Profiling Intents - Perceptual or Relative?

Which is the best intent to use when most of my colours are in gamut and I do not want them to change from the original? I am using Lightroom 4 and soft proofing for my Canon printer.

If the colors are in gamut it makes no difference.
Out of gamut colors will change, you can't prevent that. But choosing a rendering intent lets you pick your losses, so to speak. See which one is most acceptable. Relative just hard clips anything out of gamut, while perceptual compresses near the gamut boundary (so that you could get small shifts even within gamut).
Personally I never bother with intent - if clipping is an issue I deal with it directly.

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  • "paste profile mismatch" ... what rendering intent is used?

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    The first one converts using the conversion options set in your color settings, under more options. The second doesn't convert, it assigns the destination document color space. No numbers are converted, but their appearance in the new document will change as they take on a different profile.
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  • Own Profiles - Rendering Intent

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  • How to set up Print Specs and Profiles in CS5 Suite

    I am no color management expert but I do want to get my printer to print the same colors as my monitor displays in PSD, AI and InD applications.
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              Rendering Intent - Relative Colorimetric for artwork or Perceptual for photos.
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              Media Type - depends on your paper. (mine is Photo Quality InkJet).
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              Mode - I chose Advanced to get fine quality print. Automatic OK for general use.
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    ILLUSTRATOR CS5
    Bridge will ensure that Color Settings match Photoshop as 1. above. If you don’t have Bridge Go to Edit>Color Settings and specify the same as      Photoshop. Note Settings, at top of Color settings dialogue box requires the profile you created in Photoshop.
         Go to File >Print. There are 3 steps to check.
         In the  window at left are headings General, Marks and Bleed, Output, Graphics, Color Management, Advanced and Summary.
         These are self explanatory. If you do not use Bridge, check Color Management as below:
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       Unlike Photoshop, do NOT use printer/paper ICC. Rendering intent: to suit your image.
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    3. Bottom Left is Printer. MOST IMPORTANT. Here are the similar setting options as PSD 4 above which require different handling.
         Select Layout, go down to Color Matching>select COLORSYNC not Epson. This ensures Apple ColorSync does color conversion.
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         Move down list to Print Settings - Basic:
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              Color - Color
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              Mode - Advanced if you want fine quality print. Automatic is OK for general use.
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    INDESIGN and General Comments.
    Always select your Printer first as settings vary according to printer type.
    InDesign Print set up is very similar to AI. Select Color Management at left and the Printer, Printer Profile and Rendering Intent require identical settings.
    Go to bottom left, Page Setup. Specify Printer and paper size. Select Printer and the settings required are the same as AI.
    If you switch between these apps there is considerable danger that the different Profile choices will trip you up. Photoshop color management requires the Printer/paper ICC, AI and InDesign require Monitor ICC. My primary error was to select my professionally scanned printer/paper ICC profile which resulted in weird colours on AI and ID. The clue that led me to choose my Monitor ICC profile instead was the ColorSync option in Color matching in AI. I hope you will find printing runs a lot smoother for you and I heartily invite better informed users than I, can add to, or qualify this post.
    May the Force be with you!

    Regarding print brightness at output. The Settings of monitor calibration determine white point and black point. At the time you run Spyder 3 or whatever your monitor calibrator is, the software sets a white point of your choosing. current iMacs are far too bright and prints resulting from unmodified Mac monitors will appear too dark because of the excessive screen brightness. My iMac at lowest reading is 139 candelas. To get prints which match the screen I specify 80 candelas. The Spyder software also reads ambient light in the room and makes a calculation which effects the white and black points registered for both viewing and printing. Since paper reflects a light level according to lighting conditions, we each view prints in different conditions according to illumination source. This effects also effects screen viewing so conditions determine what we see.
    In simple terms, ambient light reading also modifies the software calculations for colour output. If it is too high, prints are pale, too low and prints are too dark. If the Monitor calibration has been done properly there should be no problem. The point here is to make certain your calibration process is accurate. Personally I have calibrated in a dark room at night-time and I have calibrated In a shaded room at midday. Hugely different conditions. Under both circumstances I have found the calibration has resulted in good prints. So I suspect it is user white point settings or calibration error which results in prints being too dark or too light. I understand the data used by the calibration software applies to the ambient light reading to the monitor for reading conditions and uses other color gamut data for the printing process. So printing error must surely originate with the user.
    I welcome comment from more experienced people in this matter.
    Cheers,

  • Possible solution for problems printing with ICC profiles - esp. R2400

    (N.B. This is long because I've decided to go in to details about the background of the problem etc.. Also note that whilst my experience is with the Epson R2400, anyone with problems printing using ICC profiles in Aperture may find this post helpful, as will be explained further down the post.)
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    The solution? Use perceptual rendering instead. Ok, so you can't change the rendering intent in Aperture, which makes that sound a tad difficult. However, as I said in the above paragraph, Aperture always obeys the default rendering intent specified in the profile... so you can see where we're going with this: we need to change the ICC profiles' default rendering intent from 'relative colorimetric' to 'perceptual'. I did some digging around and found one or two expensive pieces of software that could do that... but then I found that, lo and behold, the Mac OS has a command-line utility which can do the job for us, for precisely £0.00. It's called SIPS or 'Scriptable Image Processing System', and you can find out some information about it here: http://developer.apple.com/technotes/tn/tn2035.html#TNTAG58 For those who don't like reading technical jargon however, here's what you need to do to convert a profile's rendering intent. First go to terminal, then type in the following command:
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    Do not press 'enter' yet. Instead, add a space after 'perceptual', find the ICC profile you want to modify, and click and drag it into the terminal window. You should then find that your command looks something like this:
    sips -s renderingIntent perceptual /Users/yourname/folder/RandomProfile.ICC
    At which point you can then press 'enter', and the command will execute, giving you an ICC profile which will now make Aperture use perceptual rendering.
    There is just one further thing to be aware of after doing this: for some crazy reason, you then need to turn on BPC in Aperture for the prints to come out as good as possible. Black point compensation shouldn't make any difference when using perceptual rendering as the idea of perceptual is that it takes account of things like that anyway, however, in Aperture BPC does make a difference, so remember to turn it on to get a half decent print. In general, I find that prints made using this setup come out pretty well; they almost perfectly match prints made using the profiles with a perceptual intent in Photoshop Elements, except for the fact that Aperture blocks up the shadows a bit more than Photoshop. However, if you can live with that, you might find this is quite a workable solution.
    Now, I said near the beginning of this post that all the above can apply to other printers too. Most printer profiles have 'perceptual' set as their default rendering intent, in which case everything I've just said won't be of much help. However, If you are reading this because you're having problems with ICC profiles in Aperture, but you don't use an Epson R2400, find your problematic ICC profile, double-click on it, and take a look at the window that opens: specifically, at the 'Rendering Intent' the window mentions. If it doesn't say 'Perceptual' then it may well be worth trying the steps I've outlined in this post to set it to perceptual, to see if doing so produces an improvement when using the profile in Aperture.
    Finally, just one note of caution: if you decide to try out the steps I've detailed above on a paid-for custom-made profile, please back your profile up before messing with it. I haven't experienced any problems when using SIPS to change a profile's rendering intent, but I obviously can't guarantee that it won't do something weird and corrupt your expensive custom-made profile.
    If you have any questions, feel free to ask, although (contrary to any impression I may give) I am not a colour-management expert; I'm just someone who doesn't give up when they have a problem that should be solvable.
    Thomas
    Mac Pro 2.0GHz with 30" ACD; 15" MacBook Pro 2.0GHz   Mac OS X (10.4.10)  

    Thomas
    Wow - thanks for such a comprehensive post.
    I have Aperture and a 2400 so this information is exceptionally useful to me.
    Again - thanks for caring and sharing
    Brian

  • How to control Display Rendering Intent in PS CS3 & XP?

    Does anyone know a way to control the display rendering intent in Photoshop CS3 runing on XP?
    The consensus seems to be that Relative Colormetric is always used.  If I am using a large working space such as ProPhotoRGB, I would like to be able to switch between Perceptual and Relative Colormetric.
    Here is some info I think may be relevant:
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    If use Monitor_RGB as my working space, and do edit > convert_to_profile, converting from ProPhotoRGB to MonitorRGB:
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    Let me think about this.
    Looking at my monitor profile with the Color Sync Utility (I’m on a mac), the rendering of the profile is Perceptual.
    With Photoshop, I open a saturated Pro Photo image. View: Proof Setup: Custom. Device to Simulate, Monitor Profile.
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    I can change the rendering and black comp all day long and it does not affect the color I see. I have to assume that what I see is actually a Perceptual rendering, not Relative Colorimetric,  because Perceptual is the intent embedded in the Monitor ICC profile.
    CMYK is a little different. With the same image open, View:  Proof Setup: Custom. US Web Coated SWOP v2. Relative Colorimetric, Black Point checked. Simulate Paper White.
    Now duplicate the image. Convert to Profile: US Web Coated. Relative Colorimetric, black point enabled. Now View: Proof Setup: Custom. Device to Simulate, monitor profile. Absolute Colorimetric.
    Comparing the two images, the color is a dead on match.
    In the second image (already converted to CMYK), if I change the rendering and black comp, the color shifts dramatically. This behavior is different from what I saw earlier, soft proofing Pro Photo to monitor, where the rendering and black point settings did not change the image color.
    So at this point I have to conclude that Photoshop can control the display rendering for a CMYK image. But with RGB, it’s locked in somehow. I would imagine it defaults to Perceptual, not Relative Colorimetric. Can you open your monitor profile and check the rendering?
    I have a utility that actually allows me to change the intent of an ICC. I went ahead and did that to the monitor profile and saved a copy, with Relative as intent. Using this in Proof Setup (with Pro Photo image) also yields no change. Makes sense, because the color gamut of the new copy is identical, and Photoshop is rendering a file conversion.
    To get the Relative Colorimetric display requires changing the system profile to the new profile. Unfortunately when I do this, the screen color goes absolutely bonkers. All color are super saturated and I can hardly make out anything. I have no idea what that means.
    I apologize for rambling on, I’m probably not much help. Thanks for the link and I will look into this matter more when time allows.

  • Where are the rendering intent options found in LR on a Mac?

    I can't find the dialog to set the rendering intent when printing from Lightroom. How do I change from Perceptual to Relative Colormetric or visa versa? (Also, how do I change the type of paper I'm using, etc.)
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    Read that link and the user generated content: http://learn.adobe.com/wiki/display/LR/Set+print+color+management+-+Learn+More
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  • Icc profile locations inconsistent and confusing

    I apologize in advance for this long winded post, but I really would like some help, if anyone is willing to indulge me. Ive done some searching on the forum, and got some info, but I feel Im still missing something.
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    Next, I followed the directions for printing in Lightroom that Scott Kelby included in Chapter 8, pages 272-277 and 290-295 of his The Adobe Photoshop Lightroom Book. I was able to find 3 profiles for Premium Luster Paper when I followed step 4 on page 291 of the book, when I used the other option for Profile under the Color Management pane. The profiles were called, exactly, SP2200 Prem.Luster 1440.icc, SP2200 Prem.Luster 2880.icc, and SP2200 Premium Luster PK, and I was able to select all 3 of them by clicking the checkboxes in front of the profiles and now they show up as selections for printing. Thus far, I have experimented with the 1440 and PK profiles, and printed images using both perceptual and relative rendering intents, and Ive found, to my poor eyes at least, using the PK profile, with perceptual rendering intent, yields the best printer/monitor match (yes, my Eizo ColorEdge CE240W monitor has been recently calibrated using Monaco Optix, in case you were wondering), not great, but marginally acceptable. So far, so good. Now, here are my issues:
    I am trying to understand where the 3 profiles came from, since Im now paranoid about losing them, since I think Im headed in the right direction, at least. When I do a Spotlight search on my Mac, I have been able to find the SP2200 Prem.Luster 1440.icc and SP2200 Prem.Luster 2880.icc profiles under the Macintosh HD 1/Library/Colorsync/Profiles directory. However, the PK profile is not found by Spotlight. Instead, I seem to have located the PK profile by using the Colorsync utility, doing a repair profile, and then looking at profiles. The PK profile appears to reside under the directory Macintosh HD 1/Library/Printers/EPSON/InkjetPrinter/ICCProfiles/, however, it doesnt exist as a separate .icc profile, instead, it appears to reside inside a file called SP2200.profiles, which does not seem to be openable.
    So here are the questions:
    1. Which of these profiles were put into place when I installed the printer driver, and which were created when I downloaded and ran the paper profile for Epson Premium Luster paper program?
    2. Is there a way for me to extract the SP2200 Premium Luster PK from that SP2200.profiles file and put it in the same location as the other 2 .icc files, or should I not care? Im particularly afraid of losing this profile, since its the one that is working best for me at the moment.
    Thanks for any thoughts on this.

    Ans to Q1 - Macintosh HD 1/Library/Printers/EPSON/InkjetPrinter/ICCProfiles/ contains installed with driver and Macintosh HD 1/Library/Colorsync/Profiles were installed by the download.
    Ans to Q2 - Epson put them inside the "package" to keep them safe. You can access the package contents via the Ctrl+click or right+click context menu item labelled "Show package contents" (see attached screenshot), but I would
    strongly urge you not to remove them from the package. You really don't need to care where they are because they're in the safest place. It's when folk try to get smart that the system bites them.

  • What Rendering intent is used when exporting with a different color space?

    Hi,
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    Thanks.
    Message title was edited by: Brett N

    Jeff Schewe wrote:
    Bob_Peters wrote:
    The rendering intent in the Export dialog is Perceptual.
    Actually, an RGB color space to RGB colorspace is always only Relative Colorimetric...and adding Perceptual would only work with certain V4 ICC color spaces (you can find perceptual V4 color spaces for sRGB and ProPhoto I think but I'm not sure they would work in Lightroom anyway).
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    True.
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