Gradient Dithering

I realise Illustrator is a vector drawing program, but a lot of us use it to build dynamic user interfaces to output bitmap graphics. There are tools to export bitmap images (save for web and export as PNG) to this should also be optimised for it. One area that illustrator is really lacking in outputting good quality bitmap graphics is the lack of gradient dithering that can be found in photoshop.
Marc Edwards has a great writeup on this.
http://bjango.com/articles/illustratorandappdesign/
I'm sure it could be implemented as an Appearance Effect since dithering occurs at a pixel level.

They don't list Layer style gradient dither in Photoshop's feature list, but it is in CS6. I don't have acces to Illustrator CS6 and would like to know if these features/issues have been addressed. Have searched high and low on the net to see if anyone has mentioned any of these things and have found nothing, hence me asking on the forum.
I wouldn't expect Adobe to put 'Now with better circles!' on the feature list.

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    Cobby Fred wrote:
    I have to thank you all for your assistance so far. I must say I only know how to put some few things together and I do not understand some of the technical words you used such as dither, geometric dithering, blending mode... But in all I understand that if I blend colors that are close I'll get something close to smooth.
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    Hiya!
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  • Gradient with dither creates artifacts beyond gradation

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    Is this a known feature

    (sorry for the delay, I just found this report on someone else's bug list)
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    "Pixilated" may be the wrong term.  If you're talking about the appearance of bands in the data, perhaps you're referring to Posterization.
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  • Gradient Banding

    Over the years, working with Illustrator, I've come to expect that Illustrator just has issues with creating gradients, and the only way to get a good smoothly transitioned gradient is to use Photoshop. I'm  really suprised that Adobe hasn't  solved this by now. I've been reading posts about gradient banding only in dark shadows, that the banding goes away when printing, or people just trying to say that a particular gradient just can't be recreated due to the limitations of a mathmatically defined gradient. I understand completely that the gradients in Illustrator are mathmatically defined, but essentially, so are the gradients in Photoshop, even if they end up being rendered as a bitmap, correct? I also understand that images can have stepped gradients as a result of either color profile gamuts, or bit depth, however the banding I've run into is not a result of monitor issues, limited color gamut, bit depth, or excessively dark gradients and the banding is in Illustrator, shows up in the exported file (tiff, I've also tried rasterizing the AI file in Photoshop with 16bit bit depth and still got banding) as well as prints, because it's IN the file. Below is a Tiff file that shows a gradient created in Illustrator CS6 on the left, Photoshop in the middle and the original art from Illustrator on the right. You won't be able to see the banding in the file unless you download it and view it at 100%.
    So, the question is, is there a workaround in Illustrator, or a alternate way of creating gradients directly in Illustrator that will prevent this banding that I've somehow been missing in the 10 years I've been working with it? Also, Adobe, is anyone there trying to solve this problem?
    -Matt

    Over the years...I've come to expect that Illustrator just has issues with creating gradients...
    And what other vector drawing programs have you used which have no occurrence of gradient banding?
    ...and the only way to get a good smoothly transitioned gradient is to use Photoshop.
    Contrary to popular misconception, raster imaging is not immune to gradient banding. Consider: Everything you view on your monitor is a raster image.
    I'm really suprised that Adobe hasn't solved this by now....I understand completely that the gradients in Illustrator are mathmatically defined, but essentially, so are the gradients in Photoshop, even if they end up being rendered as a bitmap, correct?... Also, Adobe, is anyone there trying to solve this problem?
    What do you expect Adobe to do about math?
    I've been reading posts about gradient banding only in dark shadows, that the banding goes away when printing, or people just trying to say that a particular gradient just can't be recreated due to the limitations of a mathmatically defined gradient.
    This has been discussed at length many times in this forum. What part of what you've read do you not understand, or to what specifically do you take exception?
    I also understand that images can have stepped gradients as a result of either color profile gamuts, or bit depth, however the banding I've run into is not a result of monitor issues, limited color gamut, bit depth, or excessively dark gradients...
    How do you know the banding you're seeing is not a result of any of those issues?
    ...and the banding is in Illustrator, shows up in the exported file (tiff, I've also tried rasterizing the AI file in Photoshop with 16bit bit depth and still got banding)...
    Where are you viewing the Illustrator, TIFF, and Photoshop grads? (On your monitor.)
    ...as well as prints, because it's IN the file.
    It's in what you're viewing (the print). To see if the same banding pattern is in the image file, open the image file, count the bands, and actually measure and compare the pixel color values between the bands.
    Below is a Tiff file that shows a gradient created in Illustrator CS6 on the left, Photoshop in the middle and the original art from Illustrator on the right.
    No, below is a JPEG assembled from screenshots from your monitor.
    You won't be able to see the banding in the file unless you download it and view it at 100%.
    You can see the banding at multiple zooms. The bands change because of the resampling that your video system performs when it resamples on the fly when zooming or scaling.
    ...is there a workaround in Illustrator, or a alternate way of creating gradients directly in Illustrator that will prevent this banding that I've somehow been missing in the 10 years I've been working with it?
    There is no workaround that will prevent all banding in all grads in all situations in Illustrator or any other program. So you'll have to be much more methodical and specific in your question if you really want to understand what is going on.
    All images have banding, just as all raster images have "jaggies" (square-shaped pixels). The issue in both matters is to make them fine enough to be negligible. Visible "jaggies" is a mathematical conseqence involving the factors of pixel size and halftone dot size. Similarly, visible banding is a mathematical consequence involving the factors of number of tones (for each color channel or separation ink) that an imaging device (monitor or press) can render, and the distances spanned by each possible value step.
    When you send a linear grad command to a PostScript device, you are sending a command to vary from color A to color B across distance D in however many steps the device can handle. The device does what it physically can within its hardware limitations. Same is true for your monitor. But the limitations differ between the devices.
    So the banding you see on your monitor differs from the banding you will see on your desktop printer and from the banding you will see on film seps and from the banding you will see on press. The specifics depend on the specifics of the artwork and the imaging systems.
    Your monitor can display 32 bit color. But how many of those values are available to paint a gradient across a distance depends on how many different colors--and how different they are--to be displayed across how many monitor pixels.
    Your desktop printer has a fixed number of printer spots. The printer spots are used to build up halftone dots of varying size. How many different sizes of halftone dots (how many levels of gray) the printer can build is a mathematical function between the number of printer spots and the number of halftone dots available within a given distance. If the differences in adjacent tones (for each color separation involved) is finer than the differences between possible gray levels of the halftone screen, posterization occurs and you see it as bands in a linear grad.
    An imagesetter has a greater number of printer spots and can therefore build more different sizes of halftone dots for any given halftone ruling than can your desktop printer. So it is less prone to banding because it is able to render more levels of gray. But it is not immune. You can still exceed its possibilities by demanding finer differences in tone steps than it can reproduce.
    Banding is quite often ameleorated in print because (depending on the number of component inks involved in the subject color), the bands occur at different places on each color separation. So the resulting bands in the composite are narrower than on the individual seps, and therefore less evident. The same principle occurs on your desktop printer, but at a courser scale, because it is still a lower resolution device.
    Banding is just as likely to occur in mathematically applied linear grads in raster imaging. The rasterization is not deferred to print time, it goes ahead and occurs. But the same principle applies. You are still telling the program to change the values of a fixed number of pixels in 8-bit channels. The result is being displayed on your monitor's array of pixels. When printed, the result is being rendered on the printer's (or film's) array of halftone dots. So the banding quite likely occurs at different locations from where they occur on your monitor. In other words, I don't care what you're doing, your monitor is a poor simulation of the banding that will occur in final print. For one thing, everything you see on your monitor involves three "separations" (RGB), not four.
    The myth that raster imaging is somehow magically immune to banding stems from the fact that raster images are very frequently not really linear grads, but scattered dithering patterns (otherwise known as noise). If you use a linear grad tool in a raster image program to paint a linear grad across a broad distance of pixels, you can create banding just as you would in a vector-based program. If you do, then the bands are "nailed down" (rasterization is not deferred to print time) and if the imaging device has sufficient resolution, it will faithfully reproduce that same banding.
    Back when raster file size was a much greater issue than it is nowadays, there were 8-bit raster imaging programs (Color It! being one example) which could make beautiful images using only 256 different colors. How did they do it? By effective use of dithering. The differences in adjacent colors were greater than those of a 24-bit image. But they were mixed and scattered so as to simulate additional colors, just as the droplets from an airbrush spraying a single color can result in the perception of multiple tones, just  as a halftone screen does the same thing. Well, the nature of raster imaging is like that. Zoom way into what looks like a smoothly graduated sky and you'll see that it is in fact a scattered mixture of different values (noise).
    Vector-based grads don't involve noise. They're just mathematical commands sent to the printer's interpreter. If you must, though, you can assign noise as a raster effect to your vector objects, and it can reduce visible banding because what you would really be sending to the printer ultimately is a dithered raster image.
    So you just have to use some educated (i.e.; experienced) discernment when creating grads and when interpreting what you see on your monitor. And bear the general rules-of-thumb in mind:
    The greater the distance spanned, the fewer component inks involved, the smaller the color change, the lower resolution the imaging device...the greater the likelihood of banding.
    Set up some simple tests using simple grads in methodically arranged different values. You can build such a test array on a single page, just as you would build an array of color chips. Print it. Study the results.
    JET

  • Photoshop CC gradient banding

    I've been a using Photoshop for 20 years (as a design professional) and only since I switched to CC a few months ago, I get awful obvious banding when creating gradients. Even in rgb files, which sometimes used to occur in cmyk. Nothing seems to get rid of it, and I'm NOT looking for a noise or blur solution, please, so don't suggest that.
    I did the same actions in Adobe 4 which I still have on another computer and it doesn't occur. I hate this. Any suggestions? I have a new latest iMAC so it doesn't seem like that would be the issue.

    Greetings from Boise. I'm in a big rush so didn't go through all the answers, but have some suggestions (late to the party, I know).
    In RGB banding is more likely if you have a dominant hue, such as Blue (which accounts for far less than 10% of any Pixel's Luminance value). Additionally, it is more likely if you are working in 8 bits per Channel: this is due to "Quantization," or the Luminance "steps" between various Channel values. In 8 bits, there is a noticeable difference between, say, 125 and 126. Again, this is most noticeable with a dominant Hue. Human vision is very sensitive to Luminance Deltas (differences).
    Work in 16 bits, aRGB (not PPRGB, nor sRGB). I know there are arguments for sRGB, but: http://www.forensicallyfit.net/2012/04/16/argb-srgb-gamut-accuracy-conversion-delta-e/
    When you build the Gradient, in the Gradient Dialogue Box ensure that you select adjust the "Smoothness" control up. This will produce a dithering in the Gradient to combat Posterization. Additionally, when you have the Gradient Tool Selected, check your Options ToolBar to ensure that the Dither checkbox is selected.
    There are some very clever things you can do like overlaying and averaging Gradient Layers, but I mention that because it is only necessary in extreme cases.
    Here's a good exercise: generate a monochromatic (0-255) Linear Gradient without Smoothing and without Dither. Note the shape of the Histogram: it is "platykurtic," meaning that it is very flat and regular.
    Now-without changing the Gradient Stops or Colors, apply Smoothing and/or Dither, or both:
    Now the Histogram is neither evenly distributed nor smooth. This tells you-primarily-that what amounts to Noise (synthetic value Pixels) are being generated by PS in the background to blend the various Quantization Levels. You will probably not find them objectionable in even large prints. This is a superb way to mitigate "banding."
    Finally, you should know about a "gotcha." You'll notice (using your Info Window) that the Pixel Values of a 16 bit Document range from 0-32768, which represents 15 bits, not 16 (which would range from 0-65535). So, you are actually working in 15 bits, but the difference is unimportant to the human eye...unless, like me, you hallucinate a lot. Ahem. Anyway, you are in 15 bits (this is done to accomodate Blending Mode math).

  • T400 LCD Panel Dithering

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  • Why my gradients looks like so bad?

    When I do a gradient, it looks horrible. Everything is good if I do gradient in white to black etc. But if I do from light black to dark black it looks like this. Different software like Corel Draw gives me a beautiful gradiients. Of course also dark to darker.
    I work with CMYK and my graphics card is GeForce 660 GTX
    Any tip, advice?

    How the gradient appears where people see it should be a bigger concern than just how it appears in Illustrator or Corel.
    I did a test in Illustrator CC 2014 and CorelDRAW X7 where I setup the exact same scenario you did. I have a square box with a circular gradient going from 0,0,0,70 in the middle to 0,0,0,100 on the outside. Corel had a significantly better looking gradient than Illustrator did, however the final output of the gradient is what I’m more interested in.
    I exported both as 300dpi CMYK TIF files where both images are embedding the U.S. Web Coated (SWOP) v2 ICC profile. Opening both in Photoshop there is almost no visible difference between the two gradients. I placed them both in a single document and masked off one side of the top image. The image below shows how the files look at 300% and you can see that both images have banding. This is because the distance between the two selected colors are too near the other therefore you're going to get more visual stepping. Let me know If you know for certain which side is the CorelDRAW generated gradient.  =^ )
    If you want to know why Photoshop gradients appear so silky smooth it’s because Photoshop creates raster images which aren’t as mathematically strict as Illustrator and CorelDRAW are. Gradients in Photoshop are generated using dithering to help give the illusion of smoothness. The image below is a 500% close-up of the same 70-100 gradient and if you look close enough you can see that Photoshop is using a random dot pattern to help hide the transition from one transition step to another.

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