Optimising Dual Band on Airport Extreme

Hi,
I have just bought an airport extreme and can't understand what advantage there is to differentiate the dual band frequencies i.e. having two separate 2.4 GHz and 5GHz networks.
Given that 5GHz generally has better speed and 2.4GHz generally has better range I want my devices to preferentially communicate on the 5GHz channels but automatically switch to the 2.4GHz channel when it is advantageous, or (if possible) exploit data transfer from both channels simultaneously?!!
What would happen if I set up both channels to have the same SSID and password?
Can I add preference to my network settings on my iPad (if I have both channels running independently)?
Thanks,
Matthew

What would happen if I set up both channels to have the same SSID and password?
This is the default setup, and recommended for most users.
In this case, wireless devices will automatically connect to the best quality signal based on their capabilities and distance in relation to the AirPort Extreme.
Can I add preference to my network settings on my iPad (if I have both channels running independently)?
The iPad connects at such a slow speed.....generally about 60-65 Mbps.....that it does not really matter whether it connects to the 2.4 GHz or 5 GHz band.
If you set both bands up using the same SSID, the iPad......like other devices.....will automatically choose the best quality signal.
Isn't that really what you want?

Similar Messages

Airport Express supports dual-band. Airport Extreme supports simultaneous dual-band. What's the difference?

What is the difference between the two. And which one would be better for extending my wifi signal for my ipod touch
http://www.apple.com/wifi/

Hi Joel,
Simultaneous dual band = can process signals on both bands concurrently.
dual band = can process a signal on one band at a given time, either or.

Extending network via airport extreme N non dual band and airport expresses

I have experimented with this a lot because I have 3 expresses and an extreme, one express is wired to my extreme in bridged G mode so my iphone can access my network of macs and the rest are running in N 2.4ghz joined to the extreme network as apposed to extending the network. It seemed to me that the 5ghz is much faster but has very poor range about half the range of the N so I run the network in 2.4ghz. Oddly the express I have bridged running in G mode seems to have more range than the N network. Whenever I tried to extend the network with an express in N 2.4ghz my performance went down and I could not really notice any difference in range. Perhaps this has changed with firmware updates of late so I am going to play with them some more. A side note is that when the express is in join mode to my extremes N 2.4 ghz network I can stream full HD video 1080i and 5.1 sound to my other macs. So when my MBP is hooked up to my AV
setup I can stream Eyetv recordings around the house. But when I extend the network the playback is choppy. It seems when you extend the data rate takes a dive. The odd thing to me is that it seems that the N network does not have any more range that the G express if not even a little less range. My extreme and bridged express are in the same place in my house and if I go outside on my deck there is no N and there is a little G and again if I extend the N network with an express it seems to make almost no difference in range and the transfer speeds seems to drop.
Any thoughts on how to improved N speed / range in extend mode would be appreciated.

The ethernet port is active with this settting, (assuming you enable it in AirPort Utility) which can be a plus in some installations, but I see no improvement in the "breadth" of the wireless network using the "Join" setting, at least when comparing it to the "extend" setting. Is this correct?
The AXn's feature to join a wireless network & have its Ethernet port enabled, as you already know, is known as ProxySTA.
Although a convenient feature indeed, it's not stellar as far as maximum bandwidth goes. As an example, the following would be typical "real life" throughput values (for the AXn's 2.4 GHz radio) based on the AXn's configuration:
o Router: Wired-to-wireless: 85 Mbps
o WDS: Wireless-to-wireless: 33-39 Mbps (Note: Extended would be closer to the Router value)
o ProxySTA: Wireless-to-wired: 26-35 Mbps
Unfortunately, ProxySTA is the "worst" of the bunch.
I have to believe that a lot of the confusion between "join" and "extend" is occurring because the "extend" option is not available in the auto setup using AirPort Utility. Aren't there a lot of users out there configured to "Join" when they think they are "extending"?
No doubt the "Manual Setup" function of the AirPort Utility still needs a bit of improvement as it does tend to confuse folks. Similar, would be the differences between "Extend" & a "WDS" as both are types of WDS.

Best way to hook up Airport Express with a current Airport Extreme network

I currently have an Airport Extreme (7.2 firmware, N version, but right now running mixed mode because all my clients are G, and using WPA/WPA2), and I am thinking about getting an Express to use it to share a printer and the Airtunes feature.
My Extreme is on the top floor of a 3 floor house, and has good coverage over all the house. So I don't necessarily need the Express to extend the range on the bottom, but if it helps get a stronger signal, then why not. My stereo and printer will be on the bottom floor as well.
There seems to be several ways to add the Express to the existing network, but I don't which one is the most appropriate or what will work the best.
1) Do I use a WDS network?
2) Do I extend the network?
3) Or setup up the Express as just a wireless client for Airtunes/printer sharing?
4) Can I put a USB hub on the Express and share a printer and a hard disk? (I would do this on my extreme base station, but its in a location that I can't attach it to a printer or hard disk)
Thanks for any help.

would this approach work if the extreme were in "n" mode and all you wanted to do was set up the express for air tunes? would "b" or "g" machines be able to "see" the air tunes "station?
Since the AX is an 802.11g device you would need to run the AEBS in an 802.11g compatible mode for the AX to wirelessly connect. Therefore your 802.11b/g clients could join the AEBS's wireless network. The AX service would be available to any device connected to the network.
if one had a dual band network (an extreme in "n" and an older snow base station for "b" and "g" connectivity), how would this affect the use of an express for air tunes?
In a dual-band network one of the base stations is acting as a bridge. Therefore every device connected is on the same subnet and able to use the services of the AX. This is regardless to which base station they are connected or if they are connected wirelessly or via Ethernet.

HT4145 Does the new Airport Extreme allow "guest network" setup across all my Airports on my network? I have 1 Airport as a router and 6 others as WAP's (bridged)

Does the new Airport Extreme allow "guest network" setup across all my Airports on my network? I have 1 Airport as a router and 6 others as WAP's (bridged)

I assume that all of your WAPs are hard wired on the network.
If.....all of your WAPs are simultaneous dual band Apple AirPort devices like an AirPort Extreme or new AirPort Express.....and.....you have firmware version 7.6.3 (now 7.6.4) installed on all the AirPorts.....and.....you use AirPort Utility 6.3.1 to configure the devices......in theory.....it should work.
I don't have 6 WAPs, but I do have 3 and the network works perfectly allowing extension of both the "main" and "guest" network.

Why does the new Dual-Band AirPort Extreme Base Station act as a proxy?

The previous thread
http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=1531675
has been archived and nothing came of it, but after testing, I'm certain that their findings are true.
The Dual-Band AirPort Extreme Base Station (AEBS) with firmware 7.4.1 acts as a proxy for TCP ports 21, 554, and 7070 when NAT is turned on. This can be verified by using Nmap on any external server known to NOT have the ports open and having Nmap return that the ports are open. You can telnet to these ports to verify that they're "open," even though they are not on the server.
This functionality appears to be undocumented and as far as I can tell, the only way to turn it off is to put the AEBS into bridge mode and having some other device do NAT further upstream.
As a computer professional, this functionality extremely undesirable, particularly since it is not documented and doesn't have an "off switch." I wasted a bunch of time with one of my network engineers because of this, thinking that some network router was spoofing our server. I also wasted a bunch of my time trying to detect whatever "stealthy rootkit" had opened a FTP server and some other botnet related ports on our server, when in reality, it was simply my AEBS tricking me.
Disabling NAT-PMP ("Enable NAT port mapping protocol") does not affect this.
Is it too much to ask to have a checkbox in the "Advanced" section of the AirPort Utility to turn this feature off?

Welcome to the discussions forum Michael Bennett2.
Thanks for investigating this odd behavior.
If you want your work to be noticed by those who can effect change, you'll have to tell Apple via their feedback link. It won't do any good to post it here.
http://www.apple.com/feedback/

Configuring WDS w/ Airport Extreme Dual-Band 802.11n & Express 802.11g

I currently have an Airport Extreme Dual-Band 802.11n Model: A1301 (located downstairs) and an older Airport Express 802.11g Model: A1084 (located upstairs) which I had been using to stream iTunes to my upstairs stereo (which worked flawlessly). Recently a friend of mine recommended that I reconfigure my network to a Wireless Distribution System setup which would allow me to create a remote wireless node which improves my wireless signal strength upstairs, allows an interface to Airplay to play our music from our iPod's/Pad's and also provides an hard-wired Ethernet connection for my newly delivered Network Extender for my cell phone. So I followed the URL: support.apple.com/kb/HT4262 to assist in this conversion and found that I was unable to configure my network as desired. While this documentation is very good, there is one snafu that I worked out that finally allowed a successful setup. Follow the instructions for:
- Connecting a WDS main base station to the Internet
- Configuring a WDS main base station
- Configuring a WDS remote base station (See last line of instructions for the correct WDS Main ID)
Ensure all Wi-Fi base stations are powered on and allow them time to appear in the AirPort Menu Extra.
From the AirPort Menu Extra, select an 802.11g Wi-Fi base station to configure as a WDS remote.
In AirPort Utility, select the WDS remote Wi-Fi base station in the Base Station Chooser, and click Manual Setup.
Select the AirPort icon from the Toolbar, and click on the Wireless tab.
From Wireless Mode select Participate in a WDS network.
Click on the WDS tab.
From WDS Mode, select WDS remote.
Enable Allow wireless clients (see the first note below).
If not already supplied, enter the 2.4Ghz AirPort ID of the WDS main, then click Update.
There are two Apple ID's for the dual-band Extreme (2.4 & 5.0Ghz). Be sure to use the 2.4Ghz ID which is listed under the "Summary Tab" of the utility. What is confusing is that in the AirPort Utility, when you position the mouse cursor over the graphic of the Extreme on the left-hand side of the GUI, you are presented with a yellow dialog box which displays the 5Ghz ID and this can be misleading especially when you are trying to connect to an older 2.4Ghz Express ...

My Express is the A1264 802.11n model. My Extreme is the A1354 model.
The most crucial issue is the the Tivo, because the Premiere only works with Ethernet (I dont' have and wont' buy the upgraded wireless doohickey), but of course I would prefer that the Express also act to extend the signal, and I particularly want it do so using WEP access (or nothing, see below), since I have a second Tivo which ONLY works wirelessly and which ONLY works using WEP, not WPA.
Since there were so many different issues and needs going on, I was excited about the Dual Band because it meant I could potentially get 5G speeds for my iPad and perhaps the Tivo Premiere connection, while allowing a completely separate band for the OLD Tivo.
The other option I've been trying out (to accommodate the Tivo2 that can't handle WEP) is having no security, but making the networks hidden.
A third option I tried to make work was to create a "guest network" for just the Tivo2.
But what I'm finding out (it's what I always struggle with...networking is a nightmare.) is that if you take one from Column A, Column B disappears, so to speak.
The way it used to work on the non-dual band Extreme was as I mapped above, and the Tivo2 and my iPad used the wireless signal with no problem while the Express was Ethernet connected to the TivoPremiere, but it did so using WDS, which doesn't even seem to exist as a possibility, forget teh fact that it undermines the speed boost (so I read)
I've frankly never been able to understand the differences between the various modes and structures, and believe it or not I'm very smart and very comfortable with computers and Macs, having worked on them for 25 years.
And one of the biggest reasons I've had such a hard time is because of the many times that I have updated after making changes, Airport Utility tells me it worked, but nothing happens and then after too much frustration I end up unplugging and shutting down every single piece of equipment and rebooting everything and then it DOES work. Sometimes. But I can't be doing that every time I make one tweak, I'll go insane!
And the number of pin-resets I've done on the Express, the Dual band, and even the cable modem would make your head spin!
So there's my story. Kinda. Does it make any sense? At least in terms of my goals?
Your help is more appreciated than you can imagine.

Unable to set up dual band with my 1st Gen Airport Extreme

Not sure if my 1st Gen Airport extreme supports this but I unable to figure out how to setup dual band networking. I have certain devices that work on 2.4 Ghz and some that work on 5ghz. I trying to improve my network speed by separating the devices that can use 5ghz. Any advise please?

1st Gen AirPort Extreme will do either 5 GHz or 2.4 GHz....but not both simultaneously.
Simultaneous dual band was introduced in the 3rd Gen AirPort Extreme.
Simplest solution.....the current AirPort Express will do simultaneous dual band. You could then reconfigure the AirPort Extreme to extend the 2.4 GHz network for increased coverage.
Be careful with 5 GHz as this is pretty much a "same room" or "line-of-sight" deal since 5 GHz signals are much weaker than 2.4 GHz signals....they won't penetrate through walls or other obstructions nearly as well as 2.4 GHz signals.

Airport Extreme Simultaneous Dual-Band port forwarding broken if only TCP ports with firmware 7.6.1

When configuring my Airport Extreme Simultaneous Dual-Band router, port forwarding is broken if you only specify TCP ports to forward. This is with firmware 7.6.1. What happens is that after you hit the Update button, when the router comes back and you open the port forwarding entry, the IP is still there but the port numbers are missing.
I tried all different port numbers and ranges and nothing would stick if i only specified TCP ports. If i added UDP ports with the TCP ports then it would save them. And if you add a new entry with only UDP it saves them too.
Now this is with adding a new port forwarding. I already have existing ports being forwarded that only have TCP. They are still working. I believe i added them with a previous version of the firmware.
Any one else see this issue? Any ideas?
Maybe i should perform a hard reset and reload a saved config.
Peace,
Dan

I haven't seen the issue but you could just downgrade to an earlier firmware:

AirPort Extreme (802.11n) dual band is reporting problems?

Hi.
I can not find an answer for my error-problem:
AirPort Extreme (802.11n) dual band is reporting problems!
I have an optimum on line cable modem connected to my AirPort Extreme (802.11n) dual band.
Ethernet cables connect it 1. into my new Nehalem Mac Pro, 2. into my back-up Quicksilver PowerMac. I also have 2nd gen. iPod touch works on WiFi.
This set-up has been working well but now I daily get the above error. Sometimes it says also: You have different locations set-up and it asks me to go through the set-up procedure. May be I did the initial set-up incorrect. I don't quite understand "locations" and it's purpose.
Also the Airport runs very hot so I put a small fan in front of it. A few times I had to disconnect the cable mains to reset and get back my service. Please help.
W.W.

Walter Wedler wrote:
AirPort Extreme (802.11n) dual band is reporting problems!
I have an optimum on line cable modem connected to my AirPort Extreme (802.11n) dual band.
Ethernet cables connect it 1. into my new Nehalem Mac Pro, 2. into my back-up Quicksilver PowerMac. I also have 2nd gen. iPod touch works on WiFi.
This set-up has been working well but now I daily get the above error. Sometimes it says also: You have different locations set-up and it asks me to go through the set-up procedure. May be I did the initial set-up incorrect. I don't quite understand "locations" and it's purpose.
Can you tell what's telling you about those locations? An Apple AirPort unit can maintain different "configurations" so that it could be used in different locations without a complete reconfiguration. However, I don't believe they're ever referred to as "locations". On the other hand, a Mac can have multiple "locations" defined in the Network panel of System Preferences. Those can be useful if the Mac is used in different places with different arrangements.
If your AirPort Extreme is having problems the status light on the front will probably be amber. If you launch AirPort Utility and double-click on the AirPort Extreme item on the left, you should be able to see more details about the problem.

Airport Extreme Dual-Band Base Station Is excessively slow

Let me start off by stating this is my first apple support discussion and I have no experience in these forums but rather forums elsewhere.
My Airport Extreme Dual-Band Base Station is completely updated as of DEC. 30, 2012 running version 7.6.1 and I have the latest airport utility, so bare in mind some of the previous fixes I've Read seem unavailable to my setup
Our household has 7-13 of the following devices connected in a 24 hour average:
5-6 iPhones all running iOS 6 (1, iphone 3gs; 2-3, iPhone 4; 2, iPhone 5)
1 iPad 2 wifi only running iOS 6
2 MacBook Pro 13" early 2012 models one running mountain lion and the other running lion
1 mac mini early 2011 model running mountain lion server and is connected outside the network as a public server
1 Apple TV latest model(1080p) latest updates
1 LG 47" 1080p 3D TV
3 blueray players
2 Windows 7 PC one a laptop and the other a desktop
1 HP All-In-One Printer
1 AT&T MyCell Antenna
My problem is as follows:
My network is running rather sluggish. the base station is getting at the very minimum good signal strength to all my devices most of them getting great signal, so I doubt it be the result of range. I've tried messing with the channels and radio settings but have yet to find a correct optimal settings. I've tried searching around these forums as well as in other areas and have not found a suitable solution. my apple TV lags and jitters a lot. I have trouble airplay to it because of what I've read elsewhere which is latency issues. I have no clue how to test latency. I have realized that it isn't a matter of noise in the area because noise doesn't pass 15% and signal is optimal in all areas. of where the devices are. I've noticed connecting my server directly gives me 47Mb/s as compared to the Ethernet connection of 32Mb/s so I am clueless as to a solution. I know that with my old router the wifi speeds were outstanding but that router kept disconnecting wifi clients and then reconnecting them. sadly this is happening again with the apple router. last night my iPad would not stay connected and our network had so much lag that I couldn't even load the youtube app let alone a video. also buffering takes an odd amount of time sometimes 3 minutes. for a 30 second video on youtube. I have no guest network active and I have a wpa2/wpa personal encryption set on the network. I could use some serious help. the people of my household have no problem returning the apple router but I think to urge otherwise. if I could get some help in a solution that would be fantastic.
Thanks in Advance,
Blaine Miller

Can you tell us whether your "modem" is a simple device with only one ethernet port or is it a "gateway", which is a combination modem/router with 3-4 ethernet ports?

AirPort Extreme Base Station (New one) Dual band problem

Hey, I just got an AirPort Extreme Base Station, simultaneous dual-band today.
Anyone else having some problems with the 5GHz network? Seems my Transmit rate is very unstable. It changes between 7-54. It's 802.11n (5GHz) profile setting.
My 2.4GHz is staying at 54 (Since I set it for b/g).
As well, my MacBook Pro keeps connecting every time i update the airport base station, to the 2.4GHz one.

Welcome to the discussions, dwig365!
With a good connection, the Transmit Rate at 5 GHz should be in the 200-270 range. One of the perplexing issues with 5 GHz is that the much higher frequencies used in this band are absorbed by walls, ceilings and any obstructions much more quickly that 2.4 GHz signals. In other words, there is much less "power" with 5 GHz signals.
I've found that unless I almost have line-of-sight between the router and my laptop a few rooms away, the 2.4 GHz signal is stronger and more stable...hence faster. Taking it another step further, although it is not as "fast" as "n", "g" level signals penetrate and saturate much more effectively. It's a question of trade offs as in return for speed, you must give up penetration power.
It is not likely that you are encountering interference in the 5 GHz band, but it might help to experiment with some different channel settings. Make sure "use wide channels" is enabled under the options button on the Wireless page in AirPort Utility as well.

V. Slow transfer speeds with new dual band Airport Extreme

I have a new Airport Extreme (late 2009, dual band, full 'N' spec) which I am using to replace an older Airport Extreme (early 2008, 5Ghz, 'draft' N).
I have a USB disk attached and was interested in benchmarking the transfer speed of the new Extreme, compared to the previous version. The results are puzzling / alarming.
Shown below are transfer speeds (file copied to the attached USB drive) under different connection standards (2.4Ghz / 5Ghz & a/b/g/n)
'Old' Airport Extreme
5Ghz - 'draft' N : ~5-7 Mb/sec
'New' Airport Extreme
2.4Ghz - b/g : ~3-5 Mb/sec
5.0Ghz - a : ~3-7 Mb/sec
5.0Ghz - N : ~200 Kb/sec
Hence transfer speeds appear to collapse when I try to make use of the 'N' spec with the latest Extreme. I have tried altering items such as - wide channels (on / off), interference robustness (on / off), 5Ghz channel (manual, instead of auto), with no upside.
I seem to be at the point of concluding that either
1. I have a 'broken' Airport Extreme
2. The WiFi card on my early 2008 iMac (which implements I guess the 'draft' N standard) is 'incompatible' with new the Airport Extreme under a 'N' connection.
Any thoughts ?

Since all devices in my wireless network are capable of latest 802.11n protocol, I really do not need older and slower 802.11a/b/g protocols. To achieve above 200 Mbit/sec, 5GHz band with wide channel option turned on is really necessary. Thus I really wish I can turn off the 2.4GHz radio band (seems Apple has set this band as default) of my new dual band Airport Extreme to avoid unwanted bandwidth degradation. Unfortunately this is not possible with radio mode setting in Airport Utility.
The best I can do to force connection with 5GHz radio band (with quite consistent result) is as follows:
On Airport Extreme through [Airport Utility>Wireless] :
Radio Mode: 802.11n only (5Ghz) - 802.11b/g/n
More Options>Wireless Network Option>Transmit Power: 100%
More Options>Wireless Network Option>Use Wide Channels: checked
More Options>Wireless Network Option>5 GHz Network Name:
checked and same network name with extra suffix "(5 GHz)"
On 27" iMac through [System Preferences>Network>AirPort>Advanced>AirPort]:
Preferred Networks:
Create only one profile in Preferred Networks for the above network name with suffix "(5GHz)"
Uncheck the option [Remember networks this computer has joined] to ensure there is only one profile under Preferred Networks .
Once all above settings are done, restart Airport Extreme in Airport Utility. Your computer should connect wirelessly to the base station through 5GHz band after booting most of the time. Even when it is not occasionally, simply go to the Airport icon in main menu bar and click on the network name with suffix "(5GHz)" in dropped-down list to connect manually. With all these settings, I have achieved 300 Mbit/sec bandwidth on my iMac most of the time for fast Time Machine backup.
How I wish feature for better radio mode control by end user will be implemented in next update of Airport Utility. Apple should trust end user's brain better than artificial intelligence (or ignorance ?) in wireless network implementation. Wireless traffic between the two radio bands and among various wireless devices should be segregated specifically in Airport Utility by end users whenever dual band Airport base stations are in use.

Wireless HP Printer on Dual Band Airport Extreme Base Station

I'm looking to upgrade my router to the dual band AEBS. I'll end up with some n machines and some g machines, including a wireless HP printer. Will my n-enabled machines be able to print to the g wireless printer on the g network?
Thanks,
JD

+Will my n-enabled machines be able to print to the g wireless printer on the g network?+
Yes. All devices will receive an IP address from the AirPort Extreme, so they will all be on the same network and will be able to communicate with each other. This is true even if you have a wired only computer connected to the AirPort Extreme. It will be able to print to the printer.
But, if you enable the Guest network features, computers on this network will not be able to "see" other computers or connect to any devices on the main network.

No more WDS networking in the new dual band airport extreme?

we had a network of 3 airport extremes in our small 2 story design studio, we bought a new dual band to see if it would help with our DSL problem [it did], but there is no more WDS networking option available. this unit replaced our MAIN WDS unit. so now we are left with 'extending the network' option. it seems to be working, but what is the reason behind no more WDS?

WDS gives you more control over your network. You can set-up certain base stations as relays and others as remotes. Using the "Extend a network" option just tells the base stations to try and find other base stations. It is much easier for a novice to set-up, and I think this is probably why Apple has highlighted this feature as opposed to WDS (where you have to specify MAC addresses for all base stations and remotes).
WDS is nice if you have a mixed network with older b/g base stations since they don't have the option to "Extend a network" or "Allow this network to be extended".

Optimising Dual Band on Airport Extreme

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