H.264 for HTML5 color shifting in Safari

Hi,
I've got a video that I'm using AME to compress for use as an HTML5 background. The color needs to match exactly so the video can blend into the background. This is proving impossible because the color values are shifting in Safari relative to the other browsers.
I'm pretty sure this is a color management problem, so my question is how can I either make sure there is no color profile in the encoded .mp4 file I get out of AME, or to embed a specific profile - sRGB for the web seems appropriate?
I'll also look and see if there is a way to disable it in Safari.
Kevin N.

No ideas?
Here is an example of the color shifting (only in Safari):
https://www.tdc.org/type-competition/

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Save for web color shift - only on images smaller than 150x150px

I'm getting a color shift only on small images (150x150px or smaller) when I save for web in Photoshop CC and CS6. That's very weird as it doesn't happen to images larger than 150x150px! That issue happens with images with different measurements as well (e.g. rectangle), the small looks dull and the larger display the right color.
My Color Settings are set to "Monitor Color". Under save for web I have the following options not ticked: Embed Color Profile and Convert to sRGB. (viget.com/inspire/the-mysterious-save-for-web-color-shift)
I'm running the OS X 10.8.4 on a macbook pro, I tested that on both, Safari 6.0.5 and FF.
The squares in the screenshot were saved exatly the same way. The largerer displays the right color #FFCB32, but the smaller displays the color wrong.
I appreciate your help.
Cheers
P

JPG & PNG = Color Profile "Don't Color Manage this document". Save under save for web I have the following options not ticked: Embed Color Profile and Convert to sRGB. (viget.com/inspire/the-mysterious-save-for-web-color-shift)
Resizing in photoshop (Image Size), but the color shifts even with cropped image after save for web.

A different take on the "Save For Web" color shift issue...

Ok, everyone who has fussed much with photoshop and "Save For Web" knows about the color shift issue. If you want your colors to look right after you "save for web", you have to work in the sRGB colorspace, and have Proof Colors checked (soft proofing on) and the proof color setup set to Monitor RGB, otherwise what you get looks terrible when displayed in a browser.
But of course if you are editing for print, this is exactly what you DON'T want to do. Well, I work in both. In fact, often the same images, and I want them to appear as close as reasonably possible in both print and web formats, and without a lot of fussing on my part. And I'm pickiest about the print mode, since I have the most control there, so that's the way I want to edit by default.
Nothing new here.
Now comes the interesting part (in my mind, anyway). Obviously there is a known remapping -- because PhotoShop DOES it when you select Proof Colors. So the inverse mapping must also be known (with some gamut issues, but I'm not concerned with those, because, after all, I'm VIEWING it on a monitor anyway!). What I want is a plug-in that automatically applies that inverse mapping so that, when I do a Save For Web, I end up with the colors I've been viewing all the time when setting the shot up in print mode. Then, too, I don't have to worry about what mode I'm in when I'm editing -- it just fixes it when doing a save-for-web.
Again, I want to edit in my normal print mode (typically ProPhoto colorspace, and with soft-proofing off or set to the printer/medium combination I expect to use), then do a single operation (might be a multi-step action) to "screw up" my colors so that when I then do a "Save-For-Web", the resulting image, when viewed on the average color-stupid browser, looks like the image I've been seeing in Photoshop.
Anyone know of such a beast?   I would gladly pay for a plug-in that really works and fixes the problem.
And if you have other solutions, I'm interested, but the absolute requirement is that it I do one single edit pass for my colors for both print and web use, and I get what I see on the screen in PS on both the prints and on the web display (i.e., working in sRGB/Monitor RGB mode all the time won't cut it). And PREFERABLY, let me do all my editing work in the ProPhoto (or at least AdobeRGB) colorspace so I have a gamut closer to what the printer can do.
Anyone got a decent solution for this?

Sorry, I think I'm being unclear. This has nothing to do with individual monitor profiles. In Proof Setup, "Monitor RGB" amounts to turning off ALL color management, and simply letting the monitor do what it will. It is what the vast majority of web browsers do (even if the operating system provides color management, the browsers don't take advantage of it), so that is what you need to consider for images that will be viewed on a web browser. If you convert your image to sRGB, select Monitor RGB in Proof Set up, and turn on Proof Colors, you will see the image as it would appear on a web browser (after you save it as a jpg or use "Save For Web/Devices" to save it as a jpg).   Since almost everyone is running different uncalibrated monitors, there will be lots of variation in how it will look to them, so precise control of the color is unimportant.
That said, I would expect the color on a calibrated monitor (such as the one I use when editing) to be reasonably close to the colors I am seeing while editing in PS. To the extent a monitor deviates from "calibrated", those colors will vary, but a good monitor should show good colors.   Unfortunately, this is NOT the case, as my previous post shows. The colors produced by the steps above are oversaturated and significantly shifted in hue. There is, to my mind, anyway, no reason for this. Adobe clearly knows what the mapping is between the colors as it displays them in PS and the un-controlled "Monitor RGB" -- that is, it is the color map they are using during normal editing display. If they were to reverse-apply that map prior to saving it as a jpg, then the image would appear on a browser on that same (presumably calibrated) monitor very similar to what you set up when editing. Anyone else viewing the image on a web browser with a calibrated monitor would also see good colors. To the extent other viewers' monitors are out of calibration, their colors will suck, but there's nothing you can do about that.
I guess in some sense I AM "asking for a Color-Mamangement-solution for a "non-Color-Management-situation", but specifically I'm asking for PS Color Management to do the best it can for non-Color-Managed situations that we all face every day.
Does that make more sense?

Looking for a better solution to the "Save for web" color shift issue

Ok, everyone who has fussed much with photoshop and "Save For Web" knows about the color shift issue. If you want your colors to look right after you "save for web", you have to work in the sRGB colorspace, and have Proof Colors checked (soft proofing on) and the proof color setup set to Monitor RGB, otherwise what you get looks terrible when displayed in a browser.
But of course if you are editing for print, this is exactly what you DON'T want to do. Well, I work in both. In fact, often the same images, and I want them to appear as close as reasonably possible in both print and web formats, and without a lot of fussing on my part. And I'm pickiest about the print mode, since I have the most control there, so that's the way I want to edit by default.
Nothing new here.
Now comes the interesting part (in my mind, anyway). Obviously there is a known remapping -- because PhotoShop DOES it when you select Proof Colors. So the inverse mapping must also be known (with some gamut issues, but I'm not concerned with those, because, after all, I'm VIEWING it on a monitor anyway!). What I want is a plug-in that automatically applies that inverse mapping so that, when I do a Save For Web, I end up with the colors I've been viewing all the time when setting the shot up in print mode. Then, too, I don't have to worry about what mode I'm in when I'm editing -- it just fixes it when doing a save-for-web.
Again, I want to edit in my normal print mode (typically ProPhoto colorspace, and with soft-proofing off or set to the printer/medium combination I expect to use), then do a single operation (might be a multi-step action) to "screw up" my colors so that when I then do a "Save-For-Web", the resulting image, when viewed on the average color-stupid browser, looks like the image I've been seeing in Photoshop.
Anyone know of such a beast? I would gladly pay for a plug-in that really works and fixes the problem.
And if you have other solutions, I'm interested, but the absolute requirement is that it I do one single edit pass for my colors for both print and web use, and I get what I see on the screen in PS on both the prints and on the web display (i.e., working in sRGB/Monitor RGB mode all the time won't cut it). And PREFERABLY, let me do all my editing work in the ProPhoto (or at least AdobeRGB) colorspace so I have a gamut closer to what the printer can do.
Anyone got a decent solution for this?

Chris
I spent all day Googling and doing side by side comparisons of my old and new systems.
My display is a Dell U2410. It has several presets, including sRGB and Adobe RGB. I've been using sRGB.
On my OLD system, (Win XP, PsCS2, DwCS4) there seems to be no distinction between color managed and non color managed apps, even on this wide gamut display. I could capture (digital camera) in Adobe RGB, open and edit in PsCS2, save as .psd, convert to CMYK for print, or convert to sRGB for SFW. All images looked identical and they printed and displayed perfectly. I thought this was normal, and seemed logical. This also seems to be the source of my incorrect assumptions. I was trying to get my new machine to behave like my old one.
So I get this new machine (Windows 7, PsCS5, DwCS5) and now (still in sRGB display mode) all color managed apps appear de-saturated. Non color managed apps are OK. If I switch the display to Adobe RGB, color managed apps are OK, but non color managed apps are way too saturated. From my investigation, I believe this is normal behavior on a wide gamut display. I've tried changing the Control Panel > Display > Screen Resolution > Advanced settings > Color Management options, but to no avail. Either I'm missing something, or Windows 7 is doing color management differently.
It seems my only option now is to use Adobe RGB display setting for Ps, etc. and switch to sRGB for Dw and non color managed apps. Or, have 2 separate files for print and web. I've Googled 'til my eyes are numb and still not sure I'm getting this. Any enlightenment would be greatly appreciated.
Finally, I don't see an edit function here, so I can't remove my previous incorrect reply. Moderator, please feel free to do so.
Thanks

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This could be part of the problem > Known Issues | Adobe products on Mac OS 10.7 Lion
You can have Safari set to open PDF files in Preview.
Right or control click the Safari icon in the Applications folder then click Get Info.
In the Get Info panel click: Open with
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Color shift in save for web

Help!! Yelp! I have followed the directions in previous posts for fixing color shift when saving for web. I switched my monitor to gamma 2.2. I chose sRGB in assign color profile.
The colors still look washed out!
I am using CS4 on the Mac.
What am I doing wrong?

siri3 wrote:
What am I doing wrong?
You are using "assign" instead of CONVERT to sRGB. In addition, accurately calibrate your monitor often and regularly. Even the cheapest hardware calibrator will give superior results to eyeball calibrators.
See the FAQs in the Photoshop forum for your platform, Macintosh or Win.

Save For Web Color incorrect color shifting

SFW (CS3) isn't functioning correctly, or perhaps I'm missing a pref or configuration.
When I go to SFW, the image in the SFW window no matter what setting or level (even 100%) and resulting file is lighter, as in washed out, from it's PSD parent.
Even viewing the Original from within SFW is not the at the original levels. It's washed out.
As a test, if I do a Save As from the same PSD parent to a JPEG at 12, the file is the same level quality as it's PSD parent as expected/desired.
As such, SFW is unusable for me.
CS3, Mac Pro Quade Core 2x3GHz, OSX 10.5.5

Thanks Ann. Here's what I have:
In Edit > Color Settings:
Working Spaces: RGB sRGB IEC...
Color Mgmt Polices: Convert to Working RGB
Convert to Profile:
Source Space Profile: sRGB IEC..
Conversion Options:
Engine: Adobe ACE
Intent: Perceptual
Use Black Point Compensation (√)
Use Dither (√)
In SFW: Convert to sRGB is selected
I'm looking at a head shot 72 dpi and the woman's face is lighter using these settings from within SFW looking at what SFW calls "Original" versus the real original outside of SFW.
Saving a SFW jpg at 100% yields a lighter image than doing a Save As jpg at 12.
I have both a HP LP3065 30" and Apple 22" Cinema display and the SFW processed file is lighter on both screens. Although the SFW Original is lighter on the HP than when looking at same on the Cinema. But the output is lighter and consistent viewing on both displays. Lighter than should be.
The Cinema is set to Apple's stock "Apple Cinema Display" profile and HP doesn't support us with a Mac calibrator, but I did the best I could with Apple's - in Prefs > Display.
Regardless, it seems that SFW is the problem (in my logical but limited color mgmt knowledge). I can save as a Save As jpg and get the expected color level consistent with the original on both my HP and Cinema. Isn't this the deciding factor? The consistency across both. Wouldn't that point to SFW being the problem, since Save As works correctly?
And Peter, I totally agree with you, we need to search first. I did on "Save For Web Color Shifting" but didn't find it. I found other SFW issues, but somehow not my issue. Still, my apologies.
Thanks to both.

Fix for "color shift" bug

I have discovered the fix for the iPhoto color shift bug (at least with OS X 10.3.9). For those who tried the solution of renaming the Generic RGB Profile, this idea was heading down the right track, but ultimately is not the answer (nor did it even work for me).
When you import photos into iPhoto 5, it does not assign a color profile to the pictures. Then when you edit one using the internal editor and go to save it, iPhoto sees there is no embedded color profile and thus it automatically embeds the Generic RGB Profile, and if that is not the color profile you are using for your screen (and it most likely is not), you will then notice that the colors of your original image have been altered.
Before I tell you the simple solution to this, I HIGHLY RECOMMEND that you create a custom color profile for your Mac. You can use the included OS X one under System Preferences | Displays | Color | Calibrate, but I personally find this one difficult to use and it doesnt offer very good end results for me. The color profile creation program that works the best for me is SuperCal. This program is a little gem and after you use it, it will seem like someone gave you a brand new display. The program is free to download, but after seeing how well it works, I hope some of you will pay the $19 registration fee. On a side note, when creating your color profile, I suggest you use a gamma setting of 2.2 (not the default Mac setting of 1.8). This will make your screen match most scanners, digital cameras, printers, web images, photo labs, etc. (which are all based on sRGB which has a gamma setting of 2.2).
SuperCal can be downloaded here
http://www.bergdesign.com/supercal/
Okay, now youve created your calibrated color profile (lets call it SuperCal) so pictures will now be accurate on your screen. So now heres the fix for the color shift bug its really so simple. Go into Applications | Utilities | ColorSync Utility. Under the Preferences icon, change the RGB Default from Generic RGB Profile to your new SuperCal one. Voila! Thats all there is to it. Now when iPhoto saves an edited picture, it will embed your custom color profile. So what was once a hated annoyance now actually becomes a feature so that all of your saved pictures will perfectly match your screen.
Since the Mac is supposed to be the easiest to use computer around, Apple should fix this so that when you change the color profile for your display, OS X also changes it for file embedding, but as it stands it 10.3.9, you must change this in both places manually.

I appreciate the tip to use gamma 2.2. I'd been wondering about that.
However, as others have mentioned, tagging your photos with a monitor profile is not the way to go.
The othe thing is that under Tiger, ColorSync Utility does not have a preferences section. It only has a devices section.
It is as if iPhoto doesn't know about any profile attached to any picture, whether it's from a camera, scanner, or PhotoShop, and there seems to be no way to tell it which profile to use.
And even after replacing the Generic RGB profile with the same one the images are tagged (by renaming the other profile Generic RGB), iPhoto still displays the images with more saturation and somewhat darker.
This is on an Apple Studio 17" CRT very carefully calibrated with SuperCal.
So I have to come to the conclusion that others have in other threads -- if you're concerned about good color accuracy, don't edit the color balance of your images in iPhoto. Leave that to PhotoShop.

Color shift between Library and Develop module

Hi,
I recently noticed a color shift between in the image when going from the library to the develop module. Yes, I know this is mentioned in the FAQ, but I did not find the solutions given there to be satisfactory.
Let me explain what happens: I have taken Photos with my Canon EOS 300D, in Jpeg mode with Color Space in the Camera set to AdobeRGB. The photos I am talking about were taken with Tungsten light with auto white balance and have a distinct orange color cast. I use Windows XP and view my Photos on a LCD Display calibrated with the Pantone Huey system. The Lightroom Library Module and Photoshop CS2 both display the original image almost identically (there are no changes applied inside Lightroom or Photoshop, I view the original image in both applications). Photoshop is set to use the Adobe RGB Color space as its working Color space, Softproofing is switched off. However, when I switch to the Develop Module, the colors (especially the orange hues) shift very noticably toward pink. I can only assume that the Colorspace conversion or maybe some implicit soft proof used differs between the modules. So, to restate the problem: If I switch back and forth between Library and Develop, without changing anything and in 1:1 view to avoid errors introduced by different zooming methods, the colors shift quite drastically back and forth.
I have to say that this is really quite annoying. The whole point for me to use the develop module is to use it to make adjustments to the colors, and for this to work properly I have to see the same colors in both modules and in Photoshop. There is no point in correcting a pink color cast away in Develop that is not even there in either the library module or Photoshop (and that would then have a stronger orange tint because I tried to counter the pink tint in develop).
So this leads me to the final question: Is it possible to tell Develop to use the exact same color settings as the Library Module? Or is there another way to compensate for the color shift?
I hope I was clear in what happens and what I tried to do. If it helps I can gladly provide a sample photograph that clearly illustrates the point.
Thank you in advance for your help,
Daniel

Thanks for your comments, Don and Fred. I hope that this issue will be worked on soon.
Fred, I have set the Preview Quality to High, but it doesn't seem to make any differences concerning the color shift. I have investigated this matter further by now and made the following observations:
*The color shift is a lot less noticable on my laptop (the laptop screen is also color profiled). On my laptop the change is more of a subtle shift in contrast than in color. This might be caused by the smaller color gammut of my laptop display though.
*I have uploaded a testimage so that others can check if this shift occurs at their workstations too - after all, it might be a misconfiguration of my color management software, though I doubt that (because Adobe already states that library and develop render different previews). I would be interested if the color shift I describe is noticable at other workstations too. The link to the testimage: http://www.danyx.com/colorshift.jpg (permission to use the image to test the color reproduction is of course granted hereby).
Thanks for your help, I hope Adobe will listen soon,
Daniel

AE to PSD to FCP color shift

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I have an 1920x1080 After Effects CC project has a simpe 3 part animation to it.
A :15 OPEN that animates to a STILL FRAME and then an :15 OUTRO.
The STILL FRAME is exported from AE (COMP TO LAYERED PSD) that the client will add headshots to and then export a number PNGs to be brought into FCP7 (NOT X) and place between the OPEN and CLOSE. Simple Template.
In FCP7 The ANIMATION and the STILLS (PNGs) all line up perfectly except for the color shift.
I've ready about the gamma 1.8 .2...., QT, PRORES, etc...
I've tried a few settings, but I must be missing something.
Any help to what or where needs to be set in AE, PSD or FCP or QT7, QTX to get this to match?
under the gun.
(weird! looks fine when I do it in FCX, but client only uses FCP7.)
THANKS!

Only thing I can think of is a work around... Process all the clips that are going to be part of the AE effect thru AE, so that the color is the same when you get to the effect. (hide the shift that way). It's a work around... you should report this to Apple too in FCP feedback.
Jerry

IBooks author color shift with "Save for web devices..."

Hi! I'm a web developer and I'm learning to use iBooks. It's a really easy tool, but there is a problem with color management wich is driving me crazy. This happen when I export images from "Save for web devices..." from Photoshop, then drag it to iBooks author.
As I do for web development, I do this:
1) Configure photoshop Color Settings to work with "Color Monitor"
2) Remove any color management from my document
3) Proof Setup > Monitor RGB
4) Disable Proof Colors
5) Use "Save for web devices..." with ICC profile and sRGB unchecked
The exported JPG looks fine everywhere... Photoshop, Preview, Safari, Chrome, FF... but looks washed out when I drag it to iBooks Author. Why?
I solved this issue converting to sRGBIEC61966-2.1 profile and checking ICC profile when "Save for web devices...", but I'm not confortable with this workaround because I'm not sure about what I'm doing exactly, and I am not sure if this images are gonna look good on any device (I only own an iPad 3).
Somebody know a best method to deal with this?
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Hi KT. Thanks for your response. I'm already using this formats. Anyway, the problem occurs within iBooks Author interface. I mean: I can see the color shift (or washed out...) at iBooks Author at my computer screen. Of course, when I test it on iPad it also looks bad.
It's incredibly strange because the JPGs I'm using looks fine everywhere else except iBooks Author.

Color Shifts when rendering to H.264 Blu-ray

Since upgrading to After Effects CS5 I am seeing the following:
Whenever I render out a video file using the "H.264 Blu-ray" Output Module option, the resulting m4v video has a different color appearance than the After Effects composition from which it was rendered. The rendered file appears to have a yellow cast to it, especially evident in red highlights. This appearance is seen within After Effects (after importing the file and dropping it in a composition) as well as in VLC media player. In addition, a blu-ray disc created using the m4v file also has the yellow appearance when viewed on an HDTV. In other words, the color shift is consistant in various players as well as within After Effects itself.
Here is the bug report I submitted:
******BUG******
Concise problem statement:
Steps to reproduce bug:
1. Create a project with HDTV (Rec. 709) color space, 8 bit.
2. Import a 1920x1080 video file (any kind).
3. Render out to H.264 Blu-ray (using project color space).
4. Import the resulting m4v file and compare it to the original video.
Results: The color has been shifted; has a yellow cast to it.
Expected results: the color should appear the same for the rendered file as the original.

Chris,
Thanks for your input.
"I can assure you this isn't a widespread problem as I've rendered a fair amount of h.264 directly out of AE and haven't noticed it. Nor have I heard anything from our testing department."
Try this simple test:
Make a 1920x1080 comp in AE with your choice of footage, using any AE settings/color management etc. you want to.
Render to format "H.264 Blu-ray" (or plain "H.264") with any settings you care to choose, with the goal being best color fidelity possible.
After rendering, import the output file into After Effects.
Drop it in the original comp.
A / B the two and compare the color.
Do they match?
If so, then you have achieved what I cannot, and what no one so far has demonstrated to me that they can do, and at that point I would greatly appreciate your sharing with me the secret of your success.
If not, then join the club, because I can assure you that I am not the only one.

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I cannot read Netflix red background webpages without getting a headache/eyestrain. I know other browsers allow me to override the pages' colors but will safari allow me to specify all pages from for instance "www.netflix.com"; to have a white background while letting other pages display colors as they were created?
Will any browser do this?
It would be a cool feature.

There may be a way of doing this using CSS. In Safari's preferences under 'Advanced' there is the option to choose a user defined style sheet. I have used this since Safari came out to not display ads in Safari, and it may be well possible to use it to change certain styles (depending on page code).
..k

Color shift (lightening) when using "Save for Web & Devices..."

Can someone please let me know why I'm getting a color shift (the entire image lightens noticably) when I export an image or animated gif with "Save for Web & Devices...". It happens on PCs and Macs, and with both CS3 and CS2.
I've been using this feature (flawlessly until a few months ago) long enough to realize that there are several settings to adjust the color table, dithering, web snap, etc., but adjusting these settings don't seem to fix the problem. When I use "Save As..." the color shift doesn't occur, and that's been my workaround, but I'm currently trying to save a few animated gifs, which must be saved with "Save for Web & Devices..." in order to retain the animation.
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Ah ha! I thought so. The only reason I can speak on this topic at all is because of what I was forced to learn when I started using a Dell LCD flatscreen.
As mentioned earlier, most monitors are pretty close to sRGB, which made web work somewhat easier. However, it seems recently some so-called "wide gamut" monitors have come to market, including the recent crop of Dells. The new Dells can produce a gamut that is closer to Adobe RGB than sRGB. This means -- speaking loosely -- it can produce brighter and more saturated colours than an "sRGB" type monitor.
RGB numbers, in the context of a defined colour space, represent an "actual" real life colour. A very bright red in sRGB colour space may be represented by r255b0g0, but that same "actual" red colour is represented in the wider Adobe RGB colour space by r219b0g0. Adobe RGB, being wider than sRGB, can include still brighter reds than sRGB's brightest red, hence where sRGB hits a roof at r255, Adobe RGB can keep going higher.
Imagine two ladders, each with ten steps on it. The Adobe RGB ladder is taller than the sRGB ladder, even though they both have ten steps. The 9th step is higher (i.e. brighter) on the Adobe RGB ladder than on the sRGB ladder. So if an image contains the RGB values of r219b0g0, well if you assign it to sRGB, it will not be a very bright red. If you assign it to Adobe RGB, it will be a brighter red, because that "ladder step" (like the 9th step) is higher than the same step in sRGB.
This is why your image appears brighter when viewed in SFW and in web browsers. Photoshop knows it's supposed to be using sRGB colour space, but SFW and web browsers DOESN'T, and so it just assigns your monitor colour space, which with these Dell monitors is wider than sRGB.
I think the Dell monitor is fine...I still highly recommend purchasing some type of hardware calibration utitily (one that has a thingy that attaches to the screen to measure the light being emitted). Properly calibrate and profile your monitor, trust what you see in Photoshop, convert to sRGB for web images, and forget the rest. Either way, your images will look "good" on some people's monitors and "bad" on others.

H.264 for HTML5 color shifting in Safari

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