Neo4 and X2...

Got the Neo4 and am getting ready to get new CPu - as I understand it the last BIOS released had the needed update for X2 processors? Can someone confirm this for me?

Depends what you mean by "needed". It does let the operating system recognize two processors in task manager. The new official bios introduced some annoying problems for some people too, mostly those without dual processors. You can read about it in this index.

Similar Messages

K8N Neo4 and Memory

Hi. I'm running 32-bit XP Pro and I need more memory but my K8N Neo4 is fully populated with 4 x PC2700 512Mb dimms. I'm planning to buy 2 x 1Gb PC2700 dimms and use two of the existing 512Mb dimms. I've looked at the manual for my m/b and it leaves me confused when it refers to double-this and double-that. Can someone help me by telling me if the following memory would be suitable for my board:
http://www.google.co.uk/products/catalog?q=pc2700+ddr&rls=com.microsoft:en-gb:IE-SearchBox&oe=UTF-8&sourceid=ie7&rlz=1I7GGLG_en&um=1&ie=UTF-8&cid=12882859307161477854&ei=AotAS7HBLqL00gS_1KiSBQ&sa=X&oi=product_catalog_result&ct=result&resnum=3&ved=0CCUQ8wIwAg#ps-sellers
With my limited understanding of what should go where, I'm planning on putting the two 1Gb dimms in the green slots and the 512Mb cards in the purple slots. Does that sound right?
Thanks for any help you can provide.

Hello!
What processor and PSU have you got? What is your exact motherboard? http://www.msi.com/index.php?func=searchresult&keywords=K8N+Neo4+
One-sided memory is where memory chips, the thin black boxes on the memory sticks, are one side. Double-sided where chips are on both sides.
If you have the K8N Neo4-FX you can use up to 4 GB of memory. Your OS can't see that much. Even it may sound a little uneconomical to you, I would replace all the smaller sticks for 4 x 1GB of memory, in two kitted pairs. Should be DDR, PC2700, Non-ECC, Non-REG, 2,5 volt. It isn't certain Dual Channel will be enabled, but the size will do the difference anyway.
However the memory in your link isn't optimal for Nvidia chipsets. Corsair is what I would get.

MSI K8N-Neo4 and PCI-E x4

Hi Folks,
I've got an MSI K8N-Neo4 (MS-7125) motherboard that I'm looking to add a RAID card to. It's got a PCI-Express x4 slot on the board that I'd like to utilize. However, I've seen some conflicting information regarding it's use. In the manual on page 2-26 it states "PCI Express x4 Slot (Support PCI-E x2 device Only)". However when I look at the webpage for the board at http://www.msicomputer.com/product/p_spec.asp?model=K8N_Neo4_Platinum& it makes no mention of this limitation.
The main reason why I'm wondering is because I'd like to add a HighPoint RocketRAID SATA raid controller to my system. If the slot can handle x4 cards, then I'll purchase the 2310 model, which is an x4. If it cannot, then I'll purchase the 2300, which is an x2 model. I've seen some mentions of other people on the forums with K8N-Neo4 boards using the 2320 (an x4 card with 8 SATA ports instead of 4 on the 2310), but haven't seen what sort of bandwidth they're getting. Are you actually able to get PCI-E x4 bandwidth out of this port? Or will it downgrade it to PCI-E x2 or PCI-E x1 (the PCI-E spec says that when cards a plugged into a different size port they only need to be supported at x1)? Or, and even better question, will it even work?
Thanks for any help you can provide.

Quote from: Bas on 09-July-06, 07:25:26
Those are not different then from what's on the motherboard
Want a real one? Look at this: >>Real one!<<
That's real raid controller.....
What you mention is just the same as the onboard stuff.
As for the Linux raid stuff, I presume you mean the Linux Software raid, no those controllers aren't that good, but the High-points aren't that good either.
Heck, they don't even have their own CPU or memory.....the one I showed you has and is WAY faster
(PS. sample given is PCIx, won't fit your board, but that's a raid controller!)
Okay, that still doesn't answer my question about the PCI-E slot. You make a decent point, but I was more using the Highpoints as an example and because they came up in several searches of the forum. For the sake of getting a real answer, lets assume it is a real RAID card, such as the PROMISE SuperTrak EX8350 RTL, which according to the Serial ATA on Linux page is a real raid card and all that. Will it work in the PCI-E x4 slot on the MSI K8N-Neo4 Platinum or not?
All I really want to know is if the slot can actually run a PCI-E x4 card or not. The documentation contradicts itself.

Neo4 and amd3000+ s939 O/C help

my system is;
msi neo4 platinum
amd 3000+ s939
2x256 twinmos pc3200 ddr
msi 6200 td pcı express
I want to overclock this system. How to configure my system on beos for advice "Athlon64 3000+ (90 nm) @ 2.46 GHz (308 FSB), vcore = 1.450V, stock CPU fan, 3x HTT
PC3200 RAM @ CL2-3-3-6-1T, 2.8V,"
Hight performance mode : manuel
aggressive timing : disable
dynamic overclocking : disable
Adjust CPU FSB Frequency : 308
HT Frequency : 3x
HT Width : ? ? (how to)
SATA spreed spectrum : disable
PCIE spread spectrum : disable
PCIE Clock : 100
SSE/SSE2 : enable
Cool'n Quiet : disable
Adjust CPU ratio : ? (haw to)
Adjust CPU VID : ? (how to)
CPU voltage : 1.450
Memory voltage : 2.8
NF4 voltage : ? (how to)
memory setting ---------------------
Timing mode : ?
memclock index value : ?
CAS# latency (Tcl) : 2
Min RAS# active time : 6
RAS# to CAS# delay : 3
Row precharge time : 3
Trc : auto
Trfc : auto
Trrd : auto
Twr : auto
Twr : auto
Twtr : auto
Trwt : auto
Tref : auto
user config mode : auto
Botton of 32bit : ? ?
1T/2T Memory timing : 1T
Read Preamle value : ?
async latency value : ?

no bosd here, memory set to 2t after suggestion at 3-4-4-8, which is default for the 200mhz ram. system very stable upon boot with ht at 4 X 230, cpu at 2.07G, and ram at 460mhz. no ram issue here, tested it, even tried dropping the ram to 166mhz but same thing, MY SYSTEM WONT BOOT 2 TIMES OUT OF 10, OR APPROXIMATLY THAT. it wont even post, my screen doesnt even turn the green light, no speaker confirmation too, and the weird thing is that , i dont even have to clear my cmos. , upon pressing 2 or three times my restart button my system boots normally in o/c mode. no dynamic o/c or aggressive timings here. i like very much my board,and every thing is perfectly stable and reliable, i dont thing that its the psu, its a new thermaltake tr2 single rail 430w with 30amps.so thats the most ive couldve put out of it, and i dont want to force it more cuz its enough for, at 2.07g, my sempron outruns by far the athlon 3200+ in the sandra benchmarks. i dont want to repeat myself but thats the weird thing it doesnt boot always, but most of the time yes it boots.
thanx a lot

Neo4 Overclocking Guide

This guide is intended to help those people who have K8N Neo4 (nforce 4 based) boards. It will provide some general background information, but a lot of things will be specific to this particular series of motherboards, and in general it is assumed that the user is at least moderately familiar with the basic concepts of computer hardware and the concepts and risks associated with overclocking. As usual, I am in no way responsible for any losses/damages resulting in whole or in part from the use or misuse of this information, or in short, "overclock at your own risk". It should also be noted that I have the Neo4 Platinum, so things might be slightly different for those of you with the SLI or other variants of this board, though I would strongly suspect that most of the overclocking features will be pretty much the same. Anyways:
The Basics:
Okay, for those of you who are new to the overclocking crowd, here is a quick overview of some of the essential bits of knowledge. A very complete and thorough introduction and general overclocking guide is also available at https://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?topic=40413.0 for those of you who need extra help.
CPU Speed - If you don't know what this is, then I wonder what you were hoping to attain by accessing an article about "overclocking". The main aim of overclocking is to increase the CPU speed beyond what it is originally specified to run at. The CPU speed is equivalent to the product of your FSB speed and the CPU multiplier.
FSB - FSB is short for "frontside bus". Historically the FSB essentially controls the speed at which the CPU is able to communicate with the rest of the system, and this is pretty much still true for the Athlon64, although the impact of higher FSB speeds is somewhat diminished, as we will see later. On the Neo4 (and most any other board) the FSB and various multipliers/dividers are responsible for determining the core CPU speed, the memory speed, and the HTT speed. You PCI-E bus is locked, so raising the FSB will not cause your video card and other devices to become unstable. Additionally, there is no need to worry about an overclocked FSB screwing up the built-in SATA/IDE controller (the nforce one at least, I haven't tested the SiL, although it should be fine as well).
HTT - HTT (or sometimes just HT) is short for "HyperTransport Technology". Not to be confused with the HyperThreading feature on Intel's P4 processors, this is the communication link between an Athlon64 processor and the PCI-E bus, as well as everything that hangs off this bus, including the SATA/IDE controllers and so on. Basically, everything except for the RAM talks to the CPU via the HTT bus. The speed of the HTT bus is determined by taking the product of the FSB speed and the HyperTransport multiplier, and it provides an extremely large amount of potential throughput, so much so that once its speed is above about 800 MHz, there's very little to be gained by pushing the HTT speed higher.
Memory Clock - The memory clock refers to the speed at which the RAM modules are operated. The memory clock is determined by taking the FSB and applying a ratio to it. Generally speaking, a higher memory clock is better, although there are tradeoffs in terms of latency if memory timings (CAS latency, etc.) have to be loosened in order to get the memory clock higher, or if a ratio other than 1:1 is used (which will be necessary for high overclocks unless the RAM you are using is of extremely high quality).
PCI-E - The PCI-Express bus. This provides connectivity for your graphics card(s) and other add-in cards. The default PCI-E speed is 100 MHz, and this is locked on the Neo4 so that increasing the FSB does not increase the PCI-E speed. You may manually increase the PCI-E speed if you wish, although this is not at all recommended.
vcore - This is an abbreviated way of referring to the voltage that is applied to the CPU. Generally speaking, a higher vcore will provide stability at higher clock speeds, the tradeoff being additional heat, which may or may not require a more robust cooling solution, depending on how high the vcore is being pushed, the quality of your thermal interface compound, and the thermal characteristics of your individual CPU (some just overclock better than others). For the 90 nm Athlon64, the default vcore is 1.40V. The default is slightly higher for the 130 nm variants.
vmem - Similar to "vcore", this is a shorthand way of referring to the voltage that is currently being applied to the RAM modules. Again, an elevated vmem will generally give you improved stability at higher memory clock speeds. Memory specifications vary from manufacturer to manufacturer in terms of what voltages are supported (for instance, my RAM supports from 2.55V to 2.95V), though the default voltage is usually 2.65V. Vmem, vdimm, and vram all refer to the same thing.
Purchasing:
For anyone who happens to stumble across this guide while in the process of looking for some new hardware, I thought I'd list some of the things that are important considerations when you are buying a system with the intent of overclocking it.
The CPU - For most people, the main point behind their desire to overclock is that they want to be able to get a cheap CPU, and then run it at the same speed (or faster than) of a CPU that costs much more (possibly one for which the price premium has not come down on yet). When choosing which CPU to purchase, there are a few aspects that are especially relevant to overclocking (I'm going to assume that you've already decided to use an AMD CPU, due to the reduced overclockability, thermal problems, and generally poorer performance in most areas despite having higher raw clock speeds that all of Intel's current P4 models offer). Arguably the most important feature (when looking at the current Athlon64's anyways, which are very good CPU's and which you have to use if you want the Neo4) is the manufacturing process used. This denotes the size of the smallest individual feature on the chip (smaller is better). Your two choices right now are 90 nm and 130 nm. The 90 nm carries a fairly small price premium (about $10 for the 3000+/3200+ models), but is *much* more overclockable due to the fact that it operates at a lower voltage (and thus generates less heat), and also uses a more "mature" revision than the 130 nm parts. It is *strongly* recommended that you make sure to get a 90 nm CPU if you are in the market for a new socket 939 Athlon64. The next thing to consider is the default CPU multiplier. This is the one reason why it might be preferable to get a 3200+ over a 3000+ chip (generally speaking, all the 90 nm Athlon64's have about the same upper limit on their overclocked core speeds, until you hit the still very expensive 3800+ and FX variants, so it doesn't make sense to buy a more expensive CPU when you're not getting any extra overclockability out of it). The multipliers on the Athlon64 CPU's are "half-locked", meaning that you can run at the default multiplier (9x for the 3000+, 10x for the 3200+), or any multiplier that is smaller than the default, but you cannot select a multiplier that is higher than your default multiplier. Thus, getting the 3200+ over the 3000+ gives you two extra multipliers (10x and 9.5x) and, all things being equal, will let you achieve a higher clock speed before you are forced to run your RAM asynchronously and pay the latency penalty for doing so, although your max clock speed will likely be about the same as it would if you had gotten the 3000+ instead (so if you have cheap RAM that's not giong to overclock well at all, there's very little reason to go with the 3200+ unless a RAM upgrade is planned in the near future). So, for overclocking purposes my recommendation is a 90 nm Socket 939 Athlon64 3000+, or if you have high performance memory and want to get the most out of it, the 3200+. Both chips are competitively priced and should overclock at least to 2.4 GHz, if not higher, on stock cooling (spend the extra $10 for the non-OEM variant and get the HSF that comes with the chip, it works as well as many more expensive third-party air-based systems and is well worth the extra $10), and of course both offer the attractive feature-set of a socket 939 Athlon64 (dual integrated memory controllers, 64-bit support, dual-core processors on the future upgrade path, etc.).
The Motherboard - The motherboard is an important part of overclocking as well. There's not much point in getting a highly overclockable CPU and then pairing it with a mainboard that was not designed with overclocking in mind, and this is one area where the Neo4 really shines...it has superb overclocking support. Probably the most important feature to have if you indend to overclock your CPU by 20%+ (which should be easily attainable on either of the recommended CPU's above) is that the board have locks that prevent the overclocked FSB from overclocking parts of the system that can't handle the extra speed (like the PCI/PCI-E bus, for example), and long story short, the Neo4 has these (unlike the Via-based K8T Neo, which had no locks and which limited SATA users to overclocks of no more than about 225 MHz because any high than that and the SATA controllers would start to become unstable and kill your HDD data...working locks are a very good and important thing if you are overclocking). The next important feature is to choose a board whose BIOS lets you control the options that are important for overclocking. Again, the Neo4 does excellent here, letting you pick your memory divider, memory timings (and some very obscure ones at that), CPU multiplier, FSB speed, HTT multiplier, CPU voltage, chipset voltage, RAM voltage, and so on without complaint. The MB also has a handly little button on it that will clear the CMOS with a single press (no more screwing around with those annoying jumpers) in case you screw up and the system won't POST. The board also has some extra cooling hardware installed in the form of a passive heatsink near the rear I/O panel, but mostly it's the presence of functional locks and the wide range over overclocking related BIOS features that make it attractive from an overclocking perspective. Aside from this, it has a very nice feature set in general, including 8 SATA ports and 2 IDE channels (for a total of up to 12 drives), two gigabit ethernet adapters, firewire, 7.1 channel audio, and the additional selling point that nvidia's unified drivers tend to be much easier to install than most companies' drivers.
Cooling:
Okay, one last thing to consider before the overclocking starts. Cooling is important in general and especially if you are going to be overclocking. While a 90 nm Athlon64 performs rather admirably from a thermal perspective even when only stock cooling components are used, some simple modifications can drop your idle/load temps by 5+ degrees, which can give you a bit more overclocking headroom and which in any event will make your CPU happier.
Case Fans - The first thing you want to do is make sure your case is adequately ventilated...in general a single 120 mm exhaust fan will do the job just fine. If your case does not support fans this large, use at least two 80 mm fans, either both as exhaust, or one as exhaust and one as intake (if they perform differently, use the more powerful one as the exhaust fan to avoid overpressuring your case). If noise is a concern, the Vantec Stealth (http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=11-999-614&depa=1) series of case fans are affordable, come in a variety of sizes, perform quite well, and do not make much noise at all (though you might want to consider doubling up on the 120 mm's just to be on the safe side). This can lower your CPU temp by about 2 to 5 degrees over a poorly ventilated case configuration using the same CPU fan.
CPU Fan - As I mentioned earlier, the default CPU fan that comes packaged with the retail Athlon64 chips is perfectly acceptable for overclocking use in my opinion. The only complaint I have is that the thermal compound that comes preapplied to the HSF is fairly cheap and does not perform that well. I *very strongly* recommend replacing it with Arctic Silver (http://www.arcticsilver.com/as5.htm) before ever installing it on your CPU. To remove the default thermal pad, you can use a razor blade to get most of it off, and then hot soapy water (or denatured alcohol I've heard) to remove any remaining reside. Be sure that the HSF is free of any cleaning residue and also of any moisture before going to install it on the CPU, and then just apply the Arctic Silver and then complete the HSF installation, and you're good to go. Arctic Silver is relatively cheap (the tube you'll get will do several CPU's, and it doesn't go bad), and by replacing the thermal pad that comes on the stock HSF with it, you should be able to reduce your idle/load times by at least 5 degrees, and with this plus the added reduction you get from having a well ventilated case, you should have enough headroom to pull off some pretty aggressive overclocks.
Overclocking:
Finally, on to the good (and Neo4 specific) stuff. Hopefully at this point you have a freshly built Neo4 based system with an Athlon64 CPU that provides a large headroom for overclocking.
Initial Setup - Okay, the first thing you're going to want to do once the system is built and powered on for the first time is enter the BIOS and configure everything to run at its *default* settings. It's not quite time to overclock yet. First, you want to install Windows, patch it to SP2 if necessary, and then install some benchmarking, stress testing, and monitoring software. SiSoft Sandra is a good benchmark suite, as are FutureMark's PCMark and 3dMark lines of software. For stress testing you can use SuperPi and Prime95 (and Memtest86 if you don't mind the tedium of having to reboot in order to use it, which I do so I don't bother with it). For monitoring you can use SpeedFan or Motherboard Monitor 5. At the very least you should install one application from each category, and configure your monitoring software to launch when Windows loads. One you have all this configured and working right, it's time to start overclocking (don't install too much else, in case of the worst case scenario in which an instability causes your HDD to become corrupted, requiring a reinstall of Windows and all the software, which is admittedly very unlikely, but unfortunately possible if you're unlucky enough). For comparison purposes you may want to run some benchmarks and record the results before you start. Additionally, you may want to install something like ClockGen, which will let you tweak your FSB/CPU coltage on the fly and which can make it easier to zero in on a stable configuration without having to reboot every time an instability is found.
BIOS Layout - Just to save some time, I'll describe where BIOS options that we'll be using are all in one place, so that when I reference something you can just look up here and figure out how to find the appropriate setting in the BIOS. Basically, there are two pages that we're interested in for overclocking (note that the Neo4 manual is actually extremely well done, and describes pretty much all of the BIOS options, so you can use it as well). The first is the "Advanced Chipset Features" page. Going "Advanced Chipset Features" -> "DRAM Configuration" brings up pretty much all of your memory related options (divider, timings, etc.), *except* for the RAM voltage. The RAM voltage option is on the "Cell Menu" page, which happens to also contain all the other settings we are interested in, including FSB speed, HTT multiplier, CPU multiplier, vcore, vmem, chipset voltage, etc.. Basically, if it's not memory related, it's on the "Cell Menu" page.
HTT Speed - As mentioned earlier, your HTT speed pretty much has no performance impact on the system once it gets to 800+ MHz, so the very first thing you can do is select the 4x HTT multiplier in the BIOS. Note that as the HTT speed gets above about 1100 MHz, it will probably start to make the system unstable. Therefore, you should keep track of the product of your FSB setting and your HTT multiplier, and whenever it gets to be above 1100, decrement the HTT multiplier to the next lowest setting. at a 4x multiplier, you should be good up to about 275 MHz on your FSB. Because the HTT's impact on performance is negligible, you do not need to worry about trying to maximize its value during overclocking.
CPU speed - Onve you've reduced your HTT multiplier, it's time to find your max stable core speed. To do this first go to the memory page and select a memclock index of 100 MHz. This will run your RAM it half the FSB speed, and the reason for doing this is to ensure that as we raise the FSB, any instability the occurs is a result of the overclocked CPU and not a result of overclocked RAM, so that we can be sure that we have indeed found the maximum stable CPU speed when we are done. Leave your other RAM settings at their defaults, we'll come back and tweak these later. Now go to the CPU page and select "Manual" for the "High Performance Mode" option if necessary to enable editing of the settings. You should disable Dynamic Overclocking (since you are doing this manually) and I recommend disabling Cool'n'Quiet, though you don't have to if you really don't want to. Disable all the "... Spectrum" settings (what these do is kind of complicated, but the manual plainly states that they should be disabled if you are overclocking, so heed its advice). Also disable "Aggressive Timing", as this will decrease your RAM overclockability substantially without providing any real benefit (and may make it unstable even at its rated settings). Now, what you want to do is, leaving the other CPU settings (i.e. vcore and multiplier) the same, start raising your FSB Frequency in 10 to 12 MHz increments, depending on your multiplier (basically you want to raise it about 100 MHz at a time). Some people feel this is a fairly large jump to do at a time, but I've found that the Athlon64 handles it just fine. If you get up above about 2.4 GHz, then you might want to only go by half of this at a time though. Remember to decrement your HTT multiplier as necessary. Basically, every time you raise the FSB, test for stability by letting the system try to boot to Windows. If it is successful, return to BIOS and raise the core speed some more. Once the system fails to boot, you have two options, either raise the CPU voltage (use the "CPU VID" setting in the BIOS to adjust the voltage directly, or the "CPU Voltage" setting to specify how much over the specified amount of voltage to apply...personally I prefer the "CPU VID" route, but it's really a matter of personal preference, and yes, both can be manipulated in unison...one thing I've noticed here is that the "CPU Voltage" settings seem to allow for less variance in the final vcore setting, keeping it very close to the specified voltage at all times, whereas increasing via the "CPU VID" option lets the voltage decrease a bit from the specified value when the system is not under load) and try again (and keep repeating until you have given the CPU as much voltage as you are comfortable with and the system can no longer be made stable), or return to you last stable setting and let it boot. Once you have done this, use your benchmarking and stress testing software to make sure you really are stable at your settings. If the system crashes or the test reports errors, you will either need to raise the voltage a little, or lower the FSB a little (this is where ClockGen can be a big timesaver). While some people swear by Prime95, my opinion is that if you can get through the largest SuperPi test without any errors, your overclock is stable. Monitor your temps while you do this. If you notice that the CPU temperature is getting above 60 degrees, you are running a bit too hot. Generally speaking, about 55 should be considered the threshold of safety here. If you're running hot, you can either decrease the voltage and FSB settings, or get a better cooling solution. Once you have determined that your setting is stable and not overheating your CPU, record your core speed (not your FSB speed, the total CPU speed) and voltage settings for later. You should probably be shooting for a target clock speed of around 2.4 GHz, or more if you have good cooling, or if you are interested in doing a "safe" overclock, just shoot for as high as you can get without raising the voltage.
Memory Speed - Now that you know your CPU's limits, it's time to work on the RAM. First restore your FSB to 200 MHz and your CPU voltage to its default, and specify a CPU multiplier of 6x to make sure that the CPU will not be stressed as your raise the FSB. Go to your RAM page, and manually specify whatever timings are appropriate to your RAM modules. Also be sure to set "1T/2T Memory Timing" to 1T (set the "... Mode" setting to Manual to make the RAM settings editable). Leave the rest of the settings alone, except for the "Memclock Index Value". Here, you have a choice to make. If you have high quality RAM, or your target CPU speed is not too high (like < 2.3 GHz), you can try to run your RAM synchronously, which will give you somewhat better latency. If this is the case, select an index value of 200 MHz (note that on the Neo4, when you select a memclock index what you are really specifying in the ratio at which the RAM operates relative to the FSB...the memclock index option is basically just obscuring this setting. To calculate your ratio, divide whatever the index value is by 200, so an index of 200 MHz is a 1:1 ratio, an index of 150 MHz is a 3:4 ratio, and so on). If your RAM is not of very high quality (for example, it's only rated as PC3200), or your target CPU speed is high, you will likely need to run the RAM asynchronously, so select the next highest index value of 180 MHz. This will let you get slightly higher RAM clock speeds, at the cost of a little bit of added latency (the performance hit isn't much...you'll be much faster running asynch at 2.4 GHz than synch at 2.2 GHz). Now you do the same thing that you did with the CPU, gradually increasing the FSB (you might want to use smaller increments this time though) until the system will no longer boot (remember again to decrease the HTT multiplier if necessary), and then returning to your last stable setting (or increasing the voltage and repeating) and booting to Windows and running stability tests. You do not need to monitor your temps while doing the RAM tests (unless you want to). Generally I find that Sandra's "Cache and Memory..." benchmark works well for detecting memory instability, and you can also use SuperPi, Prime95, or Memtest86 as well. Once you have tested stable, record your memory clock speed (use the formula: memory speed = FSB speed * memclock index value / 200) and voltage and reboot to the BIOS settings menu. Note that while you may be able to attain a higher memory clock speed by selecting a higher CAS latency, it is not generally advisible to do so, as from what I've seen, although memory bandwidth remains about the same as CAS increases (as far as Sandra is concerned anyways), the lower latency provided by CAS2 improves the system score by 5% in PCMark 04, and given that RAM performance scales pretty much linearly relative to the clock speed, unless running at CL2.5 lets you get *at least* 10 to 15 MHz higher than at CL2, it is not worth it overall.
Run the Numbers - Believe it or not the performance of the Neo4 system is dictacted pretty much entirely by the core and memory clock speeds (given identical memory timing settings). The only other real factor is whether the RAM is run synchronously or not, which you just decided in the above step, so all that's left to do now is find the combination of memclock index, FSB, and CPU multiplier that allow you to get as clost to both your target core and memory speeds as possible. If you are running synchronously, your task is simple, just keep your memclock index of 200 MHz, specify your target FSB speed, and your default CPU multiplier (unless your RAM is so good that the CPU is not stable at the default multiplier and the RAM's top FSB speed, in which case drop the multiplier accordingly). If running the RAM asynchronously your task is a bit more difficult (having a calculator for this part will help), basically you have to go through the list of memory dividers (memclock indexes), and for each one calculate the ratio of memclock index / 200, and then divide your target memory clock speed by that ratio to get the FSB needed to attain your target memory speed (for example, if the target is 230 MHz, for a memclock index of 150 we get a ratio of 0.75, and 230 / 0.75 = 307 MHz, so running the RAM at 230 MHz with an index of 150 MHz requires a FSB setting of 307 MHz...pretty good if your target clockspeed is 2.45 GHz, as selecting an 8x multiplier will pretty much hit this exactly), and then go through the available *whole* CPU multipliers (I've heard that the half-multipliers should be avoided, as they cause the memory to get clocked incorrectly) and see if any multiplier times the FSB you calculated hits (or comes reasonably close to hitting) your target CPU speed. Go through all of them until you get an exact (or very close) match, and pick whichever one ends up matching most closely. Note that there is no benefit in this case to a higher FSB speed configuration over a lower FSB speed configuration, provided that both produce the same core and memory clock values, so you should not favor configurations with needlessly high FSB settings unless they produce a better fit than the others. Apply whichever settings are closest, and then apply the appropriate CPU and memory voltage settings that you got from the previous steps. Also apply whichever HTT multiplier will put you closest to 1000 MHz without going over 1100 MHz. After this, your system should be ready to boot, overclocked and stable. Be sure to do additional benchmarking and stress testing to make sure that you really are stable (if you saved your scores at the beginning, compare them to your scores now and marvel at the improvement...and post the results for people to see), and be sure to monitor your temps for a bit to make sure your cooling is working adequately.
Post Overclock Overclocking:
There's not a whole lot to do now, but if you want to try to tweak your memory timings to get a little bit of extra performance, now is the time to do it...just remember to record your stable overclock settings somewhere (*not* on the computer) in case the tweaking forces a CMOS reset and you lose all your settings, and enjoy. Also you can overclock whatever video card you have, a process that's much easier and faster than overclocking your CPU/RAM/FSB.
In Closing:
I hope someone out there finds this useful, given how long it took to write up. Maybe I'll get lucky and this will end up as a sticky...we'll see. And just to start things off, here are my benchmark scores, at stock and at the overclock described in my sig:
Stock:
3dMark05 = 3141
PCMark04 = 3589
Overclocked:
3dMark05 = 3704
PCMark = 4805

Just started ocing the system, I'm new at this so these are where my system stands and the results
--------[ EVEREST Home Edition (c) 2003-2005 Lavalys, Inc. ]------------------------------------------------------------
Version EVEREST v2.20.405
Homepage http://www.lavalys.com/
Report Type Report Wizard
Computer HOWARD-4B304E62
Generator Howard
Operating System Microsoft Windows XP Home Edition 5.1.2600 (WinXP Retail)
Date 2005-09-16
Time 16:14
--------[ Overclock ]---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
CPU Properties:
CPU Type AMD Athlon 64
CPU Alias Venice S939
CPU Stepping DH-E3
CPUID CPU Name AMD Athlon(tm) 64 Processor 3000+
CPUID Revision 00020FF0h
CPU Speed:
CPU Clock 2456.56 MHz
CPU Multiplier 9.0x
CPU FSB 272.95 MHz (original: 200 MHz, overclock: 36%)
Memory Bus 204.71 MHz
CPU Cache:
L1 Code Cache 64 KB (Parity)
L1 Data Cache 64 KB (ECC)
L2 Cache 512 KB (On-Die, ECC, Full-Speed)
Motherboard Properties:
Motherboard ID 03/15/2005-MS-7100-6A61FM4BC-00
Motherboard Name MSI K8N Diamond / K8N SLI Platinum (MS-7100) (3 PCI, 2 PCI-E x16, 4 DDR DIMM, Audio, Gigabit LAN, IEEE-1394)
Chipset Properties:
Motherboard Chipset nVIDIA nForce4 SLI, AMD Hammer
Memory Timings 2-4-4-6 (CL-RCD-RP-RAS)
Command Rate (CR) 1T
SPD Memory Modules:
DIMM1: GeIL CL25-4-4DDR 500 512 MB PC4000 DDR SDRAM (2.5-5-5-9 @ 250 MHz) (2.0-5-5-9 @ 232 MHz)
DIMM2: GeIL CL25-4-4DDR 500 512 MB PC4000 DDR SDRAM (2.5-5-5-9 @ 250 MHz) (2.0-5-5-9 @ 232 MHz)
BIOS Properties:
System BIOS Date 03/15/05
Video BIOS Date 06/27/05
Award BIOS Type Phoenix - AwardBIOS v6.00PG
Award BIOS Message W7100NZ1 V9.0 031505 14:17:53
DMI BIOS Version 6.00 PG
Graphics Processor Properties:
Video Adapter nVIDIA GeForce 6600 GT PCI-E
GPU Code Name NV43GT (PCI Express x16 10DE / 0140, Rev A2)
GPU Clock 299 MHz
Memory Clock 522 MHz
--------[ Power Management ]--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Power Management Properties:
Current Power Source AC Line
Battery Status No Battery
Full Battery Lifetime Unknown
Remaining Battery Lifetime Unknown
--------[ Sensor ]------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sensor Properties:
Sensor Type Winbond W83627THF (ISA 290h)
GPU Sensor Type Driver (NV-DRV)
Motherboard Name MSI MS-7046 / 7100 / 7125
Temperatures:
Motherboard 32 °C (90 °F)
CPU 35 °C (95 °F)
GPU1: GPU 56 °C (133 °F)
GPU2: GPU 50 °C (122 °F)
Cooling Fans:
CPU 3444 RPM
System 2637 RPM
North Bridge 7337 RPM
Voltage Values:
CPU Core 1.38 V
+3.3 V 3.34 V
+5 V 5.08 V
+12 V 12.04 V
+5 V Standby 5.17 V
VBAT Battery 3.10 V
Debug Info F 40 31 17
Debug Info T 32 35 157
Debug Info V 56 D1 C6 BD 1C 14 34 (01)
--------[ Debug - PCI ]-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Benchmarking PCMARK04/score:4684 3DMARK03/score:15075
got any suggestions, Im just trying to learn how to do this, any help would be greatly appreciated

Msi neo4+asus wi-fi pci card

what you guys think:msi neo4 and an asus wifi pci card will work together?anyway is my only option for wireless lan

I wouldn't try that they could be incompatible and kill each other... Just kidding....
The only way to know is by testing it...you'll never know....the Asus is a PCI card like any other, I think...
Be well....

500GB Maxtor S-ATA causes K8N Neo4 to freeeze

Is there a compatibility issue with the NEO4 and large drives such as this? I've tried everything I can think of to get this drive to work. With the drive connected system boots fine, but when I try to partition and format it my system freezes and I'll have to reboot.
I've tried Partition Magoc 8, Windows Disk Manangement and MaxBlast and the result is the same with each, as soon as the software tries to do something to the drive my system crashes. I checked and double checked cabling and have updated to the last BIOS with no luck. I'm running XP Pro SP2 and have 4 other drives in my system that are all large, over 200GB each, some S-ATA, some IDE.

if it's a maxtor diamond max 10 plus, than there is a general incompatibility between those drives and nforce4 chipsets. you have to contact maxtor support and ask them for an updated firmware for the HDD. just search the forum, it has been already discussed.

Is there a big difference between MSI K8N SLI and MSI K8N SLI Platinum motherboa

i am a bit tight on budget, so I was wondering if I should get the MSI K8N SLI motherboard instead of the MSI K8N SLI Platinum motherboard (my previous choice),.......what do u guys say ?

Hi,
Note that he is not talking about the Neo4 versions, looks like in the US MSI has different products:
Here is the K8N SLI:
http://www.msi.com.tw/program/products/mainboard/mbd/pro_mbd_detail.php?UID=681
And here is the K8N NEO4 SLI:
http://www.msicomputer.com/product/p_spec.asp?model=K8N_Neo4/SLI&class=mb
One has Sound blaster, the other does not.
Besides, K8N SLI Platinum has only one LAN.
http://www.msi.com.tw/program/products/mainboard/mbd/pro_mbd_detail.php?UID=641
While the Neo4 Platinum has two.
http://www.msicomputer.com/product/p_spec.asp?model=K8N_Neo4_Platinum/SLI&class=mb
A bit confusing right !? Remember that this forum is accessed by people all over the world.
The thing is that the Neo4 and the related non-Neo are using the same BIOS AFAIK.
wpr

Neo4 Platinum w/ Venice Core

Hahaha after being stuck at the silly 219fsb issue with my Winnie i broke down and gotta 3200+ Venice and the mobo easily boots 270x10 HTx3. With some more playing around i should get it upto 2.85GHz with little effort. Anyone running a Neo4 and is using a Winnie might wanna change upto a Venice. I'm using the 1.3 bios.

Quote
Allright the ram is in slots 1 & 2, yes it's TCCD double sided.
Basically from what i can tell is that all Neo4's w/SLI or not are effected by the 219fsb issue if they are using Winchester Core cpu's from 0451 to the present. What happens is you get a black screen like you OC'd to far and have to reset cmos and start over.
Seems the 2.85GHz might be outta my reach, but i did get it running 300x9 HTx3 w/ the ram 1:1 at 2T speeds. I was like wow
Thanks. I didn't hear if you set the timings automatically or manually? 2700 is very respectable , too bad you couldn't get the 1T, but I wouldn't complain either.
I mean I'm happy I can get my Venice to 2500, but I can't figure out why 8x313 works with 200:133, and 10x250 with 200:166 doesn't. CPU speed is the same and so is RAM clk. 3x or 4x makes no diffence... I won't stop till I can get this system how I want it.

PSU Question on an MSI K8N Neo4 Plat

I ordered an Antec TruePower 430W for this system. The manual says that it has a 20-pin connector for the main MB power connector.
Will I be able to use this PSU?
Will I have to get a converter piece for it?

Quote from: jrb357 on 25-March-05, 14:30:21
Well if your True 430 is of the newer vers. with 26a on the +12v you should be just fine. I'm running one and things seem stable for the most part, other then that 220fsb OC issue with the Neo4 and Winnie's, but it OC's 270fsb x9 totally stable with Clockgen and with a 10% OC on the vid card scores a 4100 in 3DMark 2005. It has a minor studdering in some 3D games, that makes me wonder if a psu with the 24pin connector would help stablize it in 3D games just alittle. So i'd say if you already own the psu go ahead and use it, but if you're looking for a new one I'd think about a different psu that has the 24pin mobo connection with a minimum of 480w and 28a/+12v.
I would prefer to get the 1 gig of dual channel RAM first. BUT... if it is really needed I will get the power supply first. My Antec TruePower is maybe at least two or three years old.

Have you OC'd MSI K8N Neo4? If so, please reply.

Hey guys!
Im trying to figure out why my system wont boot over 220mhz FSB.
My previous thread:
K8N Platinum instability! help!
If you have MSI K8N Neo4 and a winchester cpu please write down anything you changed in bios. It would help me out a lot.
Like mem timings. vcore. voltage. and so on. Anything you've changed
My system specs:
winchester 3500+
MSI K8N SLI Platinum with the latest bios(official)
PowerColor X300SE
36gb Raptor SATA
120gb Maxtor IDE
Hp CD-Writer 8100
Hiper 425w PSU (20pin ->24pin adapter)
TwinMos Twister PC4300
Windows XP ServicePack2
Latest bios (according to MSI Live Monitor)

Quote
Some1ne, Are you using an Antec True Power 380W without the 20 ->24 pin adapter?
Yes, I am using it without any adapter. I just followed the instructions given in the manual about how to hook up a 20 pin PSU to the 24-pin connector (i.e. leave pins 11, 12, 23, 24 unconnected). It was very easy to do and the pins are all keyed to prevent incorrect insertion of the 20 pin connector.
I wouldn't be concerned about your PSU if I were you...a lot of times power requirements are overstated here mostly in order to ensure that people don't go out and buy a crappy $20, 500W rated PSU and then come in and ask "why doesn't my system work, my PSU should be plenty big enough." The Antec TruePower PSU's are fairly high quality, and I wouldn't expect you to have any problems with yours.
Quote
Other question, you was able to reach 272fsb (htt) inside and only with the BIOS? or you used ClockGen ?
Yes, BIOS overclocking only, I haven't tried using ClockGen to tweak.

A few Neo4 questions (-5V still needed for onboard creative?)

My brother is upgrading his machine and I've been dealt the task of choosing his components . I've been scouring these forums and the PCP ones trying read up as much as possible on the Neo4 and am trying to figure out if this board still has the -5V problems with the onboard Sound Blaster. From what I read the boards shipping now have had this problem fixed, but older ones in the beginning had this problem. Has this issue actually been resolved now?
Is there any noticable difference between the Neo4 SLI and the Neo4 Platinum SLI? (I'll be buying either the SLI or Plat SLI in about 5 months or so myself.)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813130487 (Plat SLI)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813130492 (regular SLI)
Seems like the regular SLI is missing a few SATA ports, and that's it (perhaps some other minor differences I'm not seeing).
I may end up going with this board for him instead.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16813130484
However, he's stated that he wants the better onboard sound, but if he was stuck with this board, he'd buy an Audigy2 or something (but this adds another $100 or so to his total).
The differences between the SLI boards and vanilla Neo4 (with the exception of the onboard Creative) seem minimal at best. I don't see any glaring differences that stands out.

Man, I wish we had a definitive answer from MSI. I read this thread earlier today:
https://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?PHPSESSID=e0a58bd39846e41ae63a3f38ebf05ecd&topic=80078.0
According to a few people in this thread, the newer boards don't have the -5V requirement. It looks like I'll be going with the regular SLI Neo4, but I may get one of the PSUs in this thread instead of the Antec I wanted to buy (bought Antec for who knows how long, it's just my preferred brand, much like MSI ). I just don't want my brother to get screwed over and find out the PSU I picked has issues with newer tech down the line.
[EDIT:] And then there's this thread here which says that newer boards don't have the -5V requirement.
http://forums.pcper.com/showthread.php?t=387607&highlight=creative
It's driving me nuts I tell you.
[EDIT2:] Found another one.
http://www.hardforum.com/showthread.php?t=913884&highlight=neo4
I'm crossing my fingers that this issue has been fixed. :P

Power of the Press - MSI Neo4 SLI Bios Problem

For those interested, I just sent this to hardocp because they did the review on the MSI SLI Platinum. Since MSI headlines this review on their website, maybe hardocp can do something about this bios problem. Enjoy and please send more emails to hardocp so we can get this problem addressed! Believe me, Ive seen this works with washington politicians, I know it can work if we all do it.
I appreciate companies like yours doing extensive reviews about products. However, your review caused me and a whole bunch of others to purchase this board with enormous problems associated with it (check out the msi forums). The problem is that this board works only for 130nm chips in which you tested on. On the newer amd 90nm chips, this board is the worst performing sli board out in the marketplace (for both winni and venice core chips). You need to do something to stop people from buying this board because its just awful and the folks from MSI are silent on the subject.
It's gotten so bad that people have gone out and purchased other sli boards, transferred all of the equipment out of it and into the new one and guess what...voila, no problems. Anyway, some of those in the other user forums had the same problem but those other manufacturers quickly fixed the problem. Its just getting worse and worse. I feel like both msi (and I am MAD) and reviewers like you (unless you don't know about the problem) are silent on this and its cost me hard earned MONEY ($175 for the mobo) and hours and hours of time...
You have a LOT OF POWER with MSI and I can see it because they headline your review on their website (power of the press). For Gods sake, please do something before others make the same mistake or if you can get MSI to allocate resources to fix the problem...you would be HEROs! Thank you.

Quote from: Husker_Faithful on 19-May-05, 11:56:11
Ok, I guess I am confused some, where is the issue with the new cores? I have no issues running the San Diego core and the my memory at the listed and published speeds.....
Quote
Also is your MOBO the SLI type? I run the SLI Neo4 with a San Diego core without any issues. In fact I dropped it in and booted using the San Diego as a direct replacement for a older (if 6 months is old!!) 3500. I have OC'ed with Corecetner as far as I can push it and runs awesome!
Quote
GUys, I am not sure exactly what issues you are experiencing as there can be MANY factors! But my SLI Neo is running awesome! It overclocks (no Tiresmoke, i won't go into that in this forum ) and has NEVER once BSOD, or rebooted or even crashed! Not once and I push the crap out of this as it is my gaming box. Also TS you are SO correct on the clock settings on the ultras, you gotts make sure they are the same or it will cause issues. The only thing I am kinda bummed about is the lack of real performance with the dual 6800 Ultra's, but that is a Nvidia issue not MSI. Guys I may be blessed, but I have run three Neo MSI brds, 2 939 and 1 754 and never had any issues....
Quote
I have yet to experience any boot/reboot issues...So I think we should wait to hear more from this person before we assume anything...
Quote
I have the nForce4 SLI brd and i run a new San Diego..it booted up fine and zero problems. But man is this thing FAST
Quote
According to MSI, the Neo4 will work fine with the new cores, the Neo2 will need a bios upgrade
Quote
I set my brd up the first time for SLI with dual cards and have never had any issues..Sorry guys, but I guess it's the luck of the draw, but I have yet to ever ave an issue with any MSI brds..I have a Neo2,Neo4 and the older 754 slot Neo..no issues.
7 of your last 11 posts. Why man? Why?
This is from MSI at the "listed and published speeds"
Dear Customer,
Since the mb has not been certified to support the Venice and San Diego Core processors, please wait until beginning of June, 2005 for the release bios support for the mb.
Sincerely,
Technical Support Division
MSI Computer Corp.
As for overclocking have you read these?
https://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?topic=75897.0
https://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?topic=79534.0
https://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?topic=79827.0
Look, I have already been threatened to be banned because of my sarcastic replies to you. Read every one of your responses I listed. Obviously OTHERS are having problems. WHY don't you help them instead of TAUNTING people that yours works. They are upset, and you make them feel dumb like it's their fault.
Man I have tried to contribute so much to this issue that at least 20 different members here are having, I have tested with an Asus SLI board, I have tried different BIOS's and posted results, I have theorized with others and I feel like you are slapping me in the face by restating time and time again "what problem mine works great"i
I'm on a verbal warning because I didn't have respect for you. Well how are you respecting the other people who have problems by saying you don't know what their issue is. Read up on it or help them, instead of creating tension. Please?

Which KVM Switch with K8N Neo4/SLI ???

I'm about to give up on getting my current IO Gear switch to work with this board, has any tried IOGear GCS1732 Extreme?? ANY other USB KVM that works with this board?
Thanks
Ral

heres somthing interesting....i installed a pci usb card, now the kvm works perfectly, my old one, the one i bought months ago for 70 dollars, so that pretty much proves that it is MSI's problem, its how the mobo was designed that conflicts with the kvm, once the mobo uses the usb ports through the pci slot the kvm has no problmes. Theres a catch though, and thats what strangebrew said, the keyboard will not be detected during bios, and im thinking thats not the kvm rather a limitiation of the pci usb card, if i have another keyboard pluged in during post, once in wondows i can unplug it, and the keyboard and mouse plugged in the kvm work fine....
so it is a limitation on msi's behalf..
so in total 50 dollars, 20+tax new keyboard, 20+tax pci card, but at least i can use my kvm, and beats buying a new expensive one.
how ive set my comps up now is, one key board connected directly to the neo4, and everything else to the kvm so i still share the mouse, speakers and monitor. i just have an extra keyboard on the desk for the 2nd comp... not perfect but it cheaper, and alot better than having to unplug the keybaord back and forth...and i get to use my mx700 on both comps.
update another thing you can do, wich is what im doing now, is simply use 1 keyboard for both comps through the kvm, and leave the extra keybaord hidden or out of the way plugged into the msi board, as long as it has a keyboard plugged in the reg usb or ps2 ports, it should boot fine, and when its time to go in to bios, just whip out the extra.

Strange HTT bugs with Neo4/Platinum SLI on Athlon64 .09 Winchester Core

Hey..
I am setting up my new Neo4, and I've run into some very strange non-overclocked behaviour with the AMD64 Winchester core CPU. This does not happen with my Clawhammer CPU on the Neo4, and it also doesn't happen with the same Winchester CPU on two other different nForce4 boards I've tried. So it appears to be a problem with this MSI Neo4 board only.
When I run default non-overclocked settings of 5x HTT at 200mhz, I get a readout of 800mhz HyperTransport in Central-Brain Identifier.. what!?!
I have tried changing to various other HTT values and it's all whacked out and random... For example:
If I set the HTT to 2x, in Central Brain Identifier, it's showing as 4x HTT..
And if I set 1x HTT at 250mhz, Central Brain shows HTT at 1000 mhz??
Also.. when I check the HTT speed in other software, like Sandra... it is reporting conflicting Hypertransport speeds.. Each of the softwares is reporting something different. The HTT is all freaked out on Neo4+Winchester core. What is going on?
This isn't happening on any other nForce4 boards with the same software and CPU.
This Winchester core CPU is running at 1000mhz HTT on two other nForce4 boards I've tried.
I have no idea what the HTT is truely even running a now, cause of such bugginess with this Neo4.
Apparently Neo4 has problems with Winchester core even at stock settings.
Why no word from MSI on this? Will MSI ever fix their problem with Winchesters that no other boards have.. Or will they cause more enthusiasts to lose faith and not buy MSI in the future? Does MSI even care?
...Omnihil

Tiresmoke no offence but ur a moderator of this forum. Whats stopping moderators reporting problems that users innocure due to the products MSI produce ? Your a moderator and a moderator should acctually be able to report the big problems with MSI. I'm not gettin on your back but when people start threads off about stuff thats wrong then we have the right to know... ill contact MSI about it now to see what they say and im sure they would come visit the forum if they new their product had faults....
Quote
This Forum is a User-to-User support community for users of all ages. There is no MSI support to be found here. The moderators are not paid by MSI and do not work for MSI, we are users just like you.
Quote
So how did you become a moderator and why ? If your just a user then why be a moderator ?????

Neo4 and X2...

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