- - - Identifying Pantone TPX Colours from RGB/CMYK Photoshop/Illustrator files - - -

Hi there.
I am currently working on CMYK / RGB designs in Photoshop/illustrator. I need to supply my printers with Pantone TPX colours. I have the Pantone TPX colour book in front of me and i am picking the most appropriate colours by sight ( which is basically guess work ) . Is there a way where i can use the eye dropper tool to pick a colour and identify an exact Pantone TPX match (or the closest thing)
Apologies in advance if this seems like a trivial question, any help/insight would be greatly appreciated!

Hi ColorWerx thanks for your reply.
Sounds interesting, although i don't think thats quite what i was looking for though ( something official from PANTONE maybe)
Is there a way i can access your utility?
Can you give me an example - RGB colour i'm trying to match:
R:0
G:255
B:255

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Pantone Plus colours in PSD causing non-readable files in Illustrator

Hi
We have recently installed the new Pantone Plus colour series, but we now get the message "File not readable" on files that contain psd links which contain spot channels. I have seen this same problem on other forums but the explanation is to change the Spot channel colour to the Plus Series colour book in photoshop so it matches the new colour book in Illustrator. But when we do this we still get the "File not readable" message because the Illustrator file retains the old spot from the old Photoshop Pantone colour library until the newly saved link is placed in, the problem being you can't open the file to place the new link in!!!! This is crazy!!
To get around this we have had to re-install the old colour books to open up old files, but if we then have to work on a job with a Plus colour we have to re-load the Plus series. This isn't fun.
This has a massive impact on all our archived work which we regulary use to do updates. Will Abobe be bringing out a fix for this anytime soon? This is a major issue for our studio, it is already causing us wasted time.
Thanks
Mike

Surely Adobe can come up with a fix for this though?
Problem is we've been using them for a month or so, so if we revert back to the old libraries all the files we've been working on for the last month we will now have issues opening. So do we keep on using in the hope that Adobe will come out with a fix, or do we remove and deal with the mess that that's going to cause.

Trouble saving a pdf from In Design with Illustrator files linked.

I have trouble saving a pdf from In Design. Most of the files i've linked are Illustrator files with size up to 70mb.
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HELP!!!!!!

It did not help to close and reopen it.
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Spurious colours from RGB Curves and Track Matte...

Hello people of the forums.
I am working on a music video.
In a couple of places in the sequence where there are two or more visible layers overlapping with top layer/s having less than 100% opacity there is some unwanted 'extra' colours appearing which can be seen in the attached image below.
In the left image the unwanted colour appears in the center above the mans head, it is grey coloured.
In the right image the unwanted colour is the red.
All blending modes are Normal. There are Track Mattes in use. There are RGB curves being used.
As a result of trying to gather pertinent information for this post I found a cure, hahaha.
For the left images situation I found that turning the RGB curves off removed the colours, so I replaced the curves with Levels and the issue went away...
So for the right images situation I added a levels below the track matte and above the RGB curves, and the issue went away, no adjustment to the levels at all... I moved the levels from between the Track Matte and the Curves and the issue reapeared.
I will post this anyway but not as a question.
All the best
Peter

Hi Bill,
This is so weried I know how to do this where to point ect ect.
If i move the clip with the track matte on I get a crash.
I made a new seq and used same clip and it works. so I made a second clip next to it and it worked. I copyed those clips back to the old seq and it did not work...
It's been going on for a long time.. what do you know about seq setting with track mattes? do they only work well on some and porly on others.. all Ideas to find a answer.
answer to your above quest yes I am doing it right and why should I get a crash if I move the clip with the track matte on.
I think if we can answer that we will have fixed it.
over to you Bill
thanks for hanging in there.
Best
trevor

Is there a way to automatically populate a text box with its text's colour values (RGB, CMYK, etc)?

I'm trying to work a little faster and since Kuler now syncs into CC, I'd like to know if there is a way to colour text from a text box and have this text change automatically depending on the values of the swatch I selected.
It should work more or less like metadata, or variable text: you can customise what value will appear
I'm almost 100% sure the answer is no, but it can't hurt to ask.

The short answer is No. But I see that Ray has given you an option.

Exporting from Aperture to Photoshop CS3- file format

If I have my files in raw CR2 format in Aperture 2.1 and I then go to the edit the image in photoshop CS3 will it remain in the raw CR2 format or does it convert it to a tiff file automatically?
Currently I have PS CS2 and it converts to a tiff file when I go edit in photoshop however I thought this may be beacuse PS CS2 does not support raw files from my Canon 40D, PS CS3 does though.
Incidently the same thing happens when I use the dodge and burn tool in Aperture 2, it conversts to Tiff format.

"Will there ever" is a loaded question Apple rarely comments on future product releases, and anyone that would know wouldn't be able to comment.
So it's not possible to say if future dodge & burn (or other plugins) can work without rendering a TIFF file.
As far as "multiple file formats" though -- it shouldn't really be something you need to worry about (other than the fact that the TIFF takes up some disk space). You can export to JPEG from the original or the version, and Aperture will track the files together.

Opening photo from bridge into photoshop converts to smart object

Instead of opening the psd-file normally from bridge into photoshop the file converts to smart object.
I used to work with CS3 where double-clicking in Bridge on a psd-file would open it in Photoshop. Now, when I double click in Bridge (CS6) it opens a "quick time pro" file, which I definitely don't want. When I use the right mouse to "place in Photoshop" it does so, but then automatically converts the file into a smart object, which I don't want either. What need I do to open a psd-file in Bridge as normal psd-file in Photoshop?
Thanks in advance for help.
EVAMLG0507

Hi C. Pfaffenbichler
yes, there is a "Photoshop Document" in the list, but it has not
association. when I click on the little arrow on that line it "searches"
and shows all the files in the "program X86" on the C-drive. but I don't
know what to associate it with, or said differently, I don't know what file
in "programX86" to associate it with.
EVAMLG0507
2012/9/4 c.pfaffenbichler <[email protected]>
Re: opening photo from bridge into photoshop converts to smart object created by
c.pfaffenbichler <http://forums.adobe.com/people/c.pfaffenbichler> in *Photoshop
General Discussion* - View the full discussion<http://forums.adobe.com/message/4671500#4671500

I purchased Photoshop Elements Specifically to Covert photos from RGB to CMYK, No CMYK colour?

I selected IMAGE-MODE-appeared RGB, Bitman but no CMYK
I selected EDIT- Colour settings no CMYK
If I can't obtain conversion to SMYK the phoshop is of no use for me.

You need the full Photoshop (current version CS6) for CMYK. You could ask your commercial printer to do the conversion for you if you can obtain a reasonable price.

Why is FrameMaker using different CYMK/RGB values for Pantone library colours compared with Illustrator?

Evening all -
this is by no means the first time I'm banged my head against the colour management brick wall, and I doubt it will be the last
I am running Frame 12 and Illustrator CC on Windows 7.
Both these Adobe products ship bundled with Pantone libraries. (Correct me with I'm wrong, but these "libraries" are basically a bunch of look-up tables, mapping named Pantone colours to various CYMK, RGB, etc equivalents?)
Can anyone tell me why these two different Adobe applications appear to give different definitions for the same Pantone colours?
For example, if I choose the Pantone Coated library > 'Warm Red'
In Illustrator CC (left screenshot), it offers this as C0% M87.4% Y79.9% K0%
in FrameMaker 12 (right screenshot), I get C0% M79% Y91% K0%
Why are they different?
Are the library definitions shipped with the products simply different?
Frame's dialog ominously mentions "© Pantone, Inc., 1986, 1988"
And if I go to C:\Program Files (x86)\Adobe\AdobeFrameMaker12\fminit\color and open the corresponding .bcf file in an editor, the header says:
"BCF 2.0PANTONE¨ Coated 1.1 ©Pantone, Inc., 1986, 1988.PANTONE¨* Computer Video simulations displayed may not match PANTONE-identified solid color standards. Use current PANTONE Color Reference Manuals for accurate color. To order publications from Pantone, Inc., in the U.S. please call the toll-free number (800) 222-1149 [within NJ, call (201) 935-5500]. In other countries contact your local Pantone representative. *Pantone, Inc.'s check-standard trademark for color.[1]"
whereas if I go to C:\Program Files (x86)\Adobe\Adobe Illustrator CC\Presets\en_US\Swatches\Color Books and open the corresponding .acb swatch file in there, in amoungst the hex gibberish I note it says:
"�=$$$/colorbook/PantonePlusCoated/title=PANTONE+^R Solid Coated/$$$/colorbook/PantonePlusCoated/prefix=PANTONE *$$$/colorbook/PantonePlusCoated/postfix= CK"$$$/colorbook/PantonePlusCoated/description=Copyright^C Pantone LLC, 2010"
Have Pantone perhaps changed their colour definitions between 1988 and 2010?
(I'm thinking it would be sensible to establish this one way or the other before we get into any convoluted discussions about the Windows GDI etc etc)

David,
What options did you use for defining the colours internally and what options for output in AI? I suspect that if you examine the EPS file you created from AI for the Panotne 355C, the only values in there are the CMYK ones - no LAB nor RGB. So FM has to use the algorithm mentioned in the other thread and creates the lime green based upon the algorithm. If you have set the AI drawing to an RGB color mode and set the EPS export option for "Include CMYK Postscript in RGB files" to OFF, then you would get the desired RGB values in the EPS file.
If you're so intent on using Pantone Spot colours to get RGB, then you can create your own ACF library file with the exact RGB definitions that you want (you can then use whatever values you get in Photoshop, Illustrator or whatever source that you're trying to match). The structure of the file is as follows:
ACF 1.0
My Color Library             <---- name of library
LibraryVersion: 1.0
Copyright: © 2014 <your name here>. All rights reserved.
AboutMessage: User defined Spot colours for RGB
Names: Partial
Rows: 4
Columns: 4
Entries: 1           <---- number of colours in file
Prefix:         <---- used for display in FM, e.g. "Panotne"
Suffix:           <----- used together with prefix, e.g. "CVC, CVU, etc."
Type: Process <---- Spot, Process, Tint, Mixed (need to add specifier to Data lines)
Models: CMYK RGB
PreferredModel: RGB     <---- whatever you want
Data:
0.98 0.11 1.00 0.02              <---- CMYK values (0-1)
0 38143 19967     <---- RGB values as 16-bit, i.e. 16-bit = ( [RGB value (1-255)]*256) + 255; zero is still zero
Spruce Green                   <---- name of colour
The acf file needs to be installed in the fminit\color folder.
Also, a note of caution, If you screw something up in the acf file (like the incorrect number of entries in the file or you're missing a component value, this will hang FM if you use the View > Color > Definitions... option. You'll need to kill FM, fix or remove the ACF file and re-start. Also, FM only reads the libraries at the start, so if you need to make any changes to the ACF definitions, you have to r-start FM for those changes to take place.
[I know, FM doesn't make it easy, but it can be done...]

RGB CMYK PDF EXPORT.(colour conversion) Keeping your colours vibrant and your blacks black.

Ive been tearing my hair out for the best part of 14 hours trying to figure out how to keep the closest possible conversion for working with images(rgb in photoshop) right the way through a work flow until exporting to print (having used the image in Indesign). Here is the process I have been trying to get right.
1) working with RGB photo images in photoshop and converting them to CMYK (whilst holding on to as much colour as poss)
2) Importing them to Indesign and retaining the correct colours while working with them)
3) Exporting to high quality print and having all your colours stay 100% the same as you saw them within indesign.
I believe I have the solution so I posted my settings below to see if its the best way of doing things and to help others who might be having the same problems.
The problem
The problem is that there are many different colour models/profiles (both in RGB and CMYK) and each program can effect how the next one handles and stores colour. It can become frustrating knowing where to go in order to set the settings correctly as the combination of things to consider can make it confusing.
I understand many other people have similar problems and finding RGB blacks come out as grey. CMYK spaces get converted from one type to another either from one program to the next or even as things move around one program (causing all sorts of wonderful,colour errors) Plus you have imported colour profiles, working colour profiles and export profiles. All of which can interact and effect each other) So getting it all consistent is key other wise colours change and get washed out.   Especially vibrant colours like greens and blues. they fade etc.
Through sheer trial and error and perciverance I found a combination of settings that worked well for me.
Since I am not an expert I wanted to post up my settings to:
1) see if this is the best way of doing things.
2) Other people may find them useful if they had the same problems I had,
The Solution
In photoshop
Save the photoshop image in CMYK by selecting:
Edit > Convert to prfile.
(in destination space)
select: Euroscale Coated v2   (I think this holds the colours the truest of all CMYK colour formats.)
(in conversion options)
- Engine: Adobe ACE
- Intent: Perceptual.
- Check Use black point Compensation.
(leave all else unchecked)
Save the image ready to place in indesign (place rather than copy and paste.).
In Indesign
edit > colour settings   (make sure you click on the advanced tick box to open more options)
- Working space: =
- RGB: sRGB IEC....
- CMYK Euroscale coated v2
- RGB & CMYK convert to working space.
- Engine Adobe ACE
- Perceptual
- Use black point compensation
edit > Assign profiles
- RGB profile. > Assign current workspace: sRGB IE
- CMYK > Assign current work space Euroscale Coated V2
- Solid colour intent : preceptual
- Default image intent
- After blending intent: Perceptual.
edit > convert to profile. (use similar as above).
edit > Preferences > Apprearance of black
- on screen / export : Display all blacks as enriched black
- Priniting and export : Display all blacks as enriched black
Overprint: (not checked)
------ when exporting to PDF ----------
File > Export
in GENERAL TAB
- Adobe PDF preset: High quality print.
- Standard (drop down menu): PDF/X-42008
- Compatability: Acrobat 5 PDF1:4
in OUTPUT
- COlour conversion: Convert to destination
- Destination: Working CMYK Euroscale Coated v2
in PDF/X
- Output intent profile name: Working CMYK - Euroscale Coated v2
also:
If you are having problems with fill blacks not coming out as proper black then use registration instead of black from the swatch panel.
The above may seem either obvious to most of you or possibly not the best way of doing things but since the results worked for me and I found them tough to arrive at, it may be of use to others hence my post.
I would like your feedback on this process, have I done something wrong / could do better? If so please let me know. I am keen to improve.

I would copy and paste into InDesign forum. Text should stay 100% black. Any other black (like solid boxes or thick lines), I usually use a rich black swatch I created at 40/40/40/100. Looks 10 times better than just 100% black.

Why different values in Illustrator/InDesign/PS when converting Pantone to RGB & CMYK?

I'm starting off with a pantone color in InDesign and trying to determine a close and consistent approximation of RGB, CMYK, and Hex. When I do this conversion in InDesign, I get different results than if I do it in Photoshop or Illustrator. I have all the apps working at the same color management setting (Adobe RGB (1998) and US Web Coated (SWOP) v2). I'm working old school in CS1.
Here are my results for Pantone 187C:
InDesign
Photoshop
Illustrator
RGB
171 x 0 x 34
153 x 33 x 55
167 x 37 x 53
CMYK
0 x 100 x 79 x 20
21 x 100 x 81 x 12
16 x 100 x 86 x 6
HEX
992137
A72535
I realize that any conversion from Pantone is an approximation, but why do the different applications yeild different results? I'm fairly new to color management and print (I come from the video world), so any efforts to dumb down explanations are appreciated.

Photoshop's default is to use Lab values when converting from spot colors. So you need to set InDesign and Illustrator to use the same values.
In Illustrator, from the Swatches panel menu, choose Spot Color Options. Choose Use Lab Values specified by the book manufacturer.
In InDesign, from the Swatches panel menu, choose Ink Manager. At the bottom, check Use Standard Lab Values for Spots

Pantone 336 colours in Photoshop...

Hi,
I'm trying to turn a CMYK image into a duotone image. Specifically Black and Pantone 2291C.
Pantone 2291 is from the +336 books and for some reason I can't find it when I search the colour libraries in Photoshop.
I haven't had this problem in Illustrator or InDesign.
Would appreciate some help!
Cheers

It could be one of two things.
1. It could be that Photoshop renders things on your screen using different protocols. To check this, use the Information window to read the numerical color values as you hover over an area. If the numbers are the same in both programs, then it's just the way the program is rendering your image and they're actually the same color (they just look different on your screen).
2. You could be using a different color profile for each program. This will come up as different numbers for the same area.

Colour is not right in illustrator cmyk pantone cyan and aqua

I am trying to work with colours in illustrator. I have set my colour mode to CMYK. I am trying to create a light aqua colour and just keep getting "out of gamut" errors. I tried using the colour book for Pantone and even entering the number of a pantone colour I want and just does not look right on the screen
The file will be used to print so RGB is not an option
can some one help me set up colour settings so I can get the best match for a light aqua colour.

For the sake of understanding: Spot colors are supposed to be printed as one dedicated ink in the physical world. Unless you convert it to a process color in a controlled (=calibrated environment) the on-screen simulation is merely a placeholder whose representation may not be at all exact. Likewise, converting it to CMYK may not give the same color result due to how the separate components interact differently from a single color ink. That and then there may be specific halftoning and ink density requirements as well as the paper stock that change "mix" colors or at least their perception. The default generic profiles should do just fine, but feel free to instate a specific FOGRA 27/ 39/ custom/ whatever setting if you know who's gonna print it using what profiles. Regardless, you have to at least calibrate the monitor either by eyeballing it with a calibrated reference chart or a calibration device and then of course you have to use it for proof preview. Beyond that - light colors are sometimes created by reducing the ink density/ opacity and/or flattening them against white and letting the halftoning take care of the rest, but this really depends on specific workflows. At least on my crudely calibrated system here at home I have no issues to get a reasonable representation of the color, so something may be up on your system.
Mylenium

Conversion formulas from RGB to CMYK

Hi,
I've been writing a Colour swatch tool (in excel! hell yeah!) which allows me to pick a bunch of colours, generate complimentary colours from them, blend between 2 colours in a set number of steps and a whole bunch of other cool stuff, and then output this as a photoshop or illustrator swatch file.
As part of this tool I want to be able to covert the rgb values to cmyk. There is very little information on this on the web and what there is is fairly inaccurate.
For example,
RGB:50,128,128
Converts to CMYK 61,0,0,50 (%) using the formula found at easyrgb.com (this formula is the most prevalent one on the web/web forums)
Photoshop converts these RGB values as CMYK: 80,33,48,8 (%)
While these two colour values are *similar* the ones generated by the easyrgb formulas are nowhere near the photoshop values.
See? stupid useless formulas. (I am aware of the differences and overlap of the two gamuts)
Whilst I know that the conversion done in photoshop is done using ICC templates, and that often these conversions are device dependant, there must be a more realiable way of converting from one colour space to another using good old reliable cold hard maths.
Does anyone know what that might be? you guys at Adobe: I AM LOOKING AT YOU.
Hope you guys can help,
~silvery~
For reference I have included and commented the easyrgb formulas:
First: RGB -> CMY
C = 1 - ( R / 255 )
M = 1 - ( G / 255 )
Y = 1 - ( B / 255 )
Second: CMY -> CMYK
var_K = 1
Initally sets var_K as 1, although this is dependant on variables below
if ( C < var_K )   var_K = C
if ( M < var_K )   var_K = M
if ( Y < var_K )   var_K = Y
This bit finds the smallest value from the CMY range and sets this value as var_K
if ( var_K == 1 ) { //Black
    C = 0
    M = 0
    Y = 0
If var_K (the value that K is calculated from) is 1, then all the CMY values are reset to 0
else {
    C = ( C - var_K ) / ( 1 - var_K )
    M = ( M - var_K ) / ( 1 - var_K )
    Y = ( Y - var_K ) / ( 1 - var_K )
If the value of var_K is anything other than 1 then use the smallest value from the CMY range
K = var_K
The value of K as filtered out from the conditions above

Oliver,
I'm not sure what you mean by the term 'meta' color profiles, but I'll take a stab at what I "think" you are asking. There are some fairly widely accepted "standards" out there for both RGB and CMYK.
In the RGB world, for example, sRGB, Adobe RGB (and to some extent, ProPhoto RGB) have a fairly wide following. These are all ICC profiles, which nail down the boundaries of the color gamut and the definitions of any tri-stimulus combination of red, green and blue. Basically, they are matrix profiles that establish the positions of the Red, Green and Blue primaries, and these positions define the outer limits, or color gamut, of the color space. sRGB is a relatively small color space, so some viewable and printable colors get clipped (sRGB is the general internet, email standard and is widely assumed for many non-color managed appplications, printers, etc). sRGB can handle a fairly wide range of colors, but does clip some colors in brightly colored originals. It has the advantage of being the most widely adopted standard, plus the steps between colors are very close together. I use sRGB for average images, most people pictures, etc. Adobe RGB spreads the primaries further apart, so it describes a wider color gamut. Because the primaries are further apart, the steps are slightly larger from one color to the next, but marginally so. I use Adobe RGB for most of my brightly colored images that will get clipped in sRGB. Adobe RGB is also generally a good choice for images that will ultimately go to a printing press or inkjet. ProPhoto RGB pushes the primaries WAY apart, so it describes a HUGE color gamut...in fact, many of the colors that can be defined in ProPhoto fall outside human vision, and certainly monitors and printers.Due to the wide spacing of steps in ProPhoto RGB, images should be worked in in 16 bit, otherwide you may see some banding and posterization if large edits are made.
In the CMYK world, certain "standards" have been established, mainly for commercial offset printers (both web and sheetfed presses). By creating a standard, they are trying to establish the ink limit, densities, color gamut, dynamic range, gray balance, etc, of a "generic" sheet of commercial printing paper on the average well-maintained press using standard ISO inks, using good process control, mesurements, etc. By it's nature, this process has to encompass a wide cross section of presses, so it may act as a limitation on what some modern presses are capable of, but that's what standards usually do. If a good printer, with a modern press and great process control decides to sidestep the standard, they can probably extend color gamut, dynamic range, etc, but at the cost of no longer being "standardized". If commercial printers are "truly" trying to meet the standard, they will run tests, take measurements, and adjust their entire workflow so it matches the standard, within acceptable tolerances. Lots of shops "claim" to adhere to SWOP or GRACoL standards, but the majority of them don't. Standards for presses make some sense, because blending CMYK inks together (especially if they use ISO standard inks) on paper usually has a reasonably narrow range that works, though the paper makes a huge difference. (the same cannot be said for inkjets, monitors and many other processes, so they generally do not have standards). So for presses, there are standards for matte and coated papers, web presses, sheetfed presses, newsprint, etc. Each of these standards has its own ICC profile (or a family of profiles) that establishes ink limits, color gamuts, etc.
All ICC profiles have the necessary tags and data to comply with the ICC specification. One of those requirements is a "profile connection space", which is usually L*a*b* or a variant. So, an file on your computer may be tagged as an Adobe RGB file, and if you wish to prepare it for a sheetfed press using glossy stock, you could convert the file to GRACoL2006_Coated1v2.ICC (an industry standard profile for No. 1 coated stock on a sheetfed press). Since both files have the ability to "speak Lab" a translation can be made from one color space to the other. The numbers in the Adobe RGB file will be converted to L*a*b* (the universal translator), and then the L*a*b* numbers will be converted to CMYK, specifically GRACoL2006_Coated1v2.ICC. So, now you have a file in CMYK space with new numbers. It is worth noting that RGB has only three colorants to define colors, but CMYK has four. So, while in RGB there is only one way to define a specific color, in CMYK, there are many possible combinations that can generate many colors. This adds complexity to the equation. The CMY colors are called subtractive primaries, and are opposites of RGB (additive primaries). The "K" (black ink) is added for text, line art, neutrality, extra Dmax, and because the CMY inks are not pure and don't deliver a true black all by themselves. If the inks and paper were perfect, you could theoretically get away with CMY all by themselves, except for registration issues, text, line art, etc. Also, the additional "K" ink can help reduce the total ink limit, save ink, reduce costs, and improve quality.
Sorry for the book. This is not a simple subject, and we have only touched the surface.
Lou

Can i change imported RGB colours to specified CMYK colours quickly in Indesign rather than doing ea

Can i change imported RGB colours from a word doc to specified CMYK (already in the swatch panel) colours quickly in Indesign rather than doing each one manually?
Is there a script so you can allocate rgb colours to cmyk colours?

oh yeah, I see... You definitely need a script, so you better post this request in script forum. Since it quite scriptable (I believe), you need to know exactly (tell to the script) what colors to find and change to what. So it would work only on the specific pre-defined list of colors. I'm using something very similar regarding the fonts (I get regularly files where I need to change bunch of fonts to their alternatives). Not sure if it's possible to modify it for colors - I see some essential differences here. I'm not a scripter...

- - - Identifying Pantone TPX Colours from RGB/CMYK Photoshop/Illustrator files - - -

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