Jacman

Hi All,
I am a long time Arch fan who generally lurks around in the forum reading posts off and on.
I am a Java programmer by trade and was intrigued by a post about Jacman. Since the post was originally about Archie, and already there was a significant discussion of Jacman in there, I didnt want to pollute the thread further, hence this new post.
I am interested in helping out with the application, if any help is needed. Please let me know if there is anything that I can help out with. Also arooaroo mentioned about the app losing out to inferior gtk ones due to its Java nature. I was wondering if using a native widget toolkit like SWT would ameliorate the situation a little.
Keep up the good work!
Hal

Isn't it cool how everyone must have exactly the same PC specs so that the comparing of time stats makes sense.
Back on topic... performance is an issue for me as much as many people. However, I'm not going to lose sleep if Java's a few hundreths of a second slower to load up a main screen than a py-gtk program, or whatever lang/UI toolkit you choose to mention.
The next release of Java (which I've been testing for another project at work) is very promising and definitely improves the experience for GUI apps further. That said, I don't find Jacman sluggish.
I've tried the other Pacman front-ends and performance is also an issue. It's not a language bottleneck, it's an IO bottleneck caused by the large amount hassle you need to give the filesystem in order to show the user the package info.
Now, let's get some perspective. If I was asked to write a Hello World program, I wouldn't write it in Java. But, if I was asked to make a complex GUI, then I would.
On an optimistic note, I do believe that Sun will open source their Java implementation - although it may take a year or two.

Similar Messages

Jacman 0.2 released

Hi all,
It's been a month since Jacman 0.1 appeared. I had hoped to get 0.2 out much sooner, but it's been a hectic month and I simply get the time to invest in this project. Fortunately, I've got myself a darn good sidekick - SoniX. He dived straight into the code after it was released and started submitting great patches.
PKGBUILD has been submitted to the AUR. Or, the pkg.tar.gz can be downloaded from the project webpage.
For those who haven't heard of Jacman, it's a Java-based GUI front-end to Pacman. It provides as sexy an interface you're likely to see for core tasks of installing, removing, updating and rolling-back packages.
New features for 0.2:
* Rollback package support: allows the user to rollback to a previously installed version of a given package. Only old packages still in the Pacman cache on the hard drive call be rolledback, as old versions of packages don't exist on the servers.
* Jon-Anders (SoniX) did lots of great work on the console that displays Pacman's output. It now copes with curses-based output properly.
* Talk to Pacman: now have Y/N buttons to confirm to Pacman to continue or abort the operation. V0.1 used the --no-confirm argument which wasn't ideal.
* New config option added determine whether the main window closes after a successful operation. For example, if adding a package installed without error, Jacman will close once you click "Done". It is possible to set this option to false so that you will always return to the main menu.
* Fixed empty package bug (I think!) Iphitus reported a strange bug where "empty" packages were listed.
* An Ant buildscript is now included.
* Some internal code restructuring and general code spring-cleaning.
* New license: Apache.
Thanks also to other Archers Sudman1 and Dusty for contributing.
We've got lots more in store for future releases, so keep your eyes peeled. Also, we're always looking for feedback, so please get in touch.
Enjoy

Serious? I always thought the arch package was smaller. I guess its because when I was on dialup I had to download Sun's JRE all in one go because of their stupid no-auto-downloader policy, whereas I could break up the JRE download over several days when using pacman.
<super-rant>
The problem with many open source users when they see a program written in Java is that their first impulse is to say "Why Java?". (The second problem is that they follow that first impulse). I'm really sick of the question. Its a good language, a good interpretter, and the program being discussed at the time (in this case, Jacman, in mine, Ensmer, but we're talking Limewire, Azureus, jedit etc etc etc as well) is a good program.
I hate how every time a Java program is mentioned on this forum, some idiot decides to question the merits of Java. It starts out with (usually false) accusations about the interpreter, and then leads into (sometimes false) accusations about the language. And its the same story over and over and over.
I recently ranted against the Java language itself. I've gotten tired of programming in it, personally. But there is no reason, absolutely no reason to come down on another program or programmer soley because its written in Java.
I propose that anybody who questions another programmer's choice of programming language should be immediately banned. Its up to the developer to choose the language. Its up to the user to choose the program. They can use language as a criteria if they like, but don't complain about it.
</super-rant>
(Looks like I am in for a thread-hijacking day after all. Sorry about targetting your threads first arooaroo :-D)
Dusty

[new] jacman-0.2 - Java GUI frontend to Pacman

Hi all,
Jacman 0.2 has just been released. The necessary info:
Jacman PKGBUILD on AUR.
Jacman project page.

Dusty wrote:
how sweet. :-)
Excuse my thread-hijack this early in the day. (Its early in the day here, lets hope I'm not setting a precedent for Monday...) Does arooaroo stand for 'Andy Roberts, Object Oriented{2}'?
Dusty
LOL! Nope, but maybe I'll make that the official reason. arooaroo comes from my desire to find a relatively unique name that I can use on most sites as a nick so that I don't need to have lots of different names for lots of sites.
andrew -> aroo.
I then repeated it twice to make it odd looking to decrease the chances of anyone else having it. It has nothing to do with programming!

Python vs Java - simple benchmark comparison

Hi all,
I recently posted a speed comparison of Python vs Java.
Following Xentac's suggestion, I imported Psyco to see if I could get any JIT benefits in the Python scripts. I then tried the latested Java JDK6 dev binaries too. This follow-up can be found here.
Please be aware that I'm totally aware of the vast limitations of micro-benchmarks like these. Still, although they are based on someone else's code, I like them because they represent the typical tasks I often carry out in both my Python and Java programming: IO, lists, hashes, for loops, etc.
Any comments welcome, especially on how to optimise the Python code. I can already see a couple of ways that ought to improve the Java tests.

I agree. I honestly am not trying to say that Java is better and Python is rubbish. I love em both. There's not a great deal of difference for the most part.
I just felt that people assumed that Java was slow because they've heard it's slow, or had prior experience of the old versions.
I have friend's saying "ugh, Java is sloowwww." And so avoid it. Yet, these same people rave about Perl and Python apps. My point was simply, hate Java for other reasons - not speed!
You may notice that the Java executable is only 63K. The bulk of Java comes from its extensive class library that ships with the runtime. People think that Java must load up all the classes or something before running, when in fact it only ever loads with it needs. So, whilst the package itself is large, any sure, it does require more memory than other languages, I just don't believe it's as bulky as some assume.
The motivation for those benchmarks was a comment on Frugalware's IRC channel where someone tried it out, said it was slow, removed it, and preferred the Python/gtk front-end they have instead. Followed with some insightful remark that Java only for web apps! I don't mind others prefering other front-ends. But is Jacman really slow? Please tell me, because it runs like a dream on my system. It would go even quicker if with pacman-optimize.

Pacman -Qe Broken after today´s "full system upgrade"

From "pacman.log"
synchronizing package lists
[2008-01-17 18:04] starting full system upgrade
[2008-01-17 18:05] upgraded gnome-keyring (2.20.2-1 -> 2.20.3-1)
[2008-01-17 18:06] >>>
[2008-01-17 18:06] >>> If you use the LILO bootloader, you should run 'lilo' before rebooting.
[2008-01-17 18:06] >>>
[2008-01-17 18:06] >>> Updating module dependencies. Please wait ...
[2008-01-17 18:06] >>> MKINITCPIO SETUP
[2008-01-17 18:06] >>> ----------------
[2008-01-17 18:06] >>> If you use LVM2, Encrypted root or software RAID,
[2008-01-17 18:06] >>> Ensure you enable support in /etc/mkinitcpio.conf .
[2008-01-17 18:06] >>> More information about mkinitcpio setup can be found here:
[2008-01-17 18:06] >>> http://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Mkinitcpio
[2008-01-17 18:06]
[2008-01-17 18:06] >>> Generating initial ramdisk, using mkinitcpio. Please wait...
[2008-01-17 18:06] ==> Building image "default"
[2008-01-17 18:06] ==> Running command: /sbin/mkinitcpio -k 2.6.23-ARCH -c /etc/mkinitcpio.conf -g /boot/kernel26.img
[2008-01-17 18:06] :: Begin build
[2008-01-17 18:06] :: Parsing hook [base]
[2008-01-17 18:06] :: Parsing hook [autodetect]
[2008-01-17 18:06] :: Generating module dependencies
[2008-01-17 18:06] :: Generating image '/boot/kernel26.img'...SUCCESS
[2008-01-17 18:06] ==> SUCCESS
[2008-01-17 18:06] ==> Building image "fallback"
[2008-01-17 18:06] ==> Running command: /sbin/mkinitcpio -k 2.6.23-ARCH -c /etc/mkinitcpio.d/kernel26-fallback.conf -g /boot/kernel26-fallback.img
[2008-01-17 18:06] :: Begin build
[2008-01-17 18:06] :: Parsing hook [base]
[2008-01-17 18:06] :: Parsing hook [udev]
[2008-01-17 18:06] :: Parsing hook [ide]
[2008-01-17 18:06] :: Parsing hook [pata]
[2008-01-17 18:06] :: Parsing hook [scsi]
[2008-01-17 18:06] :: Parsing hook [sata]
[2008-01-17 18:06] :: Parsing hook [usbinput]
[2008-01-17 18:06] :: Parsing hook [raid]
[2008-01-17 18:06] :: Parsing hook [filesystems]
[2008-01-17 18:07] :: Generating module dependencies
[2008-01-17 18:07] :: Generating image '/boot/kernel26-fallback.img'...SUCCESS
[2008-01-17 18:07] ==> SUCCESS
[2008-01-17 18:07] upgraded kernel26 (2.6.23.12-3 -> 2.6.23.14-1)
[2008-01-17 18:07] upgraded libgtop (2.20.0-1 -> 2.20.1-1)
[2008-01-17 18:07] upgraded libwnck (2.20.2-1 -> 2.20.3-1)
[2008-01-17 18:07] upgraded vte (0.16.11-1 -> 0.16.12-1)
[2008-01-17 18:07] upgraded xorg-xinit (1.0.7-2 -> 1.0.7-3)
Result when using "pacman -Qe" afterwards.
pacman -Qe
alsa-lib 1.0.15-1
alsa-oss 1.0.15-1
alsa-plugins 1.0.15-1
alsa-utils 1.0.15-2
autoconf 2.61-3
automake 1.10-3
bin86 0.16.17-3
bison 2.3-4
bzip2 1.0.4-3
catfish 0.3-1
ccsm 0.6.0-2
compiz-fusion-plugins-extra 0.6.0-2
compiz-fusion-plugins-main 0.6.0-3
compizconfig-backend-gconf 0.6.0-2
conky 1.4.9-1
cpio 2.9-3
csup 20060318-5
curl 7.17.1-1
dbus 1.0.2-4
e2fsprogs 1.40.3-1
ed 0.8-3
emerald 0.6.0-3
emerald-themes 0.6.0-2
epdfview 0.1.6-5
exo 0.3.4-1
fcron 3.0.4-1
file 4.23-1
filesystem 2007.11-3
findutils 4.2.31-3
firefox 2.0.0.11-1
flashplugin 9.0.115.0-1
flex 2.5.33-3
fusion-icon 20071111-1
galculator 1.3.1-1
gawk 3.1.6-2
gettext 0.17-1
gksu 2.0.0-2
gnome-icon-theme 2.20.0-1
gqview 2.0.4-1
grep 2.5.3-3
groff 1.19.2-3
grub 0.97-9
gtk-xfce-engine 2.4.2-1
gzip 1.3.12-4
hardinfo 0.4.2.3-1
hdparm 7.7-3
hwd 5.3.1-1
hwdetect 0.9-1
initscripts 2007.11-2
iptables 1.3.8-2
iputils 20070202-3
jacman 0.4-2
jre 6u3-2
kbd 1.12.20070827-2
kernel26 2.6.23.14-1
less 418-1
libdca 0.0.5-1
libpcap 0.9.8-2
libtool 1.5.24-3
libusb 0.1.12-3
libxfce4mcs 4.4.2-1
libxfce4util 4.4.2-1
libxfcegui4 4.4.2-1
licenses 2.2-2
lilo 22.8-2
lshwd 1.1.3-5
lzo2 2.02-3
lzop 1.02rc1-3
make 3.81-3
man 1.6f-1
man-pages 2.74-1
mc 4.6.1-4
mesa 7.0.1-1
mkinitcpio 0.5.17-1
mktemp 1.5-3
mlocate 0.18-2
module-init-tools 3.2.2-5
mousepad 0.2.13-1
mplayer 1.0rc2-1
mplayer-plugin 3.45-1
nano 2.0.7-1
net-tools 1.60-13
numlockx 1.1-3
nvidia-96xx 96.43.01-6
openal 0.0.8-4
openssl 0.9.8g-2
pacman 3.1.0-1
pacworld 0.3.4-2
patch 2.5.4-4
pcmciautils 014-3
pidgin 2.3.1-1
pkgconfig 0.22-3
ppp 2.4.4-6
procinfo 19-2
procps 3.2.7-4
psmisc 22.6-1
pyqt4 4.3.3-1
pyxdg 0.15-1
qca 1.0-3
qca-tls 1.0-3
rarian 0.6.0-1
reiserfsprogs 3.6.20-3
rp-pppoe 3.8-2
rpmextract 0-1
schismtracker 0.5rc1-1
scite 1.75-1
sdl_image 1.2.6-1
sdl_mixer 1.2.8-1
seamonkey 1.1.5-2
skype 2.0.0.27-1
slim 1.3.0-2
slim-themes 1.2.3-2
squeeze 0.2.2-1
sudo 1.6.9p10-3
syslog-ng 2.0.6-1
sysvinit 2.86-4
tar 1.19-2
terminal 0.2.8-1
terminatorx 3.82-1
thunar 0.9.0-2
thunar-archive-plugin 0.2.4-5
thunar-volman 0.2.0-1
ttf-ms-fonts 2.0-1
tuxcards 2.0-1
udev 116-3
unclutter 8-4
unrar 3.7.8-1
unzip 5.52-3
util-linux-ng 2.13.0.1-2
vim 7.1.156-1
vlc 0.8.6d-1
wget 1.10.2-4
which 2.17-2
xcursor-grounation 0.3-5
xfce-mcs-manager 4.4.2-1
xfce-mcs-plugins 4.4.2-1
xfce-utils 4.4.2-1
xfce4-appfinder 4.4.2-1
xfce4-cpugraph-plugin 0.4.0-1
xfce4-genmon-plugin 3.1-4
xfce4-icon-theme 4.4.2-1
xfce4-mixer 4.4.2-1
xfce4-netload-plugin 0.4.0-4
xfce4-panel 4.4.2-1
xfce4-screenshooter-plugin 1.0.0-5
xfce4-session 4.4.2-1
xfce4-taskmanager 0.3.2-4
xfdesktop 4.4.2-1
xfprint 4.4.2-1
xfwm4 4.4.2-1
xfwm4-themes 4.4.2-1
xmms 1.2.11-1
xorg-fonts-type1 1.0.1-1
xorg-twm 1.0.1-2
xterm 229-2
zip 2.32-1
WEIRD, BUG or ???

After reading your reply, I checked "man pacman" and it changed as you said!
so I did a "pacman -Qt" to look for orphans and this is the result.
alsa-oss 1.0.15-1
alsa-plugins 1.0.15-1
alsa-utils 1.0.15-2
autoconf 2.61-3
automake 1.10-3
bin86 0.16.17-3
bison 2.3-4
catfish 0.3-1
ccsm 0.6.0-2
compiz-fusion-plugins-extra 0.6.0-2
compizconfig-backend-gconf 0.6.0-2
conky 1.4.9-1
csup 20060318-5
docbook-xml 4.5-1
emerald-themes 0.6.0-2
epdfview 0.1.6-5
findutils 4.2.31-3
firefox 2.0.0.11-1
flashplugin 9.0.115.0-1
flex 2.5.33-3
fusion-icon 20071111-1
galculator 1.3.1-1
gettext 0.17-1
gksu 2.0.0-2
gnome-icon-theme 2.20.0-1
gqview 2.0.4-1
grub 0.97-9
gtk-xfce-engine 2.4.2-1
hardinfo 0.4.2.3-1
hdparm 7.7-3
hwd 5.3.1-1
hwdetect 0.9-1
initscripts 2007.11-2
iptables 1.3.8-2
iputils 20070202-3
jacman 0.4-2
kbd 1.12.20070827-2
libsigc++2.0 2.1.1-1
libtool 1.5.24-3
licenses 2.2-2
lilo 22.8-2
lshwd 1.1.3-5
lzo 1.08-4
lzop 1.02rc1-3
make 3.81-3
man 1.6f-1
man-pages 2.74-1
mc 4.6.1-4
mlocate 0.18-2
mousepad 0.2.13-1
mplayer-plugin 3.45-1
nano 2.0.7-1
numlockx 1.1-3
nvidia-96xx 96.43.01-6
openal 0.0.8-4
pacman 3.1.0-1
pacworld 0.3.4-2
patch 2.5.4-4
pcmciautils 014-3
pidgin 2.3.1-1
pkgconfig 0.22-3
procinfo 19-2
psmisc 22.6-1
pyqt4 4.3.3-1
qca-tls 1.0-3
reiserfsprogs 3.6.20-3
rp-pppoe 3.8-2
rpmextract 0-1
schismtracker 0.5rc1-1
scite 1.75-1
sdl_image 1.2.6-1
sdl_mixer 1.2.8-1
seamonkey 1.1.5-2
skype 2.0.0.27-1
slim-themes 1.2.3-2
squeeze 0.2.2-1
sudo 1.6.9p10-3
syslog-ng 2.0.6-1
sysvinit 2.86-4
tar 1.19-2
terminal 0.2.8-1
terminatorx 3.82-1
thunar-archive-plugin 0.2.4-5
thunar-volman 0.2.0-1
ttf-ms-fonts 2.0-1
tuxcards 2.0-1
unclutter 8-4
unrar 3.7.8-1
unzip 5.52-3
vim 7.1.156-1
vlc 0.8.6d-1
which 2.17-2
xcursor-grounation 0.3-5
xf86-input-keyboard 1.2.2-2
xf86-input-mouse 1.2.3-1
xf86-video-vesa 1.3.0-5
xfce-mcs-plugins 4.4.2-1
xfce-utils 4.4.2-1
xfce4-appfinder 4.4.2-1
xfce4-cpugraph-plugin 0.4.0-1
xfce4-genmon-plugin 3.1-4
xfce4-icon-theme 4.4.2-1
xfce4-mixer 4.4.2-1
xfce4-netload-plugin 0.4.0-4
xfce4-screenshooter-plugin 1.0.0-5
xfce4-session 4.4.2-1
xfce4-taskmanager 0.3.2-4
xfdesktop 4.4.2-1
xfprint 4.4.2-1
xfwm4-themes 4.4.2-1
xmms 1.2.11-1
xorg-fonts-type1 1.0.1-1
xorg-twm 1.0.1-2
xorg-xinit 1.0.7-3
xterm 229-2
zip 2.32-1
It shows less packages, yet this are not orphans :-(
Also in "man pacman" it says "(-Qet is equivalent to the pacman 2.9.X -Qe option.)"
pacman -Qet
alsa-oss 1.0.15-1
alsa-plugins 1.0.15-1
alsa-utils 1.0.15-2
autoconf 2.61-3
automake 1.10-3
bin86 0.16.17-3
bison 2.3-4
catfish 0.3-1
ccsm 0.6.0-2
compiz-fusion-plugins-extra 0.6.0-2
compizconfig-backend-gconf 0.6.0-2
conky 1.4.9-1
csup 20060318-5
emerald-themes 0.6.0-2
epdfview 0.1.6-5
findutils 4.2.31-3
firefox 2.0.0.11-1
flashplugin 9.0.115.0-1
flex 2.5.33-3
fusion-icon 20071111-1
galculator 1.3.1-1
gettext 0.17-1
gksu 2.0.0-2
gnome-icon-theme 2.20.0-1
gqview 2.0.4-1
grub 0.97-9
gtk-xfce-engine 2.4.2-1
hardinfo 0.4.2.3-1
hdparm 7.7-3
hwd 5.3.1-1
hwdetect 0.9-1
initscripts 2007.11-2
iptables 1.3.8-2
iputils 20070202-3
jacman 0.4-2
kbd 1.12.20070827-2
libtool 1.5.24-3
licenses 2.2-2
lilo 22.8-2
lshwd 1.1.3-5
lzop 1.02rc1-3
make 3.81-3
man 1.6f-1
man-pages 2.74-1
mc 4.6.1-4
mlocate 0.18-2
mousepad 0.2.13-1
mplayer-plugin 3.45-1
nano 2.0.7-1
numlockx 1.1-3
nvidia-96xx 96.43.01-6
openal 0.0.8-4
pacman 3.1.0-1
pacworld 0.3.4-2
patch 2.5.4-4
pcmciautils 014-3
pidgin 2.3.1-1
pkgconfig 0.22-3
procinfo 19-2
psmisc 22.6-1
pyqt4 4.3.3-1
qca-tls 1.0-3
reiserfsprogs 3.6.20-3
rp-pppoe 3.8-2
rpmextract 0-1
schismtracker 0.5rc1-1
scite 1.75-1
sdl_image 1.2.6-1
sdl_mixer 1.2.8-1
seamonkey 1.1.5-2
skype 2.0.0.27-1
slim-themes 1.2.3-2
squeeze 0.2.2-1
sudo 1.6.9p10-3
syslog-ng 2.0.6-1
sysvinit 2.86-4
tar 1.19-2
terminal 0.2.8-1
terminatorx 3.82-1
thunar-archive-plugin 0.2.4-5
thunar-volman 0.2.0-1
ttf-ms-fonts 2.0-1
tuxcards 2.0-1
unclutter 8-4
unrar 3.7.8-1
unzip 5.52-3
vim 7.1.156-1
vlc 0.8.6d-1
which 2.17-2
xcursor-grounation 0.3-5
xfce-mcs-plugins 4.4.2-1
xfce-utils 4.4.2-1
xfce4-appfinder 4.4.2-1
xfce4-cpugraph-plugin 0.4.0-1
xfce4-genmon-plugin 3.1-4
xfce4-icon-theme 4.4.2-1
xfce4-mixer 4.4.2-1
xfce4-netload-plugin 0.4.0-4
xfce4-screenshooter-plugin 1.0.0-5
xfce4-session 4.4.2-1
xfce4-taskmanager 0.3.2-4
xfdesktop 4.4.2-1
xfprint 4.4.2-1
xfwm4-themes 4.4.2-1
xmms 1.2.11-1
xorg-fonts-type1 1.0.1-1
xorg-twm 1.0.1-2
xterm 229-2
zip 2.32-1
Now I am lost, hahhahahahahaahahahahahaha

Java hangs forever

I can't run practically any java app, nor java applets inside my browser.
I start them, I can see the splash screen of couple of app (or the java logo when running an applet), then nothing happens...
I tried deleting my ~/.java dir and reinstalling j2re. What can I do?
The only apps that I succeded to run so far are jacman and some simple console programs.
Thanks!,
Federico

I am using Oracle 8.1.7 and XSU12

Not a single package manager GUI?

There is not a single package manager GUI for archlinux. The one provided in community repo jacman is quite unstable and the gtkpacman in aur can even search packages.
How about porting http://www.packagekit.org/index.html to archlinux.

Phrodo_00 wrote:yes I was thinking about you and the couple of packagekit topics that have appeared... and not thinking as seroius intentions from arch, but from, you know, some guy, you seemed pretty decided in that post, looks like I was wrong then... anyway, now that I know you aren't really interested and I'm starting vacation at university (and starting to work in a job if I can find one) I might aswell start taking a look at libalpm (why is it called like that?) and packagekit and see if I come out with something.
From http://www.archlinux.org/pacman/ :
As of version 3.0, pacman has been lib-ified, with a backend library named 'libalpm' (Arch Linux Package Management). Speed in some cases has been improved, and this should allow us in the future to speed development of alternative front ends.
EDIT: however, some other guy nicknamed tradiaz said he was going to do it, not a lot about him has been heard though.
There are two recent commits from him, you can see them in gitweb for example :
http://gitweb.freedesktop.org/?p=packagekit.git
(look for alpm and the date of today)
But it looks far from complete if the table on the faq is uptodate:
http://www.packagekit.org/pk-faq.html

Gtkpacman as root?

i gave gtkpacman a try and it looks really promising. but why is it necessary to run it as root???
this is only needed for installing and removing packages and upgrading the database.
when starting, there is this message that i have to start the application as root to do stuff.
this is not true: i have to be root to install or remove stuff, but i do not have to start the application itself as root to do so.
imo, there is a strict separation between the gui and the underlying install/remove mechanism.
so the root (or if using sudo the user's) password is needed only when the three actions mentionend above are actually performed.
as i said it looks promising, but so far i think it's not really trustworthy.
vlad
btw: sudo is also a possible option.

I hear what you're saying and it makes a lot of sense. But I guess it's just about where the developer's priorities lie when making the software. I'm not even sure if gtkpacman is maintained any more.
Speaking for myself, as the dev of Jacman, I know that you start off with something that covers the basics. It may mean you cut several corners, but hey, it's just a 0.1 right?! And then slowly you add more and more refinements. Jacman doesn't need root rights to browse the packages, but you will not get very far once you try and install/remove packages if you weren't root when you started the application. It's just a lot of hassle doing all that sudoing and so that was one of the corners I cut - I wanted to add other features which were a higher priority for me. And I dare say for similar reasons the dev of gtkpacman came across similar issues.

Package List

OK, Very Happy So Far. I have followed everyones advice and tips,tutorials kindly given me,. upgraded system etc. AnyHow what I have been searching for is a way to find out what packages PacMan may have , I want to know if there is a command to give pacman that will give me a list of whats available. I havn't added any sources or repos yet'not sure what PacMan uses or what package tool it is closely related to (apt-get,yum,Portage,etc etc) is there a gui for pacman ,not that I need it , I know how to add install a package but am just curious to see whats available?

Hutchy wrote:Thanks penguin ,are these downloadable with pacman or do I have to download & compile them as I tried installing them but got this error for both
" pacman -S gtkpacman
gtkpacman: not found in sync db
. Sorry not sure what Aur is
The AUR may seem a little daunting if you're a newbie. I know it took me a while to get the hang of it, and I had been using Arch for 6 months, so I understand.
Regarding Jacman, if you wish to bypass the AUR for now, I've already created a pkg.tar.gz and I'm reliably informed that pacman can install from URLs. Therefore, you can do this:
pacman -A http://download.berlios.de/jacman/jacman-0.2-1.pkg.tar.gz
Then it's just a matter of typing 'jacman' at the command prompt.

Suggestion regarding website usability, and the AUR

Hey everyone, lately i've been doing some thinking on how to improve the website and integrating things as easily and best as possible. Before the flames on this being commercial software begin, just hear me out.
With minimal - no effort and hacking of the source code we can have these features:
· Single login/registration for everything below
· Announcements on front page piping automatically piping discussion to it's own thread in specified forum
· Blogs
· Gallery
· shared login with mediawiki
· An improved AUR system, with an accurate way to gauge package usage (which i'll describe and show below)
· Shop
· Donations system which displays in real time and adds user to a thank you page (unless they choose to be anonymous)
· Forum system lightyears better than phpbb (current info and userbase simple to import)
· Very powerful (and easy) administration/privelage system
· RSS Feeds on every Area you choose to have them for
· even our user map can be integrated with no effort
· mailing list threads piped to specified forum and vise versa
What i'm proposing is vBulletin. An owned license (one time lifetime fee) is only 160$, and i feel with the extra donations this is well worth it, in pretty much every way i can think of.
AUR system:
It probably will be easiest to show by example, so here it is - http://www.vbulletin.org/forum/showthre … did=108515 . The best feature this offers us (along of course with being centralized), is the way the voting would work. Right now, i know i'm guilty, but i just get too lazy and forget to always click to vote on a package i use. And also alot of the time i stop using said package.
With this system, you click install, when you have installed a package, the contributor can see exactly who installed and who hasnt (Which is good as a way to nudge people who post for support, yet havent clicked install/voted). People will be much more likely to vote/click install a package here, since doing so will enable them to be notified via email every time the package is updated. and when they uninstall and no longer wish to be notified of updates, they just click uninstall.
I know currently we have the rss feed for the aur which does similar, but afaik it only shows new packages and not updated ones?. Which can be a pain to always check to stay up to date.
Anyways, give it some thought. I've been using and hacking up vB for quite some time, so if you guys have any questions on other areas, just ask. I'm posting this to the mailing list as well. Don't take this as a flame on the current website efforts. I just feel this would make things easier to manage and stay organized, and better for the end user for the same reason.
Thanks for making it through my novel,
-- Chris O'Reilly

Ok guys, I'm gonna butt in here, I've seen this happen several times before. While you can discuss all you want, I guarantee nothing will happen unless somebody actually chooses to do something. We talked for ages about a wiki, but it didn't happen until rasat set it up. We talked for ages about a NEW wiki, but that didn't happen until cactus set it up. We talked for ages about forum mods, but that didn't happen until dibble set it up. We talked for ages about Arch64 before syamajala and now andyRTR took on the project. We talked for ages about a custom kernel PKGBUILD before I and later dibble tackled the project. We've talked for ages about gui frontends to pacman and people have set them up and the project usually falls apart, barring jacman. and so on.
Now, if anyone is *serious* about this project, and I mean serious as in you've thought about it and realize that its HUGE, I would suggest one of two things:
1) talk to Judd and see if he has any ideas
2) start hacking something together and show it to Judd
Now, from previous experience in Arch-related development, I can guarantee that Judd won't just accept or assign someone to start this project. What he will do, however, is provide answers and feedback if someone is working on it, and if he likes the results, he will accept them as well. This is typical arch development.
I would say that since the website is such a visual first impression of Arch, Judd might want more input into it, but I doubt this is true.... if he was that concerned, something would have been done with the front page before now. ;-)
Basically, I'm saying talk all you like, but it won't do any good.
Dusty

Jacman

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