Apple going MS style - don't install Lion if you don't need to

Hi,
I am obviously frustrated. I want to warn anyone with an Apple MacBook, MacBook Air or iMac that is not very recent. If you do not need Lion, don't install it. It is a disaster.
Don't get me wrong. I am a huge Apple fun, but with this release I am getting a degavu regarding my MS Windows history. Lion has similar "features" as Windows has and which were my original reason the happily get rid of MS Windows. Apple has gone totally the wrong way with this release if you ask me.
Problem I have since I installed Lion:
- non responsive applications for no apparent reason.
- hanging system several times a day.
- having to reboot my system to get any response from it several time a day.
- totally unpredicatable battery lifetime of my MacBooks. Mostly less than half the original amount before installing Lion.
This is not just on a single system, but on all systems I have. All systems were bought during 2007.
In my opinion this release is in it's current state a disaster and absolutely not Apple worthy. I hope they fire some people at Apple for this, becaus this will damage the brand in my opinion and should never happen again.
Why MS style (in my opinion)? Apple has given a lot of focus on useless graphical features (LaunchPad and MissionControl) (also degavu regarding MS). Well I can tell you it is not worth it. Snow Leopard was working like a charm. Lion is more like a Snail.
I hope Apple will come with updates really quickly, otherwise I am afraid the are now on the same quality level as MS. The point have always been happy to pay the Apple prices, because they were absolutely worth it. I can get poor quality for much less money. Even though this update is very cheap, it is still not worth the money.
Best regards,
Ruud Wijnands

I have two other email accounts so the loss of loss of apple email is no big thing. Cheaper cell phones is not a bad thing either
so ha ha back at ya

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Virgin Media spend all kinds of money advertising their broadband as the fastest in the UK, but don't tell you (up front anyway) that you'll be cut off if you actually try and use it.
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Message was edited by: McGinty

If I don't install lion will I be cloud less next june

I am not planning on installing lion. On reason is iTunes 10. I don't like it, the only reason I have it installed is to update my iPhone. I use iTunes 9 for everything else. iTunes is colorless and it sounds like finder is also. If I don't upgrade to lion and mobleme goes away what about iCal, mail etc.
dave

I have two other email accounts so the loss of loss of apple email is no big thing. Cheaper cell phones is not a bad thing either
so ha ha back at ya

MacBook Pro 13 " going slower in performance after Installing LION OSX

Hey Guys ,
I had noticed some problems in my MacBook Pro 13" which I bought in the MID of 2011 ( i5 processor ) , I had purchased and installed LION OSX and observed after installing that my Backlite ( Keyboard ) dont get on when I start up at the LOG IN , which used to work in SNOW LEOPARD .
Booting takes SO SO SO long as when comapared with the previous OS .
Heating Problem is also a must to mention .
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Thank You .

I'm curious if you ever found a solution for this issue. I recently purchased the SanDisk Extreme II 480GB, replacing my OWC Extreme Pro 240GB. The OWC never experienced the "slow to wake" issue whereas the SanDisk drive does, consistently. To make sure I'm having the same symptoms, this is what happens to me: Put the mac to sleep (either manually or letting it do it on its own, waiting for the led to pulse showing that it is asleep), then wake it up (press a key on the keyboard), the logon screen shows almost immediately but as soon as I try to type the pinwheel/beach ball shows up, I wait between 20 and 30 seconds and then I'm able to type and all is well.
I contataced SanDisk and their support was horrible. They simply told me "contact MAC for this issue" (no joke, not "contact Apple" but "contact MAC", in all caps). I explained that it works fine with the OWC drive just not the SanDisk. They replied with another article showing that all macs have trouble waking from sleep (not true). I replied again indicating that I've never had this issue with any of my 3rd party drives, only this SanDisk. Then the replied simply stating that all mac's have issues with 3rd party hard drives when waking from sleep. At this point I threw a fit and yelled at my screen, even though it wasn't my screens fault.
In any case, their support has not been willing to do any actual troubleshooting. I'd love to return it and I might have to - but as you stated, it's annoying to have this issue but the performance is fine the rest of the time.
Thanks for any input you have.
Bryan

DON'T UPGRADE LION until you read this thread

https://discussions.apple.com/thread/3197249
You will see from this thread that many people who have upgraded to Lion (versus a clean install) have had a disasterous experience. For instance:
I have lost count of how many times my computer has crashed in the last 3 weeks after not having a single full computer crash for years
The overall speed/performance of the computer and every application slows to a crawl
Programs "stop responding" for minutes on end and then work at a snail's pace when they come back
You can see from the thread that the problem seems to be associated with Flash. Uninstalling flash helps but it means you can forget about Youtube and every other application/web site that requires it.
From my own experience, I recommend you stay away from a Lion upgrade until this problem is fixed as it is extremely frustrating. I don't know if people who have done a clean install have the sme problem.

rtln wrote:
I run FlashBlock and have no problems with YouTube. The videos are in h.264 also. I find it a much better experience. There are a few sites that use Flash effectively but for the most part I find Flash is used in poor design and tons of advertising. I'm happy to be rid of it.
I am running 10.6 on my primary HD but did do an upgrade to 10.7 on an external HD so I could try it out. There are some things I really like in Lion but unfortunately there are also a LOT of things I do not like (LaunchPad, Spaces, conflicting touch gestures in every app, wasted time and resources on animated interfaces, ugly user interface in iCal, Mail, Addressbook etc.). The stability of Lion seemed fine though.
I just bought a new MacBook Pro and so instead of migrating or transfering a clone I did a nice new Clean install of 10.6 (and all the updates) and my favorite apps (all newest updated versions) and after I ran a clone backup of that, I upgraded to 10.7
Maybe that's the trick to updating.
Excellent advice
My recommended method, clone your internal to an external, install Lion on the external, when ready either physically interchange the drives or clone the external back to the internal.
The external becomes one of your backup methods, it's already up to date.

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Try the online Apple Store or do a Google search.

I am trying to install a clean copy of Lion, but I don't see the OS in my Disk Utility

Good Morning Friends,
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Hi Bohandleit208,
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Download Lion Again Without Installing Snow Leopard First
There's an easy method to force a download within the Mac App Store without any tinkering. It seems to be the official method, although I found no description of this in any of Apple's documentation.
So here's how to do it:
Open the Mac App Store.
Navigate to your Purchased page.
Hold down the Option key on your keyboard and click on your 'OS X Lion' purchase link (not on the 'installed' button).
You see the Lion product page. It should say 'Installed,' but that button is clickable. Hold down the Option key again and click on 'Installed.' If you don't hold the option key it will tell you there's already a newer version installed.
Enter your login credentials.
Download.
It's important to hold down the Option key twice. Once on the Purchased page, once on the Lion page. You also can't navigate to Lion directly, you need to open it from the purchases page. But if you follow this procedure you should find the Lion Installer within your Applications folder.
Now, make yourself a bootable DVD or USB flash drive for installing Lion:
Make Your Own Lion Installer
1. After downloading Lion you must first save the Install Mac OS X Lion application. After Lion downloads DO NOT click on the Install button. Go to your Applications folder and make a copy of the Lion installer. Move the copy into your Downloads folder. Now you can click on the Install button. You must do this because the installer deletes itself automatically when it finishes installing Lion.
2. Get a USB flash drive that is at least 8 GBs. Prep this flash drive as follows:
Open Disk Utility in your Utilities folder.
After DU loads select your hard drive (this is the entry with the mfgr.'s ID and size) from the left side list. Note the SMART status of the drive in DU's status area. If it does not say "Verified" then the drive is failing or has failed and will need replacing. SMART info will not be reported on external drives. Otherwise, click on the Partition tab in the DU main window.
Under the Volume Scheme heading set the number of partitions from the drop down menu to one. Set the format type to Mac OS Extended (Journaled.) Click on the Options button, set the partition scheme to GUID then click on the OK button. Click on the Partition button and wait until the process has completed.
Select the volume you just created (this is the sub-entry under the drive entry) from the left side list. Click on the Erase tab in the DU main window.
Set the format type to Mac OS Extended (Journaled.) Click on the Options button, check the button for Zero Data and click on OK to return to the Erase window.
Click on the Erase button. The format process can take up to several hours depending upon the drive size.
3. Locate the saved Lion installer in your Downloads folder. CTRL- or RIGHT-click on the installer and select Show Package Contents from the contextual menu. Double-click on the Contents folder to open it. Double-click on the SharedSupport folder. In this folder you will see a disc image named InstallESD.dmg.
4. Plug in your freshly prepared USB flash drive. You are going to clone the InstallESD.dmg disc image to the flash drive as follows:
Open Disk Utility.
Select the USB flash drive from the left side list.
Click on the Restore tab in the DU main window.
Check the box labeled Erase destination.
Select the USB flash drive volume from the left side list and drag it to the Destination entry field.
Drag the InstallESD.dmg disc image file into the Source entry field.
Double-check you got it right, then click on the Restore button.
When the clone is completed you have a fully bootable Lion installer that you can use without having to re-download Lion.

I have Tiger. Can I install Lion on an external drive?

I have an iMac Intel Core 2 Duo running Tiger. What I would like to do is install Lion on an external hard drive and have the ability to boot up using either Tiger or Lion as the occasion arises. Reason being, I have some software apps that would no longer run on anything higher than Tiger and would require $1200 worth of upgrades. While I plan to eventually make such upgrades (and perhaps buy a new Mac to put it all on), for now I'm seeking an interim solution.
In short, I want to take advantage of what Lion has to offer in the way of increased speed and flexibility (especially with internet surfing) while at the same time being able to boot up part of the time in Tiger to continue to run my older apps when needed.
So, can it be done? Install Lion on an external HD? Or do I need to install Snow Leopard first, then upgrade to Lion? Or is none of this possible without buying a new computer and just keeping my old machine to run Tiger with the older apps?

The short answer is yes, the somewhat longer answer is that you must should first install Snow Leopard. With the exception of Classic / OS 9 everything you do with Tiger should run fine in Snow Leo.
Lion System Requirements: http://support.apple.com/kb/HT4949
Next you will need more memory. Consider Lion's specfied 2 GB minimum with a great degress of skepticism. That is a very small cage for this cat. 4 GB is a more realistic minimum.
If I interpret your system correctly, you have a mid-2009 iMac. It can address 8 GB memory. Lion will be very comfortable with that amount.
Message was edited by: John Galt

Does installing Lion Server mean: No Sleep ?

Hi,
I have the problem, that my iMac won`t go to sleep automatically after the time I setup in the energy saver settings.
I can get it asleep, if I select Sleep in the Apple menu, but it is only working manually.
I already tryed resetting PRAM, NVRAM, SMC and I even already did a clean install of lion Still the same problem.
But I also installed Lion server and I could imagine this is a problem.
Is here anybody, who installed Lion server and who can confirm, if his Mac falls asleep by itself or not?
If Lion Server is the problem, I would do another clean install without Lion Server, so my mac will sleep again. I would prefer
not to have the VPN service, but having a Mac, who does not consume power all the time...
Without Lion Server I can still access it with VNC or ARD and the iMac would be waken up by the "Wake on Demand" feature.
Regards
Florian

I know did again a clean installed of Lion without installing the Lion Server.
Now the sleep mode works again.... So it seems, that installing Lion Server is responsible for the iMac not going to sleep.
I installed Lion server because of the VPN functionality. I got this working without Lion Server by using a smart tool EasyVPN, which allowed me to setup OS X Lion as VPN server (PPTP and L2TP) without having Lion Server installed. you can get this tool at: http://www.squashedsoftware.com/products-easyvpn.php
Perhaps this is useful for somebody...
Regards
Florian

Since the time i have installed lion my mac book pro is working very slow

its been couple of months since i installed lion, after that my pro is working very slow .
would want to knw what to check ??

I don't really understand why Lion slows down computers, but it obviously does. What worked for me is upgrading my memory from 2GB to 4GB. Also, check your hard drive space. If it is close to full, try upgrading your hard disk to a better model.
If neither of those work, you might have to do a clean reinstall of Lion. This involves cleaning out all your data and reinstalling your OS.
Cache-file cleaners like SpeedUp Mac ($29.99) can help a lot if Lion was pre-installed on your Mac, but if you installed Lion manually, they don't really do much.
Tip: NEVER try MacKeeper to make your Mac "faster": I had the misfortune of it wiping out all my data (movies, music, photos, iMovie projects, iPhoto photo books and faces, etc.)
Message was edited by: apple is awesome

My MacBook Pro very slow after i installed Lion

i have a problem wih the server is not respoded with 502 (yahoo)

I can't really read your message very well, but I am assuming your problem is Yahoo! is not responding on OS X Lion.
This doesn't have much to do with Apple or OS X Lion, but if you think it involves OS X Lion, what worked for me is upgrading my memory from 2GB to 4GB. Also, check your hard drive space. If it is close to full, try upgrading your hard disk to a better model.
If neither of those work, you might have to do a clean reinstall of Lion. This involves cleaning out all your data and reinstalling your OS.
Cache-file cleaners like SpeedUp Mac ($29.99) can help a lot if Lion was pre-installed on your Mac, but if you installed Lion manually, they don't really do much.
Tip: NEVER try MacKeeper to make your Mac "faster": I had the misfortune of it wiping out all my data (movies, music, photos, iMovie projects, iPhoto photo books and faces, etc.)

Any downside to installing Lion?

I am new to Mac (from PC) but am going on my 3rd MBP in my first month due to recieving 2 bad Macs out of the box! Must just be bad luck but still...
First was a track pad issue, second was due to a bad graphics card and hopefully my 3rd 15" MBP 7200rpm, 8GB RAM will be 'The One" but this will be Apple's last chance. If this one's not perfect I will return it and go back to PC.
Anyway, I will return this MBP (the one i'm typing on) as soon as my new one arrives in a couple of days and want to know since I have had such bad luck with my new Mac's so far, is there any reason not to upgrade to Lion right off the bat? Will there be any reason to wait till they get the "Bugs" out?
As I am completely new to the Mac OS I will be learning everything from new anyway so if the OS looks / acts differently it's no big deal.
Also, if / when i do upgrade ot Lion, are there any tips you have for me in regards to this process? As I will not have anything on my new MBP should i upgrade before i run the Time Machine backup or do the upgrade after I have everything installed on my new Mac?
Thanks, I look forward to your reply.
Rich

Whether you install Lion or not is a decision you make based on whether you have a need for the new features in Lion and if all your essential software will be compatible with Lion.
As for upgrading:
How to Install Lion Successfully - You must have Snow Leopard 10.6.7 or 10.6.8 Installed
A. Repair the Hard Drive and Permissions:
Boot from your Snow Leopard Installer disc. After the installer loads select your language and click on the Continue button. Then select Disk Utility from the Utilities. After DU loads select your hard drive entry (mfgr.'s ID and drive size) from the the left side list. In the DU status area you will see an entry for the S.M.A.R.T. status of the hard drive. If it does not say "Verified" then the hard drive is failing or failed. (SMART status is not reported on external Firewire or USB drives.) If the drive is "Verified" then select your OS X volume from the list on the left (sub-entry below the drive entry,) click on the First Aid tab, then click on the Repair Disk button. If DU reports any errors that have been fixed, then re-run Repair Disk until no errors are reported. If no errors are reported click on the Repair Permissions button. Wait until the operation completes, then quit DU and return to the installer. Now restart normally.
If DU reports errors it cannot fix, then you will need Disk Warrior (4.3.) if DW cannot fix the drive, then you will need to reformat the drive and reinstall Snow Leopard.
B. Make a Bootable Backup Using Restore Option of Disk Utility:
Open Disk Utility from the Utilities folder.
Select the destination volume from the left side list.
Click on the Restore tab in the DU main window.
Check the box labeled Erase destination.
Select the destination volume from the left side list and drag it to the Destination entry field.
Select the source volume from the left side list and drag it to the Source entry field.
Double-check you got it right, then click on the Restore button.
Destination means the backup volume. Source means the internal startup volume.
C. Important: Please read before installing:
If you have a FireWire hard drive connected, disconnect it before installing the update unless you will boot from this drive and install the update on it. Reconnect it and turn it back on after installation is complete and you've restarted.
You may experience unexpected results if you have installed third-party system software modifications, or if you have modified the operating system through other means. (This does not apply to normal application software installation.)
The installation process should not be interrupted. If a power outage or other interruption occurs during installation, use the standalone installer (see below) from Apple Downloads to update. While the installation is in progress do not use the computer.
D. To upgrade to Lion:
Purchase the Lion Installer from the Mac App Store. The download will start quickly. Lion is nearly 4 GBs so a fast internet connection is essential. Download time could run upwards of 4 hours depending upon network conditions and server demands at the time.
Boot From The Lion Installer which is located in your Applications folder.
Follow instructions for installation.

Apple going MS style - don't install Lion if you don't need to

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