Values in sample editor

This may be a stupid question but in the sample editor what do the values on the side of the wave represent? I would think its a measure in mV but I'm not sure, I need to find out the decibel level of a recording I made so any help doing this would be appreciated.

Use the function "change level" in the sample editor (in the functions menue) and select "find maximum" to quickly check the absolute level of a file

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Sample value accuracy in sample editor

My setup is a motu 2408mk3 into Logic Pro 6 on my G4 mac.
When I open a 24 bit aiff file in the sample editor and set the sample editor to view samples on the vertical axis, it only shows a max sample value of 32767. This is the max value of 16 bit data, it should read 8388607 for a 24 bit file.
Logic recognizes the file as a 24 bit file, so why does it not show the sample values correctly?

Admittedly, my reply is based on a guess here... but it wouldn't surprise me if the Y-axis display is indeed preset at 16-bit values. Not sure if Logic 6 contains an algorithm that adapts the Y-axis amplitude values according to the bit depth of the sample you're looking at.

Sample Editor - "sample accuracy" is a matter of opinion...

In trying to figure out exactly what was going on with start/anchor/end points in the Sample Editor, I discovered the basic relationship between the Sample Editor and Arrange window... thought this might be useful to others.
Basically, it's a matter of opinion whether or not the Sample Editor truly lets you make sample-accurate edits. By itself, the Sample Editor does let you move the start/anchor/end points to any sample value, and Logic will save and remember these settings, accurate to the sample.
But, you can't rely on those sample-accurate edits when you place the region in the Arrange window. Logic always "remembers" them, but the results in the Arrange window can get sloppy.
Bottom line: Logic forces all region start and end boundaries to rounded tick values. So, if you go into the Sample Editor and adjust the start/anchor/end by samples, it's impossible for all of these edits to get consistently represented in the Arrange window. To get that, Logic would have to allow the region start and end to be between ticks, and it won't allow that--something has to give.
Here's what actually happens: you set the anchor with sample accuracy in the Sample Editor, then you place the region in the Arrange to be at exactly bar 5 (5 1 1 1 1), for instance. You'd expect the anchor to be at exactly bar 5, but it isn't... it's close, but what Logic actually does is line up the region by the region start marker. The region start marker never moves relative to the region's audio: when you try to put the anchor at bar 5, Logic actually slides the region to the nearest tick value--the start marker goes precisely on a tick, and the anchor ends up slightly ahead or behind the bar 5 marker.
Now, this behavior isn't so bad in most cases--can you really hear a few samples difference between exactly where you put the anchor, and exactly where it ends up ? Almost certainly not, although I know an obsessive-compulsive post editor who isn't going to be happy when I tell him this...
But the dark side of this behavior occurs with the region end point. Again, Logic never moves the region start relative to the region's audio--it shifts around the anchor to make the region start fall on a rounded tick. But what about the region end ? Unfortunately, even though the Sample Editor will let you put the region end anywhere you want it, and it will save the region/file that way, that region end will get shifted around to fall on the nearest tick in the Arrange.
So, you cut a sample precisely in the Sample Editor, make sure the start and end fall on zero crossings, then you place the anchor at a transient point and spot the region in the Arrange. What actually happens is that
1) your start region edit gets preserved
2) the anchor gets put somewhere fairly close to the actual spot point
3) the region end gets rounded to the nearest tick
#1 is great, #2 probably OK, but #3 can be a problem. Your region may sound great in the Sample Editor, but it may click on the back end in the Arrange... unless the region's start and end happen by luck to be exact tick multiples of each other, the region end will get moved by a few samples, which may cause a glitch in playback.
My suggestions:
1) Be aware that anchor's aren't placed with sample-accuracy. You probably will never care, but it's good to know.
2) Leave a tick or two of silence at the end of a region. If you use a Sample Editor to trim the region end precisely to a zero crossing, you'll probably get bitten when you put this region in the Arrange. Either do a destructive fade in the Sample Editor, or use the fade tool in the Arrange. (DAWs are going to have to take a few more steps forward before we can stop being superstitious about fading the start and end of every single region, even when edits are at zero-crossings. If the work is important, crossfade everything!)
3) Apple... PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE revamp the Arrange window to be sample-accurate. There are so many kludgy little issues that would go away if the base timescale could be samples. Not to mention that almost every other DAW has this...
James
[email protected]
Dual 1.25 G4 Mac OS X (10.4.8)

iSchwartz,
Serves me right for not doing a listening test.
Turns out that you're entirely right about what actually gets played back. I did a few tests by aligning two regions, phase-canceling them, then moving around the start, end, and anchor points.
Sure enough, what I HEARD corresponded exactly to what I saw in the Sample Editor.
But the Arrangement doesn't show things that way--I was looking instead of listening, and in these cases, the Arrangement can show things that are contrary to what gets played back.
When you move that end marker to the right in the last step of your test, I'll bet the Arrange window doesn't show the little glitch that you're now able to hear. And if you take an Arrangement region that ends with a little glitch, you can remove it by sliding the region end a sample to the left in the Sample Editor, but you'll still SEE the glitch in the Arrange window. Looks like the Arrangement plays back exactly what you've got in the Sample Editor, but it DISPLAYS things rounded to the nearest tick.
And this gets more confusing when you move around the anchor point. Trim one of your clicks so the anchor and the region start are both precisely on the transient, and move that region to a bar marker. Then look at the Arrange window at maximum zoom--you'll see exactly what you'd expect.
But... now... go back to the Sample Editor and try moving the anchor a few samples to the right. When you go back to the Arrange window, nothing has changed--the transient still looks like it's precisely on the bar marker, while the Sample Editor shows that it's not.
And it gets weirder... go back to the Sample Editor, and move the region start a few samples to the left. Now, when you go back to the Arrange window, what you see is exactly the opposite of what you'd expect. You'd expect the anchor to have stayed put, and the region start should have moved. Instead, the region start is still at the bar marker, but the audio inside the region appears to have moved.
This is why I was so confused about what was going on. You're completely right about the playback--I did some tests, and all this strange behavior I'm seeing in the Arrange window, none of it makes it to playback. When the Arrange window and Sample Editor disagree, the Sample Editor seems to be ALWAYS right.
But when you start doing sample-accurate editing with the Sample Editor, the Arrange window no longer reflects reality--region start and end markers appear to be on at rounded ticks, even though they're not, and audio will appear to be displaced within regions, even though it's actually lined up perfectly by the anchor.
Just goes back to point #3... it's kludgy crap in the Arrangement resulting from the tick timebase. Logic 8 ?
James
[email protected]
Dual 1.25 G4 Mac OS X (10.4.8)

Playback speed in Sample Editor window many, many times faster than track (at correct speed) in arrange area. How do I sync Sample Editor playback speed to correct speed/tempo in arrange area? Track is spoken word.

Playback speed in Sample Editor window many, many times faster than track (at correct speed) in arrange area. How do I sync Sample Editor playback speed to correct speed/tempo in arrange area? Track is spoken word. Sample Editor playback sounds like Alvin on a meth binge. Spoken phrase is generated from Textspeech. Textspeech can export files as WAV files or MP3 files. Perhaps a clue?: When exported Textspeech WAV file is dragged and dropped into track in arrange area of new project, it exhibits same supersonic speed. When Textspeech file is exported as MP3 file and dragged and dropped in arrange area track, it plays at correct speed.

Thanks Erik,
If nothing else, this huge list of updates and fixes, shows clearly that the Logic Dev team is working hard on fixing and improving LPX to a major degree.... and from the list of fixes done.. show they do read the bug reports submitted!
As an aside....
I recall how all the 'naysayers' prior to LPX (and in some cases, since...) were proclaiming how Logic was dead, the team was being disbanded, we won't see any further development, the Dev team doesn't listen or care... and so on....... I wonder where those people are now?

Not able to increase gain of blue Apple Loop in Sample Editor, even when I bounce in place

As far as I understand things, bouncing in place creates a new audio file that you can alter at will. I have a blue Apple Loop from Logic's library that I want to permanently change the gain on. I can bounce in place but all the functions in the sample editor are greyed out, thus not allowing me to change the gain. The loop is a surround sound loop, I don't know if that matters. It's happened to me in stereo so I don't think so.

Finaly i was able to solve the problem.The other machine was having some firewall blocking the receiver.

File appears different in arrange window and sample editor

I received a few AIFF files from someone Im working with: 24 bit, 44.1, same as I use. However, although they show up fine in the sample editor, in the arrange window they look clipped, as if they've been recorded too loud. This is making them very hard to edit. I've tried refreshing the overview in the sample editor, but with no success. Has anyone got any tips?

Does the file appear distorted visually, or does it also sound distorted?
In arrange, between the *Horizontal Zoom Slider* and the *Horizontal scroll arrows* you'll see a Waveform button with which you can adjust how "fat" the waveform is displayed. Clicking toggles it between the last setting and fully zoomed out. Clickhold to let the slider pop up.
!http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5179/5407362168_6d8e888c2a.jpg!

Logic express 9 can't move samples in sample editor, logic express 9 can't move samples in sample editor

New at logic nine express. Looking at the sample editor where it says I should be able to select part of a sample in the sample editor and move it . Option click does give me the correct icon but can't move the selection. On Macbookpro and logic express 9.1.5, os x 10.5.8

I think I got confused.. and that the instructions were talking about moving the selection, not the underlying wave form... I think I get it now, thanks to me for answering myself

Open file in sample editor

Hey forum,
This is probably a super noob question, but I have a clip of a 7 bar guitar line that I want to open in the sample editor so I can reverse it. I know the default is to double-click it, but it has the arrow on the left side and when I double click it, it pulls down the only take that I did of that section (instead of opening in sample editor). I want to know how to do this for other clips with more than one take as well.
So basically, how do I open a snippet in sample editor without double clicking on it?
Thanks,
Daniel

Hey Jorge.
Thanks for the suggestion. I've actually had to re-install the bug ridden 8.0.0 version to get it to work. Never thought i'd be saying that
I haven't updated it yet as i need to get some work done before i waste another day trying to sort out mysterious errors.
Thanks anyway
Rowan

Feature Request: Destructive editing with AUs in Sample Editor

I would like to be able to apply edits destructively in the sample edit window with Audio Units like we could in Logic on MacOS9 (which used AudioSuite plugins). This is an ongoing request, year after year, among veteran Logic users. In every update it is ignored. The feature requires no redesign of the sample edit window, just another menu sub item droplist. While the bounce in place feature is a welcome addition, it is not a replacement for this feature that was removed in the migration to MacOSX and has been sorely missed ever since.
Here's just one recent sentiment from a user on the NYC Logic Users Group:
"I recently changed over to Logic from Pro Tools and I really miss this feature! For handling plosives and de-essing small fragments."
I also know a very prominent producer who boycotted Logic 8 and 9 for this reason alone. While I would never do that (since I happen to love all the new features and feel comfortable with the workflow of Logic 9), I sympathize with this person's frustration over the lack of this feature. I find myself constantly in the position of wishing I had destructive editing back in my Logic tool belt.

With all due respect, I personally cannot stand soundtrack. A lot of effort was put into the app that should have gone into Logic. As you allude to, I can trigger that Logic keystroke to open any sample editor, which is what I do. I just want the functionality back that was taken away from us many moons ago. I'm not looking for workarounds. This is just a simple feature request. But thank you for the suggestion.

Sound disappeared from Sample Editor?

Can anyone help? The sound has completely disappeared from my Sample Editor window and also the Audio bin.
I can't audition any loops in the list now, but if I drag them to a track in the main Arrange page they play fine. Then double clicking on that Audio loop or any audio clip in Arrange to bring it up in the Sample Editor window shows the waveform okay, but playing it just goes through the motions with the cursor moving as normal but no sound. Dead. Nada.
Is it me? I am not a novice with Logic but I can't work this out. I tried throwing away the preference files in Library/Prefs but nothing doing.
Any help would be appreciated as I can't edit in Logic now like this.
Cheers
Musolen

Well thanks again Chorleyman,
I have had a play around and added another Audio strip in the Environment, set it to Output No.256 (The highest) and the Sound in the Sample Editor came straight back on. It's still called Audio and not PreListen, I can't seem to rename that, but it works now so I have my solution.
Thanks again for the advice and to everyone else reading this and mulling it over.
Cheers,
Musolen.

"Open in external sample editor" seems to be broken?

Hey all,
I'm hoping that someone can help me figure this out. I'm using Logic Pro X 10.0.7 in conjunction with Adobe Audition CS6. This problem seems to happen intermittently, and on some of my machines, but not others. I've also witnessed it on others' machines as well.
When I try to open a region of audio in the external sample editor (For which I've set up Adobe Audtion CS6 to do destructive edits), I can manage to get the file to open correctly in Audition. HOWEVER, when I make my edits in audition and try to SAVE the file in Audition to send it back to Logic Pro X, I get an error message that the file cannot be saved because it is "in use by another application". It's almost as if Logic doesn't release the file to the external sample editor in order for it to be overwritten, and updated.
When I switch back to Logic, after I get the error message, Logic "refreshes" the waveform information, but it's still unchanged, because the external sample editor can't save the changes that I've made to the region. Can anyone relate? Offer me useful tips on how to fix this? Is it a bad configuration on my end, or just a bug in Logic?
Thanks,
Steve

Ok so I think I might have figured this out on my own... Apparently, if you highlight a region, and the region is open in Logic's Editor window, while you're trying to edit the region with an external editor like Audition, it will throw the "file is in use by another application" error, when you try to save the changes you've made in the external editor. I found that if I close the "Editor" window in Logic, before trying to open the region in Audition, Audition is then able to save the changes to the file.
Derp.

Sample editor 'functions' greyed out.

Hi there,
I'm having a problem in Logic 8 whereby all the functions in the sample editor are disabled. I'm pretty new to logic but i'm getting to grips with it, just can't figure out why i can't use any of the functions

They are greyed out because of a possible lack of manual reading....while that's the most likely cause a secondary problem might be not applying basic computer use skills that you already know.
In most every program what must you do to data to be able to edit?
You have to select it... it looks like from the pic you've posted that you have not selected the audio, usually it comes up selected (darker color) when you open the sample editor.
Either drag select the area you wish to work on or use the Apple key in combination with the A key to select all.
This is basic editing, from a long time Logic user...trust me, reading the manuals can provide many benefits... there's always secondary information included along with the info you're looking for. Logic's manual has a large chapter on editing audio in the sample editor. It's a good read.

Sample editor audition button goes silent when any track is solo'd

I've discovered that if a track in the arrange window (and others, I think) is in solo mode, it seems to override the audio audition function when I open the sample editor. This seems to be some poor heirarchical design to me because it forces me to go back to the arrange window (bye-bye sample editor!), find the solo'd track, unsolo it, move the window to hunt for the sample editor, or open another sample editor window from the track I was originally working on. A complete nuisance. Shouldn't the sample editor have priority?
Also, the solo tool is basically worthless right now because it never starts playing at the point I click on in a region. Completely inaccurate. You certainly can't zero in on any critical audio editing with this clumsy feature. Maybe it has to do with sluggish performance due to buffer setting issues??? It's a far cry from Digital Performer, where you simply highlighted a section of a region ("soundbite" in DP) and it instantly played back as soon as you let go of the mouse regardless of any solo assignments per tracks. Plus it was dead accurate. I spent the extra 700 mammies upgrading to Logic Pro mainly for the precious "marquee tool" which does s##t in terms of selecting and copying (it splits the region after you copy a selection, then you have to undo the split). Whoops, I'm ranting. Just can't believe the agony of audio editing in this beast of a program...

Excellent! I can't imagine how you discovered that...
The little "1" in the parameters indicates which audio channel the sample editor plays through - you can change it to anything, but this is not saved in a song (annoyingly enough), so whilst for most people it would be more convenient to set it to track 128 or something, we have to leave it at 1 and reserve that channel for the sample editor, or keep changing it all the time.
So it's mostly understanding of how Logic works that gets you these steps, and that comes form trial and error, experience, exploration, manual reading, and asking other people...
Could you describe the key command set-up you mention here?
Everyone of us here will have different requirements and workflows - I strongly recommend digging through the key commands window to see what useful things lay in store. Some things I use frequently others may have a different way of achieving, and some commands I never use are absolutely essential for others.
The beauty and the achilles heel of Logic is that it is so configurable - great for power users, but often it leaves new users confused as they simply don't know enough to set themselves up efficiently.
But key to efficient working with Logic are selection, navigation, zooming, screensets, linked windows (especially editor windows) and personalised key commands and autoload songs. So do explore those tools and see what they have to offer.
The tip I mentioned here doesn't help you particularly, but there are loads of key commands that will - I'd suggest starting a separate thread with just this issue and ask how others here would handle it - you might be suprised how many different answers you get - many ways to skin the same cat in Logic
But the audio editing in Logic still seems much more tedious than DP
It's also tricky to make these kind of judgements when you aren't too familiar with things - you may be right on the money, but you also may just not know key concepts and workflow tips that make things much easier.
There are plenty of new users who post along the lines of "Logic is cr.ap because..." and within a few posts it's abundantly clear that they just simply don't have a clue - I'm not implying that about you at all - I'm just simply saying that it takes time to build up workflows and explore the small little things that make or break an efficient workflow.
So I'm not saying you're wrong, but from your posts I would also guess that there's still a lot about Logic you're not on top of that could probably make you life a lot easier - so hang around here, and hopefully you should improve some workflow habits fairly quickly...
I hope that's been of some help. It's so much better when people control the rants, calm down, and start learning...!

Sample editor display jumps to file begin on zoom with large files

Hey - does anyone else have this problem:
When I zoom in to the max possible zoom level in the sample editor in Logic (eg to edit single samples with the pencil), in any audio file longer than 12:41, the waveform display suddenly jumps to very beginning of the file.
It happens using either the zoom-in key, zoom slider or zoom tool. It is somewhat infuriating because I have to guess when to stop pressing zoom-in to get as close as i can without triggering the jump. (If i go one zoom level too far, I have to go back, zoom out and re-find my place and try again.)
I did some investigation and the bug in zoom behavior starts happening with audio files a little shy of 12 min 41 sec ( 12:40.871ms to be more exact).
Here are the results in "length in samples" of a test audio file (AIFF 24-bit Stereo, 44100Hz):
33554453 samples and greater => sample editor jumps to beginning when zoomed in to max
33554432 - 33554452 samples => sample editor jumps to END of file when zoomed to max (bizarre, eh? a 20-sample window in which the bug works in the OPPOSITE direction!)
33554431 samples and less => sample editor zoom is normal and zooms in perfectly to the proper location at max zoom.
I also tested other things like trashing my logic prefs and starting from an empty song with nothing in it - none of which make any difference. This bug is present in Logic 8.0.2 on both my Macbook Pro with OS X 10.5.7 and my Powerbook G4 with 10.4.11
Maybe time to report this to apple - can anyone corroborate by just continually pressing your zoom-in key with the cursor in the middle of an audio file longer than 12:41 and see if the display jumps to the beginning?
Thanks!

bump?

Sample editor problem

I was tracking a voice over in Logic 9 and I accdentally opened the sample editor, now I can only here the track selected in the editor and nothing on the timeline, I closed the sample editor but I still can't hear the track on my timeline... I can't fiure out how to deslect and close the sample editor and get back to a functioning timeline.. closing the sample editor doesn't revert back to the timeline.. the timeline stays muted... any suggestions?

[Opening The Sample Editor|http://documentation.apple.com/en/logicpro/usermanual/index.html#chapter =17%26section=1%26tasks=true] read the note at the bottom of the page
[Understanding Relationships between windows|http://documentation.apple.com/en/logicpro/usermanual/index.html#chapte r=4%26section=7]
A

Values in sample editor

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