Virtual copies and DNG files

I may have completely misunderstood something, but I thought the metadata in a DNG file was contained within the file. The virtual copy function in LR1 is very interesting for making different versions of the same image, but if the image metadata for the virtual copies is in XMP files, does this preclude the use of this function with DNG files?
Martin

Thanks. So the XMP metadata block in a DNG file will just contain any non-destrictive edits made on the original file. The information about any edits in virtual copies are then in accompanying files (XML?). Or is this information only contained within the Lightroom database?
I am just trying to understand how the information is stored and if it is accessible to other applications.
Martin

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How does LR3 handle virtual copies and xmp files?

Hi,
I see only 1 xmp file and yet I have several virtual copies of that same photograph... where are the corresponding xmp files? I am using exiftool to place some info in the CR2 files and then need to update the corresponding xmp file...
Thanks,
Juan

Hi Juan,
Virtual copies are only stored in the LR catalog, never in the XMP sidecars. If you update the XMP using exiftool and update the metadata in LR, both the original and the virtual copy will be updated with the XMP data.
Marc

Naming Presets for Virtual Copies and PS Edits

I'm new to Lightroom 4.1 and have been setting everything up... I'm having trouble with figuring out an efficient, clear naming system to distnguish Virtual Copies and Copies Edited in Photoshop. I tried using the "File Template Editor in the external Editing window... but I find it VERY confusing. Can anyone recommend a system and the way to enter it as a Preset in the File Template Editor.
My Image File Naming is as follows: KOBRIEN_YY_00001.dng
Thanks in advance for all suggestions!

Best to set the Rename Template from within the 'External Editing' panel of Lr Preferences. The format should be along the lines shown in screenshot. You add the custom text after the template has been saved.
Above should work OK for photos edited in Photoshop, but Virtual Copies are a different beast and can't be renamed using templates. If you do try it the master is renamed, not the copy. The thing is, VCs must have the same base name as the master. However, you can manually edit the Copy Name field in Library Metadata panel.

Option to add Virtual-Copies to DNG -exists?

Option to add Virtual-Copies to DNG -exists?
..or only "convert virtual-copy-into-DNG" ?
( ..Not what I consider acceptable option :
Evolved (history)states of virtual-copies could be copied back temporarely to the original file's history, then "save as a snapshot" (then not forget that you do have such snaphots), then come back in its history stage befor pasting/or synchronizing and perform an insifignant change -in order to keep different versions of that photo...)

Same problem here.
/usr/lib/vmware/bin/vmware: /usr/lib/vmware/lib/libpng12.so.0/libpng12.so.0: no version information available (required by /usr/lib/libgdk_pixbuf-2.0.so.0)
/usr/lib/vmware/bin/vmware: /usr/lib/vmware/lib/libgcc_s.so.1/libgcc_s.so.1: version `GCC_4.2.0' not found (required by /usr/lib/libstdc++.so.6)
/usr/lib/vmware/bin/vmware: /usr/lib/vmware/lib/libpng12.so.0/libpng12.so.0: no version information available (required by /usr/lib/libcairo.so.2)
/bin/bash: /usr/lib/vmware/lib/libgcc_s.so.1/libgcc_s.so.1: version `GCC_4.2.0' not found (required by /usr/lib/libstdc++.so.6)
/usr/lib/vmware/bin/vmware: error while loading shared libraries: libexpat.so.0: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
However, when running as root vmware works, but browsing for a VM does not.
(vmware:7926): libgnomevfs-CRITICAL **: gnome_vfs_uri_unref: assertion `uri != NULL' failed
(vmware:7926): libgnomevfs-WARNING **: Cannot load module `/usr/lib/gnome-vfs-2.0/modules/libfile.so' (/usr/lib/vmware/lib/libgcc_s.so.1/libgcc_s.so.1: version `GCC_4.2.0' not found (required by /usr/lib/libstdc++.so.6))
Permissions/path/module issue?

Camera raw and DNG files appear as generic icons

Camera raw and DNG files appear as generic icons instead of image previews (Bridge CS5)
What can I do ?

Hi Yammer.
First thanks a lot for taking your time to help me. I am really happy about it!
I will try to answer:
1)
I meant by having the Camera Raw.8bi placed in BOTH "C:\Programmer\Adobe\Adobe Bridge CS5\Plug-Ins" and in C:\Programmer\Fælles filer\Adobe Plug-Ins\CS5\File Formats" the ACR will be found in two versions - or rather in two places (I know the former shouldn't be, but it solved my preview problem).
2)
YES - I do have tried twice starting the Adobe Bridge holding down the Ctrl-key and ticking the two (the third was greyed out but ticked anyway) and with no help.
3)
I have tried to do the *.8bi search you suggested, and this gives me the following dump - absolutely with a few more entries than yours. Some are like doubled.
Do you think I can just delete these?
Kind regards, Jan

I write both JPG and DNG files in the camera.   Camera is a Leica Monochrom.   Photo, unlike iPhoto, seems to ignore DNG files and only imports JPG files.   What am I missing here?

I write both JPG and DNG files in the camera.   Camera is a Leica Monochrom.   Photo, unlike iPhoto, seems to ignore DNG files and only imports JPG files when both are present on the SD card. JPGs are used for quick proofing on an iPad.    DNG RAW files are edited on a Mac Pro (2013).    Other than deleting the JPGs before importing images from the SD card, is there any way to force Photo to select and import only the DNG images?

Thanks Larry,
I did see the J stacked in the lower left of the thumbnails but couldn't figure out how to get to whatever is below it.   How do you select R?
I use an iPad to do quick proofs of my images.   A JPG is good enough for a proof ( dust on the lens, composition, blown out image, etc. ).   The iPad is JPG friendly and can load the images quickly.    Serious editing takes place on my Mac Pro with the DNG files.   I use the same workflow with the the Leica M 240.   iPhoto has been a quick and easy importer to the Mac capturing all of the metadata in the EXIF sidecar file ( location, date, time, camera settings, lens type). A quick scan in iPhoto for the "keepers" let's me export those worth editing to Lightroom/Bridge/Photoshop. I typically shoot 50 images from three locations in a normal day. If I'm lucky I'll get 1 worth real work to add to the portfolio.

Virtual copies and smart collections

Previous answer not satisfactory.
Are virtual copies considered by LR to be the same image. Then why have them. They are different especially after I add more processing.
Therefore when i make a smart collection of aspect = square and rating is 3
all versions should show up. Not the way it seems to work LR5.7 on Mac 10.9
Then I sort at top for 2014 and select to go into a regular collection Best squares of 2014.
As it works now it is useless because I have to rely on memory to know I made a different version based on a virtual copy.
I consider this a bug... Again read my other post today.
If all you can do in collection is just the easy filters what is the point. I can do it manually.
If this take rocket scientist to code an algorithm to figure out virtual copies are different than originals then get them on it ASAP.
This is what gets me. If you know they don't work put it right out front on the help page what IT DOESN"T DO. BE HONEST
YOU are getting paid for that. Why should a customer have to waste his time when feature is obviously deficient.

Disclaimer: I have no idea what you're talking about, nor did I read your other post today. That said, here are a couple of points which may be pertinent:
* Virtual copies are 100% different photos (in the catalog database, in collections, etc..).
* Internally, the main difference between a virtual copy and a real copy is that the virtual copy omits the associated file and records the associated (master) photo instead.
PS - I recommend understanding how it works before jumping to conclusions about how it doesn't..
Note: be aware that there are master-photo/virtual-copy attribute filters in the library module (which remain active in develop module..).

AE stopped to open cr2 and dng files, PS still works

Hi
I have a mac book pro 16gb OS 10.9.2 and worked over 6 months with AE and Photoshop CS6 opening and working with cr2 (Canon 5dmk3 raw) and dng (converted from magic lantern) files.
all went well. For no apparent reason (maybe any kind of update?) my AE does not recognize these files anymore. They just show up grey and not selectable in the open/import dialog.
I can still open them using photoshop with the well known dialog box for raw files. so somehow the raw importer seems to work? Tried adobes dng converter 8.4 but converted files do still not open.
Did someone encountered the same problem and found a solution? Thanx very much for your help!
Roger

See this:
http://helpx.adobe.com/bridge/kb/acr-84-bridge-cs6-metadata.html

Develop Settings and DNG files...where is the info stored?

I just converted my Nikon NEF files to DNG. Previously I saved all changes I would make to my photos in the XMP sidecar files. I'm confused how things are working now because I thought those same changes would be saved to the DNG file.
Now that I use DNG files, when I make adjustments to the develop settings in LR, are those changes ONLY saved to the catalog? Or is there a way to save them into the DNG file so I can bring them to LR on another computer and see my changes? I feel like when I had XMP files before with my RAW files, the develop settings were saved there in addition to the catalog, so my changes came with me... Maybe I'm wrong though.

>Each of my RAW files also has a corresponding 10KB XMP file.
These are known as XMP sidecars and are applicable only to proprietary raw files (e.g. CR2, NEF, etc). Adobe have a policy of not writing anything back into a proprietary raw file (exception being date/time stamp) because the proprietary data tends to be undocumented. The XMP sidecar provides a safe documented means of storing the metadata corresponding to each proprietary raw file.
> I understood that the metadata is written to the file itself, but apparently only to DNG JPG and Tif files - right?
Correct
>So, if this is correct, then all metadata except that originally written by the camera is saved in the XMP file on RAW files?
For proprietary raw files the metadata is written into the XMP sidecar, but for the other formats you mention it's written "into" the XMP block of the actual file.
> Is the XMP file the information used by the Catalog? If I open a RAW image in Photoshop CS3 will the XMP information be read and applied when the file opens?
Yes to both questions

Virtual copies and history?

I want to creat virtual copies that include the history so I can rever them from BW back to the origianl color. Why is the history removed when you creat virtual copies?

Alan - thanks for the tip. The conundrum of "which history should be shown" for multiple virtual copies isn't actually one at all. When a virtual copy is created, the history of the parent image is duplicated; further edits to that particular virtual copy are added to the top of that copy, just like they are now. Subsequent edits to the master copy don't affect any of the descendant VC's, including their history.
Andrew - why does it have to be a new iteration? It clearly isn't, since it has inherited all of the non-destructive edits from the parent. And you haven't addressed my workflow issue - how do I identify all of the edits made to a virtual copy? Right now, I can't; Lightroom throws this information away. There's no penalty if Adobe duplicated the edit history, you don't have to look at it if you don't want to.
Cornelia - someone has already created a feature request, here it is:
http://feedback.photoshop.com/photoshop_family/topics/new_virtual_copies_should_inherit_de velop_history
Cheers,
Tim

LR 3 and DNG files created and edited in LR 2

Workflow had been to import Nikon NEF files, convert to DNG in LR2, do my edits, and save the data within the DNG file. Tried to upgrade to LR3 tonight, using the trial version while I wait for my package to arrive. The catalog migrated just fine, with the exception that the edited DNG files were ignored.
DNG files that had not been edited seem to have imported just fine. But what fun is that. I need access to all my DNG files to continue the editing that I had been doing in LR2.
I verified the DNG files were still on the computer. I then tried to sync one of the folders I knew had edited DNG files in it that hadn't been migrated in the catalog import. LR 3 refuses to acknowledge the files exist, and doesn't give me the option to import them. :-(
Is there some option or preference I need to set/reset? Is this a known bug or issue? Is there a workaround?
Computer is a Intel Quad Core with 4 GB running WinXP Pro.
Thanks in advance,
- Arved

I don't remember what the settings were when I imported the catalog. Whatever the defaults were.
Whatever happened during import, I should still have the option to add the files when sync'ing a folder? But I don't.
Neither LR2 nor LR3 will allow me access to the edited DNG files now. I've erased and am rebuilding the catalog (all pertinent info was written to sidecar and/or within the DNG file, so I'm not anticipating any problems with this. It's showing the expected 27,000+ files being imported). I think I'll try building the LR3 catalog the same way when I fire it back up, once I'm sure I'm back up and running in LR2.
Thanks for the quick response!
- Arved

Strange artifact in some NEF and .dng files

Using a Nikon D80 with 4 GB Sandisk Extreme SDHC card; shooting full resolution NEF; Mac G5, Mac OS X 10.4.10, images are run through Adobe DNG Converter 4.1. Image is opened in Camera Raw 4.1 (and now 4.2) window within Photoshop CS3 Extended.
In some photos with dark areas, there is a single, tiny, transient on-screen artifact in form of a red dot, either two or three pixels square, which always appears in the same location against, say, a dark sky or trees. It can persist or literally disappear on its own after about two seconds. If the file is reopened in the same session, the red dot may not be there at all. If the loupe tool is used, it always disappears within the loupe after about two seconds, even though it may persist in the unmagnified screen. The good news is that opening the image as a .psd in Photoshop shows no sign of this anomaly, no matter how greatly magnified.
Note: It can also appear if I drag the NEF or .dng file over to Preview. But in this case, it does not disappear.
Does anyone have a clue what may be causing this?
A screen shot comparison from Camera Raw 4.1 is attached below. The left image shows the dot in place in the section of the photo and with the loupe.The right image shows the dot gone, but persistent in the unmagnified image.
Neil

Again, thanks, Thomas. Most, um, enlightening! <g> I've been shooting raw exclusively over the past six months or so. Camera Raw apparently did its job, which would explain why the pixel disappeared after a couple of seconds. I'll probably run the same image through Lightroom to see what happens. However, I can still see using .jpg once in awhile (family and friends snapshots destined for email or postcard-size prints). But then, the question begs, if other pixels are compensating for the bad pixels, does that materially affect overall resolution or appearance of the images? Although I've been aware of annoying "stuck" pixels on LCD monitors, I never really thought about how DSLRs deal with this. Neil

Powershot G15 and .dng files

Why can't I import and edit RAW files directly from my powershop G15, without converting to .dng files? I am using Lightroom V 3.6.

SarahCD42 wrote:
I am using Lightroom V 3.6.
That's why.
G15 came out after Adobe quit maintaining Lr3.
Yes, Adobe could keep retrofitting old software with new camera support, but they don't.
Note: if they did, the money to do so would be coming from users who pay to upgrade, and only benefit users who haven't paid to upgrade.
Rob

Virtual copies and using Description, or title etc to print

Hi!
Never really use the text features in LR.
I've built a strip sheet to print. 4 strips with 4 versions (VIRTUAL COPIES) of the same image with different exposures.
I remember in the Print Module, you can add text. in this case I'd like to add the exposure (manually is fine) Example: NORMAL +1/3 +2/3 +1
So, this is a virtual copy problem.
It wont allow me to add the text to DESCRIPTION, Also, Under: Title, I can add say NORMAL, but that is the same for each image. Can't be individually labeled?
Is there anyway to label, title, description, etc, a series of the same Virtual Copies. Again, it would be great to print the actual exposure, but I'd be happy manually labeling the VC.
Thank you!
Max

Autowrite is in catalog settings. have you tried another catalog and optimised the current one??
Picturequest wrote:
Okay
In LIBRARY MODULE - Right Panel - METADATA
If I type in the TITLE or DESCRIPTION or COPY NAME, if I then hit enter, tab or return, the cell goes empty.
This is not Virtual Copy related. Even a sing RAW selected, behaves the same.
I can't find the autowrite to XML setting in the Prefs? Not sure where it is.
Weird!

Virtual Copies and Exposure Setting

I've read that the SDK is for export/web/metadata, so apologies for asking a question when I the answer is probably no...
What I'd like to be able to do is write a plugin that would enable me to select an image in the library, and then automatically create virtual copies, with each copy having a variation on the exposure settings, in effect creating a bracketed set, which I can then export for exposure blending.
Is this type of functionality feasible right now?
On the LR/Enfuse plugin guide it says that when batch processing LR/Enfuse can re-import the blended result image into the source image stack, which gives me hope that the SDK can do things with the Library module.

No, it's not possible to do this with the current SDK. The limitation you'll hit with what you're proposing:
You can't create virtual copies of photos via the SDK.
You can't change develop settings via the SDK.
I've noted these as feature requests for future SDK enhancements but I can't make any promises about when/if it might appear.

Virtual copies and DNG files

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