P2 workflow with merged clips

Hi,
I'm working on a documentary with approximately 50 hours of material, DVCPro HD 1080p25. There are several shooting-periods and we're already working on it.
I logged and transfered the media to separate shooting-day bins and divided it by Firestore and Card number, eg 200801_16FS1.
Audio is recorded on HD and there is an external TC generator on the camera (HVX-200) making a audio signal with TC, linked to the audio recorder (Cantar).
With Timetools 1.0 (updated it to 1.1 but it didn't work, Leopard maybe?) I overwrite the video TC and I manually merge the clips by TC.
Sorry for the long introduction.
Now the problem....
Because of 2 Firestore and 3 P2 folder each day I made a day-sequence of all the material as an overview (separate days). Also the audio runs longer so I had to combine clips on the day-sequence.
Now if I work with the day-sequence I have to scroll the sequence, find the material, match frame it, adjust the I and O point an patch the audio (because I don't want to use the first 4 tracks of camera audio). Before I can insert or overwrite in my working-sequence.
Or..
Scroll the sequence, find the material, set I-O, cut I-O, copy, and paste it in the working-sequence.
If I want to go back to the day-sequence from the working-sequence I have to match frame (I see the merge clip), reveal in browser, read out the bin name, go to the day-sequence.
This all seems a little bit too complex, and I've the feeling it can go a lot quicker.
So I'm open for all suggestions.
Thanks a million,
Tim

1) what if i'm working in 720p, does a 720 capture change things?
WHy would it? If you are working in 720p, then capturing 720p only makes sense. I don't understand what you mean.
2) what do you use your mxo2 for?
Capture of tape formats...output of tape formats...broadcast monitoring...direct capture from a camera if in a studio type situation.
3) the thing that frustrates me about p2 capture is that the duet card is unreliable
Duel... but true. And under Snow Leopard, incompatible. This is why I kept my Powerbook G4.
firewire to hd is slowwww,
Faster than real time, actually. No matter if you shot 1080 or 720...injesting is faster than real time. Yes, you have to back up the files, THEN import. But that is the way with ANY tapeless format.
and p2mobile/gear is so ** expensiv
I hear ya. Look for a used Powerbook on eBay, or look for a PC laptop with PCMCIA connection. FAR cheaper.
I was hoping by going SDI out would give me another option. i
For capture...sure. But still back up those cards! Those are your master tapes.
OH, wait, you said FREEMAN. Sorry
Shane

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Help with merged clip decision for a short film

Greetings and thanks in advance for any perspective you can offer.
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I've realized I can use Plural Eyes to merge my clips and audio fully outside of Premiere CC. Those clips, once imported, retain marker comments and suffer no other "unique" limitations.
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Sounds like you have a very weak signal. I'd set away from PrPro and handle this in SB, or Audition. Listen carefully with a good pair of noise-canceling headphones first, and then test on monitors.
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Hello Premerie Pro CC community,
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Hello Premiere Folk,
I've recently, as of last night, updated to Premiere Pro CC 7.2. I'm currently cutting a feature using merged 5K red raw clips. We were expereicning some weird things but were able to work around them. The update fixed to major problems we were having;
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This bug is NOT FULLY FIXED. I'm on a tight deadline so i'm not looking very hard online to see if i'm alone - so please forgive me for just posting here...
I'm using CC7.2.1 it's 1/21... very grateful that match frame FINALLY works on merged clips, but, again, this insert/overwrite bug is only PARTIALLY FIXED.
Insert/overwrite with merged clips on 3-point edit now works, but ONLY when cutting in BOTH merged video+audio... if you're just trying to cut in the audio from a merged clip using a 3-point/4-point edit via hotkey, it's a no-go.
I, for example, needed to re-cut in audio under some video with effects on it. So, I unpatched the video source completely and patched source audio tracks 1-4 to the appropriate sequence tracks. Upon hitting insert or overwrite multiple times, nothing responds. The only way to cut anything in from the source (merged clip) was to patch the source video back into the timeline on an unused video track, then cut ALL the tracks from the source in, I then had to delete the video track re-link the now free audio to the original video. Not a big deal, but annoying enough & waste of precious time on tight deadline.
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Trimming tool problems with merged clips

I'm trying to edit a filmstyle sequence with merged clips (created video and audio synched, then merged into new clips). This works fine, except when I try to trim edits in the sequence - the trim tool works, but the picture in the left and right trim windows jump to different parts of the clips being trimmed, and do not show the correct frames being trimmed. The trim tool works fine when used with unmerged clips, but somehow can't seem to work with the synched up clips
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Has anyone else experienced this problem? Is this a bug, or is there a way around this? Thanks for any pointers...

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Hi. I'll edit a fifteen minutes short film soon and I'd like to work with Première CC.
The film will be shooted with the new Sony F55 so I'll have to manage RAW files and xavHD files. I made some tests and Premiere read them perfectly.
But ... My problem is this:
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Marc

That's not the only thing missing with merged clips. Copied from my previous discussion:
No Match Frame
No Replace Edits (picture matches, but audio gets out of sync)
And for that matter, NO out-of-sync indicators at all. None.
No making SUBCLIPS in the project panel (via source panel ins and outs). A subclip gets created, but it's not the part you selected.
No retention of MARKER comments. Once you select a new clip, the comments go POOF! Gone.
I just cut a 10 minute dialogue short with merged clips, and I can't think of a single time I knocked audio out of sync. But I was prudent in my technique.
If you need the functionality, 1) file a bug report and 2) use the PluralEyes method.

Sync problem with Merge Clips options in PP CC

Hello
First post in the Adobe Communities! I'm glad to be a port of it
I'm editing a short film and I've started using the Merge Clips option to do the syncing of image and sound, together with the "In Points" option as the Synchronize Point. When I sync material I like it to be exact and perfect, therefor I use the Audio Time Units option to do so, to insert my in-points, but when I Merge Clips the result isn't as exact as I told it to be, the audio clips are slightly out of sync, very slightly but annoyingly, and it seems to ignore my workflow, or adjust it self or something. I was wondering if the Merge Clips option supports when you use Audio Time Units option to set the in-points for syncing, or if there is any other option or work-around to get the syncing perfect. OR, is it suppose to be like this when syncing? I hope not. I'm not sure but I think I hear an echo effect in the merged clip as well, very minimal though.
The screenshots are zoomed in on with the "Show Audio Time Limits" option on.
I want it to be like this...
...But it end up like this when I Merge Clips
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Best Regards,
Daniel

Thanks, I suppose I can start batch-converting my mjpg movies before importing them inte PE7, if that would make this problem disappear. I'll try that (I have FormatFactory installed, but VirtualDub seems like a nice tool if that is better), although that would make the process a bit more long-winded...
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I attach the GSPOT info on that file.
(I never had this problem on my older XP system that run PE2...).
I will try converting to see if the problem disappears.
Thanks!
// G

Trim mode with merged clips

I'm cutting a feature film on FCP 5.0.4 editing 23.98 NTSC DVCAM. The audio was recorded on a hard disk recorder with independent timecode and the clips were merged using slates.
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However, the actual edit made is correct, it's just impossible to see what frame I'm on without playing it back or getting out of trim mode. If I trim the audio and video tracks together then everything works as it should.
Has anyone seen this problem before? Know how to fix it? I couldn't find anything in the archives.

I created a new user account and trashed my preferences and I have the same problems. I created a new project, and new sequences. Same problems.
It only happens with 23.98 (batch reverse telecined using Cinema Tools) NTSC DV clips that have been merged with separate 24-bit 48 khz Quicktime audio clips (converted from BWF using BWF2XML). Clips that were captured from the tape with audio and video simultaneously don't have this problem. The discrepancies between the actual amounts trimmed and the white numbers in the trim windows are consistent. If it's off by 6:10 on a clip, every time I try to trim that clip it will be off by the same amount. But the number varies from clip to clip. It's generally 5-8 seconds.
If I try to trim only the audio, I don't have any trouble. If I trim the audio and video at the same time I don't have any trouble. It's only when I trim the video on its own. If I use the original video clip before it's merged with an audio track then it trims fine. If I cut the merged clip into a sequence then delete the audio track from the sequence the problem remains.

Syncing Audio with Merge Clips option and OMF export question/issue

Hi,
In the past when I've edited video, when it came to syncing audio I always did it manually. This time, using Premiere Pro CC, I used the merge clips option, to speed up the syncing audio process, which was a huge time saver with excellent results.
The question/issue I have..is that when I get my OMF exported for my sound editor, will this screw anything up, since on the project file, it doesn't use the original audio file, but the one that was merged. And in the project list, I don't even need to have the original audio file listed, since it's already been merged into a clip, which I used in the project. I know it's the same file used, but will it mess anything up since a merged clip audio was used instead of just dragging the original track onto the timeline?
- Ken

A good way to know for sure (and therefore feel comfortable that you're doing the right thing) is to do a test OMF export, then open this in Audition. This ill show you exactly what you're exporting.

Match-Frame with merged clip doesn't work

I have a merged clip forged from one video clip (with four channels of audio) and two audio clips, so the resulting merged clip has six channels of audio.
Merged via in-point, everything's in synch, fine.
Edit the merged clip into timeline.
Match frame.
Problem:
It matches to a clip with the same name as my merged clip... but it's not my merged clip because it's only got the four audio channels from my video source clip.
I've tried different clips, tried linked or unlinked, same result.
To boot, if in the timeline I select only audio channel #5 (which was from one of the audio source clips) and match-frame, it matches to the same pseduo-master clip, but, is several frames or seconds off.
Ideas anyone?
thanks!

Interesting... if I make a merged clip and name it "Apple" then place it in the timeline, the timeline clip is also named Apple. If I then in the browser change the clip's name to "Brother" and put it again in the timeline, it puts in a clip called "Apple"; and the first clip in the timeline is also still called Apple. But if I delete the Apple clips from timeline, and now put in Brother clip, it puts in a clip called Brother..... as if it's not updating the name-change. So that's weird.
But, none of the name-changing affects the match-fame problem; it still fails.

Missing Audio with Merged Clips

I'm experienced a very confusion and frustating kink in clip merging process. I suspect other people have encountered it before, but I can't find where. I'll post tech details at the end.
I merged clips by marking an in point on the audio and an in point on the video. I placed both clips in to my timeline. I deleted the stereo track that came with the video. I linked the 4 mono channels to the video, and dragged them over to a bin, where it asked me to name the merged clip, and I named it according to the scene.
I had no problems working with them
Upon returning to my work, however, some of the audio seems to be missing. That is, the top of the four mono tracks is there, but the other three, while there in the timeline, play no sound - they don't have any waveforms anymore (it is not any kind of mute track issue, the waveforms themselves are gone).
I have since tried merging clips directly in the media browser, using in points, and this seems to resolve the problem. While I am happy to see a solution for the future, I am on a very tight deadline and don't have the time to re-merge all of my hundreds of clips.
This is an awful bug that Adobe has got to fix.
Thanks!
Shot on canon 5D
From Properties:
"Type: MPEG Movie
File Size: 1.3 GB
Image Size: 1920 x 1080
Frame Rate: 23.976
Source Audio Format: 48000 Hz - compressed - Stereo
Project Audio Format: 48000 Hz - 32 bit floating point - Stereo"
Audio on dual system (unsure of which model):
From Properties:
"Type: Windows WAVE audio file
Source Audio Format: 48000 Hz - 24 bit - Mono
Project Audio Format: 48000 Hz - 32 bit floating point - Mono"
Premiere Pro 5.5, most recent update.
Windows 7 Home Premium 64 bit, most recent update.
ASUS G53JW
Intel Core i7 Q740 @ 1.73Ghz
8Gb Ram
NVIDIA GeForce GTX 460M

I created a new user account and trashed my preferences and I have the same problems. I created a new project, and new sequences. Same problems.
It only happens with 23.98 (batch reverse telecined using Cinema Tools) NTSC DV clips that have been merged with separate 24-bit 48 khz Quicktime audio clips (converted from BWF using BWF2XML). Clips that were captured from the tape with audio and video simultaneously don't have this problem. The discrepancies between the actual amounts trimmed and the white numbers in the trim windows are consistent. If it's off by 6:10 on a clip, every time I try to trim that clip it will be off by the same amount. But the number varies from clip to clip. It's generally 5-8 seconds.
If I try to trim only the audio, I don't have any trouble. If I trim the audio and video at the same time I don't have any trouble. It's only when I trim the video on its own. If I use the original video clip before it's merged with an audio track then it trims fine. If I cut the merged clip into a sequence then delete the audio track from the sequence the problem remains.

Additional audio channels being imported with XML from FCP. Merged Clips. Out of Sync

Problem
When I import an XML Interchange Format V5 file from FCP7 and then import into Premiere Pro CC, my merged clips now have 4 audio channels. 2 from the original file and 2 from the merged audio.
Versions
FCP 7
Premiere Pro CC 7.2
Workflow
* Create merged clips in FCP
     * ProRes Video clip with camera audio
     * Stereo audio clip
     * Sync in Timeline
     * Delete unneeded audio tracks, reducing track on video clip to 1 mono track, centered
     * Drag to browser
* Export XML Interchange V5
* Open Premiere
* Import XML Interchange File
* Clips are imported, HOWEVER
     * Clips now have 4 tracks of audio
     * Tracks 1-2 are audio from the original Video clip
     * Tracks 3-4 are audio from the synced second source audio file
     * Additionally, tracks 1-2 are now OUT OF SYNC
I cannot find a way around this. Clips now all have out of sync indicators on them. Merged audio is insync, and original audio is out of sync.
I do not want to have to resync all of my audio, everything is tagged and organized into bins.
Anybody know why this happens and a workaround?

Ha ha, an excellently wry comparison.
I'm using photo-jpeg because it was reccomended to me as a way to achieve greater image quality when exporting within the confines of youtube.

Problem with Clip Usage and merged clips in CS6

The 'Clip Usage' drop-down menus don't seem to work in Premiere CS6 for merged clips. The info bar at the top of the project window correctly lists the number of times the viedo and audio from the clip has been used, and the downward-pointing arrow appears, but when you click on it... nothing happens. Same's true of the 'Video Usage' column in the main body of the project window. Non-merged clips work just fine.
Anyone know if this is just a problem with my project, or if it's a bug in Premiere? Had a lot of trouble with merged clips in CS5.5, and was hoping they'd be solved by CS6 - I've been using Creative Suite for a long time, and the lack of good merged clips support was always one of the challenges in persuading other indie editors to switch over from FCP...
Thanks!

...and the lack of good merged clips support was always one of the challenges in persuading other indie editors to switch over from FCP...
I guess they just have to weigh that up against the lack of support they got from Apple for FCP in its entirety.

Serious error using merged clips

Premiere crashes when I try to use a merged clip. When I double click on the clip it loads into the preview panel, but when I perform any actions such as overwrite or insert or if I right-click on the clip I get this message: "Sorry, a serious error has occurred that requires Adobe Premiere Pro to shut down..."
Here are the details:
All the clips I am using in the project are merged clips.
The video clips are AVCHD with reference audio, and the audio clips are .wav 48 MHz.
Running a Mac Pro OS X 10.9.3 and the latest update of Premiere Pro CC 2014
I have tried the following:
turned off GPU accelerated preview in favour of software only
deleted the merged clip and re-created it (in case it was somehow corrupt)
opened the project with a different system user (to rule out user settings)
started a project from scratch, merging the same clips and then performing similar tasks
emptied the After Effects cache
spent 90 minutes with tech support controlling my computer trying various things I'm not certain about
Wasting too much time. Tempted to revert to FCP until this is resolved. Please help.

I don't know about cc 2014, but in the past 5 months working in cc 7.2.1 & 7.2.2 I've found merged clips to be incredibly unstable/buggy. In one case a handful of merged clips were preventing me from importing sequences from other projects. I've run into issues where the match-frame function doesn't work with them, and worst of all every time I've used them they've significantly slowed down premiere (creating a very annoying lag between every interaction with the program).
My workaround has been to avoid merged clips at all costs, and instead use single-angle multicams to group video & audio from different sources. It ain't ideal, but it's been a far more stable workflow.
Don't know about the 2014 version - I'm afraid to give merged clips another serious try after all the headaches they've caused in the past. If anybody has seen improved stability with merged clips in the recent update I'd be very interested to hear.

Merged Clips Audio Issue

Trying this again, having a major problem since update working with merged clips. I merge all my video and audio clips in a pre-workflow project in premiere pro. Just got my footage back from the shoot, labeled and sync'd in the project.
Because Premiere doesn't allow you to have more than 1 project open at a time, I copied the files, closed the pre-workflow project and opened my feature film project I've been working from. Copied the merged clips bin, I click on a clip, video plays fine but there's no audio playback.
I try importing the files from the pre-workflow project using the import project feature, keep only the actual merged clips (as the rest of my project is this way) still no audio. I have cleaned my media cache, reset preferences, even uninstalled premiere and redownloaded. Problem persists.
Can you help me figure out what the issue is so I can get back to making progress on finishing this feature film project?
The only thing different I've done this time that I didn't do last time was copied the audio into the bin with the video clips and merged that way. Before was putting video clips into my master audio bin and merging. But I don't see how this could possibly be the problem.

Going to try, but here is my workflow and have not encountered any problems until this last P/U days footage. I've been doing things this way because I found having all files in the project was causing it to crash constantly when I was working. I have a new I7' processor IMac with 24 gigs of RAM. And since Premiere does not allow you to have multiple projects open at the same time (Wish this would change. Avid and FCP both allowed multiple projects) I have to do things this way.
Pre-workflow Project File
Label all Video and Audio files to match Scene #'/Takes
Set in points on all video and audio to reflect slate
Merge Clips
Working Project File
Import only Merged Clips into Project. Either via import or copy/paste
Now I've done this workflow from just about the very beginning. Deleting all of the original source video and all audio clips from my working project so only my bins containing my merged clips remain. Have had no problems and edit has been smooth. Did a pickup day last week, followed same steps as I've done in the past, imported the merged clips into my working project and the clips have the audio set to none by default. Now once I go into the sequence I can manually set it and it's there but I cannot play audio in the source monitor which is how I edit, there's no reason I should have to go back to the crappy FCP way of editing doing the copy and paste from a sequence.

P2 workflow with merged clips

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