Rendering in 24p

Hi there,
I always render my movies out in 25p simply because in my country we are using PAL system instead of the 29.97p NTSC system.
Now I am thinking of rendering in 24p bcos I read some wehre that says 24p will have more cinema look. Do you think there is any potential problem that I may face if my movies are rendered in 24p ? Will my TV be able to play it correctly ? Will my Mac computer be able to play the 24p correctly ?
Thanks

The main thing that gives a "cinema" look is not the jerky 24fps motion but the way the film is shot and edited:-
1. Video tends to be sharp and naturally colourful whereas film cameras generally use longer focal length lenses with shallower depths of field which enable differential and rack focusing . . . . essentially the ability to throw unimportant parts of the image out of focus.
A DSLR camera can create these shallow depth of field effects, which is why they are so popular with independent film makers.
2. Cinema films rarely have a clean bright colourful image like you get with a video camera, as a lot of work goes into colour-correcting or grading to create a particular atmosphere . . . dark and sombre, frighteningly garish or stark, warm and friendly etc.
You can get something of this feeling by applying the FCP X "Looks" filters or other proprietary brands.

Similar Messages

Realtime effects become jerky after being rendered for 24p HD video

Hello,
Any one comes across that for 24p HD Video clips, e.g. just adding a "cross-dissolve" as the transition between two clips (I have tried both uncompressed and ProRes 422 HQ). Before rendering, the realtime effects (green in color) plays perfectly across. However, after render realtime or render all, we find that there will be once that the video becomes jerkly about at the "out" point of the "cross-dissolve". The same result to the video recorded when "print-to-video" or "edit-to-tape".
The only work-around is to either export the whole sequence to a quicktime movie, OR adding a dummy "Quicktime" effect filter into the both video clips and render all effects. Both methods are very time consuming, as it is video footage
Also, this problem seems happen to 24p only, not 50i or 60i. I wonder there is any error in calculating and making the render file of the effect for 24p.
Software configuration:
10.4.10, Final Cut Pro 6.0.1, Quicktime (most updated), KONA3 driver 4.0 (actually this problem happens to BMD MultiBridge/DeckLink Systems too)
Is it a "known" bug in FCP? or anyone get similar problem but have a solution to it?
Thanks.
Regards,
Golden

Hmmm....odd. I only saw this with P2 footage that was imported with FCP 5.0.4 and used in projects since upgraded to FCP 5.1. That little jitter at the end. I had that. I had to reimport all my footage under FCP 5.1.1 and it went away.
But that is NOT what you are dealing with...same issue, different footage, different version of FCP.
Got me.

Video slips when rendered - a 24p problem?

Hi
I use a Panasonic DVX100B to shoot and Final Cut Studio 2 for post. On this video I am working on I make my cuts where I want them, but then if I apply any effect requiring a render, the clips slip by about 2 seconds when rendered. If a certain clip has an effect, but can play without render, then I get the slip when I export as a QT - surprise! Weirder, this only happens with some but not all of my footage.
I think it must have something to do with the 24p Advanced Pulldown Removal. Like the missing frames confuse the render function, which goes to get its info from the wrong place.
When I shoot 24p I can capture it with my settings as straight DV/NTSC or as 24p APR. (Usually I use capture now, as I find the camera often has trouble finding the start frame when I log first).
When I capture DV/NTSC I get no weirdness, but all my duplicate frames are there of course and when I edit into a 24fps timeline the wrong frames are removed. (Some way to make that not happen?)
When I capture APR I sometimes get audio out of synch, and I sometimes get this slipping when rendered problem.
Anyone know what I'm doing wrong? I'd be so grateful to know.
-Morgan

sneedbreedley wrote:
My preset in CS3 is HDV 1080p30. The stills were taken from videotaping photos with my SONY Z5U camcorder. I believe they are 1920x1080p.
So you were using 1920 source in a 1440 preset. You then did frame grabs to create the stills? How did yo do that? You may be exporting to yet a different format.
So, rather than reverse engineering your whole workfflow; it would be easier to examine the actual source being used in the new project. Can you provide the details on the actual assets being used? IN CS4 it is very easy to create a new sequence in the same project with the correct aspect ratio; assuming that is the problem. But we are still shooting in the dark since we dont know the details of your assetts.

Rendering Problem-24p

Hi, I shot some footage on a dvx100 and captured it to my fcp 5.0 using the advanced pulldown removal. (First, was this correct?) Now every time I bring a clip from the browser to the timeline, it needs to be rendered, which casues a huge waste in time. With other footage that was shot regulat 30i I never had this problem of having to render everytime i brought something into the timeline.
Did I do something wrong? Thanks for any help,
Noah

Glad to help.
I see that you marked this as ANSWERED, but didn't give any indication as to what post helped and solved your question. Next time, please do this, so people may know.
New Discussions ReponsesThe new system for discussions asks that after you mark your question as Answered, you take the time to mark any posts that have aided you with the tag and he post that provided your answer with the tag. This not only gives points to the posters, but points anyone searching for answers to similar problems to the proper posts.
If we use the forums properly they will work well...
Shane

CS 4 requiring rendering of 24p mxf files?

I have Adobe Premiere Pro CS 4, and shoot with Panasonic HPX-170 cameras. I transfer all CONTENTS folders to hard drive after shooting. According to CS4 specs, mxf files are compatible. and all the presets show up in the 'create new sequence' window. So when I create a new CS4 project with a preset of either 720p 24p with footage shot like that, or HD 1080i 24p project with same footage shot that way, why am I getting a redline when I drag the clips to timeline?
At first, I shot in DVCpro50 480 60i, imported to the CS4 preset of DVCPro50, but never get a red line. Same if I shot in SD DV, and imported into
NTSC DV preset. I make sure the preset matches whatever I shoot in.
Not sure what I am doing wrong, because I should not have to render out native video in 24p, either 720p or 1080i, HD or SD.
Adobe Premiere CS 4 is installed as a stand-alone. But I also have Premiere Pro CS 2 with the Matrox X100 card installed. I have had
CS 4 just over a year, never encountered any conflicts. But just started shooting in the other formats other than DVCpro50 recently.
My system:
Custom built in 2005 with
Intel 4 3.2 ghz
3.65 gb ram
SATA drives for video/audio files
Windows XP Service Pack 3
Any advice is appreciated. Thank you.
Dennis in Peoria

I make sure the preset matches whatever I shoot in.
Well, the red line is an indicator that simply isn't true in this case. I'd take a closer look there to resolve the issue.

Aspect Ratio is Officially Jacked Up

Forum,
I read some other threads on this similar problem, but this one seems like even more of a maze than some other stuff I've come across. So any help would be greatly appreciated!
I exported my entire rendered HDV,24p, ProRes 422 sequence back to FCP from Color. Some of it has maintained the same aspect ratio and some of it is now an entirely different ratio. Could this have anything to do with my latest QT 7.5 update? I'm sorry if this post is looks similar to others, but judging from the posts I've been reading, the project settings and media formats seem to be the crux of the matter.
With that being said, it would probably take me forever to find someone with the identical problem that I'm facing.
The craft of editing is such a whacked up mess, yet we all love it!
Von

JPo,
I don't understand why there would be mixed resolutions if I shot everything the same. There was originally a 3:2 pulldown but I removed it prior to sending to Color.
Under Item Properties>Format, all of my clips are labeled as 1920x1080 despite all the different aspect ratios that are being displayed from clip to clip.
My suspicion is that it has something to do with the geometry room because I wrote in a previous thread about a problem with aspect ratios changing while I was in Color. The advice given to me at the time was not to do any scaling or rotating in Geometry, but make those changes in Color.
So, I made sure to reset all of my geometrical changes back to there original state. Although the issue with different aspect ratios (in Color and FCP both) was not fixed.
I think what I might have to do is send a copy of the original ungraded project to Color and regrade the whole thing minus any scaling or rotating. What do you think about this plan?
P.S. I'm thinking that using Geometry for user shapes in conjunction with the secondaries room should be okay just as long as there's no scaling or rotating. What do you think?
Thanks for helping me as my project has come a long way and I just can't wait to knock this grading out!
Trey

CS5 renders 24p HDV as alternating lines?

I'm having issues rendering HDV 1080p24 sequences containing Sony V1U 1080i 24pSCNA footage. If I render a timeline preview or render out a sequence through Adobe Media Encoder the rendered footage looks pixelated as contrasting detail flickers/shimmers. It looks exactly like Premiere Pro is rendering each frame by alternating between fields. I have tried turning on Maximum Render Quality and Maximum Bit Depth in both the sequences and Adobe Media Encoder, as well as changing the 24p Conversion Method in Playback Settings, to no avail.
The original footage Premiere captured from tape looks perfectly fine when played back in a third-party media player. Aside from some tearing on movement it also looks fine played back in Premiere using the Mercury engine accelerated by an NVIDIA GTX 470. The issue only occurs when a preview is rendered or the sequence is rendered out through AME (even when previews have not been generated or used for AME's rendering).
I've checked the interpret footage dialog, but there doesn't appear to be any useful options. Changing the footage's framerate to 23.976 merely slows down the footage, so PPro must be performing reverse pulldown on the fly in the sequence.

No, I'm editing in an HDV 1080p24 sequence. I wanted to edit and export as 23.976p, so that's why I chose that preset.
According to the preset's description, it is "For editing with IEEE1394 (FireWire/i.LINK) HDV equipment. 16:9 progressive-scan 1080p HD video at 23.976 frames per second. 48kHz audio."

Dvx100 24p advanced footage needs rendering?

I have footage captured from a DVX100 as 24p advanced into FCP. I used 2:3:3:2 pulldown to capture it. Now I'm editing on a 23.98 timeline but final edit needs to be rendered in that timeline despite the fact that I don't have any filters. However, in a regualr 48khz timeline, it needs no rendering. Can anyone help?

I would wager if you look at the footage, the pulldown has not been pulled out and the clip is still at 29.97. There is probably some break in the cadence and the pulldown was left in. You can try Remove Advanced Pulldown from the menu on the clip and see what happens...
Patrick

24p advanced footage needs rendering?

I shot footage in 24p advanced and imported into FCP using 2:3:3:2 pulldown. I then began editing in a 23.98 timeline and discovered that all clips I put there need rendering. I then changed the timeline to 48Khz (not 23.98 or 24p) and the clips don't need rendering anymore. I'm positive I shot in 24pa, especially because I see the stuttering when I panned during the shooting/recording stage. Even the screen on the DVX100 indicated 24pa. What am I doing wrong?

Sometimes I have a similar problem. I shoot advanced 24p on my XL-2 and capture using the pulldown removal setting on FCP -- but when I get there the footage needs render. Honestly -- I would try just re-capturing and making sure all the settings are correct. Before I do anything in my project file I always change the EASY SETUP to universal Pulldown Removal settings. That way, I'm positive it will be capturing into the correct timeline setups, etc.

Motion Renders GREEN! 1080p 24p AVC Intra Blues??

I shot a commercial using a Panasonic HPX 3000 with the AVC INTRA codec at 1080p 24p. I sent it from FCP to Motion, tweaked it, then round tripped back to FCP, rendered and the entire image is GREEN. Please help. Deadline looming.

hi,
welcome to the posts.
Have you tried exporting out of motion, either through compressor or as a direct export and importing that clip into fcp. If you have a deadline then this might help you meet it. I had a motion project yesterday that fcp could not render without crashing. Dont think compressor liked it either, had to export from motion as an uncompressed 10 bit and fcp was happy. Think it had something to do with the four emitters I had running, shouldnt be a problem really though.
hth
adam

Rendering 24p Anamorphic

I shot on a DVX100A in 24p advanced and squeeze mode. I imported it with the 2.3.3.2 puldown and I am trying to edit on the 23.98 timeline but I am getting the render bar. Is this supposed to require rendering. I was under the impression that it shouldn't have to. I checked everything and I'm pretty sure I havn't made a mistake in importing and settings.

#28 Having to render every clip in the timeling
Shane's Stock Answer #28: When I put a clip in the timline, I have to render it before it will play. Why?
Your clip settings MUST match your timeline settings. If you have DV/NTSC material, you need a DV/NTSC timeline. The frame rate, audio rate and dimensions (4:3, 16:9) all need to match exactly. You might be missing something as simple as making sure that the sequence is set to anamorphic.
The most important thing you need to do is properly set up your project from the start. It is always advisable to use the Easy Setups. Here is an in-depth article on the topic:
http://www.kenstone.net/fcphomepage/settings_fcp_5balis.html
Shane
"There's no need to fear, UNDERDOG is here!"

HD movie files need constant RENDERING in FCP 24p HD 1440 x 1080 sequence.

Hi,
I have been editing a feature film which which uses a FCP 24p HD 1440 x 1080 timeline (sequence, or many different sequences actually). The movie was filmed exclusively on a Canon HV40 camera using, of course, 24p HD footage, widescreen. However, I am now adding footage shot on a small Canon Powershot digital camera which also can shoot decent HD video (.mov files likewise, but not in 24p). When I put this HD video into my timeline, a red render bar appears above the footage, and apparently I have to render the footage before being able to view any of it in "Safe RT" mode. When in "Unlimited RT" mode, an orange bar appears above the footage, and it "plays", but the footage plays very unsteady, stopping and starting, making it nearly impossible to edit fast & intuitively because the eyes/mind don't see the full clips in all their natural wonder/splendor. One just sees images that skip and fumble by, along with their sounds, and it's somewhat headache-inducing. Is there any cure for this? I have lots & lots of Powershot footage to edit into this film, but at this rate it will really slow down the natural flow of editing if i can see the footage as nature or god or Buddha or humans intended it to be viewed.'
Any help would be much appreciated.
Thanks,
Marc

David,
It might seem simple and obvious from your end, but these issues are pretty spanking new to me - despite editing for years in FCP they've just never come up. I'm a simple aim & shoot, edit & print sorta guy. So, I don't know, for instance, how to convert the 940 footage to to my Canon HV40 footage. Any help would be greatly appreciated. I did run a sample of mixed clips through through compressor, and there does seem to be some degrading of quality on the 940 footage, tho' I'll accept/use it like that if I have to. Luckily all the 940 footage appears in the film as flashbacks of sort from the main character, so the degrading element of the 940 footage might have a redeeming stylistic affect - MAYBE. But I'd rather keep it as pure of footage as I possibly can muster.
Thanks much,
Marc

Rendering out of phase (pixelated). How can I fix it?

Equipment: Canon Vixia HF20 (set to MXP) and Kodak Zi8 (set to 1080) Alienware M-18x - i7-2860QM @250GHz – 16 GB ram – Windows 7 Professional Service pack 1 (with all recent updates installed.) NVIDIA GeForce GTX 560M (with latest drivers and updates installed.)
Premiere Elements 12 (Expert mode)
Canon is used for the main picture. Kodak is used for smaller “picture in picture” on top of main picture.
Preset in Premiere Elements 12: NTSC-AVCHD Full HD 1080i-30
I have used this same camera/Premiere Elements setup with success in Premiere Elements 8 and 10.
When the first video (Canon) is brought into Video 1 track it looks great and no orange render line appears. When the second video (Kodak) is placed in the Video 2 track, resized, and placed in the lower right hand corner of the monitor panel (on top of Video 1) and I click outside of the bounding box it looks fine (as does the Video 1). The orange line then appears above both videos as normal.
The problem is when I render the videos they both become “out of phase,” pixelated, as if I had dragged their bounding boxes slightly one way or the other.
How do I get the videos to render properly so that I can upload the project to YouTube? (This was never a problem with Premiere Elements 8 or 10)
Many thanks,
Randall

The camera manual does not offer any clear information regarding interlaced or progressive.
Here is what information I have been able to obtain from other sources on the web:
<<As far as I can tell, I am recording in 1920 x 1080p (not interlaced). I have sent a question to Canon tech support, but they tout that the Canon Vixia HF20 records in full 1080p. I have the ability to set it to a 24p or 30p frame rate, and apparently, that records in 60i.>>
another sources adds:
<<My recording options are:
- 60i
- "PF30" which is described as "30 frames per second, progressive" but then it goes on to say "Using this frame rate, video is recorded as 60i"
- "PF24" which is described as "24 frames per second, progressive. Using this frame rate will give your recordings a cinematic look." but then it goes on to say "Using this frame rate, video is recorded as 60i">>
My camera is set to the default "60i"
I installed the latest version of Quicktime
I added the tracks to the timeline as suggested above and used your method for adding PiP 25% LR. When I rendered a section of the video, it was pixelated as mentioned above (no change.)
As I mentioned before, this was not a problem with either Premiere Elements 10 (Using this computer) or 8 (using another computer). The only reason I upgraded to Premiere Elements 12 was that Premiere Elements 10 would not work when I updated the video drivers and software.
Many thanks for your help.
Randall

Apple ProRes 422 HQ needs rendering, but it shouldn't.

Sequence Settings (hereafter called the master sequence) are:
Apple ProRes 422 (HQ) 1920 X 1080 24p 48khz preset.
Frame Size: 1920 X 1080 (HDTV 1080i 16:9)
Pixel Aspect: Square
Editing Timebase: 23.98fps
Compressor: Apple ProRes 422 HQ
Audio: 48khz/16-bit
Footage is:
Apple ProRes 422 (HQ)
Frame Size: 1920 X 1080
Pixel Aspect: Square
Editing Timebase: 23.98fps
Compressor: Apple ProRes 422 HQ
Audio: 48khz/16-bit
Data Rate: 19.5 MB/sec
I need to put a timecode window burn on the entire movie for a web clip. So I exported a ProRes master as a QuickTime movie using the sequence settings. I then imported that clip and slipped it into a new sequence with identical settings (hereafter called TimeCode burn sequence) and was surprised to see the red render bar across the entire sequence.
As an experiment, I exported a brief (one minute) clip from the same master sequence. I then slipped that clip into my TimeCode burn sequence and it does not need rendering (it shouldn't).
I shouldn't have to render the Master clip first, only to have to re-render it once I but the window burn on. The movie is 30 min. long and the file size is 34GB. Is there a file size limit on ProRes HQ clips that don't need rendering? Why don't the shorter clips from the same sequence need rendering. I don't understand this. Very time consuming.
EDIT: I will probably end up using the Timecode Generator option in Compressor, so please don't suggest this, as I am aware of it. I want to figure out this mystery.
Message was edited by: Mr. Landers
Message was edited by: Mr. Landers

No, you're absolutely correct to use HQ. Just checking.
The Red footage is has 4:4:4 subsampling, so HQ's the way to go.
If you generally use Recompress All Frames on Export then you probably know that it's pointless to render your timeline before an Export, since your Render files won't be accessed. Unless you need to work in that same sequence with the timecode - but, you could just use your exported master for that.
I know the recompress all frames option is probably overkill for a sequence with only one effect, but I'm also thinking about drive space. With those huge Red files, your render files have to be eating up quite a lot of it.
So, I'm suggesting that you don't need to render this sequence before exporting. Just export the unrendered sequence with Recompress All Frames. That saves you the space the render files would be taking up.

P2 1080i/24p and CS3

Started a DVCPRO HD 1080i/24p project. Imported P2 mxf files shot in 1080i/24p. Timeline needs rendering when mxf is placed on timeline.
Why does this happen? Every other native P2 project for DVCPRO HD does not require rendering. ex, 720/60 etc.
CS4 does not behave this way in the trial I downloaded.

I noticed the same issue while running some tests today. I shot 6 x 30 second clips to p2. 1080i 24p, 1080i 24pa, 720p 24p, 702p 24pn, DVCPro 50 480i 24pa, DVCPro 50 480i 24p. I created 3 sequences, one for each of the resolutions.
On the 1080i sequence the 24p requires rendering while the 24pa does not. Same thing for the DVCPro 50, the 24p requires rendering while the 24pa does not. None of the 720 clips required rendering and neither of those were shot in 24p advance.
I am very interested to find out why this is happening.

Rendering in 24p

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