System Overload ...i know ..I'm not the 1st ...

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Replies : 10 - Pages : 1 - Last Post : Aug 10, 2009 12:04 PM by: Pancenter
4feet4
Posts: 17
From: Pasadena
Registered: Mar 12, 2009
System Overload ...i know ..I'm not the 1st ...
Posted: Aug 9, 2009 7:52 PM
Any quick tips on what to do? My project is small - while monitoring my CPU usage it never goes above 30 while running the project - I've got 2.78 GB of free disk space - 4Gig Ram - I dont use my IMAC OSX 10.5.5 for anything but Logic? Hoping to get around this CONSTANT issue - thanks for your help.
Imac Mac OS X (10.5.5)
Larry Mal
Posts: 654
From: Saint Louis, Missouri
Registered: Sep 27, 2007
Re: System Overload ...i know ..I'm not the 1st ...
Posted: Aug 9, 2009 9:48 PM in response to: 4feet4
Well, if you are saying you have only 2.78 GB's of space on your hard drive, then you'll want to have more. You should leave about 10-15% of your drive free.
dual 2.8GHz Mac Pro, Macbook Pro 2.16 GHz Mac OS X (10.5.6) 2 GB RAM
4feet4
Posts: 17
From: Pasadena
Registered: Mar 12, 2009
Re: System Overload ...i know ..I'm not the 1st ...
Posted: Aug 9, 2009 10:51 PM in response to: Larry Mal
I'm running LP8 - I have an IMAC OSX 10.5.5 - 2.4 processor - 4 GB RAM - M-Audio Fast Track Pro interface (USB direct to MAC) - I do NOT have an external hard drive ( sounds like I should ? - although I was told by others my system would be sufficient) - I use ALL instruments/track options ( midi etc) and will need to in the future - I want to be able to run a full music project 10-15 tracks. So far I'm running 4-5 tracks -(1) midi - the rest are audio with little to no effects ( in one project I'm using an LP8 template but deleted most of the tracks to cut down on the load ). Don't know if I can freeze these tracks-I'm new to this - thats why I'm looking for options ........ i was also using a 3rd party software in the project - Steinberg Groove Agent 3 (drums) but it was giving me the same error ..even when it was the ONLY track in the project....(its not fully compatible) - however I was finally able to create a full drum track with GA3 - play the midi data back - and record it to an audio track - therefore deleting the midi data I was having issues with and keeping the drums.... hope this helps?
Imac Mac OS X (10.5.5)
4feet4
Posts: 17
From: Pasadena
Registered: Mar 12, 2009
Re: System Overload ...i know ..I'm not the 1st ...
Posted: Aug 10, 2009 6:39 AM in response to: 4feet4
Updated
Imac Mac OS X (10.5.5) 2.4 Processor, 4 GB RAM, M-Audio Fast Track Pro Interface, No External HD
Larry Mal
Posts: 654
From: Saint Louis, Missouri
Registered: Sep 27, 2007
Re: System Overload ...i know ..I'm not the 1st ...
Posted: Aug 10, 2009 7:54 AM in response to: 4feet4
Perfect. Well here are some suggestions:
1) Logic 7, 8 and 9 all have a "freeze" function. Logic 9 has a new "bounce in place" function which I haven't used yet. These will make temporary audio files of your MIDI instruments so that you are able to play them as finished audio for the most part and free up CPU power. ( I haven't yet used "bounce in place", I just got Logic 9.) This will help with MIDI instruments quite a bit, and you can still go back and change them by un-freezing... I guess "thawing" would be the proper term.
2) The reason I was asking about your audio interface is because I was wondering what you had available. You very definitely want to record to a non-system (on that Logic nor your operating system are on) drive. Firewire is much superior to USB, which is why I'm glad to hear you are using USB as your audio in. By using Firewire in and Firewire out, on an iMac, you would be halving the bandwidth. In your case you are not.
You will add very much stability to your Logic work by adding an external Firewire drive and recording audio to it, and working on Logic projects there! If you have the money, I'd go with Firewire 800, which is frankly overkill, but why not. Firewire 400 drives will work fine for you. Add one and many of the overload messages will disappear, simply because right now you are pulling information from (in the form of calculating what the virtual instruments and Logic are doing) and writing information to (in the form of writing what those instruments and Logic are resulting in) to the same disk.
Try these two things and get back to us. I think you'll be very happy with the results.
It's also important to pay attention to your buffer size. When it is not important for you to play with it in real time, you want to make it be 1024. Otherwise as low as possible. So when you are recording audio to a MIDI drum track, you'd want it to be very low so you can play along accurately. When you have all that done, and are editing MIDI only, then put the buffer higher. When mixing, put it higher.
Let me know how this works, good luck, L
dual 2.8GHz Mac Pro, Macbook Pro 2.16 GHz Mac OS X (10.5.6) 2 GB RAM
4feet4
Posts: 17
From: Pasadena
Registered: Mar 12, 2009
Re: System Overload ...i know ..I'm not the 1st ...
Posted: Aug 10, 2009 9:10 AM in response to: Larry Mal
Ok Great - Thanks - makes sense - I was using a Lacie with Protools an my PC ( it recently crashed) - I was under the impression I would have enough processing power with out it on the MAC.
Looks like I can pick one up for just a little over $100 ( I'm rolling in that kind of cash) ... please clarify though - you stated: "Firewire is much superior to USB, which is why I'm glad to hear you are using USB as your audio in. By using Firewire in and Firewire out, on an iMac, you would be halving the bandwidth. In your case you are not" ....are you GLAD to hear I am using USB as in - We may have found the problem .... go external to free up processing ? Please confirm.
Thanks again
Imac Mac OS X (10.5.5) 2.4 Processor, 4 GB RAM, M-Audio Fast Track Pro Interface, No External HD
CCTM
Posts: 249
Registered: Mar 11, 2007
Re: System Overload ...i know ..I'm not the 1st ...
Posted: Aug 10, 2009 9:28 AM in response to: 4feet4
4feet4 wrote:
Ok Great - Thanks - makes sense - I was using a Lacie with Protools an my PC ( it recently crashed) - I was under the impression I would have enough processing power with out it on the MAC.
As stated in an earlier reply, if you only have 2 or 3 gigs of free space on your Mac hard drive, processing power is NOT the problem. Your boot disc is way too full. You should have at least 20-30GB free.
Running a second drive for the audio side will, of course, help, but you MUST clear out the main hard drive (or fit a larger one) before you run into even more serious problems.
HTH
CCT
Larry Mal
Posts: 654
From: Saint Louis, Missouri
Registered: Sep 27, 2007
Re: System Overload ...i know ..I'm not the 1st ...
Posted: Aug 10, 2009 9:37 AM in response to: 4feet4
Well, you have enough processing power, that isn't the issue. All the processing power in the world won't matter if you have 64 megabytes of RAM, there will be a bottleneck. Another bottleneck is with data transference. Like I said, when using a single drive to transfer date from as well as to- which is what you are doing when you are using Logic, running within the scope of the operating system, and hosting virtual instruments, all of which is writing the resulting audio information to the same drive, at the same time, then you are creating another problem. But you don't have to do that, by sending the audio written to another drive other than the one the audio is being generated from.
In other words, your processing power is both faster than and irrelevant to the physical limitations of the hard drive itself.
Another bottleneck would be if you were recording tracks on a Firewire in, and sending that to and external Firewire drive out. This is one of the limitations of the iMac, there is no way to add what is called another bus, which is simply another pipeline for data transference. You can get around that with a Mac Pro, in which you add another internal hard drive, which connects directly to the motherboard, and has its own bus. Or by adding another Firewire PCIe card, which will add another Firewire bus, again, with its own data transference. On an iMac, you have one Firewire bus, and one USB bus.
Clear? You can imagine these as pipes of water. The more pipes you have leading to and from a location the faster it will go.
USB, in your case, is a dedicated pipeline in. Nothing (well, your mouse, maybe a flash drive) is using that pipeline. Your Firewire is a pipeline out, in this case- you could reverse this, it doesn't matter*. If you use Firewire in and out, then you are sending water flowing in both directions in the same pipe. It will work, but not as well. By adding a dedicated bus, you would be adding another pipe to flow in one way, while the original flowed the other way. No impedances.
I don't see why you can't use the Lacie drive you already have, though. It's quite likely your crash wasn't due to it. No need to buy another drive, if it's Firewire, anyway. Just give it a shot- this isn't a cure all, but just good audio practice. Let me know how it pans out. Good luck, L
*Firewire is better than USB in all situations. But you seem to be going a track or two of USB audio in, so I'd use USB for that. For light use it's fine. Then you can use your superior Firewire bus to write the audio to the external Firewire drive.
dual 2.8GHz Mac Pro, Macbook Pro 2.16 GHz Mac OS X (10.5.6) 2 GB RAM
4feet4
Posts: 17
From: Pasadena
Registered: Mar 12, 2009
Re: System Overload ...i know ..I'm not the 1st ...
Posted: Aug 10, 2009 11:12 AM in response to: Larry Mal
L - Thanks for laying that out in simple terms - learning a ton and loving it ( when things work) - I will pick up another Lacie - my old Lacie for my PC crashed - I'm better off starting from scratch ( I'm still trying to retrive some data of the old one) ... I'll let you know how it works. I would have got an external drive outright but the Logic Certified guys at Apple told me I would not need one - sounds like this is the big problem. I'll use the freeze method when needed also....... maybe I'll have better luck with Groove Agent 3 with the external drive.
Much appreciated-
(TBD)
Imac Mac OS X (10.5.5) 2.4 Processor, 4 GB RAM, M-Audio Fast Track Pro Interface, No External HD
Larry Mal
Posts: 654
From: Saint Louis, Missouri
Registered: Sep 27, 2007
Re: System Overload ...i know ..I'm not the 1st ...
Posted: Aug 10, 2009 11:39 AM in response to: 4feet4
And free up some room on that system drive.
dual 2.8GHz Mac Pro, Macbook Pro 2.16 GHz Mac OS X (10.5.6) 2 GB RAM
Pancenter
Posts: 3,306
From: Southwest U.S.
Registered: Apr 22, 2007
Re: System Overload ...i know ..I'm not the 1st ...
Posted: Aug 10, 2009 12:04 PM in response to: 4feet4
4feet4 wrote:
L - Thanks for laying that out in simple terms - learning a ton and loving it ( when things work) - I will pick up another Lacie - my old Lacie for my PC crashed - I'm better off starting from scratch ( I'm still trying to retrive some data of the old one) ... I'll let you know how it works. I would have got an external drive outright but the Logic Certified guys at Apple told me I would not need one - sounds like this is the big problem. I'll use the freeze method when needed also....... maybe I'll have better luck with Groove Agent 3 with the external drive.
Groove Agent 3 loads samples into memory so I doubt if your luck will change.
The -first- thing I would do is clear some space on your hard drive, my feeling is that OSX is writing swap files and the drive head is working overtime to try and find free space to write. That in itself could cause an overload.
Free drive space now or expect more problems than you're currently experiencing.
pancenter-
Power Mac G5 1.8GHz Dual, 4GB RAM Mac OS X (10.5.5) RME Audio - MOTU MIDI, Mac (Logic 8.02), Intel/XP-Pro Quad Core PC

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System Overload ...i know ..I'm not the 1st ...

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