MOTION MENU INCONSISTENCIES (+ poor transcoding)

Hi everyone
I'm using Encore 2.0, Win XP Pro SP2.
I'm having trouble with the motion menus in my project. I have three main pages with identical motion settings (loop forever, no loop point set, duration 5mins);
- one page animates only one of the three buttons it contains
- the second simply refuses to animate at all
- the third animates sometimes but not others.
None of these problems follow any logic, all the settings are identical, the files were all generated identically and were transcoded before previewing.
ALSO, I've built this new project with .mov files and transcoded them within Encore, yet very similar setting in Sorenson Squeeze afforded significantly better MPEGs (which I previously used to build the DVD with but stopped building the disks this way as chapter point were tricky). Any clues as to why Encore fails when competing with Sorenson here? Major cube artifacts visible in the blacks..
VERY frustrating!! Please help!!
Thanks in advance.
Best
Shane Daly
Cinematographer, London
[email protected]

I dont understand why you setting the duration of a loop for 5 mins. If you want to animate the buttons in submenu for the duration of the menu, all you need is to set two options: first one is animate buttons and second one is forever.
Transcoding will depend on the transcode quality settings of the codec.

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CS4 Encore motion menu crash while transcoding (render motion menu)

Hi,
I have a rather large but simple Blu-Ray project. I have a main menu (with a CS4 Premiere dynamically linked background video and WAV sound but no animation on buttons) that is linked to a series of video index menus with motion (the chapter are linked to six buttons that include video preview). All my videos are dynamically linked to a Adobe CS4 premiere sequence in five different projects. All the Adobe CS4 Premiere projects where manually transcoded with success. I have a total of 43 menus (including the main menu and one popup). Here is my problem...
In my Blu-ray project, every time render my motion menus, CS4 Encore crashes (no error message) and generates a crash report. The weird thing is that it never crashes at the same place. I can render from 1 to 6 menus before the crash. I have noting running except encore and I have no screen saver and my power settings is set to never.
I work on a Intell Quadcore 2.5 Mghz, 4 GB of RAM, Spphire HD4850 Graphic adapter (updated less than a week ago), Vista 32 (updated). All my CS4 apps. where updated less than a week ago.
Any ideas???
Any help would be appreciated because I am getting very upset with CS4 Encore....
SirEnigma
Here is the crash report:
<?xml version="1.0"?>
<!DOCTYPE crashreport SYSTEM "AdobeCrashReporter.dtd">
<crashreport version="1.1" crVersion="3.0.20080806" applicationName="Adobe Encore" applicationVersion="4.0.1.048" build="unknown">
<time year="2009" month="8" day="3" hour="2" minute="39" second="10"/>
<user guid="REMOVED FOR POSTING"/>
<system platform="windows" osversion="6.0.6001 SP 1.0" applicationlanguage="English (United States)" userlanguage="en_US" oslanguage="en_US" ram="2942" machine="Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Quad CPU Q8300 @ 2.50GHz" model="x86 Family 6 Model 23 Stepping 10" cpuCount="4" cpuFreq="2496 MHz" busFreq="" locale="English (United States)"/>
<crash exception="EXCEPTION_ACCESS_VIOLATION" instruction="0x0bcd3c3f">
<backtrace crashedThread="0">
<thread index="0">
<stackStatement index="0" address="0x0bcd3c3f" symbolname="PSSLO::Document::DeactivateInlineInput"/>
</thread>
</backtrace>
<registerSet>
<register name="EAX" value="0x0000000b"/>
<register name="EBX" value="0x00000000"/>
<register name="ECX" value="0x0fc80058"/>
<register name="EDX" value="0x00000000"/>
<register name="ESI" value="0x00000003"/>
<register name="EDI" value="0x0fc80058"/>
<register name="ESP" value="0x138cd940"/>
<register name="EBP" value="0x323c1160"/>
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Finally I have found a workaround. I set all the motion menu's to no animation and build the projetc. Afterward, I put the animation on one menu and I render it. It is very long but it works. now my problem is elsewhere. On my output BD, some menu's only have a few second of animation before they loop. in some cases i dont even have a second. I have rebuilt my project and I have the same effetc but Encore seams to have put loop points at random.

Motion Menue transcoded in Encore is jittering even if framerate is correct

Dear users,
do you experience the same? I have a motion menue encoded in Encore and burnt onto Bluray. I used a quicktime 23.976p file on import as all footage is in 23.976fps as well. Fusion automatically transcoded the file to an m2ts. When I play the Bluray on a hardware player, the motion menue seems to jitter (judder). I check the corresponding m2ts-file in after effects and I see that the framerate seems to be correct, 23.976, but on some frames the video doesn't move, but repeats a frame. How can this be? When source files have all the same framerate?
I am using Encore 5.0 on Windows 7 64bit.
Is this a bug?
Thank you much.

I seem to be having a similar problem, but mine is on DVD with a motion menu. The video, despite the frame rate and conversion method, is rendered as interlaced instead of progressive in Encore. I found this article on Creative Cow that describes my exact issue, and it seems like the issue you are having as well.
http://forums.creativecow.net/thread/145/870084

Motion menu / poor quality / low resolution

Hi everyone,
I'm having some trouble with motion menu resolution.
I'm working on a project that consists of six short video clips. As first play, I'm using an asset that contains all six video's. After this, I want to introduce a motion menu showing the six clips - allowing the viewer to watch certain clips again and again.
To achieve this, I created separate tracks for each of the clips, and dragged these from the outline window to the menu window.
The project is working (basically) how I want it to, except that the resolution / image quality of the clips in the motion menu is not anywhere near sufficient.
I know that the 'simulate' option is limited in this respect, but I'm talking about the menu as it is shown in apple dvd player. I first tried building the project and viewing it in apple dvd player, and even burned an actual dvd to see if that would help - which it didn't.
I have searched the manual and these forums for answers but haven't been able to find a solution.
Here's hoping someone has an idea!
Thanks in advance,
Lianne.
G4 Mac OS X (10.4.7) DVDSP 3.0.2

Hi Drew, you again Thanks for your response.
After reading the manual chapter you mentioned and a chapter it refers to, I decided that my menu does need to be rendered. It said in the manual that changing the final rendering from hardware to software should result in a better result. I tried that and I do think the resolution is marginally better - still no good though!
The video tracks themselves (which were used to create the buttons in the motion menu) look fine, even when I stretch the window to the max. This suggests to me that the video in itself is okay. I don't understand why the same clips look so bad in a menu where they are only 1/8 the size? I would expect quite the opposite...
Might it have something to do with the way I've created the buttons (i.e. dragging from the outline window?). I'm going to try and create the menu in a different way.
In the meantime, suggestions are still more than welcome!

Motion Menu Woes

Please would someone help me with this...
I have a simple menu structure: 6 buttons linking to encoded m2v files (each video is about 4 minutes long). The background of the menu is a looping video (transcoded to m2v) and the audio is coming from a wave file.
If I select 'animate buttons' when I render the motion menu, it hangs. I have tried re-encoding the quicktime files and still it hangs. I removed the background looping video, and it doesn't make a difference - all roads lead to a hang!
I have spent hours and hours on this and just cannot get it right. What am I doing wrong?
Many thanks

Bump

Why motion menu bitrates can't be changed

When you click "Animate" buttons for a menu, this turns it into a motion menu. Encore renders all motion menus at 8 mbps, cannot be changed. This wastes a lot of space on the DVD if you have many motion menus.
All assets have Transcode Settings. Motion menus are the lone exception. Is there something special about motion menus that Transcode Settings couldn't be implemented? Is there a reason why motion menus must be rendered at 8 mbps while everything else can have different bitrates? Is there something technologically difficult for Adobe to make an option to have Transcode Settings for motion menus?

Please refer to your post in the Cow forum.
The best thing for you to do if you would like to have control over the bit rates that are used to transcode motion menus is to file a
feature request
here on the Adobe site.

Red frames in my Blu-ray Motion Menu

It seems like every time I start a new project, Adobe has a new problem for me to work through.
I am building a Blu-ray that has a motion menu that is the length of a song. I've done this before and had no problems. But for some reason this time Encore CS6 is doing something odd. On the finalized disc, about two seconds into the motion menu, what I had for the motion menu is replaced by solid red. It flickers a few times at first, and then stays solid red until about the 35 second mark, where it goes back to normal. The menu still works, and the buttons are all still visible and selectable.
Part of the video was created in After Effects and exported as an .mp4 file. That was brought into Premiere Pro CS6 and placed in a timeline which had a single frame of the menu as an image until about the 37 second mark, which is when the animated video from AE would start. This timeline was exported as an H.264 Blu-ray m4v file with a 20-35mbps rate, which is what all the other videos are set to. The video itself plays fine if I bring it back into Premiere or watch it somewhere else, but as soon as Encore transcodes it for the menu, I get the red screen near the beginning. I have tried higher and lower bit rates, but no matter what, it always does it in the same spot for the same amount of time.
Is this an Encore CS6 issue? Does Encore not like it when there is not much motion in a motion menu? I have done others where there is no motion for large parts of them and had no issues. Or a video driver issue, or a video file issue? Should I just use an mp4 for the motion menu video since it gets transcoded anyways? Or does Encore act up if a motion menu is too long?

You are a life saver. I imported the video as an mp4 and not an already-compliant m4v, and Encore rendered everything perfectly.
My list of what to do, what not to do, and tricks for getting this program to work properly is getting longer and longer. I can see why it's bundled with Premiere Pro and not a stand alone product that costs money. And I can see why they are not making new versions of it anymore. Sony Vegas Pro works far better apart from not being able to switch menu pages while keeping the background and music going.

Motion Menu Renders Interlaced

Related to this topic http://forums.adobe.com/message/5716612#5716612 which refers to Blu-ray, but I am using DVD. It sems like the same issue. I don't know if this is a DVD limitation, or if it's an Encore one. No matter what, my motion menu renders interlaced and it looks pretty terrible. Is this something I can correct?
Preview within Encore after rendering the menu.
Actual video

Burn and disk and test on a TV. Use a player that handles progressive. I don't know what you will see, but don't trust Encore preview.
See this thread:
http://forums.adobe.com/message/1803390#1803390
I think it was bluray, but Encore will re-transcode motion menus if you mess with them at all. And I think I recall some users having the problem you are describing. The workaround is burning everything in the menu to the motion background except for the highlight layers themselves.

For all of you who are having Motion Menu render problems - try this

Just humour me for a minute.
I have another Sonic application, and a known bug in the Motion Menu rendering applies to 29.97DF projects only.
IE, NTSC.
Often the video in a motion menu will fail to mux.
There are workarounds though.
1 - Make sure your GOP structure is 15 at most
2 - Make certain the frame length of your video file is divisible by the GOP structure. IE, it must be a multiple of 15 frames.
3 - if these both fail, reduce the bitrate of the video 500kbps at a time until it muxes. Most will work at 7,000, some need to be 6,000 and there are even times when you need to go as low as 4000.
Try it - Encore uses a Sonic Authorcore, so it's worth a look.

>Are you saying that NTSC 29.97 divided by 15 is okay?
Not really.
What I am saying is that your movie frame length should be divisible by the GOP structure with a GOP of 15.
With NTSC video, you can have GOP lengths
i up to
18, but it is not mandatory to go to 18 - 15 is a perfectly acceptable figure. You could use a GOP of 12 if you really wanted to. What this means is typically the number of frames between I-Frames.
MPEG-2 encoding (AKA "Moving Pictures by Educated Guesswork") P & B frames work something like this:
i P-frames provide more compression than I-frames because they take advantage of the data in the previous I-frame or P-frame. I-frames and P-frames are called reference frames. To generate a P-frame, the previous reference frame is reconstructed, just as it would be in a TV receiver or DVD player. The frame being compressed is divided into 16 pixel by 16 pixel macroblocks. Then, for each of those macroblocks, the reconstructed reference frame is searched to find that 16 by 16 macroblock that best matches the macroblock being compressed. The offset is encoded as a "motion vector." Frequently, the offset is zero. But, if something in the picture is moving, the offset might be something like 23 pixels to the right and 4 pixels up. The match between the two macroblocks will often not be perfect. To correct for this, the encoder computes the strings of coefficient values as described above for both macroblocks and, then, subtracts one from the other. This "residual" is appended to the motion vector and the result sent to the receiver or stored on the DVD for each macroblock being compressed. Sometimes no suitable match is found. Then, the macroblock is treated like an I-frame macroblock. The processing of B-frames is similar to that of P-frames except that B-frames use the picture in the following reference frame as well as the picture in the preceding reference frame. As a result, B-frames usually provide more compression than P-frames. B-frames are never reference frames.
In short, the I-Frame is the full description reference frame. A P frame is also a reference frame but describes the difference between the last I-Frame & itself. A good analogy is when you are on the telephone & describing what you see to a friend. The initial background description (The street, the sky, what you can see etc) would be an I-Frame. Then you describe a person walking down the street - that would be your P-Frames, as you are only describing the i changes
in the scene.
The bitrate can also affect things - I mentioned this too, and if a motion menu will not mux, first make sure that the film length is divisible by the GOP, and that the GOP is 15.
If it
i still
won't mux, drop the bitrate by factors of 500 until it will.

Motion menu not working

I'm frustrated. In the menu, under Properties/Motion tab, I select the video that I want to set up as my motion menu and it's not working. All I see is a static image of the video clip. The audio works but not the video clip set for motion. Please help.

But what I remembered is using part of a clip in Encore and I had a hell of a job to, anyway, unsuccessfully work the sound out ok. This is when I made the exact clip I needed in PP and imported it in Encore. Then I set the loop for ever. This way you can have this clip playing till someone chose what to wathch. I guess it's nice to have some movie starting automatically when there are not to many choices from them.
When doing both a Motion Menu and also adding Audio to it, you will probably be best served to Export these as elemental streams from PrPro, and Import those into Encore.
I will create a new Sequence in the Project, and create the Video part to the intended Duration for the Motion Menu. Same for my Audio, and often do this in yet another Sequence. I will chose Audio source files with quite a bit of repetition during the Duration, and a fade-in/fade-out to it. I've marked a half-dozen SmartSound pieces, that work very well for this.
The Video is Exported as DV-AVI Type II, with NO Audio, and multiplexing is turned off.
The Audio is Exported as either PCM/WAV 48KHz 16-bit, or AC3 DD 5.1 SS through the SurCode encoder (plug-in that costs ~US$250) for Surround Sound, NO Video and no multiplexing, obviously.
Doing it this way solves a lot of potential problems. Muxed files can cause issues with En, though not always.
One caveat that I learned the hard way - if you have Audio on your Menu and also Button Transitions with Audio, you will want the Audio for each to match perfectly in format and CODEC. Otherwise you will probably loose the Audio in one, or the other. Last caveat - stay as far away from MP3's as you can. Some work, some just do not and the quality will already have suffered greatly. I only use these for some of my SFX in PrPro and never, never for anything else.
Good luck and don't forget to Render those Motion Menus... [Grin]
Hunt

Is it possible to have a video loop while audio plays in a motion menu?

Hi!
Here's the deal:
I have a seamlesly looping 8 second video clip for my motion menu, but the audio file for that menu lasts 1 minute. For rendering time/disc space and bit budgeting purposes I would like to use the video file as a loop while the audio file plays trough in my motion menu.
Is it possible to have the video file loop while the audio plays trough, or do I have to make my video 1 minute long too?
Any help will be appreciated!

The video must also be 1 minute long too.
You could always loop the 8 second clip though.
Load up Premiere, add your loop & 1 minute audio clip.
Set 2 seconds silence at the head of the audio.
Loop your 8 second clip 8 times to give you a 64 second video clip.
This will give you 2 seconds of silence at the trailing end, but there is really no other way

Change color in an Encore motion menu background

I am thinking about using an existing Encore menu but I would like to take the moving background which is shades of blue and change it to shades of another color. I've done this in PS for fixed backgrounds by right clicking and sending the menu to photoshop.
However I am not sure 100% on how to do this for a pre-built menu with motion? I assume it is some kind of workflow of adding the menu to an Encore project and then sending the video from that timeline (as a video track not a menu?) to Pre Pro and using color tools there to replace color, etc.....then rendering it with an appropriate codec and somehow marrying it back with the original menu buttons, etc. in Encore..
Just not sure how to make that all happen! Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks,
BJBBJB1

You are on the right track. A Motion Menu uses a Video Asset (and maybe an Audio Asset too), for the motion.
All you have to do is create a Video Asset, or modify an existing one, Import that into Encore as an Asset, and then use the Pickwhip to link to that for the Motion Menu Background.
Once, those Video Assets for Motion Menus were WMV files, but in those days, Encore was ported for the PC only. Now, with X-platform capabilities, the format is M2v.
I would take the Motion Menu Background Video into PrPro, adjust the colors, and change it, in any way you need, then Export that for Import into Encore. If you have used a Menu Template, then there will be an existing Motion Menu Background Video already associated with it. Just use the Pickwhip to change that association.
Good luck,
Hunt

DVD Burn Error: too much motion menu content yet not much.

hi
Keep getting this when i try to burn my DVD, can anyone advise?
+- The following warnings and errors were found during the validation of the current project:+
+- There seems to be too much motion menu content in your project. Correct this problem before you continue burning this project.+
Message was edited by: Logic Pro

Perhaps you can elaborate a bit more. How many menus do you have in the project? In the scenes menus how many motion buttons do you have? How many differen audio files are you using in the menus? Of the files you dropped into motion menus/buttons, how long are those clips? How long are the various audio files you are using? ? ? ? ?? ????? ???????????
I can't see your project so I have no idea what you are already using and if what you have is clearly excessive or not.
Patrick

Audio Motion Menu Limit

Hello!
I am at a stage in my project that i need to add a voice over to the dvd. The dvd consists of 110 static menus - which up until now has worked fine. I have an audio file that needs to be cut up for each section, and the file is 460mb - so each menu will roughly have 4mb of audio on it.
So am I right or wrong in saying that after all the menus have the audio in, the motion menu size will be 460mb? or maybe a bit more including the static menu elements? If not is their anyway I can work out what the total size of the motion menu's will be?
This is pretty urgent so any help would be very very appreciated.
Thanks,
Steven.

You should be okay as long as you don't exceed a total of 1Gb in Menu Space.
Over that & all bets are off.
Under that, and you should be okay.

Video in 16:9 Motion menu preview being cropped

I can't find any discussion on this but am maybe asking the wrong question.
How do I get the 16:9 preview buttons on a 16:9 motion menu to play without cropping the top and bottom of the source clip? I don't understand why a 16:9 clip doesn't fill a 16:9 preview window- and can't find any setting which fixes this.
4:3 preview windows play fine.
Hope someone can help.
Thanks, Steve

I'm not sure that you're describing what's happening well. Can you describe what you're doing in a little more detail? Or could it be you're actually doing letterboxing, not 16:9?
Alex

MOTION MENU INCONSISTENCIES (+ poor transcoding)

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