Round Trip and Render issues - Color back to FCP

Graded, rendered, send to FCP. Looks good on the timeline, minor issues with some variable speed clips and sound (for some unknown reason) but i had duplicated timelines and was able to gather everything onto one timeline and each clip plays back fine, but i can't really get a good read thru, the timeline after about 5-7 secs will start to hold up. I think maybe its having a problem playing back the rendered files off the internal harddrive and the firewire 800 drives I use for capture scratchs. So I export a self-contained movie file and it won't play without stopping in either quicktime or FCP. I can't figure out what the problem may be or how to fix it. My next call is apple support but i figured maybe one of you esteemed gentleman may be able to see the tree in my forest. Thanks, Steve

Michael Trauffer wrote:
but i figured maybe one of you esteemed gentleman may be able to see the tree in my forest.
I see a lot of trees here, so I'll grab my chainsaw and start swinging away
I appreciate that, as here in south louisiana we keep our chainsaws oiled and ready to roll
Graded, rendered, send to FCP.
I follow you up to this point. I'm assuming you're using XDCAM EX footage?
Yes
Looks good on the timeline, minor issues with some variable speed clips and sound (for some unknown reason)
I should point out here that it's been documented on numerous occasions in this forum that Color doesn't necessarily play well with variable speed clips. The Color User Manual has a section on page 75 that shares some steps that should be performed before sending a sequence to Color. One of those steps is baking a variable speed clip into a quicktime movie.
Gotcha, I actually did that to solve that issue.
but i had duplicated timelines and was able to gather everything onto one timeline and each clip plays back fine,
Sorry, I can see how this can be confusing. What I meant to say that is when i had the weird audio issue (it sounded as if the stereo pair were out of sync with eachother, giving it a wierd audio reverb even though i could not visually identify from any information available on the timeline) I then overwrote those audio files and that fixed it. But all this was on the initial sequence timeline that i had loaded from color after the grading.
but i can't really get a good read thru, the timeline after about 5-7 secs will start to hold up.
Define "read thru". If the sequence is dropping frames, it sounds like a bandwidth issue with your scratch disks, or a hardware setup problem.
Yes dropping frames is exactly what it was doing...I am running a quad-core xeon with 2.8ghz, with 4 daisy-chained firewire 800 drives.
I think maybe its having a problem playing back the rendered files off the internal harddrive and the firewire 800 drives I use for capture scratchs.
How many drives do you have designated as capture scratches?
I have one folder on one of the 800 drives designated for this project. In color I chose a different 'render Directory' on the internal hardrive (i believe it was a default)
What specific drives are you using?
Lacie 500gb drives
If by "internal harddrive" you mean your system drive, this is a big no-no. I can only assume here, but I think you're working with ProRes material at this point. Depending on your specific Mac, the internal drive may not be up to the task. If you consider that that drive is running your entire OS, plus any open application, plus Final Cut Pro, plus accessing the render files, plus any other source material that you may have stored on that drive, you're asking that one drive to do a whole lot of work.
I get that. But should i change Color's render directory to somewhere in the project folder on the Lacie Drive?
So I export a self-contained movie file and it won't play without stopping in either quicktime or FCP.
A self-contained movie file of what?
The sequence.
How are you exporting?
FCP export > quicktime Movie > What are your sequence settings?
Xdcam 720p30 project settings based on xdcam clips, 1280 x 720
Open the file in Quicktime Player, and press Command I to open the Info Window. Make a note of the format information and post that information here.
I wish i could and I will when i get back to the office after dinner.
Chainsaws can get pretty heavy after a while. I'll take a break here and see if I hit anything of value.
I think you did...but confirm for me. Color's render directory, whats a better place for it? And thanks for the quick response it is duly appreciated.

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Nelson Brann wrote:
A brilliant guy (Andrew Balis) told me to send my sequence to Color then send it right back to FCP before I do ANYTHING.
I'm not sure if I'm getting slightly off-topic.
Currently I suggest an additional step. After doing the roundtrip as Andrew suggests - follow up with a full render of the entire sequence and then send THAT back to FCP. I've had Send To fail after rendering that worked on a quick roundtrip - this additional step reveals quirky non-obvious problems.
It also came in useful once when Color crashed after a "real" render and lost the green render bars. Since I had kept that initial sequence in FCP I still had a good timeline referencing the rendered clips.
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I've got a problem since the last pro applications update. Since then my clips got a different look in brightness and contrast in color as in FCP.
If I send a clip from FCP to color, it looks more dark with higher contrast. If I send it back to FCP you can see the made changes, but the brightness is higher and contast lower again. And I mean a huge differnce between the both programs.
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Patrick Inhofer wrote:
That tech note specifically discusses how FCP's assumption about RGB files forces it to handle their gamma differently than "YUV" based file formats.
Relevant bit:
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2. Next select all of the clips after the video clip you just selected by typing "tttt" this changes to the "Select All Tracks Forward Tool". Click on the track after the video track you just linked and it will select all of the tracks thereafter. Hit the "A" button to change back to the selection tool and move all of the selected tracks away from the previous video/audio track.
3. Next type "RR" this will change to the "Ripple" tool. Now click on end of the video track on the previous video clip and type -15 (for negative 15 frames). Then click on the beginning of other video clip to the right that you linked and type +15 (for plus 15 frames).
4. Type "tttt" to change back to the "Select All Tracks Forward Tool" the hit the "A" button to change back to the selection tool and drag all tracks back together again.
5. You may then drag and drop your transition in between both video clips.
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Any ideas why?
Not really, but it has been a continuing problem. You're sure it is the audio that is out of sync, and not the video? (Just checking) There are a lot of complaints, especially with HDV about frame drift.
Best solution is to lift the audio from the previous timeline and paste it into the graded (from COLOR) sequence. Even when a mixed stereo final is part of the workflow, it almost never comes back the same, so most, if not all, users avoid sending and retrieving audio as part of the COLOR roundtrip. In my experience, even if it somehow mysteriously lands back in sync, the pan settings are all slammed over to one side.
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Round Trip and Render issues - Color back to FCP

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