline to output the show as ProRes 422 HQ. The HQ may be overkill I realise.
Just wondering if anyone else might have some ideas...?
Ben

Hi X,
How does one do the 'quote' thing, I don't even know what it is called.
Have I got this right?: I should convert the whole show to the ProRes before sending to Color?
X: "Yes. But then again, I never would have editied with native HDV."
The first edit was done a long time ago. And was so close to a good edit, that when I came to finish this up it seemed like a logical thing to do (just stay with HDV). You are absolutely right, I should have converted everything before starting to finish this off.
I'm trying to get an output (final master) that might slip by a network's mandate for full HD ...
X: "If someone says "full HD", I have no clue what that means. If you have a network spec sheet that says "ProRes 422 HQ", then that is what you deliver. You can do the conversion from LT to HQ for the final using Compressor."
I haven't been doing TV for a long time; so I'm in a learning curve - some are still asking for tape, some for .mov files on a drive - whatever the codec. I'll be doing the rounds in a week ... and will get the uptodate spec sheets then.
Thanks mucho for your help,
Ben

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Converting mixed HDV/XDCam to ProRes?

1. If I have HDV and XDCam EX on the same HDV timeline ... and do a Media Manager conversion to transform both codecs to create a new timeline that is all ProRes 422 ... will the XDCam be converted from XDCam or from HDV (given it is on an HDV timeline??)
This may seem like a dumb question. I'm not sure whether the media manager takes it cue from the actual orginal media, or from the sequence settings of the timeline?
2. The HDV is 1080i and the XDCam is 1080p. I need the ProRes 422 to be 1080i ... there is a predominance of HDV in the movie, and it is headed for television anyhow. Do I have to worry about the XDCam being converted from progressive to interlaced in some way?
All ears,
Ben

Thank you Shane,
Both are the same frame rates. First thing I checked. Even though I cut my teeth in film, and still shoot as if I have film in the camera, and though I'll use 24fps if I know it's going to end up in a theatre, I have to confess I've often found 29.97 fps smoother ... and it still looks like film to me (despite the noise of the naysayers) as long as the lighting and the use of the lens is cinematic.
Seems like I'm always 'still' learning when it comes to digital processes though... which is made easier by you...
Much appreciated,
Ben

Long HDV and XDCAM clips through Final Cut Server

Hi,
I know that I could post this in Compressor and/or Quicktime and/or Leopard/Tiger Forums, but as this problem it`s causing my Final Cut Server to not working well, I think it makes sense to post here.
To resume: HDV and XDCAM clips (all on original codec, only xdcam transferred to mov in xdcam transfer) with file size bigger than exactly 4GB always FAILS in "Final Cut Server"/"Compressor alone in ANY machine installed from scratch"/"Anything that uses Quicktime". Source and Destination being localy or networked. DV or DV50 can get bigger than that, I`ve never seen this error with DV`s codecs.
I had seen this problem before I bought final cut server. When I was transcoding our interviews for transcription. We always worked with BETA SP and captured in DV or DV50. We were starting to go to HDV and now to XDCAM and this error has started to appear.
I have a "proxy" made a year ago from a HDV and it`s original has 8GB. I tried this file again and as I expected didn`t work. In ANY computer with any installations with only the latest updates. I`ve remembered that I was using Tiger at this time, and Quicktime/Tiger/ProApps had a old version.
My two cents are that some update from Tiger/Leopard/QuickTime/ProApps made this happen.
So ANY HDV/XDCAM file bigger than 4GB it`s FAILING in ANY system. (Tiger or Leopard, With or without FCP and QT PRO, Installed from scratch and updated every thing).
Some tests I`ve made:
-Compressor works with this two codecs to lower res in TIGER and with QuickTime Version 7.4.0 and LOWER. (had to be tested, but I think that was my version of QT when I managed to make the proxy of this two codecs).
-Compressor doesn`t work on any system with QT above 7.4.0.
-CATDV (http://www.squarebox.co.uk/) version 6 can make proxy versions of this two codecs in TIGER ONLY! They already know of this problem and CATDV 7 works on both.
-Compressing in compressor with H.264 (same codec as the FCSvr proxy) BUT without changing the resolution, size and etc. Works OK in both Tiger and Leopard.
-Exporting through QT works in ANY system BUT I loose TC, so it`s not an option (and I can`t input this workflow in FCSvr without using compressor).
-Exporting from FCP as QuickTime Movie with H.264 doesn`t work on Both (Tiger and Leopard).
-Exporting fro FCP as QuickTime Conversion with H.264 works but as exporting from QT I loose TC and can`t input this into FCSvr workflow.
Error message are always: "QuickTime error = -50" or "QuickTime error: corrupted data" (and of course it`s not corrupted because it`s used - even in FCP to edit - and opened viewed, catdv can do proxy and everything).
I`m surprised not to see anyone freaking out about this issue... I don`t think that It`s only me.
This is some problems that I came across while trying to find a solution:
http://www.paulescandon.com/blog/?p=39
http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?messageID=4912265&#4912265
http://www.squarebox.co.uk/faq155.html
http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?messageID=5513003&#5513003
http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=1903644&tstart=0
http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=1780228
http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=1853507
As you can see this is not the first time I`ve posted about this issue.
I`m sending a bug report as well.
Thank You all in advance.
Regards

Hi Chará!
We should, but I think the others will be disappointed eheheheh.
It doesn`t matter what version of Leopard I`m using (right know I`m using Leopard Server 10.5.6, but this issue has happened even with 10.4 if QT is updated and all updates of 10.5 up, as I`
ve mentioned above).
What file size are those clips that are longer than 10min?
I really don`t get, how it`s possible that just the two of us has HDV and XDCAM files with file size longer than usual? Maybe people that do interviews don`t like to record the entire interview and when capturing those clips would be under this file size limit? Or maybe we are the only ones in the whole world that transcode longer HDV and XDCAM clips (it`s funny that it doesn`t even need to be FCSrv, with only ONE machine and compressor this issue happens all the time).
I`m convinced that I have to install a Tiger version in a virtual machine with compressor and doesn`t update anything to test this further on. But I`m certain that with TIGER and CATDV this works ok! And I think that CATDV uses QT engine to do this transcodes.
This is too much of a mystery to me. Maybe it`s time to spend 24+ hours with apple in a international call and probably not getting anywhere.
I`m only posting this here in FCSrv forum because this issue it`s must worse when you have hundreds of clips with this issue and if you bought the package it doen`t matter if it`s a problem with QT+OSX or whatever, apple has to solve it for FCSrv use.
Do you reckon?
Let`s get in touch through email: lucas at rwcine.com.br
(at = @ and delete spaces).
Regards

Quicktime Reference with XDCam HD

I'm trying to export QT Ref clips from an XDCam HD timeline.
Seems no faster than a regular export, with the same results as self-contained movie. Is it possible to export reference files with xdcam originals?
Thanks anyone!
Rob

KellyBrothers wrote:
Is it possible to export reference files with xdcam originals?
I don't believe so.
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So, when exporting movies out of FCP as HDV or XDCam, FCP converts those Open GOP files to closed GOP. In other words, no reference movies since FCP/QT is actually converting the files a bit, resulting in the extended processing time and full-length movies.

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If I am creating graphics in Photoshop for an HDV or XDCAM 1080p timeline, both which are 1440x1080, does it matter if the graphics are 1440x1080(1.33) or 1920x1080(square)? Which size creates the highest quality?
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John

Hey Andy
FCP X will handle the realtime transcode of the native XDCAM source footage (to ProRes) for playback and effect handling, thereafter any render files will be physically created in the ProRes format, so technically you'd be fine sticking with XDCAM ... in FCP 7 lingo the FCP X workflow is akin to editng your native XDCAM footage in a ProRes timeline (with Umlimited RT turned on), which was often the preferred workflow for that format. That said, others preferred to get out of the XDCAM format altogether as quickly as possible, and transcoding to ProRes (or Optimizing Media as FCP X likes to call it) will certainly provide you with better timeline, playback and effect handling performance.
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Leigh

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