Third Party Routers & Airport

I'm a noob. I just got an airport express for christmas (i love it). I would like to put it in my room (in client mode), and have another cheap router broadcasting the ethernet signal to it to repeat (WDS). Now, I know that apple says this can't be done but I read all over the internet that it can. All I need to do is change the ip adress and a few settings. My problem is that all of the threads i've read are old, and I need to know of a new compatable third party router that I can buy for cheap and I need to know if it works for sure.

I disagree with Don's assertion. Certainly that is the first time that I have seen a post claiming that there is 100 devices compatible with Apple's WDS.
If you are going to search Google for devices, use http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&q=WDS%2BRouters+%2BMac%2BCompatible&btnG=Search instead of Don's link. It combines search items instead of making them optional. It also greatly reduces the number of hits.
The devices known to be compatible with Apple's WDS are:
AirPort Extreme base station (AEBS)
AirPort Express
Linksys WRT54G or WRT54GS (not latest versions v5)
Belkin F5D7230-4 and F5D7231
one specific model from SMC (don't know the model number)
one specific model from Buffalo (don't know the model number)
BT Voyager 2100

Similar Messages

Airport Extreme/Express vs. third-party routers

Do the common glitches in network connectivity with Leopard occur almost solely with third-party routers, or is it fairly commonly spreads between them and Extreme/Express users? Just curious.

In my line of work I setup various brands of wireless routers on a monthly basis.
I have not experience any network connectivity issues with any macs running leoapard. However there are on 3 models of router I have used since leoaprd came out.
The linksys wrt54G.
The Netgear D834
Apple Basestations.

SPI firewalls on third party routers may cause incorrect behavior

Disclaimer: Apple does not necessarily endorse any suggestions, solutions, or third-party software products that may be mentioned in the topic below. Apple encourages you to first seek a solution at Apple Support. The following links are provided as is, with no guarantee of the effectiveness or reliability of the information. Apple does not guarantee that these links will be maintained or functional at any given time. Use the information below at your own discretion.
Some users have reported that image queries to sites such as Google Image Search, Google Maps and Bing do not display results in Snow Leopard. This is because of overaggressive "SYN Flood" protection in the firewalls of some third party routers.
When image results are to be displayed, Safari and Firefox make multiple simultaneous connections to the host to retrieve them. This is usually faster than downloading one and moving on to the next and on and on.
Safari in Mac OS X Snow Leopard may make as many as sixteen simultaneous connections to the Google image server's HTTP port within 0.0043 second to retrieve the data; in Mac OS X Leopard it may be as few as eight.
Some consumer-level SPI firewalls misinterpret the attempt to open that many simultaneous connections to one server as a "SYN flood" and block the traffic. Not good, especially when the connections are being made from your machine to an outside host, so the firewall is effectively blocking you from perpetrating what it thinks is a SYN flood.
Some Flickr users have experienced a similar issue.
If your router allows configuration of its SPI firewall, you may be able to solve this problem if it has a setting labeled something like:
Maximum incomplete TCP/UDP sessions number from same host
On those routers, this setting is often set to a default of "10"; simply increasing this value to a much higher value - many have had good luck with "20" - will allow accesses to work as desired and will also allow some room for possible future expansion in the number of simultaneous queries made.
If your router does not offer such a setting, there's no solution other than to disable the firewall.
Note that any operating system - Linux, Solaris, even perhaps Windows 7 - could trigger the same problem. You can even generate the same issue in Windows XP by applying "speed tweaks" such as this.
(Some explanation from Microsoft is available as well.)
In short, it's a bad assumption made on the part of the SPI firewall's designers, not by Apple.
This is the 1st version of this tip. It was submitted on April 20, 2010 by William Kucharski.
Do you want to provide feedback on this User Contributed Tip or contribute your own? If you have achieved Level 2 status, visit the User Tips Library Contributions forum for more information.

Odd,
What tip ?
I presume this is a left over from the Previous discussion thread and a Topic that is now a User Tip.
9:44 PM Thursday; April 28, 2011
 G4/1GhzDual MDD (Leopard 10.5.8)
 MacBookPro 2Gb( 10.6.7)
, Mac OS X (10.6.7),
"Limit the Logs to the Bits above Binary Images."  No, Seriously

Third party routers that need no firmware update

What are the best third party WiFi routers with LAN ethernet ports that need no firmware update to work with 10.4.8 and Windows XP?

Actually the extra ethernet ports is paramount.
Otherwise you don't know who is being secure to
whom. You end up having two routers to setup for
configuration of security. Simplicity is
important, since I want to be able to help set it up
for the friend, and forget it.
?? That doesn't make any sense - I think you're missing something fundemental here. The extra ethernet ports are on the LAN side of the secure connection. The firewall in the router isolates the internal, LAN network (wireless + ethernet) from the external WAN (aka the big bad internet). Whether or not you have a switch attached to one of the LAN ports makes no difference, security-wise - you are in control of the devices connected to the LAN side of the router. WEP/WPA/WPA2 security controls who is able to connect to the wireless LAN.
From a security standpoint, there is ABSOLUTELY no difference between buying a router with eight lan ports and buying a router with four lan ports plus plugging in a five-port switch to one of the lan ports. It's exactly the same thing.
What you don't control is the WAN side of things - the internet itself. You certainly wouldn't want to connect the switch to the WAN port on the router, at least not unless you wanted to run, say, a web server that is exposed to the internet itself. This wouldn't be a good idea in any case - there are better ways to set this up as well (either by setting up a DMZ, or by setting up port forwards)
There is absolutely no reason why you would want or need two routers for this setup - this is only an issue for extremely large networks.
The WRT54G has 1 WAN port and four LAN ports. You can have four hardwired devices (computers, printers, switches, etc) on these LAN ports - they are protected from the internet by the firewall in the router. You can also have any number of wireless devices on this same router; these, as well, are on the LAN side of the router, and are therefore protected.
Adding a switch to the LAN side of the router has absolutely no impact on security. No additional routers would be required.

Airport vs third party Routers

Is there a true advantage of using a Airport router vs. say Net gear Router? If so why??
Thank you Wendy99

Is there a true advantage of using a Airport router vs. say Net gear Router?
I guess it depends on what features that you need or special requirements that you may have. If one router has the features that you need...and another doesn't....then your choice is pretty much already made.
As far as wireless signals, the broadcast power of wireless routers is limited by law, and everyone is running their routers full blast, so in that regard, there really won't be much difference....performance wise....from brand to brand.
It is a good idea to keep all of your routers from the same manufacturer since they will be compatible for other purposes like "extending" the network for more coverage. Trying to "mix" routers from different manufacturers is always a challenge.
If you already have a Mac or several Macs, it will be easier to set up and configure an Apple router than say a Cisco or Netgear product. If you are used to working with PCs, you will probably be comfortable setting up a router from virtually any manufacturer.

Time Capsule/Third Party Router/Airport Express/Printer/MacBook/27 in. iMac

I could really use some help.
I have a Gigaset router hooked up to my broadband connection. That is connected to my Time Capsule via an ethernet cable. I use the wireless off the Time Capsule for both my MacBook and my 27 in iMac (which is located in another room), that is hooked up to my HP LaserJet printer. I have an AirPort express that I want to have in my iMac room so that I can print wirelessly from my MacBook and eventually from my iPhone (but I don't need to figure that out yet). I can not seem to get my Airport Express to connect to my Time Capsule. Thanks for your help!

Most likely not, as very few non-AirPort routers are WDS-compatible with the AirPorts.

Anyone else having issues with third party routers...

Last week I started having issues with my Asus RT-N66U where certain wireless devices e.g. PS3, Xbox 360, Laptop, etc. have issues connecting to the internet (the PS3 reporting a DNS issue) even after I replaced it with a second rt-n66u.
I then tried using the HH3 I got with BT and have none of these problems.
Back on the Asus I tried a manual DNS (BTs 62.6.40.178 and 62.6.40.162) but these are having issues as well although strangely it will work fine if I use it purely as a wireless access point via the HH3 (With HH3's internal wifi disabled), right now I'm testing it again with Google's DNS but I want to know, is anyone else having any issues?

Is your firmware up to date? http://support.asus.com/Download.aspx?SLanguage=en&m=RT-N66U+%28VER.B1%29&os=8

Re: SPI firewalls on third party routers may cause incorrect behavior

This tip is ready for publication.

Odd,
What tip ?
I presume this is a left over from the Previous discussion thread and a Topic that is now a User Tip.
9:44 PM Thursday; April 28, 2011
 G4/1GhzDual MDD (Leopard 10.5.8)
 MacBookPro 2Gb( 10.6.7)
, Mac OS X (10.6.7),
"Limit the Logs to the Bits above Binary Images."  No, Seriously

Airport with third party wireless router?

Will Airport Extreme units play well with third party routers? I have Verizon FIOS and would like to use my Airport Extreme base station and Airport Express unit on my home network. I have successfully set up Airport Express in my office as a WDS. Can Airport Extreme base station be set up as part of a WDS?
Thanks for any insights.

Will Airport Extreme units play well with third party routers?
No industry-wide standard exists for WDS, so it is impossible to predict how Apple's implementation of it (or anyone else's for that matter) will interface with other equipment.
Wikipedia has a short but fairly comprehensive list of third party equipment that allegedly support WDS. Missing from the list is a Linksys access point, which I nonetheless successfully configured as a WDS remote station. They call it "repeater mode".
Yes Verizon FiOS is absent.

How to extend a wifi network of third party router with TC 4th generation?

After searching the communities for a while, I did not find a definitive answer on the following question:
- I recently bought a 4th generation Time Capsule 2TB (MD0322/A), that I also want to use as an extension for our existing wifi network.
- This wifi network is maintained by a Sitecom Wireless 300N XR Gigabit Router. Router is set to work over 2.4 GHz (B+G+N) because of several non-N-wifi devices in the network. The channel in use is currently 11.
- This router provides so called WDS functionality, i.e. the ability for other wifi access points to act as a seamless extension of the basic wifi network (using the same SSID).
- The security settings in the router are WPA2 Mixed, with a password in plain ASCII.
- There seems to be no way to set different security levels for WDS-connections versus normal AP (access point) connections. If WDS is enabled, the security settings of the AP-mode are extended to the WDS connection.
I have set the Sitecom router to enable WDS, and added the MAC-address of the TC in the configuration of this router.
When configuring the Time Capsule, with Airport Utility 5.5.3, I can select the option to use TC to extend an existing network, and I can select the network of choice using the WPA personal or WPA/WPA personal security. However, the TC does not succeed in extending the network, and reports this back. If I manually configure the TC and select the network of choice, Airport Utility reports back that the selected network cannot be extended.
I have read several times in other posts that Time Capsule can only connect to third party routers via WDS using WEP-authentication, but these posts were quite old. I was wondering if this is still the case, or that Apple has updated this functionality in newer versions of TC, and thus there could exist a trick to connect to a WDS using WPA.
I really would appreciate suggestions
Bram Bos

gilles13 wrote:
I have a mac and pc (win7) both are connected thru a network with wifi and allready two access pt.
Airport can not be used to extend a WiFi created by a non-Apple box.
You need to turn off the radio in the router (shut down the existing WiFi). Purchase TWO Airport Express units. Connect one to the router with an Ethernet cable. Configure that one as your primary WiFi network and then use the second Express as the extender.
You need to locate the second Express where it receives a decent WiFi signal. Too far away and it has nothing to extend. Too close and it doesn't buy you anything. Before you plug in the second Express, check to see where the primary WiFi disappears completely. My personal WAG is that you want to locate the second Express 2/3 the distance to that point.
If you use Airport Utility to configure the units, it's a snap. In fact, if you configure the primary first and the extender second, AU will default to exactly the settings that you want.
By the way, I refereed to the Express because it's less expensive than the Extreme and you didn't indicate any need for the Extreme features.

Airport Extreme and third party wireless routers

I have a dual-band Airport Extreme that works well with all of my newer Macs. I have older laptops, however, with PCMCIA wireless cards that can't do WPA2-Personal security, only WEP. My only solution has been to set up a Guest network with no security. Is it possible to connect a third-party wireless router to the Airport Extreme that offers WEP security?

Are you trying to setup the Belkin router to use the same wireless network name as the AirPort Extreme network?
That would require that that the Belkin's network use the same security.
If this is the case, try setting up the Belkin with a different wireless network name. Unless the Belkin is really limited in features, you should be able to choose the type of wireless security to be used on this Belkin network.
If you can do this, "point" your WEP device at the wireless network that the Belkin is producing and the signal will bridge when it reaches the AirPort Extreme.
Regading your question about connecting a router to the ethernet port on a computer that is already setup for Internet Sharing...this is not likely to work. I very much doubt that you would be able to get an Internet connection with this type of setup.
Message was edited by: Bob Timmons

Third Party base stations for airport express

Hi, I recently bought an AX, my question was answered earlier so I guess my doubt now is which third party products could act as base stations which can be recognized by the AX, which Linksys products (not too expensive) would you recommend? I thank you in advance for your attention.
John

An Airport Express can act as a client (printing and AirTunes) with ANY wifi-certified 802.11b/g wireless router.
In terms of using an Airport Express to extend an existing wireless network, then I wouldn't recommend ANY third party router, I would use an Airport Extreme Base Station or another Airport Express.
It has been shown to work with
- a Linksys WRT54G or WRT54GS (not latest versions v5)
- a Belkin F5D7230-4 and F5D7231
- one specific model from SMC
- one specific model from Buffalo
- BT Voyager 2100
For wireless routers not on this short list - not possible.
In particular, it will not work with any WiFi routers from D-Link or Netgear.
http://www.dd-wrt.com/wiki/index.php?title=WDSLinked_routernetwork
iFelix

Configuration of AirPort Extreme Using Third Party LAN Ethernet Adapter?

Hello;
I am trying to set up my own wireless connection, not without great consternation. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Here is my current situation:
Subscribed to DSL service - installation went well, and it works fine on two other computers (that are not wireless). Installed same in computer that will use airport extreme, and it shows a connection, but won't load the browser pages.
Airport Extreme Base Station is working, software installed, etc., but computer doesn't offer airport as a connection choice in system preferences, internet connect, Airport set-up assistant, etc. (because there's no airport card installed????). Consequently, I can't finish w/airport set-up assistant.
I'm using a third party LAN ethernet wireless adapter since I was told airport cards for my G-4 are no longer made. Adapter and software installed, and shown to be working.
What am I missing?
Thanks
KAS
PowerMac G-4 Mac OS X (10.3.9)
PowerMac G-4 Mac OS X (10.3.9)

Hello Duane
Thank you for your warm welcome and quick response. I will try the AirPort Admin Utility. Your help is greatly appreciated!
-K
PowerMac G-4 Mac OS X (10.3.9)

Airport or third party card

I have a G5 Dual 2.7 I am upgrading, am I limited to using the Apple Extreme airport card or can I use a third party PCI card?

Hi-
You may use most any OS X compatible PCI adapter if you wish.
http://eshop.macsales.com/search/Wireless+PCI
USB adapters are also available.
http://eshop.macsales.com/search/Wireless+USB

Extend range of unencrypted WLAN of third party router *without* using WDS

Hello,
Imagine the following scenario for which I would like to find a solution -- but I think it's impossible, so I'm looking for hints:
My neighbour operates an open (unencrypted, unprotected) wireless network that I can use. He uses a third party WLAN router that does not support WDS. I have good reception only in a certain area in our house, so I would like to extend the range of the network, using my Airport Express station (or possibly other hardware).
I cannot make changes to the configuration of my neighbours router anyway, because we don't know the password for the configuration pages (and we don't want to reset the device to factory defaults).
I know that normally one would configure the two routers (his and mine) to use WDS (each knows the other's MAC address, uses the same channel, SSID and encryption setting etc.), but this is not possible here.
I could join his network with my powerbook wirelessly and then set up sharing preferences on the powerbook such that the WLAN internet connection would be shared onto the ethernet port to which I would connect my Airport Express station to allow wireless access by other machines. This isn't the cleanest setup because I think my powerbook would have to distribute IP addresses using DHCP and NAT which my neighbour's router does, too, so we should not use the same IP range (e.g. would use 192.168.1.xxx and I would use 10.0.1.xxx) and probably we shouldn't use the same SSID, either.
Because there's no WDS support, something like the above seems to be the only solution to me, namely: I would have to join his network as a normal client and the redistribute more or less separately (different subnet/different SSID/different IP address range/...).
Now, the Airport Express can join an existing network as a client, but despite the displayed settings in Airport Admin Utility, bridging to the ehternet port or Airport Express does not work. I have read a lot of Apple documentation, and my understanding is that when setting up Airport Express to join an existing wireless network, the only purpose would be to use it as the receiving end for iTunes music streaming and possibly to connect a printer to it; but the ethernet is completely disabled. (It took me hours to figure this out because the Admin utility clearly suggests that the station would operate as WLAN-ethernet bridge in this setting, but it doesn't.)
So do you have any other solutions to this problem? WOuld an AIrport Extreme station be capable of doing this?
I don't want to use my powerbook as the 'bridge' to share the WLAN connection to the ethernet port as described above because that would require my powerbook to be on alll the time and be located in an inconvenient place.
Thanks for your replies!
P.S.: I do have some older/other wireless routers available, but I think they're not going to help because they won't allow this rather unusual setting. They're all very basic.
Powerbook G4 1 GHz Mac OS X (10.4.7) Airport Express

WOuld an AIrport Extreme station be capable of doing this?
No. The only way an AirPort Extreme base station (AEBS) can wirelessly join a network is using WDS. It does not offer the wireless client mode like the AirPort Express (AX).
Using your PowerBook as you suggested is the only solution using Apple's devices.
There may be 3rd party repeaters that you can use but I have no experience with them.

Third Party Routers & Airport

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