NI 9505 Closed Loop Position Control Example

Hello, I have a cRIO 9073 with a NI 9505 module that I'd like to use for simple position control of a unit along a lead screw.
I don't have the softmotion module, and am trying to write a program bassed off of the "Position Control (closed loop) - NI 9505" example to control the position the small motor attached to the lead screw (Faulhaber 2342S024CR with a 512 count/rev encoder that we had laying around)
I've reviewed the manual PID tuning example, and have not had much luck getting the response that I'd like when making large position moves simply by adjusting Kp,Ki,Kd gains of the position loop, as the overshoot remains too high for this application when making large moves.  The system is also oscillating about the set point, and doesn't ever seem to dampen out unless I change things other parameters on the fly such as the current limit, or current loop parameters (osciallations get worse as current limit is increased).
Can someone advise me if the components of this example are up to this task?  Or on the interactions between the current limit, current loop parameters, and position loop parameters from this example, and which parameters would have the most impact on achieving desirable system performance?
Is there a VI available that can autotune such a motor?

Hello - there are many reasons why a closed loop controller can oscillate - from correct settings of controller (kp,ki,kd) to making sure signals act in the appropriate direction to deadband/friction in the actuator to badly sized signals/actuators.
Firstly, have a look at the signal your controller is outputing (ideally in LabVIEW so you can graph it). Does it oscillate - perhaps as a sawtooth, a sinewave or simply switching between maximum and minmum values. I presume the electrical motor driving the screw which is driven from some AO signal from the cRIO (could also be a PWM signal driving the motor).
I expect (from what you say about current limit) the control signal will be oscillating by switching between maximum and minimum (e.g. +10V to -10V) or oscillating like a sinewave. What values of kp, ki, kd are you using ? If kd is non-zero, set it to zero (you only need worry about this if you want to get maximum performance). Is ki non-zero ? Try setting it to zero - any better ? If you are still getting big oscillations in your control signal, keep reducing kp (e.g. half each time?) until oscillations disappear (as you reduce kp, control signal *should* get smaller - maybe not straight way though).
If this does not make oscillations go away, then it may be that you have a sign wrong in your loop - i.e. a positive control signal makes lead screw move in opposite direction controller expects. This should be a fundamental thing sorted out when setting up the loop - you could do an open test to check which way +ve voltage moves lead screw. If you find it moves in opposite direction - you can either re-wire, or put a "-1" gain on controller output.
If there is any more subtle oscillations / obersvations, then try to show some plots of the lead screw motion and control signal, as that always helps when trying to diagnose what is going wrong.
Good luck.
Consultant Control Engineer
www-isc-ltd.com

Similar Messages

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  • Closed loop control of step motors possible with 7344?

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    You are right. NI motion control boards don't apply a control algorithm
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  • Can the USB NI DAQs be used for process control,eg.closed loop? or is too fast

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  • Difference between open loop and closed loop mode when finding the index on a stepper motor axis.

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    Hello Mark,
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    Luke H

  • Closed loop configuration question

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    Thanks for the reply
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    analog control or digital control(in the form of digital pulse train),
    (i am inserting from first message)
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    motor is stopped, position is not held in place.  However, while
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    So I am really back to my origional question;  Which configuration
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    Wayne Hilburn

  • Closed Loop or Open Loop

    Dear All,
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    Really looking forward to the replys of you kind souls out there! Thanks!
    Regards,
    Oompa

    Oompa,
    to learn more about the general concepts of motion control, please visit this link.
    In general I widely agree with JB's suggestions. I'll just add some more comments to your questions.
    If you need closed loop control depends on what you try to accomplish. If you just want to generate a certain torque (current mode) that is proportional to the output voltage of your control device, you may not need to run a closed loop system. A similar statement is true for the voltage mode.
    Closed loop control is especially important if you need to control the position, or if you need to run a special trajectory profile (position/velocity/torque over time)
    Maybe it's possible to control the current/voltage mode of your drive with a digital signal. You will have to find out in the manual or check with the vendor.
    Using two drives with a single motor doesn't seem to be recommendable. If you want to do something like that, you will need to switch the power signals with relays between the two drives, but as you are working with inductive loads this might become quite tricky and there is a risk to burn both, the motor and the drives...
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    Jochen Klier
    National Instruments

  • Why are my steppers misbehaving in closed loop mode, but work fine in open loop

    I have a 7344 controlling a 4 axis prototype machine, which is configured with 50,000 steps/rev and linear encoders providing 50800 counts per inch. The physical properties of the machine are less than perfect (prototype!), so there is a considerable amount of backlash in the hardware (about 0.008" - 0.010").
    The observed behaviour is as follows: when repeatedly blending in the X,Y plane using vector space 1 in closed loop mode, an axis will be driven (uncommanded) to the zero encoder reading (home position) occasionally (about 1 move in 600). I have kept a log of the commanded positions being passed to the controller (via the flex_load_vs_position function) and a move to zero is not being com
    manded. The application is single-threaded, so there is no chance of race conditions. The ready state of the board is being confirmed by means of the flex_check_blend_complete function call before any blend is commanded. The programmed relationship between steps and counts/revolution have been independantly confirmed as being correct.
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    This problem can be replicated under versions 5.0.1 and 5.2 of the FlexMotion software.
    I can clearly run without bumping into the problem by running open loop, but unfortunately that is not acceptable in this situation. Any ideas, anyone?

    Hi, and thanks for coming back so promptly. I think I need to give you some more information - sorry if it turns into a long post!
    The system behaviour when it 'misbehaves' is that it starts the anomolous behaviour well clear of any home or limit switch (>6"). When it 'goes wrong', it then slews one or both axes to the zero position. Having arrived at the zero position, it then carries on with the next blend without killing the motor.
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    I have carried out some further tests that may be of help:
    If I place a large (1 sec) inter-blend delay in the calling functions, the anomalous behaviour is not noticed. However, the start/stop nature of each move means that this test is knocking the bejezus out of a rather fragile prototype machine, so I can't do this too often!
    The encoder positions are being read back on each move cycle and monitored, and they are not showing any anomolous behaviour, so I don't think they are the culprit. I have placed a 'scope on the quadrature encoder inputs and the edges are good and sharp with no real indications of noise.
    I could test with a blend factor other than -1 if you think that might be illuminating?"

  • Position Control of compumotor linear servo table and GV-U6E with PCI-7344

    I'm referring PCI-7344 (not 7334).
    I have the GV-U6E which is a drive only and does not possess control functionality. the drive only version does not store or use programs. So, serial commands can not be sent through COM port by LabVIEW even though A few basic commands can be emulated.
    I am trying to do position control as I mentioned. For example, the motor should move A point to B point exactly with a certain speed. The points must be aboulte position.
    I would like you to see the reference comment that I have been contacting with in your website forum.
    http://exchange.ni.com/servlet/ProcessRequest?RHIVEID=101&RPAGEID=135&HOID=506500000008000000DD490000&USEARCHCONTEXT_CATEGORY_0=_14_&USEARCHCONTEXT_CATEGORY_S=0&UCATEGORY_0=_14_&UCATEGORY_S=0
    Regard,
    Jin Ho Lee
    ----- Original Message -----
    From:
    To:
    Sent: Thursday, September 26, 2002 5:00 PM
    Subject: Re: (Reference#1549-QYW196) "Position Control of linear servo table and GV-U6E with PCI-7344
    >
    > Note: Your reference number is included in the Subject field of this
    > message. It is very important that you do not remove or modify this
    > reference number, or your message may be returned to you.
    >
    >
    > JinHo. Compumotor is a very popular brand, and I know of several customers
    > who integrate our 7334 with Computmotor drives. However, when you say that
    > the MAX configuration doesn't fit in the compumotor drive settings, are you
    > referring to the specs from the 7344? It looks like the 7344 and the
    > Compumotor will work well together through a UMI break out box. If you're
    > referring to specific commands that the Compumotor receives, I'd have to
    > know more about the protocol. If the Compumotor needs serial commands,
    > then you can send them through the computer's COM port from LabVIEW.
    > Please let me know exactly what kind of configurations you're trying to
    > set. The 7344 can be completely configured in MAX and LabVIEW.
    >
    >
    > Best Regards
    >
    > Kyle Voosen
    > Applications Engineer
    > National Instruments
    > http://www.ni.com/support
    >
    > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    >
    > Problem Description :
    > "Position Control of compumotor 406LXR linear servo table and GV-U6E(motor
    > drive) with PCI-7344"
    >
    > "Since I had the answers referring:
    > http://exchange.ni.com/servlet/ ProcessRequest?RHIVEID=101&RPAGEID=135&
    > HOID=506500000008000000DD490000& USEARCHCONTEXT_CATEGORY_0=_14_&
    > USEARCHCONTEXT_CATEGORY_S=0& UCATEGORY_0=_14_&UCATEGORY_S=0
    >
    > Wiring step was done well. However, I still have a problem that MAX
    > configuration doesn't fit in compumotor drive settings. Therefore, the
    > setup is shown below, and I want to know how I can set up PCI-7344
    > configuration in MAX or LabVIEW VI.
    >
    >
    > -----------------------------------------------------
    >
    > Uploaded from device address 0
    >
    > Gemini GV Servo Drive Setup
    >
    >
    >
    > Motor Setup
    > DMTR 1703
    > Motor ID (406-x-LXR-M-x-D13-x-x-x-x-E5-x-x-x)
    > DMTIC 2.48
    > Continuous Current (Amps-RMS)
    > DMTICD 0.00
    > Continuous Current Derating (% derating at rated speed)
    > DMTKE 17.6
    > Motor Ke (Volts (0-to-peak)/krpm)
    > DMTRES 10.10
    > Motor Winding Resistance (Ohm)
    > DMTJ 119.300
    > Motor Rotor Inertia (kg*m*m*10e-6)
    > DPOLE 1
    > Number of Motor Pole Pairs
    > DMTW 40.5
    > Motor Rated Speed (rev/sec)
    > DMTIP 7.40
    > Peak Current (Amps-RMS)
    > DMTLMN 3.4
    > Minimum Motor Inductance (mH)
    > DMTLMX 3.4
    > Maximum Motor Inductance (mH)
    > DMTD 0.000000
    > Motor Damping (Nm/rad/sec)
    > DMTRWC 0.23
    > Motor Thermal Resistance (degrees Celsius/Watt)
    > DMTTCM 20.0
    > Motor Thermal Time Constant (minutes)
    > DMTTCW 0.33
    > Motor Winding Time Constant (minutes)
    > DMTAMB 40.00
    > Motor Ambient Temperature (degrees Celsius)
    > DMTMAX 90.00
    > Maximum Motor Winding Temperature (degrees Celsius)
    > DHALL 1
    > Disable Hall Sensor Checking
    > DMTLQS 0
    > Set Q Axis Inductance Saturation
    > DMTLDS 0
    > Set D Axis Inductance Saturation
    > DTHERM 0
    > Disable motor thermal switch input
    >
    >
    >
    > Drive Setup
    > DMODE 2
    > Drive Control Mode
    > DRES 8400
    > Drive Resolution (counts/rev)
    > DPWM 16
    > Drive PWM Frequency (kHz)
    > SFB 1
    > Encoder Feedback
    > ERES 8400
    > Encoder Resolution (counts/rev)
    > ORES 8400
    > Encoder Output Resolution (counts/rev)
    > DMEPIT 42.00
    > Electrical Pitch (mm)
    > SHALL 0
    > Invert Hall Sensors
    > DMTLIM 1.5
    > Torque Limit (Nm)
    > DMTSCL 1.5
    > Torque Scaling (Nm)
    > DMVLIM 119.000000
    > Velocity Limit (rev/sec)
    > DMVSCL 119.000000
    > Velocity Scaling (rev/sec)
    >
    >
    >
    > Load Setup
    > LJRAT 0.0
    > Load-to-Rotor Inertia Ratio
    > LDAMP 0.0000
    > Load Damping (Nm/rad/sec)
    >
    >
    >
    > Fault Setup
    > FLTSTP 1
    > Fault on Startup Indexer Pulses Enable
    > FLTDSB 1
    > Fault on Drive Disable Enable
    > SMPER 8400
    > Maximum Allowable Position Error (counts)
    > SMVER 0.000000
    > Maximum Allowable Velocity Error (rev/sec)
    > DIFOLD 0
    > Current Foldback Enable
    >
    >
    >
    > Digital Input Setup
    > INLVL 11000000
    > Input Active Level
    > INDEB 50
    > Input Debounce Time (milliseconds)
    > INUFD 0
    > Input User Fault Delay Time (milliseconds)
    > LH 0
    > Hardware EOT Limits Enable
    >
    >
    >
    > Digital Output Setup
    > OUTBD 0
    > Output Brake Delay Time (milliseconds)
    > OUTLVL 0100000
    > Output Active Level
    >
    >
    >
    > Analog Monitor Setup
    > DMONAV 0
    > Analog Monitor A Variable
    > DMONAS 100
    > Analog Monitor A Scaling (% of full scale output)
    > DMONBV 0
    > Analog Monitor B Variable
    > DMONBS 100
    > Analog Monitor B Scaling (% of full scale ouput)
    >
    >
    >
    > Servo Tuning
    > DIBW 1500
    > Current Loop Bandwidth (Hz)
    > DVBW 100
    > Velocity Loop Bandwidth (Hz)
    > DPBW 40.00
    > Position Loop Bandwidth (Hz)
    > SGPSIG 1.000
    > Velocity/Position Bandwidth Ratio
    > SGIRAT 1.000
    > Current Damping Ratio
    > SGVRAT 1.000
    > Velocity Damping Ratio
    > SGPRAT 1.000
    > Position Damping Ratio
    > DNOTAF 0
    > Notch Filter A Frequency (Hz)
    > DNOTAQ 1.0
    > Notch Filter A Quality Factor
    > DNOTAD 0.0000
    > Notch Filter A Depth
    > DNOTBF 0
    > Notch Filter B Frequency (Hz)
    > DNOTBQ 1.0
    > Notch Filter B Quality Factor
    > DNOTBD 0.0000
    > Notch Filter B Depth
    > DNOTLG 0
    > Notch Lag Filter Break Frequency (Hz)
    > DNOTLD 0
    > Notch Lead Filter Break Frequency (Hz)
    > SGINTE 1
    > Integrator Option
    > SGVF 0
    > Velocity Feedforward Gain (%)
    > SGAF 0
    > Acceleration Feedforward Gain (%)
    > -----------------------------------------------------
    >
    >
    > Regards,
    > JinHo"
    > NI Software :
    > LabVIEW version 6.0
    > NI Hardware :
    > Motion Control device PCI-7344
    > Driver Version :
    > no
    > OS :
    > Windows 2000
    > CPU :
    > Pentium
    > RAM :
    > 128
    > Vendor :
    > DELL
    > Customer Information :
    > Jin Ho Lee
    > North Carolina State Univ.
    > US
    > [email protected]
    > Ph: (
    > 919
    > )
    > 512-9929
    >
    >

    Yes, we used an NI PXI-7344 motion control card with an NI UMI-7764 box connected to a Gemini GV-U12E servo drive. (which is a drive only.)
    We did positional control in absolute position mode.
    I can send you an AutoCAD schematic detailing how to connect the UMI-7764 to the Gemini GV servo drive.
    In regard to the Rs232 interface to the GV servo drive,
    the GV drive only model is "configurable" not "programmable". You can create unique GV configuration files with Compumotor's Motion planner then download the configuration via Rs232 using LabVIEW as desired. Or, using LabVIEW via Rs232 you can change individual GV drive parameters on demand,
    or use the GV's two analog outputs back to LabVIEW's analog inputs to measure commanded motor current or torque, etc.etc.etc

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