PREMIERE PRO cs3 & cs5 - audio out of synch by 6 frames after export

i have never had formal training on adobe premiere, and therefore when i am working with my students it is basically down to expereince i have gained by myself.
with cs3, we always worked on the basis that it would always export the audio out of synch with the video by 6 frames so they would routinely have the audio tracks on two separate tracks, one for editing and one for exporting which was offset +6 frames.
when we made the transition to cs5 and new kit i was stunned to see that the synch issues were still there. and since a quick google yielded very little evidence that others shared this issue i thought it must be something i am doing wrong after years of bad habits learned on the fly.
so here is my workflow, where am i going wrong and why is it always out of synch?
open cs5
choose an editing format. (this varies but the synch issue is always the same)
import content
edit
export (normally as a microsoft avi, with no compression which i later convert into quicktime compressed with ANIMATION)
i teach on an animation course so normally the content we import is a sequence of stills such as jpg or tiff, but we also capture stuff on dslrs too
the timeline colour is normally yellow, which is fine at standard def, but larger def we will render workspace to turn it green
the editing format depends on our target format. the current project is 720 hd
the export as avi with no compressor i suspect to be a weak link in this work flow, but the problem remains if i export as anything else so....
now as an additional point on the matter, the current project we have had people miming to an audio clip which we played live for their performance. the audio blips were aligned on the timeline with the audio blips from the edit
but after rendering out, the footage is out of synch by 6 frames. it has always been this way.
any thoughts? i know i must be doing something wrong, but the issue is consistant across different computer, running different OS and different versions of PREM...so either i am doing it wrong or premiere is fundamentally broke.....i suspect its me though

is there a logical reason for opting for a preset which is the lowest common denominator rather than a highest? is it not better to work at the best res possible?
does it matter either way? because i have often created 1080p content and worked in a 1024/576 edit environment only to later export at 1080p with no loss of quality?
i create the avi and then open this in quicktime to export to the desired formats.
now that you posted that comment i cant believe i have never done the simple trouble shoot of 'at what point does it go out of synch'
files are too big to playback uncompressed though.
i know it is a workflow issue and not a prem issue because no one else seems to have the problem.
im going to run some tests
thanks, will report back

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Hello all,
I have an AVI file which uses the Huffyyuv codec and PCM audio. Premier Pro (PP) recognizes the audio, as I see the audip specs in the project pane.
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Holmdel NJ

Problem solved everyone!!!
Rebecca of Adobe support helped me identify the root cause: project was originally set up as standard (2-channel) and although it had evolved to a 5.1 project over time, it could never grow up to be anything other than a standard audio project. After you set up the new project, the setting that controls your audio is buried in the project somewhere. Changing your project settings to set up new 5.1 audio tracks for new timelines does NOT make the project 5.1! The real audio identity attribute set at birth is not alterable OR EVEN VISIBLE (even as a grayed-out project setting) although PP will allow you to set up and mix 5.1 audio tracks at will. So you may think you're working on a 5.1 project now, but you're only fooling yourself and PP goes right along with it. Even the .ac3 files you create via export are 5.1! But dare to build your DVD in Encore and all of your timelines are transcoded back to 2.0 instantly. Resistance is futile.
A new feature in PP CS4 will allow you to view, and even CHANGE, your project's audio identify from standard to 5.1. How sweet!
Well, I've devised a way to dig out myself out of this deep hole in CS3 and it worked, but I can't promise that it will work for everyone. (This assumes you own the Dolby Digital 5.1 codec from Minnetonka.)
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Tip #2: when re-exporting and replacing files, always select audio and video separately. For some reason, Encore will allow you to replace an .ac3 file when you perform an elemental audio export, but when you try to combine video and audio and both files exist, Encore will prompt you to replace the video, but immediately abort with an error that it cannot replace the .ac3 file, thus forcing you to delete the .ac3 component manually before trying again.
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See if this helps... To work with AC3 sound files in Premiere CS3, copy the ad2ac3dec.dll file from the Encore CS3 directory into the Premiere directory

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Welcome to the forum
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No Audio after Relinking mxf Media Files - Premiere Pro CS3

Product: Premiere Pro CS3 - Version 3.2.0
Hardware: Pentium 4; 3 GHz; 1GB RAM
Hard Drives: Using 2 external 1TB Hard Drives for my film's storage and access
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User Experience Level: Novice
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To experiment on how I can get the audio to work:
1)I've clicked on an individual mxf clip file in the Project Window
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3)Copied and pasted the Offline Media mxf clip file to a new folder in the same project
4)Clicked on the Offline Media mxf clip file in the new folder
5)Clicked on Link Media in the Project menu
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Premiere pro cs3 doesn't place audio into the corresponding video track

It places a video clip with audio in the Video 1 track, the audio is not automatically placed into Audio track 1 but it goes to Audio 2 or 3 or 4. I checked settings both Project and Preferences but have not clue what may cause this problem. Any help would be greately appreciated.
I have Premiere Pro CS3 running on Vista home premium. Thank you

FAQ:Why is there no audio in my imported MPEG file?
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Eddie
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Import Premiere Pro CS3 Windows projects into Premiere Pro CS5 Mac.

Hi there people. I hope you can help me. I have had premiere pro CS3 on my windows system for some years but now run a Mac with Master Collection CS5, my problem is that my existing prproj files on windows format do not open in CS5 Premiere Pro for Mac, I get a message telling me that I need to see the user guide for importing options, I have tried to do so, but there is no information about how to do this.
Can anyone here please tell me how to get around this, as I need to rework some of these old windows projects however my old windows system is totally dead now so I cannot open the files in the CS3 windows version either.
Please help, oh and spare me the useless windows vs. mac arguments.
I hope someone here can help
Thanks

Since you are trying to Open a CS3 PC Project, you should not have THAT many issues in CS5 Mac. Have you tried both the Open and Import - similar but different operations? Have both methods failed?
One possible problem would be the Effects & Transitions used in the CS3 PC Project. Here is a LIST of the Transitions and Effects in CS4 for the PC, that are missing in the Mac version. I would assume that CS3 and CS5 would be similar. However, in similar cases, PrPro has thrown a more specific error message. I have only Opened Pr 6.5 Mac Projects into PrPro 2.0 PC, and these have been almost perfect. Where there were missing Transitions, I got a very explicit message, telling me what had been used that was missing from my program, and exactly where the problem existed (specific TimeCode). In my case, two Transitions just did not exist in my PrPro 2.0, and one was a 3rd party Transition, or Effect, and I did not have that. Still, the older Mac Projects Opened fine, and I just made note of where I would need to make changes. I would anticipate that similar would occur, if the Mac version did not have some Transition, or Effect, but do not know specifically. Still, based on the warning messages that I got, with such complete documentation, I'd expect similar.
Now another consideration - Assets. If there are Assets that you cannot work with on your Mac, say DV-AVI, or WMV, those would likely throw an error. Again, I would expect that error message to elaborate a bit more.
Do you know the details of your CS3 Projects and their Assets? Anything that you can think of there?
Just thinking here, and unfortunately, I have never gone the direction that you are going, and with the versions that you are working with, so something simple and glaring (to others) might just be slipping past me.
Good luck, and maybe others will have much better input on your issue. Also - welcome to the forum!
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When I export an edited movie using the Adobe Media Encoder of Premiere Pro CS3, the quality is disappointing. A lot of details are lost and the contrast is less than the original footages. Further, I see that the size of the movies are reduced with about 30%.
I use the H.264 preset ‘HDTV 720p 23.976 High Quality’, but with the frame rate changed to 29.97 fps. Other settings are default.
My questions are:
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created with a Samsung NV24HD camera.

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The Cineform AVI files play perfectly fine when using Virtualdub for playback, but Windows media player behave just like Premiere.
Everything worked fine a week ago. Premiere appeared to use something called "ffdshow" to play the Cineform files, and I could edit without any trouble.
A few days ago, when I tried the same, that's when the problems came. Whenever I hit Play button in Premiere, a popup window came up, saying Premiere wanted to use ffdshow, and the options was "never", "no once", "yes once", "yes always".
When everything worked a week ago, I had to use the "yes always" option.
Now, it does not matter which option I use, Premiere will not play the Cineform files.
I did not make any changes to my computer between the day everything was okay, and when the problem appeared.
A Cineform representative suggested "ffdshow" is the troublemaker, so I uninstalled ffdshow and removed any traces of it I could find, but the same problem still exist.
Then I uninstalled Cineform NeoHD
Uninstalled and reinstalled Production Premium CS3 suite
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Still same problem, nothing has changed.
It does not matter if I use 50i or 25p source files.
My system: (Laptop)
Windows Vista ultimate 64-bit
Intel 2,66GHz quad core CPU
4GB ram
Nvidia Geforce 8800M GTX
3x internal 7200rpm harddrives set up with raid-0
Anyone else experiencing this?
Any ideas what might be wrong?

dont know , but this stuff might fix your prob.. overwrite whatever ffdshow screwed up...
cfrepair utility:
http://www.siliconimaging.com/DigitalCinema/SiliconImaging_support.html
cineform codec (neo player)
http://estore.cineform.com/NeoPlayer.aspx
never used the cfrepair thing..but did install neoplayer which gave me the codec to use cs3 with cf raw files ( sample of cf raw at the si 2k site -- avi ext )
ps.... to keep overhead down on my computer I took the resulting cineform "player" out of my startup directory....as it wants to run in background when you install it...no need for that for my purpose of just getting the codec

Error in Premiere Pro CS3.

Whenever I had a problem and i posted it here, i always got helped by you guys, so first of all, i want to thank those who helped me out there, and wanted you to know that i really appreciate that help.
Here is probably my last issue with Premiere Pro CS3.
The problem:
From time to time, i get an error. A message saying: " sorry a serious error has occurred that requires adobe premiere pro to shut down"
It saves the current project, and when i start premiere over, it loads it from there. It usually happens when:
I ' activate ' an effect, example: I change the opacity to 0 ( typing it with the keyboard as a percentage ) and press enter. Right when i press enter, it pops up. ( it happens with any kind of effect, just from time to time, when i ' activate ' it)
When i minimize an audio file by dragging it to the left or the right, it happens when i release the right mouse button. These are just examples. The issue is that when i make a change, this error repeats.
I'd love to hear what the issue may be.
Appreciate any kind of help.

Can you give us the specs. of one of the typical Projects, and their Assets, where you see this happening?
Next, can you give us the specs. of your computer, in as much detail, as is possible?
Can you also list the programs/processes, that load at boot up? A screen-cap, or report from Process Explorer will tell us a lot.
Also, before beginning an editing session, you might want to look into this ARTICLE. If you have Win7, be sure to look down-thread for the link to Black Viper's Web site for tuning that OS.
This ARTICLE might be useful for telling you what is happening with your system and your programs, when you get the error and crash.
Good luck,
Hunt

Importing AVIs into Adobe Premiere Pro CS3 !!!

Heres what Im trying to do: We have been working on a PC Leitch Velocity Q NLE system for the past couple years and just got 2 new Matrox Axio LE NLEs with Adobe Premiere Pro CS3. We are trying to get all our old projects from the Velocity system onto our Matrox systems and not sacrifice any of the video quality. I've been thinking that the best way to do this is by compressing old projects to AVI format from the Velocity system and move them over to the Matrox using an external hard drive.
I was actually able to bring in an AVI from the Velocity system onto the Matrox yesterday using the same Velocity settings below, except that I changed the aspect to 720 x 480 and the audio sample rate to 48,000. When playing the video on the timeline in Premiere the video looked great on my computer monitor but on my external NTSC monitor all motion in the video looked a little jerky as if frames are missing. I tried importing the test clip into both Matrox uncompressed 8-bit and uncompressed 10-bit projects and had the same resulting jerky looking video. Even after rendering the clip the video looked the same. Then I tried exporting the clip to mpeg using the Matrox media encoder but saw no change in the jerky movement. Here are my project and export setting for both systems.
The AVI was made on a PC Leitch Velocity Q NLE system. My project settings on the Velocity system are;
29.97 drop frame
720 x 486 24 Bit
Interlaced field order B
Sub pixel off Cropping off
Audio:
16 sample
44 / samples / second
2 channel
Export settings are; (These are the settings I was trying the first time that didnt work. All I changed the second time was the aspect ratio to 720 x 480 and the audio sampling rate to 48.)
AVI
Frame rate 29.97
720 x 486
No Compression
Color 24 Bits
Field handling interlaced field order B
Audio:
16 sample
Sampling rate 44
2 channels stereo
Do you recommend compressing the video coming out of Velocity?
There are a couple other options other than No Compression in the export dialogue such as: Microsoft H.263 video codec, Microsoft H.261 video codec. I definitely want to maintain the highest quality possible.
Matrox Axio LE project settings
Editing mode: Matrox NTSC
Timebase: 29.97 fps
Video
Frame Size: 720 x 486
Pixel Aspect Ratio: D1 / DV NTSC (0.9)
Fields: Lower field first
Display: Format 30fps Drop Frame Timecode
Audio: Sample 48,000 Hz
Display: Audio sample
Video Rendering: Maximum bit depth is Unchecked
Previews: File format Matrox uncompressed 8-bit NTSC (tried Matrox uncompressed 10-bit too.)
I think the jerky video might be due to dropping frames but Im not sure.
Any help is greatly appreciated!

While it seems that the field order is consistent, I have seen issues where converting from clips that change field order creates this sort of problem. This is particularly obvious when converting from MJPEG codecs like Meridien or Miro/Pinnacle to DV.
What happens if you just import the files into Premiere and let it do the rendering to the project settings?

PREMIERE PRO cs3 & cs5 - audio out of synch by 6 frames after export

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