Preview application color management

Print with preview from a psd document letting PS determine colors to Epson R2400, preview shows washed out or wrong colors. Is Tiger's preview app useless once you let PS determine color?
G5 2.3 2.5RAM/PowerBkG41.67 1.5RAM Mac OS X (10.4.8) Aperture1.5.2

Totally in agreement! Your frestration is clear and I hope I'm not clogging up your thread with my "contributions". Trouble for me is that I don't have confidence that my printer or display profiles ARE setup properly. I have swapped colour mgmt seetings so often now that I'm probably cancelling out profiling at both ends. Think Chinese translated to Albanian, to French, and output English!!! Problem also that PhotoShop profiles label standard differently than HP. "CYMK", for example, has no counterpart in the HP printer settings! What to use? ICM, Application Managed???
I continue searching for a solutuion & came across this site http://www.ocad.ca/about_ocad/technology_media/sb/printing_help/color.htm . Based on this info, and translating to my application, I am getting a bit closer. At least the printer is now "paying attention" and actually printing something other than "whatever it feels like".
Now that I've got colours close to matching (WYSIWYG), it is apparent that I do, in fact, have some issues with my LCD monitor brightness/contrast settings. I am now working through that and hoping I don't need to go to the expense of buying a Spyder calibration tool. I DON'T make a living at this and would prefer to spend my hard earned $ on glass/equipment to improve quality at the front end. Photos from Costco will be here in about hour...

Similar Messages

No Real time Previews with color management on

Hi Everyone,
I use Color management all the time for correctly interpreting YUV footage in CS3, when I try the same techniques in CS4 I cannot get a realtime preview until I turn Color management off ... is any one else experiencing this ?
Thanks
Nic

I tried the same thing on my MacBook Pro and there was no issue. Here's my specs:
Processor 2.4 GHz Intel Core i7
Memory 8 GB 1333 MHz DDR3
Graphics AMD Radeon HD 6770M 1024 MB
Software Mac OS X Lion 10.7.4 (11E53)
I'd suggest:
Submit bugs to http://www.adobe.com/go/wish . More on how to give feedback: http://bit.ly/93d6NF

Preview panel loses Color Management after Minimize Bridge CS5

Whenever I minimize the Bridge CS5 application window to the Windows taskbar, upon restoring or maximizing the Bridge application window the image(s) currently showing in the Preview panel no longer appear color managed (they look exactly as they would appear from a non-color-managed app.) In order to see them as color managed again, I have to either de/re-select their thumbnails or double click the Preview panel twice (once to minimize it, and once again to restore it.) Otherwise resizing the Preview panel has no impact on the color. The thumbnails in the Content panel are fine. This did NOT occur in CS4 or earlier versions of Bridge - otherwise the same environment.
I have a wide-gamut monitor, which causes many non-color-managed images to look super saturated, especially reds & greens, so it is probably much easier to notice this behavior in this environment than from a typical-gamut monitor.
Windows 7, x64, ATI Radeon HD 4850 graphics card, Bridge v4.0.3.9
Anyone else notice this annoyance?

Thanks Curt,
I doubt this is a video issue as no other versions of Bridge behave this way on this system. I have the same preference settings in Bridge CS5 as for Bridge CS4 - which works fine. Nor does Photoshop exhibit this behavior post-minimizing, & Photoshop behaves perfectly for all the OpenGL Drawing settings (which I have set to Advanced in PS.) Bridge just seems to poorly manage the Preview panel color post-minimizing the application window, but otherwise everything displays fine during operation. I'd be surprised if it was just me but if it is, it's an easy enough annoyance to work around. I'd imagine that this isn't too observable on a normal-gamut monitor.
I tried your suggestion of "use software rendering", just in case, but it made no difference. Appreciate the idea though...
One more observation:
While thumbnails are being generated for the first time on large images, they also have the non-color-managed appearance until they complete their generating, at which time they take the managed appearance - but I just consider that a processing-timing final step & it hasn't changed behavior from previous versions of Bridge.

IE10 Consumer Preview Still Only Does Half Color-Management

The Internet Explorer version 10 Consumer Preview does not do full color-management - it ignores the monitor profile.
This is not a real surprise, as I have had it confirmed to me by someone inside Microsoft, but I thought I'd just pass along that in my Windows 8 CP testing I've verified this to actually be the case.
IE9 and IE10 do not manage the color of web page elements at all, and both interpret image color profiles in images if they're present, but they only convert the colors to sRGB, no matter what monitor profile you're actually using. For calibrated and profiled systems, this yields inaccuracy; for example, with wide gamut monitors the colors of images carrying a profile will always be oversaturated.
Sigh. Progress marches on EVER so slowly.
-Noel

Let me try to help you further:
1. In Illustrator's Swatch settings pallette, should the Spot Color Mode option be set to use:
a. CMYK
b. LAB
c. Book Color (not sure if this refers to the pantone swatchbook)
- I would use "c" - Book Color. This is the file going to the printer which will use Spot Color on press. For a copy of the file to be output by your Canon, use "a" - CMYK.
2. In the View menu should Overprint Preview be checked, and why, and would it differ based on the settings for #1.
- Only if the color was transparent ( which it isn't ) would overprint preview be of any use or you use a tint value of the Spot color and a black, but even then you may not be able to detect any change in the screen view. I typically do not use any overprint preview and I do not rely on the monitor for any color deisions. You could be different and that is OK. Let me know if you are able to detect any deviates using overprint preview.
I'm sorry for being a little short. There is a lot of confusion about these issues and Adobe and Pantone are not making things any easier.
The key is your Canon will not be able to print accurate Spot color without a RIP for the necessary color tables and conversions for that particular printer. In your case, it will be necessary to build a CMYK file to print a somewhat approximate representation of that specific Spot color. Another frustrating part of this matrix is CMYK cannot match all Pantone Spot Colors.

Photosmart 8750, color managed by application

I have not used my printer for high quality printing in over a year; also the software is downloaded (not from the disk supplied which is lost). The updated software is slightly different from the original. I have two questions regarding printing with "color managed by application": 1. In the list of printer profiles, there does not seem to be a selection for the three color cartridges of tri-color, blue photo, and gray photo; to be used with high quality photo paper. I have learned the hard way that the right setting here is imperative. 2. In selecting color management, I have picked "color handling by PhotoShop Elements" (I used to use Adobe Photoshop 7, if that makes a difference). A message "Did you remember to disable color management in the printer preferency dialogue" appears, but there are only two options for that: "ColorSmart/sRGB" and "Adobe RGB." In the past I selected "Managed by application," which is no longer an option (except on the previous screen as previously noted). Do I select "AdobeRGB" since I am using Adobe Photoshop Elements? Thanks for any assistance you can offer. Of course, I can print with "managed by printer," but I believe "managed by application" gives a bit richer color.

My prints recently have had a green cast. Any suggestions?

Fully Color Managed Application (using calibrated monitor profiles)

Hi,
I'm new to JAVA 2D so I may be missing something obvious - apologies if I am, but I've been trawling the API and web to try and solve this for many hours - so any help would be much appreciated!
I'm trying to write an application to open a JPEG with an embedded colour profile (in this case AdobeRGB) and display it with correct colour on my monitor, for which I have an accurate custom hardware calibrated profile. In my efforts to do this several problems / queries have arisen.
So, JAVA aside, the concept is simple:
a) Open the image
b) Transform the pixels from AdobeRGB->Monitor Profile (via a PCS such as CIEXYZ).
c) Blit it out to the window.
(a) is fine. I've used the following code snip, and can query the resulting BufferedImage and see it has correctly extracted the AdobeRGB profile. I can even display it (non-color corrected) using the Graphics2D.drawImage() function in my components paint() method.
BufferedImage img = ImageIO.read(new File("my-adobe-rgb.jpg"));(b) Also seems OK (well at least no exceptions)...
ICC_Profile monitorProfile = ICC_Profile.getInstance("Monitor_Calibrated.icm");
    ColorConvertOp convert = new ColorConvertOp(new ICC_ColorSpace(monitorProfile ),null);
    BufferedImage imgColorAdjusted = convert.filter(img,null);[I was feeling hopeful at this point!]
QUESTION 1: Does this conversion go through the CIEXYZ (I hope) rather than sRGB, there seems to be no way to specify and the docs are not clear on this?
(c) Here is the major problem...
When I pass imgColorAdjusted to the Graphic2D.drawImage() in my components paint() method the JVM just hangs and consumes 100% CPU.
QUESTION 2: Any ideas why it hangs?
Pausing in the debugger I found the API was busy transforming by image to sRGB this leads to my third question...
QUESTION 3: If I pass an image with a color model to drawImage() does drawImage do any color conversion, e.g will it transform my adobe image to sRGB (not what I want in this case!)?
And if answer to Q3 is yes, which I suspect it is, then the next question is how to make the J2D understand that I have a calibrated monitor, and to tell it the profile, so that the Graphics2D it provides in paint() has the correct color model. Looking in the API I thought this was provided to J2D through the GraphicsEnviroment->GraphicsDevice->GraphicsConfiguration.getColorModel(). I tried looking at what these configurations were (code below). Result - 10 configurations, all with the JAVA 2D sRGB default, despite my monitor colour management (through the windows display properties dialog) being set to the calibrated profile.
QUESTION 4: Am I just off track here - does Java 2D support monitor profiles other than sRGB? Is what I am trying possible?
GraphicsConfiguration[] cfg = GraphicsEnvironment.getLocalGraphicsEnvironment().getDefaultScreenDevice().getConfigurations();
    System.out.println(cfg.length);
    byte[] d;
    for (int j=0; j<cfg.length; j++) {
      System.out.println("CFG:"+j+cfg[j]);
      d = ((ICC_ColorSpace)cfg[j].getColorModel().getColorSpace()).getProfile().getData();
      for (int i=0; i<d.length && i<256; i++){
        if (d[i] != 10 && d[i] != 13){
          System.out.print((char)d);
System.out.println();
Any help much appreciated.
Thanks.

I have had some sucess with this, but it wasn't easy or obvious. The trick is converting the color to the monitor profile and then changing the color model to be sRGB without changing the pixel data. JAI's Format operation does this easily although I'm sure there are other ways to do it. The RGB data is then displayed without being converted to sRGB so that the monitor calibration is maintained. I will answer your questions since I had similar ones.
Q1. Yes the conversion is done using XYZ as it should be.
Q2. I believe paint is just very slow, not hanging. Any color model other than XYZ or sRGB requires conversion before it can be displayed (as sRGB). This is both slow and incorrect for a calibrated monitor.
Q3. Yes that is what I have found, a conversion to sRGB will always happen, unless it appears to be already done as when the color model is sRGB (even though the pixel data is not!).
Q4. It is possible but apparently only with this somewhat strange work around. If there is a way to change the Java display profile to be other than sRGB, I could not find it either. However, calibrated RGB display can be achieved.
Since I have seen many other posts asking for an example of color management, here is some code. This JAI conversion works for many pairs of source and destination profiles including CMYK to RGB. It does require using ICC profiles in external files rather than embedded in the image.
package calibratedrgb;
import com.sun.media.jai.widget.DisplayJAI;
import java.awt.*;
import java.awt.color.*;
import java.awt.image.*;
import java.io.IOException;
import javax.media.jai.*;
import javax.swing.*;
* @author keitht
public class Main {
    public static void main(String[] args) throws IOException {
        String filename = args[0];
        PlanarImage pi = JAI.create("fileload", filename);
        // create a source color model from the image ICC profile
        ICC_Profile sourceProfile = ICC_Profile.getInstance("AdobeRGB1998.icc");
        ICC_ColorSpace sourceCS = new ICC_ColorSpace(sourceProfile);
        ColorModel sourceCM = RasterFactory.createComponentColorModel(
                pi.getSampleModel().getDataType(), sourceCS, false, false,Transparency.OPAQUE);
        ImageLayout sourceIL = new ImageLayout();
        sourceIL.setColorModel(sourceCM);
        // tag the image with the source profile using format
        RenderingHints sourceHints = new RenderingHints(JAI.KEY_IMAGE_LAYOUT, sourceIL);
        ParameterBlockJAI ipb = new ParameterBlockJAI("format");
        ipb.addSource(pi);
        ipb.setParameter("datatype", pi.getSampleModel().getDataType());
        pi = JAI.create("format", ipb, sourceHints);
        // create a destination color model from the monitor ICC profile
        ICC_Profile destinationProfile = ICC_Profile.getInstance("Monitor Profile.icm");
        ICC_ColorSpace destinationCS = new ICC_ColorSpace(destinationProfile);
        ColorModel destinationCM = RasterFactory.createComponentColorModel(
                pi.getSampleModel().getDataType(), destinationCS, false, false, Transparency.OPAQUE);
        ImageLayout destinationIL = new ImageLayout();
        destinationIL.setColorModel(destinationCM);
        // convert from source to destination profile
        RenderingHints destinationHints = new RenderingHints(JAI.KEY_IMAGE_LAYOUT, destinationIL);
        ParameterBlockJAI cpb = new ParameterBlockJAI("colorconvert");
        cpb.addSource(pi);
        cpb.setParameter("colormodel", destinationCM);
        pi = JAI.create("colorconvert", cpb, destinationHints);
        // image is now the calibrated monitor RGB data ready to display, but
        // an unwanted conversion to sRGB will occur without the following...
        // first, create an sRGB color model
        ColorSpace sRGB = ColorSpace.getInstance(ColorSpace.CS_sRGB);
        ColorModel sRGBcm = RasterFactory.createComponentColorModel(
                pi.getSampleModel().getDataType(), sRGB, false, false, Transparency.OPAQUE);
        ImageLayout sRGBil = new ImageLayout();
        sRGBil.setColorModel(sRGBcm);
        // then avoid the incorrect conversion to sRGB on the way to the display
        // by using format to tag the image as sRGB without changing the data
        RenderingHints sRGBhints = new RenderingHints(JAI.KEY_IMAGE_LAYOUT, sRGBil);
        ParameterBlockJAI sRGBpb = new ParameterBlockJAI("format");
        sRGBpb.addSource(pi);
        sRGBpb.setParameter("datatype", pi.getSampleModel().getDataType());
        pi = JAI.create("format", sRGBpb, sRGBhints); // replace color model with sRGB
        // RGB numbers are unaffected and can now be sent without conversion to the display
        // disguised as sRGB data. The platform monitor calibration profile is bypassed
        // by the JRE because sRGB is the default graphics configuration color model profile
        JFrame frame = new JFrame();
        Container contentPane = frame.getContentPane();
        contentPane.setLayout(new BorderLayout());
        DisplayJAI d = new DisplayJAI(pi); // Graphics2D could be used here
        contentPane.add(new JScrollPane(d),BorderLayout.CENTER);
        frame.setDefaultCloseOperation(JFrame.EXIT_ON_CLOSE);
        frame.setSize(600,600);
        frame.setVisible(true);
}

On my 10.6.8, my preview application disappeared and all my documents are coming up as color sync utility. So I can't print anything. HELP!

Where did my preview application go? I have been trying to print documents but everything is coming up under color sync utility, which I don't even know what it is, and there is no "Print" option. All the previous questions about this problem say to go to Preview, but it has gone away. I've looked in Finder and Apps and had both my 20 something children look for it, and none of us know what to do next.
I have a 10.6.8 Mac using Google Chrome as my server, if that matters.

Download Find File for Mac If that piece of software can't find it, you can custom install Preview directly from the disc that came with your Mac when you purchased. It's inside disc #1. Follow the online instructions.

Realtime Ram Preview Fail in Color Management is on

Hi. I m work with Ari Alexa footage as shown VIDEO: After Effects and Alexa - The Expurgated Version by ChrisZwar And I enebled mercury transmit in video preview preferences. When I want to ram preview After effects does not preview in real time. In info window appearce red text fps: 0,6/25 (NOT realtime) Note: project working color space is on
What should I do in this case

BeraT, if you disable Display Color Management (View menu > Use Display Color Management) and Mercury Transmit, do you get real-time playback during RAM preview?
Display color management and video preview in After Effects both impose a processing burden. As each frame is sent for display, additional work must be done to apply a color transformation or a dimensional transformation, respectively. If you have both color management and video preview enabled, both transformations are applied, plus an additional color transformation for the Mercury Transmit monitor. None of these transformations are cached, they are done live, on-the-fly and require additional processing at playback time.
The net result is that both color management and video preview require more processing power during playback. Larger frames, higher frame rates, and higher color bit depth increase the amount of processing power required, due to the increased memory requirements of the frames.
A faster processor would help give real-time playback more often, but you can also increase playback speed by lowering the memory requirements of the RAM preview frames: reduce the resolution in the Composition panel or the playback resolution in the Preview panel, reduce the project's color bit depth setting, or reduce the Frame Rate or increase the Skip rate in the Preview panel. Disabling the Use Display Color Management option will also help, as it removes one of the processing steps.
All of that aside, if you aren't able to achieve real-time playback when both Display Color Management and Mercury Transmit are disabled, that tells you the problem is coming from somewhere else. You'll need to provide more information about what's happening in your comp.

Manage Bookmarks on Preview application

Hi there,
does anybody know, how to manage bookmarks on preview application?
I want to group my bookmarks in different folders or how can I highlight pages or sth. like this?

ideato, thank you for your reply. perhaps I am missing it, but I cannot find anything in these articles about how to create bookmark folders on Firefox/Android, not how to move bookmarks between folders. I can see how to sync bookmarks to desktop, organize them into folders on desktop, and then sync the folders back to phone. I am hoping for something that can be done just on the phone.

Preview Color Management broken? Profile not applied?

Hi all,
I've come upon an inconsistency and wondered if anyone else is having this issue?
I profiled my Xerox Color Laser Printer. When I print out of Photoshop CS 4 my prints look great.
If I print out of Preview (Mac OS X 7.5), the colors are not correct and the In Printer color management prints match the ColorSync Color Managed with my new custom profile selected prints? I tried turning on the soft proofing, and the screen image in Preview looks amazingly like my successful Photoshop Color Managed Print, but when I print, the image appears as if the printer profile is not being applied. FYI, this profile is an ICC v2 Profile.
As I noted prints out of Photoshop are accurate and just fine.
Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks, and so long for now, TOM

Thanks for the reply Richard. I indeed tried the latest driver, 91.31. The new control panel was quite confusing. I managed to get to the performance and quality place, but there was no way to set a color profile to a specific game, so keeping the same drivers, I went back to the classic control panel. Color profiles can't seem to be applied for game profiles, as the value in the profile switches to a "0" every time I hit apply (read that some other guy on the nZone forums had the same issues). So as of now, I just use the 84.21 drivers and set the color profile manually in the taskbar.
By the way, does anyone else here set color profiles in their game profiles? If so, how's the experience?

Color Management and Preview

Hi All,
Wonder if anyone can help me? I wasn't sure where to post this, so hope it is in the correct forum.....
I have got a MacPro with the NVIDIA GeForce 8800GT graphics card, together with two displays - an EIZO ColorEdge CG222W, which I bought recently, and a Dell 2005FPW that I have had for a while.
Both monitors are calibrated, but today I noticed something rather strange. I was working on an image for an exhibition in Photoshop CS3. Whilst in PhotoShop I dragged from one display to the other, and everything was fine - the image had the same accurate colors on both displays.
I went ahead and exported the image to a jpg in preparation of sending to my online printer, and included the icc profile in the image. The color profile attached to the image is Adobe RGB. However, when I open the image in Preview, the colors are displayed much darker (and less accurate) on the EIZO monitor, whereas the Dell is still accurate. But if the image is opened in ColorSync, then I see the same colors displayed on both monitors.
It looks like Preview and EIZO are having some weird issues with one another..... can anyone think why this would happen? I'm wondering if it is as simple as Preview not being able to read icc profiles, or if there is something else going on.....
Thanks
Simon

Thanks for the answer - currently the Dell screen has the menu bar on it and is the primary. I had also wondered if it had something to do with primary/secondary, and I did try switching them so that the EIZO became the primary. but it didn't have an effect.
Note - the EIZO does have hardware calibration, whereas the Dell only has software calibration.....

Color Management in Bridge CS6

Hello,
I'm having a strange color management issue in Bridge (64 bit). Essentially, Bridge is not displaying images in either the thumbnails or preview pane using the correct color profile.
Background: I'm on Windows using a dual monitor setup (both independantly calibrated) but I have the issue even when I use only one monitor. Photoshop has no issues with color settings. I've tried resetting all settings (hitting Ctrl as Bridge starts). I've tried purging my cache and having Bridge generate monitor-size previews.
The weirdest part is when I start Bridge, for a split second images appear to be in the correct profile, and then Bridge adjusts everything to the wrong color profile.
Any thoughts?
Thanks!

Omke Oudeman wrote:
about A:
I don't get that, I have a custom made monitor profile based on D65 and with or without this profile the only difference one would spot would be in the total picture, this screenshot shows what I see and that is not as much difference between the Bridge thumb and preview (and in the metadata placard you can see they are 16 bit ProPhoto with on top of it the floating PS panel with the same image. It is one picture of one screen, without my monitor profile (and without knowing what happens during the adding process to the Adobe site) or with, the difference between both applications would not change, only the total picture. (or I really don't understand anything anymore about color management )
The first threshold question is whether you're using a wide gamut monitor. I'm going to assume the answer is yes. The reason it's essential to embed your monitor profile in your screenshot is if you do not have a wide gamut monitor, someone looking at your image who does will be able to tell since the gamut will be smaller than it should be. If you are not using a wide gamut monitor, that would explain why you cannot see the difference. Additionally, whether you have a wide-gamut monitor or not, if you do not embed a profile, the untagged image will appear way oversaturated when brought into Photoshop (this is happening for me) unless I can guess the approximate color space of your monitor.
Admittedly, if you are using a wide-gamut monitor, then although the image will be way oversatured without a profile (until I assign one), both the Photoshop portion and Bridge portion should be way oversatured by the same amount. However it's not particularly helpful to use guesswork and approximation when trying to narrow down a problem like this. You say "this screenshot shows what I see," but you have to keep in mind you are looking at it on your monitor. Even though your screenshot will obviously look right to you on your monitor, someone looking at it on a smaller gamut monitor won't see what you're talking about.
about B:
There you have a point but this was a current project at hand and at this moment there is a bit over saturation in the wood. In real life I also almost never have to deal with the bright colors of your example. I don't want to go again messing my workspaces to create a screenshot for the files you provided but I can assure you I have less to none difference between both files in both Bridge and PS, like I never have seen your problem on my current computer (Mac Pro, 2 x 2,4 6 core intel Xeon mid 2012 and a lot of RAM and SSD etc including ATI Radeon HD 5770 1024 MB VRAM running OSX 10.8.3) as well as my former MacPro with same graphic card - and two others - that I used since 2008 during OSX 10.5 to 10.7 with all used versions of CS.
Yea, I understand why you don't want to mess with your workflow. I wouldn't either if I were in the middle of a project. But (assuming you have a wide-gamut monitor) if you finish a project and do get the chance, I encourage you to try the ProPhotoRGB color patch in Photoshop versus Bridge. When you really stray from sRGB, you, like me and Yammer, should see a major difference. I suppose there's the possibility that the Mac version of Bridge works differently, but that doesn't seem likely. It's possible you've never noticed the difference before because (again, assuming you have a wide-gamut monitor) you've never been looking for it, or you don't shoot many subjects with colors vastly outside sRGB - things like flowers, dyes, clothing, bright lights, etc.
And as for the quote, I also never make my choices based on colors for DNG in Bridge, in fact, I always shoot with manual WB set to 5500 K, whether in daylight or artificial light, I just don't bother because I want my colors to be adjusted in ACR and refined the way I want them in PS. The plus side of manual WB is that all colors are off in the same way and can be adjusted in the correct direction in one go for a series
That's an interesting idea and really illustrates the beauty of shooting RAW - tons on flexibility. And in fact, whether you use manual white balance, or don't, with RAW everything can be corrected or adjusted from a certain baseline by the same amount after the fact anyway.

Color management detective needed!

I need help with some color management issues I'm having.
I've noticed that RAW images imported into Aperture (both 1.0.1 and 1.1) look very different than those imported into PS2 via ACR. I've been told that this is simply a result of the different conversion algorithims each program uses.
However, since I don't see a lot of discussion about that here I began to wonder if the differences I see between PS2 and Aperture are unusual. Also, I've noticed that when I export a RAW file from Aperture or PS2 as a JPEG, the colors of the resulting files look slightly different than they did before export (no adjustments were made in either program). Finally, when I upload the exported JPEGs to a website, the colors change once again!
This is very frustrating, because I spend a lot of time adjusting the image and finessing the colors... only to see it significantly altered when I put it on the web. I'd like to better understand what's happening here and have more control over the process.
So I've created a website with various examples of what I'm talking about. I imported the same RAW file into Aperture and PS2 without adjustments. Then I used OS X's Grab application to take a screen shot of how the image appears in each program. Then I exported the image as a JPEG from both PS2 and Aperture, using Adobe RGB as the embedded profile in both cases. (Note: my monitor profile is a custom profile created by EyeOne) Then I uploaded the JPEGs to a website I often display photos on, and then took a screen shot of how both the Aperture-exported and PS2-exported images appear on the web.
Please look at http://web.mac.com/chriskresser/iWeb/Site/Last%20Roll.html
So, my questions are:
1. Why does the color vary so dramatically between Aperture and PS2? Is this normal, i.e. do you experience the same thing? Is there something I can do about it?
2. Why do the exported JPEGs look different than their RAW master's? Again, is this normal and is there anything I can do about it?
3. Why do the JPEGs uploaded to the web look different than the JPEGs opened in Preview or PS2?
I've tried to standardize my color workspaces as much as possible, but I'm not sure I've done it correctly. In Aperture, onscreen proofing is off and I'm just using the default colorspace (which I understand is a wide-gamut RGB?). In PS2 I am using Adobe RGB as the working colorspace. My monitor profile is the custom calibrated Eye-One profile.
I really appreciate any help you can offer. I'm pulling my hair out trying to get this straight.
Thanks,
Chris

Thanks to everyone for helping me figure this out.
Let me make sure I understand. In Aperture, when I go to export a JPEG for web use or printing from another application with my home inkjet I select sRGB as the color space.
In PS2, I use Adobe RGB as my working color space, but when I save a JPEG for the web, I change the profile to sRGB before exporting. Do I use the "Edit>Convert to profile..." command for this? Or should I be using sRGB as my working color space in PS2 since most of my output is for the web and home inkjet? (There are occasionally times I send files to a printer for output, though).
The Aperture RAW and PS2 RAW look significantly different on my monitor too, not just on the web. I'm using the default ACR settings - do you think they need to be customized for my camera? I see what you are saying... the ACR RAW does look much brighter than the Aperture version and kind of washed out. Not sure how to fix that though...

Need help understanding profiles and color management

I made the big leap from inexpensive inkjets to:
1 Epson 3800 Standard
2 Spyder3Studio
I have a Mac Pro Quad, Aperture, PS3, etc.
I have a steep learning curve ahead, here's what I've done:
1 Read a lot of books, watched tutorials, etc.
2 Calibrated the monitor
3 Calibrated the printer several times and created .icc profiles
What I've found:
1 The sample print produced by Spyder3Print, using the profile I created with color management turned off in the print dialog, looks very good.
2 When I get into Aperture, and apply the .icc profile I created in the proofing profile with onscreen proofing, the onscreen image does not change appreciably compared with the no proof setting. It gets slightly darker
3 When I select File>Print image, select the profile I created, turn off color management and look a the resulting preview image it looks much lighter and washed out than the onscreen image with onscreen proofing turned on.
4 When I print the image, it looks the same as was shown in the print preview...light and washed out, which is much different than what is shown in edit mode.
5 When I open PS3 with onscreen soft-proofing, the onscreen image is light and washed out...just like displayed in PS3 preview. If I re-edit the image to look OK onscreen, and print with the profile and color management turned off, the printed image looks OK.
So, why am I confused?
1 In the back of my simplistic and naive mind, I anticipated that in creating a custom printer profile I would only need to edit a photo once, so it looks good on the calibrated screen, and then a custom printer profile will handle the work to print a good looking photo. Different profiles do different translations for different printers/papers. However, judging by the PS work, it appears I need to re-edit a photo for each printer/paper I encounter...just doesn't seem right.
2 In Aperture, I'm confused by the onscreen proofing does not present the same image as what I see in the print preview. I'm selecting the same .icc profile in both locations.
I tried visiting with Spyder support, but am not able to explain myself well enough to help them understand what I'm doing wrong.
Any help is greatly appreciated.

Calibrated the printer several times and created .icc profiles
You have understand that maintaining the colour is done by morphing the colourants, and you have understood that matching the digital graphic display (which is emissive) to the print from the digital graphic printer (which is reflective) presupposes a studio lighting situation that simulates the conditions presupposed in the mathematical illuminant model for media independent matching. Basically, for a display-to-print match you need to calibrate and characterise the display to something like 5000-55000 kelvin. There are all sorts of arguments surrounding this, and you will find your way through them in time, but you now have the gist of the thing.
So far so good, but what of the problem posed by the digital graphic printer? If you are a professional photographer, you are dependent on your printer for contract proofing. Your prints you can pass to clients and to printers, but your display you cannot. So this is critical.
The ICC Specification was published at DRUPA Druck und Papier in Düsseldorf in May 1995 and ColorSync 2 Golden Master is on the WWDC CD for May 1995. Between 1995 and 2000 die reine Lehre said to render your colour patch chart in the raw condition of the colour device.
The problem with this is that in a separation the reflectance of the paper (which is how you get to see the colours of the colourants laid down on top of the paper) and the amount of colourant (solid and combinations of tints) gives you the gamut.
By this argument, you would want to render the colour patch chart with the most colourant, but what if the most colourant produces artifacts? A safer solution is to have primary ink limiting as part of the calibration process prior to rendering of the colour patch chart.
You can see the progression e.g. in the BEST RIP which since 2002 has been owned by EFI Electronics for Imaging. BEST started by allowing access to the raw colour device, with pooling problems and whatnot, but then introduced a primary ink limiting and linearisation.
The next thing you need to know is what colour test chart to send to the colour device, depending on whether the colour device is considered an RGB device or a CMYK device. By convention, if the device is not driven by a PostScript RIP it is considered an RGB device.
The colour patch chart is not tagged, meaning that it is deviceColor and neither CIEBased colour or ICCBased colour. You need to keep your colour patch chart deviceColor or you will have a colour characterisation of a colour managed conversion. Which is not what you want.
If the operating system is colour managed through and through, how do you render a colour test chart without automatically assigning a source ICC profile for the colourant model (Generic RGB Profile for three component, Generic CMYK Profile for four component)?
The convention is that no colour conversion occurs if the source ICC device profile and the destination ICC device profile are identical. So if you are targetting your inkjet in RGB mode, you open an RGB colourant patch chart, set the source ICC profile for the working space to the same as the destination ICC profile for the device, and render as deviceColor.
You then leave the rendered colourant test chart to dry for one hour. If you measure a colourant test chart every ten minutes through the first hour, you may find that the soluble inkjet inks in drying change colour. If you wait, you avoid this cause of error in your characterisation.
As you will mainly want to work with loose photographs, and not with photographs placed in pages, when you produce a contract proof using Absolute Colorimetric rendering from the ICC profile for the printing condition to the ICC profile for your studio printer, here's a tip.
Your eyes, the eyes of your client, and the eyes of the prepress production manager will see the white white of the surrounding unprinted margins of the paper, and will judge the printed area of the paper relative to that.
If, therefore, your untrimmed contract proof and the contract proof from Adobe InDesign or QuarkPress, or a EFI or other proofing RIP, are placed side by side in the viewing box your untrimmed contract proof will work as the visual reference for the media white.
The measured reference for the media white is in the ICC profile for the printing condition, to be precise in the WTPT White Point tag that you can see by doubleclicking the ICC profile in the Apple ColorSync Utility. This is the lightness and tint laid down on proof prints.
You, your client and your chosen printer will get on well if you remember to set up your studio lighting, and trim the blank borders of your proof prints. (Another tip: set your Finder to neutral gray and avoid a clutter of white windows, icons and so forth in the Finder when viewing.)
So far, so good. This leaves the nittygritty of specific ICC profiling packages and specific ICC-enabled applications. As for Aperture, do not apply a gamma correction to your colourant patch chart, or to colour managed printing.
As for Adobe applications, which you say you will be comparing with, you should probably be aware that Adobe InDesign CS3 has problems. When targetting an RGB printing device, the prints are not correctly colour managed, but basically bypass colour management.
There's been a discussion on the Apple ColorSync Users List and on Adobe's fora, see the two threads below.
Hope this helps,
Henrik Holmegaard
technical writer
References:
http://www.adobeforums.com/webx?14@@.59b52c9b/0
http://lists.apple.com/archives/colorsync-users/2007/Nov/msg00143.html

Bridge doesn't allow me to turn on color management

Any idea why Bridge doesn't allow me to edit/turn on color management? When I go to Edit>Creative Suite Color Settings I just get an error. Says I must launch at least one qualifying CS product. As I have Dreamweaver CS5.5 and PS CS5 running I never know what the issue is. Any ideas? Adobe help is useless on this.

If that is the case, Adobe needs to do a better job in how the settings function. For example, instead of just getting an error message with a confusing statement, the message would provide further clarification and also solutions. The message says one needs to have at least one program running to set up color management. It doesn't say one entire color suite. But thanks so much for responding to my questions.
A bit of the problem is that writing a manual and a help file is not that easy at all. But when it comes to complicated applications like PS and combined with other applications it really is a difficult task. I'm not saying Adobe succeeds clearly in this task because it is not easy to find your way in the new help files but with a bit effort you will soon explore there is a lot of information about understanding color in the PS on line manual (use the menu help / Photoshop Help and your browser shows a page from product support. Top right above there is the option to download the PDF manual. And in the provided list on your browser window you see also the option for Creative Suite, click on it and you will see a complete chapter about Color Management.
While I know a bit of this subject I'm certainly no expert. It is a complex matter but the basics are not that difficult and the result of your learning effort will pay it self back
Another issue I have noticed is that Bridge does not do a good job at updating thumbnails. I frequently have to hit F5 to refresh when this should happen automatically. I use a Windows 7 machine and perhaps all of this works better on Macs - I don't know.
That should not be needed on either Mac or Windows. While no knowledge of Windows at all to me it seems related to a cache problem. First point Bridge to the folder that gives you this problem and then choose the menu Tools/ cache / purge cache for folder. See if this gives better results. If so and you have other folders with same problem use the option to purge the entire cache and have a fresh start. You need a bit of time because all thumbs and previews have to rebuild.

Preview application color management

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