Visible artifacts caused by Fill Light in Lightroom

With the LR V1.0 I noted in many cases very strange looking highlight-shadow edges. This was very pronounced in same cases, and never appeared with RawShooter in similar situations. After having done some experiments I think that one culprit is the Fill Light algorithm. Please take a look at the following example. Its a quite ordinary 8Mpix Canon CR2 file with an ordinary landscape scene. I soon I use some "fill light" to bring up the shadows on the mountain, strange "band of pixels" appears along the edge of the trees and the sky. RawShooter has a similar Fill Light algorithm, which does not case such side effects.
At first I thought that too strong jpeg compression might be causing this, but that I saw this in the Lightroom screen before any conversion.
I made a few screen dumps from 1:1 view of this image fragments:
http://www.pbase.com/phototalk_thh/lightroom_strange_artifacts
Have you also encountered such problem?

Thomas,
Before, I start, I'm going to be entirely objective here. You are having a genuine issue here and I'm approaching from that point completely. You've documented it well, which helps in following it.
Both Fill Light and Highlight recovery use internal masks to work. This means that there has to be an edge somewhere. When dealing with sudden contrast jumps like in your image, then it is possible to get the edge showing. I'm looking at 2 images here on my machine. Both of the same scene. A ruin against a blue sky. One underexposed a lot, the other mildly underexposed. Over 30 of FL gives me an edge like yours on the underexposed image, but not until 60 with the mildly underexposed image. The edge in the first image still looks okay until I start adding Recovery. This is probably because the Masks have the same edge point and are boosting each other, making it look much worse.
FWIW, the Fill Light in Lightroom is not based on any RSP code, so I suspect that a like for like figure comparison is moot, much like comparing F or C scales on a degree by degree basis.
Is there an issue? Not so much on reasonably exposed images, but for underexposed images, I do see an edge when pushing Fill Light in regions of high contrast . It is exacerbated by using Recovery.
It has been mentioned before by me in the past.

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Is there any slider in Aperture that equates to "fill light" in Light Room

is there any slider in Aperture that equates to "fill light" in Lightroom? thank u, joanlvh

I always have to chuckle at this question. Aperture introduced a much, much more sophisticated tool, Highlights and Shadows, in Aperture 2, if not 1.5. Now that Lightroom has finally caught up, everyone thinks that it is something new.
You may find this thread helpful: https://discussions.apple.com/message/18038140#18038140
Bottom line, Highlights and Shadows can do much more than "Fill Light." And, in any case, Lightroom 4 dropped "Fill Light" for ... "Highlights and Shadows."
If you want a brute force "Fill Light", try some of these:
-- "Brightness"
-- Brushing Dodge and Burn
Enjoy!
DiploStrat

Bug - Fill Light slider causes app to hang

Lightroom release v1.0
When I slide the fill light slider to the right I get the hourglass and have to force quit the application.
Using a Dell Insprion 9300 laptop, Pentium M chip 2.0 ghz, 1MB RAM

Do you have an NVIDIA graphics chip in your laptop? If so, disable the nView tool and try again.
Alexander.
Canon EOS 400D (aka. XTi) • 20" iMac Intel • 12" PowerBook G4 • OS X 10.4 • LR 1 • PSE 4

I just downloaded lightroom 5.6. Why do I have fill light and recovery but not highlights and shadows?

I just downloaded lightroom 5.6. Why do I have fill light and recovery but not highlights and shadows?

Your photo is using legacy processing version (2003 or 2010). Click the lightning bolt up near histogram, or use process drop-down at bottom in dev module (right panel, camera cal section) to use current processing version (2012).

Camera Raw 4.0 Fill Light Slider Not Working

Hi,
Just installed Photoshop CS3, and I'm having an annoying problem.
When using Camera Raw 4.0, all the sliders work smootly except for the Filli Light slider. Its the only slider that is almost impossible to adjust via dragging the slider via my mouse. Of course, this is probably my most frequently used adjustment.
The Photoshop CS3 was a clean install, directly from the CD provided by Adobe.
There was never any Beta version installed.
Sure hope that you can help.
Thanks,
Ira

The Fill Light adjustment is the single most processor intensive of all the controls in Lightroom. When you first move the slider it causes Camera Raw to generate a large blur copy of the image and that takes a bit if time. During that initial bit if time, fill Light will NOT be as responsive as the other controls in Lightroom...it only takes a moment but if you are trying to make adjustments while CR is building the mask, you'll get jittery results. The key to using it is to move the adjustment off zero, pause a bit while the mask is being generated and then start fine tuning the adjustment. After that initial move off zero is done, it should be about as fast as most of the other controls-and no, you DON'T want CR to auto-generate the mask for every image by default, it would make Camera Raw much slower overall.

ACR 4: Fill Light and Recovery producing halo effect in CS3

When adjusting Fill Light or Recovery in ACR 4, I'm getting an outlining effect in contrasty areas of some images. Happens with both RAW and DNG files.
 
 This does not manifest itself with any other adjustments.
 
 Anyone else seeing this? I've included a couple of examples, one with no post processing and one with Fill adjustment only.
 
 Thanks
 
 David
 
 
<a href="http://www.pixentral.com/show.php?picture=1ZY1FghAeIDxaLFKtxfOdGZdXpWTef0" /></a>
<img alt="Picture hosted by Pixentral" src="http://www.pixentral.com/hosted/1ZY1FghAeIDxaLFKtxfOdGZdXpWTef0_thumb.jpg" border="0" />
 
 
<a href="http://www.pixentral.com/show.php?picture=1Lw87lBqNRFsysFUunP73SNwcc9IFo1" /></a>
<img alt="Picture hosted by Pixentral" src="http://www.pixentral.com/hosted/1Lw87lBqNRFsysFUunP73SNwcc9IFo1_thumb.jpg" border="0" />

David,
In case you are still monitoring this discussion, I also have experienced these halos whilst using Lightroom to edit Tif files which are both under and overexposed in the same image - that is, they are very contrasty. This experience has been subsequent to the release of both CS3 and Lightroom - which both use the ACR 4 engine, as I understand it. From my observations, the halos result from using a combination of too much Fill and Recovery but seem more influenced by Recovery than Fill. I have thought that this is not unexpected, and is therefore probably not a bug, as there must be a natural limit to how much of an overly contrasty image that you can rescue. I have been able to minimise (but not completely eliminate) the halo effect by judicious use of added Exposure in lieu of some Fill (to recover at least partially some of the underexposed regions) and a reduced amount of Recovery - and just accepting that all the highlights might not be as optimally enhanced as desired. Perhaps the halo effect produced by these wonderful tools may be further reduced in subsequent releases of CS3(ACR4) and Lightroom - a possibility hinted at by Jeff Schewe in his reply to your post.

Fill Light algorithm

Hi all
I find the fill light slider in lightroom and ACR 4 to over increase saturation creating an unpleasing effect...
... of course my monitor is calibrated and I have everything color managed the right way
I also tried dxo optics pro, ***I LIKE LIGHTROOM BEST*** but... their fill light algorithm gives much more natural effect, so please talented adobe engineers... fix this in next releases
Cheers

To Wolf and Lee :
-Yes shadow/highlight in photoshop is more powerful and can give the exact result one is looking for with some practice
But lightroom is a standalone program aimed at users that doesn't want to much bother with complicated tweaks, I'm not complaining about, I just find that this particular adjustment doesn't match the quality I was expecting
I tried it with a raw file taken by my s3 pro (wich has 14 bit/channel raw format and much more dynamic range then other DSLRS) and I find dxo optics pro giving more pleasing results right away regarding this particular slider
I think that with all the controls we have in lightroom one will be able to achieve the look he's after, and I'm happy with so many tweaks, I particularly like it smart cropping, TAT, the vibrance slider and the facilitated curves controls are really nice and so far unmatched by any other software I know
But still IMHO fill light slider could me much better, trying this particular function in dxo confirmed what I was thinking
regards

What happened to fill light in Camera Raw 7? I miss it.

Fill light seems to be missing in Camera Raw 7...how to substitute for it?

If you really, really want it back you can force the conversion to use process 2010.
But try Trevor's suggestion, and especially try taking the time to unlearn the old way and get used to using all the new controls. I'm finding it easier to get good results more quickly with the new setup.
-Noel

Photoshop CC camera raw 8.5 where is the fill light and recovery buttons

I have mac OS and I downloaded Photoshop CC and camera raw 8.5, I don't' see fill light and recovery button.

Photoshop CC camera raw 8.5 where is the fill light and recovery buttons
Hi Teresa, you may have worked this out already? but i just downloaded Photoshop CC and I too used the recovery and fill light buttons and couldnt see them in the raw processing window... HOWEVER!! i did some research and they are available!! YAY, you can toggle between the latest and the older layout... and the recovery and fill optoins ARE there... the link explains it... but when you open some raw files... on the right you should see a little camera - camera calibration button when you click on there the first drop down PROCESS - change to 2012 mode and then click back to the BASIC processing wheel and they will be there... cheers Danni

Fill light presets for PV2012

I don't claim that these will match PV2010 fill light. What I claim is, these applied after import will provide a fill light - like effect similar in strength to fill light of the same name. I used to start many of my images with fill light, and these are a way to get to similar starting points faster.
Fill Light 20
Exposure 0.27
Contrast -15
Highlights -10
Shadows +10
Clarity 5
Saturation 5
Fill Light 40
Exposure 0.55
Contrast -30
Highlights -20
Shadows +20
Clarity 10
Saturation 10
Fill Light 60
Exposure 0.83
Contrast -50
Highlights -50
Shadows +50
Clarity 20
Saturation 25
Fill Light 80
Exposure 1.1
Contrast -60
Highlights -50
Shadows +50
Clarity 20
Saturation 25

Well, whilst it may well be a bug, it still can be used to create some interesting images. Try setting the Black level slider to the same value as Fill light one - this creates an interesting stylized effect. This however does not work on all the images.
Look for Paris photos (colour ones) here http://www.aletan.com - these are examples where Fill light and blacks were both upped to 100.
Alex

A few months ago I bought an imac 27 inch late 2013 ... ever since I have continuously problems with my external HDD that disconnect all the time and cause problems in other software (Lightroom, Adobe PS CS6) ...

a few months ago I bought an imac 27 inch late 2013 .. §16GB - and flash memory) - 3,3 Ghz Intel Core 15
ever since I have continuously problems with my external HDD that disconnect all the time and cause problems in other software (Lightroom, Adobe PS CS6) ... it is not a HDD problem, because it occurs with my 3TB WD HDD (Time Machine), my 1TB WD and 1TB IOMEGA
any one have a solution? anyone dealt with this problem in the apple care program?

You are still under warranty and/or have AppleCare. Call them. Let them deal w/it.

Equivalent of 'Fill LIght' slider

Hi all.
I'm just getting used to Aperture after years in Photoshop and loving it.
One slider I'm missing. The Fill light slider in CR4.1 does a great job of opening up dark shadow details without affecting the blacks.
What's the best way to do the same thing in Aperture? I've tried using both the Shadow/Highlight and the Quarter Tone levels sliders but wondered if anyone had any problems/successes with these or other methods?
Any other suggestions?
Thanks.
M.

Shadows in the shadows/highlights brick is the equivalent adjustment. They're the same thing, they're just named differently in the two programs.

Incorporating Active D-lighting in Lightroom or Bridge?

I would like to have the capability of using the Nikon 800 Active D-Lighting when I want it.
My organizing and basic (gross) adjustments happen in Lightroom 5.3. Lightroom, and as near as I can find, NO Adobe products (Lightroom, Bridge, Photoshop) can read the ADL information from a Nikon D800 .NEF, so apparently I have to go outside my normal workflow to incorporate the ADL data.
I'm looking for the simplest and most efficient way to get from a NEF that has information Adobe won't read to some kind of raw file (a .dng?) WITH the ADL data. So far, the only path I've found is to open the images in View NX2 and convert them to 16-bit tiff files because View NX2 doesn't have any "convert to dng" that I can find.
Then, I have to open the tiff files in Bridge (or LR), shove them into ACR, and save them as .dng files. Aside from being clumsy, the .dng files are HUGE... a 48MB .NEF becomes a 42MB (approximately) .dng file. BUT, if I go through View NX2 and generate .tiff files, the tiff conversion to .dng generates a file between 110 and 120MB - almost THREE TIMES larger than a .dng created directly from the .nef.
Is there a reasonable way of getting a source file into Bridge orLightroom that incorporates the data in the Nikon .NEF?

DavePinMinn wrote:
I've seen arguments both ways
Many are made by people who don't know what they're talking about, even some proclaimed to be "experts" .
DavePinMinn wrote:
Picture Controls - similar results from calibrations in ACR?
Active D-Lighting - maybe sort-of doable in ACR although from what I understand it there's no substitute for the in-camera shadow curve applied
Vignette Control - I presume ACR does something similar in effects?
Auto Distortion Control - don't know whether the loss of this is a problem or not
High ISO NR - does ACR do a better job with this than the camera can do? seems like this one would be nice to have from the camera
All Settings from “Custom Setting Menu” - I'm not sure what other settings there may be
Focus Point Location in the frame - interesting to have but most times not critical
Only thing Lr reads is white balance and in a few cases some other thing.
My biggest complaint about Nikon manuals, is nothing talks about which settings affect raw data and which don't.
Turns out, other than a possible reduction in exposure via ADL, none of them affect the raw data - they only affect the creation of the jpeg(s) by camera firmware or Nikon software. (I mean, basic exposure settings affect raw data too, but none of the others do).
To me, this is a really good thing - shooting raw means all you have to worry about when shooting is getting the exposure right - yippee!: the rest you can worry about in post.
DavePinMinn wrote:
I may as well shut off most of the unique settings the D800 can adjust 'cause they won't be read anyhow.
Or just forget about them. Personally, I shoot with a contrast reduced & saturation increased neutral profile - all the time. This allows me to better assess raw exposure, highlight/shadow detail, and captured color.
DavePinMinn wrote:
I understand better now why there are people in other forums swearing by the Nikon software...
Yeah - they haven't mastered ACR! Seriously, ACR's lens corrections are very good, and color handling, and sharpening, and noise reduction, and ...
Nikon's editing toolset is far more extensive than ACR, but in terms of the basics, I think ACR is better.
DavePinMinn wrote:
Focus Point Location in the frame..
Yep - a point in favor of Nikon software to be sure.
ExifMeta can show focus point(s), in custom-friendly (text) format, but not on the image itself, so ya still gotta use your powers of visualization...
Rob

Removing Photoshop Elements 9 caused missing lens profiles in Lightroom 3.3

After my trial on Photoshop Elements 9 expired I removed it from my Windows Vista system. The next time I started Lightroom 3.3 I tried to apply a Canon lens profile to some new images and the profile was missing, not only was it not on the list, none of the 862 images taken with this lens had the profile applyed to them anymore. I tried to repair the installation and it failed saying I was missing components. I then tried to upgrade to RC 3.4 & it failed with the same message. I finally thought it might have been caused by the removal of Photoshop Elements so I went to the restore point that it did prior to removal. Now I have the lens profile back that was missing the Canon EF28-135mm profile as well as to the other 862 images. My question is should there be anything else I should look for to see if it is missing or damaged? Thanks - Larry

Larry,
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C:\ProgramData\Adobe\CameraRaw
This directory contains lens and camera profiles installed with LR
2) User related configuration files:
C:\Users\[username]\AppData\Roaming\Adobe\CameraRaw
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Downloaded/created lens profiles
ACR defaults (like ACR cache size, any defaults set in LR)
Downloaded/created camera profiles
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Switzerland

W510 causing my room lights to flicker

New w510. When I plug the powerpack into an outlet which is on the same circuit with a bunch of compact florescents that I have in this room, the lights start flickering at regular intervals.
Apparently the power pack is putting a surge on the line or drawing lots of power at certain intervals. The interval is around a second or two.
Is this a defect?
Fire hazard?
Damaging to other electrical equipment?
Any ideas what might be going on? We have lots of computers here, an older Lenovo T61. I've never seen anything cause the lights to flicker.
The power pack does not seem unusually warm or having any indication of being defective.

The draw should not be very great. If you were complaining about a high-draw appliance, like a refrigerator, I would suggest a loose ground somewhere in the circuit. I think you may have a shielding problem in the adapter. I have seen problems like this in a couple of instances, but only when using a cheap knock-off adapter. In that case, it also caused static if a radio was plugged into the same circuit. If it is under warranty, I would call support and tell them I was afraid it would cause a fire, even though I know that isn't going to happen. It might make it more likely they would send a replacement.

Visible artifacts caused by Fill Light in Lightroom

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