Pops when transferring thru daisy-chained MOTUs -- Logic?

I have two BLA-modded 828mkIIs, daisy-chained together via Firewire, feeding into Logic via firewire as an "aggregate device."
When playing back transfered tracks that were recorded into Logic, there'll be random, infrequent pops/clicks or soft thuds (like the sound of engaging a plug-in) across a few of the tracks. It's not some kind of peak; it'll happen in near silence, too, although when it happens on a track that had a hotter input, the noise is louder. I've swapped out Firewire cables, and it doesn't happen when I use the MOTUs individually.
It's gotta be something in the firewire connections or the computer/Logic... It's not coming off the tape. Any ideas?
Thanks, Ryan

It could be your audio settings. Basically, larger I/O buffer size might help.
You are doing the multitrack recording from tape to Logic, right? It may be your Mac is struggling to process it all at once using the current I/O buffer settings. Try increasing this parameter value and see what happens.

Similar Messages

Strange pops when pressing play and stop. Logic 9.1.3, Mac internal Sound

Hi,
So I opened Logic for the first time in a while.
Logic Pro Version 9.1.3 (1697.87) 32bit.
Mac 2 x 2.8GHz Quad-Core Intel Xeon
Mac OS 10.6.5
6GB RAM
I am using the internal Mac sound card, set up as follows :
Core Audio
Built In Line Output
IO Buffer Size 512
I am running ONE Mono audio track, with one Space Designer plug-In (mono>Stereo) inserted on the first insert slot.
There is nothing else playing back on this particular logic song.
Every time I press the spacebar for play or stop, I get a tiny delay, a pop, and then is starts, or it stops playing.
This is using the Macs' own internal sound card. With Logic's own Space Deigner, on ONE mono audio track.
SO, any ideas as to why this happens?
The only reason I opened Logic, was because I wanted to show a producer friend of mine some personal Space Designer presets I had made a couple of years ago, in case that was the type of ambience he is interested in using for a mix.
My plan was to use Logic as an effects suite, using a Motu 828mk3 conected via ADAT Lightpipe to my Pro Tools HD converter, to send and recieve 4 stereo sends and returns with 4 instances of Space Designer.
But, if Logic hiccups with the internal sound card... what will happen when I use the Motu? I dread to think about it, but will test it tomorrow.
At least I have two weeks to get this working or re-do my convolution reverbs in another plug-in (Waves IR1) that I can use in Pro Tools, in case Logic just does not work out.

The multi-purpose internal audio chips used in Mac's & PC's has some built in latency and seemes to default to a basic 16-bit 48kHz format. Any change from this and the chip has to change on the fly, I knew sample rate did this, makes sense bit depth might as well.
Some internal chips have a built in noise gate which can also cause a "thump". (rare)
Cheap or out-of-spec audio chips with a high DC offset will cause a pop when pressing "Play" and "Stop", as will an audio file that has a high DC offset.
pancenter-

Motu firewire daisy chain with logic?

Actually 2 questions:
1. I have a motu 896 HD and a 828. I try to connect these with the firewire ports with no success. aggregate devices? Does not work for me...suggestions?
2. My 896 has main out 1-2 and analog 1-8. In logic the main out occupies 1-2 and analog 1-2 goes to 3-4 and som on... I have a mixing console and it would be much less confusing if the outs from the motu is the same in logic...suggestions?

I have used the same 2 devices as well as an 896HD with an Ultralite, as an aggregate device with no problems. Do this:
Plug the 896HD into your mac with firewire. Plug into the 828 from the 896.
Go to the MOTU device setup, and set the Clock of the 896 to Internal, and the 828 to sync to the 896.
Go to Audio Midi Setup, make new aggregate device, select both units, 896 first then 828 second.
Open logic and select the Aggregate device in the Core Audio Driver preference.
Then you SHOULD with any luck have both units working in logic, it should give you LOADS of inputs in the inputs section of the mixer. You can rename the inputs by either. Going to the Mixer>Options>IO Labels, and selecting "User Name" and inputting what you want it to be called. Or go to the MOTU device setup app, and change the input names there, then in Logic Select "Driver Name" instead.
Hope this helps, it is possible so don't panic.

Daisy Chain?

Hello All!
I am just wondering if you can Daisy Chain FW drives.......?
I got some new LaCie Drives (LightScribe 16x FW, and the Bigger Disk). They both have FW.. the HD has FW800 as well, and that will more than likely be the connection between the comp.
Can I attach the DVD-RW to the port on the HD, and the HD to the comp? (all of this saving a port....
or do I need to just get a FW Hub so I can use my iPod as well..
Many Thanks!!!
-G

As already mentioned you can daisy chain up to 64 devices (I think). As also noted don't power them from the FW bus. A single device is ok but I would not daisy chain anything that was not powered externally in the lead and then connect to that outwards. If the lead item is powered it will power additional devices that may not have an external power source. My point is to protect the PB FW port and not overload it. I had a PB Ti667 and went through 4 logic boards because the FW port would burn out (Had Apple Care Thank you very much) when I would daisy chain 2 HD's. Apple has since fixed this problem. During that period I would use a powered FW hub or would use a PCMCIA FW card and power the card. The only draw back was you cannot boot from a external drive unless it is via the FW port.
MJ

Problems with establishing daisy chain, FW800

Hi there!
I am experiencing some weird problems when trying to daisy chain two or more drives with FW800.
It was working fine until yesterday, when suddenly the second drive in the chain wouldn't show up in finder. Also, connecting/disconnecting the cable from the second drive caused the first drive to be disconnected.
So using one drive works fine, but connecting another in a daisy chain does nothing except occasionally disconnect the first drive.
I was running a daisy chain with three drives yesterday with no problems.
I have tried swapping cables, rebooting the drives and the Macbook Pro, and using different combinations of the harddrives - no change.
Seems to me that the source of the trouble is the Macbook Pro. It could possibly be a hardware issue, but I find it weird that a single drive on FW800 works fine...
Anybody got any ideas?
- MacBook Pro (late 2008), Snow Leo (10.6.4), 2x Lacie d2 Quadra

The problem is that this could be tough to troubleshoot if it is a power supply, as the offending drive will attempt to pull the juice it needs to keep running from the FireWire bus.

Thunderbolt to firewire adaptor does not work when daisy chaining firewire devices

Hi,
I just purchased the Thunderbolt to firewire adaptor for my new late 2012 iMac.
It works when connecting a single firewire device, but when I daisy chain another drive, the first drive disconnects and nothing mounts.
I am trying a Hitachi G-Raid and a couple of WD My Studio II hard drives. They all work when connected directly to the adaptor, but not when more than one drive if daisy chained with firewire.
Has anyone got firewire daisy-chaining working with a thunderbolt adaptor? (just to clarify I am not refering to thunderbolt daisy chaining, as the adaptor is an end-of-chain thunderbolt device).
Thanks

Yikes, that's sad to hear.
I can't test it, no TB here, but are all these drives self AC powered, ie. no bus powered drives?

Flickering video when daisy chaining firewire devices - HELP!

I have a 12" Powerbook with a single firewire 400 port, to which I have attached 2 daisy chained external hard drives. I have no problem capuring video off of my camcorder when I daisy chain it onto the end, but when the firewire is sending video the other way, as in the case of "printing" to tape, or using a television during editing, the audio clips and the video flickers substantially.
I've observed that connecting the camera directly to the computer eliminates this problem. Of course, it's a bit awkward, since I also eliminate my scratch disks (the external drives)! I've tried a firewire hub as well, and it seems that either the extra device or the doubled length of cable is interfering with the signal in such a way as to cause the flickering.
Has anyone else experienced this problem?
In any case, I'm thinking about buying a MacBook Pro. Assuming I run into the same problem, I was thinking about adding firewire buses with the Express Card slot. Has anyone done this, or have recommendations for firewire cards that reliably work with MBPs?

When you say 'flickering' what do you mean?
If the playback is stuttering, meaning the data rate is not being sustained, then it is a Firewire glitch. If the video is strobing or rolling then it a video issue with the timeline or the capture settings or something else.
We daisy chained Firewire back in the day on the first edition Powerbook (400Mhz with 10GB internal) and had no issues, that was 4-5 years ago, so your PB12 should be fine with this.

Firewire drives work individually; fail when daisy chained

I have 3 FW400 drives daisy-chained. All was fine until a couple of weeks ago when I started having problems with drives randomly freezing up or unmounting, especially when writing large amounts of data (e.g., during a backup.)
Despite multiple repairs with Disk Utility, running Disk Warrior & reformatting one of the drives, the problem continues.
But--each drive works fine when connected directly to the Mac.
-Does this indicate a problem with the chipset in one of the drives? (I already ran Hardware Test on my G5.)
-Would a Firewire hub solve this problem?

I have seen this problem before. It could be a chipset failure but it may be that each of the chipsets has the same ID. This causes problems with connecting them all at once. It seems to me that recent changes in Mac OS X can cause FW enclosures with the same ID to have problems connecting at the same time.
One way you can verify this is if the enclosures also have USB 2.0 connections you will find they work with one on FireWire and the other two on USB.
If an ID problem is your situation, even a hub will not help. If you have a friend with a hub or you have a WiebeTech Maxelerate you can use its hub to verify if a hub will work or not.
http://www.amug.org/amug-web/html/amug/reviews/articles/wiebetech/max/
You might want to contact the FW enclosure manufacturer and see what they believe the issue is. Quite frankly, if you need to use more than a single enclosure or hard drive at a time I would consider external SATA. It is a lot more reliable for me.
Have fun,
Michael

Mac Mini 2012 (new) - displayport daisy chaining.

Does anybody know whether the TB controller on the 2012 (new) Mac Mini supports DisplayPort v1.2 daisy chaining? I am aware of the limitations of the current Apple TB display, but am wondering if a workaround would be to use display v1.2 panels. My guess is that the TB controller used in the TB display was not compatible with multiple display handling (e.g., Eagle Ridge), but was hoping that the controller used on the macbook/mac mini/imac logic boards does (e.g., Light Ridge). HDMI is too limiting, so I was hoping to daisy chain 2-3 displayport v1.2 displays off of the single TB out from the new mac mini.

thanks the replies. OWC sold me the kit, cable etc based on the Macmini's specs. I talked with support and the drive I installed should work with no issues.
They did have me reset the PRAM which did. They also told me I might need to install Yosemite 'several times before is sticks' - whatever that means. lol.
Anyway I zapped the PRAM. So far no mysterious restarts with the drive being unrecognized.
One thing I didn't mention though...
MacMini is in a backyard home office (about a 100 feet away with buried CAT6 cable connecting it to the network). I was using Screen Share from my MBP reinstall all my work software. Every crash occurred while using screenshare. I never had any crashes when I was actually sitting at the computer.
I don't know if that has anything to do with it - but I haven't used ScreenShare for any length of time to control the Mac mini since the pram zap. Figured I'll use the computer for a week or so and see how stable it is and then try using screenshare again and see if the behavior repeats itself.
Meanwhile I'll keep my fingers crossed.
I'm just suspect that it was a PRAM issue. But I'm a layman.

Daisy chain Voyager hard drives & iMac Intel Core2Duo (white model)

It would appear that Voyager hard drive enclosures from Newertek won't allow you to daisy chain them via SATA. Yet they conveniently provide you with a SATA cable if you have an eSATA port on your Mac. Is there any sort of KVM switch/ hub that makes the SATA hard drives connect directly to each other via SATA instead of via the iMac's Firewire for data transfer.
I'm finding I large gobs of data to transfer between two hard drives, and a dual drive enclosure never likes to remain mounted on my iMac no matter whom I buy, so I'm dealing with these Newertek Voyagers. The other thing that's messed up about these Newerteks is if both are plugged in to the two Firewire ports of my iMac, when I wake up in the morning, I can't eject either one without a force eject. I'm hoping if I can daisy chain them somehow by SATA I'll get faster data transfers, not have to copy back to my iMac everytime I want to copy to the other drive, and have more reliable connectivity with only one Firewire port of my iMac in use.

You can get them - "firewire to sata bridges" is the term.
I don't think it'll make any practical difference - writes will still have to go from one disk, through SATA to the firewire to the Mac, then back out the firewire to the other SATA. There's no controller to handle the direct connection.

Daisy-chain 2x Motu 8pre

Hi All,
I'm trying to daisy-chain 2 Motu 8pre's using ADAT into LE9.
Logic happily recognises one 8pre when used alone. But when I chain the 2 together the only way I can get input is if I use Motu's 'CueMix FX' software.
My proplem with that is....basically, I don't want to use it. It seems if I want to mute an input in logic I have to cross over to CueMix etc.
Anyway. Can I get the two Motu's recognised by Logic as one device, bypass CueMix and do this using ADAT ??
Hoping someone out there is doing this exact thing.
Cheers. - John.

To daisy chain 2 motu interfaces (or other 8 channel interfaces with lightpipe) you must attach a lightpipe (ADAT) cable to the master interface's INPUT from the second interface's lightpipe OUTPUT. Your master interface IS connected to the computer via firewire. Now DISCONNECT the firewire from the second interface!
This puts your second interface into CONVERTER mode and Logic recognizes its' inputs AFTER you re-set your core audio.
A second lightpipe cable INTO your aux interface FROM your master interface will clock it to the same clock used on the master (word clock, AES, etc..)
Please send me cash for this info.
Took me an hour of futsing to figure it out.
16 INS!!!!
___Tim Leitch

Daisy Chain Grouping

Hi:
I am working on a query of all inspections and their re-inspections that have never passed.
I have a database table of Building Inspections with a unique id called InspectionID and it increases. Each inspection is related to a Building Permit with a unique id called PermittingID.
Sometimes the inspections fail and have to be re-inspected. I do not relate each re-inspection to the original inspection. I relate each re-inspection to the inspection being re-inspected. I am using daisy chain logic.
The PermittingID may have multiple types of inspections and each one of those inspections may have re-inspections.
The PermittingID is not unique across each subset.
I actually have 3 different inspection status'. The inspection can be a P, F or an AP. I will be filtering out the AP.
I had help with the query below and the only problem is, it's missing two tickets that should be included. For example: Tickets 3591 and 3843 should show in the results and they do not.
Here is the query. Thank you in advance!
create Table #Test1(PermittingID int,InspectionID int,ReinspectionRequestNum int,InspStatus bit)
insert into #test1
values
(3,3480,NULL,0),(3,3669,3480,0),(3,3942,3669,1),
(3,3422,NULL,0),(3,3603,3422,0),(3,3924,3603,1),
(3,1636,NULL,0),(3,2740,1636,0),(3,4353,2740,1),
(3,2641,NULL,0),(3,3188,2641,0),(3,3298,2641,1),
(3,2641,NULL,0),(3,3188,2641,0),(3,3298,2641,1),
(3,5151,NULL,0),(3,5188,5151,0),(3,5308,5188,0),(3,5608,5308,0),(3,5724,5608,0),(3,5854,5724,0),
(3,3591,NULL,0),(3,3843,3591,0),(3,44335917,3843,0),(3,4777,4437,0),(3,5069,4777,0),(3,5204,5069,0),(3,5242,5204,0),
(9,1,NULL,0),(9,2,1,0),(9,3,2,0),(9,4,3,1),
(10,3,NULL,0),
(11,4,NULL,0),
(17,236,NULL,0),(17,237,NULL,0),(17,238,NULL,0),(17,8,NULL,0),(17,11,NULL,0),(17,16,NULL,0),
(105,9577,NULL,0),(105,9600,9577,0),(105,9986,9600,1),
(105,77,NULL,0),(105,82,77,1),
(105,38,NULL,0),(105,76,38,1)
Select *,ROW_NUMBER() over (partition by PermittingID Order by InspectionID asc) as R1 into #test2 from #test1
Select max(R1) as EliminateR,PermittingID into #test3 from #test2 where InspStatus=1 group by PermittingID
Select min(R1) as EliminateR,PermittingID into #Test4 from #test2
where InspStatus=0 and PermittingID not in (Select PermittingID from #Test3) group by PermittingID
/*select * from #test2
select * from #test3
select * from #test4*/
select A.PermittingID,A.InspectionID,A.ReinspectionRequestNum,A.InspStatus from #test2 A INNER JOIN #test3 B on A.PermittingID=B.PermittingID and A.R1>B.EliminateR
union
select A.PermittingID,A.InspectionID,A.ReinspectionRequestNum,A.InspStatus from #test2 A INNER JOIN #test4 B on A.PermittingID=B.PermittingID and A.R1>=B.EliminateR
drop table #test4
drop table #test3
drop table #test2
drop table #test1

This was already asked and answered:
create Table #Test1(PermittingID int,InspectionID int,ReinspectionRequestNum int,InspStatus bit)
insert into #test1
values
(3,3480,NULL,0),(3,3669,3480,0),(3,3942,3669,1),
(3,3422,NULL,0),(3,3603,3422,0),(3,3924,3603,1),
(3,1636,NULL,0),(3,2740,1636,0),(3,4353,2740,1),
(3,2641,NULL,0),(3,3188,2641,0),(3,3298,2641,1),
(3,5151,NULL,0),(3,5188,5151,0),(3,5308,5188,0),(3,5608,5308,0),(3,5724,5608,0),(3,5854,5724,0),
(3,3591,NULL,0),(3,3843,3591,0),(3,44335917,3843,0),(3,4777,4437,0),(3,5069,4777,0),(3,5204,5069,0),(3,5242,5204,0),
(9,1,NULL,0),(9,2,1,0),(9,3,2,0),(9,4,3,1),
(10,3,NULL,0),
(11,4,NULL,0),
(17,236,NULL,0),(17,237,NULL,0),(17,238,NULL,0),(17,8,NULL,0),(17,11,NULL,0),(17,16,NULL,0),
(105,9577,NULL,0),(105,9600,9577,0),(105,9986,9600,1),
(105,77,NULL,0),(105,82,77,1),
(105,38,NULL,0),(105,76,38,1)
;WITH Hierarchy(PermittingID, InspectionID, ReinspectionRequestNum, LastChild)
AS
SELECT PermittingID, InspectionID, ReinspectionRequestNum, LastChild = CAST(InspectionID AS INT)
FROM #test1 AS FirtGeneration
WHERE InspectionID NOT IN (SELECT COALESCE(ReinspectionRequestNum, 0) FROM #test1)
UNION ALL
SELECT PrevGeneration.PermittingID, PrevGeneration.InspectionID, PrevGeneration.ReinspectionRequestNum,
LastChild = CAST(CASE WHEN Child.LastChild>Child.InspectionID THEN Child.LastChild ELSE Child.InspectionID END AS INT)
FROM #test1 AS PrevGeneration
INNER JOIN Hierarchy AS Child
ON PrevGeneration.PermittingID = Child.PermittingID
AND PrevGeneration.InspectionID = Child.ReinspectionRequestNum
SELECT h.PermittingID, h.InspectionID
,LastInspectionID = LastChild.InspectionID
,LastInspStatus = LastChild.InspStatus
FROM Hierarchy h
-- Last child
LEFT OUTER JOIN #test1 AS LastChild
ON h.LastChild = LastChild.InspectionID
AND h.PermittingID = LastChild.PermittingID
WHERE h.ReinspectionRequestNum IS NULL
AND LastChild.InspStatus = 0
OPTION(MAXRECURSION 100)
DROP TABLE #Test1

Is daisy chaining on a macbook air through the thunderbolt to Firewire 800 adaptor possible?

Hello,
I am attempting to daisy chain two Glyph portagig 50's and connect them to my MacBook Air. They are both 1TB, 7200RPM drives and are both connected to external power. When I attempt the daisy chain only the first drive mounts and when I attempt to connect the second drive to it, the first (mounted) drive ejects and the second drive does not mount. Both drives need to be turned off and on again in order for either to be remounted.
I contacted Glyph and they have said that it is most likely a problem with the Thunderbolt to FW800 adaptor. Which leads me to wonder whether or not daisy chaining through the adaptor is even possible.
Any help would be greatly appreciated!
My MacBook Air is a mid-2011 model with a 1.8GHz Core i7 processor and 4GB of RAM, if that helps at all.
Thank you!

GeorgeFlick
They are both 1TB, 7200RPM drives and are both connected to external power.
Eeeek, dont do that anymore. 2.5" dont need power, and daisy chaining them BOTH thru thunderbolt, your Air is likely kicking one because youre mostly likely sending feedback THRU the firewire.
Some inventive folks unknowingly have powered (3.5" need power, 2.5" DONT) 2.5" thru USB and found out the hard way they deep fried circuitry.

Good Idea, Bad Idea: Daisy-chaining external hard drives

I'm about to buy a White Macbook (maxing out RAM) which has one Firewire 400 port.
I currently use a Firebox to record audio and I know that I will need an external hard drive. The consensus is that Firewire is far superior than USB 2.0 due to a stable transfer rate.
However, I'm wondering which is superior in this case- getting a Firewire 400 external hard drive (7200rpm of course) and daisy-chaining it, or getting a USB 2.0 hard drive?
I typically only record 2 tracks at a time with my Firebox, but I would prefer it if I could use it to its full capacity and record 6 if I wanted to. I assume that this will have a great effect on it when daisy-chained.
With my current machine (details listed below), I get messages all the time from Logic Pro telling me I'm overloading it or maxing it out or whatever. In buying a new machine, I strongly desire not to have these problems again, so any advice would be greatly appreciated.

I'm under the impression there isn't a laptop being currently produced that has two Firewire 400 slots and is capable of running Logic Pro. Apple's offering has two choices - 1 Firewire 400 slot in the White Macbook for $999, and 1 Firewire 800 slot in the Macbook Pro line, starting at $1999. It is absolutely horrific, I know, but I didn't design the current line.
Since the biggest advantages between the $1999 model and the $999 model have very little to do with audio editing, I decided against the extra grand for some fancy new toys.
Advantages of higher-end:
A) Better graphics card
B) 0.3 Ghz more processing power
C) multi-touch trackpad
D) environmentally friendly
E) possibility of installing a solid state drive- at 128 GB.
My current machine was upgraded once, but was quickly smited back to original specs by a power surge (seriously- all I lost were the upgrades). It has since then been a bit of a finicky computer. It freezes now and then, and the kernel errors are frustrating. Plus, it's noisy.
So yeah- I would totally take you up on the notion of upgrading my current machine first, but it's not really worth the trouble anymore.
I've also posted before and have been told that pretty much any Mac I buy now will be far superior than my current machine.
That being said, I suppose I ought to look into USB 2.0 external drives.
Does anyone have any suggestions? Advice for what to look for? If I could find one that is 9600rpms, will that make a difference or is 7600rpm pretty much the max for the 400mbs transfer speed? Any suggestions for external drives that use both Firewire and USB 2.0? Any other ideas in general?

Can't daisy-chain Firewire drives reliably from 1-port Powerbook. Hub??

I have found that I cannot get a daisy-chained Firewire drive to mount more than 50% of the time. This problem doesn't happen with Tiger with the same drives. I have tried 4 different brands of late-model Firewire drives (Iomega, Smartdisk, Maxtor, and Seagate) with different cables and what happens is that a drive that is directly attached to the 12" Powerbook will mount, but the second chained drive fails to mount a majority of the time. Since I only have one Firewire port, this is preventing me from using more than one drive at a time, and I lost two Firewire drives to corruption today. Three out of four partitions lost contained bootable backups of Leopard and Tiger. Ouch!
This issue could prevent from using Leopard with my Powerbook, which is supposed to be Leopard-compatible. I can't remake the clones too easily with only being able to attach one drive at a time. I am thinking I will order a Firewire hub and try that, but I am not sure if that would be a solution, and I am wondering why I can always daisy-chain under Tiger, and not under Leopard. Does anyone have experience with Firewire hubs and Firewire operation details? Will I be able to get reliable Firewire with a hub?

I have exactly the same problem !
I have found this :
Using Multiple FireWire Devices at the Same Time
Power Macintosh computers can transfer perfect digital video (DV) on FireWire when no other devices are using the FireWire bus. If you have problems transferring digital video, make certain that no other FireWire devices are being used at the same time. Turning on a DV camera that is already connected may cause a FireWire hard disk to stop working. If this happens, turn off the camera and verify that the hard disk has recovered. Then unplug the FireWire cable from the camera, turn the camera on, and reconnect the FireWire cable to the camera. Check with the hard disk vendor for a possible firmware update to prevent this problem.
here:
http://www.2ndwave.com/firewire.asp
At the moment I can't upset what I'm doing to test it but I intend to do that as soon as I finish copying transferring...
I have the following device attached to different firewire ports:
a firewire video device connecting my G5 Desktop to the TV screen
a firewire ibot
I thought I would give u a head start

Pops when transferring thru daisy-chained MOTUs -- Logic?

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