Upgrading to High Def

Upgrading to High Definition
I am currently using PE4, Windows XP Pro
I have been using a Canon ZR830 NTSC
I have been happy with my Videos until I bought a new 46 inch HDTV. Now I notice that the definition of my videos leaves a lot to be desired. I plan to get a HD camera soon but in the meantime I can borrow one to use. I know that I must upgrade my software.
I have a great bluray player. I do not have a bluray burner.
My questions are as follows:
Should I get PE 7 or 8
Can I open a PE4 project in PE7 or PE8
If I do a project with HD media and then burn to a SD DVD, how much better will that be than a project with SD media?
When I get a bluray burner, is the procedure still to burn the project to a folder and then burn those files onto the disk?
Any recommendations on a bluray burner? Cameras?
Thanks for your help.
Cliff

Cliff,
Welcome to the forum.
I'll take a crack at a couple of your questions.
Can I open a PE4 project in PE7 or PE8
Usually. There can be issues with 3rd party Effects and Transitions, and also with things like Themes, or Instant Movies. Now, you cannot go the other direction, so I would do a Save_As, using a different name, so that you do NOT over-write your PrE 4 Project, once you "convert" it to PrE 7, or 8.
If I do a project with HD media and then burn to a SD DVD, how much better will that be than a project with SD media?
This can be touchy, though some have had good luck. Many feel that Adobe does not do that good a job of converting HD material to SD. Now, one can burn HD to a DVD-Video, with a much reduced Duration (much less room on a DVD-5, or DVE-9, than on a BD). If you do downsample from HD to SD, you will not likely notice much increase is quality. This ARTICLE addresses converting HD to SD, but it is very heavily oriented towards Adobe PrPro CS4, and not PrE.
When I get a bluray burner, is the procedure still to burn the project to a folder and then burn those files onto the disk?
Right now, PrE does not allow Burn to Folder for BD Projects, but only to BD. Should an update for PrE 8 be offered, I do not know if this function will be added.
I'll let some of the HD experts comment on these, plus your other questions.
You might also want to post to the Muvipix "Community" (their fora), as a lot of folk there do HD and many also use PrE. You'll see some of the same posters, both here and there, but there are many on Muvipix, who do not post to this forum.
Good luck,
Hunt

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Based on my own testing, the distinctions between an HD-DVD movie (which are true 1080) and an Apple TV video converted as its own maximum settings (which is 720) is actually quite noticeable if you have a 1080 TV set, but at the same I don't consider it a show-stopper. I watch a lot of HD broadcast content that's only 720p, and it's still very good.
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FCP in High Def

Heyy
I am a college student studying media and production full-time, and I use Final cut pro in the house aswell.
I am interested in upgrading my old sony DV camcorder to a High Def one, but i have been searching google for about 2 weeks now and still can not find any HD Camcorders that work well with FCS3
any suggestion on which camera's are fully compatible with Final Cut Studio 3.

Tape is still king.
Days are numbered.
ALL of Sony and Canon's pro cameras sold today use miniDV format.
HA! Wow...where are you? MiniDV? ALL of the cameras use MiniDV? What about the Sony F900? That's a high end professional camera...that takes HDCAM tapes. What about the Sony EX1 or EX3...there is no tape drive on those cameras at all...that is solid state SxS cards...TAPELESS. Then there are the dozens of Sony cameras that shoot Digibeta and Betacam...those aren't miniDV. And those are still sold today.
Then there is the Canon 5D MarkII, and the 7D, that shoots to SD cards...
There are the Sony and Canon HDV cameras, those shoot to HDV tape, that is the same form factor as DV...but isn't miniDV. If that is what you mean. But ALL cameras? Hardly.
Maybe when flash memory gets cheaper/bigger enough we'll see an i-frame codec that will make the editing less cumbersome and easier like it is with DV...
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Tape is not king. And no, ALL Sony and Canon cameras sold today do not shoot to tape.
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Are apple a high def joke?

Im close to giving up on apple, heres why :
I have owned final cut pro for a while now and up graded my camera to hd. I bought the top of the range sony camcorder hc7 which is mac compatible and looked forward to making my first high def movies.
But my mac would not capture the footage becasue my verison of Final cut pro HD wouldnt read it. So the guys at the MAc store suggested two solutions
1 downgrade and buy final cut pro express which would read the format
2 upgrade to the new version of final cut pro sutdio which would also read the format.
The problem with solution two is that i was adivsed by the guys at the MAc store that my Powerbook G5 was not powerful enough to run the new new Final cut studio annd so they suggested by a new machine.
So i looked into buying a new machine but this is the bit I am amazed at Mac dont make any machine that can write to Bluray. If I am going to spend a large amount of money to upgrade my technology to high definition there is now way Im buying a machine without a bluray drive. I can of course buy a pc with blu ray drive no probelm. In my opinion apple are a high def joke. Any reason why I shouldnt abandon apple all together and guet myself a Viao?

Jeff I dont understand your comparison of Bluray to Dlt. Bluray is the only storage technology that can seriously be expected to fit high def movies. I dont expect to be able to cram them onto to DVD's. Since HD DVD withdrew from the market, one could hardly consider BLuray format of the week. In case you hadnt noticed high def is the new way of shooting and displaying video. I would suggest walking into any home entertainment store to discover this. Morever I bought final cut pro HD , its got HD at the end of the title of the software so its not reaally unreasonable to assume it might be able to handle HD. Well it couldnt, it wouldnt read my high def footage and I was told by the guys at the MAc store to either upgrade to a version of Final cut pro that would (which involved buying a new machine) or spend exra money to downgrade to another verison that would.
If its such a waste of time to put Blu ray drives in computers why are there many pcs with bluray drives? wake up Apple, people are buying high def products and they will want to output it somewhere. To describe Bluray as obscure sounds bizarre to me. Did you not read the news? bluray won the format war. Its so frustrating being a loyal Apple customer to be so behind the times. I feel like an idiot for going with Apple.
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can make my film in FCP and use an external driver to burn into onto a blu ray? If so can anyone reccomend one?

High def for the web?

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Re: should I buy a High Def CAMERA or not?

Ok, first of all, thank you SO much all you guys who have been helping me with very good info. So- I see the logic of NOT getting high def now if I am just playing and learning and dealing with YouTube.
I could get just a plain (non-high def) camera for under $300, like a canon ZR-850 which is miniDV but not high def. Or I could get the Canon HV20 or the Sony HDR-HC7 for about $1,100. Why should I spend the extra 7-800$ if I can't even use the high def stiff without a lot of expensive upgrades on my computer software or my screen I would be projecting on. My question is: I have a DELL 40 in plasma screen TV, and I have a G4 mac laptop w/ iMovie 06. CAN I USE HIGH DEF NOW WITH THE EQUIPMENT I HAVE? question #2 If I buy a high def camera now, can I still edit it with iMovie 06 ? is it just that the high def stuff will not be seen as high def? or is it that it won't even work at all and I won't be able to see anything or edit anything unless I have high def software etc?

Hi Stephen:
From my perspective, the question to as if you should shoot in HD comes back to the reality of HD. Few people actually own BlueRay players. Few (in real terms) people own HD TV's. So if YOU want to connect your HD camcorder to your HD TV, for fun, then sure. BUT if your planning on marketing, selling or in any way distributing your final DVD to a group, then it's harded to justify, since again, few people will be able to view your product.
I am no expert. From what I am hearing as I was asking the same questions, HD can also be tricker to shoot well, the data is a magnitude more than SD. Unless you MUST shoot in HD, what I am being told is to get a really good SD camera (mini DV, nat.) and shoot it well.
Hope this helps.
FFF

When is it time to invest in a high-def editing setup?

I own a ten year old digital editing appliance that I'm considering replacing with Final Cut Pro. I want to start work on some niche documentaries that I plan to sell online. I made one documentary at home about six years ago that I still sell online.
I've never bought a HD TV because I don't watch broadcast television. I find conventional DVDs on high-def screens very grainy in image quality ... downright unwatchable ... so to this day I still watch all my DVDs (homemade and store-bought) on a big tube television set.
Personally, I don't want a high-def TV for watching old movies and 70's TV shows on DVD. I'm perfectly happy with my tube TV, my 2001-era editor, and my twelve year old standard-definition Sony PD150 cancorder which I just had serviced and cleaned.
Heck, 20% of my viewing pleasure still comes from videocassettes, which I can get at the Goodwill for 25 cents a piece.
But ... now... I have some ideas for some new niche video products. Only problem is ... I haven't followed the conversation about high-def at all. I'm wholly and utterly ignorant. Pretty much all I know is that BluRay won the format war … and I know I can look up 720p, 1080p, 1080i should that information become important.
That's the extent of my knowledge. I honestly have no idea whether my Sony PD-150, my old editor, and single-layer DVDs would be just fine ... or whether they would result in a bunch of refund requests when I start selling these new DVDs I want to make.
God help me. I just don't keep up with what other people are doing.
And googling "do-I-need-to-dump-my-90's-era-digital-camcorder-and-standard-definition-editing- appliance-in-favor-of-ten-thousand-dollars-worth-of-new-high-def-cam-and-editing -gear-if-I'm-going-to-make-another-sellable-DVD" didn't really yield much.
Can anyone help me here?
1) Is anyone in the lower-mid-range video business … like a budget wedding guy or a niche how-to video … still using standard-def stuff to churn out acceptable product in high volume?
I've sold hundreds of copies of my DVD online and two weeks ago I got my first ever refund request … the guy berated me for selling a DVD in standard definition when (he said) the "commercial standard" now is high-def. No one else has ever complained. So now I'm left wondering if this guy is the first of a new generation of customers who would not tolerate a standard-def product … or if he's just a dork who needed to complain about something.
2) How does manufacturing a high number of copies of a high-def video work? My 50-minute standard-def movie fit wonderfully on an inexpensive 4.7GB DVD. Running off copies was cheap and painless. I understand that high-def discs are some 25GB. Are you guys with your new Mac and Final Cut Pro working with HD buying these expensive discs for large volume runs? Are even decent bread-and-butter wedding shoots or corporate training films these days getting burned to BluRays?
3) Does it make sense to trade in a perfectly good 90's high-end standard definition digital cam for a new HD cam when I'm still going to burn it to a conventional DVD?
4) Is my gear still perfectly acceptable for budget projects? I really don't want to pay for Final Cut Pro and a HD burner ... I would only get one if my old editor is flat-out obsolete, which it certainly isn't for editing home movies.
Note: "Budget" does not mean poorhouse. I'm talking about "working" niche videos … competent (non-broadcast) megachurch sermon DVDs … homemade documentaries … non-Rolls-Royce weddings … small business promo videos ...
… the stuff that working joe videos are made of.
What constitutes "reasonable and acceptable" these days, when just about everybody has a high-def TV set they're watching these things on?

When I made the move from SD it was painful. It was just before the digital broadcast change over and when I hooked up my new Samsung 37" HD TV to my cable box I almost hurled.
since then, almost all of the broadcasters have caught up with HD transmission and almost all broadcast stuff in 1080i or 720p look amazing.
Standard Def DVDs are another story. Well done commercial SD DVDs can look quite nice when playing back through my new Samsung Blu-ray player. The folks who compress down to SD for the big studios are indeed rocket scientists and they're doing things that most of us simply can't afford to do.
Plus, the scaling technology in players and TVs has come a long way as well. So Don't throw out your standard DVDs just yet.
Should you consider a Hi Def camera? I'd say Yes, The time has come. If all you were doing was posting 480P online I'd say use your camera til it croaks. but the optical delivery is a factor for you.
Authoring your own BD for mass duplication? That's a little more complicated still. There are licensing issues involved in Blu-ray authoring which are complex. It's one of the reasons that we probably won't see Blu-ray hardware in Macs for a while. I don't think you can duplicate as easily as you can with DVD. You can burn your own one at a time if that's a possibility for you.
Shooting HD and delivering SD DVDs? It can be done. But compressing so that you end up with a satisfactory product is sort of a black art. You'll see lot's of discussions online about how many people are disappointed with HD to DVD, some claiming that their SD to DVD projects actually look better.
My latest technique for getting respectable DVDs is to first downrez in Mpeg Streamclip to an anamorphic SD file still in the Prores codec. Then I use Bitvice to do the mpeg2 file.
The bottom Line.
If you can afford it, get a new camera, BD burner and learn how to author BD. The authoring software is not fully baked yet for mac users but you should definitely head in that direction ASAP. You can even incorporate SD footage in an HD timeline and the SD footage is much more palatable than SD DVD.
On the up-side, you might be happy to know that you missed the worst of it. Be thankful that you were able to put it off so long. There are many other people out there who rode the bleeding edge and suffered a great deal of economic and emotional trauma.
good Luck!
g

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Downloading High Def Mini DV through Macbook pro to external hard drive

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My question is will I lose the High Def quality because I only have one firewire 400 input and will have to daisy chain the tape deck through the back of the external Hard drive. I asume that I'll need about 2000 gbs of external storage for the project, correct? Also, will my system be able to handle the editing, compresion and then creation of a master (maybe renting a Blue ray disc burner).
I have a macbook pro 15" with 1gb ddr2 sdram 667 mhz speed. There is a Bank 0 and a Bank 1 slot for ram that list have ing 1gb of ram (does this mean there are 2gb of ram?). Also, the firewire is 400mb/sec. Graphics card is an ATY,RadeonX1600. I'm using final cut pro 5.1.4. that I bought with finalcut studio pro.

Hi(Bonjour)!
If you use Apple Intermediate Codec to capture, you'll need 12 to 15 meg/second of space, that's an hefty 45 to 48 gig. for one hour. ( an external hard disk about 58 X 48 gig: 2784 gig ...)
As I read in FCS2 additionnal documentation regarding work in HDV and other formats, you can capture HDV natively (same hard drive space than regular mini DV), but you will need more processor power to display and scroll content than media captured with AIC.
Michel Boissonneault

Standard Def on High Def TV

Hello all
I work in standard def with the Sony DCR-SR80 (MPEG-2 format 16:9). I then convert in MPEG Streamclip. I use to export to DV format but more recently I'm exporting to "Apple DV/DVCPRO - NTSC" 720 x 480 (unscaled). My FCE Easy Set up is Format: DV/Panasonic DVCPRO Rate: 29.97 Use: DV-NTSC 32 khz Anamorphic. This is all nice because there really isn't any rendering going on. I film a lot of high school football so there is fast moving objects on the video.
My problem is that I create these projects and then burn them in iDVD and play them on my High Def Samsung TV (1080P) through my Blueray player (1080P) and the video has a jpeg look to it. I can make it better by adjusting my TV but I'm curious why it looks this way. Is it the camera? I nolonger have a tube television in the house so I can't compare. Any suggestions? whether a new camera or maybe new format and conversion settings. I tried to give as much detail as possible. I'm aware there are a lot of variables in there questions.
Thank you all in advance!!
Ween

Hi(Bonjour)!
That's normal as your base material is MPEG converted to DVCPRO. MPEG compression artifacts are transcoded to DVCPRO upon conversion with MPEG streamclip. MPEG format doesn't render rapid action like football very well.
Worst, you play a standard def DVD in a HD set. The image (and the MPEG artifact)is upscaled 6 times to fit the HD screen.
By the way you should choose a 48 khz audio preset as it's a standard in video edition.
Michel Boissonneault

Trying to get High Def Picture/Video to my 40" LCD. Help

Hey all
I have recently brough a MacBook Pro 2.33,
I have downloaded some videos & TV eps which are in High Def (720). On the MacBook they look brilliant, I wanted to hook the Macbook up to my Samsung 40" LCD and then hopefully be able to watch my High Def videos on the big screen in crystal clear quality, So I hooked up the macbook to my TV via a DVI - HDMI Cable and got the display on the LCD, which looks ok, Thought it would be perfect as it was just using it like a Monitor. I played with the resolutions to get the best fitting picture as there doesnt seem to be the Native Res for my LCD, I always end up loosing a tiny bit of the screen at the top & the bottom, but not too fussed about that, So i was playing my High Def Videos but they are definatly not in the quality that they look like on my Macbook, Very bitmappy etc..
Wonder if you lot can offer an advise as to how I can use the Macbook to get true High Def picture to my LCD
Thanks in advance
Cube Design
PS. Obviously all this will give me Video out, but hows the best way to get sound out? just a headphone to phono lead into my amp?

Large screen displays don't necessarily have a 1:1 pixel mapping. Ideally you should find out what your display's native resolution is, and pick something close to that. 720 is 1280x720, 1080 is 1920x1080. Your TV may only accept those resolutions... it's a TV and not a monitor.
My Pioneer (connected to my mac mini) is receiving 1280x720 and the menu bar barely shows on the screen due to overscan but movies look great.
You can turn on underscan (picture is shrunk to avoid overscan) on a tab on the Displays preference pane, provided your Mac detected that it was a TV.

Upgrading to High Def

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