Mixing Levels

Im getting mixed answers when it comes to mixing levels (Theatrical), because in text books - it says don't exceed -6db, but I've heard a lot of people tell me that -4.5db is the norm, and then when I look at the mix my sound editor did awhile back, it goes all the way up to -0.5db at times - during the action sequences. What's the real deal? I mean, -6db doesn't sound too good in the action sequences, but I've also heard that if something isn't loud enough, you usually want to lower volumes rather than make it louder. Anyone know?

The real deal is that a theatrical mix is done in a calibrated room at a fixed level. There is no meter level that will answer your question.
Study this and this for a while.

Similar Messages

How to calibrate mixing level

Is there a way to generate pink noise in logic to calibrate the mixing level and if so how does one do it properly? I want to calibrate my mixing level with a c-weighted meter. Thanks.

Here's how it ties:
Much of this is backed by different sources and tests. The magic number you see is the avg foreground listening level where it is not too loud, not too quiet - one study I remember involved ( memory may fail ) a movie in a theater calibrated to this ( was it a Lucasfilm? ). This was attended by many people of different ages from different relevant industries. Afterwards, attendants were asked how the levels were, too soft, right, too loud - the result was a resounding right.
Now, transfer this into the sound creation process. If you know the level most people agree is the proper foreground listening level... you should probably spend a good time monitoring at that level ( you may do so already ), since ( Fletcher Munson ) our ears respond differently to frequencies at different avg levels. Your mixes will probably transfer better. Also, this allows you to set your levels appropriately when creating with a DAW since many of our digital devices have ceilings ( 0dB ). Then, you convince yourself to focus on your avg level instead of squashing the p*ss out of your mix - you just remove that component and focus on a good mix with proper dynamics and ample headroom instead of trying to get an insanely "loud" CD.
That's that for starters,
J

[SOLVED]Pulseaudio & Gnome - Mixer levels, S/PDIF

After years of keeping as far away as possible from pulseaudio, I thought I'd give it another try, well, this is my story:
(... I deceided to cut my rant, just the facts:)
After installing pulseaudio, everything seemed to be working fine, except that the S/PDIF channel always became un-muted upon login to gnome.
I could mute it manually via alsamixer, and store everything just fine with alsactl, and all my mixer values were restored on reboot just fine.
S/PDIF stays output remains off right up until gnome loads. I presume that pulseaudio does 'something' to my mixer settings, but I have not been able to determine what that 'something' actually is.
Even worse, I installed both pavucontrol and parprefs, and after literally just clicking through the options in pavucontroll (specifically the output profiles) I now have no proper output devices, just 'dummy devices' and sound no longer works.
I deleted ~\.config\pulse and rebooted, and it still is misconfigured.
How can I tell pa to leave my alsa/hw mixer levels the hell alone, this is assuming I can get it back to how it was before I started messing with pavucontrol...
Last edited by hungerfish (2015-01-17 01:48:28)

> ~ $ pacmd list-cards
1 card(s) available.
index: 0
name: <alsa_card.pci-0000_00_08.0>
driver: <module-alsa-card.c>
owner module: 6
properties:
alsa.card = "0"
alsa.card_name = "HDA NVidia"
alsa.long_card_name = "HDA NVidia at 0xd3480000 irq 23"
alsa.driver_name = "snd_hda_intel"
device.bus_path = "pci-0000:00:08.0"
sysfs.path = "/devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:08.0/sound/card0"
device.bus = "pci"
device.vendor.id = "10de"
device.vendor.name = "NVIDIA Corporation"
device.product.id = "0d94"
device.product.name = "MCP89 High Definition Audio"
device.form_factor = "internal"
device.string = "0"
device.description = "Built-in Audio"
module-udev-detect.discovered = "1"
device.icon_name = "audio-card-pci"
profiles:
input:analog-stereo: Analog Stereo Input (priority 60, available: unknown)
output:analog-stereo: Analog Stereo Output (priority 6000, available: unknown)
output:analog-stereo+input:analog-stereo: Analog Stereo Duplex (priority 6060, available: unknown)
output:analog-surround-40: Analog Surround 4.0 Output (priority 700, available: unknown)
output:analog-surround-40+input:analog-stereo: Analog Surround 4.0 Output + Analog Stereo Input (priority 760, available: unknown)
output:iec958-stereo: Digital Stereo (IEC958) Output (priority 5500, available: unknown)
output:iec958-stereo+input:analog-stereo: Digital Stereo (IEC958) Output + Analog Stereo Input (priority 5560, available: unknown)
output:hdmi-stereo: Digital Stereo (HDMI) Output (priority 5400, available: unknown)
output:hdmi-stereo+input:analog-stereo: Digital Stereo (HDMI) Output + Analog Stereo Input (priority 5460, available: unknown)
output:hdmi-surround: Digital Surround 5.1 (HDMI) Output (priority 300, available: unknown)
output:hdmi-surround+input:analog-stereo: Digital Surround 5.1 (HDMI) Output + Analog Stereo Input (priority 360, available: unknown)
output:hdmi-stereo-extra1: Digital Stereo (HDMI) Output (priority 5200, available: unknown)
output:hdmi-stereo-extra1+input:analog-stereo: Digital Stereo (HDMI) Output + Analog Stereo Input (priority 5260, available: unknown)
output:hdmi-surround-extra1: Digital Surround 5.1 (HDMI) Output (priority 100, available: unknown)
output:hdmi-surround-extra1+input:analog-stereo: Digital Surround 5.1 (HDMI) Output + Analog Stereo Input (priority 160, available: unknown)
output:hdmi-stereo-extra2: Digital Stereo (HDMI) Output (priority 5200, available: unknown)
output:hdmi-stereo-extra2+input:analog-stereo: Digital Stereo (HDMI) Output + Analog Stereo Input (priority 5260, available: unknown)
output:hdmi-surround-extra2: Digital Surround 5.1 (HDMI) Output (priority 100, available: unknown)
output:hdmi-surround-extra2+input:analog-stereo: Digital Surround 5.1 (HDMI) Output + Analog Stereo Input (priority 160, available: unknown)
off: Off (priority 0, available: unknown)
active profile: <output:analog-stereo+input:analog-stereo>
sinks:
alsa_output.pci-0000_00_08.0.analog-stereo/#0: Built-in Audio Analog Stereo
sources:
alsa_output.pci-0000_00_08.0.analog-stereo.monitor/#0: Monitor of Built-in Audio Analog Stereo
alsa_input.pci-0000_00_08.0.analog-stereo/#1: Built-in Audio Analog Stereo
ports:
analog-input: Analog Input (priority 10000, latency offset 0 usec, available: unknown)
properties:
analog-input-mic: Microphone (priority 8700, latency offset 0 usec, available: unknown)
properties:
device.icon_name = "audio-input-microphone"
analog-output: Analog Output (priority 9900, latency offset 0 usec, available: unknown)
properties:
analog-output-speaker: Speakers (priority 10000, latency offset 0 usec, available: unknown)
properties:
device.icon_name = "audio-speakers"
analog-output-headphones: Headphones (priority 9000, latency offset 0 usec, available: no)
properties:
device.icon_name = "audio-headphones"
iec958-stereo-output: Digital Output (S/PDIF) (priority 0, latency offset 0 usec, available: unknown)
properties:
hdmi-output-0: HDMI / DisplayPort (priority 5900, latency offset 0 usec, available: no)
properties:
device.icon_name = "video-display"
hdmi-output-1: HDMI / DisplayPort 2 (priority 5800, latency offset 0 usec, available: no)
properties:
device.icon_name = "video-display"
hdmi-output-2: HDMI / DisplayPort 3 (priority 5700, latency offset 0 usec, available: no)
properties:
device.icon_name = "video-display"

Mixer Level/Reference Level

I feel like I'm starting to become a regular here on the RF discussion board. I'm not sure if that's a good thing or not...
I'm making some measurements using the 5660...and the results seem unnecessarily noisy. I'm concerned that perhaps I'm not setting the "Reference Level" correctly. Could somebody clear up the definition of the mixer/reference levels? In "traditional" mixer notation, there's the RF (input) port, the LO (reference) port, and the IF (output) port. How do the 566x's define this in relation to the mixer/reference level? All of the help documents just list how the attenuation is set based on the relative levels...but it's still a bit confusing as to what I'm setting when I input a level for the "Reference Level" field, and furthermore, what the optimum level should be based on a particular application.
Brandon

Hi Brandon,
Is always good to fully understand what is going on in this field of RF (and yet it is hard to tell sometimes).
The objective is this. Whatever your signal amplitude or power level is, it better be satisfying the needs of the mixer. That is where, the mixer level comes into picture. Our goal is to bring our signal level up or down so that it meets the effective signal level.
Look at the following drawing and I hope your questions are cleared with this.
Hope this helps,
Message Edited by Yardov on 05-16-2007 12:29 AM
Gerardo O.
RF Systems Engineering
National Instruments
Attachments:
attenuation level.JPG ‏33 KB

Mixing level based measures issue

Hi experts
I have a geography dimension with the following hierarchy WW/Country/store.
I created 2 level based measures using as source a measure called 'sales':
level based measure 1: store sales share of WW (it shows for every store his contribution in the World Wide)
level based measure 2: store sales share of country(it shows for every store his contribution in the country he belongs to)
when I test the measures separately they are working perfectly:
report 1: at country level
country------------store name--------------level based measure 1
country1----------store 1-------------------------------30%--------------/
country1----------store 2-------------------------------30%--------------/
country1----------store 3-------------------------------40%--------------/
report 2: at WW level
country------------store name--------------level based measure 2
country1----------store 1-------------------------------2%--------------/
country1----------store 2-------------------------------3%--------------/
country1----------store 3-------------------------------4%--------------/
country2----------store 1-------------------------------1%--------------/
country2----------store 2-------------------------------2%--------------/
country2----------store 3-------------------------------2%--------------/
|
|
|
|
country10-------store5----------------------------------1%--------------/
and the issue I have is when create the following report for a specific store
country------------store name--------------level based measure 1--------------level based measure 2
country1----------store 1-------------------------------30%---------------------------2%
NULL----------------NULL---------------------------------NULL-------------------------NULL
NULL----------------NULL---------------------------------NULL-------------------------NULL
NULL----------------NULL---------------------------------NULL-------------------------NULL
NULL----------------NULL---------------------------------NULL-------------------------NULL
NULL----------------NULL---------------------------------NULL-------------------------NULL
NULL----------------NULL---------------------------------NULL-------------------------NULL
NULL----------------NULL---------------------------------NULL-------------------------NULL
NULL----------------NULL---------------------------------NULL-------------------------NULL
NULL----------------NULL---------------------------------NULL-------------------------NULL
NULL----------------NULL---------------------------------NULL-------------------------NULL
I have a set of empty rows :the number of the null lines is 10 which is the number of all the countries.
Any one knows why he is adding those line and how can I avoid that.??
Regards

1) you have mixed the definitions of levelbasedmeasure1 and levelbasedmeasure1.
2) make sure all the columns (other than measures) are from dimension tables. i.e. country, store ...etc should not be fact columns
3) make sure you have the level based measures at proper level in the dimension heirarchy

Stereo mixer levels bug?

I've seen this posted about previously but no replies so thought I'd have a go.
I keyframed a drop in levels from 100 to 0 to fade out the audio but immediately after the zeroed KF, the levels pop back to 100.
I would have thought they would remain at 0 myself from this KF onwards but not so.
I've worked around by trimming the layer back to the zero KF but this is not ideal for all circumstances.
Any ideas?
Running AE 13.1 on Mac Pro 10.9.5.
Ta
Yan

Thank you for reporting this issue. I have verified that this is a bug that was introduced in After Effects 2014.1 (13.1). We will investigate and hope to fix this in a future update.
In my testing, I found that this problem only occurs during RAM preview and audio preview. The problem does not occur when you scrub with audio (CTRL/Cmd + scrub), or when you render the composition via the Render Queue.
A workaround you can use is to set the Left Level and Right Level parameters to 0.01% instead of 0%. This should leave the audio functionally inaudible, and it avoids the bug. If having the audio at 0% is important, at the end of the Stereo Mixer keyframes you could also keyframe the layer's Audio Levels property to 0% to absolutely zero out the audio.
Apologies for the bug.

Mixer levels revert to prior setting when I play track

I adjust the level of one or more tracks in the Logic Express mixer but when I click play in the transport bar the level reverts to the original setting. I see no way to save the modified setting. Idea's?

Hi,
there are two possible things that can cause this:
1st, most probable: You have activated automation. That is, you have (by accident or in ancient times) set the level of a track to xy and inserted a level change somewhere on the way. Logic then switches the automation to "READ" (look if there's a small green field "read" in the channelstrip just above the fader, which otherwise should read "off").
Solution: Turn off automation by clicking on the "read" field and set it to off. Or - click on your track in the arrangement window, press "a" (for "a"utomation), and delete the wrong volume nodes.
2nd, most likely if you use imported MIDI files, the midi data itself could contain a volume information (you can see it in the event list). So you have to open the event list and delete the volume change event.
Cheers,
Fox

Mix levels on some tracks

I've set up a preliminary template ... I have separate tracks for drum types (kick, snare, etc.) -- I've loaded loops into those tracks & cut them apart ... but I notice on some of the tracks, no matter how low I set the level in the mixer, it's above the "zero" (in the red) .. even if I back it down to being inaudible. .... I'm missing some detail about the channel strip detail but I can't figure out what. (It does not seem to push the master track into the red, so I wonder what's going on).
Help if you an - thanks in advance

Voltrocks wrote:
and the levels reflect that (now the stuff isn't clipping, for instance).
Well, if Pre Fader Metering said stuff was clipping, and now you've switched to Post Fader Metering, that same stuff could still be clipping.
The best way to work is using Pre Fader metering as it allows you to see if the plugins you're running on a channel are causing clipping before the actions of the fader. For example.
If in Pre Fader metering, the channel is reading a peak value of -3dB, then you know that as long as you don't push that fader up by 3dB or more, you're not going to get clipping at any point.
If you are in Post Fader metering and the peak value reads -3dB, but your fader is set to -4dB then you're likely to be getting clipping BEFORE the fader, at the output of the plugins.
There is always a lot of debate around this concept as a lot of people will say that a digital mixer like this has so much headroom that you're unlikely to get audible clipping at any stage. Personally I say, use Pre Fader metering so you CAN see what's going on before the fader as what goes on after it is very easy to keep an eye on too. It's just a far safer way of working and should keep down your chances of creating distortion while mixing. Just learn what it means.

Ideal Surround Sound Mixing Levels for Music

Hi all,
When using Soundtrack Pro and you mix in Surround sound there are little dots by each speaker and there are more dots for how louder you want the sound to be by that speaker.
My earlier attempts at surround sound have finally worked but the music is so low in the rear speakers that you'd never hear it unless you put your ear to the speaker. Then again I don't want to up it too loud either.
Is there anyone that's familiar with professional audio editing that have any suggestions on typical ideal levels (in dots) by each speaker so that the music really fills the room?

Have you tried posting this question here...
http://discussions.apple.com/forum.jspa?forumID=743
Someone here may have answers, but the STP forum should have some core users with info as well.
K

Final mix levels

Just been browsing through previous threads about final output mixes and just want to explain what I am doing and what would be the best way to get the final mix done.
Have 7 tracks that have been written for a half hour film , the music is mostly acoustic guitar with synth and the odd cello , oboe and harp( all garritan). I have them finished and have incorporated sound files of sea and bird cries etc but want to bounce them for final output at a realistic level, balancing them all up to a similar level at the same time. Would logic compression be the way to go? I have compared my unfinished music levels with professional cd's and my outputs seem way too low . The pro cd recordings seems to bring their peaks to just under clipping. is that the way to go? using such things as limiters and the like I have no experience so would appreciate any info on their uses?
Marto

Did you see this?
http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=388347&tstart=15
Also, within this thread there are links to some helpful articles on the tc site.
This might help too:
http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/aug04/articles/computermastering.htm

Tracks reverting to pre-mix levels after setting them lower

After recording a tune, I go to mixdown and naturally adjust the levels of each track. Since day 1 I keep running into the same problem. Tracks on which I adjust the levels lower automatically revert to pre-adjustment levels, seemingly at the same point in the piece. How can I simply set a track's level during mixdown and have it stay where I put it?
Thanks

It sounds like it's most likely one of two things...
There's the obvious volume automation, but I would imagine that's really not the kind of thing that can be easily added by mistake.
So my guess would be that there is MIDI controller data (CC#7) being written to the audio regions on those tracks, perhaps from a controller...?
select a track, and open your Events window, and look for controller #7. If you see a lot of that data listed there, select one of the volume data lines in the list, then use the "Select similar" command. This will select ALL volume data for that track, and then hit delete.
See if that's what's going on....

How can l keep the same track mixer volume levels in logic when bouncing a project ? HELP !!!

When l bounce a project, all of the mixer levels return at the defult level automatically, they do not stay at the levels l require (levels l have previously set for each track). Which means l do not get each track at the volume l need when it is made into an mp3.
Below is an example from a help-discussion website with someone who has the exact same problem as me. However, none of the suggestions the people have made on it will resolve the on-going problem for either of us :
http://www.logicprohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=374597 (there is a clear explanation of the problem on this link with helpful screen shots)
Any help, suggestions or advice would be much appreciated.
Many thanks.

I gave the most probable cause/solution in that thread:
Open the event list (E), select and remove all MIDI CC [b]7[/b] messages from all tracks/regions.
To select all MIDI CC 7 messages in one region, first select one, then hit shift-S.

Pre Mastering/levels on final mix

I am fairly new to LogicPro. My levels in PT were pretty good on final mixes..I have been messin' around for several weeks with Logics master plugs(adaptive limiter/compressors) on 1-2 but levels seem still pretty low. Any suggestions to boost it up without destroying the mix? also would i put a limiter before or after a compressor on 1-2 ?Thank you

How are your individual tracks? Is the mix level itself (not the mastering level) satisfactory?
All depending on the song, I usually use the Multipressor/EQ/Adaptive Limiter (usually in this order, but not always at the same time). Sometimes if it fitting, I will stick in the Stereo Spreader in the chain. Mind you, I will often A/B the results to see if the plug-ins made it sound better or just louder (if it's just louder, I'll take it out).
Check your settings on the Adaptive Limiter. You may be able to squeeze a bit more gain out of your final result without making a sonically mushy brick. Like I stated earlier, I also add in the Multipressor at times as it can bring out a little sparkle (or oomph, depending on the sound) in the mix when used judiciously. Mind you, if you use it, pay attention to the bands you are working on. Otherwise, you will wind up destroying the mix.
jord

How to only display specific members from dissimilar hierarchy levels?

Hi,
I have a Business Partner that routinely wants to build a report that displays members from dissimilar hierarchy levels. For example, she wants to display member "210_UNASSIGNED EXP/ACC" from level 8 and member "E090_ADVISOR SERVICES" from level 1. When she filters on just those two members, the reports displays as such:
She then must manually expand the "E020_CORPORATE AND EXECUTIVE" member 7 times to see "210_UNASSIGNED EXP/ACC":
Is there anyway to make her life easier and have the report display only the "210_UNASSIGNED EXP/ACC" member and the "E090_ADVISOR SERVICES" member, even though they are from different levels?
Thanks,
Michael J Titera
BI4.0 SP8.3
SQL Server 2012

Hello Michael
Displaying information from mixed hierarchy levels without the context of the parent members is a reporting workflow best suited to WebI and CR. The AOLAP content can be exported as an Analysis View and then this becomes a data source for WebI and CR.
Our previous product Voyager used to allow member selection from mixed levels without the context of parent members but it caused a lot of confusion and misinterpretation of the data, which is why we deliberately do not have it in AOLAP.
Worth noting that BI4.1 was a big release for AOLAP with many enhancements. One is "Expand to Level". So instead of having to click 7 times to expand the hierarchy, it now just requires one mouse right-click to do the same thing.
Regards
Ian

Low levels when recording?

Using a 1212m, recording from 1/4" line-in or from Host wave (ASIO 1/2), when the Patchmix Strip & Main Mix levels appear to be set just right, the recording software (SoundForge 9c or Cubase LE) shows peaks of only about 5dB. Is this normal? If I record at this level can I just Normalize afterward without distortion? It seems that clipping levels anywhere in the path would not be good, but I'd like to record the best quality signal possible. Any suggestions are appreciated.
By the way, are there any Plug-ins that allow Auto Levels in recording software?

>> May not be the same with Sigmatel audio, but with Realtek in XP, you have to have both the master volume and the wave volume up in the playback mixer. Have you tried adjusting the Wave level control? <<
Yes. For output volume, only the wave volume affects levels in Audition so I set it to maximum. The master volume changes loudness of the speakers but does not affect Audition's record levels per Audition's level meters.
For record volume, the "Line-in" slider affects audition level meters. I adjusted this to maximum.
With both output (wave) and record (line-in) sliders set to maximum, Audition's record level meters still show a maximum of about -30 db. When playing the recording back using Audition, the hardware speaker's volume knob has to be turned WAY up to hear the song.
Thanks for your reply,
Skyzoomer

Mixing Levels

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