No shuttling of Long-GOP?

I'm still new to Pr. Up to now, I've been editing with ProRes or DVCProHD. Those are intraframe codecs. I just loaded a 7D project (h264). I have no ability whatsoever to shuttle the Source or Sequence monitors. I only get an update when I release the CTI. And not only that, the update takes a second or two.
Is this how Pr handles Long-GOP codecs?
Is this how FCPX does it? I'm intrigued by their skimmer, and I wonder whether it works on Long-GOP; and if Apple can skim or shuttle, can't Adobe?
If this is the way Pr handles Long-GOP, I'm going to go back to transcoding it all before editing, and start ridiculing the idea of native editing in Pr.
Somebody please tell me that I'm doing something wrong.
I don't have a CUDA card installed. If I got one, could I shuttle like I can with intraframe sources?
I'm on a pretty fast MacPro octo 3GHz, with my footage on a roughly 1GB/s RAID.

Hi Jim
Really, for 5D or 7D footage, you don't need to transcode with Premiere Pro. I edit that footage all the time with a bunch of other codecs too, sometimes a 5D, 7D, AVCHD 60P, EX all running in a multiclip, and don't usually experience what you are seeing.
AVCHD plays about as well as 5D or 7D, maybe slightly more lag. I actually use a 60P version of AVCHD which I think is more stressful on PPro and it's fine for the most part. BTW, AVCHD is using H.264 encoding, the AVCHD denotes all the extra files that surround the .MTS files inside the AVCHD 'wrapper' and it's what Blu Ray and all kinds of AVCHD camcorders use. When you bring a AVCHD directory into PPro, it strips out everything and you wind up with those .MTS files.
I use the same 'selects' technique as you. I'll drop everything shot on a timeline and then do selects. Sometimes I'll sync a bunch of footage together (using PluralEyes -available for FCP and PPro) and do selects on a variety of shots. I scrub through 'virgin' shots to do this, and I can do it all day. Occasionally there will be a pause before the new clip appears in either the source viewer or program, like PPro needs to fill a buffer, but for the most part it's pretty smooth. If I'm doing a bunch of disk access in the background with other apps things bog down, and sometimes I'll notice this and I'll notice that I'm doing some background copying or whatever and I'll stop that and then PPro picks up.
I do have very fast eSATA RAID connections running around 200-250MB/second on 5 different separate drives.
Also, I think that where your 'media cache database' and 'media cache files' (check PPro prefs) are stored should be a fast drive with a fast connection. I use my fastest drives for that.
On the Mac, use Activity monitor to see if some other non-PPro process is taking up cycles when you're trying to shuttle, this would result in the problems you're seeing as well.
Try this:
You have the ability to adjust the playback resolution of both the source viewer and the program viewer, it's a little menu in the right top corner of those panels. Adjust it to something other than what causes you problems. Intuitively having 1/2 or 1/4 would seem to make it work better, but sometimes having it full works better, even if the panel is not big, especially with H.264 encoded material.
BTW, Quicktime player is very bad playing back H.264 anything, the underlying engine is just not built for it. However, even on my Mac, which is not as fast as yours, QT plays back native 7D files fine, though scrubbing is not great. If you want to see how Premiere should play back on a Mac, use the free Movist, it's the best and simpliest and least expensive player of anything out there. QT will not play back AVCHD files that well if at all, as they are more highly compressed than Canon H.264.
That being said, if you can live with the transcoding model, using MPeg streamclip to Prores is probably the smoothest and fastest way, however, gave up that model a long time ago when I switched to PPro. It's a joy to not fill up hard drives with terabytes of prores nor take the initial time to transcode and instead use the source material directly. You'll also avoid strange QT gamma problems if you use the source files rather than the Mpeg / QT transcodes. Look up Shane Hurlbut's talks on these issues. Tons of former FCP DSLR and AVCHD editors have done the same. Figure out the time savings and hard drive savings and it behooves you to try to make the Premiere Pro non-transcode model work for you.

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Sony EX1R MPEG-2 Long GOP

Dear Apple,
you are a fan for all your Apple products, recently I bought a SONY camera EX1R MPEG-2 Long GOP CODEC.
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I was wondering if you're planning to read this format in IMOVIE
future version?

There is no one from Apple here. This is a user to user forum. I suggest you provide feedback to Apple by clicking iMovie/Provide Feedback within iMovie.
A couple of thoughts...
It seems a bit of a mismatch to pair a $7,000 camcorder with a $15 editing app, but I agree with you. iMovie is a pleasure to edit in.
Since you are likely to have Final Cut Pro installed, you should be able to import from this camera into ProRes422 using FCP. iMovie 11 can edit ProRes 422 (but only if Final Cut Pro or Logic Studio is installed), so you might try editing in iMovie that way. I base this on hearsay since I do not own Final Cut Pro or a $7,000 camera.
Good luck.

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getting red frames when export from cc 2014.2 codec used panasonic mxf format long GOP 50p. If any solution please help on that

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Shuttle No Longer Works. Song Playing Repeats

Starting yesterday, no matter what mode of iTunes my iPhone is in, Shuttle no longer works. The first song that is played repeats after it is finished. To move on, I have to press fast forward.

Play a song.
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100mb long gop or 200MB iframe for editing?

Hi
Hope to shoot various slomo, regular speed, timelapse of ballet/jazz dancers agaianst a white curtain on a black stage. Using my SONY EX1R and probably renting a NANO which will give me 100MB or more...
Question is, should I record it in in the NANO at 100MB or more long gop or 200MB-ish iframe, what's the difference and can FCP 7 and my MAC PRO 3.0, 7200rpm internal hard drives edit this kind of footage - probably shoot 1280x720 24p 60fps mostly.
THX

Don't shoot any kind of Long GOP if you can avoid it. They are not editing formats and will have to be transcoded to an iFrame format.
Many consumer and prosumer cams shoot Long GOP MPEG 2 or MPEG 4 and FCP does a very good job of transcoding to ProRes for example, but you need to take a look in the Easy Setups menu. Those are the formats that FCP works with.

Using EX1 and native Long GOP with FCP

Hi,
I have heard it suggested on forums that presently FCP has a preference to convert HDV to prores and that if you want to work with GOP, the files have to be converted to prores in compressor for the workflow?
How does FCP handle native GOP as a workflow rather then converting to prores? I have a Macbook 2.2GHz Intel Core 2 Duo with 4GB ram and am worried that my system will not be fast enough to work with this material?
Also, if I work with native GOP and set the render to prores 442, will this have any effect on the performance on FCP (bearing in mind the speed of my machine)?
Thanks

I have heard it suggested on forums that presently FCP has a preference to convert HDV to prores and that if you want to work with GOP, the files have to be converted to prores in compressor for the workflow?
When capturing from HDV via Firewire you have the option to capture as native HDV, Apple Intermediate Codec (AIC) or Apple ProRes 422. All of these formats are natively supported formats that you can easily work with in FCP. Your post title suggests that you are actually working with an EX1 and so would not be capturing HDV via Firewire. With the EX1 your basic choice would be direct clip transfer via the Sony's Log and Transfer plugin or by using Sony's XDCAM Transfer app, neither of which provide transcode during capture to any other codec. Such captured footage would have to be transcoded after capture, using Compressor or similar, if you wished to work natively in a different format. Alternatively you could use a third party I/O device to capture your footage to another format via the camera's HD-SDI output.
How does FCP handle native GOP as a workflow rather then converting to prores? I have a Macbook 2.2GHz Intel Core 2 Duo with 4GB ram and am worried that my system will not be fast enough to work with this material?
FCP handles working with native HDV easily. With FCP 6 you also have the option of choosing to work with the native HDV and have FCP handle all rendering using the Apple ProRes 422 codec. Another option in FCP is the Open Format Timeline, which like the rendering option above, allows you to edit with the native HDV clips directly in an Apple ProRes 422 timeline. Your MacBook should be fast enough to handle any of the above workflow choices, though my recommendation for you would be to work in a native HDV timeline with renders set to ProRes. That set up would probably provide the maximal performance for your system.
Also, if I work with native GOP and set the render to prores 442, will this have any effect on the performance on FCP (bearing in mind the speed of my machine)?
As noted, that setup should work well.

Help with FCP and long project editing - Thanks!

I have posted several questions in this discussion group and in the iMovie group to no avail. I get a lot of answers, but not from anyone who has actually done any of the editing I am seeking. So if anyone has actually done the editing I am describing below -- I appreciate your help. Yes, I have searched the archives -- but again, I see a lot of confusing feedback. I have been working on this for three days now and it's driving me crazy! I have discovered that iMoive is $#@% -- and does not work with a long project, (40 minutes) so I am thinking about switching to FCP-HD. Thanks.
Here goes:
1: I need to transfer original master footage, 1080i HDV from a Sony HDR-FX1 to an editing program, edit the tapes (over 5 hours total) into a 50 minute "program". I then need to "share" or export the footage back to a new tape, using the Sony HDR-FX1 as the receiving camera. Simple enough.
2: I need to make sure the outgoing footage is of equal quality as the original footage taken from the camera. I am guessing here, that the footage can be edited in FCP-5 as "native" -- then transferred back to the Sony?
3: I am assuming that the native footage is just that -- and will not require the long process of converting to another format, e.g., ASI that takes hours to
render. (as in iMovie).
4: I am assuming I can edit and view HDV as native footage in FCP in real time, like iMovie, via firewire from the camera?
I really appreciate any assistance.
Chance

Welcome to the family, you'll be joining us soon.
The FCP product page says: > It features powerful new multicamera editing, native HDV support, ... edit everything from DV and SD to DVCPRO HD and fully uncompressed 10-bit high-definition video. Or work with new formats like native HDV (long-GOP MPEG2) and 50Mbps IMX... HD editing requires a 1GHz or faster PowerPC G4 or G5 and 1GB of RAM (2GB recommended).<
You seem to have the hardware including the Flux-o-pator, but, really, you want to talk to an Apple reseller who handles FCP and understands HDV via Sony. I don't like the way you're using "I am assuming..." You can't assume anything. Give them a chance to sell you FCP or Studio and go demo your camera on their system. You will have concrete evidence of the minimum machine specs and how well you can get your files in and out of the application.
Call you local Mac user group and try to locate other FCP users.
Try also the creativecow.net forums for Sony HD products.
Google your camera model for support groups.
bogiesan

Does FCP support 1080i open GOP HDV files?

Hello........
A FCP pre-purchase customer question:
Will FCP support 1080i open GOP HDV for seamless editing ? My capturing device requires it.
My previous NLE has frame errors/stutters that occur when placing two or more .m2t or .mov clips side by side that were captured consecutively on a Firestore Recorder (FS-4 Pro HD).
The Firestore FS-4 ProHD captures 1080i HDV into 9 minute clips ( approx 2GB, but not always the exact same byte size ), which then can be dropped into an NLE timeline and played back seamlessly, one after another. This feature is essential to my multi-cam editing of 2 hour live music performances.
I've gotten approval from Firestore to use FCP, Canopus Edius, or Avid, and I'm willing to give FCP a try if Apple can absolutely confirm before purchasing.
Dual 2 GHz Power PC G5 Mac OS X (10.4.9)

FCS2 doesn't support .m2t files, you will need to use Streamclip to convert if your Firestore device doesn't make .mov files.
http://www.squared5.com/
FCS2 supports long Gop HDV editing,
Good Luck
Z1&V1user

Final shuttle question!

Hi,
Thanks to all who have helped me so far. I think I'm at the last hurdle
To summerise so far. I have a table with an Oracle text index on it that I wanted to be able to filter on. I'm not great with AJAX, so I've tried my best to stick with PL/SQL as I'm more familiar with it.
I have use a procedure to populate a temp table with the data I needed to pick from using a query that includes the oracle text elelments that I wanted to use.
I've added a filter that submits the page and returns the query with any new filtered values.
Yesderday's task was to populate the right hand side of the table with already selected values.
Today I have created the code to add and delete entries that are new or back in the left hand side.
My last problem is that the left hand side of the shuttle is long. When the page is submitted it scans down the whole length of the left hand shuttle before it continues. So whilst the page is functioning correctly it doesn't look great.
I added a button that calls a javascript function
function clearList()
var rl = document.getElementById("P27_ECLASS_LEFT");
rl.options.length = 0;
in the hope that it would clear down the left hand side and stop the scan, but it doesn't seem to do anything.
I know the function is running because the first time it ran I'd mispelt it and got an error!
Anyone got any bright ideas?
Thanks
John

Hi John,
The function looks ok. I've tested it here: [http://apex.oracle.com/pls/otn/f?p=22619:19] and it seems to work as you require. It possibly depends on how you are calling it and then submitting the page.
Andy

Long export time

XDCAM EX 720p (16:9) (HDTV 720p (16:9). I changed the render settings to ProRes 422 from "same as codec", as many have recommended. But two minutes clip takes up to 15 minutes to export to QuickTime self-contained. This process takes only seconds when using "same as codec". Is this normal ? I tried to change the compression settings to ProRes422 and then it was much faster but some in this forum advices me not to change that setting. I would appreciate very much if someone could give me some explanation.

Finnur Bardarson wrote:
I am not going to output the material as ProRes. It will still be XCDCAM EX. I am only talking about ProRes render option, which make it take a long time to export.
Hello Finnur.
Here's an excerpt from a workflow document that I wrote regarding using XDCAM in FCP. I hope this helps clarify the difference between render and export settings.
*FCP Rendering vs. Exporting*
Final Cut Pro 6 and 7 give the option for HDV and XDCAM HD/EX sequences to be rendered using ProRes instead of the original Codec. This option allows the editor to edit on a native timeline, and also greatly improve render times by rendering in I-Frame instead of Long-GOP.
_Choosing to render in ProRes does not mean that any exporting of that sequence will be exported in ProRes._ There is some confusion regarding this. It must be understood that Rendering for timeline playback and Exporting are two separate operations. When a clip is edited to the timeline, Final Cut is simply referring to the source clip when playing back. However, if that clip needs to be rendered for realtime playback, and the render command is given, Final Cut will create a QuickTime file in the render scratch, and will refer to the resulting QuickTime file instead of the source clip when the timeline is played back. In this example, the render files are ProRes.
Now, when the Export command is given, Final Cut will by default, export using “Current Settings”. This means that the resulting QuickTime file will be written using the current sequence settings, not the current render settings.
Example A: Source clips are XDCAM HD 1080 60i VBR. Sequence is set to match to XDCAM HD 1080 60i VBR. Render control is set to Original Codec (in this case, XDCAM HD 1080 60i VBR). Any rendering for this sequence will be done using Long-GOP Mpeg 2 (XDCAM HD). Any exporting with default settings will be done using Long-GOP XDCAM HD 1080 60i VBR.
Example B: Source clips are XDCAM EX 1080 60i VBR. Sequence is set to match: XDCAM EX 1080 60i VBR. Render control is set to ProRes 422. Any rendering for this sequence will be done using I-Frame ProRes 422. Render times will be significantly faster than renders done in Example A. Any exporting with default settings will be done using XDCAM EX 1080 60i VBR.

Sony XAVC-Long

How can I import Sony XAVC-Long files into Premiere Elements 13? I want to use the higher bit rates provided by this codec used by the PXW-X70 camera.

I would like to buy the Sony PXW-X70 camera, but don't have it yet. But, yes, Sony says:
When recording in XAVC, the PXW-X70 uses the MXF file format, efficiently compressing full HD (1920 x 1080) resolution using the MPEG-4 AVC/H.264 CODEC. Image sampling is 4:2:2 10-bit with high-efficiency Long GOP compression at 50 Mbps, 35 Mbps, or 25 Mbps.
Sony also says that the camera records AVCHD using a slower bit rate (28 Mbps).
Maybe I'm just stuck trying to transcode XAVC or using the AVCHD format. Or maybe I have to pay for Premiere Pro?

Editing FS7 XAVC footage on Avid: I-frame groovy, L-GOP horrendous

Gidday all, We are experimenting with XAVC AMA in anticipation of our own FS7 finally turning up (any month now!).We have now gotten hold of a decent quantity of FS7 25fps 4K footage, some in I-frame, some Long Gop. Great results with AMA performance to the I-frame material! We can more than comfortably run multiple layers with four or more real-time effects and a realtime LUT applied, and it absolutely sings along, even in non-proxy mode. Scrubbing is fast, playback is quick and perfect, all is well. BUT, sadly, things are absolutely dreadful with Long Gop. Its incredibly sticky and sluggish while scrubbing, drops frames constantly and generally makes it look like our computer is WAY underpowered. Even a single layer with no effects, no LUT, and proxy on 1/16th cannot play back cleanly. It will drop frames constantly, frequently "gum up", and generally be such a pig that it is completely unusable for real editing. Thing is, our computer isn't at all, and when we monitor subsystems nothing seems to be working especially hard... Quadro 4200, 32GB RAM etc, all quite moderately strolling along. Yet the timeline performance is an absolute dog. Here are our system specs:-Avid version: MC 8.3.1Sony XAVC AMA plugin: PDZK-MA2OS: Windows 7Processor: Intel i7 3930kMotherboard: asus p9x79 proGPU: Nvidia quadro k4200RAM: 32gb ddr corsair ram (4x8gb DIMMs)System drive; 128gb Samsung 840 sata3 ssdMedia storage: RAID 0 array of 4*2tb western digital black 7200rpm hddsVideo monioring: Matrox MX02 mini to 1080p screen via HDMI It also seems that the mere presence of L-GOP material through the timeline, even after it is removed, causes similar performance problems to continue, even for I-frame material that is fine if cut in a project by itself. Its looking to us like this must be a software problem, presumably with the Sony AMA plugin. That seems plausible maybe, given that people have been cutting F5 & F55 I-frame footage for a while now, but the Long GOP is brand new? We'd REALLY appreciate any feedback from others to determine if this issue is universal or something bizarre in just our system. Thanks all! Tony

Doug, I'll contact Sony and see what they say about it. But I don't want to get stuck for 2 or more weeks without a camera! I had a PMW-EX1 that died after four hours of power on back in Feb 2008 and what a fiasco to get it replaced! I eventually got a new one as B&H replaced it, but that was reported on the first day of possession. Now it's been over a month and I'll have to deal with Sony, which could take a long time, based on other's experiences reported in forums. Oh, and they lost my packaging last time, so the resale value of the cam just dropped because there's no box anymore to pack it in. Sony discarded my box and sent the camera in a smaller instapack box. Tip: never send the camera in the original box! Alister, I made an interesting discovery about playing XAVC-L UHD at 59.94fps.. while Premiere can't fake any semblance of realtime playback, I found that VLC Media Player, after digging through the advanced menus and finding a section where it determine thread usage (default = 1 thread) after I set this to 30 threads, VLC plays the UHD 60FPS XAVC-L file I made (I panned the camera back and forth to simulate worst case motion) fluidly and effortlessly. CPU use= 3%. Furthermore, I invoked 'thread optimization' in nVidia's driver and CPU usage is now 2% when playing the 60FPS video on my 4K monitor. Only problem I see is video "tearing" that slowly works it's way from top to bottom of the monitor. But the VLC playback of all XAVC flavors is totally effortless and barely uses any CPU. No lags, no delays. The problem is Premiere. What a dog.

Somebody help me. pls.

I'm beginner on FCP.
and I captured from my HDV and try to edit.
but,
viewer is strange.
every frame in viewer is white(blank) and sometimes marked "X"
it is normally displayed only when 'play'
In single frame, jogging and shuttling, reverse playing, it just blank,
(when jogging, sound is hearing)
but point it and move to timeline, I can see every single frame.
I already know HDV is long GOP mpeg2 and so it is hard to en/decode.
but I think my case is abnormal.
somebody help me, pls.

but,
viewer is strange.
every frame in viewer is white(blank) and sometimes marked "X"
it is normally displayed only when 'play'
In single frame, jogging and shuttling, reverse playing, it just blank,
(when jogging, sound is hearing)
but point it and move to timeline, I can see every single frame.<
Welcome to the family. Sorry I do not understand your language, I only know English.
Check the Canvas View controls to see if you have set it to ALPHA.
bogiesan

Media encoder cc pauses while I edit in premiere cc!

If I try editing in premiere cc while encoding in media encoder cc, the encode pauses. what gives?

If you'll notice your encoding in AME, it normally maxes out all your CPU cores. It does mine. This is awesome!
But, if you want to edit, you need those cores, especially with Long-GOP footage that relies on CPU for real-time decompression. So, in effect, you're telling your computer to let Pr take over the CPU when you start editing in Pr.
It's a pretty smart way that Adobe enabled this behavior, if you ask me.

Can't import HDV 720p from my Sony HDR HC1 camcorder to my FCP 5.0.1 help

I have footage that was shot on a contractors JVC HDV camera at 720p. I play it in my Sony HDR HC1 and i can view it and it plays awesome. It even recognizes its 720p. But i try to import it into Final Cut Pro on my IMac G5 or powerbook G4 17inch and it can play the camera but not capture footage. I have FCP version 5.0.1 How can i get this video into my editing software ive tried it on imovie as well and cant import video but i can control the camera. Please help.
Do i need to buy the updated FCP i noticed doing some research there is a FCP 5.1 now that i heard nothing about?
Thanks for the help in advance.
powerbook g4 17inch, powerbook G4 12inch, imac G5 Mac OS X (10.4.7)

Get a hold of the JVC camera the footage was shot with. When FCP 5.1.2 is released (this month), you'll actually be able to capture the footage directly... problem is that the JVC recording is short GOP, and FCP currently only supports LONG GOP... You will need to upgrade to capture the footage directly, or buy this: http://www.lumierehd.com But in any event, you'll need the JVC camera to capture it's recordings, now or in the future.
JVC's iteration of HDV isn't the same as Sony's... that's the problem. PLUS FCP doesn't support any recordings of the JVC format except 1080i60 as of now. 5.1.2 will change that I believe. IBC was where this new update was announced I think, and you'll need to "cross grade" your FCP 5.0.x version to FCP 5.1. to get this update down the line... Yeah, I don't like the situation either, but there it is... Canon's HDV and JVC's HDV are very similar FWIW...
Jerry

No shuttling of Long-GOP?

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