OC4J - Hot Deployment Question.

Hi All!
I have a J2EE Application (App.ear), that often change. For every deploy I stop and start the app server (OC4J).
Is there any risk if I adopt the "HOT DEPLOYMENT"? What are the 'Contraries', if there is any?
(The application contain EJB, Servlet ecc.).
Thanks in advance, Veri.

Hello
You can take a look to Debu's blog on Hot Deployment
Regards
Tugdual Grall

Similar Messages

  • OC4J hot deployment

    Hi,
    Does OC4J support hot deployment (with exploded directory structure) ? If so, how to achieve this?
    Thanks in advance,
    Moin

    Have a look at Debu Panda's blog http://radio.weblogs.com/0135826/2004/05/17.html#a30
    This is a really good source for information on OC4J related issues.

  • OC4J Hot Deployment/Extended deployment

    Hi
    Although this question has been asked over and over again, i couldn't find any real solution for my problem... so i'll ask again.
    Context:
    I've started recently using JDeveloper 10.1.2 and it's embedded OC4J server. I was previously working with Eclipse and Tomcat (with tomcat sysdeo plugin).
    In my previous senario, the deployments where made in a directory structure (exploded, not packaged), allowing a more fast reload from the container (when i compiled a class tomcat would automatically reload its context... not always this would work properly, but, still, it mad development a whole lot easear).
    Problem:
    I'm not able to do the same in Jdev/OC4J. Every time i compile a knew class, i have to start the server all over again, witch is a really tedious task... (each start can take more then five minutes, many times only to realize that i had done something wrong and have to restart).
    Question:
    Can this go faster? Can OC4J make extended deployments? If so, will that mean that i don't have to generate the hole ear file each time a make some change in a class?
    Or just, how do you develop in OC4J in a more productive away?
    Thanks in advance
    kim

    Hello,
    It is possible with OC4J to have the application automatically reloading the resources in development. It is documented in the deployment guide:
    - Automatic Deployment
    Regards
    Tugdual Grall[url]

  • Procedure for hot deploying EJBs using  Jdeveloper and OC4J comtainer

    i am using JDeveloper , please any one help me out in hot deploying EJBs. what is the procedure if i want to hot deploy EJBS

    1) You have to start OC4J with higher Java heap size e.g. java -Xms100m -Xmx150m -jar oc4j.jar
    2) The RMI port by default used is 23791 and configurable by modifying config/rmi.xml.
    regards
    Debu

  • Collaborative Development / Hot Deployment?

    We are a small development team (5-7 people) and have a need to develop collaboratively because each of us is working on small parts of a large application, and we have code dependencies upon eachother. We are looking for suggestions on how to develop collaboratively.
    We have attempted to use 9iAS to develop on - but every time we change any class files, we have to restart the OC4J container for them to be recognized error free. JDeveloper is out of the question because our current PC's cannot handle it (PII ~ 350mhz, 256RAM) and we cannot get new PC's for another year. We have attempted to run a standalone instance of OC4J on the server, but that still requires restarting the instance anytime classes are changed.
    Does anyone have any suggestions for collaborative development? Does anyone know of an environment that has a working hot deployment feature? We are not developing any EJB's, it is strictly a JSP/Servlet solution with Data Access classes for database interaction.

    Semi-speculation on my part follows:
              My understanding of "hot deployment" is that if a new ear file was placed in
              the applications directory it wouldn't supercede the old ear file until it
              was manually deployed. It may however get staged to managed servers but not
              actually deployed. i.e moved but not available.
              -Brett
              "Josh Garcia" <[email protected]> wrote in message
              news:3e1deefc$[email protected]..
              >
              > As I understand, hot deployment should ONLY occur when server(s) are in
              development
              > mode. Are there any cases where hot deployment can occur even when
              servers are
              > in production mode?
              >
              > A little more detail:
              >
              > We are running a WLS 7 SP1 cluster, and, even though our administration
              and managed
              > servers are all in production mode, our EAR is automatically deployed to
              managed
              > servers when placed in the 'applications' directory. Should this be the
              case?
              > I thought that I had to physically redeploy through the console if I was
              in prduction
              > mode.
              >
              > Josh
              

  • Hot deployment of servlet

    hi
    i have compiled the servlet in jdeveloper and set the path to oc4j../../web-inf/classes path;after compiling the class Is it neccassary to shutdown the oc4j container;
    after shutdown the container only i am seeing the effect;without shutdown the container can we see the effect;we can do it Tomcat ;Is there any facility in OC4J ;
    bye
    chaitanya

              Hi, suppose you have the servlet called JoeServlet and registered as joeservlet with an argument, say, a file joe.txt. If you want to 'hot' deploy the JoeServlet you should make sure that a) the servlet's name must be unique b) the servlet's class must be in your servlet classpath (see the properties sheet aside) c) the initial argument, say: joeargument=./joe.txt, must match the the name expected by your servlet (eg. getInitParameter("joeargument")). If you have done correctly WLS must work.
              Joe
              "Jayesh Patel" <[email protected]> wrote:
              >
              >I am trying to hot deploy a simple servlet using weblogic console.
              >
              >I am getting error saying that
              >
              >"Property change error for property "RegisterNewServlet".
              >Servlet could not be loaded or instantiated"
              >
              >I am sure that servlet class I am trying to load is in servlet
              >class path.
              >
              >Any idea what is going wrong here.
              >
              >Thanks.
              >
              >
              >
              

  • Having issues hot deploying with ebcc in Solaris environment.

    I keep getting an error message when hot deploying a new webapp portal using ebcc.
    The error message reads" Unable to add module. appname to application descriptor for portal app. I check the portalapptools and i see the webapp in the portal management.. I also see that it added this to the database under the Portal table.. It never actually added the webapplication under in the console.. This is where it gets stuck... Basicly the steps that are missing are adding a deployment descriptor and then the webapp.. I manually did it and it works.. the problem after that is that i need to execute sync.sh after i bounce the manage server or else i dont see the webapps under portal management..
    So basicly the 2 questions are:
    1..Why doesnt hot deploying work in unix using X11?
    2.. Why do i need to execute sync.sh everytime after every bounce?
    Thanks,
    Oscar

    Oscar,
    Are you running the EBCC on the same machine as your server? The hot
    deploy mechanism of the EBCC forces you to have the server and the EBCC
    on the same machine. While the files are sync'd to the database, the
    web app files never get transfered. The deployer then is syncing to
    nothing.
    Try running it all on one machine, locally or with a remote display.
    Depending on your window manager some Java Swing applications like the
    EBCC do not always display fonts well remotely but it should still work.
    oscar sumano wrote:
    I keep getting an error message when hot deploying a new webapp portal using ebcc.
    The error message reads" Unable to add module. appname to application descriptor for portal app. I check the portalapptools and i see the webapp in the portal management.. I also see that it added this to the database under the Portal table.. It never actually added the webapplication under in the console.. This is where it gets stuck... Basicly the steps that are missing are adding a deployment descriptor and then the webapp.. I manually did it and it works.. the problem after that is that i need to execute sync.sh after i bounce the manage server or else i dont see the webapps under portal management..
    So basicly the 2 questions are:
    1..Why doesnt hot deploying work in unix using X11?
    2.. Why do i need to execute sync.sh everytime after every bounce?
    Thanks,
    Oscar--
    scott dunbar
    bea systems, inc.
    boulder, co, usa

  • Previous unanswered Hot deploy of non EJB, non JSP classes

              Subject to my last post I've since seen my questions has appeared twice on this
              newsgroup, March 2001, and Nov 2000 and no responses to it those times. Aren't
              there BEA engineers reading this newsgroup who would know the answer to that question?
              http://newsgroups.bea.com/cgi-bin/dnewsweb?cmd=article&group=weblogic.developer.interest.jsp&item=3776&utag=
              http://newsgroups.bea.com/cgi-bin/dnewsweb?cmd=article&group=weblogic.developer.interest.jsp&item=5171&utag=
              

              Firstly I already did call BEA support before coming here, this is my last resort.
              I can't get a definitive answer from support. They were the ones that actually
              suggested to me that I post here in the first place. I did search the BEA edocs
              and couldn't find anything on it.
              Secondly, I am using WL 6.1 SP1, and in the thread just beneath this one, which
              I referred to directly in my opening post on this thread, I do mention this in
              the opening paragraph, in fact I give considerable detail.
              Thirdly, I never implied there was an onus on any BEA engineer to answer anything
              here. What I did mean was that given that they do read these posts and they do
              answer posts, I was merely a bit concerned that as I'm third person to ask, it
              would be strange to still get no response given that they answer other questions.
              I mean if they don't know, then who does? It's a real simple yes/no answer, it
              would take 5 seconds.
              Paul
              Robert Patrick <[email protected]> wrote:
              >
              >
              >The answer is simple -- move to WLS 6.x and use enterprise applications
              >(or web applications or an EJB jar file)
              >to package everything up into a single deployment unit and hot deploy
              >the whole deployment unit. WLS 5.1 and
              >earlier do not support hot deployment of non-servlet/non-JSP/non-EJB
              >classes.
              >
              >Mike Reiche wrote:
              >
              >> You can always call BEA Support - 1.888.232.7878 to get the help you
              >need. This
              >> newsgroup is not official BEA Support. It is out of the goodness of
              >their hearts
              >> that BEA engineers help people out here.
              >>
              >> I don't really think you wanted everyone that read your email and didn't
              >know
              >> if such a feature was available, to send you an email saying 'No, I
              >don't know
              >> if such a feature is available'. That's why there were zero responses.
              >>
              >> None of the posts you listed mention what version of WL. That makes
              >a difference.
              >> Also read the online documentation at edocs.bea.com, search for 'hot
              >deploy'.
              >>
              >> Mike Reiche
              >>
              >> "Paul H" <[email protected]> wrote:
              >> >
              >> >Subject to my last post I've since seen my questions has appeared
              >twice
              >> >on this
              >> >newsgroup, March 2001, and Nov 2000 and no responses to it those times.
              >> >Aren't
              >> >there BEA engineers reading this newsgroup who would know the answer
              >> >to that question?
              >> >
              >> >http://newsgroups.bea.com/cgi-bin/dnewsweb?cmd=article&group=weblogic.developer.interest.jsp&item=3776&utag=
              >> >
              >> >http://newsgroups.bea.com/cgi-bin/dnewsweb?cmd=article&group=weblogic.developer.interest.jsp&item=5171&utag=
              >
              >
              ><!doctype html public "-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en">
              ><html>
              >The answer is simple -- move to WLS 6.x and use enterprise applications
              >(or web applications or an EJB jar file) to package everything up into
              >a single deployment unit and hot deploy the whole deployment unit. 
              >WLS 5.1 and earlier do not support hot deployment of non-servlet/non-JSP/non-EJB
              >classes.
              ><p>Mike Reiche wrote:
              ><blockquote TYPE=CITE>You can always call BEA Support - 1.888.232.7878
              >to get the help you need.  This
              ><br>newsgroup is not official BEA Support. It is out of the goodness
              >of
              >their hearts
              ><br>that BEA engineers help people out here.
              ><p>I don't really think you wanted everyone that read your email and
              >didn't
              >know
              ><br>if such a feature was available, to send you an email saying 'No,
              >I
              >don't know
              ><br>if such a feature is available'. That's why there were zero responses.
              ><p>None of the posts you listed mention what version of WL. That makes
              >a difference.
              ><br> Also read the online documentation at edocs.bea.com, search
              >for
              >'hot deploy'.
              ><p>Mike Reiche
              ><p>"Paul H" <[email protected]> wrote:
              ><br>>
              ><br>>Subject to my last post I've since seen my questions has appeared
              >twice
              ><br>>on this
              ><br>>newsgroup, March 2001, and Nov 2000 and no responses to it those
              >times.
              ><br>>Aren't
              ><br>>there BEA engineers reading this newsgroup who would know the answer
              ><br>>to that question?
              ><br>>
              ><br>>http://newsgroups.bea.com/cgi-bin/dnewsweb?cmd=article&group=weblogic.developer.interest.jsp&item=3776&utag=
              ><br>>
              ><br>>http://newsgroups.bea.com/cgi-bin/dnewsweb?cmd=article&group=weblogic.developer.interest.jsp&item=5171&utag=</blockquote>
              ></html>
              >
              >
              

  • Hot deployment using the REDEPLOY feature

    Hi
    I am rather confused regarding the usage of the HOT DEPLOYMENT in WLS 6.1 sp2
    - Win2000.
    According to the documentation - "deployment.pdf" p. 31 you should be able to
    simply touch the REDEPLOY file and the entire application should then be redeployed
    by WLS. However according to the following link:
    http://newsgroups.bea.com/cgi-bin/dnewsweb?cmd=article&group=weblogic.developer.interest.management&item=2095
    the usage of the REDEPLOY feature is only for WebApp's not EJB's.
    So my question in short terms: What am I supposed to belive ? the BEA documentation
    or the BEA support team ?
    I have tried using the REDEPLOY feature as suggested by the documentation however
    the WLS fails to do the redeployment with an execption.
    Kind regards
    Jorgen Fastrup

    From my experience REDEPLOY does work for EJBs as well. You need to meet two conditions: REDEPLOY file should be in META-INF and your application should be deployed under the domain/application. I was not able to get it to work when the application is deployed elsewhere. If somebody knows how to it, please let me know.
    Alexander.

  • Stateful session bean hot deployment error?

    Hi,
    i'm getting an exception ...
    1. Deploy a stateful session bean.
    2. Hit the server and create an instance, then remove it.
    3. Change Stateful session bean source compile and hot deploy it.
    4. Hit the server and try creating an instance...exception !!!!
    "IllegalArgumentException: Object is not an instance of declaring class"
    Please help!!!
    Naveen

    Hi Navin,
    Firstly could you let me know , what option did you set in Jdeveloper to perform hot deploy ??
    I would like to hot deploy Stateless Session beans on Embedded OC4J using JDeveloper.
    Bhavesh

  • Exploded (hot) deployment  on a Weblogic cluster

    AFAIK, exploded hot deployment on a Weblogic cluster is not supported through OEPE.
    When deploying an application on a cluster, each change, no matter how small, forces you to republish these changes, ultimately causing the application to be redeployed by OEPE. Turnaround time for this (depending on the app) can take some time.
    Is there a workaround available for this ?
    I'm looking for a way to minimize the turnaround time between developing code, and actual seeing the code changes on the screen. The requirement however is that deployments should be possible on a managed instance / cluster (non AdminServer).
    Does Oracle Weblogic support such "hot deployment" capabilities from an IDE like Eclipse ? Does anybody here have such a process in place ? (perhaps using ant / maven2 tooling)

    Hi
    I  want  to  clarify that the  application has to be  deployed  to  a cluster  of  two managed  servers, amandad_Server_1 (On Windows  server hosting  console) and amandad_Server_2 which is running  in  other Windows  server.
    I deployed  the application  following  your  recdommendations and the  resulta is  as  follows:
    Windows  server (running the  console)
    1  EAR  file  was copied to  ...  \user_projects\domains\amanda_domain\servers\amandad_Server_1\stage
    2.  The application files  extractected  from the EAR files  were  copied to   \user_projects\domains\amanda_domain\servers\amandad_Server_1\tmp
    Windows  Server not  runn ing the  console
    No files  were copied to neither
    ... \user_projects\domains\amanda_domain\servers\amandad_Server_2\stage
         \user_projects\domains\amanda_domain\servers\amandad_Server_2\tmp
    Questions
    1  Windows  server  not running the console  the  files  were  not  copied....What  might  cause  this behaviour....? how to  fixi it...?
    2. Do I have  to  manaully copy  the  files  to  folders
    ...\user_projects\domains\amanda_domain\servers\amandad_Server_2\stage  
       ... \user_projects\domains\amanda_domain\servers\amandad_Server_2\tmp

  • Hot deployment and JMX

    Hi,
    I need to know how classes are loaded in hot deployment. my problem is that I'm using a JMX server that has some MBeans registered into it, but when I redeploy an application, and the JMX server is recreated as are the MBeans, the JMX agent clearly points to the old instances of the MBeans instead of the redployed ones. It seems that only restarting the OC4J would fix the pointers.
    Is there any way to fix this? or do I have to restart the server every time I deploy an application?

    What option are you using for deployment ? Are you choosing re-deploy ? We recommend Oracle9iAS install in a test/production environment when
    the application has stabilized.
    Also if you are in a development mode and constantly changing your applications you should consider deploying your apps in standalone OC4J. You can choose to do open-expanded directory deployment.
    If you are using OC4J standalone:
    1) you can replace the EAR file in applications directory and it redeploys
    2) you can replace a Servlet class and change the time stamp on web.xml and it redeploys the srvlets
    3) It automatically redeploys the JSP files
    4) If your EJBs are changed, replace your EJBs and change the timestamp on application.xml and it redeploys
    Some of these options are disabled in OC4J embedded in Oracle9iAS to provide a stable environment for production applications.
    If you still have problems in hot-deployment in OC4J please send me a test case at [email protected]
    thanks
    Debu

  • Auto/hot deployment

    I am using Oracle9ias 9.0.2.0.0. I need to use hot deployment. So, I modified
    the server.xml file in %ORA_HOME%/j2ee/home/config to include
    application-auto-deploy-directory="../applications/auto"
    The ear file that I copied to %ORA_HOME%/j2ee/home/applications/auto is not
    being picked up by ther server. Restarting the server doesn't seem to make
    any difference.
    Any suggestions ?

    Hot deployment is development feature available in OC4J standalone.
    In a deployment environment such as Oracle9iAS
    hot deployment is not supported as things would get out of sync with the infrastructure
    repository used for managing the app server and your application.
    -Prasad

  • Form executable hot deployment

    Hi,
    When user had an open instance of the form, and the executable is re-deployed, then user is getting FRM-92101 while attempting any action on the form (including exit_form(no_validate). In the past we tried this kind of hot deployment several times and it works. We expect once the user closed the current form and re-opens the same next time, it automatically loads new instance of the form executable.
    So, my question is should users close all instances of the form that is getting deployed?
    Our environment is
    IAS 10g R2 bundlepatch 9593176.
    DB 10g R2 (10.2.0.4)
    Client running on JRE 1.6.0.22 on Windows Vista sp1.
    Thanks,
    Ravi

    Thanks for the update. We use 32bit version of Vista deployment with IE as our standard browser. We some times experienced with forms freeze with 1.6.0.22 JRE version. But when ever we upgraded java versions last time, each new version gave us lot more troubles(most of them are forms freeze while processing transactions). We only have 5 reported form freezes in last 7 months with Jre 1.6.0.22. Are you aware of all bugs and issues fixed in JRE 1.6.0.24? Is this stable for Oracle forms deployment.
    I also heard that some of the Oracle applications(Apps) 11i uses 1.6.0.14 version fixed on the server and client machines, and they never experienced any forms freeze issue.
    Our configuration is open to highest client version available at base level 1.6.
    We do have load balancing server and SSO configured to use SecureID.
    Edited by: user12136228 on Jun 13, 2011 10:13 AM

  • Hot deployment problems with weblogic 7.0 sp2

    Hi Guys
    I am trying out hot deplyment of a j2ee application on WebLogic Server 7.0 SP2
    Approach 1
    The application is deployed in exploded ear format from the folder
    d:/work/testbed/ear. The appropriate entry in config.xml looks like this.
    <Application Deployed="true" Name="Testbed"
    Path="D:\tools\bea702\projects\testbed\applications\testbed"
    StagedTargets="" TwoPhase="false">
    <EJBComponent Name="SessionBeans" Targets="myserver" URI="SessionBeans.jar"/>
    </Application>
    Creating or touching the REDEPLOY file in META-INF folder doesnt cause hot
    deployment to occur
    Approach 2
    Copied the ear file to the applications folder. Creating or touching the
    REDEPLOY file in META-INF file caused the application to be redeployed.
    However the weblogic console is constantly spitting out this message.
    Undeploying EJB Component SessionBeans
    <Sep 29, 2003 9:53:46 PM IST> <Notice> <Application Poller> <149400> <Activating application: Testbed>
    <Sep 29, 2003 9:53:46 PM IST> <Notice> <Application Poller> <149404> <Activate application Testbed on myserver - Completed>
    Undeploying EJB Component SessionBeans
    <Sep 29, 2003 9:53:51 PM IST> <Notice> <Application Poller> <149400> <Activating application: Testbed>
    <Sep 29, 2003 9:53:52 PM IST> <Notice> <Application Poller> <149404> <Activate application Testbed on myserver - Completed>
    Undeploying EJB Component SessionBeans
    <Sep 29, 2003 9:53:57 PM IST> <Notice> <Application Poller> <149400> <Activating application: Testbed>
    <Sep 29, 2003 9:53:57 PM IST> <Notice> <Application Poller> <149404> <Activate application Testbed on myserver - Completed>
    It seems that the application is getting undeployed and reactivated every 5
    seconds.
    Questions
    1) Any reasons why approach 1 didnt work
    2) What could be causing this constant undeployment and reactivation
    Thanks for your time
    anand

    I think I figured out what is causing the application to be redployed every 5
    seconds. It seems that if the application is deployed in the weblogic domains
    applications folder you should NOT create a <Application element. Weblogic
    automatically recognizes all applications in this folder and deploys them.
    Removing the application entry (as shown in Approach 1) from the config.xml
    and hot deploying by touching the REDEPLOY file did the trick.
    One question still remains. Is hot deployment only possible when I copy the
    exploded ear to the domain "applications" folder
    Thanks for your time
    anand
    ps : The idea of trying it without the <Application element came from trying
    out hot deployment in Weblogic 8. WLS8 first deploys the application in the
    applications folder, followed by the application configured in the
    <Application element. Since both the applications were essentially the same it
    gave me a JNDIException saying that some entity is already bound with the same
    name. Weblogic 7 however doesnt complain at this point.
    - anand
    In article <[email protected]>, Anand Raman wrote:
    Hi Guys
    I am trying out hot deplyment of a j2ee application on WebLogic Server 7.0 SP2
    Approach 1
    The application is deployed in exploded ear format from the folder
    d:/work/testbed/ear. The appropriate entry in config.xml looks like this.
    <Application Deployed="true" Name="Testbed"
    Path="D:\tools\bea702\projects\testbed\applications\testbed"
    StagedTargets="" TwoPhase="false">
    <EJBComponent Name="SessionBeans" Targets="myserver" URI="SessionBeans.jar"/>
    </Application>
    Creating or touching the REDEPLOY file in META-INF folder doesnt cause hot
    deployment to occur
    Approach 2
    Copied the ear file to the applications folder. Creating or touching the
    REDEPLOY file in META-INF file caused the application to be redeployed.
    However the weblogic console is constantly spitting out this message.
    Undeploying EJB Component SessionBeans
    <Sep 29, 2003 9:53:46 PM IST> <Notice> <Application Poller> <149400> <Activating application: Testbed>
    <Sep 29, 2003 9:53:46 PM IST> <Notice> <Application Poller> <149404> <Activate application Testbed on myserver - Completed>
    Undeploying EJB Component SessionBeans
    <Sep 29, 2003 9:53:51 PM IST> <Notice> <Application Poller> <149400> <Activating application: Testbed>
    <Sep 29, 2003 9:53:52 PM IST> <Notice> <Application Poller> <149404> <Activate application Testbed on myserver - Completed>
    Undeploying EJB Component SessionBeans
    <Sep 29, 2003 9:53:57 PM IST> <Notice> <Application Poller> <149400> <Activating application: Testbed>
    <Sep 29, 2003 9:53:57 PM IST> <Notice> <Application Poller> <149404> <Activate application Testbed on myserver - Completed>
    It seems that the application is getting undeployed and reactivated every 5
    seconds.
    Questions
    1) Any reasons why approach 1 didnt work
    2) What could be causing this constant undeployment and reactivation
    Thanks for your time
    anand

Maybe you are looking for

  • How do i move photos from one mac to another

    I just purchased a MacBook Pro, and would like to move the photos on my old iMac to it.  How do I do that?  Thanks.

  • PC Cam 300 not compatible?

    I recently purchased a new Dell XPS. When I went to go install the PC Cam software from the CD, an error message popped up in Windows XP Service Pack 2 saying:"The software you are installing?has not passed Windows Logo testing to verify its compatib

  • Install older drawing tablet

    The last frontier! I recently purchased a used G4 and have both OS 10.4 and OS 9.2 up and running. I recently installed an older version of Painter (runs well in Classic) and would like to install equally old tablet (CalComp Drawing Slate).. All othe

  • Set Application Parameter for Table

    Hi all, Can anyone explain me how to set application parameters for a web dynpro application. Is is embedded in an iView in Portal. I want to set the parameter WDTABLENAVIGATION to SCROLLBAR. I cant find it under Application properties. Thanks

  • Can you author a DVD with surround audio using FCE?

    Or is this only possible via DVD Studio Pro (which is only available in FC Pro)? Just a newbie looking the most cost effective options . . . My apologies for the possibly silly question. Cheers.