Outdoor Wireless Mesh Design Question

Hi,
We have a wireless mesh network which currently is having some connectivity issues.
One of the main issues we are seeing is with RRM configured the Mesh Access points seem to all select Channel 11 on the 2.4ghz frequency.
I would ike to modify manually, although wondering if best practice is to use RRM or select manually.
Thanks
Brad

Hello Bradley,
We'll, if you have WCS then a mismatch would happen with the cnofig template on WCS (if you have one).
There could possibly be an AP template on the WCS to set the radio for the APs automatically.
This is from Configure -> AP Configuration Templates -> Lightwieght AP.
From this location you can configure a template with the AP settings and push it to the APs you want. You can also schedule the time at which the template will be applied. A recurrence also can be configured.
So make sure that:
- No mismatch between WCS and WLCS (you can go to Configure -> Controllers and try to audit differences between WLC and WCS).
- Save your configuraiton on WLC if you apply it from WLC.
- Make sure that there are no AP templates on WCS with recurrence configured.
To avoide any mismatch in the future, I suggest you do all your configuration from WCS. This way you'll save time (if you have more than one WLC) and you'll also make sure configuration is consistent among all controllers.
HTH
Amjad

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Outdoor wireless mesh deployment for major events

I am interested to hear if anyone here has any experience in setting up a large scale wireless mesh deployment that covers an area that are a few blocks.
1. How do you deal with 2.4ghz interference as 2.4ghz and 5ghz band are unregulated. I'm not able to use 5ghz as the end devices are smartphones that do not support 5ghz.
2. How do you deal with the backhaul capacity as each hop for Cisco Wireless Mesh would result in a 50% drop in network throughput.
3. How do you deal with installation of the wireless mesh APs in public areas. Do you install this on a mast and leverage on the lamp post to provide power? Or do you talk to building owners to install the APs on the top of buildings? What are the challenges you face in installing wireless mesh APs in a public area.

Hi David,
Here is some info that might help.
Mesh 7.0 design guide
http://www.cisco.com/en/US/docs/wireless/technology/mesh/7.0/design/guide/MeshAP_70.html
Enterprise Mobility
http://www.cisco.com/en/US/docs/solutions/Enterprise/Mobility/emob41dg/ch8_MESH.html
1500 Design Guide
http://www.cisco.com/en/US/docs/wireless/technology/mesh/design/guide/MeshAP.pdf
1550
http://www.cisco.com/en/US/docs/wireless/access_point/1550/quick/guide/ap1550qsg.html#wp57699
1500 install guide
http://www.cisco.com/en/US/docs/wireless/access_point/1500/installation/guide/1500_ch2.html
"Satisfaction does not come from knowing the solution, it comes from knowing why." - Rosalind Franklin

Outdoor Wireless Mesh 1524 AP Power Question

Hello Group,
I curious, if I have a 1524PS AP that I would like to power from a power pole and the power pole does not have a street light or street light power control on it today but it does have 480V/277V power source, can I still use the power source directly by wiring the 40ft power cable in directly. I would think not, but I am getting a lot of questions about this lately so I am looking here for some help.
From the cisco documentation it says we can use 480V power sources. However, its a bit ambiguous in some places stated that it can be done if you use a street light power tap - is this just a power cord or does it include some sort of transformer as well?
My understanding is that most 480V systems in scenerios like this are 2-phase. However according to the cisco documentation for the 1524 AP you can power the AP via 90-480V power source. I am little nervous to try that here. I know 277V can be dangerous. Will the Cisco AP support cutting the existing power cord (40ft) and wiring it directly into a 277V/480v power source off the light pole? I have been getting conflicting reports from the documentation and others. Any help here would be greatly appreciated.
Is the AP power supply capable (via a transformer of some sort) of converting direct 277/480V power to something usable via the AP? The 40 ft power cable supplied with the AP looks like its made for 110/240 only so cutting and rewiring it hot into the 277V source could be dangerous correct?
If someone could give me a definately answer here it would be greatly appreciated. We can't proceed until we figure this out.
Thanks in advance

Hello Bradley,
We'll, if you have WCS then a mismatch would happen with the cnofig template on WCS (if you have one).
There could possibly be an AP template on the WCS to set the radio for the APs automatically.
This is from Configure -> AP Configuration Templates -> Lightwieght AP.
From this location you can configure a template with the AP settings and push it to the APs you want. You can also schedule the time at which the template will be applied. A recurrence also can be configured.
So make sure that:
- No mismatch between WCS and WLCS (you can go to Configure -> Controllers and try to audit differences between WLC and WCS).
- Save your configuraiton on WLC if you apply it from WLC.
- Make sure that there are no AP templates on WCS with recurrence configured.
To avoide any mismatch in the future, I suggest you do all your configuration from WCS. This way you'll save time (if you have more than one WLC) and you'll also make sure configuration is consistent among all controllers.
HTH
Amjad

Mesh design question

Dear Sirs.
My customer plans to extend existing wireless coverage and upgrade to controller based network.
Let me shortly describe the situation based on the attached network map.
RAP points are installed on the buildings, they have wired uplink.
MAP points are installed outdoors (in the IP66 sealed ABB boxes) on the poles (height 5 m), only power is present on the poles, no wired uplink.
Now MAPs (Non root bridges) are connected to RAPs (Root bridges) via 5 GHz interface in bridge mode.
Red points: already installed Autonomous APs, 1242AG model.
Green points: APs planned for installation.
1. In order to upgrage to controller base network I want to install two 2504-25 controllers in failover mode. I have AP-to-LWAPP-Upgrade-Tool and is familiar with the image upgrade procedure. However, I have a question: if I upgrade all existing RAPs and MAPs to LWAPP mode, how the MAPs without wired uplinks will connect to RAPs and then to controller? Should I have physical access to their console port to issue some CLI commands to connect to RAPs?
2. Can 2504 controller be configured for operation in mesh network mode without additional licenses?
3. For network expansion I plan to install 3502E access points in sealed boxes. I chose them due to separate 2.4 and 5 GHz antenna ports, in order to use omni antennas for 2.4 client coverage and 5 GHz directional antennas for wireless uplinks. The distance between APs is abou 100 - 250 meters. Is it recomended to use directional antennas for wireless uplinks or I can take 1602E (or 2602E) access points and dual band omni antennas and install a good working mesh network with 5 GHz uplinks on omni antennas?
4. Can 2504 controller work together with 1242AG, 1602E and 3502E points?
5. How should MAPs be preconfigured to begin working in mesh network after powering them up on the poles on site?
Kind reagrds
Alexei

1. In order to upgrage to controller base network I want to install two 2504-25 controllers in failover mode. I have AP-to-LWAPP-Upgrade-Tool and is familiar with the image upgrade procedure. However, I have a question: if I upgrade all existing RAPs and MAPs to LWAPP mode, how the MAPs without wired uplinks will connect to RAPs and then to controller? Should I have physical access to their console port to issue some CLI commands to connect to RAPs?
> The MESH AP's along with your other access points (lightweight) will obtain their code from the WLC when they join. I would always stage the MESH AP's prior to mounting them to certify they work and they can form a link. You would need to purchase a power injectors for each RAP and get a AC power adapter for each MAP.
The Upgrade tool is to only convert autonomous AP's to lightweight. They stopped supporting 802.11n access points in that tool.
2. Can 2504 controller be configured for operation in mesh network mode without additional licenses?
> With the newer code version you will be using, yes. You can have both MESH and traditional Local mode or FlexConnect mode access points.
3. For network expansion I plan to install 3502E access points in sealed boxes. I chose them due to separate 2.4 and 5 GHz antenna ports, in order to use omni antennas for 2.4 client coverage and 5 GHz directional antennas for wireless uplinks. The distance between APs is abou 100 - 250 meters. Is it recomended to use directional antennas for wireless uplinks or I can take 1602E (or 2602E) access points and dual band omni antennas and install a good working mesh network with 5 GHz uplinks on omni antennas?
> If these are going to be exposed to the outdoor elements, then you need an outdoor antenna. It's hard to say what antenna you need, but if your using a 3502e, make sure you get an antenna that is a 3 lead so you can utilize all 3 antenna ports. Patches are directional, so if you are going MAP to MAP to MAP to RAP for example, you would need an omni. Patch works if your going Fromm MAP to RAP.
4. Can 2504 controller work together with 1242AG, 1602E and 3502E points?
> Yes they can. The code you run in the WLC, you need to make sure it's supported by the access points. Here is a compatibility matrix
http://www.cisco.com/en/US/docs/wireless/controller/5500/tech_notes/Wireless_Software_Compatibility_Matrix.html
5. How should MAPs be preconfigured to begin working in mesh network after powering them up on the poles on site?
> Stage them first. Please reference these guides.
http://www.cisco.com/en/US/docs/wireless/technology/mesh/7.4/design/guide/mesh74_chapter_010.html
http://www.cisco.com/en/US/tech/tk722/tk809/technologies_white_paper09186a0080b1c101.shtml
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Mesh Design Question -- Guest Access

In reviewing all the documents concerning Mesh with the controllers and Guest access. I'm assuming the following, through a redirect on the WLAN controller we can have a guest client create an account and also have their credit card charged. We are getting ready to building an 80 radio 1522 mesh network using the 4400 WLC. Do we need the WCS program or is that over kill? And is my assumption on the guest portion correct?
Thanks

Although I have never tested this credit card stuff with the WLAN, however note that WCS is an optional software for extra managability (with some really good feauters). It is not required to run the WLAN setup.
A tip for ur design of 80 radio network: while using 1522 mesh APs, you dont need a controller with a capacity of 80 APs. Actually you need lesser capacity. In design phase, while calculating WLC capacity, count RAPs as 1 and MAPs as 1/2. for example if you have 10 out of 80 APs as RAPs in ur design and remaining 70 as MAPs you actually need a controller with a capacity of (10x1)+(70x1/2)=45. so 4402 with 50 AP capacity will do the job.
Please feel free to contact me if you wish any further discussion.
Waqas Akhtar
0092-333-4848579

Wireless Mesh/Backhaul question.

We have a customer who wants a wireless bridge/mesh link between two buildings. They want as much throughput as possible, better than 802.11b/g 54Mb for preference. We've identified Cisoc 1552E or I APs as suitable devices but we can't tell from the literature what sort of bandwidth we can expect over the backhaul link, will it use 802.11n speeds or are we stuck with b/g data rates? Any advice would be much appreciated.

22mb is the supported data rate I think. Why not look at the Cisco ExtendAir radio. It is 5ghz non-wifi bridge with up to 160mb of throughput and 5 9's of uptime.
http://www.cisco.com/web/partners/pr46/solutions_plus/exalt.html

Outdoor Wireless 1500 series in mesh

Hi,
we have installed a wireless outdoor setup in point to point. i need to get a few doubts cleared on outdoor wireless tech.
1) does cleanair in 802.11a work and if so will it detect any interference between the two outdoor ap's ( i read that 802.11a doesnot support cleanair, and this is not client access. i need to only detect any inteference between the RAP and MAP)
2) What is the usual downtime on 802.11a while dynamic channel selection happens. i have seen disconnection in some cases upto 20 mints on 801.11a band.
3) what is the recommended datarate between RAP and MAP (i have read to keep 25mbps now it is in auto, is this ideal)
appreciate your help,
regards,Arjun

Hi Emmett,
Sadly there are no 1300 Series with "A" or "N" Radios.
For "A" try the 1400 Series
For "N" try the 1250 Series
Cisco Unified Wireless Network Quick Ordering Guide
http://www.cisco.com/en/US/prod/collateral/wireless/ps5679/ps6548/prod_brochure0900aecd80565e00_ps6087_Products_Brochure.html
Hope this helps!
Rob

Wireless mesh site survey

Hello all,
I need to perform several wireless mesh site surveys. The challenge I have is that I generally use a 2600 autonomous ap for indoor site surveys. However I have not found an easy way to do an outdoor mesh site survey. Any suggestions or best practices from the group?
Sent from Cisco Technical Support iPad App

You use a 1552 with the survey image installed.
HTH,
Steve
Please remember to rate useful posts, and mark questions as answered

Outdoor Enterprise Mesh 802.11n deployment

Hi
Is Cisco WCS mandatory when deploying an outdoor enterprise mesh solution?If I am goin to use the 1552E purely as an outdoor access point ,do I really need the Cisco WCS?
Sumesh

NO Not mandatory... WCS is a management software where in we can manage the wireless network.. if WCS is down network will not be down.. Lemme know if this answered ur question!!
Please dont forget to rate the usefull posts!!
Regards
Surendra

Setup outdoor wireless

I work at a garden. We have many activities in the summer. I setup outdoor wireless using Cisco 1310 wireless bridges, one is root bridge and other is non-root bridge. I find if the non-root bridge behind a tree, the signal reduce from excellent to low. I am using Omni directional antenna. If I have Yagi antenna, will that help? Can I add another AP/repeater/bridge behind the non-root bridge? If yes, how to configure them? Or any other suggestion.
The configuration can be found here:
Sample of Cisco 1310 Wireless Root Bridge
http://www.howtonetworking.com/cisco/rootbridge.htm
Sample of Cisco 1310 Non-Root Bridge Configuration
http://www.howtonetworking.com/cisco/nonrootbridge.htm

This is what we like to do.
Building Switch +++ cat 5 +++ Root Bridge ? 100 feet ?-- 1st Non-root bridge ?-- 200 feet 2nd non root bridge. Between the root bridge and non-root bridge is limited 100 feet because there are some trees and it is not clear path.
So far first two bridges (root bridge and 1st non-root bridge) works fine. We would like to cover more area and we may have another wireless client that can?t reach the 1st non-root bridge, so we need to add 2nd non-root bridge. Do you think if this design is possible? If yes, how to configure it.

Centralized WLC Design Question

Dears,
In my scenario, i am designing CEntralized WLC deployment. I have 30 AP in Buidling X(200 Users) and 20 AP in Buidling Y(150 Users). I am planning to install HA WLC CLuster where Pimary & Secondary WLC will reside in physically different Data Centers A & B.
I have a wireless Design Question and i am not able to get clear answers. Please refer to the attached drawing and answer the following queries:
If Buidling X users want to talk to building Y Users, then how Control & Data Traffic flow will happen between Buidling X & Y. Would all the traffic will go to Primary WLC from Bldg X APs first and then it will be Re Routed back to Buidling Y APs? Can i achieve direct switching between Bldg X&Y APs without going toward WLC?
If Building X & Y Users want to access the internet, how would be traffic flow? Would the traffic from X&Y AP will go tunnel all the traffic towards WLC and then it will be routed to internet gateway?is it possible for Bldg X&Y AP to directly send traffic towards Internet Gateway without going to controllers?
I have planned to put WLC at physically different locations in different DC A & B. Is it recommended to have such a design? What would be the Failver traffic volume if Primary WLC goes down and secondary controller takes over?
My Reason to go for Centralized deployment is that i want to achieve Centralized Authentication with Local Switching. Please give your recommendations and feedback
Regards,
Rameez

If Buidling X users want to talk to building Y Users, then how Control & Data Traffic flow will happen between Buidling X & Y. Would all the traffic will go to Primary WLC from Bldg X APs first and then it will be Re Routed back to Buidling Y APs? Can i achieve direct switching between Bldg X&Y APs without going toward WLC?
Traffic flows to the WLC that is the primary for the AP's, then its routed over your network.
If Building X & Y Users want to access the Internet, how would be traffic flow? Would the traffic from X&Y AP will go tunnel all the traffic towards WLC and then it will be routed to Internet gateway?is it possible for Bldg X&Y AP to directly send traffic towards Internet Gateway without going to controllers?
The WLC isn't a router, so you would have to put the Internet traffic an a subnet and route.
I have planned to put WLC at physically different locations in different DC A & B. Is it recommended to have such a design? What would be the Failover traffic volume if Primary WLC goes down and secondary controller takes over?
Like I mentioned... earlier, the two HA WLC has to be on the same layer 2 subnet in order for you to use HA. The guide mentions an Ethernet cable to connect both the HA ports on the WLC.
Thanks,
Scott
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2504 WLC with 1552E AP's not able to wireless mesh

Good day all,
I'm seeking some assistance/help for a problem I'm havine with a WLC and 9 APs. I have a basic configuration on the WLC and I have configured one of the APs as the RAP. Now I try and add a second AP into a wireless mesh but it cannot see the RAP. They are sitting 5 feet apart but I don't see anything on the controller for the second AP. If I attach it to the wired network it can see the AP. RF-2 is solid green, RF-1 is dark, Uplink is dark, Status is orange. I understand that this means it's seeking for the RAP/MESH.
I've tried some debug commands but to tell you the truth I am by no means a wireless expert.
When the second AP boots this is what I see through the console
*Mar 1 00:00:52.515: %CAPWAP-5-CHANGED: CAPWAP changed state to DISCOVERY
*Mar 1 00:00:52.775: %SSH-5-ENABLED: SSH 2.0 has been enabled
*Mar 1 00:00:52.803: Logging LWAPP message to 255.255.255.255.
*Mar 1 00:00:52.827: %LINK-3-UPDOWN: Interface Dot11Radio1, changed state to up
*Mar 1 00:00:52.827: %LINK-3-UPDOWN: Interface Dot11Radio0, changed state to up
*Mar 1 00:00:52.843: %LINK-5-CHANGED: Interface Dot11Radio1, changed state to reset
*Mar 1 00:00:52.843: %LINK-5-CHANGED: Interface Dot11Radio0, changed state to reset
*Mar 1 00:00:53.071: %SYS-6-LOGGINGHOST_STARTSTOP: Logging to host 255.255.255.255 started - CLI initiated
*Mar 1 00:01:46.827: %MESH-6-ADJACENCY_STATE_MACHINE_STARTED: Mesh adjacency state machine started
*Mar 1 00:01:53.491: %CDP_PD-2-POWER_LOW: All radios disabled - NON_CISCO-NO_CDP_RECEIVED (0000.0000.0000)
Any assistance would be great.

You still have two radios on the RAP just like the MAP. As long as you are powering up the RAP/MAP with the correct power source, the radios should come up. This means that you should have client access enabled by default on the 2.4ghz and 5ghz client access is optional. Juat make sure that the AP/RAP/MAP is in the correct AP Group and that the WLAN is present in the AP Groups. This will allow that WLAN to be broadcasted to the AP's in that AP Group. If your using the default group, then by default, all WLAN's 1-16 will be broadcasted, WLAN 16 and higher will not be unless you define the WLAN in the AP Group.
Thanks,
Scott
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Outdoor Wireless #

Hi,
I have Two Offices at a distance of 3KM with line of site.
Can you advice outdoor wireless device model.
Both Sites are on different network
Office 1 : 192.168.1.0/24
Office 2 : 192.168.2.0/24

Try using directional antennas.
Cisco Aironet Antennas and Accessories Reference Guide
http://www.cisco.com/en/US/prod/collateral/wireless/ps7183/ps469/product_data_sheet09186a008008883b.html
Cisco Aironet 2.4 GHz and 5 GHz Antennas and Accessories
http://www.cisco.com/en/US/prod/collateral/wireless/ps7183/ps469/product_data_sheet09186a008022b11b.html
Hope this answers your question.

*wireless mesh networking*

can a wireless mesh networking application be built using the sun java wireless toolkit??if yes ...then plz tell me how to do it..

The distance at 54 Mbps for 2.4 GHz side of the mesh (client access) is basically the same distance as it would be with most 2.4 GHz Access Points.
That said the "indoor range" being 90-100 Ft and outdoors being further because there are no obstructions. Now the Cisco Aironet 1500 does have an amplifier and a higher gain 2.4 GHz antenna enabling it to transmit further but how far that goes at 54 Mbps depends on the client being used (and the Access Point's ability to hear same).
remember just because the Access Point is improved (the client is typically operating at lower power and in some cases with an internal antenna so distance it really a matter of the client used and the environment it is used in. So there is no real exact answer as it varies but I'd expect to get at least 140 Ft or more outdoors at 54 Mbps. Again, you'd really have to test it with your specific client in your environment more more accurate numbers.

Wireless Internet Access (Cisco IP NGN or Cisco Wireless Mesh Networkin)??

Dear Cisco Wireless Team
Please educate us on where to start, or the CISCO product we might need to purchase
We are trying to branch out a new Internet wireless access and wireless phone service business in our company, and presently looking for the right Cisco product solution to purchase to enable us offer this service in LAGOS, NIGERIA.
The service will be rendered in Africa, the country NIGERIA, and the city LAGOS.
We would like to mount or install the product in Lagos, Nigeria.
As we are new to this kind of service. We would appreciate if the Cisco wireless team can work with us in pointing or directing on the right product to purchase and what are required. We understand the Cisco Wireless Mesh Networking Solution, Cisco IP Generation Network, Cisco 12416 or 7600 Series Router might be the right products to purchase, but we are not sure on what needed or what are required to meet our service need.
Possibly we would like to offer Wireless Internet Access to unlimited subscribers, and also Wireless or Mobile Phone service to unlimited subscribers in Nigeria.
Anticipating your reply

I suppose Cisco Wireless Mesh Networking would be a good choice.The Cisco mesh architecture makes it easy to scale coverage as capacity needs dictate, including increasing access point density; adding wired connections, controllers, and radios; and using dual high-powered, high-sensitive radios and a selection of high-gain antennas.Refer the document for IP NGN in the following URL http://www.cisco.com/en/US/netsol/ns537/networking_solutions_solution_category.html

Outdoor Wireless Mesh Design Question

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