Scopes / Color-Correction Question

When I apply a color-correction effect - RGB Curves for instance - before I make a single adjustment the scopes jump to new values, as if I had made an adjustment. When I click the eyeball to turn the effect off the scopes all go back to their original values.
The Composite Video doesn't change until I actually make an adjustment, but the scopes all register some change - before I make a change.
What is going on here? It seems so basic I must be missing something simple.
Any help would be appreciated - Thank You!
[edit: btw the changes in the scopes are not small or barely noticeable - they're huge and obvious. Thanks again.]

We made tests raw video files from various camcorders: Sony EX1, Panasonic AG-AC160, Panasonic TM900. In all this tests the pixels shift and even more: changes the tones of the video (particularly in the midtones) just when we apply (without change anything) any tool of Color Correction tab. The "All Scopes" show this clearly. The same problem when we use Colorista II or Magic Bullet Looks. For us this video is the proof of the situation, please watch in 720p:
I remember perfectly that when I was talking about this issue, someone replied: "go to a different NLE!", with plenty of irony, of course. But the problem is not me, canoli99, Ann Bens or others who have seen this problem. The problem is in Premiere and somehow we received this confirmation from Steve Hoeg/Adobe "It can be fixed but we cannot commit to any timeframe. Fixing and testing changes can often take months".
Only one detail that could help solve this bug: if we apply any tool of Color Correction tab on a AVCHD [4:2:0/8 bit] in the timeline, the problem occurs and the scopes jumped. BUT if we convert the same AVCHD to Cineform [4:2:2 or 4:4:4, 10 bit], put this new file Cineform in the timeline and then apply the same tool of Color Correction tab, the problem disappears and the scopes don't jumped.

Similar Messages

Color correction questions

I have a few questions about the color correction tools in Premiere CS4.
1. Suppose that the colors in my shot are basically correct, but the blacks have a tint to them. Which is the best color correction filter to use to correct for this?
2. Do any of the color correction filters desaturate secondary colors? I have a shot that would probably look fine if I could just desaturate the yellows.
I know that this can be done in Photoshop.
3. Is there a good technique in Premiere for matching colors between two scenes or cameras? I know Avid's color correction has a specific setting for this.
Thanks in adance!
J. D.

1) tint in black probably means white balance was off a bit ( not matched to your light source).
Can try to correct WB overall and get rid of black tint ( use eye dropper and choose the black area that's supposed to be black and make it black...see what happens to the rest of your image colors )
2) maybe broadcast colors...which has some tendency to imitate "selective color" in photoshop, as you adjust stuff ...
3) no ...except maybe ( again ) broadcast colors ... but probably you have to do by eye or LUT...but basically no
I'm kinda new at this so dont take my word as gospel...someone else may have cool ideas ( they usually do )

Auto Color Correction Question

Once you've used Auto Color Correction (Shft+Cntr+B) and then saved, is there any way you can undo this command to bring a photo back to its original state? [I know ideally you should save the modified version with a different name/number, but I forgot to do this!]

If one has done a Save (and closed the Image File), instead of a Save_As, or Save_As_a_Copy, I know of no way to Undo.
One might be able to "deconstruct" the effects of the Auto Color Filter, by using other Filters/Adjustments, but it will require a lot of hand-work, time and experimentation.
I have a workflow, that keeps this from happening. Where possible, I use Adjustment Layers, so that the underlying Background Layer is not touched. In the cases, where I cannot apply the necessary adjustment/effect in an Adjustment Layer, I Duplicate (Ctrl+J) that Background Layer, and apply the adjustment/effect to that. When done, I always Save the working PSD, with all Layers and Adjustment Layers. Actually, I always do a Save_As, so that my originals are never overwritten, but you acknowledge that you know that part now.
Maybe others will be able to help you get started with the "deconstruction," but I'd look into a Color Balance Adjustment Layer, and work with it for a bit.
Good luck,
Hunt

Color Correction Question...

I'm a new user of Final Cut Pro v.5. I've been given dark, grainy footage, and when I brighten it by increasing the midrange in the 3-way color corrector, the graininess becomes extremely pronounced. Is there any way to reduce or get rid of the graininess?

Hello Donna... welcome to the forum...
Have a look at this:
http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?messageID=1067315&#1067315

Color correcting question

I know this is a popular effect and I tried to search before asking.
Does anyone know how to remove certain colors like make everything black and white except the red and yellow flowers. or to make everything black and white except the people?
I have fcp5.0 studio

http://www.lafcpug.org/tutorials/basicpleasantvilleprint.html

Color correction, muzzle flares and smoke questions

A couple of days ago I directed an action sequence called 'Silent takedown' using Premiere CS5 and After Effects. The goal was to do a very fast paced editing style but still within the realm of 'classic' action films from '90 like Face/Off and Mission Impossible 2. I've got some question regarding visual effects done in After effects. Tell me if you thought they were good or bad. Also the color correction was done in AE and PP. Does the overall movie look good?
Here's a full link again: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O62_hYOmlaY
Thanks for watchin'

Well, aside from it being quite disturbing to have a team of 14 year olds turning everyone to blood soup it's got some great camera work.
Your first mistake might have been thinking there's anything worth copying in mission impossible 2. Sorry, had to be said.
Todd's right. The clouds of blood is comical. Maybe tone that down? Right now it just looks like a string of video copilot tutorials one after another. You need to hide effects, and make them feel seamless.
Ask yourselves what are you trying to showcase. If it's post production, you have to tweak those effects and make them look classy. There are shots where bullet holes are appearing in glass and there's little breakage, and no reaction from the actors. You can't just glue in effects. If the actors don't react, you can't use the shot, or it should be changed so you don't notice. Add a shake etc.
If it's editing, then that has to be solid too.
You've got time shifting all over the place without it being stylistic. For example, the guys who walk up off the top are shown in a wide shot that you re-use for the security cam. They enter, put their masks on, walks softly up to the guards and take them out, but then we are inside and the scarface guy is watching action that happened minutes ago on the monitor. If you're going to jump around in time, you need to find a stylistic way to do that. Why not bring the scarface guy's scenes into the lead up, show the monitor, (drop that long shot at the top) to introduce the guys sneaking up. This introduced tension (will scarface notice???) gives you an idea of who the guards are watching out for and drops that opening super wide of the two kids going up against the wall. That shot doesn't work because when you show them super-wide, you get a feeling for how exposed they are and what a terrible job they're doing of "sneaking" up. But it works as security cam footage...
Another example is when you have one of your agents say "good morning gentlemen. He says something strange to men who are in masks and they give him enough time to put a gun to his head and pull the trigger in spite of the face that they're holding their own guns. Then you have the camera exposure flash cuts to the other agent sneaking up...
If you want to make this effect work, you need to use editing to explain why the second guard didn't reflexively shoot the first agent. have the agent say, "good morning gentleman" and start the action of raising the gun. Then flash cut to the other agent sneaking up, then back the the first agent shooting, then back to the second guard being shot. Then all of a sudden you have a frenetic action scene. Right now the pacing feels slow and unrealistic.
The effects go off the rails a bit at the end. The muzzle flashes don't aim in the right direction, and the particle smoke becomes very obviously added in post. One shot in particular is a dude walking through a black smoke cloud from behind a van. Loose that smoke in the second to jump cuts. And if oyu're going to have a smoky enclosed space. you have to add atmosphere in other shots.
If you're not going to use practical effects for the gunshots, you need to cut away. Having a guy explode with particles and stock footage will always be "funny" without having some squibs on set. I know it makes it harder and more complicated, but you have to have the whole package, or it'll always just look like kids messing around and...
... oop, my render is done.

Color correction novice back with a problem/question.

Hi,
I have been working on color correction for an edit of a live 2 camera shoot concert. Edits are almost all final. I dug into correcting color between the 2 cameras & after some practice got good results.
Tho, I noticed that corrections looked slightly different after rendering them, and again slightly different after exporting to full uncompressed quicktime video.
Saturation levels shifted (less), & some shots showed slightly different color balance. This is a unique shoot because the stage was fully lit in red light & red can be one of the most difficult colors in video (in my experience).
So I eventually started that vicious cycle of correcting not by eye but by anticipating what was needed to get a desired result after rendering & exporting... each time it was lengthy renders & exports before seeing the results.
So I had several versions of the project saved w/ different renderings, etc. All of this is stored on a 250 gig 2nd internal drive which I bought & installed just for editing. All files & edit lists etc were kept there.
So I'm trying to look at different versions after having to put the project aside for a couple of weeks, and every version I open shows me a list of render files that it says it can't find. I've just been choosing to re-render.
(I'm wondering if a routine session of running disk warrior on my drives could have contributed to this?? Thats the only thing I can think of, other than the OSX upgrade to 10.4.4, which also included a quicktime upgrade.)
I'm new at this so I'm trying to figure out if this disappearance of render files is normal? In one version I chose 'search computer for render files' or something to that effect & I watched it go thru my drives one after another & when it got to the 2nd internal drive (where all the render files should be), it spent about 1/10th the time that it spent searching other drives. It really jumped in & out of that drive really quickly.
Its not all the render files that are missing, I looked in the render folder & some have older dates, while a section of them are from tonite when I re-rendered. Then more with the older date.
Anybody have any advice?
Thanks for your help
Duane
G5 tower Mac OS X (10.4.4)

Hi,
I have been working on color correction for an edit of a live 2 camera shoot concert. Edits are almost all final. I dug into correcting color between the 2 cameras & after some practice got good results.
Tho, I noticed that corrections looked slightly different after rendering them, and again slightly different after exporting to full uncompressed quicktime video.
Saturation levels shifted (less), & some shots showed slightly different color balance. This is a unique shoot because the stage was fully lit in red light & red can be one of the most difficult colors in video (in my experience).
So I eventually started that vicious cycle of correcting not by eye but by anticipating what was needed to get a desired result after rendering & exporting... each time it was lengthy renders & exports before seeing the results.
So I had several versions of the project saved w/ different renderings, etc. All of this is stored on a 250 gig 2nd internal drive which I bought & installed just for editing. All files & edit lists etc were kept there.
So I'm trying to look at different versions after having to put the project aside for a couple of weeks, and every version I open shows me a list of render files that it says it can't find. I've just been choosing to re-render.
(I'm wondering if a routine session of running disk warrior on my drives could have contributed to this?? Thats the only thing I can think of, other than the OSX upgrade to 10.4.4, which also included a quicktime upgrade.)
I'm new at this so I'm trying to figure out if this disappearance of render files is normal? In one version I chose 'search computer for render files' or something to that effect & I watched it go thru my drives one after another & when it got to the 2nd internal drive (where all the render files should be), it spent about 1/10th the time that it spent searching other drives. It really jumped in & out of that drive really quickly.
Its not all the render files that are missing, I looked in the render folder & some have older dates, while a section of them are from tonite when I re-rendered. Then more with the older date.
Anybody have any advice?
Thanks for your help
Duane
G5 tower Mac OS X (10.4.4)

Color Correcting in Final Cut general question

I am finding I'm at the end of a long process with my feature film and I'm preparing to output and yet again I've run up against a wall of my ignorance...
1. It's a dv film I don't want to just output the film and then apply a color correct as I'm afraid of a lot of clipping...so I'm doing the individual clips through the film and I'm finding a lot of them I have to limit the rgb to 90 some go as low as 88, some are just fine at 100 or 97...it was shot on the dvx100 and I looked up the dvx and see it is geared for superwhite...but I want to prepare my film for broadcast...I wonder though if this is why I'm getting a lot that I have to limit the rgb to 90??? I wouldn't have known to tell the DP please don't use the superwhite settings.
So am I doing this right?
After I output the whole thing, do I color correct the quicktime again when I letterbox it (it's 720x480 to be letterboxed to 1:85:1) before encoding it for the mpeg2? Or if I'm doing it this way is it not necessary?
Thank you

Also is it stupid to do this when I already went through the film and applied color correction as what is bothering me is a lot of the color correct with the range check shows that little arrow that shows it's on the edge...those are the clips I'm bringing down to code because a lot of them the rgb is too hot...for just preparing a professional dv is it necessary to do what I'm doing?
I really want to prepare it once and not do different color corrects again so if what I'm doing above is correct for broadcast quality though it's going to look more muted on a dvd but maybe that's my confusion as many of the bright hilights giving it that look are on the verge or are clipped.

Color Correction Workflow Question

If I am color correcting on the "original clip" - and then pulling that color corrected "original clip" into its own "clip sequence" that I then pull into a "master sequence", along with all the other "clip sequences" that make up my edit, and I am trimming those "clip sequences" to get just the snippet I need...
Is that creating a longer rendering time than if I...
Do not color correct on the actual "original clip" - still put the "original clip" into its own "clip sequence" - trim and resize that "clip sequence" to just the snippet I need, and then do the color correcting on that "clip sequence" instead of the "original clip" itself?
I'm hoping there is no descernable difference in the approach, but I thought I'd throw it out there.
Thanks.

Good enough for me.
BTW Jim the workflow set-up you held my hand through (http://forums.adobe.com/message/5522489#5522489) is what I'm utilizing here - so far it has truly changed the way I approach everything for the better.

Question about moving a project from FCP to Premiere to do color correcting/sound finalizing.

My friend and i have been editing a film on FCP express. I've been learning more about editing and color correcting recently and have been teaching myself on Adobe Premiere. I offered to color correct the film on Premiere on my system. I'm curious what the best way to do this would be. is it possible to take the timeline from FCB with the raw data and somehow open that in CS? Or should he export the pre corrected final cut without correcting as a certain type of file, then I work on that, then export that as the final cut?

If FCP express has XML export, then you can export the project and then import the XML into Premiere Pro. It will give you the basics of the timeline and basic transforms for each clip (position, scale, rotation). However, not everything comes across - titles and 3rd party effects will not come across.
Given that, another option is to render out the entire movie and then grade it in Premiere Pro. But you lose a lot of control if you go that way.
The third option is to import into Premiere Pro and rebuild the bits you might be missing from FCP and then you have both the control and options.
Hope this helps,
Dennis

Premiere CC scopes in color correction

My scopes work correctly with the first clip in my timeline. After that, they don't respond. I have no idea what the problem is. I am working on CC. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks

If Premiere is not working properly restart computer, hold down shift + alt while opening Premiere until welcome screen.
If this does not help,
You need to be more specific.
Which CC, which scope, which effect etc.

Color correction

there was a thread on cs5 about this that interested me, so I started new thing here cause Im using cs3..
Shooternz, your help in the cs5 thread was great...and this is what I did....in my particular circumstances...
( I have to say that this is really the first time I'm sorta getting serious about CC and using the scopes etc...to try to learn this better )
I know the basics and the monitor stuff and the way people shoot properly exposed grayscale, color etc on set for calibration ( using film mostly in my experience, but done with digital too as I've seen )...
Sooo, here's the thing... I shot this clip as a test to see how long the music had to be to get a mssg across later on ( an insert shot that I will shoot on the day in the right location etc )... so this was a timing test sorta....didnt care about the lighting.
However, since I shot it I've tried to make it as good as I can ( why not ? )
I had a flourescent unit ( drop down ceiling 32K flourescents ) above...but it read about 36k on color meter and needed color correction at that ( LB and CC correction ..know what I mean ? )...so OK...who cares, its a test and timing only sooooo I dont put gels on the light and just shoot.
Soooo, I DID IN FACT put a grayscale down to fix it later if possible....even though it wasn't lit right....
This is what it looks like basically...
pretty terrible...very yellow and compressed tones etc...not good...
Soo, following your suggestions in thread in cs5, using waveform and vectorgraph, I come up with this instead..
WAYY BETTER ! ( thank you ! )....but...not perfect...thats OK, I didnt light it right...but better ....
Now, though, when I paste attributes of this to the clip in question I end up with this pixelation or "splotchy " stuff..as shown here
Now, my experience using psd tells me that if you try to correct too much, there's a sorta " limit" to what you can do, and things start just plain getting screwed up..."splotchy" like this... but if I had some way to just pick on the "yellow" gamma or something maybe I could get rid of it ....OR do a color replacement ( change ??? )... like pick out that particular color and change it to something closer to the white??? Have you ever dealt with this type thing ??? I know I started out all wrong to begin with but am wondering what you think ??
Thanks !
Rod
ps...this was a dumb test so please dont , you know, put much into this...I know I shot it all screwed up to begin with..

Hey Rod
Your CC looks fine and if the intention was to correct the col temp and exposure issue..you did fine. I see you have a full scale of tones in the greys.
Obviously you should start off with a correct exposure and that doesn ot necessarily mean a "technically correct" exposure.
You do not have to shoot and CC / grade to display the full range from Balck to white.
Its important to rember that the CC and grade (and the composition) are part of "the story" At times you will want crushed blacks and other times you may want a high key look or compressed tones in the mid. Then afetr the "tones" you think about what color tells the story.
Always..... Levels before Color correction!
BTW - the eye rules but ensure technically that the scopes confirm what you think you see.
Heres someof my images reflecting different CC for a "fit with the story"
Flat , clean,compressed mid tones, clinical ( a green screen BTW)
Dark , compressed toward blacks with detail in mids, juicy highlightsdramatic ( slo mo)
Full tonal range,hi color, "summer on xmas day"
full range color and tone, texture "yummy"
Clean and clinical mid ranges with slight color de-saturation of BG
FG grade to match bg (key) and fit time of day look.
Keep in mind...the above shots started in the photography and the cc / grade is enhancement.
Good luck mate.

Color Correcting In CC - Making Whites Actually White

Okay so my main question is,
Are there any functions or plugins where I can look at the clip, and then click on a spot that I know should be white (But its not because the camera wasn't white balanced 100%), and have After effects automatically adjust so it is white.
Kind of like how you set white balance on a camera, where you hold up a white card or other completely white object, click the white balance, and the camera automatically adjust to make it white.
Except I want to be able to just click on a point in the footage and have it adjust everything.
If this is not an option, then are there any good tips for white balancing the footage?
IE: I film a subject against a white wall, the camera wasn't white balanced so the background appears to be light beige. I want to click the background in AE and have it color correct and make it white.
Thanks

Finding perfect white is always a challenge and it may foul up other things in your shot because white walls are reflective and if someone is wearing a blue shirt against a white wall, white may not be white. Setting white may get you in the ball park, but it is usually only the first step in color grading. You usually want to push highlights to one hue and shadows to another.
The procedure and the tools used to color grade a shot depend entirely on the shot. For most of my work Colorists II is my preferred tool. Some shots require more than one instance of colorist to get to where I want to go. Color finesse is also good, but for some work, and this depends entirely on the shot, Auto Color is all that I need. No matter what technique you use to grade your shots you need some kind of scope or histogram that you understand so you can know where you are pushing the levels in the shot. I'm always checking areas of a shot with the Info Panel to make sure I know what I've done to the color values. Most of all, good color grading takes time to learn and a very thorough knowledge of color.

Color Correction Monitor

I know this question has come up before, but after reading some posts I thought I'd see if anyone had any feedback on this monitor.
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/469728-REG/JVCDT_V24L1DU_DTV24L1DU_24_MultiFormat.html
It's the JVC DT-V24L1DU 24" Multi-Format LCD Monitor with 1080p Native Resolution and HD-SDI.
I've got a Kona LHe card with HD-SDI I/O.
Could I do critical color correction with that setup? I'm not at the stage where my color correction is critical yet, but I don't want to be re-buying anything if I don't have to.
Any suggestions?
Lawrence

This isn't an area of color correction per-say but involves general engineering of all the different video signals and how to mix them up and travel back and forth and what not.
Generally speaking, HD video is in a completely different color space than Analog/Digital video. itu-709 vs. itu-601. How are those conversions handled? Is the device you're using accurate? It's just one of the many bains of video engineers that care.
I've heard but not been able to confirm that some JVC hdv cams are in the itu-601 spec which if true would totally throw off how FCP handles color space conversion and the nearest I can tell that it does this is simply through frame size.
How are you monitoring currently? Aside from this monitor, what interface is spitting that video out of your computer? Currently at my house, I use an Aja Kona LHe that spits out component analog to my PVM-14M4U. When I am working with itu-709 video, is that on-the-fly video downconversion completely accurate? Without external scopes I couldn't tell you but I'm relying on the the trustworthiness and reputation of Aja products. I've installed and use many of their products in various facilities and I know them to be of excellent reputation.
As far as your colors being far off, you tell me? Who's your viewing audience, what sort of display are they watching, how's that signal getting there?
I'm hoping some of the more learned folks here can correct or corroborate any of the info I've related this morning.
Good luck, the water gets deeper and much colder very quickly the more you know.

Color correct 3 camera angles

this might be a stupid question. i know how to open the color correction window and bring up the wfm/vts/rgb parade and then scope/eyeball color correct with 3 way cc. is there some kind of automated way fcp5 in multiclip can match camera angles? i saw an eyedropper. can you sample white and black and match this way? thx in advance

See III-471 of your user manual. This is accessible from the "Help" menu. I think that's as automated as it gets.
JC

Scopes / Color-Correction Question

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