PNG 8 Alpha Transparency Palette Errors

I am attempting to export a PNG 8 image with alpha transparency using Fireworks 11.1.0.205 on Windows 7 64-bit. When I attempt to optimize the image to PNG 8, Adaptive with Alpha Transparency and rebuild the palette it crushed the palette down. The image is a grayscale image and the bug appears similiar to the one reported here http://blogs.adobe.com/sarthak/2010/09/png-8-export-color-palette-issues.html.
Here is a screen cast of someone doing what I want to do, http://brenelz.com/blog/png-8-alpha-transparency-screencast/ (fast forward through the parts of him editing HTML).
This is an example of what I am trying to do, an PNG 8 with alpha transparency (view full image);
This is what I get when I open and then export the sample image out of Fireworks;
It crushes the palette.
This is the optimize panel when the original file is first opened:
This is what happens when the palette is rebuilt, which matched the exported palette;

Linda,
I do not appreciate your condescending tone. I have attempted all of your instructions. Embedded is a window capture of my graphic on a TRANPARENT canvas with your suggested settings. Also embedded is the resulting graphic. Finally, embedded is the original graphic that demonstrates what I am attempting to achieve.
Transparent Canvas
Resulting image on export.
Original image
I'm disappointed that you cannot be bothered to attempt to recreate the problem and post evidence to back up your claims.
I have tracked down the creator of the original image who says about using Fireworks "the quality was rarely good enough." The tool used was ImageOptim, http://imageoptim.pornel.net/.

Similar Messages

Alpha transparency workaround

Since people still insist on using IE 6 and I can't figure out how to use my logo with alpha transparency (despite copying the code exactly), can anyone tell me the code I would use to display my logo in png form for IE 7 and above and my logo in jpg form for IE 6 and lower? Thanks.

Hi instead of using an IE conditional statement why don't you try using the iepngfix.htc file which enables IE6 to display png alpha transparency files correctly.
Instructions on how to use it (and download link) is available here:
http://www.dlnqnt.co.uk/index.php/tag/iepngfixhtc/

Opening Fireworks PNG-8s with alpha transparancy

Hi all,
I have to do some work on some files I didn't create -- a couple hundred png files. They are 8-bit, indexed files, but when viewed on the web they have 256 levels of alpha transparency. When opened in Photoshop, they have only one level of alpha transparency :(
Turns out these are in some proprietary Fireworks format ... anyone have any ideas how I can get these into Photoshop without losing my alpha channel, hopefully without having to BUY Fireworks ... oh how I miss ImageReady ;)
Thanks in advance.

Photoshop doesn't work with continuous transparency in indexed color mode, only one transparent value is allowed. (ImageReady wouldn't do it, either)
You may need to use another application to convert them to a normal RGB image with transparency.

Bug in fireworks CS4 when exporting 24/32bit png with transparent alpha?

Hi there,
I recently upgraded to CS4 from CS3 and am quite disappointed to find that the png export facility for 24 or 32 bit png's is next to useless on my installation of Fireworks (Vista). I have a colleage who has reported the same behanviour on his mac.
Please see this native fireworks CS4 png file and attempt to export it as 24 or 34 bit png, ensuring the canvas is transparent (it shuold be already)...
http://www.capitalh.net/demo-bug.png
Viewing in preview mode in CS3 would show the png with its alpha channel indicated by the chequered transparent pattern. Exporting it as such would produce the desired result > a png with a nice blended alpha channel.
Viewing in preview mode in CS4 shows a horrible render of the image on a white background. Exporting the image produces the same result. Please see this link for confirmation:
http://www.capitalh.net/demo-bug-export.png
Please also see this simpler image, this time using a simple ellipse shape:
http://www.capitalh.net/demo-bug-export-simpleshape.png
You'll notice that it is not transparent, and the ellipse has not been anti-aliased.
Can anyone shed some light on this behaviour?
Exporting png's as such is something that I do daily at work, and is a basic requirement of an image editting application targetted at web design.
Am I doing something wrong? I've been using Fireworks since 2003 so I'm inclined to think that I'm not.

That's a bit, um, oh never mind. Would've been a rubbish joke anyway.
Aww...pooh. I love "rubbish" jokes!
If fireworks is unable to export a transparent png at 24bit, then why have the option?
(granted the option is acutally implied, not given)
Also, why the horrible rendering on preview and export?
Transparency for 24-bit isn't an option and isn't implied. Create a FW document with a transparent canvas. Go to File>Image Preview. If you select PNG8 as your export option, then you have drop-downs for No Transparency, Index Transparency, or Alpha Transparency. PNG32 shows the checkerboard where the document is transparent. If you select PNG24, you do not have the transparency options. Transparent areas in your document are set to white, just as they are if you select the JPEG format. Try it.
I don't know why your rendering is horrible. I'd have to see your image.
And also, why all this confusion related to Photoshop, seems Adobe really aren't helping the issue:
http://forums.adobe.com/thread/152434
Possibly Adobe thought it was less confusing, as they didn't have to go into the math. However, you do see Linda Rathgeber's answer, that the Photoshop convention is...well...misleading? (I'd call it wrong, but that's just me. ) It's just one other issue to bring into alignment as Adobe works to merge the Macromedia offerings into their line.

Why Does Reading A Gif Or Png Containing Transparent/Alpha Pixels Fail?

I'm trying to read in gif or png with transparent pixels into a BufferedImage so that I can create a font inside of Java. Right now, I'm defaulting to the assumption that the background of the font image is white. However, I want to make it so that the font background is whatever pixels happen to be transparent. The images I'm reading in have only two colors: black and white. I set all the white pixels to transparent when creating the images in hopes that I could do a check for all pixels with Alpha < 255. I have tried numerous possible solutions, such as saving the png files with different applications, ImageIO.read, and Toolkit.getDefaultToolkit().createImage, and JAI.The types of the resulting BufferedImages have varied between TYPE_BYTE_BINARY, TYPE_BYTE_INDEXED, and TYPE_CUSTOM. What I want is TYPE_INT_ARGB so I can get the dang alpha pixels.
1. Is there a way to read in alpha pixels of png or gif (doesn't have to be both) from within the main Java libraries as a BufferedImage with type TYPE_INT_ARGB? If so, how?
2. Failing that, is there a way to read in alpha pixels of png or gif (doesn't have to be both) by using a decent external library as a BufferedImage with type TYPE_INT_ARGB? If so, how and with which one?
This has been frustrating the heck out of me, since I thought this was something very simple to do, but I've spent two days poring over the entire Internet for a possible solution.

package aerobush.ocr.translator;
import java.awt.Graphics2D;
import java.awt.Image;
import java.awt.Toolkit;
import java.awt.datatransfer.Clipboard;
import java.awt.datatransfer.DataFlavor;
import java.awt.image.BufferedImage;
import java.io.DataInputStream;
import java.io.File;
import java.io.FileInputStream;
import java.io.IOException;
import java.io.InputStream;
import javax.imageio.ImageIO;
import javax.imageio.ImageReader;
import javax.imageio.stream.ImageInputStream;
import javax.media.jai.JAI;
import javax.media.jai.PlanarImage;
import com.sun.imageio.plugins.png.PNGMetadata;
public class ImageUtils
     static public BufferedImage readPng1(
               File pngFile ) {
          try {
               BufferedImage image = ImageIO.read(pngFile);
               return image;
          catch (Exception e) {}
          return null;
     static public BufferedImage readPng2(
               File pngFile ) {
          try {
               BufferedImage image = (BufferedImage) Toolkit.getDefaultToolkit().createImage(
                         pngFile.getAbsolutePath());
               return image;
          catch (Exception e) {}
          return null;
     static public BufferedImage readPng3(
               File pngFile ) {
          try {
               final PlanarImage planar = JAI.create(
                         "FileLoad",
                         pngFile.getAbsolutePath());
               BufferedImage img = planar.getAsBufferedImage();
               return img;
          catch (Exception e) {
               e.printStackTrace();
          return null;
     static public BufferedImage readPng4(
               File pngFile ) {
          try {
               ImageInputStream stream = ImageIO.createImageInputStream(new FileInputStream(
                         pngFile));
               ImageReader r = ImageIO.getImageReadersByFormatName(
                         "png").next();
               r.setInput(
                         stream,
                         true,
                         false);
               PNGMetadata metadata = (PNGMetadata) r.getImageMetadata(0);
               BufferedImage i = r.read(0);
               if (!i.getColorModel().hasAlpha() && metadata.tRNS_present) {
                    int alphaPix = (metadata.tRNS_red << 16) | (metadata.tRNS_green << 8)
                              | (metadata.tRNS_blue);
                    BufferedImage tmp = new BufferedImage(
                              i.getWidth(),
                              i.getHeight(),
                              BufferedImage.TYPE_INT_ARGB);
                    for (int x = 0; x < i.getWidth(); x++) {
                         for (int y = 0; y < i.getHeight(); y++) {
                              int rgb = i.getRGB(
                                        x,
                                        y);
                              rgb = (rgb & 0xFFFFFF) == alphaPix ? alphaPix : rgb;
                              tmp.setRGB(
                                        x,
                                        y,
                                        rgb);
                    i = tmp;
               return i;
          catch (IOException e) {}
          return null;
}Edited by: oldbushie on Sep 13, 2009 2:07 PM
Edited by: oldbushie on Sep 13, 2009 2:08 PM

Why can't I export a 24 bit PNG with alpha transparency?

I have just upgraded my Macromedia Studio 8 to Adobe CS3, and
it seems that I still can't export a 24 bit png with transparency
from Fireworks (Photoshop can do it, but it's just not suited for
volume graphic production). Anyone know something I don't, or can
someone at least explain why I can have alpha transparency on 8 bit
and 32 bit, but not 24 bit pngs? Currently, I'm planning to export
everything from Fireworks, then batch-process through Photoshop to
reduce from 32 bit to 24 bit, which is just... gah! Words fail
me.

Kathleen13 wrote:
> I have just upgraded my Macromedia Studio 8 to Adobe
CS3, and it seems that I
> still can't export a 24 bit png with transparency from
Fireworks (Photoshop can
> do it, but it's just not suited for volume graphic
production). Anyone know
> something I don't, or can someone at least explain why I
can have alpha
> transparency on 8 bit and 32 bit, but not 24 bit pngs?
Currently, I'm planning
> to export everything from Fireworks, then batch-process
through Photoshop to
> reduce from 32 bit to 24 bit, which is just... gah!
Words fail me.
>
If I'm correct, 8-bit png supports index transparency just
like GIF's
do. 32-bit png's support alpha channel transparency, so you
can get
variable or partial transparency in a full color image(8 bits
for each
color and 8 bits for an alpha channel) and 24-bit png's are
similar
jpegs, only you get lossless compression and no user-defined
settings.
So essentially, when you export a 32-bit png file you are
exporting a 24
bit color image with an 8-bit alpha channel.
Jim Babbage - .:Community MX:. & .:Adobe Community
Expert:.
Extending Knowledge, Daily
http://www.communityMX.com/
CommunityMX - Free Resources:
http://www.communitymx.com/free.cfm
.:Adobe Community Expert for Fireworks:.
news://forums.macromedia.com/macromedia.fireworks
news://forums.macromedia.com/macromedia.dreamweaver

Photos app bug resurrects long-removed photos (related to PNG alpha)

Wanted to report/discuss a possible privacy concern and image glitch, and understand it better for submission to Apple's feedback page: the iPad (and maybe iPhone) Photos app will consitently resurrect long-deleted photos in your Camera Roll, under certain circumstances. These are long-removed photos (as in removed many months ago, prior to the iOS 5 update), and possibly only the reduced-size thumbnail versions.
Note: as near as I can tell, the deleted photos were NOT originally from the camera roll! That's where they resurface, but I believe they are photos from other albums, maybe once which used to by synched to iPad but which I no longer synch. So "removed" might mean deleted or it might mean "no longer synched to iPad"... the images are so old I can't recall.
So the bug, I'm guessing, it two-fold:
1) The Photos app (and/or iPhoto during wired synch?) is not fully removing photos (or at least, their thumbs). They're no longer visible in Photos app, but are being retained somewhere on the device.
2) A glitch in the Photos camera roll PNG handling (which I think may be new with iOS 5) causes those old images ro re-surface when you add a PNG to the camera roll. (The old photos were JPEG, but the image that triggers the bug must be a PNG with alpha channel)
I have seen this on both an iPad 1 and iPad 2, running iOS 5.
Here's how to reproduce it:
1) Synch some photos to your iPad, then deselect them for synching and re-synch (so they're not there any more). Also, add some photos or screenshots to the camera roll and then delete them. I say to do both because I'm not 100% where the old photos come from, and I'm hoping this covers all bases! Actually, most people have already done these things in the past, and can probably skip this step.
2) Generate a transparent PNG using the art app Procreate (and probably any app that saves PNGs to the camera roll with alpha channel). All you have to do is scribble somethign into a blank Procreate canvas, then export it to your photo album. There is no need to do anything special to get an alpha channel or PNG format: you always get that. (Unless you used the Fill command to completely cover the canvas.) Now in the camera roll there should be your scribble on a transparent background. You can email it to yourself and see that clearly in Photoshop or Preview.
3) Here's the glitch: look at your camera roll (thumbnails view) and you'll see that the alpha-transparent background of the image has become one of your old removed photos! Tap it to enlarge and the alpha becomes black (which is fine, although it may seem odd if you intended to paint onto the default white canvas). But for just a moment, before you see the black, you will get a full-size glimpse of the old photo. (Or, maybe, an enlargement of the thumbnail?)
4) If you keep saving more alpha PNGs, you'll keep seeing more and different old photos coming back to life in the alpha regions of the thumbnails (and, briefly, at full size).
5) If you delete all those PNGs and then save some new ones, you'll see the same sequence of old photos reappear again.
Needed fix: removed phtos/thumbnails should be properly purged, and alpha PNGs should show simply black (or some default background) at all times.

Ok, I replicated it and I don't like it! I didn't use the one you marked cause I couldn't call it up properly but I did Bing
transparent gifs and loaded up 3, one was totally invisible in the thumbnail and I could clearly see one of my pics perfectly in the thumbnail but when I brought it to page the gif filled the frame.
I have no idea where the pic came from, I mean I recognize it but from where in the album I have no idea.
Oh yeah, I was wrong about the first pic coming to page, it wasn't the same image but a different one...and I have no idea how the one that came up, (what i thought was the underlying pic) did, or how it got there or even from where.
This is some weird stuff though not as weird as that silly *** movie, what a load of tripe; I should have just spent my
time on this, it's infinitely more enjoyable!
Ok, here's the consensus from my layman iPad view:
What happened now and most probably before was a 'transparent gif' or a partially transparent gif like the one I spoke of first that I could see the edge of or the outer perimeter of, the underlining image with the gif taking up say 3/4 of the thumbnail; this it what it was.
This is totally apparent to me now because of your having me import a totally transparent gif which was invisible over my pic, thus the freaky part I didn't like...keying the thumbnail with one thing and ending up with something totally different when brought to page.
Still doesn't explain where this silly iPad is grabbing these pics from?
But here's something funny; my camera roll shows say 9,200 pics but my, 'iMy System' app say I have like 11,300 which I always thought was a fluke, that it was just reading wrong but maybe it's seeing something we're not. What if all those pics we're deleting to save space or just generally culling have never left the system? Maybe that goofy app is really reading the true count!
Those others up above us here who mentioned privacy concerns.. this could be whats going on, there's a ghost
in the machine and it be our old pics and god knows what else floating around in that iPads memory.
Ok, I'm crazy tired and I have to wrap this up. Least now we know how to replicate this but on the other hand I think we opened up an even bigger can of worms... the mystery of where all those images are hiding in our iPads?
I haven't hardwired to a computer since I upgraded to ios5 so whatever's going on here, leastwise for me is iPad
based and can't be blamed for synching issues like you discuss up above unless what I'm grabbing here is old stuff
reimported back into my pad from the mainframe when I was backed up for the ios5 upgrade?
Oh well, let me know what you think. Please do forgive my not getting back to you sooner on account of the movie
but you already know I regret choosing that over this! Hope you had a good night and thanks...

PNG w/ transparency opens and looks horrible

I have a PNG sprite map. 85KB in size. Took it to an online PNG crush, got it down to 29KB and it looks great.
When Photoshop (CS5 on Win7x64) opens that file, there is transparency, but the edges look miserable. Very jagged and aliased. The file opens in Indexed 8-bit, but even changing the mode to RGB and high bits per channel, it looks very ugly.
I browsed out to the file hosted on our website, cleared the cache and viewed just the image online through the browser. It looks fantastic. Refreshed page and it still looks great. Downloaded that file to local PC, opened in PS CS5 and it's back to looking miserable. Any ideas what I'm doing wrong here? Is it because I took this PNG file to some online compressor that PS can read the file buy degrades its quality?

Oh wait. Nevermind. Seems there's a note at the very bottom of the PNG optimizer website which states that:
PS CS5 and earlier cannot properly VIEW an indexed PNG with Alpha transparency (my apparent issue). But they also state (and I'm not sure how current this is) that no version of PS supports MAKING indexed PNG with Alpha transparency.
If that's true, I'm very surprised at Adobe. I have no plans to upgrade to a later version of PS, but with 65-75% filesize savings, it's amazing the software doesn't have that support.

Appending alpha transparency swatches to a CLUT

I have a 160 swatch color table I generated in PS and I'd
like to append some alpha transparency values to it for PNG8
processing.
In Fireworks CS4 I've loaded up a test image, successfully
loaded in the .act file I exported from PS and then selected 'Alpha
Transparency' from the trns pulldown menu. Briefly some new
swatches show up in the swatch palette, but then they disappear.
I've tried everything I can think of. If there was a way to
manually add and edit the transparency swatches to the act that
would be ideal, but when I try to add swatches to the table I don't
see any way to edit the transparency value, only RGB/HEX etc.. I'm
somewhat stuck at the moment.
Is there a way to do this? Maybe even some sort of
independent color table editor?
It's important that I have exact control over the CLUT file
used as the device that the images will be running on can only have
one CLUT active at any time, and all of the images in the UI need
to be built to reference this single table.
Another tangental issue I've encountered is that the PNG8
alpha transparency in FW seems to be restricting itself for some
reason. For example, I've created a 256 pixel wide image in PS with
a black ramp that goes from 100% opaque to 100% transparent across
x-axis. I open this in FW, select PNG8, adaptive, 256 colors, alpha
transparency and I only get 16 swatches (4bit?), completely
faceting my ramp - however I've seen others online getting 8bit
values of transparency using this same method...
For example
Here
and
Here
Any and all feedback much appreciated.
Nate

natronix wrote:
> Jim,
> That one only contains 16 transparent values, if the
optimize palette
> functioned correctly it would be 255.. the source image
I started with
> contained a 256 pixel wide block, blending from opaque
black to completely
> transparent (therefor 1 opaque color and 255 values of
transparency).
>
> However when I select PN8, adaptive sampling, 256 colors
and alpha
> transparency, that file is what Fireworks creates.
>
> I'd described this previously- the posting of this file
was per Linda's
> request to see a PNG8 with non-index transparency, which
it has, albeit not a
> full 8bits.
>
> On another note, I've opened up the .act files in a hex
editor and can see
> that it does not contain an alpha attribute. So my
initial concept of appending
> these new transparent values from Fireworks to the .act
are moot. I've
> discovered the .pal color table format, which is almost
identical to .act
> except it contains an extra hex pair for an alpha value.
>
> Apparently Photoshop use to support importing and
exporting of .pal color
> table files. I don't know what version support stopped
at. I've tested CS3 & 4
> and they aren't playing nice.
>
> It appears as though I'll need to manually concatenate
the .pal file starting
> with the existing .act table that I have, porting the
hex values over, and then
> manually building out the transparent values I want. The
next and final step
> will be to identify a version of Fireworks, or some
other host, that can
> utilize .pal and run optimizations on the files I have.
That or I get a patch
> to Fireworks that fixes the optimize panel, better yet a
patch to Photoshop
> that enables alpha transparency in PNG8.. I'm not
holding my breath.
>
>
Nate can you share the original 256 value set, even if it is
in PSD form?
Jim Babbage - .:Community MX:. & .:Adobe Community
Expert:.
http://www.communityMX.com/
.:Adobe Community Expert for Fireworks:.
http://www.adobe.com/communities/experts/members/206.html

Re: Best fix for getting PNGs alpha to work in IE?

On 20 Sep 2006 05:56:53 -0700, [email protected] in
macromedia.fireworks wrote:
<snip>
>There is the obvious problem of lack of Alpha support on
IE 5 & 6 but
>this can be cured with javascript fixes.
>One Ive found is Bob Osola JS fix, the problem with this
relies on the
>user having JS turned on and it doesnt work on PNGs used
as a CSS image
>background.
>Can anyone recomend another method(s)?
>Ive heard that you can embedd some code in a CSS rule
relating to
>getting PNGs alpha to work but cant find anything on the
net?
How about this;
<
http://www.scss.com.au/family/andrew/webdesign/pngbehavior/>

first, click file>publish settings>swf and tick "permit debugging". you will then see the line number of the problematic code in the error message which should speed your debugging substantially.
but that first message looks like you do NOT have an object in your library with class name Sight or you have some other class Final that's being used (and extends Sprite and is not dynamic).

Export to png with transparancy

hey, can this be done?
export to png with transparent background
even setting the background of the slide to "none" doesn't work
if you can't achieve this, does anyone have any ideas how I could do a workaround?
cheers, D

Ahh, I read this and thought you required the export. You essentially want to take an image from Keynote into some other application WITH transparency, correct? If so, you may want to take a look at Skitch.
http://www.plasq.com/skitch -currently in public beta as a free download
You could copy the items as you're currently doing, then open Skitch and paste them in. Your objects will appear with a white background. Next, click the color well at the bottom of the colors on the right hand side in order to bring up the color palette. Change the opacity to Zero, then hold down Shift, while clicking in the color well. The background is dropped out and you have full transparency. You can even use Skitch to resize the image to exactly the size you want it to be. Click and drag the tab and to export at that size.

Recommend an image editor that has a magic wand tool to delete white background and save as PNG with transparency

Hi Everybody,
I need an iPad app that can open an image and has a Magic Wand-type tool so I can select white background around a subject. Then delete the white areas so it becomes transparent. Then save as a PNG with transparency. I've tried Pixelmator...I can select the white but I can not delete the white. I downloaded Photoshop Express...no magic wand tool.
Does anyone have any recommendations?
Thanks,
Gary

It's a shame you don't have Mac. The feature is built in the system (in Preview, Pages, etc).
That makes me think: this feature should be in the iPad iWork apps too (Pages and keynote): check out this guide: http://www.cultofmac.com/256475/knock-out-those-backgrounds-instant-alpha-hidden -in-pages-for-ipad-ios-tips/

On closing Photoshop CC, I am getting an error message on screen that read's "Selective Palette error: no element found at line 1. Are you able to assist with this problem?

Can anyone shed some light on this error message I am getting upon closing Photoshop CC
I am getting an error message on screen that read's "Selective Palette error: no element found at line 1. Are you able to assist with this problem?

Same issue here in WI and for me it was at 6:36p CST.
I'm changed my password, removed iCloud from my phone ... tried 3G and WIFI with no luck. I also cannot check it on my Mac or iPad. I was able to get contacts and calenders back on my phone but no mail yet.
Did the whole Apple support thing and apparently I'm part of the 1%
EDIT: Question: are all of you former MobileMe users as well? Just wondering because I know there were going to be some changes as they completely move MobileMe over to iCloud and drop the "extra" services. I just can't remember if it was just a single cut off date or a series of dates. THAT email is stuck in my iCloud folders.

Missing Transparency palette in InDesign CS4

Wanted to make something transparent today and realized my Transparency palette is missing in InDesign 6.0.3.
Did the UI change, is the Transparency palette not on the Windows menu anymore?
Or is it somehow not loaded (not sure why), and if so how to I fix it?
If it helps... I also have CS2 installed (I didn't uninstall it for some reason when installng CS4) and it has the Transparency palette.
Thanks.

Thank you!
I was reading all the articles for older products talking about re-installing, and removing fonts, etc. I'm so glad it was just a UI change.

"Preserve alpha transparency" with flattening for PDF

For what reason, in Illustrator CS3, is the option for preserving alpha transparency not available in the PDF flattener, but only under the object menu by choosing Flatten Transparency...
The reason i'm asking, is because when using some effects and spot colors, the background of the flattened object becomes a white bounding rectangle that overlaps other objects. I can workaround this by saving a copy, flatten all objects and then save a PDF. But isn't it possible to directly save a correctly flattened PDF from the original unflattened file with spot colors, without having to flatten the objects manually?

here is an example, when I upload this image to the printers I loose the white background and eveything on the bottom of the card is pushed up. The same thing happens with the brochure I have. I can't upload that because this site will not allow it.

PNG 8 Alpha Transparency Palette Errors

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