CMYK breaks different in Pantone books to Illustrator swatch conversion

Why are CMYK breaks specified differently in Pantone books as to when you convert the same spot colour to CMYK in Illustrator swatch options?
More importantly, which one is correct?

Patone decided to use LAB formulas in CS6. So, if you call up a specific Pantone number and then convert to CMYK in Illustrator you get different CMYK percentages than what is or has been communicated in their swatch books. I recommend bypassing converting, instead just build your own CMYK swatch based on the swatchbook. This would be just to comply with your pre-existing workflow. But, it means creating 2 files, one Spot, one CMYK for whatever is appropriate for your situation. Obviously the Spot file goes to the print vendor, the CMYK file you build stays with you for proofing. Sidenote: I have seen some screen shots of users who had previous CMYK files next to a newer LAB>CMYK version and, on screen, the color "looks" closer to their ( Pantone's ) swatch book samples. But users are reporting the files print much darker than before and no longer match Pantone's swatch books. Go figure.

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How do I add Pantone Color Books to Illustrator CC?

I'm used to using the Pantone Process color book in illustrator, but it's missing from my Illustrator CC. How can I add it? I had it at work, so I assume it is a standard color book, because my work never paid for anything extra. I see I have a Pantone+ CMYK Coated color book, but the names of the swatches are different from Pantone Solid to Process color book I'm used to.

oh. then you are requesting for the old pantone books?
here you go
Dropbox - pantones.zip
let me know when you've got it because i'd like to delete it.

Pantone color book for Illustrator 6

Where can I find updated color books for Illustrator to use the latest Pantone colors?
Eg. I do not find Solid Coated 2028 in my recent installation
Thanks in advance
Charlotte

Ask in the AI forum. Certain Pantone colors have changed over the years and this may be such a case where it appears under a different number...
Mylenium

Colors pantone book do not match with screen?

Hello,
I am having a problem with matching the colors in my Pantone book with the colors on my screen. My screen is calibrated with the colormunki display. The adobe suite is synchronized and I use fogra39 as my working space.
I have looked up a color in my Pantone+ uncoated guide: a deep dark red (1797c). However, when selecting the swatch in illustrator it shows up as a pinkish red. It does not match the color book at all!
Also, the cmyk values of this swatch are entirely different than what is is in the guide.
Can anyone tell me what the problem is?
Ps. I have overprint view on and use lab colors to show spot colors. My monitor is normal gamut, but I can reproduce the color with my own cmyk mix. So my monitor can reproduce the color.
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Thanks!

There is one point which nobody have made mention of, which also is something anyone who works in print should know about.
The first thing to know is that there are some Green and Red Pantones that are IMPOSSIBLE to reproduce on screen because of the limitation of the RGB gamut. (The RGB of screens can only reproduce a bit more than 60% of the real-life colors and around 50% of the Pantone are situated inside the remaining missing 40%. Almost EVERY Pantone, on your charts, that are situation on the 2 top and 2 bottom positions are not reproducible on screen.)
So, it's always normal that some Pantone never look the same between a screen and the Pantone chart even if the screen is calibrated in the best ways and that is why you uses a Pantone chart. The Pantone chart isn't just a "decision" tool, but also a "preview" tool so that you can see the exact final color regardless of what's on screen.
If that is not working with your workflow, then it simply means that your workflow is flawed as it's how it has been made to be. It's not a choice, but a limitation of physics with computer hardware which you have to live with as a professional.

Pantone colours in Illustrator have changed

I've opened an old packaging artwork in CC that was originally created in Illustrator CS5 and made design amends. All looks OK, everything behaving as it should.
I then copied and pasted the same artwork into a brand new CC document (as I needed to create a new artwork whilst using the same elements) and the Pantone colours all look much paler. Why is this?
Both document set ups are the same and both set up as CMYK not RGB.
If I paste back the elements from the new artwork to the old, the colours look OK again.
If I convert the Pantones to CMYK the values are different. I can't use CMYK colours as the job needs to be printed as Pantones.

Peter,
The Pantone to CMYK values (CMYK representations issued/published by Pantone) have changed a few times over the years. What you see on your monitor reflects the CMYK values.
The Pantone inks themselves have not changed.
So you can keep printing as you did, and hopefully live with the changes in on screen appearance.
You may use the same libraries to have things look the same.

8 steps to load a Pantone color in Illustrator - What?

Hi There,
Illustrator's way of specifying Pantone colors has driven my colleagues and I to distraction.
Firstly we go through 4 menus to select the book color, then view the swatch library as a small list, then show the find field, then search for the color, then finally load the color - 8 steps in total.
Then if you need to specify an uncoated color, you have go through all 8 steps again.
what is the proper way to load a Pantone color in Illustrator?
Any help would be much appreciated.
Cheers

I'm on CS2 and I've been using Illy since it started.
I have always found that the quickest and easiest way of making a Pantone colour is to use Pantone's Solid to Process Imaging Guide. Make a CMYK colour using the CMYK values given up in the guide, make a swatch of it and then edit the swatch to a spot colour with the appropriate Pantone name and number. It's really far less trouble than using Illy's ready-mades. Believe me :-)
As for CS3, there is apparently little to recommend it. It seems to have far too many bugs. I'm awaiting a version that works properly and it looks like it may be a longish wait. I occasionally have to revert to Illy 6 and 9 (6 was brilliant) on an old computer for special effects and filters that "improved" versions can't cope with. Illy has somehow got far too complicated and unintuitive for basic run-of-the-mill vector work. The bottom line: if it wasn't busted why did they mend it?
And yet again, where did Dimensions go to? Illy's 3D is total junk.

Cannot Edit a pantone color in illustrator

Has anyone encountered the problem of not being ablw to edit a pantone color in illustrator? I'm trying to switch it to process CMYK and the top portion of the editing box is ghosted out.
Solution?
Thanks !!
Ron

You need to have the swatch palette open > click on the element that uses one of the Pantone colors > the swatch should be highlighted in your swatch palette, panel, whatever > you should see the CMYK triangular square in the palette > click on the CMYK icon to convert the color to process > should show up as a new swatch, if not, just drag it to the swatch palette.

Pantone colors in Illustrator

Hello everyone,
I am using Illustrator 10 and send a job to my printer using an image as a Pantone color.
However they tell me that the image is CMYK and that I need to color it with the PMS color
I've indicated. I created the image in Photoshop, first made it gray sclae then created it as
a duo tone. Is this not the correct way? I've also checked in Illustrator but the only options
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Typically, when you create a duotone in PS, the file becomes a Spot color file, not CMYK ( for instance, Black + Pantone 340C ). Your print vendor is confused or does not understand the file structure. Yes, the Ai file is CMYK, but there will be at least 2 additional channels in the color separations in the RIP where they can select just the 2 Spot colors to print or 4 process colors ( CMYK ) + 2 Spot colors ( Pantone Black + Pantone 340C ) for a grand total of six colors. If, for some reason, the job was not estimated for 6 colors and they want to get away cheap, they can demand that you Place the Grayscale .tiff and paint that using Process color equivalents ( 100c, 0m, 69y, 15k as an example ), which is nowhere near the same as a duotone. Even if you did what they want, you painted the Grayscale image using Pantone 340C, it's not the same thing as using a duotone. There will be no Black in the image. You've done it the correct way, just confirm you are dealing with the true duotone file and not a CMYK ripoff ( which is unlikely because you'd have to convert it to CMYK on purpose ). Make sure you get a contract proof of the job so they do not mess what you've done. There is no way to create a Duotone Illustrator file, it's either RGB or CMYK. CMYK for print, RGB for web. They need to figure out their color space. Ofcourse it's CMYK, but the image is not CMYK, it's a duotone. You need to solve this before they go to press.

Can I create a photo /travelogue book in Illustrator?

Can I create a photo/travelogue type book in Illustrator?

That's what I thought! I tried to convince the salesperson that InDesign would be better be he suggested Illustrator. Okay, I'll have to start the conversation again. Thanks for the heads up! I'll dump the Illustrator!
With appreciation,
Raymond
www.photosalongthejourney.com

Pantone Plus Color Bridge Swatches don't match

Hi
I have used a Pantone Plus Color Bridge swatch (specifically Pantone 115 CP - yellow) in my inDesign CC 2014 project.
I have an illustrator .eps file, created in Adobe Illustrator CC 2014 placed in the document. I have used the same Pantone Plus Color Bridge swatch in the .eps file.
When printed there is a VERY noticeable difference between the yellow swatch in the inDesign document and the Illustrator placed graphic.
It looks "correct" in the Illustrator placed graphic, i.e. it matches the swatch book but where the swatch has been used in inDesign, it seems to have shifted to an almost green hue.
Could anyone explain why this might have happened?
Thanks

In your bottom capture the 187 swatch is from the the legacy Pantone library where solid color swatches were defined as CMYK. Here I'ved saved the old pre CS6 coated library and 187 is defined as a spot color but with CMYK values:
Starting with CS6 the solid swatches are Lab definitions and if you chose to convert them to process CMYK, the conversion is color managed Lab to CMYK and the results will depend on your document's CMYK profile and not a Pantone set value. If you select the swatch and look at the Color panel you can see the definition is Lab and the type is Spot:
If you don't want a color managed conversion for CMYK simulations use Pantone + Color Bridge, those swatches are defined as CMYK and the Type is Process

Capturing a raster image's texture to be saved in Illustrator swatches

Does anyone know how to capture a raster
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Thanks

where is the image coming from?
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Illustrator swatches to indesign

something has changed and I have not been able to figure it out. I have used illustrator since 88 and have always relied on new swatches I create in illustrator being automatically added to quark/indesign. I no longer use quark but noticed some time ago that my ai swatches were not added to inDesign when placing a file. I always thought this was a bug that would be fixed in the next version but having recently upgraded to 5.5 I've concluded that doesn't seem to be the case. Today I imported a logo provided to me and the colors were added so I'm thinking the problem must be how I'm setting up the color or saving the file. I have tried as many options as I could think of but can not recreate the behavior. I have googled the problem and searched the forum and failed to find the answer. Please clue me in - how can I ensure that any custom illustrator swatches are automatically added to inDesign swatches. Thank you.

I feel as though I've tried every option. My normal habit is to save files as .ai and import them by dragging from the finder to the open inDesign document. When I need the color swatch to appear, I have returned and tried saving files as eps ( using various version options all the way down to 3 ) and importing them with the place command. None have worked. As for creating the swatch, I sometimes do it by placing a color sample from another document. Most often I do it by selecting "new swatch" giving it a name and mix values. If it's a process color, I select global and of course this is not an option with spot colors. My color names are chosen to remind me of their use, such as "logo_background" or "web_banner".

I can see a font from a previous project in a different program in Font Book and Illustrator is not finding the font when I open the file.

I am using Adobe Creative Cloud and have the new updates installed. The file was created in Artbook, but saved as a PDF. When Illustrator opens it says it does not recognize the variants (regular extended, light extended) of the main font (regular) which it does recognize. Any Clues on this front?
The font Skia-Regular_Extended is missing. Affected text will be displayed using a substitute font.
The font Skia-Regular_Light-Extended is missing. Affected text will be displayed using a substitute font.
To preserve appearance, some text has been outlined.

Have you searched the font menu for the name of the font?
In a PDF the font might also have been renamed.
If the font is there, but under a different name, you'll have to reapply it to the text.

Pantone books in CS5 vs Pantone Plus books in CC

Hi All,
After a recent upgrade from CS5 to Creative Cloud, I created a new graphic using our corporate Pantone Colour (PMS 541u), but when I sent it to (digital) printing, I discovered that it did not print the colour we were expecting.
I understand that the new Pantone Plus books no longer have CMYK values attached to the PMS colours, instead they only use LAB colours, so rather than the old way of printing using the CMYK values linked to the spot colour chosen, it now converts the Spot colour to a LAB colour, then to a CMYK colour that is completely different to the CMYK values linked to the 'old' PMS colours.
Given that it is imperative for us to ensure that our corporate colours reproduce as close to the colours on our packaging (there are 20 different products that are printed in true spot PMS colours), this makes it very difficult to match colours now.
I have tried using the new 'colour bridge' colours, but again, they're completely different to the old PMS colours and the new Plus colours. We use both coated and uncoated stock, so we need both the 'u' and 'c' CMYK values depending on what stock we're printing on.
here is an example of the variation in colour (PMS 541) that i'm experiencing, both on screen (yes I know it's not an accurate representation), and when printing digitally.
I don't particularly want to remove the new colour books and replace them with the old ones as is suggested in a few work arounds, as I want to ensure that we're using the most up to date colour profiles/books etc.
Can someone please explain what is the best way to achieve an accurate colour match when converting from PMS to CMYK for process printing?

I'd say that the answer to your final question isn't to use the old colour books. In fact, the newer, LAB-based ones will yield a better match if your settings are right.
Firstly, get your Colour Management settings right for the output conditions, by using an appropriate CMYK profile (I can't tell you which one this would be without knowing how you're printing). This way, if you convert your spot swatches to process in Illustrator, you should automatically get the closest match.
Also, you say digital printing. Many RIPs for digital presses and copiers have built-in spot colour simulation libraries, which you can manually adjust to the closest match possible. On Fiery RIPs (which I'm most familiar with), this feature is called 'Spot-On'. If you send the job to the printer with spot colour swatches intact, and named as they normally are, the RIP will convert them to the specified CMYK formulas.

Can I easily match Pantone colors using Illustrator?

Hi all,
I run a small invitation supply company.
Our primary design tool up until now has been Photoshop Elements.
We recently purchased a $6000 printer from Xerox which is the 'gold standard' for graphic arts and Pantone approved.
We also have a pantone color bridge. When I print a color using the hex code, the color looks NOTHING like the pantone swatch.
I contacted Xerox and they told me that because Elements has a very low degree of color management that we will never be able to easily color match our pantone swatches and that they aren't surprised the color is way off.
I suppose I naively figured that spending $6000 on a printer would get us easy and flawless color matching. Xerox says- not so.
They suggested investing in Illustrator and they are convinced that it will be much more likely to get us to the point that we want. Ultimately I want to be able to pick a color from the pantone deck, enter the code, and feel confident that the print will come out 100% the corresponding color.
Am I living a pipe dream?
I would like some feedback before proceeding.
On top of the financial investment, obviously there is a lot of time that my partner and I will have to spend learning Illustrator.
Any input would be great.
Thanks,
Aaron

Am I living a pipe dream?
Yes.
More precisely, you are just failing to understand the fundamental difference between spot color and process color.
I want to be able to pick a color from the pantone deck, enter the code, and feel confident that the print will come out 100% the corresponding color.
Not gonna happen, even if you do all the tedious color management setup you can.
The above assumes you are, in fact, talking about matching Pantone spot colors. (Pantone does not just publish spot color swatches, but that is the usual sense in which beginners refer to Pantone.)
A spot color is, by definition, an actual, physical, single ink which is loaded into a press. The only way to achieve your 100% pipedream is to load that actual, physical, single ink into your $6000 printer.
But that's how a printing press works, not how your $6000 printer works. It works by printing four "primary colors" of inks and then arranging tiny dots of them in proximity to each other in order to "trick" the eye into seeing them as a mixture of colors on the page in proportions which try to approximate the spot color as best it can.
But physical inks are simply not accurate enough to actually do that. There are many, many spot colors which simply cannot be replicated by mixing arrays of primary colors of inks. That's what all this "gamut" talk is about. That's one reason why spot color inks exist.
The Pantone spot color matching system is a means by which to consistently communicate proportional mixtures of actual, real, physical inks of known specific colors. All anyone (including Pantone) can do with the CMYK inks (or dyes) in a desktop printer is try to recommend percentages of those CMYK inks to best approximate a match to an actual, physical spot color ink.
It gets worse. Your monitor cannot actually match a spot color ink swatch, either. Your monitor glows. Ink doesn't. Even on tediously calibrated systems, there is more to perceived "color" than just numerical values of CMYK or RGB or HSL or Lab. There is chroma. There is reflectance. There is opacity. There is grain.
Then there's the whole matter of the incredibly context-sensitive adaptabability of human vision.
So if you are selling the output of your $6000 printer as the final product, you should not use Pantone spot color swatches as any kind of contract color specification, because your printer cannot actually print spot color inks. If you're doing color-critical work that the customer will refuse when specified colors don't match, you and your customer must specify colors which your device can actually produce.
JET

CMYK breaks different in Pantone books to Illustrator swatch conversion

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